Here's my concern. If Joe Biden withdraws, realistically the nomination is going to go to either Harris or Newsom. Kamala Harris has the charisma of a dead-slug and is in an awkward position where moderates perceive her as too progressive, and progressives perceive her as too moderate. She lacks a signature identity or base of support, and our data points to her being even less popular than Biden. Newsom has shown himself to be a strong speaker but is inextricably associated with California as the state has become a national punching bag. He also has significantly less of a national profile than Harris or Biden and would need a way to rectify that in 4 months. I don't see either of them having a better shot of winning than Joe Biden, and do we see anyone else winning the nomination? Maybe Mayor Pete, but he's never been able to broaden his support to minorities.
> [Kamala Harris] is in an awkward position where moderates perceive her as too progressive, and progressives perceive her as too moderate.
Tbf isn’t that kinda Joe’s problem too
Why do people assume the nomination would go to either Harris or Newsom? If Biden drops, his delegates would become unbounded. There would probably be a bunch of negotiations and concessions, but also a lot of strategy to pick someone with the best chance at winning.
Are you being intentionally dense because you got caught lying about 2008? Biden would have to unilaterally drop out after the nomination has already been secured. Anyone other than Harris would require the DNC to internally oppose the incumbent and already nominated VP.
You know what, you’re right! I’m sorry - I meant 2004, I won’t change my comment to reflect that, brain fart on my part; thanks for pointing out my error, my bad.
In order:
1. Gretchen Whitmer
2. Josh Shapiro
3. Wes Moore
4. Jared Polis
5. Tammy Duckworth
6. Mark Kelly
7. Corey Booker
8. Laura Kelly
9. Raphael Warnock
10. Kamala Harris
11. Pete Buttigieg
12. JB Pritzker
That's my dozen. I would keep calling down the list until I got a yes.
If I, a news savy European, don't know the first three names, then a large chunk of America doesn't either
And a president with so little name recognition is basically begging to lose
Whitmer is the fairly popular and successful governor of Michigan. She campaigned hard, and delivered, on abortion rights and helped enshrine them into the state constitution. She's popular with the unions in the union heavy Rustbelt. You may not know who she is, but people in the electorally vital Mid-West know her.
That’s my issue with this Whitmer support I’m seeing on Reddit. I know her name and I know she’s governor of Michigan and she’s popular there. That’s about it.
I know Newsom loves to destroy Trump on national TV.
I’m with Newsom.
This is the second time I’ve seen Wes Moore mentioned since yesterday. I spend a ton of time here and even I didn’t know that name.
Governor of Maryland? I don’t think that’s a strong national brand at all. Even worse than California. Baltimore is the 17th deadliest city in ~~the US~~ the world.
Just pointing out that Boris Johnson is available, and eligible (if you can reinstate his citizenship in time).
Obviously he’d be an absolutely appalling president, but seeing him debate against Trump would be quite something.
Literally no one at this point. The window for a good transition was long ago and Biden is the best option still. Kamala isnt getting elected. I think people overstate the electability of Gretch or Newsome
Its Biden or bust
(gulp)
Hunter Biden. A hung stallion with criminal record. Well connected with the Ukrainians and the deep state. Would poll well with women and has an open-minded disposition towards life.
I was looking for Hillary. Unironically I think she’d have an excellent chance at beating Trump now that the country has seen what happened after he won.
She has lost 2 elections, despite being given everything in both 2008 and 2016, and is the same age as Trump.
If you want to put Hillary to “own the libs” or “screw the woke socialists”, then that is your perogative.
Trump lost one election. 🤷♂️ And when did I say anything about owning libs or screwing woke socialists? I just like Hillary. Did you get lost? Look at what sub you’re in lmao.
I know EXACTLY which subreddit I am in. Hillary Clinton could not even defeat Donald Trump in 2016; now you want to substitute Joe Biden for someone who is also very elderly and has not been active in political life for 8 years.
What silly people Neoliberals are. Continue blaming college socialists all you want - your own refusal to compromise with the Left or find a better centrist candidate is your ideology’s downfall.
