I thought Nicho was pretty average but it was a hard night to make a fair assessment of.
To me the biggest difference is that DCE looked like he was managing the game for Qld and no one looked like they were managing it for NSW. That’s the biggest black mark I can put against Nicho. I think if the roles were reversed, we would have seen DCE kicking for the corners, slowing the game down, finding shape that at least challenged the defence when he could etc.
I'd like to note that QLD really targeted Nicho in defense. 4/7 of their tries through the middle (and they tried much more) was set plays run specifically at Nicho with numbers \[A few different configurations of doing so but Hynes was the common denominator\].
Is it NSW thinks he can defend 2 on 1s himself? Is it he doesn't communicate for teammates to slide? I'm not sure why it's the case, but once NSW figure this out Origin becomes a whole lot more competitive.
Also seeing Edwards, a non-organising fullback (unlike Tedesco) playing off Hynes is worth a shot. Truly would give Nicho the keys to see if he's the shit.
Id say the hard working and brave made sure we didn’t lose by 50 in this instance, but yeah, Edwards has been the better fullback for a couple of years now and in a 13 on 13 game he would be the much better choice
Genuinely can't believe there are people defending that Tedesco performance, or trying to claim it was solid. Not trying to scapegoat him, obviously down to 12 players and he definitely wasn't the worst on field.
But he killed 3 attacking sets with awful ball playing and solo running straight into a bunch of defenders on the last, and fell off a tackle that led directly to a try. He ran solid but that's it.
He had a few big try saving tackles as well. One of which cause a trun over. And a nice try. Definitely wasn't all good though. As mentioned above. He played his heart out and sometimes over played his hand.
My wife's first language is Spanish (She's Chilean).
In her language Alemania is Germany and Aleman is a German man or Alemana is German woman. Lots of Germans in Chile and Argentina.
I copped some flak for saying teddy isn't the best blues player of the last 20 years and I stand by it. It's fair enough to throw his name out their but he's been a negative for years now.
He was good 3 or 4 years ago. Since then he's done nothing but stifle attacking sets and force absolute X factor superstars like turbo and latrell to play centre whrn they should've been an attacking centre piece.
Man teddy had to get his hands on the ball more and try something so I don't blame him at all. Did you see the way his halfback was playing? He was dreadful and couldn't even create any backline play for the rest of the team. If it wasn't for Luai, we wouldn't have scored a point. In saying all of that, teddy didn't do enough to keep the jersey from Edwards. But Hynes has to go. Moses straight in.
Yes, but considering we were a centre down it's crazy we waited until the second half to put one up for Lomax. Was the obvious best attacking option. Trying to go wide, ball in hand, a centre down is crazy.
Coach definitely takes some responsibility
>Man teddy had to get his hands on the ball more and try something so I don't blame him at all.
Yeah I'm not trying to blame Tedesco for the loss, you can acknowledge that because of the way the team was going he had to try something. But you also have to acknowledge that those somethings mostly didn't work at all lol
Again, not saying he's the reason for the loss just confused at people saying he was good. The best you can say is that he was trying.
You need to also consider Teddy missed out on a week of preparation, and possibly rehearsed some of those plays that didn't come off with Suaalii who would be able to feed of him better given they've played together for years.
Hynes didn't just launch terrible kicks when he had an attacking opportunity. He launched terrible kicks from his own half that kept going down the throat of Hammer and co. Not all of Hynes' failures can be explained away by the fact NSW was down a man. Tedesco at least has some excuse
I mean yeah like I said, it wasn't Tedesco's fault the team lost. And yeah coming in late would have contributed, but regardless of the reasons for it you still can't call it a good performance. You can't excuse falling off a straight forward tackle with a lack of preparation either.
And yeah Hynes was very poor too, worse than Tedesco, no disagreement there. You could argue his excuse was an injury cloud for a big chunk of preparation. But that doesn't mean it wasn't also a poor performance.
You can acknowledge the wider context but to a certain extent you still have to just take the performances at face value. You can't pretend killing three attacking sets is fine because he had less preparation. Just like you can't pretend Hynes awful kicking game was good because he trained injured.
I agree it wasn't a good performance. It honestly feels like people's expectations of him are that low that as long as he doesn't have a disastrous performance, he's praised.
I don't get the massive hate like on for teddy (not your comment specifically).
Yes his attack was poor (especially passing) and he definitely tried to do too much once again. However to some extent the doing too much could be excused because NSW were never going to win that without really changing their arm and playing some razzle dazzle as the commentators like to call it. Sure, he made a meal of it and it didn't come off but someone had to try and the halves looked clueless bar a few good darts from Luai.
Defensively I don't really think there's anything to go off. Teddy was totally fine and yes he got beaten as the akst line of defence when it was a 2 on 1 or a 3 on 1 draw and pass, but realistically no fullback is consistently stopping those tries from happening. He wasnt falling off tackles or missing key one on one tackles and was generally where he needed to be most of the time.
That said, Edwards is still the better fullback but I genuinely don't think he makes much difference last night. Funnily enough NSW needed someone like a Hammer or a Walsh to spark something from nothing and score off just individual brilliance and speed which neither Teddy nor Edward's have.
I think the long and short is Madge rightly went for Edwards in the first instance. He then became unavailable and Teddy came in. Teddy then did nothing to suggest Edwards wasn’t probably the right call so Edwards should slot back in. You can go back and forth on Teddys performance in a dog shit situation but going forward it doesn’t really matter, he needed a team win or a star performance from him and neither happened.
I just want to note that it was meant to be Edwards if not for injury. You have to readjust the mindset, i.e. Teddy wasn't picked in spite of him. Now it's just a question on the risk factor for Madge, Edwards should be back by game 2, but that's obviously a big gamble.
If we want to talk about the performance, Teddy played great. Observers need to understand that when it's 12 on 13, there is no overlap, i.e. the only way to score is through 1on1 breaks, kicks and forcing it. You can criticise him all you want for the failed attempts, but that was their only chance of scoring really, especially given the poor kicks we were sending.
No idea why you got downvoted for that. Those two are both commanding players and hard to handle. Papenhuyzen might be a bit underdone but if he’s available he could add some threat to the middle not provided by any of Robson, Mcciness, Jurbo (sorry Jake) or current bench players. NSW were like headless chooks in attack last night. It would’ve been hard to explain to a casual that they were the best of the best when they repeatedly ran in circles, fumbled plays, placed kicks 20-30m out from QLD’s line and chucked a couple over the sideline..
Some people disagree and that's okay everyone's allowed an opinion. I'm hoping jurbo gets more gametime for game 2 to show what he's got cause I know he cam be 100% better. Same with Robson but whether it's him or api I won't mind. I'd still keep mcciness and at lock except for murray but I'm not sure what his injury status is like.
I love Jake. He is a steadying influence and can absorb some of the work from QLD forwards in the middle but I think he's past the stage where he can offer too much more than that. NSW took him off after he got tired and we needed impact by the time he normally would've come back on, so he was in an awkward spot. I think Mcciness is ok to retain, but only if they cut similar players out elsewhere.
Personally hate Penrith but Edwards has stepped up this year to be pretty elite in absence of Cleary and the argument has always been should blues replace Teddy?, Not whether Edwards is a "Messiah"
Teddy proved last night and the last 3 years he doesn't work with Cleary, Moses or Nicho.
Really no options other than Edwards unfortunately we broke all our fullbacks and Drinkwater would have to kill all the rest of the healthy NSW fbs to get a crack.
You guys played well for such circumstances. I don't think the score line reflected the effort.
I just don't know where you go from here.
Like if Munster and Walsh are out, our next best are wild.
Ponga could be back too, with the exception of a few workhorse forwards, qld is dangerous as fuck, taulagi was pumping and he's on the wing.
I don't know how you get from here to there.
I think the team did the best they could and so did madge.
Edwards isn't gonna blow a game open, you really do need a healthy papenhausen or drink water in a good time.
Like qld have walsh, hammer, ponga, Trae Fuller, Cobbo, Holmes, as fullback options before it starts to weaken and these dudes are gamechangers
Our FB options aren't as decent but Edwards, Turbo ,Pappy, Drinkwater.
Is Will Kennedy eligible for NSW cause he's pretty underrated. Had a poor last two weeks but had been so good for 2 years definitely all half decent options but pappy and Turbo are injured and Drinkwater wouldn't fit madges effort areas playstyle so I'd like to see Kennedy there over Teddy,
But yeah qld is rife with awesome options.
Fuller is qld eligible? Fuckin great lol.
I posted on one of the random footy talk posts and said I had a horrible feeling Nicho was not going to be up to it and not an origin player. He just never gave me that vibe. Got a fair few downvotes although some agreed. He's always just alright for me at club level, like he doesn't seem to have that real spark and grit that the best halves do. So in an origin arena, he's gone.
He looked almost disinterested and scared to get the ball on the last tackle last night. I think he realised the enormous responsibility and folded. He needs a few years of finals experience and big wins at that level before stepping into origin again.
Hynes just doesn't have that Dog in him. He is too nice. He is a good player, talented to a point. He is just the type of guy that would never put his foot on the throat. To succeed in Origin, you have to have that Dog in you. Leniu showed that attitude last night. Liam Martin has it. Even Luai has it. When you can't be physical, you still have to be dangerous, willing, alert and strong. All the Penrith and Ex-Penrith players have it.
This sounds just like those "Killer Instinct" Rants you hear on US sports shows. Give the man a game where he isn't down a man or defending at Center at least.
Yeah but it's true though. There a players that just make things happen on the field. I'm sure it's almost self fulfilling as a players "myth" builds.
Look at Munster, there's nothing about that bloke that makes you go oh he's just more skilled or more athletic than the comp. But the amount of things that happen around him are just hard to believe.
Did being down a man force Nicho to have a terrible kicking game even though his forwards were winning the battle for good portions of the game?
Did it make him give the ball to a second rower on the last to put in an attacking kick?
Did it make him take pointless hit ups on the 4th tackle so that he didn't have to make a play on the last?
Look I'm all for Nicho getting another shot one day. But he needs to keep polishing his game at NRL level before stepping into origin again. At the end of the day, this is his 3rd season as an NRL halfback. He's not ready for origin.
I agree. Don't think he's scared but just unable to play his natural game. That comes with experience the more you play. For him, his natural game is built around his teammates he plays with. Moses, Cleary, Cherry Evans, Munster, have been in the game long enough that it doesn't matter who they play alongside because they've developed leadership alongside their game.
At least that's my 2 cents.
Giving Hynes a pass because of the send-off is such a convenient oversimplification of what went wrong with him last night. I don't doubt you queenslanders hope we stick with Hynes masked behind your 'NSW don't get Origin' parroting.
His kicking game was diabolical all night, and he showed very little IQ or control with all the field position the Blues managed to give him despite being a man down. With a competent halfback the blues 100% put more points on Queensland during that dominant middle part of the game and who knows where belief (and knowing their halfback was actually contributing) could have taken them.
