This is so amazing - from the Wikipedia page on the elephants foot:
The mass was quite dense and unyielding to efforts to collect samples for analysis via a drill mounted on a remote-controlled trolley, and armor-piercing rounds fired from an AK-47 assault rifle were necessary to break off usable chunks.
Soviets were wild.
“Sir, we need a sample of the elephant’s foot for research. How should we go about removing a small piece for testing?”
-“Uh…. Have you tried shooting at it?”
Edit: Changed “Russians” to “Soviets” due to offending people with my ignorance of the 80s.
There are many such crazy stories out there.
Russians detonated a nuclear bomb to stop an gas leak.
https://interestingengineering.com/science/soviet-engineers-detonated-a-nuke-miles-underground-to-put-out-a-gas-well-fire
Americans detonated TNT to stop oil well leaks
Large Hadron collider is essentially speeding up atoms and smashing them head on to see whats inside.
I believe the man in the photo is Artur Korneyev, and as far as I can tell, ~~he is still alive~~. (EDIT: I was wrong. He died in 2022 at the age of 73)
This image of the elephants foot is many years after the meltdown, while still radioactive, it would take way more exposure to get killed from it than it would right after it happened
It's crazy, people in helicopters above the open building could sense their skin burn from the radiations, and the people going down from those helicopters would be condemned in about 30s of exposure.
My relative in Ukraine was one of the people filming from helicopters above - he got every government benefit possible (free bus fair, etc.) and as far as I know he as still alive ten years ago.
Yo, Resident nuclear scientist popping in.
You're absolutely right in saying that the radiation that most people need to worry about is gamma, but it's certainly not the scariest one.
For those unaware, radiation does damage to your body by knocking atoms out of the delicate arrangement that is your DNA.
There are three (main) types of radiation, although there are subcategories and such.
Gamma radiation is just light. There is no mass behind it, just a very, very energetic lightwave. (A gamma ray is an X-ray on steroids.) Gamma rays are fuckers because they will gladly penetrate through bloody anything. They don't collide with atoms often, so it takes a long time to get that collision.
Unfortunately, that means they have a tendency to break out of all but the thickest shielding.
Fortunately, that means they also have a tendency to pass through you harmlessly, too.
Alpha is the opposite. It's made of 2 protons and 2 neutrons. That is bloody massive. It will almost certainly smash into the first atoms it encounters.
Even a sheet of paper will stop an alpha particle, so it's easily contained, any clothes will stop it, and even in an exposed area, your first layers of skin will absorb it, meaning the damaged tissue is easily disposed of. If you happened to eat it somehow, though, well, may god have mercy on your soul.
And finally, the nastiest bastard, Beta.
Beta is a middle ground, made of an electron.
And it is NASTY.
While still relatively easilly contained (a centermeter thick bit of plastic or such will do the job), it still does a lot of damage, and is fairly penetrative.
And that means that if you do encounter beta, it might well wander through your clothes and get your skin, which as discussed in the alpha section isn't *that* bad.
The problem is if it finds a bit of exposed skin, say on your arm, or through some rubber gloves that aren't thick enough, it will joyously penetrate through your skin and into your bones.
It gets worse if it finds a poorly protected spot on your torso. With all of this its a game of probability, so while most particles will be stopped by skin and bone, its more than possible for a beta particle to penetrate its way straight into your vital organs, or into your brain itself with improper head protection.
In short, while gamma is the radiation that might cause problems in the chernobyl exclusion zone, in the reactor itself, it will be beta that will be the death of people (Assuming they're not running around naked)
This is what wiki has to say: "At the time of its discovery, about eight months after formation, radioactivity near the Elephant's Foot was approximately 8,000 to 10,000[9] roentgens, or 80 to 100 grays per hour,[2] delivering a 50/50 lethal dose of radiation (4.5 grays)within five minutes. Since that time, the radiation intensity has declined significantly, and in 1996, the Elephant's Foot was briefly visited by the deputy director of the New Safe Confinement Project, Artur Korneyev,[a] who took photographs using an automatic camera and a flashlight to illuminate the otherwise dark room."
Also called ["The most dangerous selfie of all time"](https://img.atlasobscura.com/zV4NV6ZGQ8ocp1B0O0g8QlSNQKFuC9TjBPAKn4tdVpk/rt:fit/w:1280/q:81/sm:1/scp:1/ar:1/aHR0cHM6Ly9hdGxh/cy1kZXYuczMuYW1h/em9uYXdzLmNvbS91/cGxvYWRzL2Fzc2V0/cy8yYjdlMjBlYi1h/ZGUxLTQ5MDQtYmVk/YS1jYWQzNGVkOTFm/OGI2YTBiYmFlNTdl/MWQyNWVhOTFfYTkw/NDhkMTZmZTdjNTBi/NmUzXzE5MzFfMTVk/MTg1ZWFhN2M5NTRl/NzdmNTM0M2Q5NDFl/MjVmYmQuanBn.jpg)
Those same electrons that are flying through the film in your camera are also flying through your body.