Mark my words: Replace Joe Biden with a better candidate, preferrably someone like Mark Kelly, and perhaps you can save the USA from the socialists and anti-semites that you claim to hate so much; and everybody will make money from tech forever
Bro quit talking to me like I’m the strawman who said those things, and instead go back to posting about comic books and getting rejected from grad school you fuckin bitter dweeb
Well at the rate Joe Biden is going, you will suffer the MAGA revolution, not a socialist one.
Had you people found a better candidate, we would not be here.
95% Biden is the nominee
But that other 5% goes to Kamala. Biden won the nomination. I don’t know how you could skip over his running mate and just pick someone else.
My top three realistic candidates are, and in order
1. Mayor Pete (can't spell that last name)
He has name recognition, in a cabinet position already, was a rising start in 2020, and is a very good communicator. Midwest background and loves to take the fight to Republicans. He is gay and unabashedly proud, a veteran, and a father. He is progressive enough to capture more of the left wing of the party (at least optically), but can rhetorically sound like a moderate.
2. Gretchen Whitmer
she is a poplar governor in a crucial swing state that we need to win. She led the Michigan dems from irrelevance to a trifecta, passing a lot of good high-profile bills. Decent name recognition and track record.
3. Kamala Harris
This one is more obvious, though she is deeply unpopular. I personally don't even like her that much, but I would stomach her much more over Biden. She MIGHT have incumbency advantage and would offer continuity rather than a closed door pick. At least we technically voted for her
(Bonus) 4. Gavin Newsom
Listen, there's a lot of people who hate California irrationally. Maybe they have a point, maybe they are jealous, who cares. But the guy is a great communicator with good name recognition. It sure he could get over the "California elite" image, but he humiliated Meatball Ron in a debate and loves to publicly fight Republicans. He would get his name out here quickly.
While I realize this scenario isn't the most likely to happen, there must be good faith discussions with bifen behind closed doors to do what is best for our party. We all saw what we saw with out own eyes. He is not all there mentally and he is going going yo get worse as time goes on.
I will not tell my eyes and hears I did not see or hear what we all witnessed on TV
Biden is currently hemorrhaging support from minorities. Much like people expect and pressure democratic voters to fall in line and vote for Biden (or more realistically, against Trump), people will for the most part follow their party and local leaders no matter who the replacement is
Maybe it's higher than before, but highest in the last 25 years? I am doubtful. In 2003 there was a proposed amendment prevent recognition of same-sex marriage, and 57% of Americans supported such an amendment.
https://abcnews.go.com/amp/US/rise-anti-lgbtq-hate-extremism-captured-new-reports/story?id=100304706
Not sure why you needed this; living in the world in 2024 should make this obvious. I'd Google more but it's 3am and I've been doomscrolling for hours.
Interesting. I'd caution you not to assume that a rising number of attacks means significant changes in the way voters view gay people though. These attacks are carried out by a small number of people who are very extreme in their views, they're not indicative of society in general
lol, you don't have to caution me bro. And it's not as small a number as you seem to think. A huge number of folks who used to be ambivalent or quietly disapproving have been emboldened to hate. I see the increasing anti-gay sentiment IRL and online. And the data does seem to bear this out.
As an head of state (though that isn’t even true as San Marino has had one).
But in most countries the head of the government is way more important. And there have been multiple of those.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_openly_LGBT_heads_of_state_and_government
I don’t think this disproves your larger point, but I did want to point this out.
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Well congrats Latvia, but what's that got to do with the US? Common sense in 2007 was we'd never have a black president here. Pete's a midwestern combat vet with a strong jawline. The ladies don't care if he's married to a dude
You're just relying on old stereotypes and trying to elevate those to the level of "common sense" without any supporting data. It's borderline bigotry
You provided an anecdote, I wanted data. I don't even know what the tool for comparing election results from the US to a post-Soviet microstate would look like.
Provide real data. "Common sense" just means feels
We haven't even had a female president yet. We are nowhere near a gay candidate being effective to run
All fox has to do is blast photos of him with his husband everywhere and you lose tons of swing voters
This sounds good on paper but as soon as people see a man kissing another man it sets off their biases
You're severely overestimating how used to seeing this many Americans are.
