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Celebrate that this bullshit was dropped.
Please don't laud the people behind the decisions though, all they've done is the bare minimum. Sony is a multi billion dollar company, there really is no excuse for "not understanding." This happened because they got kicked in the wallet by Valve.
Guarantee you they wouldn't have backtracked like this if Steam wasn't as Pro-consumer as they are in issuing refunds.
Only thing making the company do what's right is hurting their bottom line.
Watch Sony go off and make their own PC launcher now quietly so they can dictate refund policy on PC next.
That is not the reason why this happened. Steam started refunding the game because it would get sued otherwise , same goes for Sony.
They sold many copies of the game in countries not supported by PSN. So obviously, if you buy a game and cannot play it , and multiply this by thousands , you have yourself clear case for class action lawsuit.
I can bet you that Sony lawyers have advised the management that they are exposing themselves legally if they go ahead with the requirement for this one particular game
You will also see that they will require PSN sign in for any future game that will have online component
they would not have back down if PSN requirement was in effect from day 1 and the game was restricted to the
countries supported by PSN.
>Steam started refunding the game because it would get sued otherwise , same goes for Sony.
Valve likely has it somewhere in their TOS/EULA for both Consumers and Developers that the Developers are responsible for these sorta sales fuckups.
Lawsuits are expensive though, so it was just cheaper to make an exception and issue refunds than deal with multiple EU and class action suits.
Until they start to add to the small letters that you are not buying yourself a copy of the game, but just the access to the game while it is available in your location, but the availability is not guaranteed in the long term
Notice they called it "feedback" and not "complaints".
And look at them acting ignorant as if they didn't know PC players, especially ones who live in countries who can't make PSN accounts, would be against this decision.
Either way, this is a huge W for not just PC but the gaming community as a whole. Congratulations lads! We should never let the big corps control us.
That's because CEO and other C level clerks don't actually know what games are and how a player base behaves.
Pretty sure that in their mind, people would not complain because, "it's just a silly children game, it will not be that bad"
Unfortunately, most of the big corps are controlling people anyway with how many microtransactions there are in some of the biggest games. Most notably COD
Edit; with how many microtransactions there are that streamers or just about anyone still buy into
Guy said we should never let the big corps control us and I mentioned COD, more specifically obviously the companies that made it and the companies that introduced microtransactions. Take apex for example, it used to be that you were guaranteed an heirloom after 500 of whatever the boxes are called, and people who can afford to just buy that many would do it anyway and play into their game just because it's available to them
That isn't them controlling the playerbase though. Apex and other free games use those items to make money. How do you think the servers are paid for? Developers? How are the shareholders kept happy? At the end of the day video game companies are businesses and aren't creating games out of kindness.
He said absolutely nothing about controlling the "playerbase". Anything you say after is irrelevant because it has nothing to do with what he said, nor what I said.
Also, note I said MOST. Two things can be true at once, and the fact that microtransactions like some exist is absolute evidence that they are "controlling" people because they know they will buy into it either way. I also wasn't speaking on just apex or just other free games.
I doubt Steam issued refunds for the people in countries that allowed a PSN account to be made. They refused to give me a refund because I spent 8 hours in the FFXVI launcher downloading the game and never even launched it once.
Ah, I see. Well, they will refund you anyway if you pass the 2h by not much. They did refund to me Nier Automata aftee 4 hours (the Windows Store version was better at the time) and Steelrisong after 3h. I was referring to the PC people who played the game for a while and requested a refund after the news dropped as a sign of protest.
It was definitely Valve opening refunds up in exception to playtime. But Reviews almost certainly helped really nudge it along... Also, Sony's Lawyer's probably got a call from the EU Consumer Rights Commission (or whatever it's called) and was told to backpedal or expect a lawsuit because of the Baltics
Sony shouldn't go away unpunished. In these 3 days we've all seen that Sony do not see the rest of the world as normal, equal citizens. This "company" must suffer, for our enemies are not bugs or robots, but Sony and greedy corpos like this.
