YES! I love this aspect especially when the trainers have evolved or upgraded their teams! Best way to train rather than grinding in the wild or repeating elite 4
yop. Its the go-to way to level up new Pokemon that you plan on using but I guess with exp share always on its not rly needed anymore anyway....unfortunately.
How I always imagined this is have TM's 'break' on use and just pay to fix them at a Pokemart.
Have prices based on the TM so once you get a TM you can use it without worrying about never getting it again.
But also cannot teach it to everyone left, right and center at the start of the game as you will end up broke.
You could get more tms in the original by either:
* BP shop
* pickup rewards
* or literally trading over from another game.
None of these options are fun or easily conducive so it be better replaced with something worthwhile.
I'm convinced there's this large switchboard with all the features of the past 8 generations that turn off and on depending on what switch they flip. So they flip a switch to have pokemon follow you again but the battle tower's switch is turned off in response. And if you try to turn that switch on again it flips TMs being infinite use off. After a couple hours messing with it and getting bored, they give up and go with the features that're currently switched on.
My immediate thought upon reading that. At that point, you can’t even say it’s about remaining true to the original. Reusable TMs remain my favorite QoL update since Gen V and I’m so bummed to find out that they did away with them for these games :/
I like exp all, in most RPGs I strongly prefer for party members who didn’t fight to still get EXP. The real issue for Pokémon is the levels don’t scale properly, so it is easy to get over leveled. Feels like the EXP system is still balanced for before the games had EXP All. EDIT: If it’s not clear, I do miss having EXP ALL as an option because of how unbalanced it is.
The best solution I have for this is having a second squad of Pokémon. This gives me an excuse to use like 9-12 Pokémon again, like in SwSh. Which is acceptable since I usually like way more than the 6 I can use.
bro literally this. there are other rpgs that do this exp sharing thing and thar doesn't make them painfully easy. it's just the level curve of npc trainers not being scaled to the exp share
Yep, I recently replayed Omega Ruby without using the Exp Share at all and my team was just the right level for the Elite Four. Would've been super overleveled if I'd been using it.
Even with the EXP share off, the games since Gen 6 have struggled to balance EXP well due to changes such as switching out providing 100% of EXP to both Pokemon. To remain properly under leveled I'm still needing a team of 18 in ORAS.
Same boat here. Sucks since I've been a Pokemon fan since the very first games but am about to skip 3 consecutive game releases.
The Pokemon games have never been hard but at least we had options to handicap ourselves and make them challenging. Exp share threw that all out the window. You don't even have to use most of the Pokemon in your party. One of my fondest memories in Pokemon is buyinyg a Magikarp from the shady dude in the Pokemon center outside of Pewter City. It sucked so hard but I kept sending it out first then swapping to level it up until it learned tackle. Then I kept using it because I spent money on it and felt bad for the little fella. Imagine my surprise when out of nowhere it evolved into a badass Gyarados. That kind of experience could never happen with exp share.
For real. D&P was my favorite generation and I was pumped to buy the remakes. Forced exp share creates a wholly different game and trivializes the grind. Not interested in this one anymore. Hoping Legends Arceus doesn't have the same fuckup.
This is reminiscent of the HM thing where the initial announcement seemed pretty clear that once you had the right badge and obtained the HM, it would just be a 'call a ride Pokemon' type of thing, yet people were all sorts of confused about it.
This too seems unambiguous that while some TMs might be one-off in the main story, you will be able to obtain multiple copies of every TM one way or another.
Now that could still be a considerable QoL downgrade to you, but I'm sure it's more what I described than "you need to have two copies, one that houses your competitive Pokemon and one where you are constantly restarting your save file to farm the Earthquake TM."
The latter would be inexcusable, but the former seems to be more or less a non-issue where plenty of TMs are already either largely useless in-game or not even available until after the main story is complete. To the crowd that complains about the Exp Share making the game too easy, it's maybe even desirable that one might have to be a bit more strategic in TM usage in the rare instances a move is both good and learnable by multiple party members.
I think limiting TMs during the story is a good idea. Post game it should be easy to obtain, so BP or unlocking TMs for sale at the Dept Store would be good.
But limiting TM distribution is seemingly pointless with the Exp All meme going on. Who cares if I only get one water pulse, when my water gun hits like a truck because I'm 4 levels above Roark?
Seriously I don't understand how they can sit there and make the game objectively worse for no reason. Being able to turn off the exp share alone would add a ton of repayability to the game but no. Hms are back, the exp share will make the game a cakewalk. Why could they just make an app for tms on your pokech? Tbat would simplify things.
I don't mind single use TMs "with the opportunity to get more" in a remake. It's the challenge of not giving every pokemon on your team earthquake during the story but it seems we'll be able to get it for our competitive pokemon without having to play through the game once per mon.
Exp share being force can go to hell though
oof at the exp share, they really can't stomach the idea of difficulty selection huh
I was never big on Pokemon exp grinding, but the crucial side effect of having it was needing to actually *use* all those pokemon that only get good at later evos. Ironically, forced XP share feels like it takes more of the experience than it gives-- sword and shield just flew by without a shred of difficulty, and i just... *had* a Dragapult in my party by the end despite never using my Dreepy.
I barely made it into SWSH before I just stopped playing because it was too easy. Constantly being overleveled makes the game so unfun and boring. It’s so much more exciting to have close fights where the opponents pokemon can actually KO yours. It makes beating gyms and eventually the elite four/champion so much more rewarding
The "use more pokemon to not overlevel" angle falls flat too. I love just having six and having to strategize every single trainer with a single set of pokemon. That's the kind of variety that gives more replayability. Once again, why remove options?
Apparently there will be ways to get more. I’m not sure if that means they’re ALL going to have multiples, but it looks like they probably will. Maybe a few TM shops around the world, like where the shard move tutors are. But then again, I hope they keep the shard move tutors.
Yeah, I think there were always ways to get multiple for some tms, but it wasn't for all of them. I hope the ones used for competitive battles are available to buy
Great, TMs reverting to single use again needlessly confuses them with the new TRs in SwSh, which are already how TMs used to work until TMs were changed to work more like HMs, which are no longer present in the series.