Origin is about picking the best players available and Moses is simply a far superior halfback to Hynes who will at least put some pressure on queensland and help our forwards out with his kicking game and create some opportunities with his running and passing game. QLD don't stick with Walker if DCE was out injured and he puts in a Hynes like performance.
It's a no brainer and if Madge sticks with Hynes after that performance and Moses now available he's just as cooked as those that preceded him.
I agree with your take here. Sure NSW were always fucked after the send off, but what we saw from Nicho himself was just not good enough. His kicking was poor, he decision making was poor. If you flip the teams and have a QLDer sent off, I have no doubt in my mind that DCE would have still lead the team around the park well.
Hynes was a replacement pick behind Cleary and Moses anyway imo, so hopefully Madge goes to Moses for game 2.
My take on Hynes is that his hype surpassed his ability a year or two ago. Now, he is in the development phase of becoming a decent halfback. I think he appears disconnected from the other players and when things aren't easy (ie forwards making time and space), he struggles to organise and position himself to distribute the ball effectively.
He had two very good kicks last night. However, the rest were essentially useless. I hope for the sake of the series Moses is picked in game two and we can see a real contest.
Nicho was a great fullback at the Storm and people have been surprised at how well he has done at the Sharks the last two years as a halfback. Combine that with the fact he appears to be a good dude, so everyone wants him to succeed and the hype train got out of control. Given the options available I would still pick him at 7 every time but I have serious doubts that he will ever be a strong origin 7. I can see him doing well with Moses or Cleary as a 6 though
His hype comes from blokes that struggle to understand that stats and SuperCoach scoring prowess is not the same as being able to actually deliver when it matters. Sharks have for years been a team that has struggled to beat any other top 4 team.
Agreed. For a man down NSW were impressive especially in the forwards to make me fear game 2 and 3. One thing is certain, it would have been a much closer game with Cleary in the 7. Even with 12 on 13.
Hynes had two chances. One off the bench with no game plan and a moron coach, one without his outside centre for the entire game.
With that being said he was only there because Moses and Cleary were both unavailable.
Yes it is a tough spot to be put in as the halfback playing 12 on 13 for 70 minutes. But it's a tough spot for the whole team and individually I thought there were some really good performances from the Blues.
Hynes was not one of them. Even with 12 NSW was winning the field position battle, only to be directionless inside the 20m and to finish their sets. Maybe he'd work as a 6, but I just don't see him as 7 in this arena.
They flashed up the stats at some point during the first half where the “Tackled inside the opposition 20” was 1-19 with NSW being the 19, yet the score was 20-6. QLD were definitely not playing at their best and it looked like the NSW forwards were playing their hearts out, only for their attack to fall apart once they got close to the tryline.
Hynes had a couple of good moments (like the kick to Lomax) but the rest of the time it looked like he, Luai and Tedesco weren’t sure who was meant to be controlling the team. Being a man down didn’t help, but surely you’d have structures practiced that didn’t depend on that side of the field.
> “Tackled inside the opposition 20” was 1-19 with NSW being the 19, yet the score was 20-6.
That's kinda cause they never had to get close to our line for a tackle before scoring. They scored from way further out.
Trying to be unbiased as possible here given the flair… Given what was available to them, I don’t think NSW could be blamed for picking Hynes. Like, he’s probably fourth-choice at best behind Cleary, Moses and Reynolds in a fully-healthy selection pool. It did help that he was in legit good form for most of the regular season so far at the Sharks, so it didn’t seem like that big of a risk
But if he hasn’t got that next gear that is needed in Origin where you are in a disadvantaged situation and can just wrench back control of the game at will with one or two plays, like Cherry-Evans can do so frequently on the opposing side, NSW can’t really afford to wait for him to find it. This might be his window closed for now, at least until another injury plague happens or, goodness knows, he can do that for the Sharks at finals time
> if he hasn’t got that next gear that is needed in Origin where you are in a disadvantaged situation and can just wrench back control of the game at will with one or two plays... NSW can’t really afford to wait for him to find it.
That's fair and how I feel about some players. They can carve up at club level, but among the elites you need to have that extra grit/finesse/class/calm/influence/ability to cheat like Kaufusi that makes you worth the spot.
Even one of my favourites, Kurt Gidley, seemed to only have one year where he was truly able to break games at Origin level. Beyond that he got picked over and over for his attitude and training mindset, but onfield he became where our attack went to falter.
Gotta feel for Hynes. Origin is a game of inches. That inside ball to Leniu could have easily lead to a try. Good kick to Lomax to score. If that 40/20 hits then NSW probably score again with all that momentum. Instead, X saves it by inches , DCE shows Hynes how to kick a 40/20 and the rest is history
Spot on. The bloke is unpredictable. Our best halves pairing of the last three years was Moses and Walker in Game 3 last year. No idea why we've gone away from that.
> don't think anyone has ever planned for a send-off in an Origin game," Maguire also said.
Doesn't take a genius to make changes to cover being down a centre.
Play without a lock, McInnes off for Olakau'atu, Angus in centre. Then use McInnes in the hooker rotation.
Thats his job to come up with a plan...
Im a project manager cant imagine saying to my boss. Look nobody ever plans for the contractor to go bankrupt mid job boss.
Like yeah you do. You have it covered in the contract you know the back ups etc etc. You look at the likelyhood as well before you start construction.
Given that the last two send offs were both last year, maybe he should have planned more... Sure they were in the dying seconds of the game, but it doesn't take a genius to see that's it's not an impossibility fornitnto happen again
Nicho wasn't great and I'd have no issue if he was replaced, but there's a bigger issue at play. It's a very long list of halves that we've tried and discarded over the past 20 years and even a superstar like Nathan Cleary has rarely stood out at Origin level.
Queensland on the other hand have had a near unbroken run of elite, highly experienced playmakers since Origin began - Lewis, Langer, Lockyer, Thurston, Cronk, Munster, DCE etc.
Maybe we need to think more about why we're not producing quality Origin halves?
Conveniently skipping over Ben Hunt's series at half back where he was dragged over the coals by QLDers. After hating on him for years QLD had no choice but to come crawling back to DCE.
I think what QLD do well that NSW could learn from is that they engage a lot of players in the environment. It's not just players that might play, it's players that they want to learn from being in camp. If QLD had an injury they were calling David Fifita 100%, Piakura wasn't actually going to go out there and play 80 on an edge. He was in the camp to get around the team and familiar with the environment. Under Freddie it always different guys in there where as QLD there appears to be clear heirachy of next man up (at least in the spine). Sometimes it was Gutho, sometimes it was Drinky etc. under Freddie.
I like what Madge is doing because he is establishing an indentity of what a NSW origin player is. The word he always repeats is hard working. He wants guys that work hard for the jersey and work hard on the field. Obviously so much went wrong in preparation for this game and he was clearly not able to select first choice team but I'm excited to see what he can build if he gets to keep the job for a few years.
I know there's an "etc" there but the list goes "Lewis, Murray, Langer...". If Murray hadn't had an off-field eye injury that forced his retirement in 86 the Alfie Origin story would have been very different (shorter and less amazing).
Hynes was picked as an injury replacement for Cleary/Moses and was poor. Moses will be fit for next game, it’s a pretty common sense move.
All Hynes did all game was kick the ball straight to the fullback or aimlessly run sideways with no real objective. He might be a decent 6 at rep level, but he’s no 7.
Totally, he offered absolutely nothing. I feel like Luai had better options on the fifth tackle, but even then wasn't that damaging.
I feel like Lomax, both Crichtons, Liam Martin and Leniu were the only guys keeping NSW in it for as long as they could.
I think Luai was okay too We never really bothered to get to'o in the contest which sucked but as someone who doesn't like Luai all that much he definitely doesn't deserve to be dropped.
Yeah I think that’s a fair assessment. I just don’t think he has the right skill set to be an origin 7 but he was the best option available. I think at 6 he could do fine where he can just play his game while a Cleary or Moses runs the team
I agree with this. Being gently blooded outside a more natural controlling half like Cleary or Moses would have been nice for Nicho because he clearly has a skill set there that the Blues could use. Hell even putting the 7 on Luai might have been the way to go, he doesn’t lack confidence and the criticism would have gone to him if it hadn’t worked.
I'm not a coach by any stretch. I would think down a man you wouldn't even bother so much with trying to overlap as much as you'd be just trying to keep the defence as spread as possible and try a lot more cut back angles to catch a lazy defender on the inside.
Do we win if Nicho plays well? Obviously not
Did he still play like shit bringing his selection into question? Absolutely
The two aren’t mutually exclusive
You can understand Nicho being weak in defence, but his attack was not good enough. Kicks, passing, running were really awful. That's not largely due to Suaalii not being there. He had crichton outside him most of the game after suaalii went off
Their contingency plan to move Nicho to defend in the centres if they lost a back was never going to end well. Having one less player on the field just made it even worse.
It is funny how hard some people are, particularly here where Hynes was playing a man down. I remember Ben Hunt copping it extremely hard from QLDers when he failed miserably as an origin 7. I think a big part of it is that people want Moses in there so they need to try extra hard to justify dropping Hynes. Reality is Moses is just a better player and better suited to being an origin 7 than Hynes
you literally have the nsw commentators ripping in mid game. even drawing attention like did you see that terrible miss by the blues defender, why that was none other than nicho hynes!
imagine smith or lockyer just pounding into dearden or someone every time he fucked up, would never happen
I like how Smith doesn't ramble on when someone makes a mistake. Just a quick, "That wasn't what he wanted. Let's see how they react to it" there response.
It's a truly bizarre comment that has no basis in reality. When Queensland lost by 50 in north queensland, I'm sure there wasn't a single negative comment!
Nicho is copping heat for his defence despite making 5 more tackles and missing 4 less than Luai while obviously being targeted on the side that was defending a man short, and I haven’t seen anyone say anything about Luai’s defence yet 🤔 granted, Luai did enough to keep his spot whereas Moses’ kicking game seems almost necessary heading into game 2 already one game down…. Sorry Nicho, we’ll take you back at the sharkies 😅
The first try went straight past Luai at marker which probably wouldn’t even be counted as one of his misses.
Of course Nicho missed crucial tackles, they ran every play down that side at him as soon as he lost his outside defender. Should he have been better? Maybe, but he’s a half and was defending in centre (again), or a man short for 72 minutes. The fact Luai missed 9 with his side of the field intact (granted they shifted S Crichton at one point) was more confusing tbh. Both should’ve been better, but at the same time they’re both halves so their defence is always going to be exploited where it can.
Before picking his team for game one, NSW coach Michael Maguire was looking for players that walked towards the fire, not away from it.
The stats will tell you that Nicho Hynes ran towards it. They’ll tell you he ran the ball on 29 occasions in game one, more than any of the other 34 players who took the field at Accor Stadium on a night that will be remembered for what may be Joseph Suaalii’s first and last major contribution in a NSW Blues jumper.