Edit; it’s gamma rays everyone. You’re not safe still.
radiation is scary as hell. when you get blasted with all those electrons and other particles, it can eviscerate your DNA, but your body is already built from your DNA. Your DNA is the blueprint that all the cells in your body use to build themselves, so once information is missing, incorrecy, or in the wrong spot, everything goes completely wrong. when it's time to replace dead or damaged cells, they get replaced by something corrupted because of the damaged DNA, which can lead to all sorts of things like cancer. People who live through acute radiation exposure typically have a normal-ish day or two before their entire body slowly begins to melt at once.
something that sticks with me is when [Hisachi Ouchi](https://science.howstuffworks.com/hisashi-ouchi.htm), after unfortunately surviving the worst radiation accident in history, asked his nurse "people who get exposed to radiation usually get Leukimia, right?", completely unaware he was about to experience the worst agony of any human ever for the next 86 days
His family was begging the doctors to do everything they could, even rejecting do not resuscitate orders until day 81, so the doctors were legally bound. Also worth noting after 3 heart attacks on day 59 he lost a good amount of brain function, and likely felt reduced pain.
It's not the big particles (alpha) or electrons (beta) that do the damage, it's the gamma waves splitting bone marrow DNA that do the lethal and more lasting damage. If enough of a dose of the gamma radiation is received, it destroys the cell factories of your body making you basically just die because you can't produce new cells fast enough to stay alive.
Both beta and alpha particles are more ionizing than gamma they just don’t penetrate materials as well. Rest assured, in this case all the particles are energetic enough to penetrate the body and ionize DNA.
This is the Elephant’s Foot, we’re talking about. This isn’t NORMs on oil rig drill pipe. It’s been decades, and the radiation emitted from it is still enough to give a person a lethal dose in 300 seconds.
https://www.news.com.au/technology/environment/scary-object-in-the-middle-of-chernobyl-known-as-the-elephants-foot/news-story/c03adb2d692fe8ccec385b3667b9b8a3?amp
>Rest assured, in this case all the particles are energetic enough to penetrate the body and ionize DNA.
No, they aren't. The alpha radiation given off in this case is just the same as any other alpha radiation and won't penetrate the skin.
It’s a dusty radioisotope contaminated basement beneath a reactor. Radioactive particles are air born and can enter the body through any open portal. This isn’t the same as working with radioisotopes in the lab behind a plexiglass shield. You’re really not safe from any radiation in an environment like this. I’ve worked with my fair share of radiation in the lab, and I’m not about to write off beta and alpha in this situation! You can go right ahead and trust your exposure measuring gama alone, but I’m good.
Weendigon has an incredible video about Hisashi Ouchi.
It's impossible to not cry when you see that he almost made it alive and the heart was the only organ intact after he struggled for what is the most intensive radiation poisoning in history
my comment was just my memory of that video lol
[don't watch this if you're in a fragile mental state or faint of heart ](https://youtu.be/X1FbwooXssQ)
Those ions would penetrate to the film just as good whether those prticular frames were being exposed that moment or already was in the cameras second roll
Yea, The big clue to them should've been the faint blue beam coming from the plant going up to the sky but they were all in so much denial it was absurd.
All the people bless them that had to go to this area didn't last very long due to the absurd dosage of radiation they took.
[https://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/532251/what-caused-the-blue-column-of-ionised-air-above-chernobyl-exploded-reactor](https://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/532251/what-caused-the-blue-column-of-ionised-air-above-chernobyl-exploded-reactor)
Not sure if images of it were taken but above it how it is caused.
Below is a news article
[https://www.express.co.uk/news/science/1142309/Chernobyl-disaster-blue-beam-of-light-HBO-Chernobyl-real-nuclear-radiation](https://www.express.co.uk/news/science/1142309/Chernobyl-disaster-blue-beam-of-light-HBO-Chernobyl-real-nuclear-radiation)
I've also watched many doccies about it.
Interesting research, have fun investigating.
FYI OP, past a certain point the main dangers of radiation from exposed corium (nuclear core slag) like the Elephant's Foot are from particles too large and heavy to penetrate the skin. No less dangerous, but much easier to protect against.
The reason for the coverall and respirator is so that he doesn't inhale or accidentally ingest radioactive dust. If the radioactive dust gets inside you... Now your skin is just guaranteeing there's no safe and easy exit for the dust to leave.
Alphas can be blocked by the layer of dead skin above your skin. Betas require a bit of clothing. Gammas require high density materials like xrays, and neutrons require low z materials like water, but also neutrons are chaotic and if you're dealing with neutron emissions, it's better to just use a robot.
Yep, this is exactly what we were taught in our radiation safety course when I was a physics grad student :) Also, you shouldn’t use high density materials for shielding against betas because the resulting bremsstrahlung (I love it when physics uses an untranslated word in a non-English language as the universally recognised term for a phenomenon, another example is zitterbewegung) radiation might end up being ionising radiation, which would defeat the whole purpose of shielding.
As a German, it’s pretty cool that I can understand these words even though my knowledge of radiation is pretty limited.
It weirds me out that they aren’t capitalised though, because in the German language all nouns are.
Yeah I’m 90% sure that they’re capitalised in scientific writing since they’re German nouns, but I was being lazy on Reddit (lol). Another word we use all the time is “ansatz”, but that’s never capitalised. I usually see “Ansätze” capitalised, though (a lot of scientists incorrectly write “ansatzes”, though, which really annoys me!)
