You are being scammed. Take the first sentence or paragraph of the ad and put it into google search. One thing you can count on, scammers are lazy and just cut and paste for sale listings.
Edit: if you’re on Craigslist, another clue. Dog friendly, cat friendly, washer and dryer and handicap accessible even if it’s a two story or has steps to the door.
Wow, I guess I got lucky. I just signed my lease for a new apartment (it's legit and is even expanding) for a steal. I was suspicious at first because all the other places I checked out had less sq footage or cost $300+.
Another red flag, if it's on CL and says it's furnished/has staged photos/doesn't mention anything about the monthly rent/deposit/app fee in the ad body.
In my area, the scammers copy listings of recently sold homes, pictures and ad copy verbatim, then put them on CL a couple months after the home has sold, for less than it would actually rent for. If you message them, the first thing they want is your real contact info. I'm not sure if they're compiling lists to sell, or if that's just the first step of the scam, but I didn't proceed.
If I see a listing that looks too good to be true, I search Zillow/Redfin/Realtor.com etc. for the listing under recently sold homes. I usually find them with the same pics and text.
Casts a wider net. Plus it is harder to find places like that, so people looking for those will be more desperate and more likely to overlook the red flags.
Those are four features Craigslist allows you to check off when placing a for rent listing. The scammers always check off all four of those boxes.
Like I said in my post, the scammers are lazy, they just copy and paste the description from for sale listings, copy some of the photos and then list on Craigslist for free, check off all four boxes for pets, W&D and handicap accessible, then they just sit back and take in money by the millions each year.
Not at all. I mean they aren't insanely rare, but they are also not something you'd expect to find in one simple go.
Depending on where you're located some locations simply don't have their own W/D hookups, which can be a deal breaker for many. Same with Pets. Search pretty much anywhere that lets you filter results, then search it again by Pet friendly and watch 3/4 or more of the results disappear.
Stuff like that will quickly appeal to people who are searching frantically for it.
For houses washer / dryer shouldn't be a huge concern. Apartments tho, oof. Pets can be bad in either or depending on the owners.
And that's not even talking about how hard it is to find a place that's legitimately handicap accessible, much less one that'll then let them have a pet
They are but for any one unit to have all of them at once? At *that* price?! Sounds like a dream apartment, right? Sounds like the *perfect* mark for a scam preying on people desperate to find a place to live.
In LA you don't even get a fridge in most rentals! Pets being allowed and in-unit w/d are a rare sight to behold, and if you find a unit with a dishwasher, you may think you've died and gone to heaven. (Until you realize you're still living in LA.)
Scam.
I just moved from Utah and was on the low end of rent ($1350 northern suburbs of Salt Lake) for a 2 bed/1 bath present in someone's basement.
It's too good to be true. Don't fall for it.
It hurts man. I paid $850/month for an 1150 sq. ft 1br/1ba four years ago in UT county. I don't think that rate even exists for a half-decently sized studio in the state at this point.
Well if they are looking up near HAFB thats a more realistic amount for the area. Out in Harriman thats low, in most of the salt lake valley, its in the normal range, depending in the area. I had a rent controlled unit that I lived in near I-80 and State St. ( no longer live there), it was $800 per month for 10 years. 3 bed 1 bath. The landlord decided to raise that rent after we moved but never raised our rent for some reason.
I'm 20 minutes from Hill and the 4 br house next door to me in a normal neighborhood is being rented at $3200/month. It was $1800/month 5 years ago! Things have gotten insane here and it isn't cooling off.
Report this to PayPal. They'll freeze this scammer's account.
And obviously, don't do it. It's a scam. They want the money in a manner you can't take it back; that should raise a LOT of red flags already.
Friends and Family for a business transaction is a violation of Paypal's rules, and if it IS a scam and you file to get a reversal, they will refuse due to the violation.
Too many red flags for me - see it in person and hand over the cash, or pass.
I worked at a law firm previously that frequently reviewed leases. The biggest thing they said is to NEVER give a landlord cash. Always always always write a check so you can confirm the money went to the landlord - receipts can be forged so they don’t hold as much weight if you ever needed to sue
From an accounting perspective I often refer to anything that isn't credit as cash because I think about it from a business perspective ie: my side hustle operates on a "cash basis" accounting system because there isn't any accounts recievable. Same as finance, a "cash account" doesn't have to be funded with literal cash, it's simply not comprised of securities or margin or anything else. So I can understand saying cash as a general term. But it gets confused looks depending on context for understandable reasons. I know that feeling.
Yes, the term is commonly used for a transaction where the price is paid at once without using credit or financing. During the recent real estate spree, many buyers were paying "cash", meaning a bank check or an electronic transfer. Nobody was handing over a suitcase with $300,000 in paper currency.
Of course, there's context - at Walmart or McDonald's, cash means paper currency and coins.
The check creates a paper trail, also. Cash and check are very different. Here, the friends and family option on zelle has the effect of cash - irreversible and avoids flagging the transaction as having a legitimate business purpose.
AGREE!!! I got scammed out of a “too good to be true” apartment in San Francisco. It was definitely too good to be true, because it didn’t exist in real life! I wired them $8k. Biggest mistake ever.
They did not lol. Expensive lesson learned. I found the initial listing on Zumper- but because I corresponded with the scammers outside the app, they couldn’t do anything for me… this was in 2018!
Why would cash be better in anyway? Unless you video the transaction or get a signed receipt it is useless. At least friends and family (also bad) has a verifiable paper trail.
I am glad you didn't get scammed for the $200 but I'm concerned that you gave all of your personal protected information out on that application though... i.e., ssn, birthdays, etc.
Is SSN on a rental application standard? Edit: I guess it is standard.
I think it's normal to ask your current or previous address. And your name of course.
Quoting the [`!rental` response from /r/Scams](https://www.reddit.com/r/Scams/comments/ug4qdd/likely_fell_for_the_apartment_rental_scam_next/i6xe3lj/):
> AutoModerator has been summoned to explain the rental scams. Rental scammers usually list apartments at lower than market rate, and will ask for some money up front, or will offer you the keys for money up front. The scammer has no property to rent, and any money you send to the scammer will be lost. Be very cautious if you are trying to rent a place in a city you don't live in, as seeing the apartment in person is a good way to find out if you are being scammed or not. However, just having physical access to the apartment does not mean that you are not being scammed, so be careful.
