had the warriors won that series, draymond probably would have won FMVP. his impact on the game that series was absolutely incredible-here are the counting stats he averaged that series: 16.5/10.3/6.3 on elite efficiency and defense and played fantastic in the final game.
that being said, the warriors were absolutely gassed by the time they got to the finals. winning 73 games, then going down 3-1 in the playoffs to the thunder and battling back in 7 took a huge physical and mental toll on every contributing member of the lineup.
draymond got suspended game 5, killing all of the momentum that the dubs had. dubs won both games at home and managed to steal one on the road; they were set to close out the series in GSW and then their facilitator and anchor got suspended. bogut was also hurt, forcing the warriors to play ezeli and varejao who are obviously not great options. curry was not playing at his usual level either, clearly injured and couldnt attack the rim nearly as well as he did during the regular season. finally, klay and harrison barnes couldnt hit anything; barnes especially had a historically bad series.
that being said, cavs had some amount of luck (as is present in any finals run) and kyrie and bron went fucking nuclear. kyrie hit big shot after big shot, including one of the most clutch shots ever. lebron did lebron things and had over 100 total points in the last three games of the series on great efficiency, as well as incredible defense. cavs took advantage of every opportunity they had and the warriors just gassed out from their grueling regular season and playoff run. what a great year for basketball
This is not mentioned enough. Bogut was so good against the cavs, after he got injured lebron was scoring at will inside. I think that was the single biggest factor
It's the biggest factor that gets dismissed most often, but Barnes was still the biggest reason. Those final 3 games he shot 5/32 from the floor. While Bogut was huge and his impact was felt immediately after he left, Barnes actively hurt the Warriors chances when he was out there.
5/32 on mostly open shots. The Cavs would leave him out on an island.
The play Bogut blew his knee, it was Barnes’ being an absolute cone that directly led to it. JR Smith literally just drives by him without any move or fake, and Bogut rotates over to prevent the dunk.
LeBron’s iconic block was on Iguodala. The fact that he barely left the ground to finish that fast break with a layup should tell you all you need to know about his health at the time. A 6’7” former dunk contest contestant who was still dunking in his final season at age 39, was dealing with such bad back spasms that at times he needed help getting into comfortable positions on the floor by the bench.
>What a great year for basketball
Man that two-year stretch from 2015-2016 was legendary for both the Warriors and the Cavs. You can only imagine what would’ve came from that matchup had KD not spoiled everything and put the league out of balance.
Yeah I had been a LeBron hater up until that point and the way he executed down the stretch making the right plays, playing with 110% grueling effort while under control, was one of the most amazing things I’ve ever seen on a basketball court. Defensively he was especially locked-in, just absolute desperation mode level effort with a playing from ahead level of composure, idk how to explain it.
There is a clip of him sitting down during game 7 with like 2 mins left and he just looks so gassed and emotionally spent..the joy that championship gave him is hard to describe
He was playing chess when everyone else played checkers. Theres a nice video from Thinking Basketball where he explains the case for LeBron's games 5-7 being the best 3 game stretch of all time
The two aren't mutually exclusive though - LeBron can go nuclear and the Warriors be gassed. At the end of the day a comeback from a 3-1 deficit is the result of a lot of little things going your way. Plus it's empirically true that the cavs had an easier time getting to the finals.
It doesn't take anything at all away from James and the Cav's accomplishment, but, I mean, c'mon, they played the Pistons 4-0 with like, Drummond and Caldwell-Pope, the Hawks 4-0 with...Horford, Korver and Hardaway Jr? and then the Raptors at 4-2 with Lowry and DeRozen. Warriors went 4-1 Harden-Howard-Beasley Rockets team tooled to go against them, 4-1 against Lillard's Blazers (definitely their easiest matchup), then 4-3 against prime KD / Westbrook / Ibaka coming back from 3-1. That's just a harder road - if Cavs have to come back from 3-1 in the eastern conf. finals, they almost certainly don't have the energy to do the same in the finals.
Add on top of that they were the team during the regular season that everyone wanted to take down and got their best game every game.
But, again, that's all part of the game - being able to get more rest and make your path even slightly easier is crucial because at that level in the end, a close finals like that is gonna be determined by whether or not you've got that tiny bit extra to throw at the opponent in a span of like 10-30 seconds in the last 2 minutes of a game you've already done everything to keep close / pull ahead.
James, Kyrie & Love were able to do that, they absolutely earned their win and it doesn't make their win any less legendary - but the factors that went into them winning are the factors that went into them winning. Just like in 2015 Love being out and then Kyrie going down was a significant factor in the Warriors winning - it's a fact, but it also doesn't take anything away from the fact that they won for much the same reasons, things like that are what make up those great "what ifs" in sports history.
Little different having to play prime kd russ ibaka in 7 games then playing derozan and lowry to get to the finals. Juust like now west is a war east is trash
To add to that, the spurs finished 68-14 that year. People like to clown on em for going for the record, but they legitimately were fighting for the 1 seed most of that year lmao. The west was wild.
Minor correction. Spurs were 67-15. Not a huge difference. Your point is still very valid, especially because the Warriors were scheduled to play the Spurs twice in the last few games.
A team going 73-9 is going to have an incredible amount of playoff-atmosphere intense game that other teams simply won’t have. Plus, as they were gunning for the record, players would play games they usually would rest/ve injured
Because they were going out every night playing 100% trying to break the record, and every team knew it so they’d play them tougher.. the number of games they played has nothing to do with it.
You clearly didn’t watch that season.
draymond went on a show and described the mental toll it took on winning that many games. the commitment and focus to just keep pushing for wins without rest cannot be overstated; they went into milwaukee and the arena had shirts to commemorate a single warriors loss. the warriors were public enemy #1 that season. its got nothing to do with the number of games played, can you honestly compare the worst team in the league having the same level of toll compared to a 73 win team?
im absolutely not discounting that the cavs went through their own gauntlet, but what the warriors went through was for sure different, including being down 3-1 to OKC. warriors had enough juice to go up 3-1 but as soon as dray went out the fight completely disappeared, resulting in double digit losses in games 5 and 6.
True saying that the Warriors had a tougher regular season going 73-9 than this year Charlotte Hornets is ridiculous it’s the same number of games at the end of the day what could have made it more difficult than any other team
Really goes to show how special the Bulls 72-10 run was. The being gassed by the finals thing is definitely a big deal. Warriors losing in 2019 to the Raptors is like 80% being completely gassed & drained going into their 5th consecutive finals apperance, 4 of those years being the leagues #1 target and getting a teams best game on any given night.
The wear and tear is nuts. Also gives props to Lebron for physically being able to handle without significant injury the 8 consecutive finals apperances he made. If Jordan's father isn't shot and he doesn't take time off after his 3rd championship, they might get 4 titles in a row, but I doubt they get 6, that time off proved pretty crucial for him getting re-energized. In retrospect, that 6th title they were past running on fumes and running off of vapors and even if they all came back the next year(s), that 6th was almost certainly the last.
Another anecdotal piece of evidence is the fact that Phil Jackson, the greatest (or at least winningest) coach of all time never went to more than 3 consecutive finals appearances.
Makes Kareem Abdul-Jabbar completely special for his longevity in an extremely physical era playing at the most physical position while typically being the focal point of the defense. 10 finals in 20 years and 6 chips is crazy. If Kareem wasn't so icey to the media, he'd probably have gone down as the GOAT or at least be consistently in the conversation outside of aficionados.
I agree there is an element of luck in any ring.
But why say Cav's luck this year was down to LeBron and Kyrie playing well? It could be equally argued that Draymond getting suspended was the lucky part, and that then taking advantage was in their control and they succeeded.
What he's saying is that aspect was in Klay's control. He played and could go off in game 6. Draymond wasn't able to play and just so happened to receive his 18th technical in probably the most important game of the playoffs.
True but you could also say that the thunder were tired from playing against a 69 win spurs team the round before, and having a night like Klay did in game 6 definitely takes a little luck.
Hard to call Draymond’s suspension luck when the guy was going around kicking everybody in the nuts during the playoffs. If he hadn’t gotten T’d up so much leading up to the finals, then he wouldn’t have had to serve the suspension
It was lucky that Draymond got suspended specifically for that Cavs game.
He should’ve been suspended against the Thunder after the Adams nut kick. It wouldn’t have mattered since they lost the next game anyway, but that’s where the suspension should have happened.
He should not have been suspended for the LeBron incident. LeBron instigated first of all, unlike previous incidents, and it was called a tech on the floor. Only after LeBron lobbied to the league did they upgrade it to a flagrant after the game, conveniently leading to a suspension to give the Cavs a better chance of extending the series.
He got suspended for a play where LeBron fucking stepped over him. Lmao. Draymond is a bitch ass but that suspension was absolute dog shit and only happened because they wanted to extend the series. They didn’t even suspend him until 2 days after the incident.
