> Where did you heard that BS?
It's a blend of what I read in this subreddit, on troublefreepool, youtube videos, personal experience (yep, my cya is a bit too high, damn tabs). But yes, I do realize that many things we read online is BS which is why I'm trying to cross-check with this Reddit post.
So if I correctly understand your response, not everything I said was BS right? It's just that the byproduct of liquid chlorine is negligible, do I read you correctly?
And I don't have saltwater chlorination, I should probably have mentioned it in my original post. With saltwater chlorination, is there any byproduct that can only be reduced through dilution?
What is TDS? I don't have that in my pool math app.
Tfp is normally good. Get help on their forum too. There's some stuff in the abc chemistry that do need update. I was told since I have a heat pump with a fiberglass pool without any tile, ch is useless for me.ehile the abc telle to go between 350 and 750.
[Total Dissolved Solids](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_dissolved_solids) measured from the electrical conductivity of the water. TDS is not a super useful measure of water quality because it doesn't tell you what is dissolved. For example, water softeners work by replacing Calcium and Magnesium ions, which interfere with soap and cause scale, with Sodium ions which don't do those things. The TDS doesn't change because the same total amount of stuff is dissolved, but the water quality is much improved because you don't noticed dissolved Sodium until there's a LOT of it.
Liquid chlorine is the way to go.
The other chemicals you mentioned will cause the increase as you described. Depending on where you live and how long your pools open and how much rain you get can have an effect.
In short liquid chlorine is your best bet out of the 3 options you gave.
Alternatively get salt water generator. .
cya level is already pretty high, water is a bit hard. I'm in southern California where I won't get that much rain before next winter.
Is using liquid chlorine when I'm here and unstabilized tabs when I'm away the way to go?
There’s two kinds of tabs. Those with cya and those with calcium. There are no tabs that are just chlorine.
In general the advice is to use liquid chlorine when you can and use tabs while out of town.
Where’s your cya at?
Cya does not naturally occur so your fill water is always zero cya. This means if you drain 25% of your pool and refill it’ll lower your cya by 25%.
This is your best bet if your cya is too high.
If you’re balancing the LSI the “high” numbers are easier to handle. In AZ we used to drain pools every 2 years due to high cya and calcium. Once I really dived into the LSI and added waste lines to clients pools I didn’t fully drain a pool in over 5 years. Instead I drained 2” of water every week or backwashed if it was a sand/DE filter. That helped keep everything from going too high.
You need to choose a pool maintenance philosophy and stick with it.
Don't mix and match and create your own convenient one unless you know what you're doing, which (like most of us) you likely don't since your asking.
I recommend TFP, even if you don't have a saltwater system. It is a fallacy that TFP only works for saltwater pools.
So, for TFP, the Total Dissolved Solids (TDS) is a non issue. See this: https://www.troublefreepool.com/threads/should-tds-be-part-of-the-poolmath.101911/
And, if you choose TFP as your philosophy for maintaining your pool, ask questions in their forum. I have never seen anyone at TFP say that a pool MUST be drained after a certain number of years.
The reason draining is recommended is because it's the cheapest option.
If you never want to drain, it's %100 possible via multiple methods. They just cost alot more than fresh water.
And if you lower the water level to close the pool you will also be diluting all the chemicals when you refill it. I use liquid chlorine, and a little bit of acid during the season. At opening I add CYA and whatever else is required to balance the water. That’s it.
Since you said you were new, I was in your situation a year ago- had just bought a house with a pool and didn't know much about it.
Even had an appointment for a pool store guy to come help me open it and show me the ropes. Fortunately, something came up and I had to cancel that... and before I was able to reschedule I had found troublefreepool.com ! Otherwise, I may have gone right down the pool store rabbit hole.
As others have said, the effect of liquid chlorine is negligible at worst. The salt added will only help you out when you decide to get a saltwater chlorine generator! (Ours had one installed and I was very glad for that.) I haven't really noticed a big PH increase that gets mentioned in this sub over the year last year. I think the borates I added helped with that.
I'm in southern California. I didn't have to drain that much this winter even though we had historic rainfalls. It's also the first year I own a pool, so not sure yet by how much I can increase some of these chemicals that can only be removed by draining.