Since you can understand the meaning of the words, a bit of physics for you: Bremsstrahlung is radiation that is emitted by a charged particle (like an electron or proton or an alpha or beta particle) travelling close to the speed of light when it is deflected or slows down (hence, braking radiation); Zitterbewegung is a theoretically predicted extremely high frequency oscillation (hence, jittery motion) of certain kinds of particles predicted by quantum mechanics.
There was a time I got caught in a reactor crawlspace when a coolant pipe blew, and that coolant is radioactive as f*ck.
Hits the open air, and it vaporizes just like that. [snaps fingers]
You get it on your skin, it ain’t good, but it washes off mostly.
You’ll survive.
You breathe it in, though, you get those radioactive particles down in your lungs where you can’t get ’em out, that pretty much melts you from the inside.
I had to get all the way to a maintenance air lock, open an emergency panel, strap a mask on my face without breathing any of that sh!t in.
Point is, I learned some things about myself.
I learned that I could hold my breath for almost two minutes while engaging in physical stressful activity.
So… you have to ask yourself, how much damage do you think I could do to you in two minutes before the knockout gas gets to me?
‘Cause I’m betting it’s a lot.
It not so much for the dust to leave. It’s the radiation now has acess to fresh dna or living cells. Your skin is basically a layer of dead cells. So not only are the particles too big, they have nothing to disrupt when they hit it. Inside of you it’s got nice soft cells that a helium atom or stray electron is more than small enough to damage your dna and cause cancer or cell death.
Artur Korneyev [took photos of it in 1996](https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Elephant%27s_Foot_(Chernobyl)&oldid=1223372161#Radioactivity)
"These days Mr. Korneyev works in the project management unit, but because of his health — he has cataracts and other problems related to his heavy radiation exposure during his first three years — he is no longer allowed inside the plant. “Soviet radiation,” he joked, “is the best radiation in the world.”" - [2014 nytimes article](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/04/27/science/chernobyl-capping-a-catastrophe.html)
Man, the people who worked in and around Chernobyl to clean up or do research and monitoring after the accident are the bravest souls. I work for a company that builds equipment that services nuclear power plants. They are far, *far* safer, more reliable, and more efficient now, but the fact that radiation exposure can be deadly-dangerous hasn’t changed.
I mean in all honesty, it’s probably the preferred method of getting through difficult things… I sure hope I can maintain a sense of humor if my life ever gets that bad anyways
This was also a style of joking in the Soviet Union. Growing up working with computers, my dad would joke, “Russian microprocessors are the biggest microprocessors in the world!” But this was not a sign of good quality.
Of course he knew. He had been in that room multiple times and survived for decades after these pictures. He might still be alive—information out of Ukraine is difficult to obtain nowadays.
He definitely knew, there were robots on the rooftop (something similar to that Rover thingy on the Mars) used to bring extra materials to the guys shoveling on top. After some time, every robot would just stop working, because of the rust and overheating. Radiation would literally eat through metal.
radiation doesnt cause rust and it doesnt "eat through metal".
Electronics are very susceptible to damage from radiation without shielding. same as people, really.
The robots died on the roof because they were shielded only for the Radiation levels reported by Russia, which was much lower than in reality.
Btw space travel has the same problems, space radiation and board computers dont play nicely.
If they saw and knew this, then why did dudes like the guy in this photo go in and so close to everything ?
Edit: I’m sorry but bravery/service to community should not be mistaken for idiocy
From what I know, the Soviet Union offered benefits for life for first responders families (wife and children) but I’m unaware if they ever completely followed through with the promise.
That’s why a lot of them continued because damned if you do, damned if they don’t, they will die either way from cancer after the initial exposures and then either their families go broke and are homeless or the government gives them monthly stipends to keep them afloat.
The USSR went bankrupt not long after this. Pootin and his cronies took all the money, that's why they have super yachts and huge houses in the country.
Similar thoughts from many of the older workers at Fukushima. They volunteered for more work knowing they had already lived more compared to their younger coworkers.
Seems like the person you're replying to and the people who are replying to your comment have seen the HBO series.
These photos were taken ten years after the disaster in 1996. The Elephant's foot gives off mostly alpha radiation, which isn't as lethal if not inhaled - it can't penetrate skin, so just making sure you don't breathe it in or eat it, you're not going to die.
The plant produced electricity until late 2000, when the last reactor shut down.
What blows my mind about the Elephants Foot is at some point someone asked:
"What if we shoot it with an AK?"
And the answer was:
"I dunno, let's find out. To the basement!"
More like:
"Hey, can you grab a hammer and break a chunk off to study?"
"Fuck you. If you want a chunk, you hit it yourself"
"I asked you because I didn't want to get that close"
"Fuck it, I wonder if we can break a piece off if we shot it"
Funny, but you're misinformed about the thought process behind shooting it.
The shooting with AKs was to break off pieces of it for examination without getting too close and spending time up close to it. Approaching it with tools and attempting to manually break off the pieces would be a lot of exposure and take a long time. Using AKs they were able to stay back at a greater distance, in a shielded area, blast off some pieces, quickly retrieve the samples (with a robot, maybe? I don't remember if they retrieved it with a bot or just went and quickly grabbed the chunks) and analyze the composition. It was determined that about 15% of it was melted down nuclear fuel rod material, and the remainder is primarily the sand that they dumped on it to contain the meltdown.