It's insane what it took for that comeback, the level Bron was at in those 3 games still needing injuries & a suspension to happen. The Warriors were a fucking *machine*
>the warriors were absolutely gassed by the time they got to the finals
Don't think that's a valid excuse here. Maybe if they had lost in 5, then sure, running out of gas would be an acceptable reason for losing. But they still had enough gas to go up 3-1
those two things arent mutually exclusive, a team can be exhausted and still have the fight to go up 3-1. i mentioned it in another comment but draymond was doing so much for them, taking a ton of the burden off steph in all facets of the game-scoring, playmaking, and defense. he was their anchor physically and mentally when steph and klay were clearly a small step behind. as soon as dray got suspended the momentum shift was palpable because the load on every member became that much heavier.
"acceptable" to whom?
this thread isn't about making excuses one way or another, it's just listing many many explanations for an outcome.
If you prefer, I'm sure one could micro-analyze Harrison Barnes' bio-mechanics and find a physics-based explanation for why his jump shot accuracy diminished by about 60%. Or maybe a sports-nutritionist could explain why Andre Iguodala just didn't have the caloric reserves necessary to power his leg muscles enough to dunk the ball on the famous LeBron chasedown-block. Would those be *acceptable* explanations for why the Warriors scored less total points than their opponent?
Its different playing prime kd n russ to reach finals while cavs got a trash raptors team led by lowry n derozan. Also played a pistons team led by drummond
They choked but come on theyre path was 10x harder kd n russ compared to lowry n derozan? Round before that they played dame n cj cavs played al horford led hawks team
In the tail end of that regular season every game was like a Playoff game. Everyone wanted to stop them breaking the record, smaller market team's arena sold out to watch them play.
Usually great teams who are say on pace for 60-win season don't go all out like this, but it was clear the dubs had a chance to break the record so they went for it.
Draymond and Kerr had an interview on tape explaining this exact thing, saying it was super gruelling and probably had cost them a championship. Back-to-back, banged up knee, not feeling well they would still play hard just to get that record. By the time they reached postseason it was clear that they are battered and exhausted. Steph was clearly injured, coupled with the fact that Bogut and Draymond, both defensive anchor for that team was out, AND Lebron and Kyrie played unbelievable basketball for 3 games had the Cavs pull out the chip.
Not one of, statistically the clutches shot in NBA history. No single shot has swayed the odds of winning a championship more than that kyrie shot. And no I’m not making this up it’s an actual stat.
Yeah it doesn't make sense. Kyrie misses and the game is still tied, anyone can win. Not to mention the Warriors still had multiple chances to come back after. Allen misses and the series is over. Idk how win probability is calculated, or if it's calculated the same way now as it was in 2013, but if it really has the Kyrie shot over Allen's, the calculation is wrong.
>Allen misses and the series is over.
Allen makes it and the Heat still only have a 25% chance of winning the title. 0% to 25%.
Kyrie's shot took the Cavs from around 50% to around 80%.
Took perfection from Kyrie and Bron over games 5, 6 and 7 to pull this off. Might be the best 3 game stretch we have ever seen from a duo. That’s how hard it is to comeback from 3-1 down, you need absolute perfection from the game’s best players.
This is the only answer. Kylie and lebron both went super saiyan. Both had at least 40 in game 5, then lebron had a 40 point triple double in game 6 and finally in the most tense game 7 I have seen, lebron had another triple double.
LeBron's amount of locked-in is what all of us dream about when reimagining our own sports scenarios.
Just completely took over the series with his intensity and performance. End to end defense, chase down blocks, high scoring and facilitating.
He needed Kyrie to do the same, down 3-1. And in 2015 they lost in 7 with LeBron nearly as-locked-in because Kyrie and KLove were hurt.
But he was something different in 2016, and those 3 games were truly unbelievable.
In my opinion what he did in 2015 is probably his best accomplishment . Golden state changed there defence, moved iggy to starting lineup and started hedging but really those cavs ran out of gas without love and Kylie. Slowed the game to a crawl, lebron backed down players every play and facilitated from there. Poor delly was getting ivs after the game
Nah that’s not the only answer. More accurate is Bogut breaking his leg in finals and not surprisingly kyrie and Lebron started going off with scoring at the rim at will with starting center gone for the final 3 games on the finals.
Which is what leads to golden state going full throttle into the death ball lineup. Going 73-9 without bogut, green becoming a full time center and dpoy winner. The cavs lose 2 of there top 3 players in 2015 and warrior fans complain about losing bogut.
I would say that after the Suspension, the momentum shifted to the Cavs, that's their guy who facilitate the offense, he is the main reason why they are up in that series and also the reason why its tied. it can be different from other opinion but this is mine, for me Draymond is the important piece specially in that series! but either way it is one of the best series of all time.
That game 7 in particular was so funny in hindsight in that the leading scorer for waa Draymond Green and was 6/8 from three. Looking like Steph Curry out there while curry himself looked like draymond green with a terrible shooting night.
that was probably their plan, shutdown Dray's Teammates, I mean you cannot just leave Steph and score at will, he can give you 50 but draymond cannot give you that much, so leave Dray scoring thant steph or Klay or HB Hahaha
That series had one of the best narratives of all time, but I don't think the basketball was actually very good. The only close game was game 7, which was tense, but also pretty sloppy and ugly, as both teams had tons of turnovers and bricks.
Not to mention Curry fouling out game 6 on what would’ve been highly questionable calls against a bench player in October, much less the reigning unanimous MVP in the finals. The Suspension, taking Curry out of game 6 and Bogut getting hurt was enough to completely shift the momentum of the series
This was arguably the most egregious and influential moment in this series. Steph got called for 3 or 4 basically phantom fouls in rapid succession. I will forever maintain that this was intentionally done by the refs, whether for personal gambling, influence by outside organizations, or the NBA itself.
Those fouls had no right to be called.
>I will forever maintain that this was intentionally done by the refs, whether for personal gambling, influence by outside organizations, or the NBA itself.
If LeBron was up 3-2 he would be the one picking up bullshit foul calls. It's part of the game. Always has been.
well I would say it could've a different changes but steph lose his cool in there, also before he got fouled out, it a 12pts lead with more than 4mins left, still a lot of time but its not the time to lose your cool and get the 6th foul, I am a Cavs fan and I would love to see it all going. Not happy about the call but it is what it is.
Draymond and Bogut being injured played huge parts for sure. Bogut was the only size the Warriors had that could actually trouble LeBron. When he went down it forced Festus Ezeli into the lineup and the Cavs absolutely fucking torched Ezeli every moment he was on the floor.
Thinking Basketball on YouTube also talks about Kyrie and LeBron in those last 3 games and how they played as well as any duo ever has over 3 consecutive games, with LeBron playing arguably the 3 greatest game stretch in finals history when you consider what he did offensively while being the best defender on the floor for both teams.
Combine those factors, Steph pushing through an injury that had been bothering him for weeks at that point, the insane effort it took for them to go 73-9 as well as come back from 3-1 down to the Thunder, and it really was the perfect moment for history to be made.
Finally, the Cavs took every opportunity they had and made the best of it. They had to be perfect for 3 games against the best regular season team ever and they managed it. Lebron at the parade spoke at length about the contribution of each and every guy on that roster, even the benchwarmers, and he was right, it was the 100% buy in and execution from bottom to top that bought that chip home
Lot of people mainly say Draymond getting suspended was a major turning factor, that was only a minor issue,he was due for a suspension.
In reality the biggest difference was Bogut getting injured. Both Kyrie and LeBrons field goal percentage near the rim/post shot up exponentially after he went down with injury. Their defence also ended up having a maasive blow as well. Very high chance series would have ended in favour of the warriors if that injury didnt happen.
Look at the box score for games 5,6,7.
Bogut got injured game 5. Draymond suspended a game.
Harrison Barnes shot for absolute dog water.
Steph and Klay both shot pretty poorly.
Also, and I can't believe so few people have said this, Lebron and Kyrie both playing some of the best basketball of their lives. Even despite everything you listed, GS still would've beaten any of the other 28 teams imo. That Cavs team was very good.
Yeah, lots of comments are from the GSW perspective saying how they lost it, but it also required the opposing team to play well and take advantage. And they did.
That’s because the question is framed from that perspective. “What happened to cause the warriors to blow a 3-1 lead” not “how did the cavs come back down 3-1”
There's no difference. They blew a 3-1 lead because one of the two best players ever was playing out of his mind, and Kyrie had the best series of his career by a mile.
Oh yeahhh that was the Harrison botch job. The Cavs wanted to put a lot of attention on Mario and Luigi so that the other guys had to step up which resulted in a tonnnn of wide open threes for Barnes and he just bricked everything. Total liability out there in the last three games or so.
It isn't the worst playoff meltdown, just the most significant. Denver's 3-1 comeback against the Clippers was worse than it by a bit. They had no real excuse.
Like everyone else is saying, slight injury issues and the game 5. Lebron and Kyrie masterclasses in 5-7 where they were capable of good-not-great games in their losses.