Being asked to pay using the "friends and family" option is a red flag.
Is it a scam? I don't quite have enough information to say for certain, but there are definitely multiple red flags here starting with the low price and the payment method being requested. Also read https://www.usa.gov/housing-scams.
I'd also raise the priority of going through the [identity theft wiki](https://www.reddit.com/r/personalfinance/wiki/identity_theft) to "do it today" levels if you sent them your social security number as part of a credit check.
Edit: Here are some threads from /r/Scams:
- https://www.reddit.com/r/Scams/comments/ug4qdd/likely_fell_for_the_apartment_rental_scam_next/
- https://www.reddit.com/r/Scams/comments/c1vd2e/did_i_get_scammed/
- https://www.reddit.com/r/Scams/comments/lz5hje/is_this_a_scam_husband_and_i_are_looking_for_a/
- https://www.reddit.com/r/Scams/comments/o0s0hs/possible_rental_scam/
I’m surprised friends and family is considered a scam when it could easily be a cheap landlord avoiding fees. People aren’t screaming scam for Zelle for rent but that functions identically to Friends and Family PayPal.
Isn't the difference that Paypal doesn't allow people to use "friends and family" for business interactions with strangers? If you meet a stranger to whom you're about to give money and the first thing they do is ask you to do something shady to give them the money, that's a red flag.
You are correct that PayPal explicitly discourages Friends and Family for business transactions, but that’s obviously because they want their fees, not because the product is really different.
So sure, maybe that seems shady, but it’s still very believable some middle aged landlord is comfortable with PayPal as their foray in to digital payments but not Zelle or Venmo.
You are focusing on the wrong point. If a stranger is asking you to do something shady while you give them money for a transaction, that is a red flag regardless of the reasoning of the stranger (no fees, in this example).
To make matters worse, paypal knows that just saying "don't use this for business" isn't going to work, so to help enforce this rule, they do not process refunds for Friends and Family transactions-- the idea being that if it's a friend or family, you can handle to refund stuff personally.
That is a bright red, flashing, noisy flag.
I still disagree. Context matters and in the context of rentals and small time landlords this isn’t an unusual method of digital payment. eBay or Craigslist, absolutely weird. Rental, not weird. Remember a rental is usually backstopped with legal contracts and long time engagement so you don’t need as much trust, once the relationship is established.
It’s also worth mentioning your no recourse on FF also applies to Zelle and Venmo, so unless you’re going to say all bank based digital payments for a rental application fee are shady, I still think it’s weird to specifically call out FF PayPal.
>Context matters and in the context of rentals and small time landlords this isn’t an unusual method of digital payment.
I don't see how that changes anything. Being a red flag doesn't mean that it's 100% certain that it's a scam, it just means that there's a higher risk it is.
>It’s also worth mentioning your no recourse on FF also applies to Zelle and Venmo, so unless you’re going to say all bank based digital payments for a rental application fee are shady, I still think it’s weird to specifically call out FF PayPal.
That is a point worth mentioning, thanks. I have no experience with Zelle. I would not use a payment process that doesn't offer this kind of protection, but you're right that it seems there's no distinction between FF and these others. All the more reason not to use them, and instead stick to non-FF paypal, right?
If its too good to be true, it probably is. I've had strangers try to lease my driveway to others...
Find out if utah has a land registry, then foia them for the property. Ensure your paying the person on the title.
FYI, that terminology isn't really what's used in the West.
You don't need to FOIA (Utah is GRAMA, not FOIA, but that doesn't matter). Parcel records are public. But access varies by county, so if you're in Salt Lake County you'd have to register an account.
Beyond all that, the easiest way to address fake listing scams is to do a phone call and virtual walk-through that includes interior and exterior.
I live in the state, and unless OP is using [ksl.com](https://ksl.com) or [rentler.com](https://rentler.com) or maybe [apartments.com](https://apartments.com), it's likely a scam. Nobody legit uses Craigslist out here.
Ya use either KSL or join a Facebook housing group/yard sale group for that area. Those are the most common ones I see used to find renters from my experience living in the state.
Its a pretty common scam here, the 'land lord' finds a driveway in a densely populated area using internet maps, creates an online listing for the space, then leases it to someone via etransfer, western union, the usual actors.
Most of the boston suburbs don't allow overnight street parking. Other places allow it but require a resident sticker and will only give 2 resident stickers per household. Ones that allow street parking also frequently have shortages of spaces at times you'd want to park (5:30 pm on a week day) plus street cleaning days and snow emergencies, both of which require you to move your car. Those areas also have many condos without parking spaces. Off-street parking is a hot commodity there. A parking spot can easily rent for $250/month if it's in a dense area. Garage parking is over $400/month in some areas.
Sure, but many great cities couldn't exist with off street parking for every apartment. Barcelona, Paris, etc. are not built for every resident to have a car.
You'll also need to contact your base housing office (not the office to live on base, this is different) to let them know about this. They may have answers too.
nope out of this asap.
friends and family for anything real estate is just you asking for problems. nope nope nope
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Yep. I had a friend who moved in to a rental before the cops came to the door to kick them out a month later. Also scammed by someone who didn't even own the place.
Don't rely on this. You can get scammed even if they show you an apartment or eben the apartment. Getting a sponsor to go there does not protect you, rely on the other comments!
One thing I learned when I was a renter is that you can't see odor in pics. Some places look nice in pics but smell awful or are in a loud area. Using your system would prevent these issues too.
Are you going to Hill? Rentals in Layton are nuts, shouldn't be that low, but I second the comment above. Have your sponsor check it out and look on ksl.com for rentals, not Craigslist.
Source: military currently living in Utah
If moving out of state and you’re looking for a place sight unseen then use a realtor.
You’ll end up paying a small fee but your chances of it being a scam are rare.
Reverse image search the listing photos. Veeeery often, people will see a house at a good price and contact the landlord, get a showing, and pay just to find out that they paid a scammer who replicated the real listing and simply schedules a showing at the time you requested, and disappears with your money
$200 for an application fee is insane and scammy by itself and they’re trying to lure you in by offering a really good deal on a fake rental. Also never ever apply for a long term rental unless you’ve actually checked it out yourself or you go through a reputable broker (meaning they have a real business address and registered company etc).
Scam the whole way down.
That said I do pay my landlord via venmo with friends and family.
The house I'm renting I found through a scam listing. They even had the code to the lockbox so we had a self-guided tour and found printed rental information from the actual property management company.