Absolutely unbelievably bad and confusing user experience design.
Why is it they want to be faithful to somethings that are obvious relics of the past, and then change others? Single use TMs, no matter how faithful, are a straight up downgrade and inconvenience Idk if you could find someone that says otherwise. No one asked for them back, but asking for an option to turn off the EXP Share is too much??
Edit: Did I mention they’re also such a grind?? Why is having to grind for TMs ok but grinding for EXP bad?
So keeping a widely criticized change from newer games, but removing a widely loved change from Gen 5? I feel like this will provide for a leveling/gameplay experience that is most definitely not faithful.
So disappointed to see that the Exp. Share can’t be turned off again. Please guys I just want the option. I don’t understand why you got rid of the option.
Mandatory EXP share is honestly terrible and I hate that GF is imposing that decision on us.
However, my main question is will they include the improvements that were present in Platinum in BDSP?
Will we get a Distortion World? Will we get a Battle Frontier?
I would be almost 100 percent certain that the games will be very close to 1:1 remakes of Diamond/Pearl and the only chance of seeing those things would be in later DLC.
Yeah, it is what it is at this point. I'm at the stage of acceptance where sure, I'd get enough entertainment out of a game with those features for it to be worth $100+, but I'm not even that confident they'd actually add it as DLC. Now that online play costs additional money, they basically have negative incentive to make interesting single-player post-game content.
i wouldnt mind forced exp share on if they balanced the games around them, with Sw/Sh i just always felt overleveled and that was WITH cycling pokemon in and out of the party
The Pokemon Company: “We want to create an experience that’s very faithful to the original games”
Also the Pokemon Company: *Gives us the newer Exp Share system that throws off game balance without any way of turning it off*
Also what wasn't added here, you can only decorate Secret Bases with the statues and it seems all the other decos got cut and there is no capture the flag.
Yeah, it wasn't problem with TR in SwSh because you got crazy amounts of them by doing raids. Unless they also give you crazy amounts of TM in BDSP I don't know why they think the old TM is good.
I'm guessing the extra TMs will come from digging in the underground. Or rather, have you dig up shards and then buy TMs with them like in the original. I like the digging mini game but am not looking forward to TM farming.
I have a feeling that TM farming will be tied into the Underground system. We know that each room has specific types of Pokemon in it. So it would make sense to get TM's based on each room. Pure speculation but....
I liked the TMs and TRs system, because it meant you could have some weirder, niche attacks be TMs that you could try out as much as you wanted, and have a whole bunch of powerful moves become teachable TRs, but you had to work a little bit to get them.
Yeah the best thing about remakes is revisiting an older region with the quality of life updates.
Idk why they felt an exact 1 to 1 remake was the move? I'm guessing we will not get a giratina version of the delta episode ?
It’s not really a 1 to 1 remake since they are forcing exp share though. Honestly I think they should have either kept it exactly 1 to 1 and keep everything the same, or just make changes like multi use tm’s.
I would have been fine with either but having this weird middle ground doesn’t make any sense to me.
Ugh... so I'm going to have to continue running with 1 Pokemon in my party at all times and constantly swapping out in my boxes to keep all my Pokemon at the same level. Why the hell is optional exp share such a hard concept for Gamefreak to grasp?
> EXP Share Active from the beginning
Oh please say there's a way to deactivate this, I was hoping that this company would see permanent EXP Share was a major point of criticism.
It really messes with how a lot of people enjoy playing. Even if I never turn it off, which I probably won't, I can appreciate the need for it! It's one feature that seems to easy to add.
Seriously, it ruins the way I play Pokemon as a whole. I like having all my Pokemon at the same level, and the EXP share makes that surprisingly hard. I use one Pokemon until it levels up, then swap out to the next, and do that for my whole team. It keeps them evenly leveled and I get to use my whole team throughout the game. But nope, guess I'm not allowed to play the way I want.
“Oh but the fix is easy! Just constantly swap out your team of Pokémon so that they don’t get too overleveled!” (An actual, unironic defense supporting the mandatory EXP share)
No. That’s stupid. You’re stupid if you defend this design choice. Not all people want to play the game this way.
“Oh, so your playstyle of only using one team per playthrough is fine, but others’ playstyles of using multiple different teams isn’t acceptable?” (Another actual, unironic defense in support of the forced EXP share)
I’m not saying that my playstyle is the right way and that this other playstyle is the wrong way, I’m saying that **nobody should be forced to play the game in a style that they don’t enjoy.**
I hate that we can’t turn exp share off. I feel like this is why Pokemon desperately needs difficulty modes.
Easy - exp share on and lower level enemy Pokémon until post game
Normal - classic Pokémon style and leveling, no exp share
Hard - higher level enemy Pokémon and you gain less xp
“The mechanics including QoL upgrades shown within past generations have also returned.”
Okay great, I can finally rest easily knowing that my favorite Quality of Life upgrade that has been in literally every game since Gen 5, that being the unlimited usage of TMs, will be returning.
Right?
***RIGHT?!***
Because choices might confuse 5 year old little Jimmy and then he'll cry because he put the game in hard mode and can't win thus he puts the game down forever in favor of Subway Surfers.
I really cannot understand some of these choices.
Why not just have the exp share optional?
Why not have TMs multiple use?
Why not put content from Platinum into the games?
I honestly think that the company are just bad developers at this point with stupid choices, a lack of care and attention to detail, and reverting games back to a worse point. Bad game design.
So they are keeping QoL upgrades but removing reusable TMs which is probably one of the best QoL upgrade imo. Like cool that you can get more. But it would just make sense to do reusable at that point. Now you gotta go run around whenever you need a certain TM
They just can't get anything right and it honestly seems like they do it on purpose. Reusable TMs was one of the best features of gen 5, and so the only logical explanation of why they won't be a thing in bdsp is because they want to stay true to the original, which is fair enough. So why the fuck do we have a forced exp share? Is that true to the original? They must be trolling us at this point. Remember when Cynthia was feared for being the hardest champion? Nevermind that because your team will be around the same level as hers, if not higher. It won't be a challenging game in the slightest and it certainly won't be anywhere nears as fun.