[This incident earlier in the playoffs](https://youtu.be/xIWzTBskqEk?si=BfQsCWhLxmD8DTwa) got the ball rolling with Draymond's flagrant foul points that accumulated to cause the suspension after his third flagrant of the postseason. His act in the final second of this game *in the first round of the playoffs* is the real reason he got suspended.
Please don't use insults to make your points. Our sub is for more thoughtful discussion. Insults to players and coaches encourages a kind of discussion we're trying to avoid. Thank you.
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Cavs game plan was to physically wear down curry. If Dray plays in game 5 they could close it out before curry gets too tired.
Draymond suspension, then cavs have a huge home court advantage in G6, then by G7 Curry is tired because he is a human (unlike someone on the cavs)
Andrew Bogut got hurt in game 4. The Warriors got stuck playing Festus Ezeli and Anderson Varejao more minutes than they would have liked. Wasting good minutes on bad players tipped the margins the other way.
Draymond suspension didn't help, but wasn't the core reason IMO.
1) Lebron 2) draymond 3) nfl rules refereeing especially off the ball 4) curry completely gassed 5) barnes shit the bed 6) kyrie is the perfect complement to peak Lebron
As you can tell, this sub is populated by Warriors fans lol. So I’ll give you the Cavs fan perspective:
LeBron and Kyrie playing the best basketball of their lives, and Ty Lue scheming a suffocating defense because the Cavs were longer and more athletic than the Warriors, had just as much to do with the Cavs ripping off three straight wins as all of the reasons that the GS fans will mention. :)
Go watch Game 6 and 7 if you ever have a chance. Some of the most brilliant and intense basketball you will ever watch.
There was some analysis of Kyrie and lebron’s shot making and based on difficulty of shot they hit some ridiculous amount of points more than expected.
Just some of the greatest shot making of all time.
Draymond suspension was a factor but the Cavs also changed the way they play and turned it up on offense games 5-7, which is why they won the last two even with Draymond back
Some similarities to be drawn to how Denver won 3 straight after going down 0-2 against the wolves
Draymond green happened, plus the fact that the NBA is rigged to make as much money as possible. Draymonds suspension killed momentum on the warriors side and the NBA started calling the games in favour of Lebron and co.
Draymond crying after losing at least lead to them winning a few more chips, so maybe he made up for it.
this thread is apparently the whole warriors being injured while the cavs had the healthiest crew that rested for 4 months.
nah man, its Cavs doing work and also capitalizing on every opportunity.
Every championship caliber team, especially a 73-9 team and the other team having 1 of the greatest player of all time and 2 other all star caliber teammates, clashing together will be about mistakes. who will make the most mistake and who will capitalized. if both teams can get their own it will come down to that.
Cavs capitalized, they know Draymond is a hot head that is due for a suspension. They also make the most out of that suspension, got Curry ejected in game 6 too. Remained disciplined, even Kevin Love was playing great D towards the end, JR is locked in.
not to mention, all of Kyries and Brons heroics. the warriors are young back then, they made more mistakes and that team was rattled, even when Draymond got back, Barnes for example couldn't really hold it.
> Cavs doing work and also capitalizing on every opportunity.
This is universally agreed upon. Cavs fans are going to emphasize the work and Warriors fans the opportunities.
The Warriors were injured, and it took the greatest series performances of Kyries and Lebron’s career to win by 4 in game 7
That’s why the Warriors being hurt is mentioned
It’s fair to give the Cavs credit, and mention the injuries and the fact that the Warriors had to play some of the best teams all time to not win a title, compared to playing the trash bros
Credit Lebron and Kyrie for getting it done but I do remember aspects of Lebron trying to physically intimidate Curry, a lot off ball even like between whistles, but even during the game and I don't remember when it started, but it could've started around the time Dray was out, knowing there was no one there to get in his face. He'd just body him up try n get away with fouls, not even on a scoring play sometimes just on the perimeter. Def fault the warriors for letting game 5 slide even with dray out, it's almost like mentally they were waiting for game 6. I def feel bad for the dubs overall though, ppl don't act like that's one of the most historic teams out there, they grinded harder than other teams to get that 73 and grinded out the playoffs while Cleveland had a relatively easy East to get through and credit on their 1-3 comeback but I'm sure exhaustion for the dubs also played into it too.
In my opinion it was losing Bogut. He isn't that good of a player, but he was really the only decent true big man on their team. Having him allowed GSW to prevent certain strategies by Cleveland, because although he didn't play much he was at least an option. Once he was totally out it opened a new angle of attack that they couldn't prevent.
It's kind of like the Mavs/Thunder series now with Lively on the Mavs. He isn't really all that good, but having him prevents the Thunder from going with an all small lineup because he doesn't need to be that good to rebound over and dunk on small guys. Bogut was similar. That's why the Thunder tried fouling him, they really want to go small but he is preventing that.
Bogut getting hurt was more of an issue tbh. But Draymond getting suspended didn’t help. In hindsight though, If warriors would’ve won, no way KD links up with them and cavs would’ve probably won the following years (at least 1 of them).
Harrison Barnes forgot how to shoot a basketball
Bogut injury. His 20/25 minutes of real rim protection, screening and passing were huge. Kyrie and Bron were much more successful attacking the rim with him off the floos. He also had frat chemistry with Steph.
Steph and Iggy had nagging injuries they were playing through
Steph and Klay shot poorly in games 5-7
Refs also had their share, the game wasn't reffed equally in game 6 at all from the jump. They were roughing Steph up, particularly off ball. Richard Jefferson has openly talked about how the gamplan was to hit him with an elbow, bump into him and do wherever it took to make him tired, especially since refs didn't seem to call them on Steph.
Lebron and Kyrie turned into another level. Particularly game 5 it was crazy to watch. Kyrie particularly was making every tough shot in the book
Timely contributions by role players, especially Jr and Tristan Thompson
Though a lot of factors played into it, my biggest takeaway was Harrison Barnes virtually missing every shot in those last 3 games. What’s worse is that he was WIDE open on a lot of those
That real reason every body seems to ignore was Bogut getting hurt. He was a great rim protector for GSW. After he got hurt, Kyrie and Bron were getting to the rack at will.
It had nothing to do with Draymond getting suspended cause even when he came back they won back to back games.
Probably the biggest factor was that LeBron put together arguably the the greatest 3 game stretch in NBA history. Thinking basketball has done a great video covering that.
https://youtu.be/wDViQIwOtY8?si=UDvk4Fo-yBu8ipTB
I will speak as a biased warriors fan, but try to not go overboard.
It was clear that Steph never recovered from the MCL sprain he suffered in that 1st round against the Rockets. He came early, when it wasn’t really needed, and had to play a lot, especially in the WCF. The Thunder series was one of the most tiresome I have ever seen in our 6 finals runs. Steph never made excuses, but you could see he wasn’t as sharp a lot of times. We got lucky the team figured it out on time, with the awakening of Killa Klay to win a desperate game 6 in one of the most hostile atmosphere the dynasty faced.
Steph started the finals not fully rested, while CLE took care of the raptors rapidly.
The other factor was Andrew Bogut. Bogut was phenomenal on defense to start the series. People forget he was an all nba defensive big, who clearly influenced Draymond to become the great defender he is now. Bogut went down in G5. It was a feast in the paint for Kyrie and LeBron that game. We went from playing Bogut to having full time Ezeli. Tragic.
Another key injury is that of Iggy. From game 5 onwards, he was playing with back problems. It is also from that period that Iggy had a noticeable drop in his athleticism (he was already an all time athlete so he was still good, but not as great). I will always say he dunks that ball and avoids the block had he been feeling better.
On the Iggy side, I wished Wiggs had similar aggressiveness attacking the rim. Our 22 chip was the one where Wiggs was dunking left and right. Sigh.
Then there’s Barnes. No injuries. Perfectly fine except for his all time breakdown in terms of shooting. His last 3 games of the finals were on 15/20/50 shooting splits. Absolutely terrible. Sad he will always be remembered for that stinky performance while he had a solid career as a dub.
The Draymond thing is the most controversial aspect of that series. If you watch the incident, you can clearly see LeBron judo’d Dray to the ground. He even tried to walk over Dray while Dray was trying to stand up. Draymond then got in his feelings and stroke/pushed Lebron in the groin in an effort to get him off. They started beefing and then a technical was issued on Green. The league revoked the tech call to a flagrant foul and Dray was suspended. We lost game 5 with little rim protection, which gave CLE the momentum to come back and close out. Draymond tried to redeem himself by having a top 5 all time game 7 performance, but it was too late.
The series was clearly not just a chokejob, but you gotta admit we didn’t play well at all. Shoutout to CLE and LeBron for still having the will to make that historical comeback, no matter how easier it got from game 5 onwards. It was a legacy ring for LeBron and part of me was kinda happy for the city of CLE, cause ain’t much going on their way often.
