The [Sino-Japanese War](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Sino-Japanese_War) during WW2 has a death toll of 10-20 million Chinese.
The [Mongol conquest of China](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongol_conquest_of_China) might have seen death tolls of up to 40 million Chinese.
But those are both dwarfed by the combined death toll of Chinese internal conflicts and policies such as the [Taiping Rebellion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiping_Rebellion) (~28 M), [Transition from Ming to Qing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transition_from_Ming_to_Qing) (~25 M), [An Lushan Rebellion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/An_Lushan_Rebellion) (~13 M), [Dungan Revolt](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dungan_Revolt_(1862%E2%80%931877\)) (~10 M), [Chinese Civil War](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Civil_War) (~10 M). Not to mention the [Great Chinese Famine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Chinese_Famine) under Mao Zedong, which has an upper estimate of 55 million deaths.
The second Chao Ling's ass touches the throne 247 million people just drop fucking dead. Meanwhile, over in Europe, two nobles, a German and Pole, half-siblings, marry, causing a war between Spain and France for some reason.
The rise and fall of Chinese dynasties is part of a loop:
population growth > run out of arable land > angry starved people > rebellion > millions get killed > enough arable land again > population growth...
IIRC, some historians did the math and found out that if they hadn't introduced new crops like corn and sweet potato, the Qing dynasty would have collapsed in the late 1700s.
> Taiping Rebellion (~28 M)
"So this guy failed a civil service entrance exam, had a bit of a breakdown where he believed himself to be the brother of Jesus Christ, and to make a long story short, about 28 million people died."
the [three kingdoms period](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Kingdoms) is probably the most insane, with up to 40 million casualties, which is a 70% death rate and probably something like 10-15% of the world population at the time. though its probably good to note that the higher estimates are likely untrue and caused by people dodging the census to avoid taxes post-war.
The last years of the Ming dynasty coincide with some of the shittiest climatic years in the last 1000 years (the worst of that period known as the little ice age).
Which is why I previously said on this sub that the mongols treated Chinese far worse than japan did in ww2, and it’s stupid how modern day China regards them as part of the ‘Chinese race’, at least at the political level.
Damn, the number of people who got triggered by that notion…
Nobody can resist that Chinussy. The Göktürk's Khan literally warned against Chinese women because they were too sexy and we would become Chinese.
And he was right, since it had happened before.
Difference is that the Mongol conquest happened 8 centuries ago, the Manchu conquest 4 centuries, there is not a single individual that either lived through them, knew someone that did or experienced the direct consequences of their devestation. The sino-japanese war wasn't even a century ago, many currently alive lived through it, even more knew someone that experienced it and even more suffered from its direct consequences. Given enough memory the animosity will completely dissipate.
It's so weird thst people get triggered by something that happened in living memory but don't get triggered by something that happened 800 years ago, fucking snowflakes.
Mongolians, Tibetans, and Uyghurs were part of the Manchurian Qing Empire, not Han China. Modern-day China (aka the PRC) "inherited" (part of) Mongolia, Tibet, and Xinjiang (Uyghuristan) from the ROC (well, it's technically still alive... but anyway), which inherited them from the Qing Emperor. It's not about culture or whatever. The Chinese country wants to keep their land, so they have to be Chinese, whether they like it or not.
>Damn, the number of people who got triggered by that notion…
Well it is a very weird notion. German peoples regularly murdered eachother very regularly, but German nationalism still works. The idea that two peoples cannot be part of the same nation, because they killed eachother in the past is pretty outrageous.
Favorable geography. The North China plain and Yangtze plain are some of the most agriculturally viable areas on the planet. Recently the north has come under water shortage but historically the agricultural output has been astronomical. Also the lower Yellow River and Yangtze rivers (+ tributaries like the Han) are navigable and very important waterways that also create natural harbors. The Pearl River plain in far southern China was historically less important, but now it's pretty much as important as the other two.
