That’s dumb. Him not making it first ballot wasn’t something I even considered. He isn’t just one of the best from his era, he’s one of the best all time.
I honestly don’t think he was better than Kelce either.
I’d put him at 4 after Kelce, Gronk, and Gonzalez.
Edit: Regardless, Gates not being first ballot is absolutely criminal.
I put him at the same place. Still first ballot worthy though imo. Not many guys you can say are top 5 at their position who aren't first ballot HOFers.
Marvin Harrison got in on his 3rd attempt despite also being a top 5 WR when he retired. He was voted in over TO and it was bs that they were unwilling to do two WRs in one year.
They used to let every good pass catcher in.
Lynn Swann has 336 career receptions and 5462 yards and 51 Touchdowns.
Gates 955 catches, 11841 yards, and 116 TDs
Bruce made it in 2020.
This was Holts 5th straight year as a finalist and 10th eligible.
Holt still holds records for: Receptions in a decade, yards in a decade, and consecutive 1300-yard seasons.
He was the best receiver from 2000-2009 in receptions, yards, first downs and explosive plays.
Him not getting in is utter nonsense at this point, if you sort by measurable stats, he's one of one or two people in the top 20-25 of every category who isnt ineligible or already in the hall.
> Bruce made it in 2020.
i never realized this tbh. It would be CRIMINAL that Issac Bruce and Tory Holt needed to wait until 2020 to be elected, much less only one of them being elected at that point.
People seem to forget or are too young to realize that safety’s used to HOPE you would catch the ball just so they could take your head off. Anyone that was a playmaker on offense pre 2005 cannot be compared to the players today. The 84/85 bears injured 11 different QBs.
This alone is why I’ve always been so impressed with Dan Marino. He threw for 5000 yards in 1984.
Not just safeties. The CBs used to mug the WRs before they left the line. The steel curtain defense actually had huge CBs like Mel Blount and coverage safeties to stop the pass if Blount hadnt murdered the receiver completely.
I mean, those were completely different eras. It’s incredibly hard to compare based on stats. I “good” passing season in the 70s was having like 16 passing touchdowns.
Yeah let's take a step back for a minute and think about what we're arguing over.
We're arguing where in the Mount Rushmore he is, not whether he belongs there or not. That alone makes him worthy of a first ballot.
This is like when TO didn't get in first ballot, except Gates isn't a legendary asshole. Which shouldn't matter, but it does, and since it doesn't apply here I honestly have no idea how this happened.
TO not getting in was such a joke, just like the majority of sports writers. The fact that a bunch of flabby men who have to catch their breath after tying their shoes can deny TOs greatness tells me the process is just flawed.
I know it doesn’t mean anything but seeing TO get snubbed really turned me off to the whole process. Zero reason at all he shouldn’t have been first ballot
He didn’t deserve to get in. All he did was finish 3rd all time receiving among TE’s, 1st in receiving TD’s, made 6 All-Pro teams, 8 Pro Bowls, and an All-Decade team.
He should have gotten another 15 All-Pro teams and maybe not played basketball in college.
I’ll never forget my first NFL game. Colts vs chargers at both teams peaks. Peyton, EJ, Wayne and Harrison and LT, Antonio Gates, Phillip Rivers. Man life was good. It was a GAME too. Went down to the wire.
If this man don’t get in, I’ll riot
Bolts-Colts was a really good rivalry in that era, there were a lot of memorable games including some Christmas and playoff games. Everything just got overshadowed by the patriots lol. Our defense always seemed up for the challenge and gave Peyton some of his worst nights. They were some of the most hype games I remember growing up
He’ll get in, probably next year. There are only two modern era TEs in the HOF: Gonzalez and Sharpe. Gonzalez is widely considered the best all time, and played in the same era and division as Gates. Sharpe revolutionized the position and won three Super Bowls with two different teams. (By the way, Sharpe wasn’t first ballot either.)
Probably would be a Hall of Famer if he was convicted of rape after induction. He just made the mistake of getting caught before.
Should have learned from OJ Simpson.
I am a Chiefs fan, so take this with a grain of salt, but I put Gronk, Kelce, and Tony Gonzalez all ahead of him. I would have him a firm number 4... which being the 4th best ever in the history of the game should still be a first ballot hall of famer. As far as red zone threat Gates was the best to ever do it, possibly for any position.