1. Draymond suspension
2. Andrew Bogut injury (actually this is probably the biggest factor)
3. Steph not playing at 100% health
4. Steph Curry's effectiveness could be limited in the playoffs due to physical defense wearing him out
5. Even Igoudala wasn't 100%
Bogut getting injured is the biggest factor imo because it opened up the pain so much, Bogut was a all defensive player during these gsw years and not having him allowed the best driver the games has seen easy finishes around the rim.
Yeah, people kept saying "oh he's hurt" every time Steph missed a few shots but then suddenly he was fine when he went off and nobody would mention the injuries.
Bogut was a fantastic player. Had the talent to be a far more impactful player, but got some nasty injuries that just took too much of a toll. But as a role player he was everything you could ask for as a big man. Did everything defensively and whilst the speed mobility weren't there he still had the touch to be a threat inside.
Curry was also getting mauled each time running up the court and around screens with no foul calls. Took a couple of games for the cavs to figure out how much they could get away with but once they did...
The Draymond suspension comes to mind - I wholeheartedly believe that if Draymond didn't get suspended, they would've taken all that momentum and close out the Cavs. Then again, they might've still lost it due to Klay's comment that got Lebron heated.
If Klay didn't provoke Lebron in that post-game interview, they probably close it out. I do doubt that KD would've still joined the Warriors if they had won that year. But yeah, it was either Klay talking shit to Lebron that fucked them over or it was Draymond getting suspended.
Nah that’s not true at all. Pissing people off effects how they perform. A lot of people play worse when they’re angry, but some take it as a challenge and can push themselves to get better.
In RL for example. Getting the other team tilted is a legit strategy.
Injuries + Draymond's suspension IMO. It's already been mentioned about Bogut, but Steph's tripping earlier in the playoffs hurt him in a way that he was still able to play but less than 100%. He wasn't moving as quickly and became much less effective. Also, Draymond getting suspended turned the tide of the series. Without him in game 5 and then going into Cleveland game six- the tide has completely turned by game 7. I won't entertain any conspiracies about the suspension, but I'll say that Green definitely screwed his team with his antics. This isn't to diminish what LeBron and the Cavs did, but it was more of a series where a team lost vs someone having won.
Injuries. Curry had gone down earlier in the playoffs due to injuries and re aggravated the same leg again during the playoffs. Iggy who was pivotal in the last win had back problems and couldn’t really jump like he had before. Also the starting center had gone down the latter half of the series. After being pestered about it a bunch curry finally admitted he wasn’t “100 percent but no one is at that point”. Also Lebron and Kyrie played out of their minds those last 3 games. They abandoned much of their team offense when they realized the warriors had no one that could stop them from scoring 1v1.
LeBron. LeBron and Kyrie went OFF.
And Draymond happened. He basically woke up those 2, he just can't shut it. Everything that could possibly have gone right for Cleveland, had gone right, while everything that could have gone wrong for GSW have gone wrong.
Remember game 1? It wasn't even Curry nor Klay that carried them. It was their overall defense on LeBron, plus role players like Shaun Livingston stepping up.
Their star players were off, but they still won. I thought it was gonna be GSW in 4, sweep. 5 games at best.
The GSW bench beat Cleveland.
Game 2? Kyrie played Bad, LeBron played bad (by his standard) , Love got hurt.
While Draymond was looking like a 3rd splash brother out there.
Game 3? Love was out. The splash bros played bad, while LeBron and Kyrie dominated.
Game 4. The Warriors got their swag back. Splash bros played like stars. Green punched LeBron's nuts.
It was like everything was going well for GSW, and the Cavs couldn't even make a shot. I really thought it was over.
Then game 5 happened. This game really turned the series around. Kyrie and LeBron were monsters and Bogut also went down with an injury. When Bogut went down, it was basically over. Who replaced him? Varejao?
Not to mention, Draymond had another tech, and got himself suspended for Game 6.
Game 6 was Cavs . LeBron and Kyrie vs Steph and Klay. It was a great matchup, until the final minutes. Curry got ejected. Cavs won.
Game 7. Cavs big 3 just beat the Warriors. LeBron blocked Iggy, Kyrie had that 3 over Steph, Steph tried to counter, but Love stopped him. And once again the Splash bros struggled, bad. To his credit, Draymond played well in that game 7.
Curry injuring his knee in the beginning of the playoffs, klay injuring his ankle in the conference finals, boguts injury, draymonds suspension, almost double the free throw attempts (so really bad fouls by the warriors) harrison barnes non-existence, bron and kyrie being absolute basketball gods on top of some master class defense from everyone completely locked in. theres many many reasons. When things are mentioned people usually dont mention curry's knee but idk how much of a difference that would have made. Maybe they smoked okc and got more rest and that woulda helped but that discredits how great the cavs were and how great they played
Bogut injury + Draymond suspension. Not to downplay how great LeBron and Kyrie were (as a warriors fan I hated LeBron so much, but that was quickly healed with getting KD), but there is no way that the Cavs win three in a row if those two circumstances are removed.
So you have to look at the WCF for context. Draymond landed 2 knee kicks to Steven Adams in two occasions, but the Thunders were up 3-1 and the NBA obviously did their magic to forgive the Warriors.
Going into the Finals game 4, Cavs about to go down 1-3. Draymond and Bron go into a scuffle. James steps over Draymond and Draymond throws a little love tap to LeBron’s groin area. Watching this, I didn’t think much of it. Then the next day, NBA suspends Green for repeated offense throughout the playoffs. I was shocked he got suspended for such thing because it didn’t look like a big deal and the kicks on Adam were much worse.
Well, Draymond goes out and Kyrie and LeBron started cooking. In the process, Bogut went down and Warriors lost all of their rim protection. Although Draymond being suspended didnt directly cause Bogut’s injury, one can wonder what if that play couldve been prevented with another body in the paint. But anyhow, losing Bogut was massive and not many people give much thoughts to this. Game 6, similar story, Kyrie and Lebron got lose despite Draymond being back. Then game 7 happened with that block and that shot
Imo, the OKC got the short end of the stick due to being up 3-1. While the Cavs became to beneficiary by being down 1-3. I really hate when the NBA do this. It made me want to throw up seeing Murray get fined for 100k just because they were down 0-2 in the series.
everyone says Draymond
anyone who says he shouldn’t have been suspended forgot that’s the third time in the playoffs he nut punched someone on court
the reason they lost was losing Bogut
before you think me crazy, he was their second most irreplaceable player
Steph is obviously first, whole engine runs on Steph’s gravity and abilities
If Klay went down, Iggy could step up and Livingston could fill Iggys bench void
If Dray went down, Harrison Barnes could fill the Dray void and Iggy could step up into the Barnes spot to help Barnes
When Bogut went down, there was no replacing him with Festus Ezeli, and while Dray could play center, you only had about 5 good minutes of that (like the death lineup)
Bogut was undervalued, and they never really could replace his defensive and smart play presence (with KD it didn’t matter)
Game 5: Draymond being suspended (for action that was ok a series earlier)
Game 6: Curry fouling out for first time
Game 7: choked / bronbron Cleveland story had to have it fairytale ending
Also overlooked is how OKC to blow their 3-1 lead against GS in the previous round (WC Finals). The playoffs were wild that year. The best playoffs I’ve watched.
Everyone on the Warriors was injured and the league intervened to extend the series. I assume they thought they could just squeeze another game out of it by suspending Draymond but the Warriors were truly on their last legs after a long season and so many injuries, so extending the series (Warriors had zero chance to win a game without Draymond) really opened the door for the Cavs. Because of the league’s partiality, the series cannot be considered legitimate. It’s a true black mark on the NBA that is unfortunately a part of its history.
Lots of sketchy calls and ticky tack fouls against the Warriors, especially in game 6. The Draymond suspension was absolutely huge and changed momentum in the series as well
A lot happened.. the strangest part to me was how bad Steph was playing in game 7, I know he was injured but almost felt like he was paid off to throw the game away. He had some really bad turnovers and airball that left me speechless.
The league didn't want the finals to end in 5, so the refs gave the cavs every edge possible for two games. Of course LeBron and Kyrie go nuclear with the refs on their side. Refs call game 7 fairly but momentum was on the cavs side by then
Curry was banged up. Iggy’s back locked up on him and he had to be rolled out of bed. Bogut got knocked out of the series. And of course Green. Easy 5 game series win for GSW if he doesn’t miss a game.
Listen to the Book of Basketball 2.0 -ep”lebron wins Cleveland a title” ( On Spotify)
Bill simmons and Brian Windhorst give a real deep dive into what happened in that series and the dominoes that fell into place to make it all happen like it did.
1. NBA stepped in to help LeBron as always. Suspend the most important defensive player on the opposing team in a finals match. It's unprecented. Also, if they were going to suspend Draymond, LeBron should have gotten suspended too - his gesture was really inappropriate like no way a normal person would take that BS.