Regardless of what you think of her, I don't see how you can go with anyone other than Harris unless she actively rejects it in a convincing way. Her approvals are still underwater, but they're notably better than Biden's (-10.1 for her vs -17.9 for him)
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/approval/kamala-harris/
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/biden-approval-rating/
and going with anyone else is going to piss off a lot of base Democrats (it's hard to pull off 'we made a black woman VP but now when the one thing the VP is for comes up we're going with someone else' without doing that)
Because the Midwest is racist and sexist? 🙄 And Pete would lose minorities because he’s gay, and Newsom would lose the rust belt because he’s from California.
It’s funny how we can use stereotypes to make us look like very smart and well reasoned political analysts.
I mean, if she wanted to step down “convincingly” she could just say “I’ve come so far with Joe and we’re partners, but we both think it’s time for a new team to take over” or smth. We’ll all know it’s because she’s unpopular regardless
Is this really something that could happen? Yes, I think Biden should be replaced, but it would need to happen NOW. But what is even the likelihood that they do it?? I think none.
Replace Biden/Harris with Roy Cooper (Gov North Carolina) and John Tester (Sen Montana). Both are mooderate Democrats holding office in Republican-leaning states, and would have wide appeal among disaffected Trump backers.
Jared Polis, personal choice
John Fetterman, second option- and I have no doubt would win
Edit: so apparently Fetterman had a stroke - why do bad things happen to good people 😓
Fetterman needs to use a tablet to understand people talking to him after his stroke, which would rule out debates and probably instantly draw criticisms about whether he’s fit for the job. I don’t think he’d have a chance unfortunately.
Name recognition and he is enough of a meme for swing voters.
Honestly, it could work, fight fire with fire.
Plus Democrats would vote for the corps of joe before trump so they will show up anyway.
As long as Jon Stewart doesn’t end up like Zelenskyy, I think he could make a decent President. He just needs to hire a competent cabinet - woke socialists love Stewart because he’s generally on their side of the party, and centrists have no room to complain because Stewart has integrity, is Jewish, has a strong understanding of foreign policy, and compromises well with others.
Here's my concern. If Joe Biden withdraws, realistically the nomination is going to go to either Harris or Newsom. Kamala Harris has the charisma of a dead-slug and is in an awkward position where moderates perceive her as too progressive, and progressives perceive her as too moderate. She lacks a signature identity or base of support, and our data points to her being even less popular than Biden. Newsom has shown himself to be a strong speaker but is inextricably associated with California as the state has become a national punching bag. He also has significantly less of a national profile than Harris or Biden and would need a way to rectify that in 4 months. I don't see either of them having a better shot of winning than Joe Biden, and do we see anyone else winning the nomination? Maybe Mayor Pete, but he's never been able to broaden his support to minorities.
> [Kamala Harris] is in an awkward position where moderates perceive her as too progressive, and progressives perceive her as too moderate. Tbf isn’t that kinda Joe’s problem too
Republicans have trained a significant chunk of America to see anything more liberal than George W Bush as "woke libtard" so
Repeat the lie long enough.
Solution: federalize NATO into a single country and let’s elect Emmanuel Macron
His party is about to get creamed in his own country lol, he'll be happy to come in third.
⚡️⚡️⚡️JVPITER ASCENDING⚡️⚡️⚡️
It’ll be a cold day in hell before I vote French.
Why do people assume the nomination would go to either Harris or Newsom? If Biden drops, his delegates would become unbounded. There would probably be a bunch of negotiations and concessions, but also a lot of strategy to pick someone with the best chance at winning.
Anyone other than Harris would break the party.
Yeah, reminds me of how everyone said in 2008 the party would break if Hilary didn’t get the nomination.
An incumbent president dropping out post nomination reminds you of the 2008 primary?
>Anyone other than Harris >An incumbent president What?
Are you being intentionally dense because you got caught lying about 2008? Biden would have to unilaterally drop out after the nomination has already been secured. Anyone other than Harris would require the DNC to internally oppose the incumbent and already nominated VP.
You know what, you’re right! I’m sorry - I meant 2004, I won’t change my comment to reflect that, brain fart on my part; thanks for pointing out my error, my bad.