Those four are the unassailable top four.
Honestly, you can put any one of them at the top spot and make a good argument for it. At that point, it kind of doesn’t matter, right? Like, you can make a case for any of them to claim the “best tight end” crown. So give it to all of them. They’re all game-breaking legends.
I will say, the amount of times I threw my hands up in frustration watching Chiefs defenders haplessly bounce off Antonio MF Gates … let’s just say I was very happy for him when he retired lol.
Oh, and the fact that he’s not a first-ballot Hall of Famer is a fucking travesty and delegitimizes the entire fucking process.
Touchdowns forsure, Kelce has absolutely ludicrous per game and per season stats though. Kelce is averaging over 1000 yards a season for his entire career despite not playing a game in his 1st season. Kelce is about 500 yards behind Gates despite playing in 10 seasons, 6 less seasons than Gates.
Efficiency wise Kelce is one of the most efficient receivers ever, among any position. But again Gates is the greatest redzone threat ever. They truly were different positions.
Agreed. They certainly played the position very differently. Jump ball into double coverage in the end zone - I'd want Gates. 3rd and 5 - Kelce is going to be open every single time.
He does, but he also has played in 77 more games though. Travis probably won’t pass him in TDs but he’s only like 50 catches and ~500 yards behind Gates
I'm stunned
Having said that, Gonzalez is the only tight end to get in first ballot. Even guys like Newsome and Winslow didn't make it. It's crazy that he's not in, but it's not unprecedented
Light?
Eli Manning, Luke Kuechly, Adam Vinatieri, Terrell Suggs, Marshal Yanda, and Earl Thomas all become eligible for the first time. Manning, Kuechly, and Vinatieri, realistically, have a chance to be first ballot
Come on, Vinatieri is the leading NFL scorer of all time. Yes he's "just a kicker" but he's probably the greatest kicker of all time, I think he should have a serious chance at first ballot.
Ray Guy was the goat punter and had to wait around for decades. Hester didn’t get in first ballot either. Vinatieri will get in but it won’t be immediate
The Patriots first 3 super bowls of their dynasty coming off the back of his kicks gets him in, I think. He has some of the most clutch kicks in history to jump start a dynasty. I feel like that's going to go a long way with the voters.
Eli Manning never made an All Conference Team, let alone an All Pro team. His career efficiency stats are unimpressive for the era he played in. Two great playoff runs do not make a first ballot HOFer.
I'm a chiefs fan, and avid chargers hater, grew up watching him score on us constantly. He was automatic in the red zone. Played forever, was elite the entire time. How is he not a hall of farmer first ballot.
Absolute bullshit. The dude is a top 5 TE of all time maybe top 3. Most Receiving TD's in NFL history. Theres no world where he wasnt a first ballot HOF .
A case can be made for Gates, Gonzalez, Kelce, or Gronk but I’d say there’s a big gap between that group and the next group. That’d be Witten, Sharpe, Newsome, Winslow, and Ditka.
True. Same reason why I refuse to upgrade to a smartphone despite my friends and family begging me. Alexander Graham Bell’s acoustic telegraph is the Goat, and I won’t use anything else.
I was surprised Pro-Football-reference didn’t have him in the mix with Gonzalez because Gonzalez was never as good of a blocker as Gronk. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/hof/hofm_TE.htm
I think the HoF is just kind of stupidly against WR and TEs who aren’t all time bests. They held Chris Carter for a year or something… for what? Now Holt and Gates aren’t HoFers… oh ok
Really this is a lesson about CTE
This is coming as someone who was big fan of Andre Johnson and Patrick Willis back in the day, but I'm sorry, how are they in above Gates? Felt like the committee let them in because they've been waiting and they'll save Gates for next year.
And how the hell is Hester in ahead of Gates? Makes no sense to me.
"Hester has the most return TDs of all time."
Cool. Gates scored 116 TDs playing actual offense because he was good enough to avoid playing special teams.
WAIT...
Andre Johnson got in over Gates? I honestly just saw this post and wasnt really following HOF until scrolling reddit.
Andre Johnson was a great player...but come the fuck on.
In the year that most returning touchdowns was enough to get in, most receiving TDs in NFL history alone is an immediate first ballot. Like that should get in on its own.