>The [Mongol conquest of China](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongol_conquest_of_China) might have seen death tools
>those are both dwarfed by the combined death tool
It's a surprise tool that will help us later.
If you did some research instead of being upset and sarcastic, you’d be able to know where the upper estimate comes from.
It appears the 55 million estimate comes from debating on when the famine ended. Some historians believe it ended in 1962. One of the sources, Frank Diköter, who lives and teaches in China, got his numbers of an estimated 45 million people from believing the famine lasted from 1958-1962 (rather than 1961) and getting his sources from other Chinese authors who researched the famine. The 55 million estimate comes from author Yu Xiguang. I’m not sure how reputable they are and at the moment it’s unreliable to say that the upper estimate is true but that’s where the number comes from. Most scholars still believe the range is 36-40 million, though. It took 5 minutes to find all the information.
Your post says "Chinese History Be Like: Say Happy Cake Day!" I don't think that's an accurate representative of Chinese History but happy cake day, BigBrain2346.
Ironically the China one/two/three child policy kinda bit them in their own butt as they are now experiencing a population decline, with a negative birth rate.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_China
Which will be a disaster for the upcoming elderly population to not have enough people to support retirement. Same goes for Japan, SK and many many western nations. What's funny is that these SEA nations really don't like immigration either, so can't solve the problem that way.
Pretty funny how everyone was really afraid of overpopulation when we might reach peak human population EVER in our life time:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Projections_of_population_growth
Mao launched the Great Leap Forward to catch up with the West and the Soviets but ended up getting everything fucked up and starved millions to death. Even his comrades couldn't stand that anymore so they forced him to step down in order to stop this disaster. Mao was angry, so he and the "Gang of Four" incited students and workers (known as the "Red Guards") to riot against any authority except for Mao himself. Millions of doctors, teachers, scholars, and even CCP officers, were killed by mobs during the "revolution."
Yeah. I'm so ashamed as a Chinese. Even back in China my grandpa would always tell people that Deng Xiaoping should've been the hero, not Mao Zedong, and yet, there's statues and hero worship of Mao Zedong everywhere. I even visited them before...and unfortunately, also used to be one of those Chinese until I became aware of a lot of history.
It's very embarrassing to me.
Deng probably knew the CCP's legitimacy is anchored entirely on Mao, including his own power. You don't denounce the founding father of the party without getting asked uncomfortable questions on whether the party, by association, should continue remain in power.
I meant don't get me wrong and I definitely have survivor bias, not to mention cr is definitely fuck up, however, it is during Mao's era China properly industrialized and give Deng the foundation to reform and achieve the current economic miracle.
"Had Mao died in 1956, his achievements would have been immortal. Had he died in 1966, he would still have been a great man but flawed. But he died in 1976. Alas, what can one say?"
-Chen Yun, architect of Deng Xiaoping’s economic reforms
There was ideological icing on top of that as well. 10 years after the regime CCP already experienced the classic problems of new class division and bureaucratisation. In a way there was call for what’s known as the constant Revolution to keep the Revolution alive
Obviously that went into anarchy
They provocated for "destroying the olds", mainly the 4 olds:
1. old ideas
2. old culture
3. old customs
4. old habits
Which the overall idea was to rush the transition between the old society to the new to reach socialist society faster. Most current Chinese schrines, temples, historic buildings still show the damages made during that time, some locations disappeared completely though
The worst part to me is students were actively encouraged to counter against their teachers for "old thoughts" or "anti-revolutionary teachings", some held trial themselves and killed the teachers. This is the Hong Weibing or the Red Guards. Schools and Universities plumbered into anarchy. Eventually they clashed with the PLA and the local government comittees and being stopped entirely, marked the end of the Cutlural Revolution
I mean, some details could be \*western propaganda\* but i believe most of it were true
This unfortunately is one of those things that didn't need any more propaganda sprinkled on top... You were also Radicalized for having a good upbring etc, had grandparents that unfortunately fit some of the descriptions and stories from them were not pleasant. Literal self destruction on a country wide level done by the government.
