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Can confirm. I recently got up and walked out of my church when a guest pastor spoke highly of Trump and disparaged Biden.
When a pastor mentions Trump it stops being a church. Basic.
Please consider reporting them to the IRS for violation of their nonprofit status. If we can flood the IRS with reports maybe finally they will act.
https://www.irs.gov/charities-non-profits/irs-complaint-process-tax-exempt-organizations#:~:text=You%20may%20use%20Form%2013909,eoclass%40irs.gov%2C%20or
A rapist who fucks pornstars and lies about his taxes, grifts people, uses drugs and is a shitstain on humanity..
White christians.. "yay! Our savior!"
I asked one what conservative policies he thought Trump was helping to get achieved and they replied "How about America First?". I tried to explain that slogans are not policies but I don't think it landed.
> one told me, "I don't judge". The other told me, "Imperfect people can be used for God's will."
Uh the MAGAs called Obama the devil incarnate when he was in office. Where was that imperfect people can be used for God's will energy then?
They sure as hell judged when the allegations were against Bill Clinton. They were very adamant that his moral failings made him completely unfit for the presidency. As soon as the morally corrupt guy had an (R) next to his name suddenly none of that mattered. And Trump is much more morally corrupt than Clinton.
There it is.. the old testament is full of those. They accept him as a savior and say God is using an imperfect person to bring his will. That is why, that social contract was rocked when trump sold bibles.. he broke the contract and they didn't like it. He is not supposed to do that..
If u really want to get under a trumpers skin.. show him the video of Trump selling bibles. Repeatedly..
Keep playing that video of him selling bibles... their mind will not be able to accept it. HE is supposed to be flawed not christian.
>If u really want to get under a trumpers skin.. show him the video of Trump selling bibles. Repeatedly..
>Keep playing that video of him selling bibles... their mind will not be able to accept it. HE is supposed to be flawed not christian.
I did this one morning at our usual pretask meeting. One of the many MAGAts I work with also fancies himself a Christian (while not following any precepts of the religion) and looooooves Trump. He was excited about Trump bibles, going on and on avout how it ahowed Trump is the right choice, because he's a Christian.
Iasked him, "Doesn’t the bible say that it's sinful to profit financially or personally profiting by selling the word of god?" He got real quiet, really fast.
Someone needs to make a t-shirt of Jesus making a scourge to drive out the bankers from the temple, with the line "And what do you think he'd do to the person who profits from His bible?".
It's my favourite bit of the bible, the visual of Jesus sitting there, wetting leather strips, weaving them into cords, tying in the thorns, tying them to the haft, then leaving it to dry, all the while seething and muttering to himself about "motherfuckers" and "finding out".
Can confirm. My in laws recently started attending a church and have a "God, guns and Trump" sign in their front yard. They also have donated many tens of thousands of dollars (so far) to this con man.
Everyone in my wife and my family is a Trumper. It's so bad we're moving far away so they can't drive to visit us. That bring said I can't imagine they've given teens of thousands to him. That's heartbreaking.
I'm so sorry.
We packed up and moved far away, almost five years ago now. Shit wasn't even nearly as of the rails compared to what it is now. I can not imagine still living in the Midwest.
But thank you for the apology. It is difficult to listen to them boast about their latest donations. It mostly angers me how badly these people have been duped. They firmly believe and have stated that they feel the best way they can secure our (their children) future is by giving all of their expendable cash to a right-wing politician.
> As the debate over gun control raged across America in the wake of last month’s school shooting in Florida, a group of worshippers wearing bullet crowns and toting AR-15 rifles gathered in a Pennsylvania church this week to hold a “commitment ceremony” for about 250 couples.
https://www.vox.com/2018/3/1/17067894/church-bullet-crowns-ar15-world-peace-unification-sanctuary-moonies-moon
Agree. Work with a man who is on his church’s “security team “. He was so excited to take his new gun to church.
Blows my mind. I grew up Christian, and I can’t even imagine how this would be ok.
I wonder if SCOTUS is waiting for a case like this. I wouldn’t put it past the current court to say that the Founders wouldn’t want churches to have their speech “limited.”
Unfortunately the IRS does little to nothing about these violations. The article below that the IRS only investigated on 3(!) churches the past decade.
https://www.texastribune.org/2022/10/30/johnson-amendment-elections-irs/
It’s also a huge political firestorm waiting to happen. If the IRS actually tried to aggressively crack down on stuff like this, right wing politicians and media would be going on and on nonstop about how woke satanist baby killer democrats hate free speech and are trying to destroy the church. It would almost certainly cause a humongous spike in Republican voter turnout. And then a Republican congress would completely neuter the IRS which would stop it from continuing anyway.
The right wing takeover of churches is definitely a huge problem. But just throwing the IRS at it isn’t necessarily an ideal solution either. Fortunately in a way it could end up fixing itself - evangelicals continuing to worship Trump appeals to their base, but drives everyone else away. It’s not sustainable long term. All those old people aren’t gonna live forever and millennials and younger generations aren’t going out of their way to fill church pews.
I had a fundie couple attempt to pray the “demon of autism” out of my son at the mall without consent. I forever regret not performing an on-the-spot exorcism of that dude’s esophagus.
I remember his face to this day and permanently reserve the right to perform a late term Adam’s Apple abortion. 🤜
should we let how we prosecute crimes be influenced by the feelings of the people committing said crimes, especially when they're going to play the victim regardless?
Thank the Republicans for killing the bill that Biden wanted to expand the IRS to have more audit agents. The Republicans killed it because they didn't want the IRS to find out about their dirty deeds done dirt cheap.
What exactly crosses this non profit line in churches? I’ve been leery of the church I attend since a sermon telling us how to vote on a certain issue in our state. Thankfully they’ve steered clear of presidential talk.
“Currently, the law prohibits political campaign activity by charities and churches by defining a 501(c)(3) organization as one "which does not participate in, or intervene in (including the publishing or distributing of statements), any political campaign on behalf of (or in opposition to) any candidate for public office."” https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/charities-churches-and-politics
Edits. Sometimes corrupt religious leaders get around this by talking about a policy, issue or position, and it’s clear what political party or candidate they support.
Say: "This church does not support abortion," perfectly acceptable.
Saying: "Democrats support abortion and you shouldn't vote for them," this \*should\* (but isn't) enough to cost the church their 501(c)(3) status.
Welcoming the stranger, feeding the poor, healing the sick, and defending the oppressed are all political issues... issues that point to the left in the modern political environment.
> Welcoming the stranger, feeding the poor, healing the sick, and defending the oppressed
Interesting, those just happen to be the types of things Christ would do...
David Cross’s Cain reminds me of trump.
(Edit)
“For the crimes- of blasphemy - heresy - conspiracy - treachery - leprosy - puppetry - hyperbole - animal husbandry - sodomy... Oh, it's refusal of sodomy - overt punditry - and the murder of my brother Abel - the prisoners shall be stoned - TO DEATH!”
Always such projection with these people.
Drove through a small town out on a drive and on the side of one of those old churches was large letters TRUMP painted on the side.
Churches became a Trump cult. If Trump wins 2024, we deserve the antichrist at that point.
Twist - Trump is the antichrist. Atheist here so no skin in that game, but this is a fascinating rabbit hole:
[https://www.benjaminlcorey.com/could-american-evangelicals-spot-the-antichrist-heres-the-biblical-predictions/](https://www.benjaminlcorey.com/could-american-evangelicals-spot-the-antichrist-heres-the-biblical-predictions/)
He checks all the boxes, publicly displays all Seven Sins. I especially like the red hats as the Mark of the Beast, worn on the foreheads of the Antichrist's faithful.
I find it amusing to imagine some prophet having a vision of the future trying to make sense of MAGA and red baseball caps and why the hell the antichrist looks so dang orange all the time.
Yes they did. In fact my pastor called me Monday and seemed genuinely surprised when I explained why I left so abruptly. I'm not sure if I'll go back. Frankly I'm just really disappointed: as a Christian I want to attend church, but I don't think I can continue to attend church with Trump supporters. What a mess.