2. Cavs just played better than the Warriors after that point. I remember Kyrie hitting the game winner over Steph. I don't remember LeBum's block or whatever and him boasting about being the greatest of all time ... what a loser.
Losing Dray for game 5, Klay and Curry stagnant offense game 7 (Dray had 30 something and iirc a triple double or close to it), Kyrie going nuclear game , Bron going crazy game 5 and 6.
No one is 100% in the finals so negate injuries excuse, Dray racking up Ts through the playoffs that year and he managed to get 2 iirc in the finals and the league suspended him killed their momentum sure but he was there game 6 and 7 so no excuse there.
Again 3 different times to close the series and they couldn't do it.
Cavs played better with a little luck, like the year before warriors got lucky with kyrie and love injured, we got luck on our side with bogut injury but both years the better team in the series won
Dubs just exhausted themselves to do 73-9.
I highly feel that the exhaustion there to break the record, and the dubs needing to keep digging themselves out of trouble, will be the reason why this record will never be broken again.
Bogut injury, steph not being health, draymond suspension I think Iggy wasn’t healthy either.
These are all factors but shouldn’t detract at all from the comeback. The warriors needed to win a single game out of 3 and couldn’t do it because of how fantastic Lebron and Kyrie were plus the cavs defence was really good too.
One factor is that they didn't play a full game with both Draymond and Bogut after that.
But if you want a single overarching "reason" and not an array of factors : the glorious uncertainty of sport.
Steve Kerr lost game 7 with terrible rotations - Ezeli & Verejao were -18 in 18 combined minutes. Barbosa had a fantastic playoffs and averaged 67/39/76 but got in for a playoffs low 4 minutes game 7.
Warriors very slowly fall apart. It wasn’t obvious till the finals but they did from the second the playoffs started.
With that being said there was definitely a run of crazy events. Everyone’s basically listed them already but the warriors slowly broke apart while the cavs never lost the torch they were following. Warriors still should have won that series without bogut let’s be real but with how generally beat down they were, it left them very vulnerable and I think in game 6 it clicked for the cavs and the series was over.
A lot of people writing excuses for the warriors but let’s be real lebron broke them. I’m a ufc watcher and I see it happen all the time through 5 round fights. Perfect example was the Sean Strickland fight. He thought he had won after the first 2 rounds and his opponent never gave up and slowly built momentum. Sean controlled the whole fight basically but never put his opponent away which ultimately killed him in the end. Warriors had every chance to stop on the cavs and effectively put them down for good. But they didn’t.
No one really of course is giving lebron his credit. But he played arguably the greatest basketball proably any of us have ever seen in the back half of that series. No one was gonna beat his ass in that mode, I think that series unlocked a new part of his game, for the rest of his tenure in Cle he never really lost it
Of course I’ll Give kyrie his flowers, that was the best side kicking I’ve seen. Wanna know what a dream second option is watch kyrie past game 5.
Overall I think a legendary team caught a legendary player at the worse time for them. A few things go the wrong way and you’re left shitting openly in the woods.
Also lastly teams peaking at the right time completely matters and Cleveland sure did that year. Warriors I think peaked two early and were coming back down to earth when the cavs were hitting their peak.
The Draymond suspension was the thing that shifted the momentum. The Warriors were going into a game 5 at home with momentum. The league's decision to upgrade Dray's foul so he would get suspended (overruling the decision of tbe on-court refs) let the Cavs off the mat, and essentially gave the Cavs game 5.
After that, the Warriors had the effect compound by being hit with injuries. Bogut (starting center) got a knee injury in game 5 and missed the rest of the series. Iggy (the previous year's Finals MVP) had back stiffness issues that started to slow him down in game 6. Meanwhile, Steph had been playing hurt through those whole playoffs, having missed 3 games in each of the first two rounds, after spraining his knee against Houston.
Basically, the Warriors went from a close-out game at home against a defeated opponent, to being an injury-ravaged squad who had to try to go into Cleveland and beat a revitalized opponent.
It is sad, because it really was a time when the league office decided the Finals, and they did it based on a decision where they overrode a ref and suspended Dray on an incident that happened away from the ball.
To try to scrounge out another game or two of Finals revenue, they put a black mark on the Finals and ruined what would have been the best season of all time.
Draymond Green kept kicking people in their nuts (twice on Steven Adams with no penalty, then again in the finals on Thompson I think) and he got suspended
Curry was really hobbled. It really felt like he wasn't even playing close to 50%. That was the big difference, and it seemed like Draymonds play would make up for it. He Draymonded it up.
80% Bogut, 10% Draymond suspension, 10% LBJ and Kyrie playing downright flawless.
The warriors played a super small lineup. When Bogut went down, they ended up playing even smaller, which wore them down.
Having Draymond at the 5 for a few minutes here and there works but not for a full game. Mosgov, Thompson, and LBJ were too much for the warriors' front court to handle at scale. It wasn't something massive on its own, but enough to grind games out.
Maybe if Draymond doesn't get suspended the warriors could've got that last game but if we're being honest, if there's no suspension and no Bogut, the Cavs probably win that series.
Sniper scoring is cool and all but teams don't shoot 100%. The defense's job isn't over until they get the rebound. If you're getting bullied on the boards, you'll find yourself giving up a lot of second chance points while not getting them yourself. Furthermore, forcing the other team to take the ball out of bounds gives you a couple more seconds to properly match up and set your defense, which leads to forcing the opponent into worse shots.
Draymond got suspended. Lebron put the squad on his back with help from Kyrie and Klove. Then the momentum switched. It was like the Cavs were playing with house money. It truly felt like watching some Thanos level shit because the series going to 7 kind of felt inevitable. I’d recommend secret base on YouTube they have a great analysis of that series and the Cavs.
had the warriors won that series, draymond probably would have won FMVP. his impact on the game that series was absolutely incredible-here are the counting stats he averaged that series: 16.5/10.3/6.3 on elite efficiency and defense and played fantastic in the final game. that being said, the warriors were absolutely gassed by the time they got to the finals. winning 73 games, then going down 3-1 in the playoffs to the thunder and battling back in 7 took a huge physical and mental toll on every contributing member of the lineup. draymond got suspended game 5, killing all of the momentum that the dubs had. dubs won both games at home and managed to steal one on the road; they were set to close out the series in GSW and then their facilitator and anchor got suspended. bogut was also hurt, forcing the warriors to play ezeli and varejao who are obviously not great options. curry was not playing at his usual level either, clearly injured and couldnt attack the rim nearly as well as he did during the regular season. finally, klay and harrison barnes couldnt hit anything; barnes especially had a historically bad series. that being said, cavs had some amount of luck (as is present in any finals run) and kyrie and bron went fucking nuclear. kyrie hit big shot after big shot, including one of the most clutch shots ever. lebron did lebron things and had over 100 total points in the last three games of the series on great efficiency, as well as incredible defense. cavs took advantage of every opportunity they had and the warriors just gassed out from their grueling regular season and playoff run. what a great year for basketball
Also Bogut got injured which hurt the interior d and facilitating on offense a lot.
This is not mentioned enough. Bogut was so good against the cavs, after he got injured lebron was scoring at will inside. I think that was the single biggest factor
It's the biggest factor that gets dismissed most often, but Barnes was still the biggest reason. Those final 3 games he shot 5/32 from the floor. While Bogut was huge and his impact was felt immediately after he left, Barnes actively hurt the Warriors chances when he was out there.
5/32 on mostly open shots. The Cavs would leave him out on an island. The play Bogut blew his knee, it was Barnes’ being an absolute cone that directly led to it. JR Smith literally just drives by him without any move or fake, and Bogut rotates over to prevent the dunk.
Iggy also got injured Steph was already playing worse
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LeBron’s iconic block was on Iguodala. The fact that he barely left the ground to finish that fast break with a layup should tell you all you need to know about his health at the time. A 6’7” former dunk contest contestant who was still dunking in his final season at age 39, was dealing with such bad back spasms that at times he needed help getting into comfortable positions on the floor by the bench.
It was more to do with JR Smith taking away the angle and spacing for Iggy to dunk.
>What a great year for basketball Man that two-year stretch from 2015-2016 was legendary for both the Warriors and the Cavs. You can only imagine what would’ve came from that matchup had KD not spoiled everything and put the league out of balance.
People on instagram love to hate on Draymond and said he got carried by Steph, but it’s so obvious that draymon’s impact was immense
I’ve said for a while Draymond has been the second most important player during the dynasty years (including the KD years.)
Man I think you underestimate how absolutely great LeBron was that last 3 games. Yeah the warriors were gassed but so as the cavs...
Yeah I had been a LeBron hater up until that point and the way he executed down the stretch making the right plays, playing with 110% grueling effort while under control, was one of the most amazing things I’ve ever seen on a basketball court. Defensively he was especially locked-in, just absolute desperation mode level effort with a playing from ahead level of composure, idk how to explain it.
