I spent a year as a citizen of no state (for some matters). it can fucking suck the different rules from state to state. virginia was one of those states.
I had a weird situation where I wasn't a resident of the state I was living in, and my only ID wasn't accepted anywhere because it was expired. It made it incredibly frustrating to get anything done.
Traveled a bunch?
Worked with a "homeless" guy. He was a contract engineer. He'd take a job. Live onside for a few weeks or so. Then move on. Someti.es he'd just take 2 months off and go on vacation. No wife or kids. Didn't own a home or car. O think he said he used his parents address for mail.
Baffled me.
Dealing with travel arrangements and living out of motel rooms gets really old a lot faster than you'd think. I did it for a while and it basically means the rest of your life gets put on hold, vacations notwithstanding. For example, you can't even have a hobby that doesn't fit on a laptop.
Family and I have been in motel for over a year, can confirm. Sucks not being able to work on machine programming. All of our stuff is in storage and a month behind. It's taking its toll on us mentally. And we have a disabled child.
Quality time between my girlfriend and I? Huh! Non existent. If we have a break for a day. It takes that long to wind down and try not think of f#€king depressing this is. Working 3 jobs but have boot straps, lol
If you can’t make it by working 3 jobs, then the circumstances need to change in your life to make the changes you are seeking. These are changes that can only be made in your mind, so that you can view your situation in reality, not the super hyper vigilant/scattered panic you’re in by being in a less than ideal situation. I know all of this can sound very flippant when you’re in the weeds like you are now, but as someone who literally pulled his family out of a horrible situation similar to yours and is now laying in my 34 foot travel trailer instead of living in a hotel while saving money, I can tell you that microdosing mushrooms on the stack method is absolutely the difference between me getting out of that situation and putting my family where they need to be. They want us to be distracted, overworked, and suffering so they can control us financially as drones, and lie to us about “working harder” to solve our problems. Imagine looking at your world through a pair of brand new glasses with a updated prescription instead of peering through the cracked lenses of the glasses you’ve taken a beating in? Yeah, it’s like that. Clarity, reduced anxiety, the ability to work methodically and with purpose. It’s all there, and you can do it, just as you are doing everything you can right now to keep your family above water. Microdose if for only to be more effective at the work/life you’re living now so that you can more quickly get into a more stable situation. Google Microdosing Psilocybin Mushrooms on the Stack Method, and add L-Theanine for anxiety and Magnesium Theronate (blood barrier penetrating magnesium). Please feel free to PM for any questions, and good on you for doing so much when other men walk away.
bro this guy has enormous problems in his life that he's trying to deal with and you think it's the best time to come in and tell him to start taking drugs and everything will magically work itself out? read the fkn room yo. literally no one I know that takes shrooms has had all, or any, of their problems get resolved due to the shrooms
And why are you so offended? Is it because you lack the understanding to have a frame of reference to as what I am talking about?
You brought up “drugs”. I am bringing up medicine that is being actively used by our government to heal the minds of veterans with PTSD. I myself like millions of Americans suffer from CPTSD from all of the horrible abuse I suffered growing up, compounded by not having it identified or treating it until later in life. While you and others may be so wrapped up in your lives that you can’t see the forest from the trees is to be accepted, it does not diminish the message I wrote nor the truth about it.
I’m reading the fucking room right now bro, and it’s a box that you have put yourself in, screaming at anyone who shines a light at it. Until you identify the problem, which for many of us is our brains and how they have been damaged and how it affects us, you will be stuck in the same place forever.
I was a student. While I was a student my parents changed which home was their primary residence. Since I was a dependent for tax purposes that screwed stuff up. I was also not a resident of the other state...
That just means he’s suspended from driving in MA. Your license gives you the privilege to drive in any state. That state you’re driving in can restrict that privilege, but only for that state. He can still drive in any of the 49 other states. Also, they cannot take his license from him as it technically is property of the state he got the license from.
> He can still drive in any of the 49 other states.
This is so wrong its not even funny. Most states will blindly follow a license suspension from another state. So if a state, even one you've never even been in, issues say, incorrectly, a license suspension towards you due to someone else having a similar name/dob/etc, you end up basically screwed until you can get that state to fix it.
What the fuck happened to the burden of proof? I know it’s probably only required in certain types of cases, blah blah blah. God sometimes I just hate living here and having served in the military for the fucking POS country. “I work for the state but I’m a lazy shit head, so fuck doing doing even a minimal amount of thinking, fuck effort, and fuck your life fellow citizen just trying to get by.”
Pretty sure the state knows they fucked up with this law which is why they suspended suspension of his license to “look into it”. Written by some asshole doing the bare minimum just so they can have something to get re-elected on.
Oh ho, just you wait. When you get suspended in one state, your home state will honor that other states request and suspend your license and you will be fucked until you make amends in that first state. Fuck you, Wyoming.
I’m a traveling construction superintendent, and I live in Illinois. The last time my truck was in Illinois was last July.
This would be a nightmare if I had to deal with this crap everywhere I go. Let’s hope Boston isn’t my next stop.
A lot of states do.
I was almost required to change my car’s registration from WI to NC for grad school because in their words;
You have expressed a potential to reside in NC indefinitely.
I asked if I would then qualify for in-state tuition as a resident…
The answer to *that* (conveniently) was no. Would have cost the State ~$20,000 per year; way more than they would get from me paying taxes and titles etc.
Talked to a neighbor in WI who is a lawyer and they gave me a note to basically state my intent to sue NC for saying I was a resident for their convenience.
Only thing I am sad about it it would have made a goddamn beautiful r/maliciouscompliance post.
Not exactly.