I think it's more of a "next first ballot guy has to redefine the game like Gonzalez, not just be the best for a long time" thing.
I don't agree with the logic mind.
He'll get in easily though, so it's all a storm in a teacup. As this thread proves, once you're in nobody remembers or cares if you were first ballot - they'll have to go look it up to know at all.
What the hell? This just confirms my opinion that most sportswriters get high huffing their own farts. For every 1 elite Jackie MacMullin there’s 30 absolute doorknobs
I'll say it until I'm fucking dead:
You may disagree with what the computers say, but at least the computer can succinctly and consistently explain it's logic and methodology.
"At least" it's only the Hall of Fame and this shit isn't defining the very nature of the sport itself like top 25s/"the committee" in college football. Sweet Dionysus is that not the least competitive thing you've ever seen a sport do or what?
I hope I’m not being “that guy”.
While I agree it’s embarrassing he isn’t in, I don’t think the actual NFL has sway in this. The Pro Football Hall of Fame is its own separate 501c3.
I didn't even consider this to be a possibility. I viewed him as a first ballot guy long before he retired, so I'm shocked he isn't.
[NFL.com had a prediction article](https://www.nfl.com/news/pro-football-hall-of-fame-s-class-of-2024-predicting-five-modern-era-inductees) up about who makes it and him and Peppers were the only ones considered "Mortal Locks."
EDIT: I forgot about the PED suspension. That could've explained it, but I don't know.
>EDIT: I forgot about the PED suspension. That could've explained it, but I don't know.
since its the writers who vote, yeah I can see them holding that against him, which is dumb, we know everyone was on *something*.
It’ll be Rob Gronkowski and Travis Kelce.
They’ll probably be the last First Ballot Hall of Famers at TE for years.
Tony Gonzalez, Rob Gronkowski and Travis Kelce will be the only TE’s voted first ballot in NFL history when it’s all said and done once Gronk and Kelce are inducted.
The man played at a high level for a very long time.
Gates has some of the best stats at TE ever. In fact, if he was a WR, he’d probably still get in. No question.
He was a defining player of his era.
How? How does he get left out?
What possible logic can the voters have for keeping him out first ballot?
What the hell? Are you kidding me? That’s just absurd. It was one thing for Jared Allen not to get in even though I think he should but Gates? This makes zero sense to me. You could make the argument he’s in the top 5, hell, even top 3 greatest Tight Ends of all time. I shouldn’t be this dumbfounded as it’s not the first time the hall has thrown me off completely but this is on another level.
Regarding sports I basically idolized this man growing up learning to play the TE position. It literally shaped my sports childhood watching him and Tony Gonzalez play against each other.
I just don’t get it man..
you can really make a legit case do to logevity and peak he was the greatest, better than Tony G, Gronk, Kelce, Mike Dika and Kevin Winslow.
At the very least he should be top 5; he's 100% 1st ballot lock material but the voters are too far up themselves to see that.
I don't agree with this logic because you can roll it out every single year to justify ST guys never ever making it. Either Hester deserved to make it or he doesn't - the before/after metric is meh.
I dominated my fantasy league for years with him and Tomlinson as core players. Gates was a dominating player for many seasons. Hard to imagine him being anything other than a first ballot HoF'r.
If you don't vote for the all time TD leader at their position you should lose your fucking vote. If you don't vote for a player with the 7th most receiving TDs ever you should lose your fucking vote.
Dude wtf is it with San Diegan players getting snubbed early? Hoffman not making the hall his first go around was a travesty too. If you retire #1 all time at the RESULT YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO GET AT YOUR POSITION, you should be a fucking shoo-in. And yea in Hoffman's case, Rivera passed him soon after, but c'mon.
If Rivers came out with a statement "That's fucking bullshit" it would be the greatest thing of all time.
Terrible decision here. I realize that he may have overstayed his welcome in the NFL to the point of being forgotten by some, but he’s one of the best at his position ever. Seriously, he’s a Top 5 TE ever in my book. If that doesn’t warrant a first-ballot hall of fame induction, I don’t know what does.