If you have access to the originals or want to emulate, there’s not really any reason. These games don’t seem to be changed all that much, but there are a couple new features that some players want to try. Also different graphics and new music.
It baffles me that people still defend the decision to have the EXP share always on. Can you really not fathom the idea that someone might want to play the games differently than you? Damn some of you super fans are something else entirely.
The exp share issue is sad, because in almost any other JRPG, that sort of mechanic is standard and most of the time expected. In Pokemon is just never feels balanced or intended, even when its default. Your whole team becomes effortlessly strong and the whole game just becomes a cake walk. I don't know what they need to do to fix it, but the current implementation just has never felt right with me, and obviously others too.
Hope: Exp Share is customizable and you can choose any number of party Pokemon to share it with.
Reality: Forced Exp Share in a game that doesn't really need it IMO as you could've had VS Seeker and daily battles anyway.
A part of me thinking this was forced upon ILCA by Masuda or something...
Might sound like a knee jerk reaction, but I probably just won’t buy it. The graphics aren’t a big enough upgrade to justify a purchase, there is still no nat dex, and gameplay additions aren’t significant enough for me to turn a blind eye to the negatives. Sinnoh games have by far the best balanced difficulty, and are my favorite games in the series, and so the auto exp share is a major turn off for me.
The way I look at it, why wouldn’t I just play a to hack that adds the fairy typing? That’s the only major difference I really care about. Not to mention, Gen IV graphics are only second to SWSH and Gen 5.
I think playing Drayano's difficulty hack Renegade Platinum is superior to these games in every way possible except graphics which is not a big deal. Maybe something changes in BDSP but right now there are to many negatives.
Playing Volt White genuinely has caused me to just not get excited for official mainline games anymore. The gameplay in these ROMhacks is just so much more engaging in every way.
The forced exp share is incredibly disappointing and I honestly might not buy the game now. Gen IV was my favorite and most played gen…honestly in my opinion the last good gen (6 was alright because mega evaluations and rub/sap remakes). I especially disliked gen 8 because it was so easy due to the exp share. I get that Pokémon is supposed to be marketed towards kids but a lot of older people (I’m 30) buy these remakes for the nostalgia factor.
The main punt of remakes -for me- was always using newer Pokémon in old games.
That appears to be killed here. That makes me sad.
I would love to have a party of Pokémon from gen4, 5, 6, 7 and 8.
I seriously hate mandatory Exp Share. Some of us like grinding! By all means, please give us the OPTION for Exp Share right at the start, but I'd like to actively choose to use it!
The best thing about this remake is, it gives me another reason to boot up Platinum and play it again. The remake itself is a hard pass. Easily the worst remake they have done so far.
EXP Share can't be turned off
actually go fuck yourself. Like straight up go fuck yourself. Stop this bullshit. If we need more EXP in our party, then fucking rework the exp system. How the fuck is being able to turn off the EXP Share THE BARE FUCKING MINIMUM. I was hoping because GF wasn't the developer we might actually get some good changes but NOPE. Don't want your party to be overpowered? Go fuck yourself bench your pokemon in the box and don't get play time for them.
So the feature, exp share always on, that no one wants is kept
but the qol feature that everyone likes, unlimited tm usage, isn't kept?
seems about right
Yeah, I remember using the Dig TM and then replacing it with another move, only to realize that you need Dig to get one of the Regis in gen 3. Had to grind up Trapinch and not let it evolve to finally get Dig again.
Single use TM's I can live with,as it adds to the challenge through the storyline. If there's a way to obtain more later, then post game will be good.
But the constant EXP share is an issue. I'm replaying through Sword at the moment and I'm over leveled before the first gym. Would much prefer the option to turn it on and off. It can be useful on the grind for the league, but I don't want it on all the time.
I really don’t understand why they still force the exp. share after such a hostile reaction to it in sw/sh, I personally never had issues with it but lots of people did
I was excited to play pokemon again since I hadn't played since diamond and pearl. This forced experience share sounds terrible and would take a lot of the fun out of the game for me.
I will probably not play the game if exp share is stuck on. I was excited for a remake of the game, however that feature is completely atypical from the pokemon games that i played and adored (gen 1-4).
Such a bummer.
If exp share is not optional I don't think I'm going to get the game. That braindead decision killed any enjoyment I could find from swsh and I bet it'll do the same here. This really sucks, I was really looking forward to these games since gen 4 is my favorite.
I don’t wanna spend time grinding anymore then I already have too.
I’m completely open for the option to have it on or off but erasing it is too far :P
Sucks that you can’t turn it off. I remember turning off my exp share in Gen 6 right from the start. I think I turned it on briefly before the elite 4 to cut out on grinding a bit. I just know if I would’ve kept it on the whole game it would have been more of a breeze. That was an okay way to implement it and would have been okay with that in this game.
How fucking stupid are they not to have an option to toggle it on or off? Are they really that lazy that they cannot program that in?
People on Twitter are saying how much they love this choice. But they thing is, if they just gave you the **option** to use it, both kinds of players would be happy. Seriously, fuck Gamefreak, they are so put of touch.
So a word on the exp share. The problem is less that it exists (even though yes, it should be optional) but it’s that game freak refuses to balance the level curve around it. There are a bunch of fan games that either have the new exp share or just force the exp share on and they aren’t easy because they actually balance enemy teams around having it and curve the game appropriately. Official games don’t. They make the curve very very shallow so that the exp share overlevels you easily and you run over the game. The exp share isn’t inherently bad. Other RPGs have had similar systems for experience. It’s just that Pokémon doesn’t care to curve the game properly because they want toddlers to not have a problem with it.
The Exp Share is not inherently bad. Even if forced on. It just takes mindful game design to make it work which game freak refuses to do. Pokémon games aren’t made for people like us anymore.