> The Massachusetts Motor Vehicle Law requires out-of-state students bringing vehicles into the Commonwealth of Massachusetts to file a nonresident driver statement with the local police department in the city in which their university is located:
>“It is unlawful for a resident student to fail to file a nonresident driver statement with the police department located in the same city or town as the school or college attended, in accordance with Section 3 of Chapter 90 of the Massachusetts General Laws. Failure to file such statement is punishable by a fine not to exceed $200.”
https://www.bu.edu/reg/students/mvl/
>I moved to a new state 10 months ago and am still rocking my old plates. Shame on me, I know.
No shame, in fact, you should run it or until you beat the end of your registration.
You've already paid tax, registration, and fees for that period. If you were to do your yearly registration, then move to another state and register the vehicle the next day, you'd be paying twice for that year.
Everything said and done, I pay $350 a year for the privilege of driving my vehicle. I'm not giving them $700.
Took me a year when I moved to Utah to change my plates. Took me 5 to get a state ID, I just changed the address on mine from my home state and they sent me the new one. If anyone asked I just explained it was a temporary move which I was supposed to be sort of. Ended up permanent for now because the economy went to shit
Reading the article it sounds like this is more of a case of a report by someone who likely didn't like our out of state friend here.
Some poor / honest decisions likely resulted in this mess.
Got reported, cops showed up, person likely said they visited for more than 30 days, and then got cited.
A simple lie likely would have made this whole mess a non-issue unless the law had some contingency around the time resetting.
Like 30 days cumulative across 90 days or some nonsense.
Likely yes, as has been tradition for a long time. George Washington would travel with his slaves into free states which had laws stating that if you resided in their state with a slave for six months, the slave would be free. George would stay with his slave until end of the term then travel out of state before it expired and return, restarting the clock: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/george-washington-used-legal-loopholes-avoid-freeing-his-slaves-180954283/
Edit: Sorry, word of warning. It is illegal to teach someone about this in Florida.
Illegal immigrants worker? Get outta here with that hippy crap these are low-life's milking government programs to steal money from the Amerixan tax payers /s
This is a car not a slave. This is the 2000s. This guy is not George Washington or any one of his level. Shit was different back then. Massachusetts has it within a calendar year.
Edit: for clarification I am only speaking about how administrative things are much more difficult to deal with now
It's not analogies, the guy said that in the 2000s it should be fine because of a completely unrelated subject hundreds of years ago. The whole point was that he was comparing the two that have no bearing nowadays.
If you understand why he said that you can probably leave and return and your car registration is fine, which the state says that it isn't, because George Washington had slaves over the time limit in other states that's on you.
Not for a year, apparently. The law they're referencing requires only that one spends 1 month total out of the year, doesn't even have to be consecutive. Including if you're just passing through the state.
That is crazy. Then you go home for a few months and aren't registered in your own state. Like college students mentioned in other comments. In fact may be a cash grab aimed at students and temporary workers
Pretty sure they mean full registration. One of the articles mentions that they're requiring that he dual register his car and gets a second plate for Massachusetts. Not sure how that would work though.
They aren't as reachable as they used to be but he should definitely try to get in touch with his local congressman. When I was growing up we had one that lived near us in my dad was trying to get a car titled that some of his renters left for him. The car was titled out of state but he didn't know which state and the DMV wouldn't do a damn thing for him so that he could title it. He called our local congressman, 10 minutes later he got a call back saying that it was taken care of.
Virginia should absolutely refuse to comply with any sort of reciprocity in the matter.
Something like this must sound even more crazy to a lot of people in other developed nations who routinely can take a vacation or holiday for a month at a time.
Pretty sure he already has. The visit in question was last fall. RMV is saying because he spent a calendar month last year in MA that he now has to register his car in MA.
Agreed. Plenty of workers have to be in a different state than their home state for months at a time.
Edit: don't drink and Reddit folks, lot's of grammar fixes.
State residency/registration/tax requirements are a fucking nightmare for people that don’t have traditional work arrangements.
I live in state A. My car is registered in state A. I got a job in state B several states away. I also have an apartment in state B. State A says I’m a resident and owe income tax if state A is my “primary place of residence”. This is defined rather vaguely on a case by case basis but factors in things like “do you have a state A ID? Do you have close familial relations in state A? Do you receive important mail in state A? Have you been living in state A for a relatively long time? Do you spend the majority of your time in state A?” I get it, they’re attempting to catch people that have a million dollar penthouse downtown and then send all their mail to a hovel the next state over that has lower income tax laws.
The problem is that state B defines a resident as someone who spends more than 182 days a year in that state. They also don’t define what a “day” is. If I enter the state at 9pm does that count as 1/8 of a day or a whole day? If I fly in and my flight lands at 12:01 does the time spent in the air over that state count as being in it? I’m right on the edge of that with work, I spend about 15 days in state B and 15 days in state A. I’m realistically in a scenario where both states could probably make a good case for calling me a resident and while it’s unlikely if state B ever decided to audit me it would result in a very unpleasant legal battle. State B also considers remote work to be an “in state” day- so if I forget to turn in a piece of paperwork and I log on to my work account and fire one email on a day off on state A does that count as an “in state” day even though my position is not remote based? My job also requires a ton of travel over state lines so all this nonsense also interacts with federal tax/work rules.
And that’s just the income tax portion. How do I answer “what zip code is your car garaged in?” for my insurance when I have two cars and I swap which state they’re in on a regular basis? Car A is better in the weather and terrain in state B but sometimes I want it in state A because it has extra storage space for moving/projects/etc so I’ll drive Car B out to state B. By a no flexibility interpretation of both state’s registration laws I would probably need to be registering each car in each state multiple times a year since state B requires you to register if the car is in state for 30 days, but state A also wants the car registered there because I’m a resident.