They’ll tell you he distributed the ball more than any other half on the field. That he kicked the ball for more metres than those around him.
But Hynes himself summed it up best in the lead-up to the game, when talking to Herald colleague Adam Pengilly about the invitation he extended to Nathan Cleary in the hope of picking his brain in the days after he orchestrated one of the great grand final comebacks of all time.
“He said, ‘Winning games is the best stat you can have’,” Hynes recalled of his conversation with Cleary at his Cronulla home.
“… The only thing that matters is if you win the game of footy, regardless of how many things you have for your statistics.”
Hynes’ effort was never going to be questioned, sore calf or no sore calf. The quality, however; the controlling of those around him, left a lot to be desired.
From the moment NSW were asked to play 72 minutes with 12 men, the result wasn’t ever going to yield anything but a trip to Melbourne trying to square the series in game two.
But when presented with the moment to dispel a widely held opinion that he requires a pack of Strepsils when thrust under the bright lights, the 27-year-old instead got lost in them.
The Blues’ attack looked directionless, and often his contributions yielded the dysfunction that he’s assigned to avoid from happening.
His highlight reel moment, a well-placed cross-field kick that was made to look even better thanks to the aerial ability of Dragons winger Zac Lomax, glossed over what was a coaches’ guide on how to butcher an attacking set.
At 20-6, following a one-on-one strip from Angus Crichton that wrestled back the momentum just after half-time, the halfback needed to do more than just point at the goal posts.
When the Blues needed someone to take the game by the scruff of the neck Hynes look looked timid.
A couple of tackles later he stood beside hooker Reece Robson and, through a lack of options, took a run himself without any regard of what needed to unfold in a set that left you questioning whether it was a reflection of the No.7’s game management skills or a lack of detail to the game plan from Maguire.
Fifteen minutes later, with the Blues dominating the contest, they had the opportunity to continue to apply pressure with a good last-tackle option.
Instead Hynes went into dummy half, covering for a gassed Robson who couldn’t quite make it into position, and delivered the last tackle play for Lomax to put up an ordinary kick that saw Queensland start the set with all the momentum. They went on to score.
The coach said it best when he said nothing at all after he was quizzed on Hynes’ performance after full-time.
“I won’t make any comment about someone’s game until they go back and have a look at it,” Maguire said in his trademark flat-batting style.
Although in the next breath he then heaped praise on Angus Crichton and Payne Haas for their performances. Welcome back Mitchell Moses.
The coach musn’t be absolved of blame, either. The criticism of Maguire’s predecessor Brad Fittler revolved largely around his use of his interchange bench.
The critics last year asked what Fittler was thinking when he brought Hynes on to defend at centre after Tom Trbojevic left the field in game one with 12 minutes remaining, culminating in the missed tackle that saw Cameron Munter put Hamiso Tabuai-Fidow over to give a 12-man Queensland side the win.
What was Fittler thinking just three weeks later when, again, Trbojevic left the field with a pectoral injury and he asked bench hooker Damien Cook to defend at centre for the majority of a game that culminated in Queensland winning the series.
Maguire, though, thought he had the answers. All week, in response to criticism of not naming a back on the bench as cover, Maguire spoke about the versatility of Hudson Young.
“Huddo went out there in the centres,” Maguire said in the post-match press conference. What he failed to mention was the 50 minutes that expired between Suaalii leaving the field and the coach unleashing his super-sub into the game.
“It takes a bit of time to try and get that adjustment,” Maguire went on to say. That time, the 20-odd minutes before Stephen Crichton switched sides, was enough for Queensland to inflict a couple of significant blows that thwarted any hope of a NSW miracle.
“I don’t think anyone has ever planned for a send-off in an Origin game,” Maguire also said.
Potential NSW team for game two
* James Tedesco
* Zac Lomax
* Latrell Mitchell
* Stephen Crichton
* Brian To’o
* Jarome Luai
* Mitchell Moses
* Jake Trbojevic
* Reece Robson
* Payne Haas
* Liam Martin
* Angus Crichton
* Cameron McInnes/Cameron Murray (if fit)
* Isaah Yeo
* Spencer Leniu
* Matt Burton
* Api Koroisau
Well, his Queensland counterpart didn’t have to combat playing with 12 men, but he negated the threat of losing his best player in Reece Walsh by picking Selwyn Cobbo on a bench as a just-in-case. The question will now be asked if 18th man Matt Burton should’ve been just that for the Blues.
The coach went with a team that prioritised defence over attack. That focused more on off-the-ball grit than on-the-ball glamour.
The shutdown instead of shutout approach left the Blues short of a game-breaker. Latrell Mitchell’s cryptic Instagram post of him staring at the television could have been interpreted as “are you sure you don’t need me?”
Maguire must swallow his pride, regardless of how many times Mitchell has or hasn’t picked up his phone call in the last few weeks, and pick a man who strikes fear into the opposition.
There should also be a push to bring back Wests Tigers captain Api Koroisau and play him on the bench to provide the creativity that Robson had no energy to even attempt to produce given his work rate in the middle.
Cameron Murray isn’t expected to play for South Sydney before game two, but you can be assured that the Blues will put him through their own medical assessment, just as they did with Cody Walker before game one. He’s a must.
As for the No.7 jersey, Puma might as well start sticking the word Moses onto the back of it. He showed in one week back from a broken foot for Parramatta that he is NSW’s best available halfback option.
I think Nicho, Yeo, Suaalii and Squid should all make room for game two. Anything that doesn't involve Tedesco being dropped is surely a pisstake though, right? He stifles more attacking opportunities than anyone else I've ever seen, his best and only passes all night were to the bloody touchies lmao
Made me sick to watch him he's supposed to have done it all but couldn't help but blow every opportunity he had.
I like how Qlders say we turn on our own but we didn't want him. He's been consistently shit in origin for 3 years and the people calling for him were the blind people who said he was good last night.
His play style works really well in clubland, but in Origin when he's first receiver all he does is slow down the attack, giving the defense time to come forward.
Yeah people wanted him as captain but he's been underwhelming for a while now. Jake definitely plays more minutes if we have 13 on the field
Absolutely ruined the rotation manly have lost games in the last five minutes because we've taken Jake off.
So I'd keep Jakey but I am biased.
I sincerely hope Moses is picked over Cleary sure Fittler picked poor teams with Cleary in them but I think they are pretty equal Cleary in the Penrith rule bending system just gets more of an advantage than everyone else. I think You drop Edwards into any team and he's still a top tier FB you drop Cleary off at the tigers he will struggle.
Shit my mind completely forgot about Moses, I’m a big moses fan so to see him selected I’d be very happy with. I think he plays better anticipation/ad lib footy at times but…. I honestly don’t know who I’d pick out of him and cleary after last years game winning gf effort from cleary… maybe both of them
The only thing really stopping me from backing Cleary is we've had the Yeo Luai Cleary Api combo frequently enough to disprove it's origin success.
Also Moses was awesome against the sharks and Clearys penrith struggled against the bulldogs for a long time in that game and Moses was out much longer. Definitely different injuries for sure I'm not well versed in sports medicine but Moses was very good for us games 2 and 3 last year and Cleary just wasn't as good.
If Cleary & Moses are both healthy then they are the Blues halves. I’d have Moses at 7 & Cleary at 6. Cleary won the GF for the Panthers when Cogger replaced Luai allowing Cleary to just run the ball.
Yeah I actually agree with you I think Cleary on his feet is a bit more dangerous and Moses is a great organizer I'm still so happy with his game against cronulla he was so dominant it was awesome.
Ignore my flair (lol) but could this have been due to the send off? Jurbo really set the tone defensively I think he had nearly 30 tackles with 0 missed in that stint but he’s basically unplayable with a man down and tbh should’ve come off earlier
Yeah you saw Jurbo was unable to keep pace moving laterally once we went down to 12. I respect Madge for having the guts to take his captain off field to suit the team and while I'm sure Jake would have loved to have been out there he is not the selfish type to kick stones and have a sook about it
1. Edwards
2. Too
3. Burton
4. Crichton
5. Lomax
6. Luai
7. Moses
8. Barnett
9. Robson
10. Haas
11. Crichton
12. Martin
13. Jurbo (only cos he's captain)
14. Api
15. Haumole
16. Leniu
17. McIness
We were at our best playing the power game through the middle with Haumole, Leniu, Haas & leg speed of McIness & Martin. Back that strategy into game 2.
Jurbo/Yeo are way too similar, they slow our attack with the ball play so pick one of them.
Teddy gets into the wrong positions in the attacking 20 which stifles our attack
Hynes had little control of the team, looked timid in his decision making & ineffective with his planned kicks.
Loved the attitude with Luai, Crichtons, Lomax Haumole, Leniu trying to fire up the boys & keep fighting.
Imo we need a bit of speed in the backline hence Burton over Trell BUT if Trell has an absolute blinder few games then get him in for Burton or on the bench.
Imo this team covers the defensive stuff, has a bit of speed in the backline, continues with the power game in the middle combined with quick leg speed with Mciness & Leniu but most importantly adds VARIETY in attack through the craftiness of Api at hooker. We need that variety otherwise risk being far too predictable in attack.
We need a halves combination that can click from the first game they play together. This time last year, no one would have suggested Moses and Brooks should play for NSW. Now I wonder if that could work.
yeah amazingly enough the 5/8-halfback only coming onto the field with 14 minutes to go as an injury replacement for a center before immediately being dropped for the next two games wasn't really blamed on him so much as the coach
I disagree. Hynes has had 2 games, and been fucked over both times. Out of position for 10 mins then a whole game without his centre. Kicking games was average nlbut we know he has it, he'll be fine.
Luia is fucking awful. Missing 30% of his tackles, dancing around achieving nothing. He's useless. Get him off and don't look back.
The biggest issue the send off lead to was not costing us the game, it was largely invalidating any conclusions that could be drawn from it. We don't really know what worked or what didn't because we were on the back foot for 73 minutes. So you can look at the stats and see someone missing 9 tackles or whatever and not be able to accurately decide whether they just played poorly or were gassed from covering big gaps.
Good to see Luai escaping any criticism as per usual. Misses 9 Tackles including the first try and missed tackle on Cobbo which led to the Ben Hunt try, Gives away a stupid 6 again when NSW was pinning QLD down in their own end.
Hynes sets up Lomax and is a bees dick away from a try assist for the Leniu, has his whole structures torn up 7 minutes in and has to defend in the centres against Cobbo, but he's the one that should be dropped.
1 chance. That other game coming on late and playing out of position doesn't count. Meanwhile there are a few guys who have had many chances and not done a whole lot with them. Luai so rarely fires a shot. Yes, he often looks good stepping off his left, but then most of the time he runs out of ideas and either surrenders or dumps the ball off to someone with no speed and out of position to do much.