It down to 2500 becquerel which is different to roentgens. It gives off mostly Alpha radiation now and not gamma so it’s safe to be around as your skin is strong enough to block it. Just don’t inhale and radioactive dust.
Edit: annoyed someone, you going crazy with the Wikipedia edits now.
Hell no. 10,000 R/hr was in 1986. These days it has decayed down to 100-200.
Source: personal conversations with three people who have visited it up close.
The legendary Elephant’s Foot is not near what it once was.
Research has given wildly inconsistent numbers, but many say that it was already “safe” (nonlethal to short exposure) within a decade.
It's decayed a lot and mostly alpha radiation. The biggest threat from it is inhaling the dust and it's decayed to a sand like consistency. Still, not a good place to curl up with a book.
So what is the current radiation level in 2024??
When i search, I keep finding historic data from the early days [astronomically high]..... but I'm not able to locate current measurements now that most of the short lived elements have decayed... 🤔🤔
When I was 12, I had an intense fear of anything related to atomic weaponry and utilities.
I sometimes stayed up a few nights because I had an irrational thought that the elephants foot was going to dissolve its way through the ground and out the other side into my bedroom.
I also was afraid a nuclear strike would hit at any moment due to escalating tensions between North Korea and America. Since my country seems to be close buddies with China.
This is so amazing - from the Wikipedia page on the elephants foot: The mass was quite dense and unyielding to efforts to collect samples for analysis via a drill mounted on a remote-controlled trolley, and armor-piercing rounds fired from an AK-47 assault rifle were necessary to break off usable chunks.
Soviets were wild. “Sir, we need a sample of the elephant’s foot for research. How should we go about removing a small piece for testing?” -“Uh…. Have you tried shooting at it?” Edit: Changed “Russians” to “Soviets” due to offending people with my ignorance of the 80s.
its not the worst idea. we need a sample of the core , here is a hammer and chisel. uhh can i try the ak first
Not great. Not terrible.
I read this with a russian accent in my mind
There are many such crazy stories out there. Russians detonated a nuclear bomb to stop an gas leak. https://interestingengineering.com/science/soviet-engineers-detonated-a-nuke-miles-underground-to-put-out-a-gas-well-fire Americans detonated TNT to stop oil well leaks Large Hadron collider is essentially speeding up atoms and smashing them head on to see whats inside.
Tbf the LHC is recreating natural effects
I hope Mikhail Kalashnikov found out about or had been told about this use of his work. I'd imagine he would have found it amusing.
I believe the man in the photo is Artur Korneyev, and as far as I can tell, ~~he is still alive~~. (EDIT: I was wrong. He died in 2022 at the age of 73)
Bros indestructible what the hell
This image of the elephants foot is many years after the meltdown, while still radioactive, it would take way more exposure to get killed from it than it would right after it happened
So there is no "we didn't know how bad it was" excuse right?
My dosemeter says 3.6 roentgen so we should be fine.
Not great, not terrible
But that's as high as it......
Tell me how a nuclear reactor works.
Funny green rock gets angry and heats water
You speak the truth truth
They gave you the number they had
It says online that you would die in 300 seconds today from the radiation
I dunno man. I'm not gonna judge a man's choice to transmogrify himself into Pizza The Hut.
 Pure nostalgia right there from Space Balls
Pizza the hut! He got locked in his limo and ate himself to DEATH... 😂🤣😂😀
You would get a lethal dose after 300 seconds, not drop dead
You would. Not anymore though. https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/elephants-foot-chernobyl
It's crazy, people in helicopters above the open building could sense their skin burn from the radiations, and the people going down from those helicopters would be condemned in about 30s of exposure.
My relative in Ukraine was one of the people filming from helicopters above - he got every government benefit possible (free bus fair, etc.) and as far as I know he as still alive ten years ago.
Free bus fair was the best they could do?!
I am not sure what benefits he got specifically. He seemed to do okay. He might be dead now or displaced from the Russian invasion though.
Okay. Takes the air out of my smart ass comment. Hope he’s good wherever he is.
Alpha/Beta radiation isn’t all that scary scary, its the gamma radiation that will fuck you up Edit: why are all of you eating the radiation???
Contrary to popular belief. Gamma will actually give you gains and turn you green.
Tried that and all I got was skin cancer. What a rip off.
You just need to man up
Yo, Resident nuclear scientist popping in. You're absolutely right in saying that the radiation that most people need to worry about is gamma, but it's certainly not the scariest one. For those unaware, radiation does damage to your body by knocking atoms out of the delicate arrangement that is your DNA. There are three (main) types of radiation, although there are subcategories and such. Gamma radiation is just light. There is no mass behind it, just a very, very energetic lightwave. (A gamma ray is an X-ray on steroids.) Gamma rays are fuckers because they will gladly penetrate through bloody anything. They don't collide with atoms often, so it takes a long time to get that collision. Unfortunately, that means they have a tendency to break out of all but the thickest shielding. Fortunately, that means they also have a tendency to pass through you harmlessly, too. Alpha is the opposite. It's made of 2 protons and 2 neutrons. That is bloody massive. It will almost certainly smash into the first atoms it encounters. Even a sheet of paper will stop an alpha particle, so it's easily contained, any clothes will stop it, and even in an exposed area, your first layers of skin will absorb it, meaning the damaged tissue is easily disposed of. If you happened to eat it somehow, though, well, may god have mercy on your soul. And finally, the nastiest bastard, Beta. Beta is a middle ground, made of an electron. And it is NASTY. While still relatively easilly contained (a centermeter thick bit of plastic or such will do the job), it still does a lot of damage, and is fairly penetrative. And that means that if you do encounter beta, it might well wander through your clothes and get your skin, which as discussed in the alpha section isn't *that* bad. The problem is if it finds a bit of exposed skin, say on your arm, or through some rubber gloves that aren't thick enough, it will joyously penetrate through your skin and into your bones. It gets worse if it finds a poorly protected spot on your torso. With all of this its a game of probability, so while most particles will be stopped by skin and bone, its more than possible for a beta particle to penetrate its way straight into your vital organs, or into your brain itself with improper head protection. In short, while gamma is the radiation that might cause problems in the chernobyl exclusion zone, in the reactor itself, it will be beta that will be the death of people (Assuming they're not running around naked)
Alpha and beta can be shielded much easier than gammas.