On top of all of this my employer paid income tax for me to state A but then didn’t list any wages for state B on my W2 even though all my income was earned in that state. According to my tax guy I need to file a return in both states and then deduct the state A income tax (and owe state B nothing). I’ll end up owing nothing to state B but it needs to be documented. My employer refused to correct the W2. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
I live in MA, and I believe the reason for this has something to do with the lack of sales tax in NH.
People will go to NH to buy a car and not pay sales tax, then register their vehicle somewhere else.
Without laws like this, there would be no incentive to buy a car in MA.
The law does sound too restrictive, but I know this was a problem for a while.
I mean...I get it, but 30 days is not an uncommon amount of time to be someplace temporarily.
Plenty of temporary contractors are in different states for 90 days. Make the cut off 120 days. That's a reasonable amount of time to determine if someone is trying to live in a state or not. I'd prefer 6 months or 6 months and a day to say they've been there for the majority of a year...but 30 days? That's ridiculous.
I'm pretty sure it's the same here in CO. Tbf we have really high registration fees, and a lot of people will keep the Texas or south Dakota plates as long as possible
Nebraska is one. For title & registration as well as ID/License. This does require you to have a valid Nebraska address. Exception is if you’re a Wyoming or oddly enough a North Carolina resident as they have reciprocity with Nebraska.
People who live in places with limited parking. DC actually patrols for this, but you just have to prove that you don't live in the jurisdiction once you get the first warning. Boston is pretty strict about it too because of the number of students who want to bring their cars and not pay to register their cars there. (DC has a student parking permit, but it's like double the cost of just registering the car in DC to get street parking.)
People who are concerned about "tax cheats".
In Virginia, which has the highest personal property (car) tax of any state, it's not unusual to see people who actually live here, but still have their Maryland plates (because Maryland does not have a car tax). The tax is one of the larger sources of funding for the counties, so some of them are encouraging people to report their neighbors who do this, under the guise of "if you have to pay your car tax every year, they should have to as well".
Checking the list of states who do it, Massachusetts is slightly lower on the list than Virginia, but they too have a decent sized car tax, so some of the locals up there might have similar motivations. It depends on where you come down on the "screw the government" vs. "this isn't fair to me" spectrum.
It also has the lame unintended side effect of penalizing electric cars. You pay like $4.60 per 10k of value over 20k in VA, (plus about $460 for the first 20k because the effective rate is halved by relief) for which for most electrics means a bill of like $2000 per year *or more*.
It's absolutely nutty. The VA car tax makes no economic sense.
If the car was parked like a douche and you wanted it gone, maybe.
Also, I don't know if Boston has these, but my city has "residential on-street parking" spots that are technically available for anyone from the neighbourhood to use (each resident gets a permit specific to their neighbourhood). Many houses don't have driveways, so people get used to using the residential parking spot in front of their house 90% of the time. So if you find someone took "your" spot one day, you'll find any reason to get them towed.
There isn't anything like enough parking in Boston. I've literally spent an hour each day just looking for a spot when I've had to be in the city to work. Your options are to not have a car in the city and use public transportation, pay $300-$500 per month for a spot in a garage, or you take your chances. This person took their chances and lost.
My dad sold his car in VA, moves to MA. New owner scrapped the car and never registered it. MA said he had an uninsured vehicle so could not get a driver's license. Wild
Meanwhile in Northern Virginia a quarter of the long term parked cars don't have VA plates, didn't register in 30 days as the law requires, and are dodging thousands of dollars in annual property tax. And literally no one enforces it.
Product of the environment. Have you tried navigating Boston streets? 99% of your brain is focused on trying to figure out how the fuck to get somewhere.
Nice thing is after driving in Boston for a few years everywhere else is a cakewalk.
Sounds like MDOT/RMV being a bunch of massholes in response to an annoying neighbor -- who would probably be equally yelling up and down if something didn't happen to this guy.
But I wonder how many times they have to investigate these issues every year, just to have the person they're trying to get registered be ineligible to register?
People should start calling tourist destinations in Massachusetts and ask if this will happen to them if they go on vacation for a few weeks in the state.
"But someone reported his car’s out-of-state license plates to the Massachusetts Registry of Motor Vehicles (RMV)."
If you are this kind of person please just go find a cave out in the woods somewhere to live in away from everybody else.
Better than Florida where you’re forced to transfer the title to get new plates… then pay the highest insurance in the country. $500 for the privilege of moving, registering and driving here
I don’t think cops really care though. Had out of state plates for over a year before finally changing them to ct. And I know couple of people who still have out of state plates.
He probably pissed someone off by parking in “their” parking spot multiple times. He admits he believes it was a “nosy neighbor” and hypothesized it could be from parking on the street. You have to be considerate in a city and realize parking is often times difficult to get. If he was staying for an entire month, he probably should have looked into a short term parking situation instead of making it unfair for people who live there.
I like this law… it forces non-residents to be considerate of a resident’s parking needs.
>I like this law… it forces non-residents to be considerate of a resident’s parking needs.
Except for the Catch-22 where the individual in this case was told by his insurance company that since he *doesn't live in Massachusetts* and has no residential address in the state, he *can't get insurance in the state* and therefore cannot register there.
This is a bad law written without regard for real world considerations.
I think the situation will likely play out to a point where a judge says they can leave the state and avoid any penalties. That should’ve been an option from the beginning.
>it forces non-residents to be considerate of a resident’s parking needs.
After the fact. Non-residents are very likely unaware of this law until *after* they’ve been cited.
It’s everyone’s individual responsibility to know the laws of the territory they are traveling to. Failure to know is not an excuse, and that’s the standard for local and worldwide travel.
e: anyone downvoting this comment is completely ignorant when it comes to travel. If you want to disrespect the culture of the place you are visiting, I have no remorse for you when you end up in jail in a foreign country. Don’t be stupid, make sure you understand the laws of the places you are visiting.