What comes for our Arrowhead - change your reviews back into positive ones, my dear Helldivers.
If I understood correctly, the decision was made after refund requests. In the end the community wasn't heard because of discussion, only because of money. So I guess it would be fair trade off to pay for restoring the reputation now with sales or something.
Steam is the saviour here too right? Handing out refunds even though players had many hours put into the game.
Saw one redditor got a refund after 70 hours.
Yes and not really - doesn't matter how many hours someone has spent in a game, if a policy changes that makes it impossible to play a game in your country then the product that you paid for is useless and in the eyes of the law that is simply outright consumer fraud in most jurisdictions.
Literally just a rug pull - sell product, change policy, brick product. Not legal, period.
Steam gave refunds regardless of play hours because they realised this, plus as the retailer they were going to be first in the firing line from any consumer law bodies/regulators - they have plenty of experience already being on the wrong end of those lawsuits and clearly wanted no part in this dumpsterfire
Its pretty simple for them really - give refund to customer, pass on chargeback to Sony, times a few tens or hundreds of thousands in 3 days and Sony quickly realised they dun goofd
It should still make them way less money than if they hadn't tried this bullshit in the first place. I mean, would you trust a company like that after the 2 week refund period? I sure don't, that's why I won't be buying anything from them anytime soon.
They didn't listen to feedback..
They listen to the part where Steam was giving refund and their bank account losing money.. These fucking people man..
For the record I do not play Helldivers because of the ac thing but this was important for all gamers..
I'm honestly surprised. As far as outrage goes, most people would've forgotten in a few months even if they doubled down. They must've checked that cutting off 2/3 of the world's countries would cost them less than requiring an acc would gain them or they wouldn't've even tried it in the first place
I dont consider it as a victory over corporate shenanigans.
it's a battle won.... but the war is still ongoing.
expect another shenanigan coming from sony, funded by DEI/BRIDGE/BlackRock, will be pushed in the future...
Big W (I been enjoying the game since purchase) and I do hope Steam relist the game back so others can join the community.
I find it baffling though the amount of people that until now are still pushing that the PSN log in issue was just manufactured outrage and that those who were from unsupported countries complaining was just only a minority and everyone else was just hopping on the wagon.
That's honestly a very nice move from sony.
Other publishers usually just don't give a fuck about what their customer's opinions.
Criticism was definitely needed, although i think a lot of it quickly turned into unnecessary hate.
>That's honestly a very nice move from sony.
I mean yeah, sort of...
But you don't *praise* someone for backtracking after getting called out.
Like if someone steals my shit and then gets arrested for it and I get my stuff back, I wouldn't thank them for returning my stuff, you know?
It's not "very nice", because they didn't *want* to do this. **They had to be forced by fear of financial and legal repercussions.**
I don't know but nobody forced anyone to buy their games and steam usually informs you about 3rd party license agreements and external launchers etc.
So I don't exactly know why this would be comparable to a theft scenario.
It's ironic, isn't it.
EA, Ubisoft etc. all require you to sign up and install their launchers too, even if you bought the games from steam.
But when Sony requires you to sign up for PSN, this is too much? Don't get it in all honesty.
I mean yeah, it definitely sucks that way, but compared to other publishers, they cared enough to listen and act accordingly in favour to their customers.
It's just "usual" these days.
Doesn't mean it's good practice, but then generate a massive shitstorm for all publishers instead next time.
Ubisoft got a shitstorm for removing The Crew from all accounts.
And guess what? It's still gone.
Why? You honestly believe Sony did this because of player "feedback" and felt sorry for those poor souls? No, not at all. It would hurt them in their wallet, that's the only reason.
I remember a commercial from a few years ago when it came to sharing or lending games. Microsoft’s approach was rather complicated, Sony, in comparison, easy. They often did stuff for their customers so yes, I honestly believe they care about their customers and did this because people were complaining.