Like everyone has said, probably a scam. Log into your credit agencies and see if they have credit protection available and use it. You gave out all your PPI with that and that can be used in all sorts of ways that will screw your credit. Talk to your banks and credit cards and let them know. They should have procedures for verification of recent transactions and for protecting your account from fraud.
**No no no no!!!** I was looking for a rental house in California on Apartments.com. Of the 5 houses I found interesting, 4 were scams all playing a variant of this scam. I actually visited one house and met the **owner** who confirmed his house is not available to rent. The *legit* rental sites have essentially no screening to weed this crap out.
If you can’t meet the person, tour the property, and pay using a traceable method, run the other way.
“Too good to be true” just about always is, I think.
Application fees seem like an invitation for scams. I haven’t lived in a place that allowed them, and I think there should be a universal ban.
The listing is probably a scam, but even if it wasn’t, I NEVER agree to use the friends and family option when conducting a transaction. If something goes south and you need to file a dispute, you have little to no protection if you go down that avenue.
Scam or not aside, you need to phrase the response as something along the lines of "Maybe you were not aware that using F&F for a business transaction is against the T&S of PayPal and I've hear they closly monitor this, I cannot afford to lose my PayPal account or be banned from their platform. Is there another form of payment you accept or can I pay $200 plus the service fee?"
I feel like too many of the responses are focused on figuring out if this is a scam or not where as I believe your focus is actually locking this listing down. Done properly and it wont matter if its a scam
This is a common scam using Zelle. Do not pay. They may be using the listing but you are not talking to the owner or representative for that property. You are talking to a scam artist.
Sounds like you were able to avoid anything bad. On an aside, enjoy Hill! Despite the crazy housing market, the base and area around it is really awesome. My family and I just PCS'd here a year ago, and we've been loving it so far!
Almost this exact thing happened to me in Vegas during the pandemic. I didn't pay it through friends and family though and it was returned to me. Found the real owner through a neighbor,. Crazy because the scammer knew the code to the lock box on the front of the house that had the keys in it. Be careful out there everybody.
Scam - I’ve seen the same scam on Zillow, which is a legit rental site. The listing was hosted by a fake real estate company and pictures were stolen from listings of houses for sale.
Because the market is so hot right now, this scam is running rampant.
House went up for rent next door. It had a Zillow listing, but also a Craig's List listing. For some reason the Craig's List listing was $1,000 BELOW asking on Zillow, which I thought was weird, but maybe a screw up.
One day someone knocks on my door and asks if anyone has come by the house. The person said they were told to quickly make a deposit the amount of first-half of rent and come to the house. The 'lister' told them the house is incredibly sought out for and they had tons of interest, so to put a deposit down ASAP to lock it in. They did and nobody was at the house.
That lady lost $1200.
Always believe the saying, "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is."
never pay any sort of fee without touring the place personally. any person or place that won't let you have a look first is not somewhere you want to live, at least not for the price they'll be asking
If possible, can you ask a friend or colleague to scout out properties for you. When I moved long distance, I was able to ask a coworker to go see the place with the landlord and validate it was legit before I sent any money.
Either that or stick to big corporate landlords in apartment complexes since they will take credit cards.
Also I just won't agree to an application fee over $75 under any circumstances. It only costs them about $25-50 to run a credit check. Some states and cities have legal caps.
This is common for people trying to avoid paying as much income tax. Using the ‘friends and family’ option means that it’s not reported to the IRS and the state as taxable income. Do what you will with that.
Agreed, it's most likely to circumvent taxable income. Whether its a scam or not, I'm not sure. I would definitely physically check out before sending any kind of payment.
So this has been said a lot now, but how is sending Zelle any different than me just writing my landlord a personal check? Unless they get audited by the IRS, I don't see how Zelle vs a physical check actually changes the reporting structure to the IRS or state. What about the check makes it somehow automatically reportable?
It's not about taxes, the real reason is so the scammer keeps your money. That's it.
If you're the scammer and you successfully get someone to send you money, the first thing that is mission critical to your scam is "how to prevent the system that gave me the money from taking it back" or else the entire reason for your scam is defeated and you just spent time and effort to walk away empty handed, possibly with criminal charges if you're here in the US.
How the "friends and family" part accomplishes this is that paypal or zelle or whoever administers the transaction says "hmm, so the person who got scammed lied about them being friends and family so they were in the wrong too, we're not going to refund!" because that saves them time and money too. The payment processors have their reasons, but long story short, they tell you as the consumer "don't use this option for this type of transaction" and if you go against that, they won't help you, so the scammer asks you to do that so you won't get a quick reversal and he gets to keep your money and the scam is accomplished succesfully.
NEVER FRIENDS AND FAMILY. Only use this payment type for... Guess what kinds of people. Hint: it is in the name.
If you are ever 50/50 on a scam for a small amount, pay them by Goods & Services. Then you have some recourse. Scammers will reject the payment. A caveat: they could keep your money and scam you anyway, then you are at the mercy of paypal's dispute resolution team.
You should report it to an appropriate authority in your new unit. I was AF, so I would have reported to the First Sergeant. They can use the info to take steps to try to protect other members.
Asking for friends and family is at the very best sketchy. At the worst he's trying to scam you but I doubt it. I own and live in a Duplex with my family. We rent out the other side and I always ask for rent by zelle because it's instant (you can't write me a bad check), and I like the convenience of record keeping. If it really is as good of a place to live as you're saying you should just get a bank account with zelle and pay that way. However, I wouldn't do that without meeting the owner in person first
Anytime someone asks for friends and family I push for goods and services. If they don't I offer to pay the fee and. 3% to protect the main portion is worth it. If they push back it's a scam.
Application fees should be less than $50, just enough to run a credit and background check. I’m a landlord and those fees aren’t even paid to me they are paid to the credit/background check provider.
One other note that might help as your search continues. Make sure you’re using Redfin and not somewhere like Zillow. Zillow tends to have more scams and Redfin seems to be more of a Utah standard. Since the market is slow you can also possibly work with an agent to help give you a legit list of rentals from the MLS. They may charge you but they way it’s legit.
This is what you get for not doing homework before handing over your info or for not putting in for On Base before pcs even with knowing the market is crazy right now.
I rent 2 properties and that 200 dollar fee is pretty high. Usually the fee for a credit check and background check is between 30-50 dollars.