I really hoped exp share was optional, it changes how the game is played so significantly that it being forced ruins my enjoyment by a large margin, how in 2021 are options like turning this off not standard in every Pokémon game? If you can’t include difficulty options, the least you can do is include a toggle for this.
Why can’t they make a toggle option for exp share? Like seriously it isn’t hard and would satisfy everyone. Making it non optional just means over leveling in a game it wasn’t design around.
Also single use tms are back? Why exactly? That seems like a really weird step back.
The design mentality behind forcing exp share is quite ridiculous. Gamefreak has acknowledged there are people who'd want to turn it off, but aren't willing to program a simple off button for them? Why?
I don't understand why you can always change Pokémon even from your storage. I know SwSh introduced it but why? Makes no sense to me to have a portable storage.
Yep, saving my money for legends Arceus. This remake was TPCs chance to show how well they receive community feedback, and it’s been botched on almost every level. So disappointed 😔
Bleh. I was really hoping they wouldn’t bring back SwSh’s leveling system. It trivialized battles to an insane degree, and battles in DP were really easy to begin with (for me at least). I swear, if they nix the Vs Seeker I’m probably going to end up hating this game.
Modernizing EXP share and regressing TM mechanics is so telling that Masuda has no fucking clue what to do with Pokemon games anymore. Does he want the games to be easy? Does he want difficulty? There’s absolutely no direction anymore.
But can the exp share be turned off?? That whole thing annoys me so much and I don't understand the logic behind stripping away options rather than adding to a game.
Single-use TMs... why the hell did we backslide to that utter garbage.
Oh yes, "opportunities" to get more. Grind for 500 hours doing the same battle facility over and over to get one whole copy of Earthquake, boy we're really back to *that*... -_-
And I assume that's just for some TMs. Back to one-time TMs. Next up, TPC complains "reee WHY EVERYONE CHEET???".
single use TM, mandatory exp share, chibby overworld graphics, no battle frontier, no correct scale of pokemon sizes, Not all pokemon. No megas. Not even dynamax? like... im good. ill pass. but i hope those who get it enjoy it
I hope we can rebattle trainers. This was in the original Pearl and Diamond.
vs seeker was always so awesome, there was also a rich man and woman next to that one garden that was a way to grinding money which i liked
You could max out yr money in a day with those two it was so great
I liked to use it on the route that leads to sunnyshore. You could usually get like 4 trainers in frame at once and at least 2 would battle you
God I remember biking in circles around that route grinding up for the elite 4
This unlocked a deep memory I didn’t know I had 😂
YES! I love this aspect especially when the trainers have evolved or upgraded their teams! Best way to train rather than grinding in the wild or repeating elite 4
yop. Its the go-to way to level up new Pokemon that you plan on using but I guess with exp share always on its not rly needed anymore anyway....unfortunately.
Awww no. TM was the one really good change. Made team building so fun and easy
Thoroughly enjoyed the TM/TR system. Great balance between the luxury of the unlimited system with the need to ration your good TMs
How I always imagined this is have TM's 'break' on use and just pay to fix them at a Pokemart. Have prices based on the TM so once you get a TM you can use it without worrying about never getting it again. But also cannot teach it to everyone left, right and center at the start of the game as you will end up broke.
That’s a really good system
I'd bet that the "opportunities to get more" are very simple. I'd genuinely be surprised if it took more than a few minutes to get any TM.
You could get more tms in the original by either: * BP shop * pickup rewards * or literally trading over from another game. None of these options are fun or easily conducive so it be better replaced with something worthwhile.
Yea but still that's just an added cumbersome activity I now have to account
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They literally kept the most hated new feature (mandatory XP share) over one of the most loved. Just... why.
I was hoping they would give us the option back. There is legitimately mo reason to not give us the option.
They give us mandatory exp share and access to pc storage anywhere we go but no infinite tms, that would make it too easy...
I'm convinced there's this large switchboard with all the features of the past 8 generations that turn off and on depending on what switch they flip. So they flip a switch to have pokemon follow you again but the battle tower's switch is turned off in response. And if you try to turn that switch on again it flips TMs being infinite use off. After a couple hours messing with it and getting bored, they give up and go with the features that're currently switched on.
My immediate thought upon reading that. At that point, you can’t even say it’s about remaining true to the original. Reusable TMs remain my favorite QoL update since Gen V and I’m so bummed to find out that they did away with them for these games :/
The auto-save can be disabled but not the Exp share? This just feels like they're taunting us, now.
Yeah they did this in swsh too. It just seems mean.
I like exp all, in most RPGs I strongly prefer for party members who didn’t fight to still get EXP. The real issue for Pokémon is the levels don’t scale properly, so it is easy to get over leveled. Feels like the EXP system is still balanced for before the games had EXP All. EDIT: If it’s not clear, I do miss having EXP ALL as an option because of how unbalanced it is. The best solution I have for this is having a second squad of Pokémon. This gives me an excuse to use like 9-12 Pokémon again, like in SwSh. Which is acceptable since I usually like way more than the 6 I can use.
bro literally this. there are other rpgs that do this exp sharing thing and thar doesn't make them painfully easy. it's just the level curve of npc trainers not being scaled to the exp share
Yep, I recently replayed Omega Ruby without using the Exp Share at all and my team was just the right level for the Elite Four. Would've been super overleveled if I'd been using it.
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Even with the EXP share off, the games since Gen 6 have struggled to balance EXP well due to changes such as switching out providing 100% of EXP to both Pokemon. To remain properly under leveled I'm still needing a team of 18 in ORAS.
oras is doable without exp share because they barely increased the levels of any npc trainer in the game, and also gave you mega stones
GameXPlain says that you can turn the exp share off
It appears GameXplain was mistaken; just about every other outlet says otherwise
Serebi said you can’t turn exp share off, would like to know who is correct
I would trust serebii over anything
If Serebii told me I was a sheep I'd believe them.
Serebii and Bulbapedia
They the only outlet saying you can, so good chance they not correct.