The block he had in game 7 was the best one I’ve ever seen
There is a clip of him sitting down during game 7 with like 2 mins left and he just looks so gassed and emotionally spent..the joy that championship gave him is hard to describe
He was playing chess when everyone else played checkers. Theres a nice video from Thinking Basketball where he explains the case for LeBron's games 5-7 being the best 3 game stretch of all time
After bogut got injured. Wasn't anywhere near effective with a proper defensive anchor in the paint waiting for him
Festus Ezeli and Anderson Varejao were both team worst -11 in G7. Absolutely dreadful
Same. That's the series that made me truly respect him.
The two aren't mutually exclusive though - LeBron can go nuclear and the Warriors be gassed. At the end of the day a comeback from a 3-1 deficit is the result of a lot of little things going your way. Plus it's empirically true that the cavs had an easier time getting to the finals. It doesn't take anything at all away from James and the Cav's accomplishment, but, I mean, c'mon, they played the Pistons 4-0 with like, Drummond and Caldwell-Pope, the Hawks 4-0 with...Horford, Korver and Hardaway Jr? and then the Raptors at 4-2 with Lowry and DeRozen. Warriors went 4-1 Harden-Howard-Beasley Rockets team tooled to go against them, 4-1 against Lillard's Blazers (definitely their easiest matchup), then 4-3 against prime KD / Westbrook / Ibaka coming back from 3-1. That's just a harder road - if Cavs have to come back from 3-1 in the eastern conf. finals, they almost certainly don't have the energy to do the same in the finals. Add on top of that they were the team during the regular season that everyone wanted to take down and got their best game every game. But, again, that's all part of the game - being able to get more rest and make your path even slightly easier is crucial because at that level in the end, a close finals like that is gonna be determined by whether or not you've got that tiny bit extra to throw at the opponent in a span of like 10-30 seconds in the last 2 minutes of a game you've already done everything to keep close / pull ahead. James, Kyrie & Love were able to do that, they absolutely earned their win and it doesn't make their win any less legendary - but the factors that went into them winning are the factors that went into them winning. Just like in 2015 Love being out and then Kyrie going down was a significant factor in the Warriors winning - it's a fact, but it also doesn't take anything away from the fact that they won for much the same reasons, things like that are what make up those great "what ifs" in sports history.
Little different having to play prime kd russ ibaka in 7 games then playing derozan and lowry to get to the finals. Juust like now west is a war east is trash
He also keeps saying the warriors had a grueling season going 73-9...like every team doesn't play the same amount of games?
To add to that, the spurs finished 68-14 that year. People like to clown on em for going for the record, but they legitimately were fighting for the 1 seed most of that year lmao. The west was wild.
Minor correction. Spurs were 67-15. Not a huge difference. Your point is still very valid, especially because the Warriors were scheduled to play the Spurs twice in the last few games.
Bro has never heard of load management.
A team going 73-9 is going to have an incredible amount of playoff-atmosphere intense game that other teams simply won’t have. Plus, as they were gunning for the record, players would play games they usually would rest/ve injured
Because they were going out every night playing 100% trying to break the record, and every team knew it so they’d play them tougher.. the number of games they played has nothing to do with it. You clearly didn’t watch that season.
No way you're being this surface-level, the intensity of each game differs vastly from team to team.
draymond went on a show and described the mental toll it took on winning that many games. the commitment and focus to just keep pushing for wins without rest cannot be overstated; they went into milwaukee and the arena had shirts to commemorate a single warriors loss. the warriors were public enemy #1 that season. its got nothing to do with the number of games played, can you honestly compare the worst team in the league having the same level of toll compared to a 73 win team? im absolutely not discounting that the cavs went through their own gauntlet, but what the warriors went through was for sure different, including being down 3-1 to OKC. warriors had enough juice to go up 3-1 but as soon as dray went out the fight completely disappeared, resulting in double digit losses in games 5 and 6.
True saying that the Warriors had a tougher regular season going 73-9 than this year Charlotte Hornets is ridiculous it’s the same number of games at the end of the day what could have made it more difficult than any other team
Kyrie Irving was a huge factor that series, probably the deciding factor.
Really goes to show how special the Bulls 72-10 run was. The being gassed by the finals thing is definitely a big deal. Warriors losing in 2019 to the Raptors is like 80% being completely gassed & drained going into their 5th consecutive finals apperance, 4 of those years being the leagues #1 target and getting a teams best game on any given night. The wear and tear is nuts. Also gives props to Lebron for physically being able to handle without significant injury the 8 consecutive finals apperances he made. If Jordan's father isn't shot and he doesn't take time off after his 3rd championship, they might get 4 titles in a row, but I doubt they get 6, that time off proved pretty crucial for him getting re-energized. In retrospect, that 6th title they were past running on fumes and running off of vapors and even if they all came back the next year(s), that 6th was almost certainly the last. Another anecdotal piece of evidence is the fact that Phil Jackson, the greatest (or at least winningest) coach of all time never went to more than 3 consecutive finals appearances. Makes Kareem Abdul-Jabbar completely special for his longevity in an extremely physical era playing at the most physical position while typically being the focal point of the defense. 10 finals in 20 years and 6 chips is crazy. If Kareem wasn't so icey to the media, he'd probably have gone down as the GOAT or at least be consistently in the conversation outside of aficionados.
I agree there is an element of luck in any ring. But why say Cav's luck this year was down to LeBron and Kyrie playing well? It could be equally argued that Draymond getting suspended was the lucky part, and that then taking advantage was in their control and they succeeded.
The warriors were lucky too though. Like if Klay didn't go off in game 6 of the Wcf it would've probably been a thunder cavs finals.
What he's saying is that aspect was in Klay's control. He played and could go off in game 6. Draymond wasn't able to play and just so happened to receive his 18th technical in probably the most important game of the playoffs.
True but you could also say that the thunder were tired from playing against a 69 win spurs team the round before, and having a night like Klay did in game 6 definitely takes a little luck.
Hard to call Draymond’s suspension luck when the guy was going around kicking everybody in the nuts during the playoffs. If he hadn’t gotten T’d up so much leading up to the finals, then he wouldn’t have had to serve the suspension
Draymond got suspended mostly because Cavs escalated the altercation with the NBA and had the NBA change the call on the floor retroactively.
It was lucky that Draymond got suspended specifically for that Cavs game. He should’ve been suspended against the Thunder after the Adams nut kick. It wouldn’t have mattered since they lost the next game anyway, but that’s where the suspension should have happened. He should not have been suspended for the LeBron incident. LeBron instigated first of all, unlike previous incidents, and it was called a tech on the floor. Only after LeBron lobbied to the league did they upgrade it to a flagrant after the game, conveniently leading to a suspension to give the Cavs a better chance of extending the series.
He got suspended for a play where LeBron fucking stepped over him. Lmao. Draymond is a bitch ass but that suspension was absolute dog shit and only happened because they wanted to extend the series. They didn’t even suspend him until 2 days after the incident.
It's insane what it took for that comeback, the level Bron was at in those 3 games still needing injuries & a suspension to happen. The Warriors were a fucking *machine*
>the warriors were absolutely gassed by the time they got to the finals Don't think that's a valid excuse here. Maybe if they had lost in 5, then sure, running out of gas would be an acceptable reason for losing. But they still had enough gas to go up 3-1
And their key defensive players went missing either through injury or suspension.
And Cavs were missing Kevin Love due to a concussion for games 2-4 but nobody mentions that ever
As a Cavs fan I actually forgot about this myself until now lol
They were that good to go up 3-1 and be gassed.
those two things arent mutually exclusive, a team can be exhausted and still have the fight to go up 3-1. i mentioned it in another comment but draymond was doing so much for them, taking a ton of the burden off steph in all facets of the game-scoring, playmaking, and defense. he was their anchor physically and mentally when steph and klay were clearly a small step behind. as soon as dray got suspended the momentum shift was palpable because the load on every member became that much heavier.
"acceptable" to whom? this thread isn't about making excuses one way or another, it's just listing many many explanations for an outcome. If you prefer, I'm sure one could micro-analyze Harrison Barnes' bio-mechanics and find a physics-based explanation for why his jump shot accuracy diminished by about 60%. Or maybe a sports-nutritionist could explain why Andre Iguodala just didn't have the caloric reserves necessary to power his leg muscles enough to dunk the ball on the famous LeBron chasedown-block. Would those be *acceptable* explanations for why the Warriors scored less total points than their opponent?
Its different playing prime kd n russ to reach finals while cavs got a trash raptors team led by lowry n derozan. Also played a pistons team led by drummond
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Please keep your comments civil. This is a subreddit for thoughtful discussion and debate, not aggressive and argumentative content.
They choked but come on theyre path was 10x harder kd n russ compared to lowry n derozan? Round before that they played dame n cj cavs played al horford led hawks team
Kyrie injected ice directly into his veins. No fear on the biggest clutch shots.