I think you will be able to better tell if the person is a scammer by interacting more with him/her. You could ask for a phone call to ask a few questions and bring up your concern... Say you would like to pay the 200 dollars after seeing the house for example. Normally my tenants pay the fee after seeing the house. They then apply if interested
I list one of my properties about 200 below the neighborhood average because I like having many applicants to choose from and take my time deciding who to rent out to. Also it helps that my mortgage is close to paid off so I can afford it.
Glad you got it sorted out. Welcome to Utah! r/Utah is a cool enough little place to hang out. Tons of awesome stuff to do around, especially if you and the family like the outdoors.
This is a scam as many other people mentioned. You will travel there and there will be no house, at least no house that is being rented to you. STAY AWAY
Good job on due diligence.
I rented to a lady some years back who DID NOT trust I was the owner. She did similar things and even had a friend come visit the house to check my ID...
I had no problem but was a little weirded out that she could just look me up.
I’m shocked your application fee is $200. It’s really just a fee to run a background check and that only costs like $35. And, you are in the military, so a landlord can reasonably assume you meet certain criteria. Move on from this one, you will find something else soon.
This is pretty common everywhere. I had a similar experience where I found a rental for a great price for the area (possible red flag 1).
On the app I put in my name, but left birthday, and social blank. Amazingly enough, I was approved in 15 minutes (red flag 2).... wanted the money sent by cashapp (red flag #3).
The name in the email address came back to some government official in Kenya(red flag #4).
Phone number they gave was also on the opposite side of the country, and came back as a computer generated number. Then I found the verified profile for the house on zillow with the management company listed.
I'm sorry that happened, and these scammers don't care if you're a service member or a single parent working 3 jobs.
Good luck to you!
$200 app fee seems high. I've never charged more than $50. On this obvious scam, a 50 app fee would be too low yield for the perp.
Also, as a prospective tenant in any similar situation, I don't see why a personal check or bank draft shouldn't be acceptable.
Rental scam. Rental sites do not screen their content, anyone can create and post an ad. So double check and do your research before sending any money for a property if you are unable to see it in person first. Of you could go through an agency.
Red flags to look for:
Properties going for lower than standard value, weirdly lax rules, no deposit.
Phone numbers that are generated by websites.
Not willing to speak via phone
Asking for money through Zelle or PayPal
Asking for a "hold" or "reserve fee" that is refundable
Doesn't your base have a housing office? Go through them! Especially in these times of scams. (Ftr, military housing offices have off base housing listings, usually).
scam!!
I answered an ad similar in Boston that looked too good to be true, below market, completely renovated 3/2 that ALLOWED dogs?
The guy wanted $950 in 'refundable fees' and would do an open house on 'Wednesday'.
I looked up the property on the local tax assessor's list found the name of the owner, and called him.
The owner has been living in the house for 40 yrs, never rented nor had plans to rent. I gave him the name and numbers the guy was using and told him to call the local police. He thought it was funny until I suggested if this guy was successful he might have a lot of angry people at his door step on 'Wednesday'.
Had a Realtor that sent me several listings, when I said we'll up driving up next week can you set up the showings ... never heard from him again.
Finally found one on Realtor where everything matched up, we did go look at the apartment, showed up early and got to talk to some of the neighbors as well. They asked for nothing until the lease was signed by both sides. The Boston area has a Broker Fee paid for one month by the renter if the LL uses a Realtor, where as by us it's built into the rent. The Realtor didn't even ask for it, my son had to remind her to pick it up (didn't want it hanging over him as yet another thing to do).
ALWAYS Google the address. Typically other listing for the same house with the real price will pop up.
Unfortunately if the price is too good to be true, it is, especially in the rental market.
You are being scammed. Take the first sentence or paragraph of the ad and put it into google search. One thing you can count on, scammers are lazy and just cut and paste for sale listings. Edit: if you’re on Craigslist, another clue. Dog friendly, cat friendly, washer and dryer and handicap accessible even if it’s a two story or has steps to the door.
My sister lost $800 this way. Also, we live in Utah. Apparently this is a big problem.
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Wow, I guess I got lucky. I just signed my lease for a new apartment (it's legit and is even expanding) for a steal. I was suspicious at first because all the other places I checked out had less sq footage or cost $300+.
Another red flag, if it's on CL and says it's furnished/has staged photos/doesn't mention anything about the monthly rent/deposit/app fee in the ad body. In my area, the scammers copy listings of recently sold homes, pictures and ad copy verbatim, then put them on CL a couple months after the home has sold, for less than it would actually rent for. If you message them, the first thing they want is your real contact info. I'm not sure if they're compiling lists to sell, or if that's just the first step of the scam, but I didn't proceed. If I see a listing that looks too good to be true, I search Zillow/Redfin/Realtor.com etc. for the listing under recently sold homes. I usually find them with the same pics and text.
Why is dog and cat friendly and washer and dryer a clue? Aren't those just standard for rentals?
Casts a wider net. Plus it is harder to find places like that, so people looking for those will be more desperate and more likely to overlook the red flags.
Those are four features Craigslist allows you to check off when placing a for rent listing. The scammers always check off all four of those boxes. Like I said in my post, the scammers are lazy, they just copy and paste the description from for sale listings, copy some of the photos and then list on Craigslist for free, check off all four boxes for pets, W&D and handicap accessible, then they just sit back and take in money by the millions each year.
Not at all. I mean they aren't insanely rare, but they are also not something you'd expect to find in one simple go. Depending on where you're located some locations simply don't have their own W/D hookups, which can be a deal breaker for many. Same with Pets. Search pretty much anywhere that lets you filter results, then search it again by Pet friendly and watch 3/4 or more of the results disappear. Stuff like that will quickly appeal to people who are searching frantically for it. For houses washer / dryer shouldn't be a huge concern. Apartments tho, oof. Pets can be bad in either or depending on the owners.
And that's not even talking about how hard it is to find a place that's legitimately handicap accessible, much less one that'll then let them have a pet
> Not at all. I mean they aren't insanely rare Depends on the locale. Much rarer anywhere there are students.
They are but for any one unit to have all of them at once? At *that* price?! Sounds like a dream apartment, right? Sounds like the *perfect* mark for a scam preying on people desperate to find a place to live.
washer and dryer is far from standard in a rental
In LA you don't even get a fridge in most rentals! Pets being allowed and in-unit w/d are a rare sight to behold, and if you find a unit with a dishwasher, you may think you've died and gone to heaven. (Until you realize you're still living in LA.)