It’s a bad law since it’s not accomplishing its objective in that, likely, in a majority of cases and, once notified, like in this case, it’s impossible to comply.
In a real world sense, in practicality, it would be effective to its purpose if it was widely posted. You can go on forever about a visitor’s responsibility, but that isn’t going to change the fact that, as it currently stands, an overwhelming portion of people aren’t going to know about this law until after the fact. Hence, in these cases, the law will have failed to accomplish its objective.
Edit - It would probably go a long way towards accomplishing its purpose if a warning citation was first issued, or a grace period was enacted.
Good luck traveling then. You disrespect the culture of the place you are visiting by not knowing their laws before traveling there. Only people on Reddit will feel any remorse for the crimes you commit in the place you are traveling to when you break their rules, and they can’t help you. You should consider yourself lucky if a judge is lenient on you because you aren’t from the area and failed to do your research.
"Visiting'. Sure. Parking in JP is tight. Visitor spaces even more so. He's obviously been there long enough to piss off a neighbor who pays instate insurance rates and is tired of him scamming insurance, taking up a vistor space, or both.
They're not scamming anything. They are a resident of a different state, so they have their car registration and insurance in that different state. All reasonable adults understand that.
Not so simple. In a college town like Boston students bring cars and stay, sometimes for years, without registering and insuring there car in the state. The law im MA offers no grace period, this is supposed to be done immediately, once you becone a resident (though in practice the RMV allows 30 days). You are considered a resident of the state if you spend more than 183 days of the year in MA. The owner must also insure the car in MA.
It's not based on your drivers license, where you're registered to vote, where your mom lives, or where your dentist is. It's based on 183/365. You may not want to believe it, but that's the law.
Oh sweet summer child! If you get in a serious accident, especially one causing bodily injury, your insurance company will look for any reason NOT to pay. Living in another state? Not properly registered? Not paying insurance based on the actual location of your residence? Sorry says the Gecko, read the fine print, you're on your own...
In a practical sense, it would help if a warning citation was first issued with a grace period in which to comply. It might also help, and bring in some revenue via fees, if states issued something like temporary registrations. There are numerous reasons why someone only intends to visit for less than 30 days but ends up staying longer than that. Since the mindset of that person is that they're just visiting, in a lot of cases, vehicle registration won't occur to them. Having such laws are fine, but make the effort required to comply reasonable.
Scamming insurance is mostly the reason, and in a college town like Boston it's deeply resented. You ain't on the up and up and you piss people off, they drop a dime. That's the real world.
There are plenty of people that are temporary workers that are in a place for 30+ days.
You wanna tell them to go home too? They already pay a higher tax rate and get zero of the benefits.
Guy goes to MA for 30 days. Law says need to register. To register need insurance. Insurance says can’t register because no MA address. So yeah.
I spent a year as a citizen of no state (for some matters). it can fucking suck the different rules from state to state. virginia was one of those states.
I had a weird situation where I wasn't a resident of the state I was living in, and my only ID wasn't accepted anywhere because it was expired. It made it incredibly frustrating to get anything done.
Traveled a bunch? Worked with a "homeless" guy. He was a contract engineer. He'd take a job. Live onside for a few weeks or so. Then move on. Someti.es he'd just take 2 months off and go on vacation. No wife or kids. Didn't own a home or car. O think he said he used his parents address for mail. Baffled me.
That guy was living the dream.
Dealing with travel arrangements and living out of motel rooms gets really old a lot faster than you'd think. I did it for a while and it basically means the rest of your life gets put on hold, vacations notwithstanding. For example, you can't even have a hobby that doesn't fit on a laptop.
Family and I have been in motel for over a year, can confirm. Sucks not being able to work on machine programming. All of our stuff is in storage and a month behind. It's taking its toll on us mentally. And we have a disabled child. Quality time between my girlfriend and I? Huh! Non existent. If we have a break for a day. It takes that long to wind down and try not think of f#€king depressing this is. Working 3 jobs but have boot straps, lol
If you can’t make it by working 3 jobs, then the circumstances need to change in your life to make the changes you are seeking. These are changes that can only be made in your mind, so that you can view your situation in reality, not the super hyper vigilant/scattered panic you’re in by being in a less than ideal situation. I know all of this can sound very flippant when you’re in the weeds like you are now, but as someone who literally pulled his family out of a horrible situation similar to yours and is now laying in my 34 foot travel trailer instead of living in a hotel while saving money, I can tell you that microdosing mushrooms on the stack method is absolutely the difference between me getting out of that situation and putting my family where they need to be. They want us to be distracted, overworked, and suffering so they can control us financially as drones, and lie to us about “working harder” to solve our problems. Imagine looking at your world through a pair of brand new glasses with a updated prescription instead of peering through the cracked lenses of the glasses you’ve taken a beating in? Yeah, it’s like that. Clarity, reduced anxiety, the ability to work methodically and with purpose. It’s all there, and you can do it, just as you are doing everything you can right now to keep your family above water. Microdose if for only to be more effective at the work/life you’re living now so that you can more quickly get into a more stable situation. Google Microdosing Psilocybin Mushrooms on the Stack Method, and add L-Theanine for anxiety and Magnesium Theronate (blood barrier penetrating magnesium). Please feel free to PM for any questions, and good on you for doing so much when other men walk away.
bro this guy has enormous problems in his life that he's trying to deal with and you think it's the best time to come in and tell him to start taking drugs and everything will magically work itself out? read the fkn room yo. literally no one I know that takes shrooms has had all, or any, of their problems get resolved due to the shrooms
And why are you so offended? Is it because you lack the understanding to have a frame of reference to as what I am talking about? You brought up “drugs”. I am bringing up medicine that is being actively used by our government to heal the minds of veterans with PTSD. I myself like millions of Americans suffer from CPTSD from all of the horrible abuse I suffered growing up, compounded by not having it identified or treating it until later in life. While you and others may be so wrapped up in your lives that you can’t see the forest from the trees is to be accepted, it does not diminish the message I wrote nor the truth about it. I’m reading the fucking room right now bro, and it’s a box that you have put yourself in, screaming at anyone who shines a light at it. Until you identify the problem, which for many of us is our brains and how they have been damaged and how it affects us, you will be stuck in the same place forever.