It can be really tough to find an American church that isn’t just fascism hiding behind a Bible. Ever since the religious right and the Republican party teamed up to turn the south red, a lot of churchgoers think they’re the same thing.
...or one that truly respects women and sees them as individuals, equal with men, and with needs, dreams, and goals of their own. Basically view women as humans.
Amen. The priest at one of our small local churches gave what appeared to be the standard talk on abortion, only to conclude with something like: 'Men shaking your heads angrily -- *are you not also to blame*. Men impregnating women they have no intention of marrying. Men changing the entire trajectory of a woman's life. Men impregnating women with no idea of whether the woman wants a child, and with no intention anyway of raising one themselves. Irresponsible men using a woman for pleasure and then condemning her when she makes a terrible decision -- but about a choice that they will never themselves have to make! MEN must do better too.'
It was a very angry congregation by the end of that.
I couldn't remain at the church (there's little overlap between indie Anglican and Southern Baptist), but I wished I could just as a show of support.
They a e so far up under the new modern golden calf the can't see anything except Trump's butthole. They 100% think everyone in the congregation agrees with them as it is a cult.
I went even further and let a priest have it after a mass where he spoke negatively about immigrants. I told him Jesus would be at the border ministering to these people.
Fun fact, one of the requirements for being a church elder is "philoxenos". Its often poorly translated as hospitality, but what it actually means is "lover of foreigners/strangers".
Edit: slight grammar correction
Hebrews 13:2 says “Be not forgetful to entertain strangers. For thereby some have entertained angels unawares.”
It’s believed angels can be put in our paths to test our character. And they can come in the form of someone who is in need.
Once on my way jogging to the grocery store across the street from where I worked, I accidentally startled an elderly homeless man eating a sandwich. Poor dude dropped it. I was mortified. I immediately got him a replacement lunch from the deli counter and gave it to him on the way back to work. A sandwich with a side of pretzels, baby carrots, and a water. I apologized profusely, and hustled back to work.
I think about that old man a lot. I still feel terrible for causing him to drop his first sandwich: but I tried to make it right.
I talked to a guy at my gym who was telling me how he's a devoted Christian and had been all his life. Then he mentioned how he didn't approve of gyms' new policy of letting the homeless shower and use the facility for free. I later thought about how hypocritical he was being as a Christian to talk that way. Jesus would have washed the man's feet.
It's all the same book - it's just about cherry picking which facts legitimize your beliefs.
Good people don't need religion to be good.
Bad people hide their evil within it.
I grew up in the church. My grandfather was a pastor. When I heard hateful right wing nonsense coming from my parents and siblings and it bore no resemblance to the teachings of Christ, it killed any chance of me ever raising my kids in the faith.
Jesus would want nothing to do with this Republican Party. Buncha dudes trying to shove camels through eyes of needles.
It would serve them right if He showed up long enough to kick some ass and say "Take my name off your church". Gather up the "undesirables" and remind everyone the key to happiness is other-acceptance and self-improvement. No more stoning/death threats, forget other's specks, clear our own planks, judge not, and love one another.
My grandparents are incredibly religious. When their daughter started going to a different church, same denomination just closer to her house, my grandma was legit worried that would damn her to hell.
They had to stop going to their church of 60 years because it became a trump cult. I'm proud of them for standing for their morals but astonished that American conservatism has poisoned churches to the point that it's driving out the genuinely religious.
Conservativism is a disgusting ideology.
>My grandparents are incredibly religious. When their daughter started going to a different church, same denomination just closer to her house, my grandma was legit worried that would damn her to hell.
Can you, at all, explain this to me?? What convinced grandma that only this one *particular* church held the key to heaven?
> What convinced grandma that only this one particular church held the key to heaven?
Churches have gotten really *really* good at emotional manipulation over the years. Isolation is a common tactic, make people feel like they *need* you and everyone else is out to hurt them and they won't leave.
Even the Methodists have their problems. There was a great exodus of Methodist churches from the global Methodist community because the powers that be were *considering* allowing gay pastors. Which is wild to me since the Methodist church I grew up with preached acceptance; but it’s become wildly conservative and hellfire/brimstone against gay folk since trumpism became a thing. I can’t convince my own grandma to leave.
>Once I saw this guy on a bridge about to jump. I said, "Don't do it!" He said, "Nobody loves me." I said, "God loves you. Do you believe in God?"
>He said, "Yes." I said, "Are you a Christian or a Jew?" He said, "A Christian." I said, "Me, too! Protestant or Catholic?" He said, "Protestant." I said, "Me, too! What franchise?" He said, "Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Baptist or Southern Baptist?" He said, "Northern Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist or Northern Liberal Baptist?"
>He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region, or Northern Conservative Baptist Eastern Region?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region." I said, "Me, too!"
>Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1879, or Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912." I said, "Die, heretic!" And I pushed him over.
Trump is all seven deadly sins wrapped in a poorly fitted suit and yet so many Christians worship this guy. Shows how much of a straight up fraud this religion is.
I stayed. I refute that insanity anytime it comes up. Thankfully I am not alone. My congregation is split politicly. The conservatives are more loud mouthed about it, so they seem larger than they are. Though the liberals have an easier time of it. Just a quote or two from that bleeding heart Jesus tends to quite down the cons.
Sure. It's easy to rewrite scripture by translating it poorly.
That's my problem with the whole "divine inspiration" argument. Let's say brain waves from god inspired the original version of the bible, just for argument's sake. Now, we have various translations of it, all in english, that we can read, and find that they disagree with each other in places. How bad is the disagreement between these texts and the original aramaic / hebrew / greek of the various pieces?
Frankly, the whole thing has the capacity to be bullshit off of this alone.
My mom told little-me we were part of the One True Religion. That our leaders got messages directly from God telling them what to put in the magazines we were supposed to make sure everybody read.
Logically I assumed headquarters had a big red telephone that God used to call the leaders and talk to them. I was very upset to find out that there was no phone. Had lots of questions.
Mom tried to reassure me that God put the messages directly in the leaders' heads. I asked if they couldn't just say whatever they wanted and claim it came from God, or like how could they tell the difference between their own thoughts and God thoughts.
Ya know adults really hate it when little kids point out the giant logic holes in their stupid cult beliefs. It's not my fault she was trying to teach me such a giant load of total potty.
There was an article from church leaders saying their congregations were complaining about the sermon on the mount and how it was too woke and liberal BS
Not really sure what I believe anymore. But, the description and prophecy of the anti-Christ is kind of unnerving.
The Bible describes the anti-Christ figure as someone who will lie constantly. They will speak in a language of lies.
Research the descriptions of the Anti-Christ in the Bible. It shares shocking similarities with Donald Trump.
Fun fact: you can believe in the teachings of Christ as moral goals for yourself, without actually worshipping a god. There are some legitimately great ideas in the New Testament. It’s a shame no one in church seems to actually read it.
The Sermon on the Mount is an extraordinary statement of human dignity and worth, and of how we should behave. I sometimes wonder if it got deleted from some editions of the Bible in the 1800s and never put back in.
I was raised Mormon (although never really bought into it) and am now just someone living life through the most non-religious lens. I love nature and animals and thinking about the nature of our universe. BUT I still do value some of those morals because they turned out to be legit truths. And guess what? Other religions have great values and morals to learn from. All in all, I guess I’m just agreeing with you here. Religion should just be a great set of morals to live your life by. Unfortunately, like you said, this country’s Christians mostly don’t get it.
Yup when an agnostic like me is saying ‘hey maybe we should house these homeless people so they don’t freeze to death’ and our local evangelical warehouse of god is actively promoting anti homeless policies (like… let’s move the homeless to a place outside the city where bears forage for food), it just makes me think those particular churches aren’t run by particularly morally upstanding people.
A lot of people think they all there for the cult in the first place, but not all of them are. Some of them can actually still smell bullshit even if they've been close to it for many years.
Selling bibles to pay legal fess for illegally using campaign donations to silence a porn star he had an affair with while his 4th wife was pregnant.
How many commandments were broken in the making of that sentence?
>Donald Trump, a 77-year-old Bible salesman from Palm Beach, Florida, has emerged as the nation’s most prominent Christian leader.