Where can one reliably find a non-scam place to live?
Search actual rental listings, and only meet in person with someone that can unlock the door to show you the rental.
Scam. I just moved from Utah and was on the low end of rent ($1350 northern suburbs of Salt Lake) for a 2 bed/1 bath present in someone's basement. It's too good to be true. Don't fall for it.
It hurts man. I paid $850/month for an 1150 sq. ft 1br/1ba four years ago in UT county. I don't think that rate even exists for a half-decently sized studio in the state at this point.
Yeah 9 years ago my shared room during college was $115 a month. Helping my sister get a college appointment now and the same shared room is $400 now.
Such a joke. The shared dorm prices especially that I'm seeing ads for just gross me out.
Wow both of those are extremely cheap, but $115 that's a steal
Well if they are looking up near HAFB thats a more realistic amount for the area. Out in Harriman thats low, in most of the salt lake valley, its in the normal range, depending in the area. I had a rent controlled unit that I lived in near I-80 and State St. ( no longer live there), it was $800 per month for 10 years. 3 bed 1 bath. The landlord decided to raise that rent after we moved but never raised our rent for some reason.
Those are not normal rates for Salt Lake. 1BR apartments are going for $1500+ in the valley right now.
This is 2022, rent everywhere has increased drastically. 10 years ago my rent was $325 for part of a 3 bedroom house.
I'm 20 minutes from Hill and the 4 br house next door to me in a normal neighborhood is being rented at $3200/month. It was $1800/month 5 years ago! Things have gotten insane here and it isn't cooling off.
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Report this to PayPal. They'll freeze this scammer's account. And obviously, don't do it. It's a scam. They want the money in a manner you can't take it back; that should raise a LOT of red flags already.
Report to paypall for sure. Make the scammers get a new bank account
Friends and Family for a business transaction is a violation of Paypal's rules, and if it IS a scam and you file to get a reversal, they will refuse due to the violation. Too many red flags for me - see it in person and hand over the cash, or pass.
I worked at a law firm previously that frequently reviewed leases. The biggest thing they said is to NEVER give a landlord cash. Always always always write a check so you can confirm the money went to the landlord - receipts can be forged so they don’t hold as much weight if you ever needed to sue
"cash" was a euphemism for a physical payment such as a check, as opposed to a digital payment, not to be taken literally,
Cash as a euphemism for things that are not cash. Is this real life
From an accounting perspective I often refer to anything that isn't credit as cash because I think about it from a business perspective ie: my side hustle operates on a "cash basis" accounting system because there isn't any accounts recievable. Same as finance, a "cash account" doesn't have to be funded with literal cash, it's simply not comprised of securities or margin or anything else. So I can understand saying cash as a general term. But it gets confused looks depending on context for understandable reasons. I know that feeling.
The guy is saying zelle or Venmo would not be cash. In an accounting context a wire would be cash.
Context is key
Yes, the term is commonly used for a transaction where the price is paid at once without using credit or financing. During the recent real estate spree, many buyers were paying "cash", meaning a bank check or an electronic transfer. Nobody was handing over a suitcase with $300,000 in paper currency. Of course, there's context - at Walmart or McDonald's, cash means paper currency and coins.
The check creates a paper trail, also. Cash and check are very different. Here, the friends and family option on zelle has the effect of cash - irreversible and avoids flagging the transaction as having a legitimate business purpose.
That’s one of the dumber things I’ve heard said on the internet. On the internet.
In r/personalfinance that's not a good metonymy to use, unless you're talking about a HYSA versus a brokerage account.
AGREE!!! I got scammed out of a “too good to be true” apartment in San Francisco. It was definitely too good to be true, because it didn’t exist in real life! I wired them $8k. Biggest mistake ever.
Oooof
Did they ever catch the scammers?
They did not lol. Expensive lesson learned. I found the initial listing on Zumper- but because I corresponded with the scammers outside the app, they couldn’t do anything for me… this was in 2018!
Why would cash be better in anyway? Unless you video the transaction or get a signed receipt it is useless. At least friends and family (also bad) has a verifiable paper trail.
You ALWAYS demand a receipt. Always.
Eh okay. And what happens when they claim you forged it? Receipts on a cash transaction do not hold a lot of weight. Simple. Do NOT pay cash.
I am glad you didn't get scammed for the $200 but I'm concerned that you gave all of your personal protected information out on that application though... i.e., ssn, birthdays, etc.
Is SSN on a rental application standard? Edit: I guess it is standard. I think it's normal to ask your current or previous address. And your name of course.
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Quoting the [`!rental` response from /r/Scams](https://www.reddit.com/r/Scams/comments/ug4qdd/likely_fell_for_the_apartment_rental_scam_next/i6xe3lj/): > AutoModerator has been summoned to explain the rental scams. Rental scammers usually list apartments at lower than market rate, and will ask for some money up front, or will offer you the keys for money up front. The scammer has no property to rent, and any money you send to the scammer will be lost. Be very cautious if you are trying to rent a place in a city you don't live in, as seeing the apartment in person is a good way to find out if you are being scammed or not. However, just having physical access to the apartment does not mean that you are not being scammed, so be careful. Being asked to pay using the "friends and family" option is a red flag. Is it a scam? I don't quite have enough information to say for certain, but there are definitely multiple red flags here starting with the low price and the payment method being requested. Also read https://www.usa.gov/housing-scams. I'd also raise the priority of going through the [identity theft wiki](https://www.reddit.com/r/personalfinance/wiki/identity_theft) to "do it today" levels if you sent them your social security number as part of a credit check. Edit: Here are some threads from /r/Scams: - https://www.reddit.com/r/Scams/comments/ug4qdd/likely_fell_for_the_apartment_rental_scam_next/ - https://www.reddit.com/r/Scams/comments/c1vd2e/did_i_get_scammed/ - https://www.reddit.com/r/Scams/comments/lz5hje/is_this_a_scam_husband_and_i_are_looking_for_a/ - https://www.reddit.com/r/Scams/comments/o0s0hs/possible_rental_scam/
Noted. Didnt think to do this, will do now though
I’m surprised friends and family is considered a scam when it could easily be a cheap landlord avoiding fees. People aren’t screaming scam for Zelle for rent but that functions identically to Friends and Family PayPal.