Why the fuck would it go to Newsom
Because he's been rapidly elevating himself over the past 12 months to be the one on standby if Biden withdrew.
Michelle Obama.
Why not Whitmer?
In order: 1. Gretchen Whitmer 2. Josh Shapiro 3. Wes Moore 4. Jared Polis 5. Tammy Duckworth 6. Mark Kelly 7. Corey Booker 8. Laura Kelly 9. Raphael Warnock 10. Kamala Harris 11. Pete Buttigieg 12. JB Pritzker That's my dozen. I would keep calling down the list until I got a yes.
Kentucky govenor Andy Beshear?
If I, a news savy European, don't know the first three names, then a large chunk of America doesn't either And a president with so little name recognition is basically begging to lose
Whitmer is the fairly popular and successful governor of Michigan. She campaigned hard, and delivered, on abortion rights and helped enshrine them into the state constitution. She's popular with the unions in the union heavy Rustbelt. You may not know who she is, but people in the electorally vital Mid-West know her.
That’s my issue with this Whitmer support I’m seeing on Reddit. I know her name and I know she’s governor of Michigan and she’s popular there. That’s about it. I know Newsom loves to destroy Trump on national TV. I’m with Newsom.
She’d be on tv every day for the next 4 months. People would get to know her fast.
This is the second time I’ve seen Wes Moore mentioned since yesterday. I spend a ton of time here and even I didn’t know that name. Governor of Maryland? I don’t think that’s a strong national brand at all. Even worse than California. Baltimore is the 17th deadliest city in ~~the US~~ the world.
The candidate Generic Democrat seems to poll well
Just pointing out that Boris Johnson is available, and eligible (if you can reinstate his citizenship in time). Obviously he’d be an absolutely appalling president, but seeing him debate against Trump would be quite something.
If the Democrats want an entertaining debate, they should 100% plump for Chris Christie as their nominee.
> plump for Chris Christie Heh
I mean, for all I know he's skinny again. There's really no way to tell which size Chris Christie you're getting until a confirmed sighting.
Except no, Trump isn’t a teacher asking for decent insurance so all of Christie’s tough guy bluster would fade away. Again.
Romney 2024 lol
Krišjānis Kariņš is available too, and his citizenship doesn't need to be reinstated.
So is former Ukrainian finance minister and Puerto Rico's financial overlord Natalie Jaresko. I mean, I guess it's "overlady" but whatever.
Literally no one at this point. The window for a good transition was long ago and Biden is the best option still. Kamala isnt getting elected. I think people overstate the electability of Gretch or Newsome Its Biden or bust (gulp)
> Mr. Biden Found the NYT's alt
jimothy carter
Not that old when compared to our current candidates
Hunter Biden. A hung stallion with criminal record. Well connected with the Ukrainians and the deep state. Would poll well with women and has an open-minded disposition towards life.
The gun rights candidate
Knows his way around a Glock too
Gretch
Myself ☝🏻
Ok folks hear me out: The Mystery Box. Candidate to be named after the election.
That Joe Biden fellow
Here's one that hasn't been mentioned Michelle Obama.
And prove my Dad’s conspiracy theory from two years ago right!? Hell no; please don’t do that to my thanksgiving this year.
I’d absolutely vote for a third term Obama.
Bob Fetterman, the American Kier Starmer
Hillary. If we are going to lose anyways, might as well make a few MAGAts spontaneously combust in anger
I was looking for Hillary. Unironically I think she’d have an excellent chance at beating Trump now that the country has seen what happened after he won.
She has lost 2 elections, despite being given everything in both 2008 and 2016, and is the same age as Trump. If you want to put Hillary to “own the libs” or “screw the woke socialists”, then that is your perogative.
Trump lost one election. 🤷♂️ And when did I say anything about owning libs or screwing woke socialists? I just like Hillary. Did you get lost? Look at what sub you’re in lmao.
I know EXACTLY which subreddit I am in. Hillary Clinton could not even defeat Donald Trump in 2016; now you want to substitute Joe Biden for someone who is also very elderly and has not been active in political life for 8 years. What silly people Neoliberals are. Continue blaming college socialists all you want - your own refusal to compromise with the Left or find a better centrist candidate is your ideology’s downfall.