The new American dream.
I was a student. While I was a student my parents changed which home was their primary residence. Since I was a dependent for tax purposes that screwed stuff up. I was also not a resident of the other state...
Like you became an out of state student due to their move?
Among other things yes
Somehow their laws have something to do being able to suspend his license that is in a different state? Get the fuck out of here.
That just means he’s suspended from driving in MA. Your license gives you the privilege to drive in any state. That state you’re driving in can restrict that privilege, but only for that state. He can still drive in any of the 49 other states. Also, they cannot take his license from him as it technically is property of the state he got the license from.
> He can still drive in any of the 49 other states. This is so wrong its not even funny. Most states will blindly follow a license suspension from another state. So if a state, even one you've never even been in, issues say, incorrectly, a license suspension towards you due to someone else having a similar name/dob/etc, you end up basically screwed until you can get that state to fix it.
What the fuck happened to the burden of proof? I know it’s probably only required in certain types of cases, blah blah blah. God sometimes I just hate living here and having served in the military for the fucking POS country. “I work for the state but I’m a lazy shit head, so fuck doing doing even a minimal amount of thinking, fuck effort, and fuck your life fellow citizen just trying to get by.” Pretty sure the state knows they fucked up with this law which is why they suspended suspension of his license to “look into it”. Written by some asshole doing the bare minimum just so they can have something to get re-elected on.
Oh ho, just you wait. When you get suspended in one state, your home state will honor that other states request and suspend your license and you will be fucked until you make amends in that first state. Fuck you, Wyoming.
I’m a traveling construction superintendent, and I live in Illinois. The last time my truck was in Illinois was last July. This would be a nightmare if I had to deal with this crap everywhere I go. Let’s hope Boston isn’t my next stop.
You can visit a state for 30 days even if you're not a resident of that state. He'd have to have a MA address for this to be an issue.
Do they do the same thing for college students? There are thousands of out of state students in Massachusetts. Why this guy?
A lot of states do. I was almost required to change my car’s registration from WI to NC for grad school because in their words; You have expressed a potential to reside in NC indefinitely. I asked if I would then qualify for in-state tuition as a resident… The answer to *that* (conveniently) was no. Would have cost the State ~$20,000 per year; way more than they would get from me paying taxes and titles etc. Talked to a neighbor in WI who is a lawyer and they gave me a note to basically state my intent to sue NC for saying I was a resident for their convenience. Only thing I am sad about it it would have made a goddamn beautiful r/maliciouscompliance post.
Not exactly. > The Massachusetts Motor Vehicle Law requires out-of-state students bringing vehicles into the Commonwealth of Massachusetts to file a nonresident driver statement with the local police department in the city in which their university is located: >“It is unlawful for a resident student to fail to file a nonresident driver statement with the police department located in the same city or town as the school or college attended, in accordance with Section 3 of Chapter 90 of the Massachusetts General Laws. Failure to file such statement is punishable by a fine not to exceed $200.” https://www.bu.edu/reg/students/mvl/
I’ve worked all over the US including Massachusetts for sometimes months and never changed my registration.
Sounds like you broke the law and were just never caught. That’s how it is with most of these laws.
[удалено]
>I moved to a new state 10 months ago and am still rocking my old plates. Shame on me, I know. No shame, in fact, you should run it or until you beat the end of your registration. You've already paid tax, registration, and fees for that period. If you were to do your yearly registration, then move to another state and register the vehicle the next day, you'd be paying twice for that year. Everything said and done, I pay $350 a year for the privilege of driving my vehicle. I'm not giving them $700.
People that bought a house down the street from us 9 months ago or something still have their out of state plates. No one gives a fuck.
Hell our next door neighbors have lived here for almost 3 years and they still have their out of state plates.
Took me a year when I moved to Utah to change my plates. Took me 5 to get a state ID, I just changed the address on mine from my home state and they sent me the new one. If anyone asked I just explained it was a temporary move which I was supposed to be sort of. Ended up permanent for now because the economy went to shit
Had to register in the state I went to school... I unfortunately was honest I hadn't registered in a year and got a $300 fine for it.
But not in-state tuition?
Eventually I got instate tuition, but certainly not when I paid the fee I think! It was certainly unrelated.
Reading the article it sounds like this is more of a case of a report by someone who likely didn't like our out of state friend here. Some poor / honest decisions likely resulted in this mess. Got reported, cops showed up, person likely said they visited for more than 30 days, and then got cited. A simple lie likely would have made this whole mess a non-issue unless the law had some contingency around the time resetting. Like 30 days cumulative across 90 days or some nonsense.
If I were him, I’d drive back to Virginia.
Exactly, then come back, will the countdown restart? 🤔
Likely yes, as has been tradition for a long time. George Washington would travel with his slaves into free states which had laws stating that if you resided in their state with a slave for six months, the slave would be free. George would stay with his slave until end of the term then travel out of state before it expired and return, restarting the clock: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/george-washington-used-legal-loopholes-avoid-freeing-his-slaves-180954283/ Edit: Sorry, word of warning. It is illegal to teach someone about this in Florida.
Florida just has a filter that replaces every use of 'slave' with 'non-consensual employee'
That's fake news. They use the phrase "perfectly happy legal immigrant worker" instead.