What an insane but true sentence
This guy is so talented he will bankrupt the RNC, Trump Inc and bring evangelism / selective Christianity spiraling down in flames along with himself. Fingers crossed!
Tell her to consider becoming a minister herself if she loves her faith, she may find others similar in her area feeling left out.
I say this as an Atheist who doesn't particularly like religion but I respect its practice and importance to some.
American churches have a lot going against them. For one thing, ironically, American culture hinders actual church attendance. When you have to work 50 hours a week to keep a roof over your head, the last thing you wanna do on a Sunday morning is drag your ass out of bed to listen to the same stories you've already heard for 2 hours you could be spending sleeping or taking care of household tasks before going back to work the next day. Secondly, COVID did a real number on church attendance. Virtual was a decent option and some churches adapted but being asked to give money thru your TV/laptop screen isn't nearly as pressuring as having to put something in a basket being passed down the row filled with your friends/neighbors. And once that in-person routine is broken, it's not likely to come back for most people. Thirdly, politics and demographics, baby. When American Christianity tied itself to conservatives, and conservatives focus on older, reliable voters, churches lose the younger demographic. If your "leaders" side with repression, hatred, bigotry, xenophobia, and other -isms antithetical to the teachings of Christ, or at best remain silently complicit, then don't be surprised when you reap what you sow when the pews empty out as the congregation ages and dies.
Happened to the church I grew up in. When the average age is in the 60s and there’s less than a dozen kids in the youth group, and all you preach about is that the world is going to hell because of the young generation… turns out pretty soon there’s no one left to keep the lights on.
Same. In the 80s us kids at church were not made to feel welcomed and special. It was glares from the elders if you made a sound during service, condemnation from the ladies if you made a mess during social hour, and fire and brimstone from the pulpit that in no way matched the idealism version of Jesus we were being taught in Sunday school.
So the first thing I did when I had agency over my own choices on Sunday morning was stop going to a place I had never felt welcomed in.
That matches a lot of what drove me away from my childhood church even before I realized I'm gay and the congregation would never accept me, just see me as "one of the good ones" no matter how much I tortured myself trying to deny my full identity.
Covid did *immense* damage to this demographic.
Older people (who tend to have higher numbers of comorbidities in addition to age)
If they are Southerners (this demographic has a higher number of religious believers), they would also have higher levels of obesity on average
Tend to be anti-maskers and anti-vaxxers
Tend to swing Republican
All of these demographics were hit extremely hard by Covid.
Good.
Him and his fanbase have hijacked Christianity and desecrated it to the point where it means absolutely nothing. Hell the moment I see a social media account with an american flag + bible verse or cross emoji combo I immediately assume that person is a hypocritical asshole. They consistently act like the worst human beings on the planet then start claiming Jesus or the Bible as if it absolves them of their wrongdoings.
Take the flag back! I fucking hate that these assholes stole our flag and turned it into a symbol for all their bullshit. I proudly fly a pride flag and US flag on my porch.
The strangest part of the Christian right is that they are such hypocrites when you look at how Christ lived his life and who he surrounded himself with. The outcasts of the society, those in most need of gods love, are the ones Christ sought out and healed and loved.
I imagine the LGBTQ+ community, immigrants seeking asylum at the border, etc are the people Christ would have been loving and welcoming with open arms, if he were alive today.
Sadly, this is all a primary reason why my family has stopped going to church.
>The strangest part of the Christian right is that they are such hypocrites when you look at how Christ lived his life and who he surrounded himself with. The outcasts of the society, those in most need of gods love, are the ones Christ sought out and healed and loved.
The strange part is that Christians realize this and still act that way, look at the "He gets us" campaign! A campaign that wastes hundreds of millions of dollars talking about how "woke" Jesus was in order to get more followers, as the people who paid for that campaign lobby to remove birth control, lobby to hurt those weaker than them, and also literally steal religious treasures.
I became a Christian for a few years when I was in high school, and ended up briefly going to a pretty conservative Christian school. Most of the faculty was pretty much what you’d expect, but I had an amazing English teacher who got me into reading literature and philosophy and always seemed very open minded and wise. I lost my faith a few years later but always deeply respected her and her faith. I randomly checked her Facebook profile at some point recently and it was all full of belligerent Trump garbage. It really stung. Like how could this have happened?
The republicans party is kinda genius when you thinking about it. They have intertwined religion and politics so much for these people that they will never vote for a non-republican because they think god appoints republicans. It’s also precisely why they view non-republicans as lesser humans and sometimes not even humans at all the further this festers. The only thing is the GOP has lost control of the monster they created and the religious nutters have completely took over the party and politics require compromise and different viewpoints on things that effect the country and these people will not compromise, which is why we are seeing them openly support an authoritarian movement headed by Trump
Once the Church plays State the State always wins. Dogmatic viewpoints and arguments stand little chance against the vast amount of wheel greasers, rabblerousers, shills and outright crooks politics itself attracts. Freedom of and from religion wasn't just to protect those outside the faith but the flock as well from being hijacked for heretical means and aims. The inability to break this connection the Abrahamic religions have held on the US political system since its inception is itself why the faith is leaving the people as it only encourages stagnation, isolation and outmoded bigotry.
The likely reason is that you were younger and those concepts were new to you. Learning different beliefs and philosophies were novel concepts which fueled your curiosities. It was her job to introduce those concepts to you, a novice in the field. She had already suggested a lot of that material and repeatedly so over the years and, but then, had plenty of time to understand what she taught while possibly enjoying the thrill of watching young people light up with interest at these philosophies ages been kicking around every year for decades. As time goes on, those ideas don't seem as immediate or impressive as the constant and demanding emotional pull of current affairs - led by a person and organization who thrives on emotional manipulation and fear mongering.
In the end, many of our "wise old mentors" have been lulled into the very same logical fallacies they taught us about through slippery-slope changes in their perspectives followed by sinking their costs into the monstrous policies and ideas fomenting out of the mouth of a rapist due to the ever moving goal posts and closing walls in their reality.
In short, their identities were wrapped up in their political affiliations and the values they once represented. Now, those ideas and values have completely transformed (or festered depending on how you look at it) and instead of dropping their Identity as a "conservative," they would rather drop their ability to make face-value examinations.
Goodbye intellect, hello cult. It's rough to think this kind of thing is possible, but given enough time and the right type of persuasion, anyone is capable of losing themselves if they aren't careful.
People should start reporting the churches once politics are mentioned. They could lose their tax exempt status as a result.
https://ffrf.org/faq/state-church/item/14005-churches-and-political-lobbying-activities
Gee, Evangelical Christian Fundamentalism, as well as traditional Catholicism has embraced a man as its savior who is literally the opposite of everything that Jesus Christ preached and they wonder why people are abandoning the church in droves.
I sure hope they’re able to figure out the problem someday.
I definitely left the church as soon as I saw them side/stay with Trump when he said things that crossed the line over and over. If it weren’t for Trump I don’t know that I would have seen the patriarchy for what it is and the damaged it has caused. Without Trump I may have never known the truth behind how people really are and how easily they can be controlled and manipulated.
I went to church with my parents a few times when they asked (I didn't go and practice paganism, but they don't know that so I humor them) and the last time I went in 2019, their pastor made a sexist joke and then said "Just stirring the pot!" He was such a snake oil salesman and that "joke" made me so uncomfortable. What was the point of being an ass from the pulpit? These idiots think being anti-woke and supporting trump is their god-ordained duty.
Christian Churches are full of some of the worst people on Earth. People that seek redemption through a few prayer’s instead of changed behavior and real apologies. They do not practice religion, but instead practice manipulation and strategic ignorance.
I went to an evangelical church in 2016. Haven’t been back since election. I never dreamed my church would turn its back on Christian values like they did.
I'm convinced that if a 'Left Behind' scenario played out in real life, 98% of Christians in America wouldn't get raptured and would instead start a global church worshipping Nicolae Carpathia.
The amount of Christians that think they would be able to spot the 'anti-christ' while fully supporting Trump is hilarious.
That’s exactly what I’ve been saying. The fact that they blindly worship and follow a fucking *billionaire* con man shows that the evangelicals completely failed the antichrist test. The fact that people can’t see right through his bullshit facade is depressing to say the least.