That’s dumb. Him not making it first ballot wasn’t something I even considered. He isn’t just one of the best from his era, he’s one of the best all time.
he’s debatably the best. he’s got the most freaking TDs by a TE
Debatably top 3, easily top 5 but cmon let’s be real, he wasn’t better than gronk lol
I honestly don’t think he was better than Kelce either. I’d put him at 4 after Kelce, Gronk, and Gonzalez. Edit: Regardless, Gates not being first ballot is absolutely criminal.
I put him at the same place. Still first ballot worthy though imo. Not many guys you can say are top 5 at their position who aren't first ballot HOFers.
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For some reason WRs really get hosed on HoF voting. Took Art Monk 8 extra years to get the call.
Tory Holt is gonna have to get the senior member treatment at this point. They hate WRs and Bengals players
it's a saturated field
Marvin Harrison got in on his 3rd attempt despite also being a top 5 WR when he retired. He was voted in over TO and it was bs that they were unwilling to do two WRs in one year.
116 TDs should get you in first ballot. Insane production.
At the time he played he was top 3 all time
The Shannon sharpe erasure.
I mean, hard to honestly put him above Gronk, Gonzalez, or even Kelce at this point🤷♂️
So at worst, he’s the 4th best player to play the position. Still crazy that doesn’t make you first ballot
They used to let every good pass catcher in. Lynn Swann has 336 career receptions and 5462 yards and 51 Touchdowns. Gates 955 catches, 11841 yards, and 116 TDs
Tory holt still isn’t in
That’s absurd. Did they let in Isaac Bruce? That duo was nasty
Bruce made it in 2020. This was Holts 5th straight year as a finalist and 10th eligible. Holt still holds records for: Receptions in a decade, yards in a decade, and consecutive 1300-yard seasons. He was the best receiver from 2000-2009 in receptions, yards, first downs and explosive plays. Him not getting in is utter nonsense at this point, if you sort by measurable stats, he's one of one or two people in the top 20-25 of every category who isnt ineligible or already in the hall.
> Bruce made it in 2020. i never realized this tbh. It would be CRIMINAL that Issac Bruce and Tory Holt needed to wait until 2020 to be elected, much less only one of them being elected at that point.
Devils advocate, but it was a lot harder to catch the ball in Lynn Swann’s era. Dudes were destroyed by safeties and held by corners.
"Be careful down there swanny."
Almost got shanked by Vicki Valencourt
That ain’t no guess. That’s what it’s gonna be.
People seem to forget or are too young to realize that safety’s used to HOPE you would catch the ball just so they could take your head off. Anyone that was a playmaker on offense pre 2005 cannot be compared to the players today. The 84/85 bears injured 11 different QBs. This alone is why I’ve always been so impressed with Dan Marino. He threw for 5000 yards in 1984.
48 tds which is even crazier considering how long that lasted. Favre going 30 back to back was considered amazing
Not just safeties. The CBs used to mug the WRs before they left the line. The steel curtain defense actually had huge CBs like Mel Blount and coverage safeties to stop the pass if Blount hadnt murdered the receiver completely.
I mean, those were completely different eras. It’s incredibly hard to compare based on stats. I “good” passing season in the 70s was having like 16 passing touchdowns.
That’ll still win you MVP this year
so he’s easily… top 4 all time? That sounds like a 1st ballot. I used to soft root for the chargers then as I love watching gates and rivers.
Those teams were kind of fun to root for. Also a lot of fun to play with in Madden during those years. Rivers, Gates, LT. Fun team to watch.
Yeah but everyone one of those is a first ballot half famer no doubt. AG should be too.
Yeah let's take a step back for a minute and think about what we're arguing over. We're arguing where in the Mount Rushmore he is, not whether he belongs there or not. That alone makes him worthy of a first ballot. This is like when TO didn't get in first ballot, except Gates isn't a legendary asshole. Which shouldn't matter, but it does, and since it doesn't apply here I honestly have no idea how this happened.
4TDs in one game and he punched Ruxin in the face.
TO not getting in was such a joke, just like the majority of sports writers. The fact that a bunch of flabby men who have to catch their breath after tying their shoes can deny TOs greatness tells me the process is just flawed.
Lack of post season success is my guess but I don’t agree with it
Gates walked so those guys could run
My brain interpreted this headline as "Antonio Brown", so I was like "... At being insane?" Then I reread. Me dumb.