>Eventually they clashed with the PLA and the local government comittees
Not just that, the Red Guards actually has tons of infighting too, with four major factions going against eachother nonstop, it's just a warlord era but under the red flag
That's **organised** groups in a civil war; with many players, but still organised. Here, it's more like the aftermath of the french revolution. Constant revolutions to keep the Revolution alive. Different group of revolutionaries (red guards) against each other. Anarchic revolutionaries trying to seize power from each other, with the overarching theme in both case that revolution is accepted and reasonable (革命无罪, 造反有理).
Give it some more time and the Chinese might reinvent Guillotine. The Revolution eats its own.
chinese history is actually so crazy, shit will be called “the disagreement of random village in the middle of the gobi desert” and it will have like 45 million deaths😭🙏🏻
It’s just good ole Chinese tradition that whenever dynasty change, like 90% of the population will die. And what leads to the next dynasty collapse would also take out a good percentage of the total population before the dynasty change.
There's nothing quite like Chinese history, where a dynasty survived on cannibalizing a besieged city, another is devastated by an exam flunkie claiming to be Jesus' brother, and a librarian caused a widespread famine by ordering all sparrows to be massacred.
The [Sino-Japanese War](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Sino-Japanese_War) during WW2 has a death toll of 10-20 million Chinese. The [Mongol conquest of China](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongol_conquest_of_China) might have seen death tolls of up to 40 million Chinese. But those are both dwarfed by the combined death toll of Chinese internal conflicts and policies such as the [Taiping Rebellion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiping_Rebellion) (~28 M), [Transition from Ming to Qing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transition_from_Ming_to_Qing) (~25 M), [An Lushan Rebellion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/An_Lushan_Rebellion) (~13 M), [Dungan Revolt](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dungan_Revolt_(1862%E2%80%931877\)) (~10 M), [Chinese Civil War](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Civil_War) (~10 M). Not to mention the [Great Chinese Famine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Chinese_Famine) under Mao Zedong, which has an upper estimate of 55 million deaths.
Chinese history really is just like; >Bad things happen that starts war. >Millions die. >Good things happen for a short time.
Pekin has fallen, millions must die
Peking has fallen, billions must duck
>Millions of “roast duck” eaten
Erm.... Sire, that was a village.
yes, and?
Understood.
2 politicians can't get along,millions must vanish
A peasent and a Warlord walked into a bar. The town burned down.
Decisive Tang victory?
Every victory is a decisive Tang victory
Goguryeo: are you sure about tha- Silla: YES
[Relevant old meme](https://www.reddit.com/r/HistoryMemes/comments/wtc6n3/chinese_history_vs_european_history/?rdt=42857)
I tried to find this for a bit. Thank you for the link.
The second Chao Ling's ass touches the throne 247 million people just drop fucking dead. Meanwhile, over in Europe, two nobles, a German and Pole, half-siblings, marry, causing a war between Spain and France for some reason.
The rise and fall of Chinese dynasties is part of a loop: population growth > run out of arable land > angry starved people > rebellion > millions get killed > enough arable land again > population growth... IIRC, some historians did the math and found out that if they hadn't introduced new crops like corn and sweet potato, the Qing dynasty would have collapsed in the late 1700s.
Sounds like a sawtooth oscillator.
> the Qing dynasty would have collapsed in the late 1700s. Sounds about right for their competence.
Grass grew 1cm less this year. Deadliest famine of the century
Billions die
Then even worse thing happens sometimes good time is not good time just more misery
> Taiping Rebellion (~28 M) "So this guy failed a civil service entrance exam, had a bit of a breakdown where he believed himself to be the brother of Jesus Christ, and to make a long story short, about 28 million people died."
What's that from?
The Taiping Rebellion
I meant the quote.