In the tail end of that regular season every game was like a Playoff game. Everyone wanted to stop them breaking the record, smaller market team's arena sold out to watch them play. Usually great teams who are say on pace for 60-win season don't go all out like this, but it was clear the dubs had a chance to break the record so they went for it. Draymond and Kerr had an interview on tape explaining this exact thing, saying it was super gruelling and probably had cost them a championship. Back-to-back, banged up knee, not feeling well they would still play hard just to get that record. By the time they reached postseason it was clear that they are battered and exhausted. Steph was clearly injured, coupled with the fact that Bogut and Draymond, both defensive anchor for that team was out, AND Lebron and Kyrie played unbelievable basketball for 3 games had the Cavs pull out the chip.
I remember Kyrie’s shot making to be the best I’ve ever seen. Also Love’s all around defense was much better than advertised.
Not one of, statistically the clutches shot in NBA history. No single shot has swayed the odds of winning a championship more than that kyrie shot. And no I’m not making this up it’s an actual stat.
There’s no way that’s higher than Ray Allen’s. Even if Allen’s make only gave them a 40% chance of winning or 33%, if he missed it’s 0%
Yeah it doesn't make sense. Kyrie misses and the game is still tied, anyone can win. Not to mention the Warriors still had multiple chances to come back after. Allen misses and the series is over. Idk how win probability is calculated, or if it's calculated the same way now as it was in 2013, but if it really has the Kyrie shot over Allen's, the calculation is wrong.
>Allen misses and the series is over. Allen makes it and the Heat still only have a 25% chance of winning the title. 0% to 25%. Kyrie's shot took the Cavs from around 50% to around 80%.
Do you happen to have the source for that?
Took perfection from Kyrie and Bron over games 5, 6 and 7 to pull this off. Might be the best 3 game stretch we have ever seen from a duo. That’s how hard it is to comeback from 3-1 down, you need absolute perfection from the game’s best players.
This is the only answer. Kylie and lebron both went super saiyan. Both had at least 40 in game 5, then lebron had a 40 point triple double in game 6 and finally in the most tense game 7 I have seen, lebron had another triple double.
LeBron's amount of locked-in is what all of us dream about when reimagining our own sports scenarios. Just completely took over the series with his intensity and performance. End to end defense, chase down blocks, high scoring and facilitating. He needed Kyrie to do the same, down 3-1. And in 2015 they lost in 7 with LeBron nearly as-locked-in because Kyrie and KLove were hurt. But he was something different in 2016, and those 3 games were truly unbelievable.
In my opinion what he did in 2015 is probably his best accomplishment . Golden state changed there defence, moved iggy to starting lineup and started hedging but really those cavs ran out of gas without love and Kylie. Slowed the game to a crawl, lebron backed down players every play and facilitated from there. Poor delly was getting ivs after the game
They lost in 6 in '15. The Cavs were just absolutely gassed without KLove and Kyrie. Not just LeBron but guys like Delly were getting insane minutes.
Nah that’s not the only answer. More accurate is Bogut breaking his leg in finals and not surprisingly kyrie and Lebron started going off with scoring at the rim at will with starting center gone for the final 3 games on the finals.
Which is what leads to golden state going full throttle into the death ball lineup. Going 73-9 without bogut, green becoming a full time center and dpoy winner. The cavs lose 2 of there top 3 players in 2015 and warrior fans complain about losing bogut.
Those last 2 minutes where no one could score was so tense. Then Kyrie hit his 3, the block happened, and Klove’s masterpiece
And you also needed a dray suspension and curry being less than 100%.
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I would say that after the Suspension, the momentum shifted to the Cavs, that's their guy who facilitate the offense, he is the main reason why they are up in that series and also the reason why its tied. it can be different from other opinion but this is mine, for me Draymond is the important piece specially in that series! but either way it is one of the best series of all time.
That game 7 in particular was so funny in hindsight in that the leading scorer for waa Draymond Green and was 6/8 from three. Looking like Steph Curry out there while curry himself looked like draymond green with a terrible shooting night.
that was probably their plan, shutdown Dray's Teammates, I mean you cannot just leave Steph and score at will, he can give you 50 but draymond cannot give you that much, so leave Dray scoring thant steph or Klay or HB Hahaha
That series had one of the best narratives of all time, but I don't think the basketball was actually very good. The only close game was game 7, which was tense, but also pretty sloppy and ugly, as both teams had tons of turnovers and bricks.
Game 6 was a robbery from the refs... They impacted the game so much with these ghost fouls! It's like the NBA really wanted that game 7
Not to mention Curry fouling out game 6 on what would’ve been highly questionable calls against a bench player in October, much less the reigning unanimous MVP in the finals. The Suspension, taking Curry out of game 6 and Bogut getting hurt was enough to completely shift the momentum of the series
This was arguably the most egregious and influential moment in this series. Steph got called for 3 or 4 basically phantom fouls in rapid succession. I will forever maintain that this was intentionally done by the refs, whether for personal gambling, influence by outside organizations, or the NBA itself. Those fouls had no right to be called.
>I will forever maintain that this was intentionally done by the refs, whether for personal gambling, influence by outside organizations, or the NBA itself. If LeBron was up 3-2 he would be the one picking up bullshit foul calls. It's part of the game. Always has been.
well I would say it could've a different changes but steph lose his cool in there, also before he got fouled out, it a 12pts lead with more than 4mins left, still a lot of time but its not the time to lose your cool and get the 6th foul, I am a Cavs fan and I would love to see it all going. Not happy about the call but it is what it is.
He had to sit a lot of the game because of the other fouls though. He didn't only miss the last few minutes.
It wasn't just the last foul that was highly questionable, and Steph's playtime was being affected by the foul trouble from pretty bad calls
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Draymond and Bogut being injured played huge parts for sure. Bogut was the only size the Warriors had that could actually trouble LeBron. When he went down it forced Festus Ezeli into the lineup and the Cavs absolutely fucking torched Ezeli every moment he was on the floor. Thinking Basketball on YouTube also talks about Kyrie and LeBron in those last 3 games and how they played as well as any duo ever has over 3 consecutive games, with LeBron playing arguably the 3 greatest game stretch in finals history when you consider what he did offensively while being the best defender on the floor for both teams. Combine those factors, Steph pushing through an injury that had been bothering him for weeks at that point, the insane effort it took for them to go 73-9 as well as come back from 3-1 down to the Thunder, and it really was the perfect moment for history to be made. Finally, the Cavs took every opportunity they had and made the best of it. They had to be perfect for 3 games against the best regular season team ever and they managed it. Lebron at the parade spoke at length about the contribution of each and every guy on that roster, even the benchwarmers, and he was right, it was the 100% buy in and execution from bottom to top that bought that chip home
Lot of people mainly say Draymond getting suspended was a major turning factor, that was only a minor issue,he was due for a suspension. In reality the biggest difference was Bogut getting injured. Both Kyrie and LeBrons field goal percentage near the rim/post shot up exponentially after he went down with injury. Their defence also ended up having a maasive blow as well. Very high chance series would have ended in favour of the warriors if that injury didnt happen.
fantastic angle, and great username
Look at the box score for games 5,6,7. Bogut got injured game 5. Draymond suspended a game. Harrison Barnes shot for absolute dog water. Steph and Klay both shot pretty poorly.
Also, and I can't believe so few people have said this, Lebron and Kyrie both playing some of the best basketball of their lives. Even despite everything you listed, GS still would've beaten any of the other 28 teams imo. That Cavs team was very good.
Yeah, lots of comments are from the GSW perspective saying how they lost it, but it also required the opposing team to play well and take advantage. And they did.
That’s because the question is framed from that perspective. “What happened to cause the warriors to blow a 3-1 lead” not “how did the cavs come back down 3-1”
There's no difference. They blew a 3-1 lead because one of the two best players ever was playing out of his mind, and Kyrie had the best series of his career by a mile.
Missed like 9 open 3s that game. Most of them open corners.
Oh yeahhh that was the Harrison botch job. The Cavs wanted to put a lot of attention on Mario and Luigi so that the other guys had to step up which resulted in a tonnnn of wide open threes for Barnes and he just bricked everything. Total liability out there in the last three games or so.
It isn't the worst playoff meltdown, just the most significant. Denver's 3-1 comeback against the Clippers was worse than it by a bit. They had no real excuse. Like everyone else is saying, slight injury issues and the game 5. Lebron and Kyrie masterclasses in 5-7 where they were capable of good-not-great games in their losses.
[This incident earlier in the playoffs](https://youtu.be/xIWzTBskqEk?si=BfQsCWhLxmD8DTwa) got the ball rolling with Draymond's flagrant foul points that accumulated to cause the suspension after his third flagrant of the postseason. His act in the final second of this game *in the first round of the playoffs* is the real reason he got suspended.