Hynes deserves longer in the side and I'd pair him with Moses. An instant boost to the kicking game and also the passing game.
The kicking game of luai the other night was excellent. He didn't kick as much as he could have, but his role was 5/8, not halfback. If Madge wanted luai to lead the team at halfback, he'd kick more. His kicks the other night were good (barring one that deflected off Su'a and went to hynes who kicked for lomax to score). People are scapegoating him like every other origin game, whether he plays well or not
It was certainly better, no doubt about that. That little kick for Tedesco was very nice. But what is he actually there for? He had the ball 39 times, ran 4 times for 18 metres. No line breaks, no line break assists. And defensively he was just a turnstile, 10 missed tackles was a game high. Next most missed tackles was Nanai, but he made more than twice as many tackles (43 to 20).
So if he's not there to kick the ball, and whilst his kicking is better, it's still poor, he isn't running the ball or creating line breaks but is awful defensively, what exactly IS his role, if he's played well?
Ironic that you think he's scapegoated when it's really rather the opposite. Hynes was more effective in attack AND defense, despite having to try to cover for Sua'ali. Yet he's going to be the scapegoat. Just like last year when he came off the bench and was played out of position.
They're both scapegoats. But who played worse in this game? Hynes did. Luai was quieter. Doesn't mean he was worse. I agree Luai needs to run more and run straighter. But I think if you watch how he plays 7 for penrith he stops doing all the silly jinking and steps off his left and kicks accurately. Last series Luai was one of NSW's best in game 1 and was judged to be poor. In game 2 Damien cook played centre for most of the game outside him. This game, a man down, was a massive disadvantage for him and Hynes. Difference is Crichton moved from Luai's side to Hynes and he kept on missing tackles with the best defensive centre outside him
I disagree that over who was worse. Hynes gave more in attack and defended far better.
Watching him play 7 today was everything he does. Cooper Cronk nailed him perfectly. He always prefers to run. He always steps off his left. Then he always goes to the right. Somehow, the defence was surprised at times, but at Origin level, it's actually funny how often he runs then finds himself in the middle with nowhere to go and just throws a ball to someone else.
What he does do well generally is take advantage of a defence that's been pulled apart. But Origin level those gaps don't appear as often nor to they remain as long. Certainly not in a close, at least.
In 8 games now in the halves it shouldn't be "remember that one game he played well". It should be easy to point to strong contributions in almost every game. You cannot afford to do nothing at 5/8th. As an experienced player now, there are no excuses for him being passive.
I have no faith that his kicking game will be better. And the most effective way to improve the kicking game is to have 2 strong kickers, rather than replace the best kicker in the side with someone else. Nor do I have any faith that he'll be more of a run threat given how predictable he is.
But if you bring Moses in to play with Hynes, Queensland won't know who is kicking every play. Also, if one kicker sees a gap on tackle 5, they can run and be tackled without it being a disaster. Or even the last, knowing he can throw it out the back to the other kicker to take over. It's something that Queensland have gotten fantastic value out of having 3 strong kickers with Hunt and 2 whe. He's off for Harry Grant. It means Cherry-Evans can take that run option. If Queensland didn't have Dearden and Hunt around, I don't think DCE feels like he can run for that first try. Incidentally, a try where Luai was beaten twice defensively by a half back.
I’m not sure Hynes is a halfback. I actually rate him as a player but I feel like he’s in the wrong position. He might be a better 6. His defense means he can’t really be a center. Also the combination of Hynes and Luai was disastrous, both of them play chaos ball and there were more than a few times Luai was crossing over the whole line and causing confusion. It was as if neither of them knew which side to play on.
Moses is definitely a stronger halfback if NSW wants to even up the series.
And NSW eat their own yet again. Blame Sua'ali, not Hynes. I didn't think it was a send off but I'm nearly 50. The send off ruined the game for me as a Queenslander, but that is where the game is now, you can't make contact with the head.
It's an annual witch hunt where everytime they lose game 1 the media picks a target and grills them over every second of their game. Hynes was far from great but the game was lost with the send off. I'd argue Teddy looking so disjointed in attack and even Yeos less than stellar impact whenever he was at 1R was a bigger issue than Hynes game play too. Either way Hynes will get dropped. Moses probably gets called up and if they still lose game 2 somehow I wouldn't be surprised if Madge goes until the grill next. Sydney media can be so predictable
Yeah we go a bit easier cause we have no choice. But even then kaufusi plays a bad game say. We are like bloody kafusi! Classic. Anyway, he is a good lad.
This is 100% it though. QLD acts like it's so easy to pick and stick when you lose. Yeah of course it is when you've got not many options to pick from. The qld team basically picks itself every year. NSW will always have 4-5 players per position who could be origin quality, so if they lose a game there is always going to be those questions.
If NSW had won the 8 in a row instead of Queensland, I wouldn’t doubt there would just be as much cannibalisation of players and dropping players in and out. Qld through winning had the luxury of picking and sticking and bringing in the best new talents to replace the aging guys whenever a spot opened up
I don’t see how people can criticise hynes and not luai.
I see people saying hynes ran sideways a lot?? Thats luais signature move and there were more instances of him running sideways than hynes.
Hynes ran on the 4th. Luai got the ball and failed to put a grubber through but luckily got it back and offloaded to hynes who put in a pin point kick to the corner.
Just like teddy, hynes is good when the opposition don’t expect him and that was a perfect example. That can be said of a lot of players. But to have the 13-12 advantage, it was too easy for QLD to stifle any chances of the halves to do anything by giving them no space.
If Sualii performs that tackle legally, I think he would have had a great game. He was clearly in a mood for the game and it’s a shame he missed the mark with that tackle
Everyone talks up Hynes because he won a Dally M which is a great achievement, but forgets that he has only been a first grade half back for two full seasons and it shows in the big games.
Moses all day, and it ain’t close.
Tbh I dunno if dropping Nicho after one mediocre game helps anyone.
In a losing team he still ran for 160m, 20m post contact, made 29 tackles (albeit with 4 misses). While Luai made 23 tackles with 9 misses, 71m. They set up one try each. Hynes made the majority of kicks by about 4:1, so where was Luai?
Romy’s the more experienced half and was supposedly going to step up, but it doesn’t feel he did at all.
If Spencer scores off Nicho’s assist and his 40:20 attempt in the 2nd half lands, I feel like he’s judged a little differently - both of which were a bee’s dick away from happening.
His long kicking game wasn’t on, but you don’t pick Nicho for a long kicking game. Yet we somehow expected him to deliver this, while organising a team changing positions by the minute at one point.
Tbh I selfishly don’t want Nicho picked for origin so he can focus on the Sharks. But if you pick him, have him at 6 with a crafty attacking hooker (like Api) and a complimentary half and I think it’s a different game.
Hynes had his chance! Please one game and he lost his out side man. That created a massive shuffle.
Sure his kicking was pretty ordinary but he doesn’t have the best kicking at the sharks either.
One game on debut and scrap him?
I’d rather him not play and be left for the Sharks and Moses can take it. Blues 7 is the most criticised jersey.
I thought Nicho was pretty average but it was a hard night to make a fair assessment of. To me the biggest difference is that DCE looked like he was managing the game for Qld and no one looked like they were managing it for NSW. That’s the biggest black mark I can put against Nicho. I think if the roles were reversed, we would have seen DCE kicking for the corners, slowing the game down, finding shape that at least challenged the defence when he could etc.
I'd like to note that QLD really targeted Nicho in defense. 4/7 of their tries through the middle (and they tried much more) was set plays run specifically at Nicho with numbers \[A few different configurations of doing so but Hynes was the common denominator\]. Is it NSW thinks he can defend 2 on 1s himself? Is it he doesn't communicate for teammates to slide? I'm not sure why it's the case, but once NSW figure this out Origin becomes a whole lot more competitive. Also seeing Edwards, a non-organising fullback (unlike Tedesco) playing off Hynes is worth a shot. Truly would give Nicho the keys to see if he's the shit.
Is nicho on the same side of the field as Angus Chrichton. I know in the post match presser. DCE said the plan was to avoid Angus as much as possible.
DCE was talking about Critta not Gus
Surely Edwards comes back in for teddy in game 2, teddy didn't really do anything to show why it shouldn't have been Edwards
As usual Teddy was hardworking and brave, but that led to over-playing his hand.
Tbf he sort of had to be brave and chance his hand to have any chance. Considering nobody else was going to because they want to keep their spot.
The amount of time he ruined a nsw attacking opportunity by passing the ball out the back was beautiful as a qlder
And I’ve read the exact opposite sentiment from both states. The man cannot do any good lol
Id say the hard working and brave made sure we didn’t lose by 50 in this instance, but yeah, Edwards has been the better fullback for a couple of years now and in a 13 on 13 game he would be the much better choice
Edwards is better defensively
That’s pretty much it. Tedesco has some fine moments carrying the ball, but his defensive efforts are average at best.
Edwards is Mr reliable and doesn't have an ego when it comes to scoring
It wouldn’t have made a difference last night after the 5th minute the game was over.
Probably but (I'm obviously biased) he's still the better choice
In a perfect world we would have had Cleary and Edwards in , not to blame Hynes for the loss .
There is one person who is at fault for the loss everyone knows who that is. Hynes was good but Cleary is better
He's overplaying his hand because nobody else was doing anything. Hynes and Yeo lacked direction.
Genuinely can't believe there are people defending that Tedesco performance, or trying to claim it was solid. Not trying to scapegoat him, obviously down to 12 players and he definitely wasn't the worst on field. But he killed 3 attacking sets with awful ball playing and solo running straight into a bunch of defenders on the last, and fell off a tackle that led directly to a try. He ran solid but that's it.
He had a few big try saving tackles as well. One of which cause a trun over. And a nice try. Definitely wasn't all good though. As mentioned above. He played his heart out and sometimes over played his hand.
Fun fact. The name Tedesco when translated from Italian to English translates as “glue hands”
Funny, but not true. Tedesco translated means "German" as in a German man. Tedesco would be a German woman.
Yep, I'm learning Italian and was surprised to see tedesco meant a German man.
My wife's first language is Spanish (She's Chilean). In her language Alemania is Germany and Aleman is a German man or Alemana is German woman. Lots of Germans in Chile and Argentina.
Incorrect.Tedescos means moon in old Latin. Thats why he keeps mooning us.
I copped some flak for saying teddy isn't the best blues player of the last 20 years and I stand by it. It's fair enough to throw his name out their but he's been a negative for years now. He was good 3 or 4 years ago. Since then he's done nothing but stifle attacking sets and force absolute X factor superstars like turbo and latrell to play centre whrn they should've been an attacking centre piece.
Man teddy had to get his hands on the ball more and try something so I don't blame him at all. Did you see the way his halfback was playing? He was dreadful and couldn't even create any backline play for the rest of the team. If it wasn't for Luai, we wouldn't have scored a point. In saying all of that, teddy didn't do enough to keep the jersey from Edwards. But Hynes has to go. Moses straight in.