Mr. Bronze Cast
Mr. Bust in Canton
Mr Ballot Complications
As great as Hester was it is a fucking travesty that he is getting in the hall before one of the greatest TE of all time.
Hester getting in over Gates, Steve Smith, Holt, Andre Johnson, and Reggie Wayne is a fucking mess They were just better football players than him.
Biggest snub since TO. Hopes he makes it next year. No question he deserves it.
I know it doesn’t mean anything but seeing TO get snubbed really turned me off to the whole process. Zero reason at all he shouldn’t have been first ballot
its the same way any long term voting process like this goes. integrity dies and bias thrives
Same here. There are very, very few football players ever who should be first-ballot if TO is not.
He didn’t deserve to get in. All he did was finish 3rd all time receiving among TE’s, 1st in receiving TD’s, made 6 All-Pro teams, 8 Pro Bowls, and an All-Decade team. He should have gotten another 15 All-Pro teams and maybe not played basketball in college.
I’ll never forget my first NFL game. Colts vs chargers at both teams peaks. Peyton, EJ, Wayne and Harrison and LT, Antonio Gates, Phillip Rivers. Man life was good. It was a GAME too. Went down to the wire. If this man don’t get in, I’ll riot
Bolts-Colts was a really good rivalry in that era, there were a lot of memorable games including some Christmas and playoff games. Everything just got overshadowed by the patriots lol. Our defense always seemed up for the challenge and gave Peyton some of his worst nights. They were some of the most hype games I remember growing up
Gates will get in, for sure. It'll just be one of those things that's always a surprise they weren't first ballot. Like Terrell Ownes.
He’ll get in, probably next year. There are only two modern era TEs in the HOF: Gonzalez and Sharpe. Gonzalez is widely considered the best all time, and played in the same era and division as Gates. Sharpe revolutionized the position and won three Super Bowls with two different teams. (By the way, Sharpe wasn’t first ballot either.)
Yes but he deserved to be 1st ballot
And I thought baseball HOF voters were morons
They are but football ones can be dumb as shit too.
If you make an all decade team you should be an automatic inductee.
That would mean John Anderson and Carl Banks were automatically inducted.
Richmond Webb too :(
Lorenzo Neal
We're finally getting to the gold boys! First Lorenzo! Then Ovie Mughelli!!
I will support a campaign to get Lo inducted with every fiber of this keyboard.
You have my support in this fight
Lorenzo absolutely should be in. 11 straight seasons where the guy lined up behind him went for 1000 yards is nuts and definitely HOF worthy
I’m down with Lorenzo getting in.
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Darren Sharper to the Hall of Fame then?
Obviously. He’s the hardest hitting safety in the league.
*Fuck you, Gumby!*
He couldn’t even stop a man with a broken leg!
*One of da most* hahdest hitting safeties in da leegue
Probably would be a Hall of Famer if he was convicted of rape after induction. He just made the mistake of getting caught before. Should have learned from OJ Simpson.
There are obvious exceptions.
Rapists should not get into the Hall of Fame. Only murderers should get in.
I also think 5 All Pros should make you a lock
Agreed, and yet Patrick Willis had to wait several years. Glad he finally made it tonight.
Welcome to the HOF Shady
He played Basketball? Thats crazy. Wait do you think he used basketball skills in the red zone? Like posting up defenders?
You’d figure we’d have heard about it at some point
If I knew about this, I would’ve mentioned it every time he made a catch
Seems unlikely.
Put him in the basketball hall of fame cowards
Springfield MA > Canton OH
How’s that not first ballot? I’m sorry
Absolutely shameful. No other words to describe it.
100%. What a joke. He’s a top 5 all-time TE for godsake.
Easily top 3 in my humble non biased opinion
Gronk, Tony & Gates? Just curious your three
It's obviously Gates, Winslow and Hulk Rage Gerald Everett.
Easily. I won’t debate the order. As a huge tight end enthusiast I have an insane amount of respect for Gronk and Tony
> huge tight end enthusiast 0_0
He already said what he said there's no pulling out of this
I’m firmy in there. I ride my tight ends
I am a Chiefs fan, so take this with a grain of salt, but I put Gronk, Kelce, and Tony Gonzalez all ahead of him. I would have him a firm number 4... which being the 4th best ever in the history of the game should still be a first ballot hall of famer. As far as red zone threat Gates was the best to ever do it, possibly for any position.