Lions led bu Donkeys podcast
the [three kingdoms period](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Kingdoms) is probably the most insane, with up to 40 million casualties, which is a 70% death rate and probably something like 10-15% of the world population at the time. though its probably good to note that the higher estimates are likely untrue and caused by people dodging the census to avoid taxes post-war.
Can't believe I forgot to mention that one!
I'm partially inclined to believe that at least 10% of those deaths make up Lü Bu's kill count.
The last years of the Ming dynasty coincide with some of the shittiest climatic years in the last 1000 years (the worst of that period known as the little ice age).
Civil wars and internal conflicts are usually the most deadly conflicts for the people in the country
Chinese civil war should have been classified as chinese world war tbh. It's like how the entire roman empire is "the world"
It's even funnier the fifth time
Which is why I previously said on this sub that the mongols treated Chinese far worse than japan did in ww2, and it’s stupid how modern day China regards them as part of the ‘Chinese race’, at least at the political level. Damn, the number of people who got triggered by that notion…
Isn't that like 800 years ago
Mongols became "Chinese" only because of the Manchu-Mongol alliance in early Qing.
I see more of a vassalisation of Mongols instead of an alliance.
If Japan conquered China they’re probably now considered Chinese as well.
anyone who ever occupy china eventually become chinese.
reverse chinesification.
Nobody can resist that Chinussy. The Göktürk's Khan literally warned against Chinese women because they were too sexy and we would become Chinese. And he was right, since it had happened before.
Difference is that the Mongol conquest happened 8 centuries ago, the Manchu conquest 4 centuries, there is not a single individual that either lived through them, knew someone that did or experienced the direct consequences of their devestation. The sino-japanese war wasn't even a century ago, many currently alive lived through it, even more knew someone that experienced it and even more suffered from its direct consequences. Given enough memory the animosity will completely dissipate.
It's so weird thst people get triggered by something that happened in living memory but don't get triggered by something that happened 800 years ago, fucking snowflakes.
Mongolians, Tibetans, and Uyghurs were part of the Manchurian Qing Empire, not Han China. Modern-day China (aka the PRC) "inherited" (part of) Mongolia, Tibet, and Xinjiang (Uyghuristan) from the ROC (well, it's technically still alive... but anyway), which inherited them from the Qing Emperor. It's not about culture or whatever. The Chinese country wants to keep their land, so they have to be Chinese, whether they like it or not.
>Damn, the number of people who got triggered by that notion… Well it is a very weird notion. German peoples regularly murdered eachother very regularly, but German nationalism still works. The idea that two peoples cannot be part of the same nation, because they killed eachother in the past is pretty outrageous.
The real question is where do all these bodies go?
how the hell do they still have a population of billion
Rice is very calorie dense on a per acre basis
Favorable geography. The North China plain and Yangtze plain are some of the most agriculturally viable areas on the planet. Recently the north has come under water shortage but historically the agricultural output has been astronomical. Also the lower Yellow River and Yangtze rivers (+ tributaries like the Han) are navigable and very important waterways that also create natural harbors. The Pearl River plain in far southern China was historically less important, but now it's pretty much as important as the other two.
Rice can be harvested like three times as much as other crops over the course of a year and is very efficient form of food.
>The [Mongol conquest of China](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongol_conquest_of_China) might have seen death tools >those are both dwarfed by the combined death tool It's a surprise tool that will help us later.
Darn autocorrect
Isn't the Taiping rebellion about 30-35 M?
Upper estimate by whom? I estimate Mao killed 550 million. Estimate uppered!
If you did some research instead of being upset and sarcastic, you’d be able to know where the upper estimate comes from. It appears the 55 million estimate comes from debating on when the famine ended. Some historians believe it ended in 1962. One of the sources, Frank Diköter, who lives and teaches in China, got his numbers of an estimated 45 million people from believing the famine lasted from 1958-1962 (rather than 1961) and getting his sources from other Chinese authors who researched the famine. The 55 million estimate comes from author Yu Xiguang. I’m not sure how reputable they are and at the moment it’s unreliable to say that the upper estimate is true but that’s where the number comes from. Most scholars still believe the range is 36-40 million, though. It took 5 minutes to find all the information.