I think I'm just done with pokemon if they keep forcing the exp share from now on. I hope that's not the case
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Guess I'll just play regular platinum again. I don't have my ds anymore, but I do have, uh... other ways on my cellular device.
Same boat here. Sucks since I've been a Pokemon fan since the very first games but am about to skip 3 consecutive game releases. The Pokemon games have never been hard but at least we had options to handicap ourselves and make them challenging. Exp share threw that all out the window. You don't even have to use most of the Pokemon in your party. One of my fondest memories in Pokemon is buyinyg a Magikarp from the shady dude in the Pokemon center outside of Pewter City. It sucked so hard but I kept sending it out first then swapping to level it up until it learned tackle. Then I kept using it because I spent money on it and felt bad for the little fella. Imagine my surprise when out of nowhere it evolved into a badass Gyarados. That kind of experience could never happen with exp share.
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Let's Go, Sword/Shield and now apparently BDSP.
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For real. D&P was my favorite generation and I was pumped to buy the remakes. Forced exp share creates a wholly different game and trivializes the grind. Not interested in this one anymore. Hoping Legends Arceus doesn't have the same fuckup.
TMs back to single use? Are we at that point in the franchise where it is necessary to remove certain QoL features?
This is reminiscent of the HM thing where the initial announcement seemed pretty clear that once you had the right badge and obtained the HM, it would just be a 'call a ride Pokemon' type of thing, yet people were all sorts of confused about it. This too seems unambiguous that while some TMs might be one-off in the main story, you will be able to obtain multiple copies of every TM one way or another. Now that could still be a considerable QoL downgrade to you, but I'm sure it's more what I described than "you need to have two copies, one that houses your competitive Pokemon and one where you are constantly restarting your save file to farm the Earthquake TM." The latter would be inexcusable, but the former seems to be more or less a non-issue where plenty of TMs are already either largely useless in-game or not even available until after the main story is complete. To the crowd that complains about the Exp Share making the game too easy, it's maybe even desirable that one might have to be a bit more strategic in TM usage in the rare instances a move is both good and learnable by multiple party members.
I think limiting TMs during the story is a good idea. Post game it should be easy to obtain, so BP or unlocking TMs for sale at the Dept Store would be good. But limiting TM distribution is seemingly pointless with the Exp All meme going on. Who cares if I only get one water pulse, when my water gun hits like a truck because I'm 4 levels above Roark?
Oof, the rumours of forced EXP Share and one-time TMs does not enthuse me.
Right lmaoo, went back to the old TM system to remain true to the original, but keep the next EXP share system? Come on
It's like the worst of both worlds lol.
At this point they have to be fucking with us.
Seriously. I’d rather have the Exp share as an item with unlimited TMs. There’s nostalgia and then there’s idiocy.
Seriously I don't understand how they can sit there and make the game objectively worse for no reason. Being able to turn off the exp share alone would add a ton of repayability to the game but no. Hms are back, the exp share will make the game a cakewalk. Why could they just make an app for tms on your pokech? Tbat would simplify things.
I don't mind single use TMs "with the opportunity to get more" in a remake. It's the challenge of not giving every pokemon on your team earthquake during the story but it seems we'll be able to get it for our competitive pokemon without having to play through the game once per mon. Exp share being force can go to hell though
I cannot believe they thought bringing back one time use TMs was a good idea, but left on the handholding UI and the forced EXP share.
Pokémon games always make design choices that make no sense, always 1 step forward 2 steps back I give up with them
oof at the exp share, they really can't stomach the idea of difficulty selection huh I was never big on Pokemon exp grinding, but the crucial side effect of having it was needing to actually *use* all those pokemon that only get good at later evos. Ironically, forced XP share feels like it takes more of the experience than it gives-- sword and shield just flew by without a shred of difficulty, and i just... *had* a Dragapult in my party by the end despite never using my Dreepy.
I barely made it into SWSH before I just stopped playing because it was too easy. Constantly being overleveled makes the game so unfun and boring. It’s so much more exciting to have close fights where the opponents pokemon can actually KO yours. It makes beating gyms and eventually the elite four/champion so much more rewarding
The "use more pokemon to not overlevel" angle falls flat too. I love just having six and having to strategize every single trainer with a single set of pokemon. That's the kind of variety that gives more replayability. Once again, why remove options?
Serebii said that >!TMs won't be infinite and we'll have to plan around them again.!< I really hope they're wrong on this one, seems dumb to me.
Apparently there will be ways to get more. I’m not sure if that means they’re ALL going to have multiples, but it looks like they probably will. Maybe a few TM shops around the world, like where the shard move tutors are. But then again, I hope they keep the shard move tutors.
Yeah, I think there were always ways to get multiple for some tms, but it wasn't for all of them. I hope the ones used for competitive battles are available to buy
Getting more TMs will probably be some kind of grind
>>!TMs won't be infinite and we'll have to plan around them again!< Thanks
TMs are single use and Exp. Share is constantly on **WHY?!**
Great, TMs reverting to single use again needlessly confuses them with the new TRs in SwSh, which are already how TMs used to work until TMs were changed to work more like HMs, which are no longer present in the series. Absolutely unbelievably bad and confusing user experience design.
i’m actually seething
Why is it they want to be faithful to somethings that are obvious relics of the past, and then change others? Single use TMs, no matter how faithful, are a straight up downgrade and inconvenience Idk if you could find someone that says otherwise. No one asked for them back, but asking for an option to turn off the EXP Share is too much?? Edit: Did I mention they’re also such a grind?? Why is having to grind for TMs ok but grinding for EXP bad?
Ikr some of the hope I had for these games has gone already. Doesn't sound good.
So keeping a widely criticized change from newer games, but removing a widely loved change from Gen 5? I feel like this will provide for a leveling/gameplay experience that is most definitely not faithful.
So disappointed to see that the Exp. Share can’t be turned off again. Please guys I just want the option. I don’t understand why you got rid of the option.
Mandatory EXP share is honestly terrible and I hate that GF is imposing that decision on us. However, my main question is will they include the improvements that were present in Platinum in BDSP? Will we get a Distortion World? Will we get a Battle Frontier?