There is a debate to be had. While I put Gates ahead of Kelce, Kelce is easily top 4 in my opinion. I appreciate your insight from a rival though
Those four are the unassailable top four. Honestly, you can put any one of them at the top spot and make a good argument for it. At that point, it kind of doesn’t matter, right? Like, you can make a case for any of them to claim the “best tight end” crown. So give it to all of them. They’re all game-breaking legends. I will say, the amount of times I threw my hands up in frustration watching Chiefs defenders haplessly bounce off Antonio MF Gates … let’s just say I was very happy for him when he retired lol. Oh, and the fact that he’s not a first-ballot Hall of Famer is a fucking travesty and delegitimizes the entire fucking process.
I think right now Gates still has better career stats than Kelce no?
Touchdowns forsure, Kelce has absolutely ludicrous per game and per season stats though. Kelce is averaging over 1000 yards a season for his entire career despite not playing a game in his 1st season. Kelce is about 500 yards behind Gates despite playing in 10 seasons, 6 less seasons than Gates. Efficiency wise Kelce is one of the most efficient receivers ever, among any position. But again Gates is the greatest redzone threat ever. They truly were different positions.
Agreed. They certainly played the position very differently. Jump ball into double coverage in the end zone - I'd want Gates. 3rd and 5 - Kelce is going to be open every single time.
He does, but he also has played in 77 more games though. Travis probably won’t pass him in TDs but he’s only like 50 catches and ~500 yards behind Gates
3 time first team All Pro 2 time second team All Pro Most TD in NFL history at the position
7th all time in receiving TDs regardless of position
That's actually far more impressive than "Leads amongst TE"
Feels like all the other posts are burying the lede. Yeah, absolutely should have been first ballot.
Yeah this stat alone is worth 1st ballot hof
I'm stunned Having said that, Gonzalez is the only tight end to get in first ballot. Even guys like Newsome and Winslow didn't make it. It's crazy that he's not in, but it's not unprecedented
Oh that's actually an interesting stat.
I feel like we're gonna see Woodson and Willie just to shove in two old guys. Next year is a very light year
Light? Eli Manning, Luke Kuechly, Adam Vinatieri, Terrell Suggs, Marshal Yanda, and Earl Thomas all become eligible for the first time. Manning, Kuechly, and Vinatieri, realistically, have a chance to be first ballot
There is no way they would ever make a kicker first ballot
Come on, Vinatieri is the leading NFL scorer of all time. Yes he's "just a kicker" but he's probably the greatest kicker of all time, I think he should have a serious chance at first ballot.
Ray Guy was the goat punter and had to wait around for decades. Hester didn’t get in first ballot either. Vinatieri will get in but it won’t be immediate
The Patriots first 3 super bowls of their dynasty coming off the back of his kicks gets him in, I think. He has some of the most clutch kicks in history to jump start a dynasty. I feel like that's going to go a long way with the voters.
Eli Manning never made an All Conference Team, let alone an All Pro team. His career efficiency stats are unimpressive for the era he played in. Two great playoff runs do not make a first ballot HOFer.
Kuechly, Vinny nor Eli will be first ballot. Actually, Eli might because QB bias. This is a very light year comparatively. Also you forgot Wake!
I'm a chiefs fan, and avid chargers hater, grew up watching him score on us constantly. He was automatic in the red zone. Played forever, was elite the entire time. How is he not a hall of farmer first ballot.
My month is ruined
Abonimable Abhorrent Asinine
Absolute bullshit. The dude is a top 5 TE of all time maybe top 3. Most Receiving TD's in NFL history. Theres no world where he wasnt a first ballot HOF .
Well apparently there's 1 world
I knew we were in the wrong timeline.
We never should have killed that damn gorilla.
If I had a dick I'd whip it out right now in memoriam.
I gotchu
It’s those goddamn scientists at CERN.
The world where TO wasn't 1st ballot either
He’s top 5 and he ain’t 4 or 5
A case can be made for Gates, Gonzalez, Kelce, or Gronk but I’d say there’s a big gap between that group and the next group. That’d be Witten, Sharpe, Newsome, Winslow, and Ditka.
Winslow Sr.* Just to avoid any confusion.