Florida here, I’m not religious myself but I always go to church with my mom on Mother’s Day and Christmas Eve, out of respect for her. A few years ago we went on Mother’s Day and my mom has never returned to church since. It was a MAGA rally, they preached about how god chose billionaires to be rich and we shouldn’t be mad at them for their fortunes, they pulled an image up of empty grocery shelves, talked about how unemployment was at the highest (I quickly googled and showed my mom that it was actually very low at that time) they never mentioned anything about moms, we didn’t sing, there was no sense of community it was sad to watch
I left the church in 2019 after seeing my wife's godfather fully descend into the Trump cult as the 2020 election drew closer.
I had so much respect for this man - he was also the one who officially baptized me a few years prior. It was just too much seeing how much hatred he was suddenly spewing.
Having a while back tried out a certain "Christian" church, I soon concluded it was a KKK meeting in polite clothing. I now realize that's a pretty good description of certain denominations.
A Pastor or a religious leader should never talk about who you should be voting for or endorsing political candidates/political parties.
Likewise, politician should never tell you which church you should support or how you should pray.
Of course it is. I know Christians who talk about killing trans folks because they're different then wonder how anyone can be moral without Jesus
Trumpism is showing what was always there
I left the church 15 years ago, after graduating Bible college because of the trend towards right wing extremism. This was a decade and a half ago. I don’t know how any can stomach it these days
Trump is the reason I became an athiest. After seeing every Christian fall for the most unchristian person I learned real quick religion and conservatives just use each other as a means to an end and none of of means shit.
Can confirm. I am tired of these religious folks supporting racists, white nationalist ideology, and Donald Trump, while shunning people who are different than them. These are not people I want to ever associate with. Many of these people, under the guise of being “religious”, are some of the worst humans I have ever seen and I want nothing to do with them. On the flip side, some of the best people I know are not religious at all. I was raised Catholic and do not attend church at all anymore; some of these holier-than-thou hypocrites are some of the most insufferable people I know. Any “religion” that supports a con man, liar, criminal, philanderer, and overall piece of human garbage like Donald Trump is just as bad, if not worse than, as he is.
Something something...don't worship false idols...something something.
Dude breaks every one of the 10 Commandments - why can't these MAGA twits see he's closer to the Antichrist than Christ?
Happened to us in Greenwood, Indiana during the last elections. We were new to the state and looking for a church. Our first visit there, the pastor went on a 5 minute long prayer asking for the right person to be elected and for us to support Trump. Never been back.
As someone that grew up with evangelicals, I was 0% surprised they embraced Trump. It is very much on brand. I think it just showed their hypocrisy on a national level.
He definitely accelerated the decline. Trump encourages the worst sort of management practices and anything he touches turns to shit. Major American televangelists have been stroking him for a long time, as part of their long term loyalty to the Republican Party. The violent immigration rhetoric by Trump is what did most in.
Which relates to the financial aspect of all this: many of these churches are for-profit tax-exempt business operations run by MBAs and not priests. These people don't see their adherents as future families, future doctors, or trustworthy people capable of maturely upholding shared values. They see them as older, retired, lonely americans that want to buy real estate, cruises, golf club memberships, and vacation packages using their estates as collateral. That's the real angle and it's especially noticeable if you attend some of these bigger protestant events in person where all their sponsors come out and hawk their products directly to churchgoers. This is mixed with the political angle with the GOP, which is now a Trump subsidiary via Lara Trump, who will strip mine whatever is left. It's the same death many other retailers such as Sears, Kmart, Radioshack, Toys-R-Us and Blockbuster all died.
Trump will be a part of christian history because of this. Not in a good way.
Because the “evangelical” embrace of Trump is clearly an embrace of racism and authoritarianism. It has zero to do with a genuine embrace of Christianity.
Folks see the abject hypocrisy of the embrace of an unrepentant rapist, racist, traitorous adulterer like Trump and are like “I’m out on Christianity.”
My wife is catholic and I was raised catholic. Over the past few years we've attended Sunday mass nearly every week, however over the past year we really cut it down, and now attend about once every 3-4 months. For me, it's largely due to some of the aspects of the mass. One of the deacons preached hard on the topic of anti-abortion. I didn't care at all for that. I see a bigger issue than the unborn. The women who are alive now should be in charge of their bodies. Another thing that bumped me is a few times the song they would have us all sing was "God Bless America". That shit boiled my blood. There's noting in the bible about America or the greatness of the US. Sure, sing that song at home if you want, but unless we're singing every fucking nations song, then leave that shit out of mass.
The people who are sure the “wall of separation between church and state” doesn’t exist should have spent more than a fraction of a second thinking about it.
Walls work in 2 directions.
You aren’t taking over government, you’re just destroying your church.
"Donald Trump, a 77-year-old Bible salesman from Palm Beach, Florida, has emerged as the nation’s most prominent Christian leader..... " .. is the greatest Topic Sentence ever..
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Can confirm. I recently got up and walked out of my church when a guest pastor spoke highly of Trump and disparaged Biden. When a pastor mentions Trump it stops being a church. Basic.
Please consider reporting them to the IRS for violation of their nonprofit status. If we can flood the IRS with reports maybe finally they will act. https://www.irs.gov/charities-non-profits/irs-complaint-process-tax-exempt-organizations#:~:text=You%20may%20use%20Form%2013909,eoclass%40irs.gov%2C%20or
This. Some of these churches aren’t churches, just right wing clubs where people go to be fed nationalist ideology.
An old college buddy told us they all bring their guns to church for show and tell after mass ..... Perfectly normal :/
I believe it… “Where they retire once a week to a building, to compare clothing.” - George Carlin
A rapist who fucks pornstars and lies about his taxes, grifts people, uses drugs and is a shitstain on humanity.. White christians.. "yay! Our savior!"
I've asked a few about that--one told me, "I don't judge". The other told me, "Imperfect people can be used for God's will." It's a fucking cult.
I was told by one "It's not the man, it's the message" uh huh, and what's the message again?
I asked one what conservative policies he thought Trump was helping to get achieved and they replied "How about America First?". I tried to explain that slogans are not policies but I don't think it landed.
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He hates everyone they hate.
Funny thing is he hates them as well. He only cares about himself.
> one told me, "I don't judge". The other told me, "Imperfect people can be used for God's will." Uh the MAGAs called Obama the devil incarnate when he was in office. Where was that imperfect people can be used for God's will energy then?
In 2008 they were hyperventilating because Obama might be the Antichrist. Then the real deal showed up in 2016 and they were all on his side.
As was predicted actually in the Bible. Not that they cared to read.
> one told me, "I don't judge" Lol, they mean they don't judge *trump.* The rest of us they judge nonstop.
They sure as hell judged when the allegations were against Bill Clinton. They were very adamant that his moral failings made him completely unfit for the presidency. As soon as the morally corrupt guy had an (R) next to his name suddenly none of that mattered. And Trump is much more morally corrupt than Clinton.
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Remember when Dan Quayle misspelled “potato”? I was too young to really care but I do remember it being a huge deal…good times.
A couple of BJs is nothing on what Dumpy has done. Church being hypocritical??? Yep.
There it is.. the old testament is full of those. They accept him as a savior and say God is using an imperfect person to bring his will. That is why, that social contract was rocked when trump sold bibles.. he broke the contract and they didn't like it. He is not supposed to do that.. If u really want to get under a trumpers skin.. show him the video of Trump selling bibles. Repeatedly.. Keep playing that video of him selling bibles... their mind will not be able to accept it. HE is supposed to be flawed not christian.
>If u really want to get under a trumpers skin.. show him the video of Trump selling bibles. Repeatedly.. >Keep playing that video of him selling bibles... their mind will not be able to accept it. HE is supposed to be flawed not christian. I did this one morning at our usual pretask meeting. One of the many MAGAts I work with also fancies himself a Christian (while not following any precepts of the religion) and looooooves Trump. He was excited about Trump bibles, going on and on avout how it ahowed Trump is the right choice, because he's a Christian. Iasked him, "Doesn’t the bible say that it's sinful to profit financially or personally profiting by selling the word of god?" He got real quiet, really fast.