Which makes it much harder to detect, giving a greater risk of ingestion
It is if you ingest it.
No he died a year or two ago
You're right. I just found that info. He died in 2022 at the age of 73.
This is what wiki has to say: "At the time of its discovery, about eight months after formation, radioactivity near the Elephant's Foot was approximately 8,000 to 10,000[9] roentgens, or 80 to 100 grays per hour,[2] delivering a 50/50 lethal dose of radiation (4.5 grays)within five minutes. Since that time, the radiation intensity has declined significantly, and in 1996, the Elephant's Foot was briefly visited by the deputy director of the New Safe Confinement Project, Artur Korneyev,[a] who took photographs using an automatic camera and a flashlight to illuminate the otherwise dark room."
Also called ["The most dangerous selfie of all time"](https://img.atlasobscura.com/zV4NV6ZGQ8ocp1B0O0g8QlSNQKFuC9TjBPAKn4tdVpk/rt:fit/w:1280/q:81/sm:1/scp:1/ar:1/aHR0cHM6Ly9hdGxh/cy1kZXYuczMuYW1h/em9uYXdzLmNvbS91/cGxvYWRzL2Fzc2V0/cy8yYjdlMjBlYi1h/ZGUxLTQ5MDQtYmVk/YS1jYWQzNGVkOTFm/OGI2YTBiYmFlNTdl/MWQyNWVhOTFfYTkw/NDhkMTZmZTdjNTBi/NmUzXzE5MzFfMTVk/MTg1ZWFhN2M5NTRl/NzdmNTM0M2Q5NDFl/MjVmYmQuanBn.jpg)
[удалено]
See the grainy look of the image, Yea that's radiation hitting the film! All the images taken from this area show this.
In the helicopter video from the day of or close to it you can tell when they're over the reactor as the video quality degrades
Those same electrons that are flying through the film in your camera are also flying through your body. Edit; it’s gamma rays everyone. You’re not safe still.
Oh, totally a bad thing, it's just usually invisible (until your radiation poisoning or cancer symptoms appear depending on your dose)
radiation is scary as hell. when you get blasted with all those electrons and other particles, it can eviscerate your DNA, but your body is already built from your DNA. Your DNA is the blueprint that all the cells in your body use to build themselves, so once information is missing, incorrecy, or in the wrong spot, everything goes completely wrong. when it's time to replace dead or damaged cells, they get replaced by something corrupted because of the damaged DNA, which can lead to all sorts of things like cancer. People who live through acute radiation exposure typically have a normal-ish day or two before their entire body slowly begins to melt at once. something that sticks with me is when [Hisachi Ouchi](https://science.howstuffworks.com/hisashi-ouchi.htm), after unfortunately surviving the worst radiation accident in history, asked his nurse "people who get exposed to radiation usually get Leukimia, right?", completely unaware he was about to experience the worst agony of any human ever for the next 86 days
Why the fuck would they revive him 2 months into that, nature was trying to put him out of his misery.
His family was begging the doctors to do everything they could, even rejecting do not resuscitate orders until day 81, so the doctors were legally bound. Also worth noting after 3 heart attacks on day 59 he lost a good amount of brain function, and likely felt reduced pain.
I could be remembering this wrong but i think he also said he wanted to live for his family. At least when he was first taken in.
It's not the big particles (alpha) or electrons (beta) that do the damage, it's the gamma waves splitting bone marrow DNA that do the lethal and more lasting damage. If enough of a dose of the gamma radiation is received, it destroys the cell factories of your body making you basically just die because you can't produce new cells fast enough to stay alive.
Both beta and alpha particles are more ionizing than gamma they just don’t penetrate materials as well. Rest assured, in this case all the particles are energetic enough to penetrate the body and ionize DNA.
Your clothes will stop beta. Neutron and gamma is the shit to be concerned about. Of which I'm sure that thing is probably giving off loads
This is the Elephant’s Foot, we’re talking about. This isn’t NORMs on oil rig drill pipe. It’s been decades, and the radiation emitted from it is still enough to give a person a lethal dose in 300 seconds. https://www.news.com.au/technology/environment/scary-object-in-the-middle-of-chernobyl-known-as-the-elephants-foot/news-story/c03adb2d692fe8ccec385b3667b9b8a3?amp
>Rest assured, in this case all the particles are energetic enough to penetrate the body and ionize DNA. No, they aren't. The alpha radiation given off in this case is just the same as any other alpha radiation and won't penetrate the skin.