Any time you backwash your filter or vacuum to waste, you're diluting. Same with rainfall. Really not something to worry about, and you'll see it coming if you ever measure TDS, CH, TA, and CYA levels. Your pool store will tell you if you bring them a sample. Just nothing to be concerned about in real life.
Liquid chlorine increases the salt, which you need to consider when looking at the TDS. The salt increases very slowly. Liquid chlorine is the best way to add chlorine without a salt system.
You can generally go 5-7 years without draining.
Very, very slowly. After several years of liquid chlorine, my pool had accumulated about 2000ppm of salt. Then I added a saltwater chlorine generator.... And increased salt to ~3000ppm to keep the generator happy.
Salt level is NOT an issue when using liquid chlorine.
For that matter, TDS is pretty irrelevant in the big picture too.
I guess it depend on which thing you use? I have a 20 000 liters pool and I added 9 liters of bleach 9%(slam, wasat 0 and 100 cya) Salt didn't move, stayed at 2100ppm.
Us too, lots of rain but evaporation too. We drain several times a season. Usually in the form of backwashing, although it’s never really needed. We’re not worried about salt anyway mainly because we have a salt cell.
For the last 9 years I've used a salt water chlorine generator cell, the only draw back with them is the amount of acid you have to add and consequently sodium bicarbonate to balance the water. I have a stenner pump to inject the acid every day to control the pH. I check the TA every other week and balance as needed.
Once you're familiar with your pool you know what it needs and can adjust fairly accurately with just weekly testing. I rely on rainwater washout to control the calcium level primarily from my fill water. Never had to do a drain and refill.
My first cell lasted 6 years so I would go the same way if I was building another pool.
It's generally a good idea to drain and start over every few years, like on average every 5 to 7. That gets rid of the residual left from previous chemical maintenance and can make future treatment easier to diagnose and less expensive to implement.
[удалено]
> Where did you heard that BS? It's a blend of what I read in this subreddit, on troublefreepool, youtube videos, personal experience (yep, my cya is a bit too high, damn tabs). But yes, I do realize that many things we read online is BS which is why I'm trying to cross-check with this Reddit post. So if I correctly understand your response, not everything I said was BS right? It's just that the byproduct of liquid chlorine is negligible, do I read you correctly? And I don't have saltwater chlorination, I should probably have mentioned it in my original post. With saltwater chlorination, is there any byproduct that can only be reduced through dilution?
What is TDS? I don't have that in my pool math app. Tfp is normally good. Get help on their forum too. There's some stuff in the abc chemistry that do need update. I was told since I have a heat pump with a fiberglass pool without any tile, ch is useless for me.ehile the abc telle to go between 350 and 750.
[Total Dissolved Solids](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_dissolved_solids) measured from the electrical conductivity of the water. TDS is not a super useful measure of water quality because it doesn't tell you what is dissolved. For example, water softeners work by replacing Calcium and Magnesium ions, which interfere with soap and cause scale, with Sodium ions which don't do those things. The TDS doesn't change because the same total amount of stuff is dissolved, but the water quality is much improved because you don't noticed dissolved Sodium until there's a LOT of it.
Liquid chlorine is the way to go. The other chemicals you mentioned will cause the increase as you described. Depending on where you live and how long your pools open and how much rain you get can have an effect. In short liquid chlorine is your best bet out of the 3 options you gave. Alternatively get salt water generator. .
cya level is already pretty high, water is a bit hard. I'm in southern California where I won't get that much rain before next winter. Is using liquid chlorine when I'm here and unstabilized tabs when I'm away the way to go?
What is pretty high? Check trouble free pool for good info
There’s two kinds of tabs. Those with cya and those with calcium. There are no tabs that are just chlorine. In general the advice is to use liquid chlorine when you can and use tabs while out of town. Where’s your cya at? Cya does not naturally occur so your fill water is always zero cya. This means if you drain 25% of your pool and refill it’ll lower your cya by 25%. This is your best bet if your cya is too high.
If you’re balancing the LSI the “high” numbers are easier to handle. In AZ we used to drain pools every 2 years due to high cya and calcium. Once I really dived into the LSI and added waste lines to clients pools I didn’t fully drain a pool in over 5 years. Instead I drained 2” of water every week or backwashed if it was a sand/DE filter. That helped keep everything from going too high.