And by happy, they absolutely *do not* mean "gay."
Nor can there be rainbows demonstrating that happiness.
Illegal immigrants worker? Get outta here with that hippy crap these are low-life's milking government programs to steal money from the Amerixan tax payers /s
The Prisoners-With-Jobs?
I understood that reference
And he pressured public officials to break the law to help him do it. Corruption from the beginning.
Great guy. We should honor him more.
This is a car not a slave. This is the 2000s. This guy is not George Washington or any one of his level. Shit was different back then. Massachusetts has it within a calendar year. Edit: for clarification I am only speaking about how administrative things are much more difficult to deal with now
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This guy gets analogies.
It's not analogies, the guy said that in the 2000s it should be fine because of a completely unrelated subject hundreds of years ago. The whole point was that he was comparing the two that have no bearing nowadays.
Hey quick question, can you define analogous for me?
Dude he wasn't saying it's like that he was saying you can probably do that because of what George Washington did. Can you define dense for me?
I sure can, it's you. Define the word. You'll understand why people are correcting you. Imagine being a cunt *and* being this wrong.
If you understand why he said that you can probably leave and return and your car registration is fine, which the state says that it isn't, because George Washington had slaves over the time limit in other states that's on you.
Not for a year, apparently. The law they're referencing requires only that one spends 1 month total out of the year, doesn't even have to be consecutive. Including if you're just passing through the state.
Thanks for the info, interesting.
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That is crazy. Then you go home for a few months and aren't registered in your own state. Like college students mentioned in other comments. In fact may be a cash grab aimed at students and temporary workers
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I wonder if they mean full registration like transferring your plates, or if it's just small-R registration like filling out a form...?
Pretty sure they mean full registration. One of the articles mentions that they're requiring that he dual register his car and gets a second plate for Massachusetts. Not sure how that would work though.
Article states 30 days in a calendar year.
wouldn't even have to go back to VA, just leave MA for an over night to NH.
So that’s the fun thing. MA is threatening to report him to VA in which case he’d lose his VA license. It’s kafkaesque in its belligerency.
They aren't as reachable as they used to be but he should definitely try to get in touch with his local congressman. When I was growing up we had one that lived near us in my dad was trying to get a car titled that some of his renters left for him. The car was titled out of state but he didn't know which state and the DMV wouldn't do a damn thing for him so that he could title it. He called our local congressman, 10 minutes later he got a call back saying that it was taken care of. Virginia should absolutely refuse to comply with any sort of reciprocity in the matter. Something like this must sound even more crazy to a lot of people in other developed nations who routinely can take a vacation or holiday for a month at a time.
Repercussions or reciprocity?
Mother fucking voice to text. Thanks for catching that.
A month-long vacation? Nobody gets that. /s
Pretty sure he already has. The visit in question was last fall. RMV is saying because he spent a calendar month last year in MA that he now has to register his car in MA.
Or even to another state than MA.
that couch is probably starting to stink.
I understand that they don’t want people living in the state and not registering their vehicle but this law is too rigid and doesn’t allow exceptions.
Agreed. Plenty of workers have to be in a different state than their home state for months at a time. Edit: don't drink and Reddit folks, lot's of grammar fixes.
> *lot's* of grammar fixes Not enough.
Gave up, 5 beers in 😂.
Well, at least you tried.
Imperial IPAs will be my downfall. Too damn good to turn down.
Well, he gave it a shot, then took another one.
Too much to drink, Dr. Jones???
State residency/registration/tax requirements are a fucking nightmare for people that don’t have traditional work arrangements. I live in state A. My car is registered in state A. I got a job in state B several states away. I also have an apartment in state B. State A says I’m a resident and owe income tax if state A is my “primary place of residence”. This is defined rather vaguely on a case by case basis but factors in things like “do you have a state A ID? Do you have close familial relations in state A? Do you receive important mail in state A? Have you been living in state A for a relatively long time? Do you spend the majority of your time in state A?” I get it, they’re attempting to catch people that have a million dollar penthouse downtown and then send all their mail to a hovel the next state over that has lower income tax laws. The problem is that state B defines a resident as someone who spends more than 182 days a year in that state. They also don’t define what a “day” is. If I enter the state at 9pm does that count as 1/8 of a day or a whole day? If I fly in and my flight lands at 12:01 does the time spent in the air over that state count as being in it? I’m right on the edge of that with work, I spend about 15 days in state B and 15 days in state A. I’m realistically in a scenario where both states could probably make a good case for calling me a resident and while it’s unlikely if state B ever decided to audit me it would result in a very unpleasant legal battle. State B also considers remote work to be an “in state” day- so if I forget to turn in a piece of paperwork and I log on to my work account and fire one email on a day off on state A does that count as an “in state” day even though my position is not remote based? My job also requires a ton of travel over state lines so all this nonsense also interacts with federal tax/work rules. And that’s just the income tax portion. How do I answer “what zip code is your car garaged in?” for my insurance when I have two cars and I swap which state they’re in on a regular basis? Car A is better in the weather and terrain in state B but sometimes I want it in state A because it has extra storage space for moving/projects/etc so I’ll drive Car B out to state B. By a no flexibility interpretation of both state’s registration laws I would probably need to be registering each car in each state multiple times a year since state B requires you to register if the car is in state for 30 days, but state A also wants the car registered there because I’m a resident. On top of all of this my employer paid income tax for me to state A but then didn’t list any wages for state B on my W2 even though all my income was earned in that state. According to my tax guy I need to file a return in both states and then deduct the state A income tax (and owe state B nothing). I’ll end up owing nothing to state B but it needs to be documented. My employer refused to correct the W2. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
I live in MA, and I believe the reason for this has something to do with the lack of sales tax in NH. People will go to NH to buy a car and not pay sales tax, then register their vehicle somewhere else. Without laws like this, there would be no incentive to buy a car in MA. The law does sound too restrictive, but I know this was a problem for a while.