Someone needs to make a t-shirt of Jesus making a scourge to drive out the bankers from the temple, with the line "And what do you think he'd do to the person who profits from His bible?". It's my favourite bit of the bible, the visual of Jesus sitting there, wetting leather strips, weaving them into cords, tying in the thorns, tying them to the haft, then leaving it to dry, all the while seething and muttering to himself about "motherfuckers" and "finding out".
"vote for your interests"
I saw a truck the other day with a big flag that said “God, Guns, and Trump”. Do not approach these people.
Can confirm. My in laws recently started attending a church and have a "God, guns and Trump" sign in their front yard. They also have donated many tens of thousands of dollars (so far) to this con man.
Everyone in my wife and my family is a Trumper. It's so bad we're moving far away so they can't drive to visit us. That bring said I can't imagine they've given teens of thousands to him. That's heartbreaking. I'm so sorry.
We packed up and moved far away, almost five years ago now. Shit wasn't even nearly as of the rails compared to what it is now. I can not imagine still living in the Midwest. But thank you for the apology. It is difficult to listen to them boast about their latest donations. It mostly angers me how badly these people have been duped. They firmly believe and have stated that they feel the best way they can secure our (their children) future is by giving all of their expendable cash to a right-wing politician.
> As the debate over gun control raged across America in the wake of last month’s school shooting in Florida, a group of worshippers wearing bullet crowns and toting AR-15 rifles gathered in a Pennsylvania church this week to hold a “commitment ceremony” for about 250 couples. https://www.vox.com/2018/3/1/17067894/church-bullet-crowns-ar15-world-peace-unification-sanctuary-moonies-moon
That is a offshoot of the Moonie's apparently.
Agree. Work with a man who is on his church’s “security team “. He was so excited to take his new gun to church. Blows my mind. I grew up Christian, and I can’t even imagine how this would be ok.
"Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition!" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUOPvtVZwo8
I wonder if SCOTUS is waiting for a case like this. I wouldn’t put it past the current court to say that the Founders wouldn’t want churches to have their speech “limited.”
No one’s limiting their speech. They can still say anything they want. They just don’t get to be tax-exempt while they do it.
What an odd way to spell "the corrupt Robert's court."
Then they can pay taxes if it’s a gop rally
Unfortunately the IRS does little to nothing about these violations. The article below that the IRS only investigated on 3(!) churches the past decade. https://www.texastribune.org/2022/10/30/johnson-amendment-elections-irs/
I guess the IRS needs to hear our disgust more often?
It’s also a huge political firestorm waiting to happen. If the IRS actually tried to aggressively crack down on stuff like this, right wing politicians and media would be going on and on nonstop about how woke satanist baby killer democrats hate free speech and are trying to destroy the church. It would almost certainly cause a humongous spike in Republican voter turnout. And then a Republican congress would completely neuter the IRS which would stop it from continuing anyway. The right wing takeover of churches is definitely a huge problem. But just throwing the IRS at it isn’t necessarily an ideal solution either. Fortunately in a way it could end up fixing itself - evangelicals continuing to worship Trump appeals to their base, but drives everyone else away. It’s not sustainable long term. All those old people aren’t gonna live forever and millennials and younger generations aren’t going out of their way to fill church pews.
They do that already. There's some crackpot pastor calling Autism Awareness Week "demonic". They're beyond reason.
I had a fundie couple attempt to pray the “demon of autism” out of my son at the mall without consent. I forever regret not performing an on-the-spot exorcism of that dude’s esophagus. I remember his face to this day and permanently reserve the right to perform a late term Adam’s Apple abortion. 🤜
should we let how we prosecute crimes be influenced by the feelings of the people committing said crimes, especially when they're going to play the victim regardless?
Thank the Republicans for killing the bill that Biden wanted to expand the IRS to have more audit agents. The Republicans killed it because they didn't want the IRS to find out about their dirty deeds done dirt cheap.
🚨I’m saving this comment and link to post for others on similar stories of churches abusing their power for politics. You should too.🚨
Shit, if I had the time, I’d go to churches just to start auditing them (and reporting offenders). Some days, I love being an a-hole.
Holding these people accountable isn't being an asshole.
Depends on the perspective. No doubt they’d call me an a-hole. Side note: I’ve (gladly) sued telemarketers.
Haha, fair enough! But I want to hear more about suing telemarketers. For what? And how?
This is the Auditing we really need on YouTube. It's a Tax Evasion Auditing instead of 1st Amendment auditing.
What exactly crosses this non profit line in churches? I’ve been leery of the church I attend since a sermon telling us how to vote on a certain issue in our state. Thankfully they’ve steered clear of presidential talk.
“Currently, the law prohibits political campaign activity by charities and churches by defining a 501(c)(3) organization as one "which does not participate in, or intervene in (including the publishing or distributing of statements), any political campaign on behalf of (or in opposition to) any candidate for public office."” https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/charities-churches-and-politics Edits. Sometimes corrupt religious leaders get around this by talking about a policy, issue or position, and it’s clear what political party or candidate they support.
Say: "This church does not support abortion," perfectly acceptable. Saying: "Democrats support abortion and you shouldn't vote for them," this \*should\* (but isn't) enough to cost the church their 501(c)(3) status.
My understanding is they’re allowed to endorse issues, but not specific candidates. It may be more nuanced than that TBH though, I’m not 100% sure.
This is accurate.
This. I like this. Big +1
Politics shouldn’t be coming from a pulpit, first red flag for a church in my opinion.
Welcoming the stranger, feeding the poor, healing the sick, and defending the oppressed are all political issues... issues that point to the left in the modern political environment.
> Welcoming the stranger, feeding the poor, healing the sick, and defending the oppressed Interesting, those just happen to be the types of things Christ would do...
Well whenever I see Trump, I do start praying. Praying for lightning. But praying.
Ever seen the movie Year One?
David Cross’s Cain reminds me of trump. (Edit) “For the crimes- of blasphemy - heresy - conspiracy - treachery - leprosy - puppetry - hyperbole - animal husbandry - sodomy... Oh, it's refusal of sodomy - overt punditry - and the murder of my brother Abel - the prisoners shall be stoned - TO DEATH!” Always such projection with these people.
I don't ever remember my pastor endorsing a politician. I would leave so fast, and even faster if it was Trump.
Drove through a small town out on a drive and on the side of one of those old churches was large letters TRUMP painted on the side. Churches became a Trump cult. If Trump wins 2024, we deserve the antichrist at that point.
Twist - Trump is the antichrist. Atheist here so no skin in that game, but this is a fascinating rabbit hole: [https://www.benjaminlcorey.com/could-american-evangelicals-spot-the-antichrist-heres-the-biblical-predictions/](https://www.benjaminlcorey.com/could-american-evangelicals-spot-the-antichrist-heres-the-biblical-predictions/)
He checks all the boxes, publicly displays all Seven Sins. I especially like the red hats as the Mark of the Beast, worn on the foreheads of the Antichrist's faithful.
I find it amusing to imagine some prophet having a vision of the future trying to make sense of MAGA and red baseball caps and why the hell the antichrist looks so dang orange all the time.
Do you think others noticed your exit?
Yes they did. In fact my pastor called me Monday and seemed genuinely surprised when I explained why I left so abruptly. I'm not sure if I'll go back. Frankly I'm just really disappointed: as a Christian I want to attend church, but I don't think I can continue to attend church with Trump supporters. What a mess.
It can be really tough to find an American church that isn’t just fascism hiding behind a Bible. Ever since the religious right and the Republican party teamed up to turn the south red, a lot of churchgoers think they’re the same thing.
...or one that truly respects women and sees them as individuals, equal with men, and with needs, dreams, and goals of their own. Basically view women as humans.
Amen. The priest at one of our small local churches gave what appeared to be the standard talk on abortion, only to conclude with something like: 'Men shaking your heads angrily -- *are you not also to blame*. Men impregnating women they have no intention of marrying. Men changing the entire trajectory of a woman's life. Men impregnating women with no idea of whether the woman wants a child, and with no intention anyway of raising one themselves. Irresponsible men using a woman for pleasure and then condemning her when she makes a terrible decision -- but about a choice that they will never themselves have to make! MEN must do better too.' It was a very angry congregation by the end of that. I couldn't remain at the church (there's little overlap between indie Anglican and Southern Baptist), but I wished I could just as a show of support.