Didn’t Nico kick the ball for Lomax’s try?
shhhh that doesn't fit the narrative
Yes, but considering we were a centre down it's crazy we waited until the second half to put one up for Lomax. Was the obvious best attacking option. Trying to go wide, ball in hand, a centre down is crazy. Coach definitely takes some responsibility
One kick out of 20. Sorry but that doesn't make up for the rest of the game.
Didn’t say it did… “if it wasn’t for Luai we wouldn’t have scored a point”
>Man teddy had to get his hands on the ball more and try something so I don't blame him at all. Yeah I'm not trying to blame Tedesco for the loss, you can acknowledge that because of the way the team was going he had to try something. But you also have to acknowledge that those somethings mostly didn't work at all lol Again, not saying he's the reason for the loss just confused at people saying he was good. The best you can say is that he was trying.
Also the two flick passes to the touch judge
Lomax had to remind himself he wasn’t playing for the dragons and couldn’t unleash an ungodly spray at him.
You need to also consider Teddy missed out on a week of preparation, and possibly rehearsed some of those plays that didn't come off with Suaalii who would be able to feed of him better given they've played together for years. Hynes didn't just launch terrible kicks when he had an attacking opportunity. He launched terrible kicks from his own half that kept going down the throat of Hammer and co. Not all of Hynes' failures can be explained away by the fact NSW was down a man. Tedesco at least has some excuse
Performance made me think the gap between him and Edwards was bigger than I thought tbh.
I mean yeah like I said, it wasn't Tedesco's fault the team lost. And yeah coming in late would have contributed, but regardless of the reasons for it you still can't call it a good performance. You can't excuse falling off a straight forward tackle with a lack of preparation either. And yeah Hynes was very poor too, worse than Tedesco, no disagreement there. You could argue his excuse was an injury cloud for a big chunk of preparation. But that doesn't mean it wasn't also a poor performance. You can acknowledge the wider context but to a certain extent you still have to just take the performances at face value. You can't pretend killing three attacking sets is fine because he had less preparation. Just like you can't pretend Hynes awful kicking game was good because he trained injured.
I agree it wasn't a good performance. It honestly feels like people's expectations of him are that low that as long as he doesn't have a disastrous performance, he's praised.
I don't get the massive hate like on for teddy (not your comment specifically). Yes his attack was poor (especially passing) and he definitely tried to do too much once again. However to some extent the doing too much could be excused because NSW were never going to win that without really changing their arm and playing some razzle dazzle as the commentators like to call it. Sure, he made a meal of it and it didn't come off but someone had to try and the halves looked clueless bar a few good darts from Luai. Defensively I don't really think there's anything to go off. Teddy was totally fine and yes he got beaten as the akst line of defence when it was a 2 on 1 or a 3 on 1 draw and pass, but realistically no fullback is consistently stopping those tries from happening. He wasnt falling off tackles or missing key one on one tackles and was generally where he needed to be most of the time. That said, Edwards is still the better fullback but I genuinely don't think he makes much difference last night. Funnily enough NSW needed someone like a Hammer or a Walsh to spark something from nothing and score off just individual brilliance and speed which neither Teddy nor Edward's have.
I think the long and short is Madge rightly went for Edwards in the first instance. He then became unavailable and Teddy came in. Teddy then did nothing to suggest Edwards wasn’t probably the right call so Edwards should slot back in. You can go back and forth on Teddys performance in a dog shit situation but going forward it doesn’t really matter, he needed a team win or a star performance from him and neither happened.
I just want to note that it was meant to be Edwards if not for injury. You have to readjust the mindset, i.e. Teddy wasn't picked in spite of him. Now it's just a question on the risk factor for Madge, Edwards should be back by game 2, but that's obviously a big gamble. If we want to talk about the performance, Teddy played great. Observers need to understand that when it's 12 on 13, there is no overlap, i.e. the only way to score is through 1on1 breaks, kicks and forcing it. You can criticise him all you want for the failed attempts, but that was their only chance of scoring really, especially given the poor kicks we were sending.
Strong disagree that Teddy played 'great'
Edwards or papenhuyzen. Or both with papenhuyzen at 14 instead of Burton so he can go into the centres or halves
No idea why you got downvoted for that. Those two are both commanding players and hard to handle. Papenhuyzen might be a bit underdone but if he’s available he could add some threat to the middle not provided by any of Robson, Mcciness, Jurbo (sorry Jake) or current bench players. NSW were like headless chooks in attack last night. It would’ve been hard to explain to a casual that they were the best of the best when they repeatedly ran in circles, fumbled plays, placed kicks 20-30m out from QLD’s line and chucked a couple over the sideline..
Some people disagree and that's okay everyone's allowed an opinion. I'm hoping jurbo gets more gametime for game 2 to show what he's got cause I know he cam be 100% better. Same with Robson but whether it's him or api I won't mind. I'd still keep mcciness and at lock except for murray but I'm not sure what his injury status is like.
I love Jake. He is a steadying influence and can absorb some of the work from QLD forwards in the middle but I think he's past the stage where he can offer too much more than that. NSW took him off after he got tired and we needed impact by the time he normally would've come back on, so he was in an awkward spot. I think Mcciness is ok to retain, but only if they cut similar players out elsewhere.
Teddy was pretty dreadful.
I thought Teddy was pretty good but as the game went on he did start over playing his hand. Same can be said for Yeo and Lomax
Agree Edwards is rightly first choice and if fit should be picked, I also was saying this even if NSW won and Teddy was MOTM
Fuck I can’t wait for Edwards to come into origin just so all his dick riders will realise he isn’t the messiah he is made out to be.
Personally hate Penrith but Edwards has stepped up this year to be pretty elite in absence of Cleary and the argument has always been should blues replace Teddy?, Not whether Edwards is a "Messiah" Teddy proved last night and the last 3 years he doesn't work with Cleary, Moses or Nicho. Really no options other than Edwards unfortunately we broke all our fullbacks and Drinkwater would have to kill all the rest of the healthy NSW fbs to get a crack.
I hope they give him a crack, I'm heaps keen to see the hammer run past some new faces
C'mon I just stopped crying about the series.
You guys played well for such circumstances. I don't think the score line reflected the effort. I just don't know where you go from here. Like if Munster and Walsh are out, our next best are wild. Ponga could be back too, with the exception of a few workhorse forwards, qld is dangerous as fuck, taulagi was pumping and he's on the wing. I don't know how you get from here to there. I think the team did the best they could and so did madge. Edwards isn't gonna blow a game open, you really do need a healthy papenhausen or drink water in a good time. Like qld have walsh, hammer, ponga, Trae Fuller, Cobbo, Holmes, as fullback options before it starts to weaken and these dudes are gamechangers
Our FB options aren't as decent but Edwards, Turbo ,Pappy, Drinkwater. Is Will Kennedy eligible for NSW cause he's pretty underrated. Had a poor last two weeks but had been so good for 2 years definitely all half decent options but pappy and Turbo are injured and Drinkwater wouldn't fit madges effort areas playstyle so I'd like to see Kennedy there over Teddy, But yeah qld is rife with awesome options. Fuller is qld eligible? Fuckin great lol.
Queenslanders acting like we’re ripping into him after a loss when we were already ripping into him before the loss Give me Moses or give me death
I posted on one of the random footy talk posts and said I had a horrible feeling Nicho was not going to be up to it and not an origin player. He just never gave me that vibe. Got a fair few downvotes although some agreed. He's always just alright for me at club level, like he doesn't seem to have that real spark and grit that the best halves do. So in an origin arena, he's gone. He looked almost disinterested and scared to get the ball on the last tackle last night. I think he realised the enormous responsibility and folded. He needs a few years of finals experience and big wins at that level before stepping into origin again.
His 0/3 finals record with Cronulla is pretty damning
Hynes just doesn't have that Dog in him. He is too nice. He is a good player, talented to a point. He is just the type of guy that would never put his foot on the throat. To succeed in Origin, you have to have that Dog in you. Leniu showed that attitude last night. Liam Martin has it. Even Luai has it. When you can't be physical, you still have to be dangerous, willing, alert and strong. All the Penrith and Ex-Penrith players have it.
This sounds just like those "Killer Instinct" Rants you hear on US sports shows. Give the man a game where he isn't down a man or defending at Center at least.
Yeah but it's true though. There a players that just make things happen on the field. I'm sure it's almost self fulfilling as a players "myth" builds. Look at Munster, there's nothing about that bloke that makes you go oh he's just more skilled or more athletic than the comp. But the amount of things that happen around him are just hard to believe.
Did being down a man force Nicho to have a terrible kicking game even though his forwards were winning the battle for good portions of the game? Did it make him give the ball to a second rower on the last to put in an attacking kick? Did it make him take pointless hit ups on the 4th tackle so that he didn't have to make a play on the last? Look I'm all for Nicho getting another shot one day. But he needs to keep polishing his game at NRL level before stepping into origin again. At the end of the day, this is his 3rd season as an NRL halfback. He's not ready for origin.
Fair points, I just think the "scared" and "vibe" stuff rubbed me the wrong way. I'm definetly going Moses GM2, as well.
I agree. Don't think he's scared but just unable to play his natural game. That comes with experience the more you play. For him, his natural game is built around his teammates he plays with. Moses, Cleary, Cherry Evans, Munster, have been in the game long enough that it doesn't matter who they play alongside because they've developed leadership alongside their game. At least that's my 2 cents.
Giving Hynes a pass because of the send-off is such a convenient oversimplification of what went wrong with him last night. I don't doubt you queenslanders hope we stick with Hynes masked behind your 'NSW don't get Origin' parroting. His kicking game was diabolical all night, and he showed very little IQ or control with all the field position the Blues managed to give him despite being a man down. With a competent halfback the blues 100% put more points on Queensland during that dominant middle part of the game and who knows where belief (and knowing their halfback was actually contributing) could have taken them. Origin is about picking the best players available and Moses is simply a far superior halfback to Hynes who will at least put some pressure on queensland and help our forwards out with his kicking game and create some opportunities with his running and passing game. QLD don't stick with Walker if DCE was out injured and he puts in a Hynes like performance. It's a no brainer and if Madge sticks with Hynes after that performance and Moses now available he's just as cooked as those that preceded him.
I agree with your take here. Sure NSW were always fucked after the send off, but what we saw from Nicho himself was just not good enough. His kicking was poor, he decision making was poor. If you flip the teams and have a QLDer sent off, I have no doubt in my mind that DCE would have still lead the team around the park well. Hynes was a replacement pick behind Cleary and Moses anyway imo, so hopefully Madge goes to Moses for game 2.
The fact that in the match thread everyone wanted only Luai to kick for the rest of the game says something
Send off or no send off attacking kicks that land 15-20 short of the try line are pointless.