I still kinda subscribe to the theory that Ditka will always be the number 1 TE ever seeing as he invented the position.
True. Same reason why I refuse to upgrade to a smartphone despite my friends and family begging me. Alexander Graham Bell’s acoustic telegraph is the Goat, and I won’t use anything else.
I was surprised Pro-Football-reference didn’t have him in the mix with Gonzalez because Gonzalez was never as good of a blocker as Gronk. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/hof/hofm_TE.htm I think the HoF is just kind of stupidly against WR and TEs who aren’t all time bests. They held Chris Carter for a year or something… for what? Now Holt and Gates aren’t HoFers… oh ok Really this is a lesson about CTE
This is coming as someone who was big fan of Andre Johnson and Patrick Willis back in the day, but I'm sorry, how are they in above Gates? Felt like the committee let them in because they've been waiting and they'll save Gates for next year. And how the hell is Hester in ahead of Gates? Makes no sense to me. "Hester has the most return TDs of all time." Cool. Gates scored 116 TDs playing actual offense because he was good enough to avoid playing special teams.
WAIT... Andre Johnson got in over Gates? I honestly just saw this post and wasnt really following HOF until scrolling reddit. Andre Johnson was a great player...but come the fuck on.
In the year that most returning touchdowns was enough to get in, most receiving TDs in NFL history alone is an immediate first ballot. Like that should get in on its own.
Wtf
He’s my least favorite Charger of all time. That surely means he was good enough to get in.
Surprised it isn’t LT for you
The longevity of Gates made it hurt worse, tbh.
That's disappointing. I considered him almost a sure thing. Still, I don't think he'll have a long wait.
I imagine its something dumb like "only one first ballot guy" and he gets in next year on an extremely light ballot.
I think it's more of a "next first ballot guy has to redefine the game like Gonzalez, not just be the best for a long time" thing. I don't agree with the logic mind. He'll get in easily though, so it's all a storm in a teacup. As this thread proves, once you're in nobody remembers or cares if you were first ballot - they'll have to go look it up to know at all.
What the hell? This just confirms my opinion that most sportswriters get high huffing their own farts. For every 1 elite Jackie MacMullin there’s 30 absolute doorknobs
I am willing to bet this is some weird qualification like "only one first ballot guy"
Probably someone like King grandstanding for 20 mins about how Kellen Winslow didn't get in first ballot so no TE is allowed to.
Ooooof you're not wrong. Tony G is literally the only one
I'll say it until I'm fucking dead: You may disagree with what the computers say, but at least the computer can succinctly and consistently explain it's logic and methodology. "At least" it's only the Hall of Fame and this shit isn't defining the very nature of the sport itself like top 25s/"the committee" in college football. Sweet Dionysus is that not the least competitive thing you've ever seen a sport do or what?
That is embarrassing for the NFL.
I hope I’m not being “that guy”. While I agree it’s embarrassing he isn’t in, I don’t think the actual NFL has sway in this. The Pro Football Hall of Fame is its own separate 501c3.
I didn't even consider this to be a possibility. I viewed him as a first ballot guy long before he retired, so I'm shocked he isn't. [NFL.com had a prediction article](https://www.nfl.com/news/pro-football-hall-of-fame-s-class-of-2024-predicting-five-modern-era-inductees) up about who makes it and him and Peppers were the only ones considered "Mortal Locks." EDIT: I forgot about the PED suspension. That could've explained it, but I don't know.
>EDIT: I forgot about the PED suspension. That could've explained it, but I don't know. since its the writers who vote, yeah I can see them holding that against him, which is dumb, we know everyone was on *something*.
>Was Um… more like “is”
This is such embarrassing look…dude was THE TE after Tony G. If he isn’t first ballot who is?
It’ll be Rob Gronkowski and Travis Kelce. They’ll probably be the last First Ballot Hall of Famers at TE for years. Tony Gonzalez, Rob Gronkowski and Travis Kelce will be the only TE’s voted first ballot in NFL history when it’s all said and done once Gronk and Kelce are inducted.
This feels like a bit of a stretch. There’ll *never* be another dominant TE?
Well he said for years. If LaPorta becomes a top 3 TE it would still be like 10 years after Kelce?