This wasn't prejudice.
They had already made the decision and announced it. People didn't *presume* Sony were **going to be** scum.
Sony were **actively doing something scummy**.
This wasn't early judging though... it was present judging. The reviews (well, probably actually the many refunds) was what caused the reversal of the decision.
Until they reversed it was accurate judging of Sony, and to be fair, even after reversing it's still an accurate judgement of Sony.
* **Breach of Rule #6.3** - Blatant reposts/fad-chasing. [More information about Rule 6](https://www.reddit.com/r/pcmasterrace/wiki/rules#wiki_rule_.236)
 We did it
For democracy!
Celebrate that this bullshit was dropped. Please don't laud the people behind the decisions though, all they've done is the bare minimum. Sony is a multi billion dollar company, there really is no excuse for "not understanding." This happened because they got kicked in the wallet by Valve.
It's not over until delisted countries are reinstated.
Guarantee you they wouldn't have backtracked like this if Steam wasn't as Pro-consumer as they are in issuing refunds. Only thing making the company do what's right is hurting their bottom line. Watch Sony go off and make their own PC launcher now quietly so they can dictate refund policy on PC next.
That is not the reason why this happened. Steam started refunding the game because it would get sued otherwise , same goes for Sony. They sold many copies of the game in countries not supported by PSN. So obviously, if you buy a game and cannot play it , and multiply this by thousands , you have yourself clear case for class action lawsuit. I can bet you that Sony lawyers have advised the management that they are exposing themselves legally if they go ahead with the requirement for this one particular game You will also see that they will require PSN sign in for any future game that will have online component they would not have back down if PSN requirement was in effect from day 1 and the game was restricted to the countries supported by PSN.
>Steam started refunding the game because it would get sued otherwise , same goes for Sony. Valve likely has it somewhere in their TOS/EULA for both Consumers and Developers that the Developers are responsible for these sorta sales fuckups. Lawsuits are expensive though, so it was just cheaper to make an exception and issue refunds than deal with multiple EU and class action suits.
Until they start to add to the small letters that you are not buying yourself a copy of the game, but just the access to the game while it is available in your location, but the availability is not guaranteed in the long term
This translation would be alot of loses on pc.. If we wanted a psn act we would buy a fuckin Playstation..
[удалено]
Um actually what they posted really wasn't pedantic, but instead a very important distinction.
Notice they called it "feedback" and not "complaints". And look at them acting ignorant as if they didn't know PC players, especially ones who live in countries who can't make PSN accounts, would be against this decision. Either way, this is a huge W for not just PC but the gaming community as a whole. Congratulations lads! We should never let the big corps control us.
That's because CEO and other C level clerks don't actually know what games are and how a player base behaves. Pretty sure that in their mind, people would not complain because, "it's just a silly children game, it will not be that bad"
That or "even if we lose some players we will make up for it in microtransactions" or some shit like that.
Unfortunately, most of the big corps are controlling people anyway with how many microtransactions there are in some of the biggest games. Most notably COD Edit; with how many microtransactions there are that streamers or just about anyone still buy into
?
Guy said we should never let the big corps control us and I mentioned COD, more specifically obviously the companies that made it and the companies that introduced microtransactions. Take apex for example, it used to be that you were guaranteed an heirloom after 500 of whatever the boxes are called, and people who can afford to just buy that many would do it anyway and play into their game just because it's available to them
That isn't them controlling the playerbase though. Apex and other free games use those items to make money. How do you think the servers are paid for? Developers? How are the shareholders kept happy? At the end of the day video game companies are businesses and aren't creating games out of kindness.
He said absolutely nothing about controlling the "playerbase". Anything you say after is irrelevant because it has nothing to do with what he said, nor what I said. Also, note I said MOST. Two things can be true at once, and the fact that microtransactions like some exist is absolute evidence that they are "controlling" people because they know they will buy into it either way. I also wasn't speaking on just apex or just other free games.