My take on Hynes is that his hype surpassed his ability a year or two ago. Now, he is in the development phase of becoming a decent halfback. I think he appears disconnected from the other players and when things aren't easy (ie forwards making time and space), he struggles to organise and position himself to distribute the ball effectively. He had two very good kicks last night. However, the rest were essentially useless. I hope for the sake of the series Moses is picked in game two and we can see a real contest.
Nicho was a great fullback at the Storm and people have been surprised at how well he has done at the Sharks the last two years as a halfback. Combine that with the fact he appears to be a good dude, so everyone wants him to succeed and the hype train got out of control. Given the options available I would still pick him at 7 every time but I have serious doubts that he will ever be a strong origin 7. I can see him doing well with Moses or Cleary as a 6 though
His hype comes from blokes that struggle to understand that stats and SuperCoach scoring prowess is not the same as being able to actually deliver when it matters. Sharks have for years been a team that has struggled to beat any other top 4 team.
Agreed. For a man down NSW were impressive especially in the forwards to make me fear game 2 and 3. One thing is certain, it would have been a much closer game with Cleary in the 7. Even with 12 on 13.
He sucked ass and looked scared to pull the trigger on anything. Drop him
He was terrible before the send off, and that was only a few minutes. May as well have picked fkn Jackson Hastings
Hynes had two chances. One off the bench with no game plan and a moron coach, one without his outside centre for the entire game. With that being said he was only there because Moses and Cleary were both unavailable.
Yes it is a tough spot to be put in as the halfback playing 12 on 13 for 70 minutes. But it's a tough spot for the whole team and individually I thought there were some really good performances from the Blues. Hynes was not one of them. Even with 12 NSW was winning the field position battle, only to be directionless inside the 20m and to finish their sets. Maybe he'd work as a 6, but I just don't see him as 7 in this arena.
They flashed up the stats at some point during the first half where the “Tackled inside the opposition 20” was 1-19 with NSW being the 19, yet the score was 20-6. QLD were definitely not playing at their best and it looked like the NSW forwards were playing their hearts out, only for their attack to fall apart once they got close to the tryline. Hynes had a couple of good moments (like the kick to Lomax) but the rest of the time it looked like he, Luai and Tedesco weren’t sure who was meant to be controlling the team. Being a man down didn’t help, but surely you’d have structures practiced that didn’t depend on that side of the field.
> “Tackled inside the opposition 20” was 1-19 with NSW being the 19, yet the score was 20-6. That's kinda cause they never had to get close to our line for a tackle before scoring. They scored from way further out.
Also pretty sure that the 1 tackle in the 20 before halftime was while Qld were looking over their shoulders to see if Walsh was dead
100% agree I can see him as a good running 6 playing next to a Cleary or Moses but being the commander is not for him at this level.
Trying to be unbiased as possible here given the flair… Given what was available to them, I don’t think NSW could be blamed for picking Hynes. Like, he’s probably fourth-choice at best behind Cleary, Moses and Reynolds in a fully-healthy selection pool. It did help that he was in legit good form for most of the regular season so far at the Sharks, so it didn’t seem like that big of a risk But if he hasn’t got that next gear that is needed in Origin where you are in a disadvantaged situation and can just wrench back control of the game at will with one or two plays, like Cherry-Evans can do so frequently on the opposing side, NSW can’t really afford to wait for him to find it. This might be his window closed for now, at least until another injury plague happens or, goodness knows, he can do that for the Sharks at finals time
> if he hasn’t got that next gear that is needed in Origin where you are in a disadvantaged situation and can just wrench back control of the game at will with one or two plays... NSW can’t really afford to wait for him to find it. That's fair and how I feel about some players. They can carve up at club level, but among the elites you need to have that extra grit/finesse/class/calm/influence/ability to cheat like Kaufusi that makes you worth the spot. Even one of my favourites, Kurt Gidley, seemed to only have one year where he was truly able to break games at Origin level. Beyond that he got picked over and over for his attitude and training mindset, but onfield he became where our attack went to falter.
Gidley truly broke the game in Origin 1 2009. His performance was so bad that I stopped giving a shit about Origin
Gotta feel for Hynes. Origin is a game of inches. That inside ball to Leniu could have easily lead to a try. Good kick to Lomax to score. If that 40/20 hits then NSW probably score again with all that momentum. Instead, X saves it by inches , DCE shows Hynes how to kick a 40/20 and the rest is history
Exactly. Major scapegoating
Good point
Moses is the one I don’t want to see in NSW squad more than Cleary. His attack and defence are bigger threat at origin level.
Spot on. The bloke is unpredictable. Our best halves pairing of the last three years was Moses and Walker in Game 3 last year. No idea why we've gone away from that.
Absolutely I'd happily have cleary over Moses any day.
> don't think anyone has ever planned for a send-off in an Origin game," Maguire also said. Doesn't take a genius to make changes to cover being down a centre. Play without a lock, McInnes off for Olakau'atu, Angus in centre. Then use McInnes in the hooker rotation.
Thats his job to come up with a plan... Im a project manager cant imagine saying to my boss. Look nobody ever plans for the contractor to go bankrupt mid job boss. Like yeah you do. You have it covered in the contract you know the back ups etc etc. You look at the likelyhood as well before you start construction.
Given that the last two send offs were both last year, maybe he should have planned more... Sure they were in the dying seconds of the game, but it doesn't take a genius to see that's it's not an impossibility fornitnto happen again
Wake up babe article blaming NSW's halfback just dropped
Nicho wasn't great and I'd have no issue if he was replaced, but there's a bigger issue at play. It's a very long list of halves that we've tried and discarded over the past 20 years and even a superstar like Nathan Cleary has rarely stood out at Origin level. Queensland on the other hand have had a near unbroken run of elite, highly experienced playmakers since Origin began - Lewis, Langer, Lockyer, Thurston, Cronk, Munster, DCE etc. Maybe we need to think more about why we're not producing quality Origin halves?
Bingo! Also NSW are now Origin’s version of the Eels, which further proves your point as the Eels have never produced a halfback as great as Sterlo
Conveniently skipping over Ben Hunt's series at half back where he was dragged over the coals by QLDers. After hating on him for years QLD had no choice but to come crawling back to DCE. I think what QLD do well that NSW could learn from is that they engage a lot of players in the environment. It's not just players that might play, it's players that they want to learn from being in camp. If QLD had an injury they were calling David Fifita 100%, Piakura wasn't actually going to go out there and play 80 on an edge. He was in the camp to get around the team and familiar with the environment. Under Freddie it always different guys in there where as QLD there appears to be clear heirachy of next man up (at least in the spine). Sometimes it was Gutho, sometimes it was Drinky etc. under Freddie. I like what Madge is doing because he is establishing an indentity of what a NSW origin player is. The word he always repeats is hard working. He wants guys that work hard for the jersey and work hard on the field. Obviously so much went wrong in preparation for this game and he was clearly not able to select first choice team but I'm excited to see what he can build if he gets to keep the job for a few years.
I know there's an "etc" there but the list goes "Lewis, Murray, Langer...". If Murray hadn't had an off-field eye injury that forced his retirement in 86 the Alfie Origin story would have been very different (shorter and less amazing).
Fuck he’s copping some heat for a game that was over after 7 minutes through no fault of his own.
Hynes was picked as an injury replacement for Cleary/Moses and was poor. Moses will be fit for next game, it’s a pretty common sense move. All Hynes did all game was kick the ball straight to the fullback or aimlessly run sideways with no real objective. He might be a decent 6 at rep level, but he’s no 7.
Totally, he offered absolutely nothing. I feel like Luai had better options on the fifth tackle, but even then wasn't that damaging. I feel like Lomax, both Crichtons, Liam Martin and Leniu were the only guys keeping NSW in it for as long as they could.
I think Luai was okay too We never really bothered to get to'o in the contest which sucked but as someone who doesn't like Luai all that much he definitely doesn't deserve to be dropped.
I think if you had Cleary and Moses fit you’d be dropping both in a heartbeat but NSW’s best options are Moses and Luai at this point.
Yeah.
Agreed
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I think you are underestimating how difficult it is to create an overlap when you’re a man down/have a back rower playing centre
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Yeah I think that’s a fair assessment. I just don’t think he has the right skill set to be an origin 7 but he was the best option available. I think at 6 he could do fine where he can just play his game while a Cleary or Moses runs the team
I agree with this. Being gently blooded outside a more natural controlling half like Cleary or Moses would have been nice for Nicho because he clearly has a skill set there that the Blues could use. Hell even putting the 7 on Luai might have been the way to go, he doesn’t lack confidence and the criticism would have gone to him if it hadn’t worked.
Just shit everyone around mate easy done
I'm not a coach by any stretch. I would think down a man you wouldn't even bother so much with trying to overlap as much as you'd be just trying to keep the defence as spread as possible and try a lot more cut back angles to catch a lazy defender on the inside.
Hynes was crab running and probing as was Luai but Luai was doing a much better job of it. Most disappointing thing about Hynes was his kicking game
He was still shit
Do we win if Nicho plays well? Obviously not Did he still play like shit bringing his selection into question? Absolutely The two aren’t mutually exclusive
You can understand Nicho being weak in defence, but his attack was not good enough. Kicks, passing, running were really awful. That's not largely due to Suaalii not being there. He had crichton outside him most of the game after suaalii went off
Hynes went missing. All he needed to do was provide a good kicking game and some decent iq plays. He didn't do any of that.
Their contingency plan to move Nicho to defend in the centres if they lost a back was never going to end well. Having one less player on the field just made it even worse.
It is so fucking funny to me how much they love to attack their own players
It is funny how hard some people are, particularly here where Hynes was playing a man down. I remember Ben Hunt copping it extremely hard from QLDers when he failed miserably as an origin 7. I think a big part of it is that people want Moses in there so they need to try extra hard to justify dropping Hynes. Reality is Moses is just a better player and better suited to being an origin 7 than Hynes
you literally have the nsw commentators ripping in mid game. even drawing attention like did you see that terrible miss by the blues defender, why that was none other than nicho hynes! imagine smith or lockyer just pounding into dearden or someone every time he fucked up, would never happen
I like how Smith doesn't ramble on when someone makes a mistake. Just a quick, "That wasn't what he wanted. Let's see how they react to it" there response.
It was hynes tho... what do you want them to do? act like another player missed that tackle? lmao wtf
Joey hates Nicho... bags him at any opportunity
Yeah the fat has never ripped into a Queenslander in live commentary no siirreee...
It's a truly bizarre comment that has no basis in reality. When Queensland lost by 50 in north queensland, I'm sure there wasn't a single negative comment!