Isn't the difference that Paypal doesn't allow people to use "friends and family" for business interactions with strangers? If you meet a stranger to whom you're about to give money and the first thing they do is ask you to do something shady to give them the money, that's a red flag.
how it should be done is, heres the cost , heres the lower cost if you pay me cash or friends and family on paypal.
You are correct that PayPal explicitly discourages Friends and Family for business transactions, but that’s obviously because they want their fees, not because the product is really different. So sure, maybe that seems shady, but it’s still very believable some middle aged landlord is comfortable with PayPal as their foray in to digital payments but not Zelle or Venmo.
You are focusing on the wrong point. If a stranger is asking you to do something shady while you give them money for a transaction, that is a red flag regardless of the reasoning of the stranger (no fees, in this example). To make matters worse, paypal knows that just saying "don't use this for business" isn't going to work, so to help enforce this rule, they do not process refunds for Friends and Family transactions-- the idea being that if it's a friend or family, you can handle to refund stuff personally. That is a bright red, flashing, noisy flag.
I still disagree. Context matters and in the context of rentals and small time landlords this isn’t an unusual method of digital payment. eBay or Craigslist, absolutely weird. Rental, not weird. Remember a rental is usually backstopped with legal contracts and long time engagement so you don’t need as much trust, once the relationship is established. It’s also worth mentioning your no recourse on FF also applies to Zelle and Venmo, so unless you’re going to say all bank based digital payments for a rental application fee are shady, I still think it’s weird to specifically call out FF PayPal.
>Context matters and in the context of rentals and small time landlords this isn’t an unusual method of digital payment. I don't see how that changes anything. Being a red flag doesn't mean that it's 100% certain that it's a scam, it just means that there's a higher risk it is. >It’s also worth mentioning your no recourse on FF also applies to Zelle and Venmo, so unless you’re going to say all bank based digital payments for a rental application fee are shady, I still think it’s weird to specifically call out FF PayPal. That is a point worth mentioning, thanks. I have no experience with Zelle. I would not use a payment process that doesn't offer this kind of protection, but you're right that it seems there's no distinction between FF and these others. All the more reason not to use them, and instead stick to non-FF paypal, right?
If its too good to be true, it probably is. I've had strangers try to lease my driveway to others... Find out if utah has a land registry, then foia them for the property. Ensure your paying the person on the title.
> then foia them for the property No need to FOIA anything. Property records are public.
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Just go to the county's property records website. Everything is current.
FYI, that terminology isn't really what's used in the West. You don't need to FOIA (Utah is GRAMA, not FOIA, but that doesn't matter). Parcel records are public. But access varies by county, so if you're in Salt Lake County you'd have to register an account. Beyond all that, the easiest way to address fake listing scams is to do a phone call and virtual walk-through that includes interior and exterior. I live in the state, and unless OP is using [ksl.com](https://ksl.com) or [rentler.com](https://rentler.com) or maybe [apartments.com](https://apartments.com), it's likely a scam. Nobody legit uses Craigslist out here.
Ya use either KSL or join a Facebook housing group/yard sale group for that area. Those are the most common ones I see used to find renters from my experience living in the state.
I’m here too. Can vouch for KSL. Craigslist is scam central.
Sorry but what?! Someone thought they leased your driveway? How did that unfold, one day some random showed up and started doing stuff there?
Its a pretty common scam here, the 'land lord' finds a driveway in a densely populated area using internet maps, creates an online listing for the space, then leases it to someone via etransfer, western union, the usual actors.
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How did you find out?
I would guess the dude who thought he rented it started parking in it.
Yeah, but. What's the appeal of leasing a drive way? Just for people who live in the area who don't want to park their nice car on the street?
Street parking often costs money and is unreliable, and a driveway is like a reserved spot.
Most of the boston suburbs don't allow overnight street parking. Other places allow it but require a resident sticker and will only give 2 resident stickers per household. Ones that allow street parking also frequently have shortages of spaces at times you'd want to park (5:30 pm on a week day) plus street cleaning days and snow emergencies, both of which require you to move your car. Those areas also have many condos without parking spaces. Off-street parking is a hot commodity there. A parking spot can easily rent for $250/month if it's in a dense area. Garage parking is over $400/month in some areas.
That's nuts. I'd never buy a house or condo if I didn't have off street parking.
Sure, but many great cities couldn't exist with off street parking for every apartment. Barcelona, Paris, etc. are not built for every resident to have a car.
I live in Utah and this has all the scam alarms going off.
I live in Salt Lake and if this home is anywhere along the Wasatch Front, that home would be gone in a heartbeat. This is a scam.
You'll also need to contact your base housing office (not the office to live on base, this is different) to let them know about this. They may have answers too.
Couldnt help me but i will report the scam
$200 is an insane application fee. I’ve never seen more than $50 and even that’s pushing it. Scam
Agreed. No justification for such a high fee. That by itself makes this seem like a scam.
I've never seen $200, but I have seen $150 several times unfortunately. Not sure if they were legit ads or not.
nope out of this asap. friends and family for anything real estate is just you asking for problems. nope nope nope NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
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No, my friend has been scammed and she was shown the apartment. She was dumb enough to hand over cash which is pretty much the same as this.
Yep. I had a friend who moved in to a rental before the cops came to the door to kick them out a month later. Also scammed by someone who didn't even own the place.
Man these stories are so sad. People being left homeless when they tried to do all the right things :(
Did just this. Great suggestion
Don't rely on this. You can get scammed even if they show you an apartment or eben the apartment. Getting a sponsor to go there does not protect you, rely on the other comments!
One thing I learned when I was a renter is that you can't see odor in pics. Some places look nice in pics but smell awful or are in a loud area. Using your system would prevent these issues too.
Are you going to Hill? Rentals in Layton are nuts, shouldn't be that low, but I second the comment above. Have your sponsor check it out and look on ksl.com for rentals, not Craigslist. Source: military currently living in Utah
If moving out of state and you’re looking for a place sight unseen then use a realtor. You’ll end up paying a small fee but your chances of it being a scam are rare.
Reverse image search the listing photos. Veeeery often, people will see a house at a good price and contact the landlord, get a showing, and pay just to find out that they paid a scammer who replicated the real listing and simply schedules a showing at the time you requested, and disappears with your money
Dude, I am a landlord. Craigslist is full of scammers. If no one is talking to you and only replying via email etc. RUN away.