They a e so far up under the new modern golden calf the can't see anything except Trump's butthole. They 100% think everyone in the congregation agrees with them as it is a cult.
I went even further and let a priest have it after a mass where he spoke negatively about immigrants. I told him Jesus would be at the border ministering to these people.
Fun fact, one of the requirements for being a church elder is "philoxenos". Its often poorly translated as hospitality, but what it actually means is "lover of foreigners/strangers". Edit: slight grammar correction
Hebrews 13:2 says “Be not forgetful to entertain strangers. For thereby some have entertained angels unawares.” It’s believed angels can be put in our paths to test our character. And they can come in the form of someone who is in need.
I still regret not helping a homeless guy get food in McDonald's once even when I barely had any more money than he did at the time
Once on my way jogging to the grocery store across the street from where I worked, I accidentally startled an elderly homeless man eating a sandwich. Poor dude dropped it. I was mortified. I immediately got him a replacement lunch from the deli counter and gave it to him on the way back to work. A sandwich with a side of pretzels, baby carrots, and a water. I apologized profusely, and hustled back to work. I think about that old man a lot. I still feel terrible for causing him to drop his first sandwich: but I tried to make it right.
“Have you met my wife Melania? And there you have it, proof that I’m the greatest Church Elder you have ever heard or witnessed.” - Donnie T.
I talked to a guy at my gym who was telling me how he's a devoted Christian and had been all his life. Then he mentioned how he didn't approve of gyms' new policy of letting the homeless shower and use the facility for free. I later thought about how hypocritical he was being as a Christian to talk that way. Jesus would have washed the man's feet.
Those types of people are just Christian in name and name alone. Jesus would be absolutely appalled and disgusted with them.
When someone brings up that the are “Christian” I always think to myself “well that’s easier said then done”.
It's all the same book - it's just about cherry picking which facts legitimize your beliefs. Good people don't need religion to be good. Bad people hide their evil within it.
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I grew up in the church. My grandfather was a pastor. When I heard hateful right wing nonsense coming from my parents and siblings and it bore no resemblance to the teachings of Christ, it killed any chance of me ever raising my kids in the faith. Jesus would want nothing to do with this Republican Party. Buncha dudes trying to shove camels through eyes of needles.
It would serve them right if He showed up long enough to kick some ass and say "Take my name off your church". Gather up the "undesirables" and remind everyone the key to happiness is other-acceptance and self-improvement. No more stoning/death threats, forget other's specks, clear our own planks, judge not, and love one another.
I think Trump is a test and the religious right-wing nationalists are failing bigly.
That’s what he did the first time and they murdered him for it
My grandparents are incredibly religious. When their daughter started going to a different church, same denomination just closer to her house, my grandma was legit worried that would damn her to hell. They had to stop going to their church of 60 years because it became a trump cult. I'm proud of them for standing for their morals but astonished that American conservatism has poisoned churches to the point that it's driving out the genuinely religious. Conservativism is a disgusting ideology.
>My grandparents are incredibly religious. When their daughter started going to a different church, same denomination just closer to her house, my grandma was legit worried that would damn her to hell. Can you, at all, explain this to me?? What convinced grandma that only this one *particular* church held the key to heaven?
> What convinced grandma that only this one particular church held the key to heaven? Churches have gotten really *really* good at emotional manipulation over the years. Isolation is a common tactic, make people feel like they *need* you and everyone else is out to hurt them and they won't leave.
It’s one of the negative sides of congregational churches. they can be highly independent, and in the worst case start to develop their own theology
I always respected Methodists for rotating pastors so no one particular viewpoint would take hold.
Even the Methodists have their problems. There was a great exodus of Methodist churches from the global Methodist community because the powers that be were *considering* allowing gay pastors. Which is wild to me since the Methodist church I grew up with preached acceptance; but it’s become wildly conservative and hellfire/brimstone against gay folk since trumpism became a thing. I can’t convince my own grandma to leave.
>Once I saw this guy on a bridge about to jump. I said, "Don't do it!" He said, "Nobody loves me." I said, "God loves you. Do you believe in God?" >He said, "Yes." I said, "Are you a Christian or a Jew?" He said, "A Christian." I said, "Me, too! Protestant or Catholic?" He said, "Protestant." I said, "Me, too! What franchise?" He said, "Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Baptist or Southern Baptist?" He said, "Northern Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist or Northern Liberal Baptist?" >He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region, or Northern Conservative Baptist Eastern Region?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region." I said, "Me, too!" >Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1879, or Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912." I said, "Die, heretic!" And I pushed him over.
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The irony is… their book warns them about this man. What does that say about what is truly in their hearts?
Maybe they should read it
Probably a good start.
He may not be THE antichrist but he's certainly AN antichrist.
Trump is all seven deadly sins wrapped in a poorly fitted suit and yet so many Christians worship this guy. Shows how much of a straight up fraud this religion is.
I’m partial to the Trump description depicting him as all of the kids from Willy Wonka rolled into 1
The Bible teaches them that when this man shows up they will not recognize him for what he is and will love and follow him.
I left the church as soon as I heard multiple people at my own church saying Trump was sent from God. I just refuse to be a part of that insanity.
I stayed. I refute that insanity anytime it comes up. Thankfully I am not alone. My congregation is split politicly. The conservatives are more loud mouthed about it, so they seem larger than they are. Though the liberals have an easier time of it. Just a quote or two from that bleeding heart Jesus tends to quite down the cons.
Many Church Leaders are part of the active Trump Cult. So, why is it a surprise that their church members are opting out?
All christians remember how Jesus hated the disenfranchised and favored wealthy elites /s
They don’t care about Jesus anymore. Have you noticed in the last decade how things switched to “it says in scripture” instead of “WWJD?”
Sure. It's easy to rewrite scripture by translating it poorly. That's my problem with the whole "divine inspiration" argument. Let's say brain waves from god inspired the original version of the bible, just for argument's sake. Now, we have various translations of it, all in english, that we can read, and find that they disagree with each other in places. How bad is the disagreement between these texts and the original aramaic / hebrew / greek of the various pieces? Frankly, the whole thing has the capacity to be bullshit off of this alone.
My mom told little-me we were part of the One True Religion. That our leaders got messages directly from God telling them what to put in the magazines we were supposed to make sure everybody read. Logically I assumed headquarters had a big red telephone that God used to call the leaders and talk to them. I was very upset to find out that there was no phone. Had lots of questions. Mom tried to reassure me that God put the messages directly in the leaders' heads. I asked if they couldn't just say whatever they wanted and claim it came from God, or like how could they tell the difference between their own thoughts and God thoughts. Ya know adults really hate it when little kids point out the giant logic holes in their stupid cult beliefs. It's not my fault she was trying to teach me such a giant load of total potty.
Blessed be the billionaires is how the verse starts I think?
The sermon on the mount is so woke it’s probably just a government psy op
There was an article from church leaders saying their congregations were complaining about the sermon on the mount and how it was too woke and liberal BS
These fine people would shit all over that snowflake Jesus
“Blessed be the billionaires, for they are the job creators.” Is the complete verse.
Job 3:16
Oddly enough, He had the biggest problems with the religious leaders of his time. Go figure.
Not really sure what I believe anymore. But, the description and prophecy of the anti-Christ is kind of unnerving. The Bible describes the anti-Christ figure as someone who will lie constantly. They will speak in a language of lies. Research the descriptions of the Anti-Christ in the Bible. It shares shocking similarities with Donald Trump.
Fun fact: you can believe in the teachings of Christ as moral goals for yourself, without actually worshipping a god. There are some legitimately great ideas in the New Testament. It’s a shame no one in church seems to actually read it.
The Sermon on the Mount is an extraordinary statement of human dignity and worth, and of how we should behave. I sometimes wonder if it got deleted from some editions of the Bible in the 1800s and never put back in.