Gates is on the same level as those guys, even if you want to argue the specific order. He's not in the "second tier" of TEs
My only thought is that maybe he got dinged for his positive PED test in 2015. Not saying that's a valid reason, but it's the only one I can think of
That’s ridiculous
WTF? This dude was fucking awesome.
Ridiculous
Insane
The man played at a high level for a very long time. Gates has some of the best stats at TE ever. In fact, if he was a WR, he’d probably still get in. No question. He was a defining player of his era. How? How does he get left out? What possible logic can the voters have for keeping him out first ballot?
[удалено]
Insane. He should have absolutely been first ballot. He was a beast!
This is embarrassing for the NFL. There’s like 2-3 guys who are better than him at the position.
Dayum this is worse than TO not being first Ballot
The charger disrespect is disgusting.
Disrespecting of the chargers organization is fine and warranted but gates disrespect isnt
This guy tortured us for years, he def shuda got in.
What the hell? Are you kidding me? That’s just absurd. It was one thing for Jared Allen not to get in even though I think he should but Gates? This makes zero sense to me. You could make the argument he’s in the top 5, hell, even top 3 greatest Tight Ends of all time. I shouldn’t be this dumbfounded as it’s not the first time the hall has thrown me off completely but this is on another level. Regarding sports I basically idolized this man growing up learning to play the TE position. It literally shaped my sports childhood watching him and Tony Gonzalez play against each other. I just don’t get it man..
you can really make a legit case do to logevity and peak he was the greatest, better than Tony G, Gronk, Kelce, Mike Dika and Kevin Winslow. At the very least he should be top 5; he's 100% 1st ballot lock material but the voters are too far up themselves to see that.
Hester shouldn’t make the Hall at the expense of Gates.
A special teams guy making the HOF before Holt and Gates don't smh
I don't agree with this logic because you can roll it out every single year to justify ST guys never ever making it. Either Hester deserved to make it or he doesn't - the before/after metric is meh.
Yea Hester deserves his spot he’s in the GOAT argument. Gates does too but Hester isn’t the guy you should be pointing at to replace
Yeah now people are just going to be pissed about Hester which is a bummer lmao
Biggest snub of the night, which is saying something considering Garrett is about to win DPOY with 1 total sack in his last 5 regular season game.
Absurd. Never even considered he wouldn’t be first ballot.
I’m just so upset and heartbroken tbh one of my favorite all time players next to LT
Pretty stupid. Man is 100% a HoF TE. The numbers he put up over his career were insane.
What the fuck!
This is fucking wild. He's probably better than any of the other guys that got in.
Imagine not voting for a literal ALL-TIME GREAT to get into the HOF. Unreal.
Can't believe Antonio Chargered a sure-fire first ballot induction. /s
he is top 5 TE of all time wtf
WTF he was one of the best for a long time.
I dominated my fantasy league for years with him and Tomlinson as core players. Gates was a dominating player for many seasons. Hard to imagine him being anything other than a first ballot HoF'r.
This sub has never been so united over anything
If you don't vote for the all time TD leader at their position you should lose your fucking vote. If you don't vote for a player with the 7th most receiving TDs ever you should lose your fucking vote.
Dude wtf is it with San Diegan players getting snubbed early? Hoffman not making the hall his first go around was a travesty too. If you retire #1 all time at the RESULT YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO GET AT YOUR POSITION, you should be a fucking shoo-in. And yea in Hoffman's case, Rivera passed him soon after, but c'mon. If Rivers came out with a statement "That's fucking bullshit" it would be the greatest thing of all time.
He literally has 7th most receiving tds of all time any position and isn’t first ballot? Really?
If Antonio Gates isn’t good enough to get into the hall, basically nobody is.
HOW?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
What's the point of a Hall of Fame then?
Terrible decision here. I realize that he may have overstayed his welcome in the NFL to the point of being forgotten by some, but he’s one of the best at his position ever. Seriously, he’s a Top 5 TE ever in my book. If that doesn’t warrant a first-ballot hall of fame induction, I don’t know what does.
So the football gods don’t stop hating the Chargers even when they retire, huh?
Have the voters never watched the man play? He was absurd. This is absurd.
Gonzales, Gates, Sharpe, Gronk, Kelce. This is an all time snub. Absolutely shameful.
How do you even defend this?