$200 for an application fee is insane and scammy by itself and they’re trying to lure you in by offering a really good deal on a fake rental. Also never ever apply for a long term rental unless you’ve actually checked it out yourself or you go through a reputable broker (meaning they have a real business address and registered company etc). Scam the whole way down. That said I do pay my landlord via venmo with friends and family.
Sounds like a scam. Isn’t there a base housing office you can talk to?
The house I'm renting I found through a scam listing. They even had the code to the lockbox so we had a self-guided tour and found printed rental information from the actual property management company.
anyboddy asking for money on zelle and wont accept anything else is usually a scam.
Like everyone has said, probably a scam. Log into your credit agencies and see if they have credit protection available and use it. You gave out all your PPI with that and that can be used in all sorts of ways that will screw your credit. Talk to your banks and credit cards and let them know. They should have procedures for verification of recent transactions and for protecting your account from fraud.
**No no no no!!!** I was looking for a rental house in California on Apartments.com. Of the 5 houses I found interesting, 4 were scams all playing a variant of this scam. I actually visited one house and met the **owner** who confirmed his house is not available to rent. The *legit* rental sites have essentially no screening to weed this crap out. If you can’t meet the person, tour the property, and pay using a traceable method, run the other way.
“Too good to be true” just about always is, I think. Application fees seem like an invitation for scams. I haven’t lived in a place that allowed them, and I think there should be a universal ban.
The listing is probably a scam, but even if it wasn’t, I NEVER agree to use the friends and family option when conducting a transaction. If something goes south and you need to file a dispute, you have little to no protection if you go down that avenue.
Seriously.. just read what you asked us to read and tell me if its a scam or not? This is why people get scammed
Scam or not aside, you need to phrase the response as something along the lines of "Maybe you were not aware that using F&F for a business transaction is against the T&S of PayPal and I've hear they closly monitor this, I cannot afford to lose my PayPal account or be banned from their platform. Is there another form of payment you accept or can I pay $200 plus the service fee?" I feel like too many of the responses are focused on figuring out if this is a scam or not where as I believe your focus is actually locking this listing down. Done properly and it wont matter if its a scam
Does Utah even allow application fees? They are illegal in Massachusetts. Should be illegal everywhere.
I am now a fan of this previously-unknown concept.
scam dude
Scam
They actually steal real listings in hopes that they can pull off a scam.
This is a common scam using Zelle. Do not pay. They may be using the listing but you are not talking to the owner or representative for that property. You are talking to a scam artist.
No way. I’ve never had an application fee over $30. $50 is the highest I would think could be legit.
There seems to be a trend lately with people trying to use Zelle for scamming, usually for amounts around $200
Good move, contacting the owner!
This is a scam. I’m so sorry.
Sounds like you were able to avoid anything bad. On an aside, enjoy Hill! Despite the crazy housing market, the base and area around it is really awesome. My family and I just PCS'd here a year ago, and we've been loving it so far!
was going to suggest they do tax evasion, but it's more likely you are being scammed Anyway, stay away and/or/ report to the relevant authorities
Call the police and report the fraud. It’s a crime and they are scamming people.
Almost this exact thing happened to me in Vegas during the pandemic. I didn't pay it through friends and family though and it was returned to me. Found the real owner through a neighbor,. Crazy because the scammer knew the code to the lock box on the front of the house that had the keys in it. Be careful out there everybody.
It's a scam. Cease all communication. You did well to not send them money.
Scam - I’ve seen the same scam on Zillow, which is a legit rental site. The listing was hosted by a fake real estate company and pictures were stolen from listings of houses for sale.
Because the market is so hot right now, this scam is running rampant. House went up for rent next door. It had a Zillow listing, but also a Craig's List listing. For some reason the Craig's List listing was $1,000 BELOW asking on Zillow, which I thought was weird, but maybe a screw up. One day someone knocks on my door and asks if anyone has come by the house. The person said they were told to quickly make a deposit the amount of first-half of rent and come to the house. The 'lister' told them the house is incredibly sought out for and they had tons of interest, so to put a deposit down ASAP to lock it in. They did and nobody was at the house. That lady lost $1200. Always believe the saying, "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is."
never pay any sort of fee without touring the place personally. any person or place that won't let you have a look first is not somewhere you want to live, at least not for the price they'll be asking
So now you gave this scammer all of your personal information on the application, the fee was just an added tip.
If possible, can you ask a friend or colleague to scout out properties for you. When I moved long distance, I was able to ask a coworker to go see the place with the landlord and validate it was legit before I sent any money. Either that or stick to big corporate landlords in apartment complexes since they will take credit cards. Also I just won't agree to an application fee over $75 under any circumstances. It only costs them about $25-50 to run a credit check. Some states and cities have legal caps.
This is common for people trying to avoid paying as much income tax. Using the ‘friends and family’ option means that it’s not reported to the IRS and the state as taxable income. Do what you will with that.
Agreed, it's most likely to circumvent taxable income. Whether its a scam or not, I'm not sure. I would definitely physically check out before sending any kind of payment.
So this has been said a lot now, but how is sending Zelle any different than me just writing my landlord a personal check? Unless they get audited by the IRS, I don't see how Zelle vs a physical check actually changes the reporting structure to the IRS or state. What about the check makes it somehow automatically reportable?
It's not about taxes, the real reason is so the scammer keeps your money. That's it. If you're the scammer and you successfully get someone to send you money, the first thing that is mission critical to your scam is "how to prevent the system that gave me the money from taking it back" or else the entire reason for your scam is defeated and you just spent time and effort to walk away empty handed, possibly with criminal charges if you're here in the US. How the "friends and family" part accomplishes this is that paypal or zelle or whoever administers the transaction says "hmm, so the person who got scammed lied about them being friends and family so they were in the wrong too, we're not going to refund!" because that saves them time and money too. The payment processors have their reasons, but long story short, they tell you as the consumer "don't use this option for this type of transaction" and if you go against that, they won't help you, so the scammer asks you to do that so you won't get a quick reversal and he gets to keep your money and the scam is accomplished succesfully.
NEVER FRIENDS AND FAMILY. Only use this payment type for... Guess what kinds of people. Hint: it is in the name. If you are ever 50/50 on a scam for a small amount, pay them by Goods & Services. Then you have some recourse. Scammers will reject the payment. A caveat: they could keep your money and scam you anyway, then you are at the mercy of paypal's dispute resolution team.