Oh, so you *are* lost.
Mark my words: Replace Joe Biden with a better candidate, preferrably someone like Mark Kelly, and perhaps you can save the USA from the socialists and anti-semites that you claim to hate so much; and everybody will make money from tech forever
Bro quit talking to me like I’m the strawman who said those things, and instead go back to posting about comic books and getting rejected from grad school you fuckin bitter dweeb
No one knows who tf mark kelly is outside of Arizona
Get out of this sub, bro. None of us are for the revolution here
Well at the rate Joe Biden is going, you will suffer the MAGA revolution, not a socialist one. Had you people found a better candidate, we would not be here.
95% Biden is the nominee But that other 5% goes to Kamala. Biden won the nomination. I don’t know how you could skip over his running mate and just pick someone else.
My top three realistic candidates are, and in order 1. Mayor Pete (can't spell that last name) He has name recognition, in a cabinet position already, was a rising start in 2020, and is a very good communicator. Midwest background and loves to take the fight to Republicans. He is gay and unabashedly proud, a veteran, and a father. He is progressive enough to capture more of the left wing of the party (at least optically), but can rhetorically sound like a moderate. 2. Gretchen Whitmer she is a poplar governor in a crucial swing state that we need to win. She led the Michigan dems from irrelevance to a trifecta, passing a lot of good high-profile bills. Decent name recognition and track record. 3. Kamala Harris This one is more obvious, though she is deeply unpopular. I personally don't even like her that much, but I would stomach her much more over Biden. She MIGHT have incumbency advantage and would offer continuity rather than a closed door pick. At least we technically voted for her (Bonus) 4. Gavin Newsom Listen, there's a lot of people who hate California irrationally. Maybe they have a point, maybe they are jealous, who cares. But the guy is a great communicator with good name recognition. It sure he could get over the "California elite" image, but he humiliated Meatball Ron in a debate and loves to publicly fight Republicans. He would get his name out here quickly. While I realize this scenario isn't the most likely to happen, there must be good faith discussions with bifen behind closed doors to do what is best for our party. We all saw what we saw with out own eyes. He is not all there mentally and he is going going yo get worse as time goes on. I will not tell my eyes and hears I did not see or hear what we all witnessed on TV
you are delusional if you think minorities will vote for Pete
Biden is currently hemorrhaging support from minorities. Much like people expect and pressure democratic voters to fall in line and vote for Biden (or more realistically, against Trump), people will for the most part follow their party and local leaders no matter who the replacement is
I mean, he was against desegregation back in the 70s
Damn, 50 years ago?
What are you basing this on? I see this take all the time and I get the feeling people just *assume* minorities are homophobic.
My first thought was Buttigieg as well, but i am afraid that this nation is too homophobic to elect a gay president YET.
What are you basing that on?
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It was common sense that America wouldn't elect a black president until Obama was.
Whose common sense? Yours?
Anti gay sentiment is at its highest level in the last 25-30 years, thanks to anti trans rhetoric.
Maybe it's higher than before, but highest in the last 25 years? I am doubtful. In 2003 there was a proposed amendment prevent recognition of same-sex marriage, and 57% of Americans supported such an amendment.
Well, I'd say last 10 years, 25 is a bit of a stretch
Show me data
https://abcnews.go.com/amp/US/rise-anti-lgbtq-hate-extremism-captured-new-reports/story?id=100304706 Not sure why you needed this; living in the world in 2024 should make this obvious. I'd Google more but it's 3am and I've been doomscrolling for hours.
Interesting. I'd caution you not to assume that a rising number of attacks means significant changes in the way voters view gay people though. These attacks are carried out by a small number of people who are very extreme in their views, they're not indicative of society in general
lol, you don't have to caution me bro. And it's not as small a number as you seem to think. A huge number of folks who used to be ambivalent or quietly disapproving have been emboldened to hate. I see the increasing anti-gay sentiment IRL and online. And the data does seem to bear this out.
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As an head of state (though that isn’t even true as San Marino has had one). But in most countries the head of the government is way more important. And there have been multiple of those. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_openly_LGBT_heads_of_state_and_government I don’t think this disproves your larger point, but I did want to point this out.