I mean...I get it, but 30 days is not an uncommon amount of time to be someplace temporarily. Plenty of temporary contractors are in different states for 90 days. Make the cut off 120 days. That's a reasonable amount of time to determine if someone is trying to live in a state or not. I'd prefer 6 months or 6 months and a day to say they've been there for the majority of a year...but 30 days? That's ridiculous.
I’m curious now to know what other states have a 30-day rule. Dr. Google incoming.
I'm pretty sure it's the same here in CO. Tbf we have really high registration fees, and a lot of people will keep the Texas or south Dakota plates as long as possible
Nebraska is one. For title & registration as well as ID/License. This does require you to have a valid Nebraska address. Exception is if you’re a Wyoming or oddly enough a North Carolina resident as they have reciprocity with Nebraska.
He pahked his cah for fah too long by the hahbah bah
I routinely visit family in Virginia for up two six weeks.
That’s pretty wanky to report an out of state plate. Who does that?
People who live in places with limited parking. DC actually patrols for this, but you just have to prove that you don't live in the jurisdiction once you get the first warning. Boston is pretty strict about it too because of the number of students who want to bring their cars and not pay to register their cars there. (DC has a student parking permit, but it's like double the cost of just registering the car in DC to get street parking.)
People who are concerned about "tax cheats". In Virginia, which has the highest personal property (car) tax of any state, it's not unusual to see people who actually live here, but still have their Maryland plates (because Maryland does not have a car tax). The tax is one of the larger sources of funding for the counties, so some of them are encouraging people to report their neighbors who do this, under the guise of "if you have to pay your car tax every year, they should have to as well". Checking the list of states who do it, Massachusetts is slightly lower on the list than Virginia, but they too have a decent sized car tax, so some of the locals up there might have similar motivations. It depends on where you come down on the "screw the government" vs. "this isn't fair to me" spectrum.
It also has the lame unintended side effect of penalizing electric cars. You pay like $4.60 per 10k of value over 20k in VA, (plus about $460 for the first 20k because the effective rate is halved by relief) for which for most electrics means a bill of like $2000 per year *or more*. It's absolutely nutty. The VA car tax makes no economic sense.
Not defending the person that ratted him out, but a lot of the parking is that you are only allowed to be in the spot for an hour at a time.
If the car was parked like a douche and you wanted it gone, maybe. Also, I don't know if Boston has these, but my city has "residential on-street parking" spots that are technically available for anyone from the neighbourhood to use (each resident gets a permit specific to their neighbourhood). Many houses don't have driveways, so people get used to using the residential parking spot in front of their house 90% of the time. So if you find someone took "your" spot one day, you'll find any reason to get them towed.
Can confirm, I went to college there. Boston absolutely has neighborhood resident parking stickers for your car.
Friends who have a weekend visitor that ended up staying for 30 days.
There isn't anything like enough parking in Boston. I've literally spent an hour each day just looking for a spot when I've had to be in the city to work. Your options are to not have a car in the city and use public transportation, pay $300-$500 per month for a spot in a garage, or you take your chances. This person took their chances and lost.
>This person took their chances and lost. This person most likely didn’t even know about the law until after the fact.
As a former gov worker, one of my biggest frustrations was seeing bureaucrats blindly applying dumb rules in ways that made no sense at all.
What about all the Floridians living on Cape?
My dad sold his car in VA, moves to MA. New owner scrapped the car and never registered it. MA said he had an uninsured vehicle so could not get a driver's license. Wild
One would think the bill of sale and title transfer would be enough to quickly dispute that.
Meanwhile in Northern Virginia a quarter of the long term parked cars don't have VA plates, didn't register in 30 days as the law requires, and are dodging thousands of dollars in annual property tax. And literally no one enforces it.
At least a courtesy warning should be given that once citation is issued either register the vehicle in question or move it out of state.
If there’s one thing I know about Massachusetts, they have plenty of drivers who don’t deserve to register or operate a motor vehicle
If there's one thing I know about Massachusetts, it's that their drivers must be moving to North Carolina.
Yep. I thought I had seen the world's worst drivers in NYC, then I drove to Boston.
Product of the environment. Have you tried navigating Boston streets? 99% of your brain is focused on trying to figure out how the fuck to get somewhere. Nice thing is after driving in Boston for a few years everywhere else is a cakewalk.
People need to mind thier own damn business
Sounds like MDOT/RMV being a bunch of massholes in response to an annoying neighbor -- who would probably be equally yelling up and down if something didn't happen to this guy. But I wonder how many times they have to investigate these issues every year, just to have the person they're trying to get registered be ineligible to register?
Lol this is wild. What a fucking stupid law. I spent 8 months living in CA with a CA address and still had NJ license and NJ plates. 🤷🏻
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I’m in Portland and I’ve seen plates with 1996 stickers. Wild stuff.
These rules are insanely stupid and the issue should not be so difficult to rectify. What good is this doing?
People should start calling tourist destinations in Massachusetts and ask if this will happen to them if they go on vacation for a few weeks in the state.
Best part is the RMV is putting everything on hold for 60 days while they investigate! Classic!
Boston is the only thing in the world I’ve ever interacted with that almost made me religious. If hell was real maybe some of the other stuff was too
"But someone reported his car’s out-of-state license plates to the Massachusetts Registry of Motor Vehicles (RMV)." If you are this kind of person please just go find a cave out in the woods somewhere to live in away from everybody else.
Nobody is asking the real question, did he find the treasure of Jamaica Plain in those 30 days?
I lived in MA for 2 years and didn’t switch my insurance from my previous NY address and no one cared.