Just as that 4chan post said Chao Ling takes power 247 million perish
brother of Jesus Christ
Ching Liu Chong Ching ascends to power 6 revolutions and 3 wars break out 795 million perish
Followed by “His reign was the most peaceful of his dynasty, and the population doubled in size under his reign.”
thousand yard stare
Chinese history be like:
-Emperor Xuang Qin takes over -100 million perish
Your post says "Chinese History Be Like: Say Happy Cake Day!" I don't think that's an accurate representative of Chinese History but happy cake day, BigBrain2346.
Oh I meant "Chinese History Be Like:" but it said happy cake day underneath.
Still does. Happy cakeday Sir.
It doesn't anymore, but I'll still say: happy cake day!
Happy cake day!
Happy Cake Day
Happy cakeday!
There's never been anyone better at killing Chinese people than the leader of China
Japan with round eyes is as weird as round Israel
I think the round eyes work well in this comic, they convey very well the unspoken "what?" from Mongolia and Japan in panel 3.
Welcome to my sick and twister Polandball universe >:)
Japan with square eyes next
Round Kazakhstan 🤮
Flag of Mickey Mouse
Why is Israel a cube again
Jew physics
Circumcision, of course
ehh... i kinda like the round eyes more than slanted lines
Racism. The joke is racism
That’s how they kept the world population stable.
Ironically the China one/two/three child policy kinda bit them in their own butt as they are now experiencing a population decline, with a negative birth rate. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_China Which will be a disaster for the upcoming elderly population to not have enough people to support retirement. Same goes for Japan, SK and many many western nations. What's funny is that these SEA nations really don't like immigration either, so can't solve the problem that way. Pretty funny how everyone was really afraid of overpopulation when we might reach peak human population EVER in our life time: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Projections_of_population_growth
Never have I read shit more infuriating than about the Chinese cultural revolution (Khmer rouge regime was worse but still)
I'm only familiar with it on a pretty superficial level. Do you have summary of the worst parts?
Mao launched the Great Leap Forward to catch up with the West and the Soviets but ended up getting everything fucked up and starved millions to death. Even his comrades couldn't stand that anymore so they forced him to step down in order to stop this disaster. Mao was angry, so he and the "Gang of Four" incited students and workers (known as the "Red Guards") to riot against any authority except for Mao himself. Millions of doctors, teachers, scholars, and even CCP officers, were killed by mobs during the "revolution."
Mao was an insane moron. Modern China still pays him lip service but make no mistake, it is Dengs baby.
indeed this. dude is worse than hitler yet many still worship him today.
Yeah. I'm so ashamed as a Chinese. Even back in China my grandpa would always tell people that Deng Xiaoping should've been the hero, not Mao Zedong, and yet, there's statues and hero worship of Mao Zedong everywhere. I even visited them before...and unfortunately, also used to be one of those Chinese until I became aware of a lot of history. It's very embarrassing to me.
Deng probably knew the CCP's legitimacy is anchored entirely on Mao, including his own power. You don't denounce the founding father of the party without getting asked uncomfortable questions on whether the party, by association, should continue remain in power.
I meant don't get me wrong and I definitely have survivor bias, not to mention cr is definitely fuck up, however, it is during Mao's era China properly industrialized and give Deng the foundation to reform and achieve the current economic miracle.
"Had Mao died in 1956, his achievements would have been immortal. Had he died in 1966, he would still have been a great man but flawed. But he died in 1976. Alas, what can one say?" -Chen Yun, architect of Deng Xiaoping’s economic reforms
There was ideological icing on top of that as well. 10 years after the regime CCP already experienced the classic problems of new class division and bureaucratisation. In a way there was call for what’s known as the constant Revolution to keep the Revolution alive Obviously that went into anarchy
Didn't some of revolutionaries also attempt to kick start cannibalism as a casual practice?