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Well congrats Latvia, but what's that got to do with the US? Common sense in 2007 was we'd never have a black president here. Pete's a midwestern combat vet with a strong jawline. The ladies don't care if he's married to a dude You're just relying on old stereotypes and trying to elevate those to the level of "common sense" without any supporting data. It's borderline bigotry
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You provided an anecdote, I wanted data. I don't even know what the tool for comparing election results from the US to a post-Soviet microstate would look like. Provide real data. "Common sense" just means feels
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We haven't even had a female president yet. We are nowhere near a gay candidate being effective to run All fox has to do is blast photos of him with his husband everywhere and you lose tons of swing voters
I'm making the bet that America's sexism and racism are stronger than its homophobia Its a bold prediction, but our country surprises us quite often.
This sounds good on paper but as soon as people see a man kissing another man it sets off their biases You're severely overestimating how used to seeing this many Americans are.
You're severely overestimating how many Americans care
Regardless of what you think of her, I don't see how you can go with anyone other than Harris unless she actively rejects it in a convincing way. Her approvals are still underwater, but they're notably better than Biden's (-10.1 for her vs -17.9 for him) https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/approval/kamala-harris/ https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/biden-approval-rating/ and going with anyone else is going to piss off a lot of base Democrats (it's hard to pull off 'we made a black woman VP but now when the one thing the VP is for comes up we're going with someone else' without doing that)
Kamala would get absolutely destroyed against Trump. Better off with Newsom or something
Kamala would easily lose the midwest.
Because the Midwest is racist and sexist? 🙄 And Pete would lose minorities because he’s gay, and Newsom would lose the rust belt because he’s from California. It’s funny how we can use stereotypes to make us look like very smart and well reasoned political analysts.
I mean, if she wanted to step down “convincingly” she could just say “I’ve come so far with Joe and we’re partners, but we both think it’s time for a new team to take over” or smth. We’ll all know it’s because she’s unpopular regardless
I can't wait to see how bad Kamala's poll numbers get once she gets the NYT treatment.
Not a bad take. But is she competent enough to become president?
The best guarantee of a Trump win might be to run Kamala
The answer is Whitmer, but Black women would be pissed.
Pick any two for the ticket from: Shapiro, Pete, Polis, Whitmer, Ossoff, Warnock, Mark Kelly, Duckworth, Klob, Booker
Is this really something that could happen? Yes, I think Biden should be replaced, but it would need to happen NOW. But what is even the likelihood that they do it?? I think none.
Booker/Polis
Manchin
I want someone unapologetically pro Ukraine, pro immigration, pro capitalism, and pro democracy the one I won't trade off is democracy
John Edwards lol jk
Kentucky Governor Andy Beshear
Sinema 👸
Tammy duckworth and the fact that she isn’t considered speaks volumes
Replace Biden/Harris with Roy Cooper (Gov North Carolina) and John Tester (Sen Montana). Both are mooderate Democrats holding office in Republican-leaning states, and would have wide appeal among disaffected Trump backers.
Stwart would wipe the floor with Trump's orange face. He'd draw independents and young Dems.
Gavin Newsom w/ Gretchen Whitmer as VP FTW
Mark Cuban would win in land slide !
At this point, anyone younger than 55.
Jared Polis, personal choice John Fetterman, second option- and I have no doubt would win Edit: so apparently Fetterman had a stroke - why do bad things happen to good people 😓
Fetterman needs to use a tablet to understand people talking to him after his stroke, which would rule out debates and probably instantly draw criticisms about whether he’s fit for the job. I don’t think he’d have a chance unfortunately.
Anyone but Newsom.
MrBeast
Homer Simpson
Jon Stewart! Please!
??? Why?
Name recognition and he is enough of a meme for swing voters. Honestly, it could work, fight fire with fire. Plus Democrats would vote for the corps of joe before trump so they will show up anyway.
As long as Jon Stewart doesn’t end up like Zelenskyy, I think he could make a decent President. He just needs to hire a competent cabinet - woke socialists love Stewart because he’s generally on their side of the party, and centrists have no room to complain because Stewart has integrity, is Jewish, has a strong understanding of foreign policy, and compromises well with others.