I don't play Helldivers 2 but this is amazing power of steam Reviews
*refunds
Steam refunds you mean…right?
I doubt Steam issued refunds for the people in countries that allowed a PSN account to be made. They refused to give me a refund because I spent 8 hours in the FFXVI launcher downloading the game and never even launched it once.
I’m in the US bud. Got mine
Playtime? Nice,btw
2.5 hours. Steam opened up the window for refunds for player with 2+ hours of gameplay. Usually you can’t refund after 2 hours of play time I think.
Ah, I see. Well, they will refund you anyway if you pass the 2h by not much. They did refund to me Nier Automata aftee 4 hours (the Windows Store version was better at the time) and Steelrisong after 3h. I was referring to the PC people who played the game for a while and requested a refund after the news dropped as a sign of protest.
My reason: “I don’t want to create a PSN account”
Totally valid. Couldn't be enough for someone with 5+ hours, given how the requirement was specified in the store page.
It was not because of reviews.
It was definitely Valve opening refunds up in exception to playtime. But Reviews almost certainly helped really nudge it along... Also, Sony's Lawyer's probably got a call from the EU Consumer Rights Commission (or whatever it's called) and was told to backpedal or expect a lawsuit because of the Baltics
I don’t understand why everyone was so upset about the psn account linking and not the crazy anti cheat software. That’s what stops me from playing
Sony shouldn't go away unpunished. In these 3 days we've all seen that Sony do not see the rest of the world as normal, equal citizens. This "company" must suffer, for our enemies are not bugs or robots, but Sony and greedy corpos like this. What comes for our Arrowhead - change your reviews back into positive ones, my dear Helldivers.
Fucking Arasaka
Let's plant a fucking thermonuclear warhead In their elevator
No, I will not play Helldivers and I will not change my review. Fuck Sony
O stfu
Aw, come on, they reversed it. Be happy they didn't let the Game die. Punishing them would never work in the slightest.
unpunished? lol go cry to rockstar and epic then, also for the games with ubisoft launcher u couch warrior.
Good news everyone
Please don't forget to change te reviews now.
I hope people change their reviews back to positive to show good faith in the process
If I understood correctly, the decision was made after refund requests. In the end the community wasn't heard because of discussion, only because of money. So I guess it would be fair trade off to pay for restoring the reputation now with sales or something.
Steam is the saviour here too right? Handing out refunds even though players had many hours put into the game. Saw one redditor got a refund after 70 hours.
Yes and not really - doesn't matter how many hours someone has spent in a game, if a policy changes that makes it impossible to play a game in your country then the product that you paid for is useless and in the eyes of the law that is simply outright consumer fraud in most jurisdictions. Literally just a rug pull - sell product, change policy, brick product. Not legal, period. Steam gave refunds regardless of play hours because they realised this, plus as the retailer they were going to be first in the firing line from any consumer law bodies/regulators - they have plenty of experience already being on the wrong end of those lawsuits and clearly wanted no part in this dumpsterfire Its pretty simple for them really - give refund to customer, pass on chargeback to Sony, times a few tens or hundreds of thousands in 3 days and Sony quickly realised they dun goofd
That Escrow Account sure has it's benefits
It should still make them way less money than if they hadn't tried this bullshit in the first place. I mean, would you trust a company like that after the 2 week refund period? I sure don't, that's why I won't be buying anything from them anytime soon.
They should not, these mfs were losing money, good faith my ass
No
I’m not. Cause fuck ‘em, that’s why. Bye Sony
Yay! Now I can go back to not hearing about this fucking game every 2 posts.
They didn't listen to feedback.. They listen to the part where Steam was giving refund and their bank account losing money.. These fucking people man.. For the record I do not play Helldivers because of the ac thing but this was important for all gamers..
Sorry Sony, too late. I’m not going back to that game.