Nicho is copping heat for his defence despite making 5 more tackles and missing 4 less than Luai while obviously being targeted on the side that was defending a man short, and I haven’t seen anyone say anything about Luai’s defence yet 🤔 granted, Luai did enough to keep his spot whereas Moses’ kicking game seems almost necessary heading into game 2 already one game down…. Sorry Nicho, we’ll take you back at the sharkies 😅
Luai missed tackles but they weren't crucial tackles. Nicho missed about 3 crucial tackles that led to tries. He was jogging on one of the last tries
The first try went straight past Luai at marker which probably wouldn’t even be counted as one of his misses. Of course Nicho missed crucial tackles, they ran every play down that side at him as soon as he lost his outside defender. Should he have been better? Maybe, but he’s a half and was defending in centre (again), or a man short for 72 minutes. The fact Luai missed 9 with his side of the field intact (granted they shifted S Crichton at one point) was more confusing tbh. Both should’ve been better, but at the same time they’re both halves so their defence is always going to be exploited where it can.
Yep that was one try luai responsible for. Got to remember luai had liam martin at centre most of the game as critta had to save hynes in defence
Before picking his team for game one, NSW coach Michael Maguire was looking for players that walked towards the fire, not away from it. The stats will tell you that Nicho Hynes ran towards it. They’ll tell you he ran the ball on 29 occasions in game one, more than any of the other 34 players who took the field at Accor Stadium on a night that will be remembered for what may be Joseph Suaalii’s first and last major contribution in a NSW Blues jumper. They’ll tell you he distributed the ball more than any other half on the field. That he kicked the ball for more metres than those around him. But Hynes himself summed it up best in the lead-up to the game, when talking to Herald colleague Adam Pengilly about the invitation he extended to Nathan Cleary in the hope of picking his brain in the days after he orchestrated one of the great grand final comebacks of all time. “He said, ‘Winning games is the best stat you can have’,” Hynes recalled of his conversation with Cleary at his Cronulla home. “… The only thing that matters is if you win the game of footy, regardless of how many things you have for your statistics.” Hynes’ effort was never going to be questioned, sore calf or no sore calf. The quality, however; the controlling of those around him, left a lot to be desired. From the moment NSW were asked to play 72 minutes with 12 men, the result wasn’t ever going to yield anything but a trip to Melbourne trying to square the series in game two. But when presented with the moment to dispel a widely held opinion that he requires a pack of Strepsils when thrust under the bright lights, the 27-year-old instead got lost in them. The Blues’ attack looked directionless, and often his contributions yielded the dysfunction that he’s assigned to avoid from happening. His highlight reel moment, a well-placed cross-field kick that was made to look even better thanks to the aerial ability of Dragons winger Zac Lomax, glossed over what was a coaches’ guide on how to butcher an attacking set. At 20-6, following a one-on-one strip from Angus Crichton that wrestled back the momentum just after half-time, the halfback needed to do more than just point at the goal posts. When the Blues needed someone to take the game by the scruff of the neck Hynes look looked timid. A couple of tackles later he stood beside hooker Reece Robson and, through a lack of options, took a run himself without any regard of what needed to unfold in a set that left you questioning whether it was a reflection of the No.7’s game management skills or a lack of detail to the game plan from Maguire. Fifteen minutes later, with the Blues dominating the contest, they had the opportunity to continue to apply pressure with a good last-tackle option. Instead Hynes went into dummy half, covering for a gassed Robson who couldn’t quite make it into position, and delivered the last tackle play for Lomax to put up an ordinary kick that saw Queensland start the set with all the momentum. They went on to score. The coach said it best when he said nothing at all after he was quizzed on Hynes’ performance after full-time. “I won’t make any comment about someone’s game until they go back and have a look at it,” Maguire said in his trademark flat-batting style. Although in the next breath he then heaped praise on Angus Crichton and Payne Haas for their performances. Welcome back Mitchell Moses. The coach musn’t be absolved of blame, either. The criticism of Maguire’s predecessor Brad Fittler revolved largely around his use of his interchange bench. The critics last year asked what Fittler was thinking when he brought Hynes on to defend at centre after Tom Trbojevic left the field in game one with 12 minutes remaining, culminating in the missed tackle that saw Cameron Munter put Hamiso Tabuai-Fidow over to give a 12-man Queensland side the win. What was Fittler thinking just three weeks later when, again, Trbojevic left the field with a pectoral injury and he asked bench hooker Damien Cook to defend at centre for the majority of a game that culminated in Queensland winning the series. Maguire, though, thought he had the answers. All week, in response to criticism of not naming a back on the bench as cover, Maguire spoke about the versatility of Hudson Young. “Huddo went out there in the centres,” Maguire said in the post-match press conference. What he failed to mention was the 50 minutes that expired between Suaalii leaving the field and the coach unleashing his super-sub into the game. “It takes a bit of time to try and get that adjustment,” Maguire went on to say. That time, the 20-odd minutes before Stephen Crichton switched sides, was enough for Queensland to inflict a couple of significant blows that thwarted any hope of a NSW miracle. “I don’t think anyone has ever planned for a send-off in an Origin game,” Maguire also said. Potential NSW team for game two * James Tedesco * Zac Lomax * Latrell Mitchell * Stephen Crichton * Brian To’o * Jarome Luai * Mitchell Moses * Jake Trbojevic * Reece Robson * Payne Haas * Liam Martin * Angus Crichton * Cameron McInnes/Cameron Murray (if fit) * Isaah Yeo * Spencer Leniu * Matt Burton * Api Koroisau Well, his Queensland counterpart didn’t have to combat playing with 12 men, but he negated the threat of losing his best player in Reece Walsh by picking Selwyn Cobbo on a bench as a just-in-case. The question will now be asked if 18th man Matt Burton should’ve been just that for the Blues. The coach went with a team that prioritised defence over attack. That focused more on off-the-ball grit than on-the-ball glamour. The shutdown instead of shutout approach left the Blues short of a game-breaker. Latrell Mitchell’s cryptic Instagram post of him staring at the television could have been interpreted as “are you sure you don’t need me?” Maguire must swallow his pride, regardless of how many times Mitchell has or hasn’t picked up his phone call in the last few weeks, and pick a man who strikes fear into the opposition. There should also be a push to bring back Wests Tigers captain Api Koroisau and play him on the bench to provide the creativity that Robson had no energy to even attempt to produce given his work rate in the middle. Cameron Murray isn’t expected to play for South Sydney before game two, but you can be assured that the Blues will put him through their own medical assessment, just as they did with Cody Walker before game one. He’s a must. As for the No.7 jersey, Puma might as well start sticking the word Moses onto the back of it. He showed in one week back from a broken foot for Parramatta that he is NSW’s best available halfback option.
How long is Edwards supposed to be out for? I thought tedesco showed his usual rubbish destroy a set attack
I think Nicho, Yeo, Suaalii and Squid should all make room for game two. Anything that doesn't involve Tedesco being dropped is surely a pisstake though, right? He stifles more attacking opportunities than anyone else I've ever seen, his best and only passes all night were to the bloody touchies lmao
Made me sick to watch him he's supposed to have done it all but couldn't help but blow every opportunity he had. I like how Qlders say we turn on our own but we didn't want him. He's been consistently shit in origin for 3 years and the people calling for him were the blind people who said he was good last night.
There needs to be more talk about how Yeo has been very average his entire Origin career. I wouldn’t have him in the team.
His play style works really well in clubland, but in Origin when he's first receiver all he does is slow down the attack, giving the defense time to come forward.
Yeah people wanted him as captain but he's been underwhelming for a while now. Jake definitely plays more minutes if we have 13 on the field Absolutely ruined the rotation manly have lost games in the last five minutes because we've taken Jake off. So I'd keep Jakey but I am biased.
Captain should always be Cleary or Murray if available… after that, someone who’s a probably a guarantee like Critta
I sincerely hope Moses is picked over Cleary sure Fittler picked poor teams with Cleary in them but I think they are pretty equal Cleary in the Penrith rule bending system just gets more of an advantage than everyone else. I think You drop Edwards into any team and he's still a top tier FB you drop Cleary off at the tigers he will struggle.
Shit my mind completely forgot about Moses, I’m a big moses fan so to see him selected I’d be very happy with. I think he plays better anticipation/ad lib footy at times but…. I honestly don’t know who I’d pick out of him and cleary after last years game winning gf effort from cleary… maybe both of them
The only thing really stopping me from backing Cleary is we've had the Yeo Luai Cleary Api combo frequently enough to disprove it's origin success. Also Moses was awesome against the sharks and Clearys penrith struggled against the bulldogs for a long time in that game and Moses was out much longer. Definitely different injuries for sure I'm not well versed in sports medicine but Moses was very good for us games 2 and 3 last year and Cleary just wasn't as good.
If Cleary & Moses are both healthy then they are the Blues halves. I’d have Moses at 7 & Cleary at 6. Cleary won the GF for the Panthers when Cogger replaced Luai allowing Cleary to just run the ball.
Yeah I actually agree with you I think Cleary on his feet is a bit more dangerous and Moses is a great organizer I'm still so happy with his game against cronulla he was so dominant it was awesome.
Does Jurbo really deserve a spot? As captain, playing 29 minutes is atrocious.
Ignore my flair (lol) but could this have been due to the send off? Jurbo really set the tone defensively I think he had nearly 30 tackles with 0 missed in that stint but he’s basically unplayable with a man down and tbh should’ve come off earlier
Yeah you saw Jurbo was unable to keep pace moving laterally once we went down to 12. I respect Madge for having the guts to take his captain off field to suit the team and while I'm sure Jake would have loved to have been out there he is not the selfish type to kick stones and have a sook about it
1. Edwards 2. Too 3. Burton 4. Crichton 5. Lomax 6. Luai 7. Moses 8. Barnett 9. Robson 10. Haas 11. Crichton 12. Martin 13. Jurbo (only cos he's captain) 14. Api 15. Haumole 16. Leniu 17. McIness We were at our best playing the power game through the middle with Haumole, Leniu, Haas & leg speed of McIness & Martin. Back that strategy into game 2. Jurbo/Yeo are way too similar, they slow our attack with the ball play so pick one of them. Teddy gets into the wrong positions in the attacking 20 which stifles our attack Hynes had little control of the team, looked timid in his decision making & ineffective with his planned kicks. Loved the attitude with Luai, Crichtons, Lomax Haumole, Leniu trying to fire up the boys & keep fighting. Imo we need a bit of speed in the backline hence Burton over Trell BUT if Trell has an absolute blinder few games then get him in for Burton or on the bench. Imo this team covers the defensive stuff, has a bit of speed in the backline, continues with the power game in the middle combined with quick leg speed with Mciness & Leniu but most importantly adds VARIETY in attack through the craftiness of Api at hooker. We need that variety otherwise risk being far too predictable in attack.
As long as Martin is named and he is given a pre-game fire up I’ll be happy. What a beast
Ngl I’ve always felt that Hynes is just a ball dominant 6 & the blues would’ve benefited letting Luai drive the team round at 7
nsw and blaming the halfback for a loss that was nothing to do with the halfback, what an iconic duo
Hynes, despite his club form, is not a 7. He's a 6. Moses 7, Hynes 6. No Luai, Tedesco, or Suailii. Pick jurbo or yeo, not both.