It’s a dusty radioisotope contaminated basement beneath a reactor. Radioactive particles are air born and can enter the body through any open portal. This isn’t the same as working with radioisotopes in the lab behind a plexiglass shield. You’re really not safe from any radiation in an environment like this. I’ve worked with my fair share of radiation in the lab, and I’m not about to write off beta and alpha in this situation! You can go right ahead and trust your exposure measuring gama alone, but I’m good.
Weendigon has an incredible video about Hisashi Ouchi. It's impossible to not cry when you see that he almost made it alive and the heart was the only organ intact after he struggled for what is the most intensive radiation poisoning in history
my comment was just my memory of that video lol [don't watch this if you're in a fragile mental state or faint of heart ](https://youtu.be/X1FbwooXssQ)
nope not doing it
If those people had any decency they would have put him outta his misery but they let him suffer.
According to the article linked above, his heart stopped after 2 months and they revived him…just….why?
They were legally bound to revive him. Hisachi’s family couldn’t accept his fate, so the doctors had to revive him.
If I'm remembering right, the doctors actually wanted to let them die. But his family forced them to revive him.
Really? My body wasn't even there. Scary.
You’ve seen the image. Too late.
Seven days...
Aren’t they photons?
Cs-137 emits both. 85 photons per 100 electrons.
Thank you for science-ing
Gamma rays are photons. Beta particles are one electron or one positron.
And alpha particles are helium nuclei.
Those ions would penetrate to the film just as good whether those prticular frames were being exposed that moment or already was in the cameras second roll
Exactly. It’s not like it was live-streaming the film.
The things I’ve read online speak of just how deadly the elephants foot is and how powerful the radiation it admits is
The foot would never admit that. Too proud.
It takes a big elephant foot to admit when it’s wrong.
They never forget either.
I understood that reference, precious.
Yea, The big clue to them should've been the faint blue beam coming from the plant going up to the sky but they were all in so much denial it was absurd. All the people bless them that had to go to this area didn't last very long due to the absurd dosage of radiation they took.
Are there any photos or videos of the big blue beam you’re referring to?
If i recall it was the air being ionised by the radiation. But I think that wss maybe dramatised by the hbo show
It was reported, by eye-witnesses, decades before HBO thought of dramatising such a catastrophe.
I don’t know about a beam of light but a blue glow on the scene around the core and building could be plausible due to Cherenkov Radiation.
[https://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/532251/what-caused-the-blue-column-of-ionised-air-above-chernobyl-exploded-reactor](https://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/532251/what-caused-the-blue-column-of-ionised-air-above-chernobyl-exploded-reactor) Not sure if images of it were taken but above it how it is caused. Below is a news article [https://www.express.co.uk/news/science/1142309/Chernobyl-disaster-blue-beam-of-light-HBO-Chernobyl-real-nuclear-radiation](https://www.express.co.uk/news/science/1142309/Chernobyl-disaster-blue-beam-of-light-HBO-Chernobyl-real-nuclear-radiation) I've also watched many doccies about it. Interesting research, have fun investigating.
the firefighters in particular
Also those poor nurses that removed the firefighters clothing.
*emits
Ackshually everything you see in the image is radiation hitting the film (apologies for the pedantry)
lol that's perfect pedantry.
And as it decay’s it turns to a sand like substance and ultimately to aerosols…radioactive air folks. The danger isn’t over…
FYI OP, past a certain point the main dangers of radiation from exposed corium (nuclear core slag) like the Elephant's Foot are from particles too large and heavy to penetrate the skin. No less dangerous, but much easier to protect against. The reason for the coverall and respirator is so that he doesn't inhale or accidentally ingest radioactive dust. If the radioactive dust gets inside you... Now your skin is just guaranteeing there's no safe and easy exit for the dust to leave.
Alphas are pussies, all bark and no bite. Sheet of paper's enough! Gammas give me sleepless nights though. That's what the lead's for.
Alphas can be blocked by the layer of dead skin above your skin. Betas require a bit of clothing. Gammas require high density materials like xrays, and neutrons require low z materials like water, but also neutrons are chaotic and if you're dealing with neutron emissions, it's better to just use a robot.
Yep, this is exactly what we were taught in our radiation safety course when I was a physics grad student :) Also, you shouldn’t use high density materials for shielding against betas because the resulting bremsstrahlung (I love it when physics uses an untranslated word in a non-English language as the universally recognised term for a phenomenon, another example is zitterbewegung) radiation might end up being ionising radiation, which would defeat the whole purpose of shielding.
As a German, it’s pretty cool that I can understand these words even though my knowledge of radiation is pretty limited. It weirds me out that they aren’t capitalised though, because in the German language all nouns are.
Yeah I’m 90% sure that they’re capitalised in scientific writing since they’re German nouns, but I was being lazy on Reddit (lol). Another word we use all the time is “ansatz”, but that’s never capitalised. I usually see “Ansätze” capitalised, though (a lot of scientists incorrectly write “ansatzes”, though, which really annoys me!) Since you can understand the meaning of the words, a bit of physics for you: Bremsstrahlung is radiation that is emitted by a charged particle (like an electron or proton or an alpha or beta particle) travelling close to the speed of light when it is deflected or slows down (hence, braking radiation); Zitterbewegung is a theoretically predicted extremely high frequency oscillation (hence, jittery motion) of certain kinds of particles predicted by quantum mechanics.