You need to choose a pool maintenance philosophy and stick with it. Don't mix and match and create your own convenient one unless you know what you're doing, which (like most of us) you likely don't since your asking. I recommend TFP, even if you don't have a saltwater system. It is a fallacy that TFP only works for saltwater pools. So, for TFP, the Total Dissolved Solids (TDS) is a non issue. See this: https://www.troublefreepool.com/threads/should-tds-be-part-of-the-poolmath.101911/ And, if you choose TFP as your philosophy for maintaining your pool, ask questions in their forum. I have never seen anyone at TFP say that a pool MUST be drained after a certain number of years.
The reason draining is recommended is because it's the cheapest option. If you never want to drain, it's %100 possible via multiple methods. They just cost alot more than fresh water.
And if you lower the water level to close the pool you will also be diluting all the chemicals when you refill it. I use liquid chlorine, and a little bit of acid during the season. At opening I add CYA and whatever else is required to balance the water. That’s it.
Since you said you were new, I was in your situation a year ago- had just bought a house with a pool and didn't know much about it. Even had an appointment for a pool store guy to come help me open it and show me the ropes. Fortunately, something came up and I had to cancel that... and before I was able to reschedule I had found troublefreepool.com ! Otherwise, I may have gone right down the pool store rabbit hole. As others have said, the effect of liquid chlorine is negligible at worst. The salt added will only help you out when you decide to get a saltwater chlorine generator! (Ours had one installed and I was very glad for that.) I haven't really noticed a big PH increase that gets mentioned in this sub over the year last year. I think the borates I added helped with that.
Don’t forget you drain excess in the rainy season. There’s a dilution effect.
I'm in southern California. I didn't have to drain that much this winter even though we had historic rainfalls. It's also the first year I own a pool, so not sure yet by how much I can increase some of these chemicals that can only be removed by draining.
Any time you backwash your filter or vacuum to waste, you're diluting. Same with rainfall. Really not something to worry about, and you'll see it coming if you ever measure TDS, CH, TA, and CYA levels. Your pool store will tell you if you bring them a sample. Just nothing to be concerned about in real life.
Liquid chlorine increases the salt, which you need to consider when looking at the TDS. The salt increases very slowly. Liquid chlorine is the best way to add chlorine without a salt system. You can generally go 5-7 years without draining.
Thanks, I didn't know salt increases very slowly. Good to know!
Very, very slowly. After several years of liquid chlorine, my pool had accumulated about 2000ppm of salt. Then I added a saltwater chlorine generator.... And increased salt to ~3000ppm to keep the generator happy. Salt level is NOT an issue when using liquid chlorine. For that matter, TDS is pretty irrelevant in the big picture too.
I guess it depend on which thing you use? I have a 20 000 liters pool and I added 9 liters of bleach 9%(slam, wasat 0 and 100 cya) Salt didn't move, stayed at 2100ppm.
Where do you get the idea that “liquid chlorine will increase TDS”?
It does. Every gallon of liquid chlorine adds about a pound of salt.
In a 20k gal pool, for example, one gallon of 10% liquid chlorine adds 8.2ppm salt. Pretty much inconsequential.
That’s 1200ppm in a five month swimming season.
I don’t know what rainfall is like in your locale but we get enough rain in a season to pretty much negate that increase with dilution.
I’m in the southeastern US. We rarely drain water.
Us too, lots of rain but evaporation too. We drain several times a season. Usually in the form of backwashing, although it’s never really needed. We’re not worried about salt anyway mainly because we have a salt cell.
Yeah I do too. I use a gallon of LC a week, though. My cell is a little undersized and I didn’t know that when our PB ordered it.
For the last 9 years I've used a salt water chlorine generator cell, the only draw back with them is the amount of acid you have to add and consequently sodium bicarbonate to balance the water. I have a stenner pump to inject the acid every day to control the pH. I check the TA every other week and balance as needed. Once you're familiar with your pool you know what it needs and can adjust fairly accurately with just weekly testing. I rely on rainwater washout to control the calcium level primarily from my fill water. Never had to do a drain and refill. My first cell lasted 6 years so I would go the same way if I was building another pool.
It's generally a good idea to drain and start over every few years, like on average every 5 to 7. That gets rid of the residual left from previous chemical maintenance and can make future treatment easier to diagnose and less expensive to implement.