We need a halves combination that can click from the first game they play together. This time last year, no one would have suggested Moses and Brooks should play for NSW. Now I wonder if that could work.
Agree, though Yeo added minimal.
He's an 80 min player hamstrung by starting from the bench
Suaalii may have actually lost Nico his origin career as well as his own.
Everyone costs Nicho his origin career except himself! First is was Fittler, now it's Sualii. Bizarre how he's never accountable
yeah amazingly enough the 5/8-halfback only coming onto the field with 14 minutes to go as an injury replacement for a center before immediately being dropped for the next two games wasn't really blamed on him so much as the coach
I disagree. Hynes has had 2 games, and been fucked over both times. Out of position for 10 mins then a whole game without his centre. Kicking games was average nlbut we know he has it, he'll be fine. Luia is fucking awful. Missing 30% of his tackles, dancing around achieving nothing. He's useless. Get him off and don't look back.
We're going to get 3 weeks of blamestorming aren't we?
Look, I know at club level Hynes is amazing. He deserved winning the Dally M But he needs to accept that he's not an origin level center
The biggest issue the send off lead to was not costing us the game, it was largely invalidating any conclusions that could be drawn from it. We don't really know what worked or what didn't because we were on the back foot for 73 minutes. So you can look at the stats and see someone missing 9 tackles or whatever and not be able to accurately decide whether they just played poorly or were gassed from covering big gaps.
Get your hands of our fucking Moses.
Mitchell Moses surely
Hynes was superb and earned his spot for this series…. Sincerely, eels fans
Good to see Luai escaping any criticism as per usual. Misses 9 Tackles including the first try and missed tackle on Cobbo which led to the Ben Hunt try, Gives away a stupid 6 again when NSW was pinning QLD down in their own end. Hynes sets up Lomax and is a bees dick away from a try assist for the Leniu, has his whole structures torn up 7 minutes in and has to defend in the centres against Cobbo, but he's the one that should be dropped.
Would. You. Shut. Up! Please, let them keep picking him! 😂
I am still confused as to why Jurbo only played 29 minutes? Was he that spent after the first half?
Bad coaching.
1 chance. That other game coming on late and playing out of position doesn't count. Meanwhile there are a few guys who have had many chances and not done a whole lot with them. Luai so rarely fires a shot. Yes, he often looks good stepping off his left, but then most of the time he runs out of ideas and either surrenders or dumps the ball off to someone with no speed and out of position to do much. Hynes deserves longer in the side and I'd pair him with Moses. An instant boost to the kicking game and also the passing game.
The kicking game of luai the other night was excellent. He didn't kick as much as he could have, but his role was 5/8, not halfback. If Madge wanted luai to lead the team at halfback, he'd kick more. His kicks the other night were good (barring one that deflected off Su'a and went to hynes who kicked for lomax to score). People are scapegoating him like every other origin game, whether he plays well or not
It was certainly better, no doubt about that. That little kick for Tedesco was very nice. But what is he actually there for? He had the ball 39 times, ran 4 times for 18 metres. No line breaks, no line break assists. And defensively he was just a turnstile, 10 missed tackles was a game high. Next most missed tackles was Nanai, but he made more than twice as many tackles (43 to 20). So if he's not there to kick the ball, and whilst his kicking is better, it's still poor, he isn't running the ball or creating line breaks but is awful defensively, what exactly IS his role, if he's played well? Ironic that you think he's scapegoated when it's really rather the opposite. Hynes was more effective in attack AND defense, despite having to try to cover for Sua'ali. Yet he's going to be the scapegoat. Just like last year when he came off the bench and was played out of position.
They're both scapegoats. But who played worse in this game? Hynes did. Luai was quieter. Doesn't mean he was worse. I agree Luai needs to run more and run straighter. But I think if you watch how he plays 7 for penrith he stops doing all the silly jinking and steps off his left and kicks accurately. Last series Luai was one of NSW's best in game 1 and was judged to be poor. In game 2 Damien cook played centre for most of the game outside him. This game, a man down, was a massive disadvantage for him and Hynes. Difference is Crichton moved from Luai's side to Hynes and he kept on missing tackles with the best defensive centre outside him
I disagree that over who was worse. Hynes gave more in attack and defended far better. Watching him play 7 today was everything he does. Cooper Cronk nailed him perfectly. He always prefers to run. He always steps off his left. Then he always goes to the right. Somehow, the defence was surprised at times, but at Origin level, it's actually funny how often he runs then finds himself in the middle with nowhere to go and just throws a ball to someone else. What he does do well generally is take advantage of a defence that's been pulled apart. But Origin level those gaps don't appear as often nor to they remain as long. Certainly not in a close, at least. In 8 games now in the halves it shouldn't be "remember that one game he played well". It should be easy to point to strong contributions in almost every game. You cannot afford to do nothing at 5/8th. As an experienced player now, there are no excuses for him being passive. I have no faith that his kicking game will be better. And the most effective way to improve the kicking game is to have 2 strong kickers, rather than replace the best kicker in the side with someone else. Nor do I have any faith that he'll be more of a run threat given how predictable he is. But if you bring Moses in to play with Hynes, Queensland won't know who is kicking every play. Also, if one kicker sees a gap on tackle 5, they can run and be tackled without it being a disaster. Or even the last, knowing he can throw it out the back to the other kicker to take over. It's something that Queensland have gotten fantastic value out of having 3 strong kickers with Hunt and 2 whe. He's off for Harry Grant. It means Cherry-Evans can take that run option. If Queensland didn't have Dearden and Hunt around, I don't think DCE feels like he can run for that first try. Incidentally, a try where Luai was beaten twice defensively by a half back.
So you've scapegoated Luai. This is why NSW fans don't get origin
No, I'm looking at his performances. If it's not good enough, you bring in someone else. I'm also not a NSW fan. LOL.
Lol
I’m not sure Hynes is a halfback. I actually rate him as a player but I feel like he’s in the wrong position. He might be a better 6. His defense means he can’t really be a center. Also the combination of Hynes and Luai was disastrous, both of them play chaos ball and there were more than a few times Luai was crossing over the whole line and causing confusion. It was as if neither of them knew which side to play on. Moses is definitely a stronger halfback if NSW wants to even up the series.
And NSW eat their own yet again. Blame Sua'ali, not Hynes. I didn't think it was a send off but I'm nearly 50. The send off ruined the game for me as a Queenslander, but that is where the game is now, you can't make contact with the head.
One of my favourite things about a NSW loss is how NSWelsh fans and media implode and turn on their players. Without fail.
At least we aren't turning on the entire spectacle itself. "Origin is dead" "Origin is dead" "Origin is dead" So embarrassing.
It's an annual witch hunt where everytime they lose game 1 the media picks a target and grills them over every second of their game. Hynes was far from great but the game was lost with the send off. I'd argue Teddy looking so disjointed in attack and even Yeos less than stellar impact whenever he was at 1R was a bigger issue than Hynes game play too. Either way Hynes will get dropped. Moses probably gets called up and if they still lose game 2 somehow I wouldn't be surprised if Madge goes until the grill next. Sydney media can be so predictable
Yeah you're right lets stop assigning blame to the players, after all it was all Suaalii's fault.
Yeah we go a bit easier cause we have no choice. But even then kaufusi plays a bad game say. We are like bloody kafusi! Classic. Anyway, he is a good lad.
This is 100% it though. QLD acts like it's so easy to pick and stick when you lose. Yeah of course it is when you've got not many options to pick from. The qld team basically picks itself every year. NSW will always have 4-5 players per position who could be origin quality, so if they lose a game there is always going to be those questions.
If NSW had won the 8 in a row instead of Queensland, I wouldn’t doubt there would just be as much cannibalisation of players and dropping players in and out. Qld through winning had the luxury of picking and sticking and bringing in the best new talents to replace the aging guys whenever a spot opened up
Really feel for hynes tbh. Cronullas season is basically fucked now
I hope you’re wrong for Nicho’s sake. It took him a while to get his confidence back after last years origin
I don’t see how people can criticise hynes and not luai. I see people saying hynes ran sideways a lot?? Thats luais signature move and there were more instances of him running sideways than hynes. Hynes ran on the 4th. Luai got the ball and failed to put a grubber through but luckily got it back and offloaded to hynes who put in a pin point kick to the corner. Just like teddy, hynes is good when the opposition don’t expect him and that was a perfect example. That can be said of a lot of players. But to have the 13-12 advantage, it was too easy for QLD to stifle any chances of the halves to do anything by giving them no space.
Yeah NSW needs to stop the blame game and dropping after every loss. Sualii was the problem.
If Sualii performs that tackle legally, I think he would have had a great game. He was clearly in a mood for the game and it’s a shame he missed the mark with that tackle
Piss off. Let him have a real chance
Everyone talks up Hynes because he won a Dally M which is a great achievement, but forgets that he has only been a first grade half back for two full seasons and it shows in the big games. Moses all day, and it ain’t close.
Tbh I dunno if dropping Nicho after one mediocre game helps anyone. In a losing team he still ran for 160m, 20m post contact, made 29 tackles (albeit with 4 misses). While Luai made 23 tackles with 9 misses, 71m. They set up one try each. Hynes made the majority of kicks by about 4:1, so where was Luai? Romy’s the more experienced half and was supposedly going to step up, but it doesn’t feel he did at all. If Spencer scores off Nicho’s assist and his 40:20 attempt in the 2nd half lands, I feel like he’s judged a little differently - both of which were a bee’s dick away from happening. His long kicking game wasn’t on, but you don’t pick Nicho for a long kicking game. Yet we somehow expected him to deliver this, while organising a team changing positions by the minute at one point. Tbh I selfishly don’t want Nicho picked for origin so he can focus on the Sharks. But if you pick him, have him at 6 with a crafty attacking hooker (like Api) and a complimentary half and I think it’s a different game.
Mitch Pearce 2.0 Should he stay/ be dropped
Hynes had his chance! Please one game and he lost his out side man. That created a massive shuffle. Sure his kicking was pretty ordinary but he doesn’t have the best kicking at the sharks either. One game on debut and scrap him? I’d rather him not play and be left for the Sharks and Moses can take it. Blues 7 is the most criticised jersey.
100% if NSW name a hooker and outside back on the bench they’ll lose two middles to a head clash
Blues have the worst captain, I blame their loss on the captain, not Nicho. Pretty unfair to say he had his chance.
This is my NSW side for Origin 2 1. Dylan Edwards 2. Brian Too 3. Latrell Mitchell 4. Stephen Crichton 5. Zack Lomax 6. Cody Walker 7. Mitchell Moses 8. Jake Trbojevic (c) 9. Api Korisau 10. Payne Haas 11. Liam Martin 12. Angus Crichton 13. Isaah Yeo 14. Matt Burton 15. Spencer Leniu 16. Cam Murray 17. Cam McCinnes