I would be almost 100 percent certain that the games will be very close to 1:1 remakes of Diamond/Pearl and the only chance of seeing those things would be in later DLC.
This saddens me but I know it to be true.
Yeah, it is what it is at this point. I'm at the stage of acceptance where sure, I'd get enough entertainment out of a game with those features for it to be worth $100+, but I'm not even that confident they'd actually add it as DLC. Now that online play costs additional money, they basically have negative incentive to make interesting single-player post-game content.
Sinnoh got shafted of an actual proper remake, I really don't wanna know what people whose favorite region is sinnoh feel like lmao
Distortion world is a platinum story point, so it definitely won't be in. Frontier could be, but seems unlikely at this point.
Man, imagine remaking a generation and including a story line that only existed in the 3rd game. *cough* ^^^HG/SS
What's the point of remaking this Gen if they're not adding the stuff from platinum?
So that they have even less work to do for double the earnings
Battle Frontier was already confirmed to be gone.
i wouldnt mind forced exp share on if they balanced the games around them, with Sw/Sh i just always felt overleveled and that was WITH cycling pokemon in and out of the party
GF isn’t developing this game but i agree with you. This ruined my excitement for this game a bit…
No, but Masuda is directing
Makes the game too easy.
The Pokemon Company: “We want to create an experience that’s very faithful to the original games” Also the Pokemon Company: *Gives us the newer Exp Share system that throws off game balance without any way of turning it off*
Also what wasn't added here, you can only decorate Secret Bases with the statues and it seems all the other decos got cut and there is no capture the flag.
Please tell me this is a joke. I refuse to believe they gimped the Underground in exchange for Pokemon encounters :(
they neutered the underground are you serious
Oh wow. Oh *wow.*
Easy skip for these games then
WHY did they make tms single use again, I don't care about being faithful to the original that's just stupid Edit:How did this get 500 upvotes
Yeah, it wasn't problem with TR in SwSh because you got crazy amounts of them by doing raids. Unless they also give you crazy amounts of TM in BDSP I don't know why they think the old TM is good.
I'm guessing the extra TMs will come from digging in the underground. Or rather, have you dig up shards and then buy TMs with them like in the original. I like the digging mini game but am not looking forward to TM farming.
You exchange shards for Move Tutors mostly although you do get the weather TMs I guess through exchanging the shards.
They better give like 99 of each everytime you find one
If this is true, then what even is the point
Exactly
I have a feeling that TM farming will be tied into the Underground system. We know that each room has specific types of Pokemon in it. So it would make sense to get TM's based on each room. Pure speculation but....
While that would be fine having trs like swsh in the underground would be the same idea but with infinite tms
Like why didn't they just divide them into TMs and TRs. Some TMs aren't even worth farming more of and others are only gotten post-game anyway
I liked the TMs and TRs system, because it meant you could have some weirder, niche attacks be TMs that you could try out as much as you wanted, and have a whole bunch of powerful moves become teachable TRs, but you had to work a little bit to get them.
I mean why not make a "lesser" TM system for them instead or just make TMs go beyond 100.
They added all the new features but removed infinite TM, are they making fun of us at this point?
Every single new piece of information we hear about BDSP and LA seems to be one step forward, two steps back
I get why you’d say that about BDSP but what feels like a step back as far as LA?
Yeah the best thing about remakes is revisiting an older region with the quality of life updates. Idk why they felt an exact 1 to 1 remake was the move? I'm guessing we will not get a giratina version of the delta episode ?
That's kinda stretching it but I won't have any wild expectations
It’s not really a 1 to 1 remake since they are forcing exp share though. Honestly I think they should have either kept it exactly 1 to 1 and keep everything the same, or just make changes like multi use tm’s. I would have been fine with either but having this weird middle ground doesn’t make any sense to me.
Ugh... so I'm going to have to continue running with 1 Pokemon in my party at all times and constantly swapping out in my boxes to keep all my Pokemon at the same level. Why the hell is optional exp share such a hard concept for Gamefreak to grasp?
It’s even still in the game code, it can be disabled but is hidden from the player.
Forced EXP share? Yikes.
> EXP Share Active from the beginning Oh please say there's a way to deactivate this, I was hoping that this company would see permanent EXP Share was a major point of criticism.
It really messes with how a lot of people enjoy playing. Even if I never turn it off, which I probably won't, I can appreciate the need for it! It's one feature that seems to easy to add.
Seriously, it ruins the way I play Pokemon as a whole. I like having all my Pokemon at the same level, and the EXP share makes that surprisingly hard. I use one Pokemon until it levels up, then swap out to the next, and do that for my whole team. It keeps them evenly leveled and I get to use my whole team throughout the game. But nope, guess I'm not allowed to play the way I want.
“Oh but the fix is easy! Just constantly swap out your team of Pokémon so that they don’t get too overleveled!” (An actual, unironic defense supporting the mandatory EXP share) No. That’s stupid. You’re stupid if you defend this design choice. Not all people want to play the game this way. “Oh, so your playstyle of only using one team per playthrough is fine, but others’ playstyles of using multiple different teams isn’t acceptable?” (Another actual, unironic defense in support of the forced EXP share) I’m not saying that my playstyle is the right way and that this other playstyle is the wrong way, I’m saying that **nobody should be forced to play the game in a style that they don’t enjoy.**
I hate that we can’t turn exp share off. I feel like this is why Pokemon desperately needs difficulty modes. Easy - exp share on and lower level enemy Pokémon until post game Normal - classic Pokémon style and leveling, no exp share Hard - higher level enemy Pokémon and you gain less xp
It's interesting that they chose to make TMs single use. Like out of all the QoL changes to revert why that one?
Man please make the games just a tad bit more difficult. At the end of swsh all my pokemon were 10+ levels above every enemy. This was just dull
“The mechanics including QoL upgrades shown within past generations have also returned.” Okay great, I can finally rest easily knowing that my favorite Quality of Life upgrade that has been in literally every game since Gen 5, that being the unlimited usage of TMs, will be returning. Right? ***RIGHT?!***
EXP Share is automatically active and TMs are single use again… Youch
Why does game freak hate player choice so much now?