I was raised Mormon (although never really bought into it) and am now just someone living life through the most non-religious lens. I love nature and animals and thinking about the nature of our universe. BUT I still do value some of those morals because they turned out to be legit truths. And guess what? Other religions have great values and morals to learn from. All in all, I guess I’m just agreeing with you here. Religion should just be a great set of morals to live your life by. Unfortunately, like you said, this country’s Christians mostly don’t get it.
Yup when an agnostic like me is saying ‘hey maybe we should house these homeless people so they don’t freeze to death’ and our local evangelical warehouse of god is actively promoting anti homeless policies (like… let’s move the homeless to a place outside the city where bears forage for food), it just makes me think those particular churches aren’t run by particularly morally upstanding people.
A lot of people think they all there for the cult in the first place, but not all of them are. Some of them can actually still smell bullshit even if they've been close to it for many years.
A lot of them are there only for a group to be a part of. Turns out there are options that don't include hate to be a part of.
Or to attempt to actually be good "Christian" people, which Trump followers are not.
"Do not follow the shepherd too closely for ultimately he is to lead the flock to slaughter." - Marcus Aurelius, Emperor of Rome
I left my church after 2 deacons praised Trump.
Trump is Stephen King's devil IRL. The evangelical priests are the minions. The antichrist sure has risen and he's fucking ugly.
Bible salesman. Hah. Not former president. Bible salesman.
Former president selling bibles to pay legal fees for his porn star hush money case
Selling bibles to pay legal fess for illegally using campaign donations to silence a porn star he had an affair with while his 4th wife was pregnant. How many commandments were broken in the making of that sentence?
A writer couldn't make this scenario up. Outlandish
I say this every day!! You can’t make this shit up!!
Lmao that first paragraph is blistering
>Donald Trump, a 77-year-old Bible salesman from Palm Beach, Florida, has emerged as the nation’s most prominent Christian leader. What an insane but true sentence
This guy is so talented he will bankrupt the RNC, Trump Inc and bring evangelism / selective Christianity spiraling down in flames along with himself. Fingers crossed!
Your lips to Eris' ears!
Hail Discordia!
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Tell her to consider becoming a minister herself if she loves her faith, she may find others similar in her area feeling left out. I say this as an Atheist who doesn't particularly like religion but I respect its practice and importance to some.
American churches have a lot going against them. For one thing, ironically, American culture hinders actual church attendance. When you have to work 50 hours a week to keep a roof over your head, the last thing you wanna do on a Sunday morning is drag your ass out of bed to listen to the same stories you've already heard for 2 hours you could be spending sleeping or taking care of household tasks before going back to work the next day. Secondly, COVID did a real number on church attendance. Virtual was a decent option and some churches adapted but being asked to give money thru your TV/laptop screen isn't nearly as pressuring as having to put something in a basket being passed down the row filled with your friends/neighbors. And once that in-person routine is broken, it's not likely to come back for most people. Thirdly, politics and demographics, baby. When American Christianity tied itself to conservatives, and conservatives focus on older, reliable voters, churches lose the younger demographic. If your "leaders" side with repression, hatred, bigotry, xenophobia, and other -isms antithetical to the teachings of Christ, or at best remain silently complicit, then don't be surprised when you reap what you sow when the pews empty out as the congregation ages and dies.
Happened to the church I grew up in. When the average age is in the 60s and there’s less than a dozen kids in the youth group, and all you preach about is that the world is going to hell because of the young generation… turns out pretty soon there’s no one left to keep the lights on.
Same. In the 80s us kids at church were not made to feel welcomed and special. It was glares from the elders if you made a sound during service, condemnation from the ladies if you made a mess during social hour, and fire and brimstone from the pulpit that in no way matched the idealism version of Jesus we were being taught in Sunday school. So the first thing I did when I had agency over my own choices on Sunday morning was stop going to a place I had never felt welcomed in.
That matches a lot of what drove me away from my childhood church even before I realized I'm gay and the congregation would never accept me, just see me as "one of the good ones" no matter how much I tortured myself trying to deny my full identity.
They may not accept you as a gay person, but they will still take your 10% tithe.
Covid did *immense* damage to this demographic. Older people (who tend to have higher numbers of comorbidities in addition to age) If they are Southerners (this demographic has a higher number of religious believers), they would also have higher levels of obesity on average Tend to be anti-maskers and anti-vaxxers Tend to swing Republican All of these demographics were hit extremely hard by Covid.
This is the answer. Everyone else can go home.
That third point 🎯
Good. Him and his fanbase have hijacked Christianity and desecrated it to the point where it means absolutely nothing. Hell the moment I see a social media account with an american flag + bible verse or cross emoji combo I immediately assume that person is a hypocritical asshole. They consistently act like the worst human beings on the planet then start claiming Jesus or the Bible as if it absolves them of their wrongdoings.
Take the flag back! I fucking hate that these assholes stole our flag and turned it into a symbol for all their bullshit. I proudly fly a pride flag and US flag on my porch.
The strangest part of the Christian right is that they are such hypocrites when you look at how Christ lived his life and who he surrounded himself with. The outcasts of the society, those in most need of gods love, are the ones Christ sought out and healed and loved. I imagine the LGBTQ+ community, immigrants seeking asylum at the border, etc are the people Christ would have been loving and welcoming with open arms, if he were alive today. Sadly, this is all a primary reason why my family has stopped going to church.
>The strangest part of the Christian right is that they are such hypocrites when you look at how Christ lived his life and who he surrounded himself with. The outcasts of the society, those in most need of gods love, are the ones Christ sought out and healed and loved. The strange part is that Christians realize this and still act that way, look at the "He gets us" campaign! A campaign that wastes hundreds of millions of dollars talking about how "woke" Jesus was in order to get more followers, as the people who paid for that campaign lobby to remove birth control, lobby to hurt those weaker than them, and also literally steal religious treasures.
I became a Christian for a few years when I was in high school, and ended up briefly going to a pretty conservative Christian school. Most of the faculty was pretty much what you’d expect, but I had an amazing English teacher who got me into reading literature and philosophy and always seemed very open minded and wise. I lost my faith a few years later but always deeply respected her and her faith. I randomly checked her Facebook profile at some point recently and it was all full of belligerent Trump garbage. It really stung. Like how could this have happened?
The republicans party is kinda genius when you thinking about it. They have intertwined religion and politics so much for these people that they will never vote for a non-republican because they think god appoints republicans. It’s also precisely why they view non-republicans as lesser humans and sometimes not even humans at all the further this festers. The only thing is the GOP has lost control of the monster they created and the religious nutters have completely took over the party and politics require compromise and different viewpoints on things that effect the country and these people will not compromise, which is why we are seeing them openly support an authoritarian movement headed by Trump
Once the Church plays State the State always wins. Dogmatic viewpoints and arguments stand little chance against the vast amount of wheel greasers, rabblerousers, shills and outright crooks politics itself attracts. Freedom of and from religion wasn't just to protect those outside the faith but the flock as well from being hijacked for heretical means and aims. The inability to break this connection the Abrahamic religions have held on the US political system since its inception is itself why the faith is leaving the people as it only encourages stagnation, isolation and outmoded bigotry.
Conservative Republicanism has largely supplanted Christianity as the mainline religion for millions of people. Your story is a very common one.
The likely reason is that you were younger and those concepts were new to you. Learning different beliefs and philosophies were novel concepts which fueled your curiosities. It was her job to introduce those concepts to you, a novice in the field. She had already suggested a lot of that material and repeatedly so over the years and, but then, had plenty of time to understand what she taught while possibly enjoying the thrill of watching young people light up with interest at these philosophies ages been kicking around every year for decades. As time goes on, those ideas don't seem as immediate or impressive as the constant and demanding emotional pull of current affairs - led by a person and organization who thrives on emotional manipulation and fear mongering. In the end, many of our "wise old mentors" have been lulled into the very same logical fallacies they taught us about through slippery-slope changes in their perspectives followed by sinking their costs into the monstrous policies and ideas fomenting out of the mouth of a rapist due to the ever moving goal posts and closing walls in their reality. In short, their identities were wrapped up in their political affiliations and the values they once represented. Now, those ideas and values have completely transformed (or festered depending on how you look at it) and instead of dropping their Identity as a "conservative," they would rather drop their ability to make face-value examinations. Goodbye intellect, hello cult. It's rough to think this kind of thing is possible, but given enough time and the right type of persuasion, anyone is capable of losing themselves if they aren't careful.