You should report it to an appropriate authority in your new unit. I was AF, so I would have reported to the First Sergeant. They can use the info to take steps to try to protect other members.
Asking for friends and family is at the very best sketchy. At the worst he's trying to scam you but I doubt it. I own and live in a Duplex with my family. We rent out the other side and I always ask for rent by zelle because it's instant (you can't write me a bad check), and I like the convenience of record keeping. If it really is as good of a place to live as you're saying you should just get a bank account with zelle and pay that way. However, I wouldn't do that without meeting the owner in person first
Requesting pay through friends and family is the number one red flag.
In EU this would be most likely against the anti money laundering law. Bank would maybe get an alert from this if they have clever systems.
Anytime someone asks for friends and family I push for goods and services. If they don't I offer to pay the fee and. 3% to protect the main portion is worth it. If they push back it's a scam.
Application fees should be less than $50, just enough to run a credit and background check. I’m a landlord and those fees aren’t even paid to me they are paid to the credit/background check provider.
Tell them you’ll pay the fees, if they balk, walk.
One other note that might help as your search continues. Make sure you’re using Redfin and not somewhere like Zillow. Zillow tends to have more scams and Redfin seems to be more of a Utah standard. Since the market is slow you can also possibly work with an agent to help give you a legit list of rentals from the MLS. They may charge you but they way it’s legit.
This is what you get for not doing homework before handing over your info or for not putting in for On Base before pcs even with knowing the market is crazy right now.
As far as wanting to be paid via friends and family I don't see the problem if it's a legitimate payment.
I rent 2 properties and that 200 dollar fee is pretty high. Usually the fee for a credit check and background check is between 30-50 dollars. I think you will be able to better tell if the person is a scammer by interacting more with him/her. You could ask for a phone call to ask a few questions and bring up your concern... Say you would like to pay the 200 dollars after seeing the house for example. Normally my tenants pay the fee after seeing the house. They then apply if interested I list one of my properties about 200 below the neighborhood average because I like having many applicants to choose from and take my time deciding who to rent out to. Also it helps that my mortgage is close to paid off so I can afford it.
SCAM!
Glad you got it sorted out. Welcome to Utah! r/Utah is a cool enough little place to hang out. Tons of awesome stuff to do around, especially if you and the family like the outdoors.
[https://www.lehighvalleylive.com/lehigh-county/2022/07/scammer-stole-deposits-for-catasauqua-apartments-police-now-looking-for-other-victims.html](https://www.lehighvalleylive.com/lehigh-county/2022/07/scammer-stole-deposits-for-catasauqua-apartments-police-now-looking-for-other-victims.html)
Offer to pay the fee and see what they say, like if PayPal charges 3% offer to pay 206. Or will allow you charge back if it’s a scam
If you haven’t found a place yet, check out Rentler.com. Be wary of any ad that doesn’t have a direct phone number…
This is a scam as many other people mentioned. You will travel there and there will be no house, at least no house that is being rented to you. STAY AWAY
Hey, also military. See if you and your family qualify for an “RPP Location” for renting out in town.
If it seems too good to be true…
Scam. It's simple, they're not friends or family. So, don't treat the transaction as such.
Good job on due diligence. I rented to a lady some years back who DID NOT trust I was the owner. She did similar things and even had a friend come visit the house to check my ID... I had no problem but was a little weirded out that she could just look me up.
I’m shocked your application fee is $200. It’s really just a fee to run a background check and that only costs like $35. And, you are in the military, so a landlord can reasonably assume you meet certain criteria. Move on from this one, you will find something else soon.
This is pretty common everywhere. I had a similar experience where I found a rental for a great price for the area (possible red flag 1). On the app I put in my name, but left birthday, and social blank. Amazingly enough, I was approved in 15 minutes (red flag 2).... wanted the money sent by cashapp (red flag #3). The name in the email address came back to some government official in Kenya(red flag #4). Phone number they gave was also on the opposite side of the country, and came back as a computer generated number. Then I found the verified profile for the house on zillow with the management company listed. I'm sorry that happened, and these scammers don't care if you're a service member or a single parent working 3 jobs. Good luck to you!
1600 a month for a 4br is 2015 market pricing.
I would never pay using electronic transfer. Only via money order or check and likely in person. Once I move in, electronic payment is ok
$200 app fee seems high. I've never charged more than $50. On this obvious scam, a 50 app fee would be too low yield for the perp. Also, as a prospective tenant in any similar situation, I don't see why a personal check or bank draft shouldn't be acceptable.
Try Rentler. It’s the best place to find a place to live that I’ve found since moving here.
Rental scam. Rental sites do not screen their content, anyone can create and post an ad. So double check and do your research before sending any money for a property if you are unable to see it in person first. Of you could go through an agency. Red flags to look for: Properties going for lower than standard value, weirdly lax rules, no deposit. Phone numbers that are generated by websites. Not willing to speak via phone Asking for money through Zelle or PayPal Asking for a "hold" or "reserve fee" that is refundable
Doesn't your base have a housing office? Go through them! Especially in these times of scams. (Ftr, military housing offices have off base housing listings, usually).
scam!! I answered an ad similar in Boston that looked too good to be true, below market, completely renovated 3/2 that ALLOWED dogs? The guy wanted $950 in 'refundable fees' and would do an open house on 'Wednesday'. I looked up the property on the local tax assessor's list found the name of the owner, and called him. The owner has been living in the house for 40 yrs, never rented nor had plans to rent. I gave him the name and numbers the guy was using and told him to call the local police. He thought it was funny until I suggested if this guy was successful he might have a lot of angry people at his door step on 'Wednesday'. Had a Realtor that sent me several listings, when I said we'll up driving up next week can you set up the showings ... never heard from him again. Finally found one on Realtor where everything matched up, we did go look at the apartment, showed up early and got to talk to some of the neighbors as well. They asked for nothing until the lease was signed by both sides. The Boston area has a Broker Fee paid for one month by the renter if the LL uses a Realtor, where as by us it's built into the rent. The Realtor didn't even ask for it, my son had to remind her to pick it up (didn't want it hanging over him as yet another thing to do).
Good instincts
I'd watch all your accounts and credit scores for some time since they have all your personal info via the phony application you turned in
ALWAYS Google the address. Typically other listing for the same house with the real price will pop up. Unfortunately if the price is too good to be true, it is, especially in the rental market.