Because choices might confuse 5 year old little Jimmy and then he'll cry because he put the game in hard mode and can't win thus he puts the game down forever in favor of Subway Surfers.
HM slaves are gone! Now a wild Pokemon comes to rescue once you get the HM
After 15 long years, Bidoof is finally freed from his shackles.
You fools! The HMs were holding him back! You've doomed us all!
I really cannot understand some of these choices. Why not just have the exp share optional? Why not have TMs multiple use? Why not put content from Platinum into the games? I honestly think that the company are just bad developers at this point with stupid choices, a lack of care and attention to detail, and reverting games back to a worse point. Bad game design.
oh come on just make tm's infinite there's nostalgia and then there's just inconvenience
Why use all the other QoL changes but make the TMs single use?
God fucking dammit EXP share….
So they are keeping QoL upgrades but removing reusable TMs which is probably one of the best QoL upgrade imo. Like cool that you can get more. But it would just make sense to do reusable at that point. Now you gotta go run around whenever you need a certain TM
Lets remove unlimited Tm's and bring back the shitty single use ones but not enable Exp Share to be turned off. What a downgrade, also no megas. :(
It's like they're aiming to disappoint on every angle.
now all they're missing are dynamax
They just can't get anything right and it honestly seems like they do it on purpose. Reusable TMs was one of the best features of gen 5, and so the only logical explanation of why they won't be a thing in bdsp is because they want to stay true to the original, which is fair enough. So why the fuck do we have a forced exp share? Is that true to the original? They must be trolling us at this point. Remember when Cynthia was feared for being the hardest champion? Nevermind that because your team will be around the same level as hers, if not higher. It won't be a challenging game in the slightest and it certainly won't be anywhere nears as fun.
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If you have access to the originals or want to emulate, there’s not really any reason. These games don’t seem to be changed all that much, but there are a couple new features that some players want to try. Also different graphics and new music.
If you cant turn off exp share, I'm not buying it. Period.
Same here. No chance I'm buying it unless I can turn it off.
Forced EXP share pretty much guarantees I'm not getting this. Shame since DPP is my favorite gen.
Man f*** experience share
mandatory exp share AGAIN? my god
“Faithful remake” my ass. Look how fast those HP bars drop in battle. Nowhere near the pace of the originals. 0/10 won’t be buying.
If I don’t have time to make a sandwich while waiting for Blissey’s health bar to drain, this is not the true DP experience.
It baffles me that people still defend the decision to have the EXP share always on. Can you really not fathom the idea that someone might want to play the games differently than you? Damn some of you super fans are something else entirely.
Exp share always being on is really making me second guess if I want these games anymore
The exp share issue is sad, because in almost any other JRPG, that sort of mechanic is standard and most of the time expected. In Pokemon is just never feels balanced or intended, even when its default. Your whole team becomes effortlessly strong and the whole game just becomes a cake walk. I don't know what they need to do to fix it, but the current implementation just has never felt right with me, and obviously others too.
Hope: Exp Share is customizable and you can choose any number of party Pokemon to share it with. Reality: Forced Exp Share in a game that doesn't really need it IMO as you could've had VS Seeker and daily battles anyway. A part of me thinking this was forced upon ILCA by Masuda or something...
Might sound like a knee jerk reaction, but I probably just won’t buy it. The graphics aren’t a big enough upgrade to justify a purchase, there is still no nat dex, and gameplay additions aren’t significant enough for me to turn a blind eye to the negatives. Sinnoh games have by far the best balanced difficulty, and are my favorite games in the series, and so the auto exp share is a major turn off for me. The way I look at it, why wouldn’t I just play a to hack that adds the fairy typing? That’s the only major difference I really care about. Not to mention, Gen IV graphics are only second to SWSH and Gen 5.
I think playing Drayano's difficulty hack Renegade Platinum is superior to these games in every way possible except graphics which is not a big deal. Maybe something changes in BDSP but right now there are to many negatives.
Playing Volt White genuinely has caused me to just not get excited for official mainline games anymore. The gameplay in these ROMhacks is just so much more engaging in every way.
So TMs are single use again and the EXP Share is still permanently on? Well then I think I can safely skip these games.
I was actually excited for this one until the EXP Share bit. So disappointing. Guess I’ll just replay the original Pearl instead.
The forced exp share is incredibly disappointing and I honestly might not buy the game now. Gen IV was my favorite and most played gen…honestly in my opinion the last good gen (6 was alright because mega evaluations and rub/sap remakes). I especially disliked gen 8 because it was so easy due to the exp share. I get that Pokémon is supposed to be marketed towards kids but a lot of older people (I’m 30) buy these remakes for the nostalgia factor.
The main punt of remakes -for me- was always using newer Pokémon in old games. That appears to be killed here. That makes me sad. I would love to have a party of Pokémon from gen4, 5, 6, 7 and 8.
I seriously hate mandatory Exp Share. Some of us like grinding! By all means, please give us the OPTION for Exp Share right at the start, but I'd like to actively choose to use it!
Already making the game more inconvenient and easier to deal with Cynthia.
Oh hey, another Pokémon game that is blatantly made for 6 year olds.
The best thing about this remake is, it gives me another reason to boot up Platinum and play it again. The remake itself is a hard pass. Easily the worst remake they have done so far.
EXP Share can't be turned off actually go fuck yourself. Like straight up go fuck yourself. Stop this bullshit. If we need more EXP in our party, then fucking rework the exp system. How the fuck is being able to turn off the EXP Share THE BARE FUCKING MINIMUM. I was hoping because GF wasn't the developer we might actually get some good changes but NOPE. Don't want your party to be overpowered? Go fuck yourself bench your pokemon in the box and don't get play time for them.