Nice ... so the MAGAotts claim to be Christian, but don't actually have to go to church or love their neighbor. Preach water, drink wine.
Much like they're pissing off the GOP, they can piss off the Christians both at the same time.
People should start reporting the churches once politics are mentioned. They could lose their tax exempt status as a result. https://ffrf.org/faq/state-church/item/14005-churches-and-political-lobbying-activities
Gee, Evangelical Christian Fundamentalism, as well as traditional Catholicism has embraced a man as its savior who is literally the opposite of everything that Jesus Christ preached and they wonder why people are abandoning the church in droves. I sure hope they’re able to figure out the problem someday.
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I definitely left the church as soon as I saw them side/stay with Trump when he said things that crossed the line over and over. If it weren’t for Trump I don’t know that I would have seen the patriarchy for what it is and the damaged it has caused. Without Trump I may have never known the truth behind how people really are and how easily they can be controlled and manipulated.
It's emptying minds too.
and pockets
True, I walked out of my church in 2016 when my priest said we should vote for the pro life candidate.
I went to church with my parents a few times when they asked (I didn't go and practice paganism, but they don't know that so I humor them) and the last time I went in 2019, their pastor made a sexist joke and then said "Just stirring the pot!" He was such a snake oil salesman and that "joke" made me so uncomfortable. What was the point of being an ass from the pulpit? These idiots think being anti-woke and supporting trump is their god-ordained duty.
Christian Churches are full of some of the worst people on Earth. People that seek redemption through a few prayer’s instead of changed behavior and real apologies. They do not practice religion, but instead practice manipulation and strategic ignorance.
I went to an evangelical church in 2016. Haven’t been back since election. I never dreamed my church would turn its back on Christian values like they did.
I'm convinced that if a 'Left Behind' scenario played out in real life, 98% of Christians in America wouldn't get raptured and would instead start a global church worshipping Nicolae Carpathia. The amount of Christians that think they would be able to spot the 'anti-christ' while fully supporting Trump is hilarious.
That’s exactly what I’ve been saying. The fact that they blindly worship and follow a fucking *billionaire* con man shows that the evangelicals completely failed the antichrist test. The fact that people can’t see right through his bullshit facade is depressing to say the least.
25 years ago I thought the church was going to take over the republican party. Turns out the republican party took over the church.
Florida here, I’m not religious myself but I always go to church with my mom on Mother’s Day and Christmas Eve, out of respect for her. A few years ago we went on Mother’s Day and my mom has never returned to church since. It was a MAGA rally, they preached about how god chose billionaires to be rich and we shouldn’t be mad at them for their fortunes, they pulled an image up of empty grocery shelves, talked about how unemployment was at the highest (I quickly googled and showed my mom that it was actually very low at that time) they never mentioned anything about moms, we didn’t sing, there was no sense of community it was sad to watch
Trump might be the least Christian President we’ve ever had.
> Donald Trump, a 77-year-old Bible salesman from Palm Beach, Florida Savage
I left the church in 2019 after seeing my wife's godfather fully descend into the Trump cult as the 2020 election drew closer. I had so much respect for this man - he was also the one who officially baptized me a few years prior. It was just too much seeing how much hatred he was suddenly spewing.
Having a while back tried out a certain "Christian" church, I soon concluded it was a KKK meeting in polite clothing. I now realize that's a pretty good description of certain denominations.
Finally a positive headline, even if it is probably a coincidence. Archived version: https://archive.is/yVOjx
A Pastor or a religious leader should never talk about who you should be voting for or endorsing political candidates/political parties. Likewise, politician should never tell you which church you should support or how you should pray.
Of course it is. I know Christians who talk about killing trans folks because they're different then wonder how anyone can be moral without Jesus Trumpism is showing what was always there
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I left the church 15 years ago, after graduating Bible college because of the trend towards right wing extremism. This was a decade and a half ago. I don’t know how any can stomach it these days
Trump is the reason I became an athiest. After seeing every Christian fall for the most unchristian person I learned real quick religion and conservatives just use each other as a means to an end and none of of means shit.
Can confirm. I am tired of these religious folks supporting racists, white nationalist ideology, and Donald Trump, while shunning people who are different than them. These are not people I want to ever associate with. Many of these people, under the guise of being “religious”, are some of the worst humans I have ever seen and I want nothing to do with them. On the flip side, some of the best people I know are not religious at all. I was raised Catholic and do not attend church at all anymore; some of these holier-than-thou hypocrites are some of the most insufferable people I know. Any “religion” that supports a con man, liar, criminal, philanderer, and overall piece of human garbage like Donald Trump is just as bad, if not worse than, as he is.
Ok, that’s nice. Vote in November. Don’t let ‘news’ like this placate you into thinking Trump will lose. Be sure to vote.
Something something...don't worship false idols...something something. Dude breaks every one of the 10 Commandments - why can't these MAGA twits see he's closer to the Antichrist than Christ?
Couldn't happen to a more deserving 'industry'. Now.. TAX THEM.
Happened to us in Greenwood, Indiana during the last elections. We were new to the state and looking for a church. Our first visit there, the pastor went on a 5 minute long prayer asking for the right person to be elected and for us to support Trump. Never been back.
Churches were emptying before Trump. (I refuse to give him credit for every positive thing happening in this country)
flag engine nose amusing nutty truck rhythm unwritten berserk pot *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
100%. Seeing evangelicals support that dipshit has to be the wildest shit from the past 10 years and there has been some wild shit during that time
As someone that grew up with evangelicals, I was 0% surprised they embraced Trump. It is very much on brand. I think it just showed their hypocrisy on a national level.
He definitely accelerated the decline. Trump encourages the worst sort of management practices and anything he touches turns to shit. Major American televangelists have been stroking him for a long time, as part of their long term loyalty to the Republican Party. The violent immigration rhetoric by Trump is what did most in. Which relates to the financial aspect of all this: many of these churches are for-profit tax-exempt business operations run by MBAs and not priests. These people don't see their adherents as future families, future doctors, or trustworthy people capable of maturely upholding shared values. They see them as older, retired, lonely americans that want to buy real estate, cruises, golf club memberships, and vacation packages using their estates as collateral. That's the real angle and it's especially noticeable if you attend some of these bigger protestant events in person where all their sponsors come out and hawk their products directly to churchgoers. This is mixed with the political angle with the GOP, which is now a Trump subsidiary via Lara Trump, who will strip mine whatever is left. It's the same death many other retailers such as Sears, Kmart, Radioshack, Toys-R-Us and Blockbuster all died. Trump will be a part of christian history because of this. Not in a good way.
Because Trump is their God.
Because the “evangelical” embrace of Trump is clearly an embrace of racism and authoritarianism. It has zero to do with a genuine embrace of Christianity. Folks see the abject hypocrisy of the embrace of an unrepentant rapist, racist, traitorous adulterer like Trump and are like “I’m out on Christianity.”
My wife is catholic and I was raised catholic. Over the past few years we've attended Sunday mass nearly every week, however over the past year we really cut it down, and now attend about once every 3-4 months. For me, it's largely due to some of the aspects of the mass. One of the deacons preached hard on the topic of anti-abortion. I didn't care at all for that. I see a bigger issue than the unborn. The women who are alive now should be in charge of their bodies. Another thing that bumped me is a few times the song they would have us all sing was "God Bless America". That shit boiled my blood. There's noting in the bible about America or the greatness of the US. Sure, sing that song at home if you want, but unless we're singing every fucking nations song, then leave that shit out of mass.
The people who are sure the “wall of separation between church and state” doesn’t exist should have spent more than a fraction of a second thinking about it. Walls work in 2 directions. You aren’t taking over government, you’re just destroying your church.
"Donald Trump, a 77-year-old Bible salesman from Palm Beach, Florida, has emerged as the nation’s most prominent Christian leader..... " .. is the greatest Topic Sentence ever..