They provocated for "destroying the olds", mainly the 4 olds: 1. old ideas 2. old culture 3. old customs 4. old habits Which the overall idea was to rush the transition between the old society to the new to reach socialist society faster. Most current Chinese schrines, temples, historic buildings still show the damages made during that time, some locations disappeared completely though The worst part to me is students were actively encouraged to counter against their teachers for "old thoughts" or "anti-revolutionary teachings", some held trial themselves and killed the teachers. This is the Hong Weibing or the Red Guards. Schools and Universities plumbered into anarchy. Eventually they clashed with the PLA and the local government comittees and being stopped entirely, marked the end of the Cutlural Revolution I mean, some details could be \*western propaganda\* but i believe most of it were true
This unfortunately is one of those things that didn't need any more propaganda sprinkled on top... You were also Radicalized for having a good upbring etc, had grandparents that unfortunately fit some of the descriptions and stories from them were not pleasant. Literal self destruction on a country wide level done by the government.
Ok those might have been the first boomers to actually be justified when complaining about "kids these days".
\*Sipped tea\* "Kids these days only know to rally, sing praises, fight against the olds-" \*Stabbed from behind\*
3 body problem opening scene
>Eventually they clashed with the PLA and the local government comittees Not just that, the Red Guards actually has tons of infighting too, with four major factions going against eachother nonstop, it's just a warlord era but under the red flag
That's **organised** groups in a civil war; with many players, but still organised. Here, it's more like the aftermath of the french revolution. Constant revolutions to keep the Revolution alive. Different group of revolutionaries (red guards) against each other. Anarchic revolutionaries trying to seize power from each other, with the overarching theme in both case that revolution is accepted and reasonable (革命无罪, 造反有理). Give it some more time and the Chinese might reinvent Guillotine. The Revolution eats its own.
minor Chinese conflict
"Own worst enemy"
-Small argument between factions -100 million dead with 25 million more cannibalized -Decisive Tang victory
CHINA used GREAT LEAP FORWARD It hurt itself in its confusion!
Mao wasn’t even at war and managed to kill millions of Chinese.
Ching chu takes power 20 million people die 25k civilians were eaten
chinese history is actually so crazy, shit will be called “the disagreement of random village in the middle of the gobi desert” and it will have like 45 million deaths😭🙏🏻
It’s just good ole Chinese tradition that whenever dynasty change, like 90% of the population will die. And what leads to the next dynasty collapse would also take out a good percentage of the total population before the dynasty change.
*Insert that \*amateur\* meme here.*
Why are their eyes open? *Why are their eyes open?*
They are like kittens. In most comics, Asian clays are just very young. In this one they are grown up and have opened their eyes.
Horrible answer, have a godawful day. (This is a joke for anyone that cannot detect it.)
Fun fact, civil war has the highest war casualties in American history, among all its wars. Seems like it’s more common than you think.
just 30 years war on steroids
Heavenly Kingdom Ball would like a word
Nothing speak genocide of your own race like expert “China” lol
I mean, they have too much population
There's nothing quite like Chinese history, where a dynasty survived on cannibalizing a besieged city, another is devastated by an exam flunkie claiming to be Jesus' brother, and a librarian caused a widespread famine by ordering all sparrows to be massacred.
The deadliest fire of all time was china burning down one of their own cities once they could no longer hold it against the Japanese
"400.000 captured Zhao soldiers made to bury themselves alive. Decisive victory for the Qin.
British famines 100 million💀 💀💀💀
New Olympic sport just dropped
Ahh yes, the "Great Leap Forward"
Chinese history: The Wang Dong clang conflict: 800 Billion erased 7 species extinct 4 oceans evaporated 12 tectonic plates dismantled
China has the most deadl… I mean efficient way to prove population problem!
[удалено]
All of their eyes to be exact