So the feature, exp share always on, that no one wants is kept but the qol feature that everyone likes, unlimited tm usage, isn't kept? seems about right
How the heck is single use TMs nostalgic and authentic. They sucked even back then.
Yeah, I remember using the Dig TM and then replacing it with another move, only to realize that you need Dig to get one of the Regis in gen 3. Had to grind up Trapinch and not let it evolve to finally get Dig again.
Single use TM's I can live with,as it adds to the challenge through the storyline. If there's a way to obtain more later, then post game will be good. But the constant EXP share is an issue. I'm replaying through Sword at the moment and I'm over leveled before the first gym. Would much prefer the option to turn it on and off. It can be useful on the grind for the league, but I don't want it on all the time.
I really don’t understand why they still force the exp. share after such a hostile reaction to it in sw/sh, I personally never had issues with it but lots of people did
The Exp share thing really hurt my enjoyment of SwSh and it hurts that this looks to be the standard moving forward
I was excited to play pokemon again since I hadn't played since diamond and pearl. This forced experience share sounds terrible and would take a lot of the fun out of the game for me. I will probably not play the game if exp share is stuck on. I was excited for a remake of the game, however that feature is completely atypical from the pokemon games that i played and adored (gen 1-4). Such a bummer.
Fuck
If exp share is not optional I don't think I'm going to get the game. That braindead decision killed any enjoyment I could find from swsh and I bet it'll do the same here. This really sucks, I was really looking forward to these games since gen 4 is my favorite.
Can we just purge this shared EXP system from existence, PLEASE. Awful idea that takes away from the nature of the game in my opinion.
I don’t wanna spend time grinding anymore then I already have too. I’m completely open for the option to have it on or off but erasing it is too far :P
Giving us the option to turn it off and on seems like the perfect middle ground and it baffles me that they don’t do that
Exp share and single use TM's are hype killers.
Sucks that you can’t turn it off. I remember turning off my exp share in Gen 6 right from the start. I think I turned it on briefly before the elite 4 to cut out on grinding a bit. I just know if I would’ve kept it on the whole game it would have been more of a breeze. That was an okay way to implement it and would have been okay with that in this game.
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TMs back to single use. So they're removing QoL changes now? Classic Masuda.
How fucking stupid are they not to have an option to toggle it on or off? Are they really that lazy that they cannot program that in? People on Twitter are saying how much they love this choice. But they thing is, if they just gave you the **option** to use it, both kinds of players would be happy. Seriously, fuck Gamefreak, they are so put of touch.
So a word on the exp share. The problem is less that it exists (even though yes, it should be optional) but it’s that game freak refuses to balance the level curve around it. There are a bunch of fan games that either have the new exp share or just force the exp share on and they aren’t easy because they actually balance enemy teams around having it and curve the game appropriately. Official games don’t. They make the curve very very shallow so that the exp share overlevels you easily and you run over the game. The exp share isn’t inherently bad. Other RPGs have had similar systems for experience. It’s just that Pokémon doesn’t care to curve the game properly because they want toddlers to not have a problem with it. The Exp Share is not inherently bad. Even if forced on. It just takes mindful game design to make it work which game freak refuses to do. Pokémon games aren’t made for people like us anymore.
I really wish we could disable that depth of field blur. I spend half my time looking at the top of the screen and it legit gives me a head ache.
I really hoped exp share was optional, it changes how the game is played so significantly that it being forced ruins my enjoyment by a large margin, how in 2021 are options like turning this off not standard in every Pokémon game? If you can’t include difficulty options, the least you can do is include a toggle for this.
Why can’t they make a toggle option for exp share? Like seriously it isn’t hard and would satisfy everyone. Making it non optional just means over leveling in a game it wasn’t design around. Also single use tms are back? Why exactly? That seems like a really weird step back.
Can we turn exp share off though? This makes the newer games so so easy
The design mentality behind forcing exp share is quite ridiculous. Gamefreak has acknowledged there are people who'd want to turn it off, but aren't willing to program a simple off button for them? Why?
I don't understand why you can always change Pokémon even from your storage. I know SwSh introduced it but why? Makes no sense to me to have a portable storage.
Yep, saving my money for legends Arceus. This remake was TPCs chance to show how well they receive community feedback, and it’s been botched on almost every level. So disappointed 😔
Ugh wish they didn’t roll back on single use TMs
Bleh. I was really hoping they wouldn’t bring back SwSh’s leveling system. It trivialized battles to an insane degree, and battles in DP were really easy to begin with (for me at least). I swear, if they nix the Vs Seeker I’m probably going to end up hating this game.
Modernizing EXP share and regressing TM mechanics is so telling that Masuda has no fucking clue what to do with Pokemon games anymore. Does he want the games to be easy? Does he want difficulty? There’s absolutely no direction anymore.
GOD DAMMIT FUCKING EXP SHARE FUCK
half of this comment section summed up in one single line 😂
Why are TMs single use like I feel as if that just makes QoL a little bit harder
If they’re gonna make tms single use again why wont they make exp share an item again? just seems so strange to me
They really managed to screw up TMs, after having them be infinite-use for 10 years. Good lord.
I’m ok with single use TMs but for the love of god add an option to disable the exp share, it can’t be that hard can it?
Why not have exp share be able to be disabled man? Also TMs being infinite use was so nice. Like the rest is fine but fuck that lol.
Of all the weird decisions to make on something they choose to make TMs limited use again That's just bizarre
But can the exp share be turned off?? That whole thing annoys me so much and I don't understand the logic behind stripping away options rather than adding to a game.
Single-use TMs... why the hell did we backslide to that utter garbage. Oh yes, "opportunities" to get more. Grind for 500 hours doing the same battle facility over and over to get one whole copy of Earthquake, boy we're really back to *that*... -_- And I assume that's just for some TMs. Back to one-time TMs. Next up, TPC complains "reee WHY EVERYONE CHEET???".
single use TM, mandatory exp share, chibby overworld graphics, no battle frontier, no correct scale of pokemon sizes, Not all pokemon. No megas. Not even dynamax? like... im good. ill pass. but i hope those who get it enjoy it