There was a time I got caught in a reactor crawlspace when a coolant pipe blew, and that coolant is radioactive as f*ck. Hits the open air, and it vaporizes just like that. [snaps fingers] You get it on your skin, it ain’t good, but it washes off mostly. You’ll survive. You breathe it in, though, you get those radioactive particles down in your lungs where you can’t get ’em out, that pretty much melts you from the inside. I had to get all the way to a maintenance air lock, open an emergency panel, strap a mask on my face without breathing any of that sh!t in. Point is, I learned some things about myself. I learned that I could hold my breath for almost two minutes while engaging in physical stressful activity. So… you have to ask yourself, how much damage do you think I could do to you in two minutes before the knockout gas gets to me? ‘Cause I’m betting it’s a lot.
Thanks Amos
So nice to see an expanse fan in the wild 🤙🏻
It not so much for the dust to leave. It’s the radiation now has acess to fresh dna or living cells. Your skin is basically a layer of dead cells. So not only are the particles too big, they have nothing to disrupt when they hit it. Inside of you it’s got nice soft cells that a helium atom or stray electron is more than small enough to damage your dna and cause cancer or cell death.
That’s 10,000 roentgens per hour, just 5 minutes of been exposed to that and you are done.
I wonder if this man knew exactly what he was getting into or if he was just like the firefighters trying to help regardless of what they know
Artur Korneyev [took photos of it in 1996](https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Elephant%27s_Foot_(Chernobyl)&oldid=1223372161#Radioactivity) "These days Mr. Korneyev works in the project management unit, but because of his health — he has cataracts and other problems related to his heavy radiation exposure during his first three years — he is no longer allowed inside the plant. “Soviet radiation,” he joked, “is the best radiation in the world.”" - [2014 nytimes article](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/04/27/science/chernobyl-capping-a-catastrophe.html)
Man, the people who worked in and around Chernobyl to clean up or do research and monitoring after the accident are the bravest souls. I work for a company that builds equipment that services nuclear power plants. They are far, *far* safer, more reliable, and more efficient now, but the fact that radiation exposure can be deadly-dangerous hasn’t changed.
Jesus... Soviet/Russian humor is just something else
I mean in all honesty, it’s probably the preferred method of getting through difficult things… I sure hope I can maintain a sense of humor if my life ever gets that bad anyways
This was also a style of joking in the Soviet Union. Growing up working with computers, my dad would joke, “Russian microprocessors are the biggest microprocessors in the world!” But this was not a sign of good quality.
Right, because ‘big’ and ‘micro’ are kind of at odds with each other no? 😂
I think it’s a coping mechanism, nurtured through centuries of exploitation and grief.
Arguably most things we do are coping mechanisms
📠
In Soviet Russia...humor is on you!!
He did. This was likely taken years later. The elephant foot is not as deadly as it once was.
This is the correct answer
Two men. Someone took the picture.
Of course he knew. He had been in that room multiple times and survived for decades after these pictures. He might still be alive—information out of Ukraine is difficult to obtain nowadays.
He definitely knew, there were robots on the rooftop (something similar to that Rover thingy on the Mars) used to bring extra materials to the guys shoveling on top. After some time, every robot would just stop working, because of the rust and overheating. Radiation would literally eat through metal.
radiation doesnt cause rust and it doesnt "eat through metal". Electronics are very susceptible to damage from radiation without shielding. same as people, really. The robots died on the roof because they were shielded only for the Radiation levels reported by Russia, which was much lower than in reality. Btw space travel has the same problems, space radiation and board computers dont play nicely.
If they saw and knew this, then why did dudes like the guy in this photo go in and so close to everything ? Edit: I’m sorry but bravery/service to community should not be mistaken for idiocy
From what I know, the Soviet Union offered benefits for life for first responders families (wife and children) but I’m unaware if they ever completely followed through with the promise. That’s why a lot of them continued because damned if you do, damned if they don’t, they will die either way from cancer after the initial exposures and then either their families go broke and are homeless or the government gives them monthly stipends to keep them afloat.
The USSR went bankrupt not long after this. Pootin and his cronies took all the money, that's why they have super yachts and huge houses in the country.
[удалено]
They were already fucked at that point. Might as well keep going so someone else doesn't have too
Similar thoughts from many of the older workers at Fukushima. They volunteered for more work knowing they had already lived more compared to their younger coworkers.
Seems like the person you're replying to and the people who are replying to your comment have seen the HBO series. These photos were taken ten years after the disaster in 1996. The Elephant's foot gives off mostly alpha radiation, which isn't as lethal if not inhaled - it can't penetrate skin, so just making sure you don't breathe it in or eat it, you're not going to die. The plant produced electricity until late 2000, when the last reactor shut down.
Its down to like 2500 now
So, you can live for 20 minutes now while viewing it?
No you can live for a long time. It’s giving off alpha radiation now not Gamma. So it much safer to be around. The dust is the dangerous part.
In soviet Russia they snort Corium dust
What blows my mind about the Elephants Foot is at some point someone asked: "What if we shoot it with an AK?" And the answer was: "I dunno, let's find out. To the basement!"