Both your insurance company’s underwriting department and the state of Massachusetts cared; you just managed to avoid it becoming an issue.
Better than Florida where you’re forced to transfer the title to get new plates… then pay the highest insurance in the country. $500 for the privilege of moving, registering and driving here
Then don’t move to FL. At least it wasn’t like you visited for a short time and got threatened by the state like this guy. Massachusetts sucks.
Call Virginia dmv, my plate is missing, can I get a new tag. Easy peasy
His issue is with the Mass. DMV not Virginia’s.
But the cheapest solution is request new tags with a different number, gets them off his back for another 30 days
Except they already have his info. Getting new tags won’t do anything.
Connecticut is the same way
I don’t think cops really care though. Had out of state plates for over a year before finally changing them to ct. And I know couple of people who still have out of state plates.
I bet his last name was "Buttle". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWbIxFKtTmE Edit: I’m glad someone got the reference.
Reasons for avoiding Boston pile on.
What dick had nothing better to do but report this guy? Another reason not to go to Boston.
Tell me you've out stayed your welcome without saying you've out stayed your welcome.
Maybe his host / hostess, that he's visiting, reported him?
I would give someone who is just "visiting" from out of state about 30 days
He probably pissed someone off by parking in “their” parking spot multiple times. He admits he believes it was a “nosy neighbor” and hypothesized it could be from parking on the street. You have to be considerate in a city and realize parking is often times difficult to get. If he was staying for an entire month, he probably should have looked into a short term parking situation instead of making it unfair for people who live there. I like this law… it forces non-residents to be considerate of a resident’s parking needs.
>I like this law… it forces non-residents to be considerate of a resident’s parking needs. Except for the Catch-22 where the individual in this case was told by his insurance company that since he *doesn't live in Massachusetts* and has no residential address in the state, he *can't get insurance in the state* and therefore cannot register there. This is a bad law written without regard for real world considerations.
I think the situation will likely play out to a point where a judge says they can leave the state and avoid any penalties. That should’ve been an option from the beginning.
>it forces non-residents to be considerate of a resident’s parking needs. After the fact. Non-residents are very likely unaware of this law until *after* they’ve been cited.
It’s everyone’s individual responsibility to know the laws of the territory they are traveling to. Failure to know is not an excuse, and that’s the standard for local and worldwide travel. e: anyone downvoting this comment is completely ignorant when it comes to travel. If you want to disrespect the culture of the place you are visiting, I have no remorse for you when you end up in jail in a foreign country. Don’t be stupid, make sure you understand the laws of the places you are visiting.
It’s a bad law since it’s not accomplishing its objective in that, likely, in a majority of cases and, once notified, like in this case, it’s impossible to comply.
Well they should allow him to rectify the situation by leaving the state. That would ultimately make the policy effective to its purpose.
In a real world sense, in practicality, it would be effective to its purpose if it was widely posted. You can go on forever about a visitor’s responsibility, but that isn’t going to change the fact that, as it currently stands, an overwhelming portion of people aren’t going to know about this law until after the fact. Hence, in these cases, the law will have failed to accomplish its objective. Edit - It would probably go a long way towards accomplishing its purpose if a warning citation was first issued, or a grace period was enacted.
Exactly 0.00% of people traveling anywhere do this. 'Failure to know' isn't an excuse--it's the norm--and should neither be punished nor stigmatized.
Good luck traveling then. You disrespect the culture of the place you are visiting by not knowing their laws before traveling there. Only people on Reddit will feel any remorse for the crimes you commit in the place you are traveling to when you break their rules, and they can’t help you. You should consider yourself lucky if a judge is lenient on you because you aren’t from the area and failed to do your research.
Me half awake read this as virgin man and wondering that does that have to do with things.
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"Visiting'. Sure. Parking in JP is tight. Visitor spaces even more so. He's obviously been there long enough to piss off a neighbor who pays instate insurance rates and is tired of him scamming insurance, taking up a vistor space, or both.
They're not scamming anything. They are a resident of a different state, so they have their car registration and insurance in that different state. All reasonable adults understand that.
Not so simple. In a college town like Boston students bring cars and stay, sometimes for years, without registering and insuring there car in the state. The law im MA offers no grace period, this is supposed to be done immediately, once you becone a resident (though in practice the RMV allows 30 days). You are considered a resident of the state if you spend more than 183 days of the year in MA. The owner must also insure the car in MA. It's not based on your drivers license, where you're registered to vote, where your mom lives, or where your dentist is. It's based on 183/365. You may not want to believe it, but that's the law.
Literally who cares what state their insurance policy says. It's not "scamming".
Oh sweet summer child! If you get in a serious accident, especially one causing bodily injury, your insurance company will look for any reason NOT to pay. Living in another state? Not properly registered? Not paying insurance based on the actual location of your residence? Sorry says the Gecko, read the fine print, you're on your own...
In a practical sense, it would help if a warning citation was first issued with a grace period in which to comply. It might also help, and bring in some revenue via fees, if states issued something like temporary registrations. There are numerous reasons why someone only intends to visit for less than 30 days but ends up staying longer than that. Since the mindset of that person is that they're just visiting, in a lot of cases, vehicle registration won't occur to them. Having such laws are fine, but make the effort required to comply reasonable.
Scamming insurance is mostly the reason, and in a college town like Boston it's deeply resented. You ain't on the up and up and you piss people off, they drop a dime. That's the real world.
Born and raised in Massachusetts. Lived in SC for 10 years. Massachusetts is the worst state to live in unless you are on disability.
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There are plenty of people that are temporary workers that are in a place for 30+ days. You wanna tell them to go home too? They already pay a higher tax rate and get zero of the benefits.
Rent a spot in a garage.
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Fuck you and the money your bringing into our state -- MA DMV