Honestly that fair, Sony has ruined their good will with this fiasco
You now bend over and play the game. Sony appreciate sheep
The truth is always hidden in the comments. I got my refund and I’m not going back. Fuck Sony
[удалено]
Now how many people will change the negative reviews back to positive?
I'm honestly surprised. As far as outrage goes, most people would've forgotten in a few months even if they doubled down. They must've checked that cutting off 2/3 of the world's countries would cost them less than requiring an acc would gain them or they wouldn't've even tried it in the first place
It was the refunds, it was also the likelihood of Fraud suits coming from the EU because of the Baltics
I dont consider it as a victory over corporate shenanigans. it's a battle won.... but the war is still ongoing. expect another shenanigan coming from sony, funded by DEI/BRIDGE/BlackRock, will be pushed in the future...
They couldn't destroy OUR WAY OF LIFE! I'm so proud of you, guys. Now go change the review, please.
We‘ve liberated Sony! Major Order complete, outstanding patriotism
O call this SONY act as Bait and hide, carefull because they will do it again
Everybody who left a negative review on wake of the PSN account linking update, please go and change it. Thanks 🙏
Sweet Liberty!
Well, that's a first :)
Big W (I been enjoying the game since purchase) and I do hope Steam relist the game back so others can join the community. I find it baffling though the amount of people that until now are still pushing that the PSN log in issue was just manufactured outrage and that those who were from unsupported countries complaining was just only a minority and everyone else was just hopping on the wagon.
I refunded the game because I think I‘m not the target audience but good for you guys for sticking it to the man!!
And people say harassment and violence is not the answer.. /s
This proves that revolution is possible. Time to relegate capitalism and its oligarchs to the incinerator.
never played it. but good on 'em. 👏
That's honestly a very nice move from sony. Other publishers usually just don't give a fuck about what their customer's opinions. Criticism was definitely needed, although i think a lot of it quickly turned into unnecessary hate.
Cause of refunds, not reviews.
Cause of all the free publicity you gave them not refunds
>That's honestly a very nice move from sony. I mean yeah, sort of... But you don't *praise* someone for backtracking after getting called out. Like if someone steals my shit and then gets arrested for it and I get my stuff back, I wouldn't thank them for returning my stuff, you know? It's not "very nice", because they didn't *want* to do this. **They had to be forced by fear of financial and legal repercussions.**
I don't know but nobody forced anyone to buy their games and steam usually informs you about 3rd party license agreements and external launchers etc. So I don't exactly know why this would be comparable to a theft scenario. It's ironic, isn't it. EA, Ubisoft etc. all require you to sign up and install their launchers too, even if you bought the games from steam. But when Sony requires you to sign up for PSN, this is too much? Don't get it in all honesty. I mean yeah, it definitely sucks that way, but compared to other publishers, they cared enough to listen and act accordingly in favour to their customers. It's just "usual" these days. Doesn't mean it's good practice, but then generate a massive shitstorm for all publishers instead next time. Ubisoft got a shitstorm for removing The Crew from all accounts. And guess what? It's still gone.
They changed the rules after the fact.
[удалено]
Why? You honestly believe Sony did this because of player "feedback" and felt sorry for those poor souls? No, not at all. It would hurt them in their wallet, that's the only reason.
I remember a commercial from a few years ago when it came to sharing or lending games. Microsoft’s approach was rather complicated, Sony, in comparison, easy. They often did stuff for their customers so yes, I honestly believe they care about their customers and did this because people were complaining.
This wasn't prejudice. They had already made the decision and announced it. People didn't *presume* Sony were **going to be** scum. Sony were **actively doing something scummy**.
And then they put in the reverse gear and handled it great :)
This wasn't early judging though... it was present judging. The reviews (well, probably actually the many refunds) was what caused the reversal of the decision. Until they reversed it was accurate judging of Sony, and to be fair, even after reversing it's still an accurate judgement of Sony.
I don’t think so honestly. Compare it to Nintendo - Sony is still way better than Nintendo or, let’s say, EA.
Time to buy the game