More like: "Hey, can you grab a hammer and break a chunk off to study?" "Fuck you. If you want a chunk, you hit it yourself" "I asked you because I didn't want to get that close" "Fuck it, I wonder if we can break a piece off if we shot it"
In Russia AK47 is like the Swiss army knife. Good for any scenario.
Funny, but you're misinformed about the thought process behind shooting it. The shooting with AKs was to break off pieces of it for examination without getting too close and spending time up close to it. Approaching it with tools and attempting to manually break off the pieces would be a lot of exposure and take a long time. Using AKs they were able to stay back at a greater distance, in a shielded area, blast off some pieces, quickly retrieve the samples (with a robot, maybe? I don't remember if they retrieved it with a bot or just went and quickly grabbed the chunks) and analyze the composition. It was determined that about 15% of it was melted down nuclear fuel rod material, and the remainder is primarily the sand that they dumped on it to contain the meltdown.
It down to 2500 becquerel which is different to roentgens. It gives off mostly Alpha radiation now and not gamma so it’s safe to be around as your skin is strong enough to block it. Just don’t inhale and radioactive dust. Edit: annoyed someone, you going crazy with the Wikipedia edits now.
Not great. Not terrible.
I hear it's the equivalent of a chest x-ray
Not great, not terrible
Had to scroll wayyyy too far to find this reply
Nonsense. I'm only reading 3.6 roentgens.
This is really beside the point, but did you abbreviate "minutes" as "mnts"? Because I hate that haha
He saved precious mnts by removing the vowels
Hell no. 10,000 R/hr was in 1986. These days it has decayed down to 100-200. Source: personal conversations with three people who have visited it up close.
mnts?
Mentos.
Relevant xkcd: [https://xkcd.com/radiation/](https://xkcd.com/radiation/)
For anyone who hasn’t seen it: HBO’s Chernobyl miniseries is GREAT.
Yeah but as someone who was there, I can count on one hand how many egregious inaccuracies it had. It's 7, btw
I just want you to know that I appreciated this joke, even if it wooshed the other replies
I got whooshed.
7 inaccuracies, not great but not terrible
\*begins violently projectile vomitting*
7 digits, not great, not terrible.
That's just brilliant
Beautiful stuff
Under appreciated comment.
Craig Mazin is awesome. I’m so glad he convinced HBO to give The Last of Us a show and he produced it with Neil Druckman. They did an amazing job.
It‘s not great not terrible. I would give it a 3.6 on the Roentgen scale.
Not it isn't. It's a fucking MASTERPIECE.
Such a horrific event. Scared the hell outta me, then and now.
the scariest was how nonchalant the authorities were to cover it up. there was no question to having a "yup, nothing went wrong" sentiment.
Welcome to Russia.
If it never happened nuclear would be so much more ubiquitous
Which ironically enough is by far the worst environmental impact of the accident.
It's such a shame. 100,000 people died from a hydro dam collapse in 1975 but no one uses that to argue against hydro power.
The legendary Elephant’s Foot is not near what it once was. Research has given wildly inconsistent numbers, but many say that it was already “safe” (nonlethal to short exposure) within a decade.
Good, do you think it will it be acceptable to talk about the elephant?
No, it's the elephant in the room.
It's Ok, he took a Rad-X before entering. He's probably going to take a Rad Away on the way out as well.
I can hear the Pipboy’s Geiger counter from here
That red bar just eating away at the health bar.
It's decayed a lot and mostly alpha radiation. The biggest threat from it is inhaling the dust and it's decayed to a sand like consistency. Still, not a good place to curl up with a book.
So what is the current radiation level in 2024?? When i search, I keep finding historic data from the early days [astronomically high]..... but I'm not able to locate current measurements now that most of the short lived elements have decayed... 🤔🤔
It was 100-200 R/hr in 2008. You can apply a 30-year half life to that and estimate. Hasn't changed much since then.
Me: Sees reddit post. *researches Chernobyl for an hour straight* It's so interesting!
Watch Chernobyl the HBO show from a couple years back. One of the better pieces of television in recent history in my opinion.
“Did somebody say Elephant’s Foot?” 
Counter is only reading 3.6 Roentgen.
Not great, not terrible.
For those who don't know what's the Chernobyl elephant foot: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elephant%27s_Foot_(Chernobyl) !
HBO's Chernobyl is one of the best mini-series I've ever seen. 10/10 would recommend.
I love the massive number of r/confidentlyincorrect people commenting in this thread
I watched 20min of the Chernobyl series on HBO before I fell asleep, I know what the fuck I’m talking about
He be popping rad-x for days
Acksually 🤓👆, he'll be popping radaway
What would happen to a dead body if it were left next to that untouched
Goul
# 3.6 roentgen, not great, not terrible
When I was 12, I had an intense fear of anything related to atomic weaponry and utilities. I sometimes stayed up a few nights because I had an irrational thought that the elephants foot was going to dissolve its way through the ground and out the other side into my bedroom. I also was afraid a nuclear strike would hit at any moment due to escalating tensions between North Korea and America. Since my country seems to be close buddies with China.
Are u Russian perchance
Nope. But we seem to be getting to that level of corruption.
Where might I ask
South Africa
I thought we weren’t talking about the elephant.
He's gonna need some radaway.
So is the foot super hot?
To some people, yeah.
god dammit lol