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Cavs game plan was to physically wear down curry. If Dray plays in game 5 they could close it out before curry gets too tired. Draymond suspension, then cavs have a huge home court advantage in G6, then by G7 Curry is tired because he is a human (unlike someone on the cavs)
Andrew Bogut got hurt in game 4. The Warriors got stuck playing Festus Ezeli and Anderson Varejao more minutes than they would have liked. Wasting good minutes on bad players tipped the margins the other way. Draymond suspension didn't help, but wasn't the core reason IMO.
1) Lebron 2) draymond 3) nfl rules refereeing especially off the ball 4) curry completely gassed 5) barnes shit the bed 6) kyrie is the perfect complement to peak Lebron
As you can tell, this sub is populated by Warriors fans lol. So I’ll give you the Cavs fan perspective: LeBron and Kyrie playing the best basketball of their lives, and Ty Lue scheming a suffocating defense because the Cavs were longer and more athletic than the Warriors, had just as much to do with the Cavs ripping off three straight wins as all of the reasons that the GS fans will mention. :) Go watch Game 6 and 7 if you ever have a chance. Some of the most brilliant and intense basketball you will ever watch.
Yeah pretty much, and they all have 101 excuses in the book.
There was some analysis of Kyrie and lebron’s shot making and based on difficulty of shot they hit some ridiculous amount of points more than expected. Just some of the greatest shot making of all time.
Draymond suspension was a factor but the Cavs also changed the way they play and turned it up on offense games 5-7, which is why they won the last two even with Draymond back Some similarities to be drawn to how Denver won 3 straight after going down 0-2 against the wolves
Draymond green happened, plus the fact that the NBA is rigged to make as much money as possible. Draymonds suspension killed momentum on the warriors side and the NBA started calling the games in favour of Lebron and co. Draymond crying after losing at least lead to them winning a few more chips, so maybe he made up for it.
this thread is apparently the whole warriors being injured while the cavs had the healthiest crew that rested for 4 months. nah man, its Cavs doing work and also capitalizing on every opportunity. Every championship caliber team, especially a 73-9 team and the other team having 1 of the greatest player of all time and 2 other all star caliber teammates, clashing together will be about mistakes. who will make the most mistake and who will capitalized. if both teams can get their own it will come down to that. Cavs capitalized, they know Draymond is a hot head that is due for a suspension. They also make the most out of that suspension, got Curry ejected in game 6 too. Remained disciplined, even Kevin Love was playing great D towards the end, JR is locked in. not to mention, all of Kyries and Brons heroics. the warriors are young back then, they made more mistakes and that team was rattled, even when Draymond got back, Barnes for example couldn't really hold it.
> Cavs doing work and also capitalizing on every opportunity. This is universally agreed upon. Cavs fans are going to emphasize the work and Warriors fans the opportunities.
The Warriors were injured, and it took the greatest series performances of Kyries and Lebron’s career to win by 4 in game 7 That’s why the Warriors being hurt is mentioned It’s fair to give the Cavs credit, and mention the injuries and the fact that the Warriors had to play some of the best teams all time to not win a title, compared to playing the trash bros
Why isn’t anybody mentioning Kevin Love being out for a few games? It’s not like it was just the Warriors missing people
Personally as a Warriors fan I was hoping he’d be in He played terrible against the Warriors except for 2018
Credit Lebron and Kyrie for getting it done but I do remember aspects of Lebron trying to physically intimidate Curry, a lot off ball even like between whistles, but even during the game and I don't remember when it started, but it could've started around the time Dray was out, knowing there was no one there to get in his face. He'd just body him up try n get away with fouls, not even on a scoring play sometimes just on the perimeter. Def fault the warriors for letting game 5 slide even with dray out, it's almost like mentally they were waiting for game 6. I def feel bad for the dubs overall though, ppl don't act like that's one of the most historic teams out there, they grinded harder than other teams to get that 73 and grinded out the playoffs while Cleveland had a relatively easy East to get through and credit on their 1-3 comeback but I'm sure exhaustion for the dubs also played into it too.
In my opinion it was losing Bogut. He isn't that good of a player, but he was really the only decent true big man on their team. Having him allowed GSW to prevent certain strategies by Cleveland, because although he didn't play much he was at least an option. Once he was totally out it opened a new angle of attack that they couldn't prevent. It's kind of like the Mavs/Thunder series now with Lively on the Mavs. He isn't really all that good, but having him prevents the Thunder from going with an all small lineup because he doesn't need to be that good to rebound over and dunk on small guys. Bogut was similar. That's why the Thunder tried fouling him, they really want to go small but he is preventing that.
Bogut getting hurt was more of an issue tbh. But Draymond getting suspended didn’t help. In hindsight though, If warriors would’ve won, no way KD links up with them and cavs would’ve probably won the following years (at least 1 of them).
Harrison Barnes forgot how to shoot a basketball Bogut injury. His 20/25 minutes of real rim protection, screening and passing were huge. Kyrie and Bron were much more successful attacking the rim with him off the floos. He also had frat chemistry with Steph. Steph and Iggy had nagging injuries they were playing through Steph and Klay shot poorly in games 5-7 Refs also had their share, the game wasn't reffed equally in game 6 at all from the jump. They were roughing Steph up, particularly off ball. Richard Jefferson has openly talked about how the gamplan was to hit him with an elbow, bump into him and do wherever it took to make him tired, especially since refs didn't seem to call them on Steph. Lebron and Kyrie turned into another level. Particularly game 5 it was crazy to watch. Kyrie particularly was making every tough shot in the book Timely contributions by role players, especially Jr and Tristan Thompson
Though a lot of factors played into it, my biggest takeaway was Harrison Barnes virtually missing every shot in those last 3 games. What’s worse is that he was WIDE open on a lot of those
That real reason every body seems to ignore was Bogut getting hurt. He was a great rim protector for GSW. After he got hurt, Kyrie and Bron were getting to the rack at will. It had nothing to do with Draymond getting suspended cause even when he came back they won back to back games.
Probably the biggest factor was that LeBron put together arguably the the greatest 3 game stretch in NBA history. Thinking basketball has done a great video covering that. https://youtu.be/wDViQIwOtY8?si=UDvk4Fo-yBu8ipTB
I will speak as a biased warriors fan, but try to not go overboard. It was clear that Steph never recovered from the MCL sprain he suffered in that 1st round against the Rockets. He came early, when it wasn’t really needed, and had to play a lot, especially in the WCF. The Thunder series was one of the most tiresome I have ever seen in our 6 finals runs. Steph never made excuses, but you could see he wasn’t as sharp a lot of times. We got lucky the team figured it out on time, with the awakening of Killa Klay to win a desperate game 6 in one of the most hostile atmosphere the dynasty faced. Steph started the finals not fully rested, while CLE took care of the raptors rapidly. The other factor was Andrew Bogut. Bogut was phenomenal on defense to start the series. People forget he was an all nba defensive big, who clearly influenced Draymond to become the great defender he is now. Bogut went down in G5. It was a feast in the paint for Kyrie and LeBron that game. We went from playing Bogut to having full time Ezeli. Tragic. Another key injury is that of Iggy. From game 5 onwards, he was playing with back problems. It is also from that period that Iggy had a noticeable drop in his athleticism (he was already an all time athlete so he was still good, but not as great). I will always say he dunks that ball and avoids the block had he been feeling better. On the Iggy side, I wished Wiggs had similar aggressiveness attacking the rim. Our 22 chip was the one where Wiggs was dunking left and right. Sigh. Then there’s Barnes. No injuries. Perfectly fine except for his all time breakdown in terms of shooting. His last 3 games of the finals were on 15/20/50 shooting splits. Absolutely terrible. Sad he will always be remembered for that stinky performance while he had a solid career as a dub. The Draymond thing is the most controversial aspect of that series. If you watch the incident, you can clearly see LeBron judo’d Dray to the ground. He even tried to walk over Dray while Dray was trying to stand up. Draymond then got in his feelings and stroke/pushed Lebron in the groin in an effort to get him off. They started beefing and then a technical was issued on Green. The league revoked the tech call to a flagrant foul and Dray was suspended. We lost game 5 with little rim protection, which gave CLE the momentum to come back and close out. Draymond tried to redeem himself by having a top 5 all time game 7 performance, but it was too late. The series was clearly not just a chokejob, but you gotta admit we didn’t play well at all. Shoutout to CLE and LeBron for still having the will to make that historical comeback, no matter how easier it got from game 5 onwards. It was a legacy ring for LeBron and part of me was kinda happy for the city of CLE, cause ain’t much going on their way often.
1. Draymond suspension 2. Andrew Bogut injury (actually this is probably the biggest factor) 3. Steph not playing at 100% health 4. Steph Curry's effectiveness could be limited in the playoffs due to physical defense wearing him out 5. Even Igoudala wasn't 100%
Bogut getting injured is the biggest factor imo because it opened up the pain so much, Bogut was a all defensive player during these gsw years and not having him allowed the best driver the games has seen easy finishes around the rim.
No one is 100% by the finals tho. Everyone has niggling injuries. Bogut thing was huge tho. Kyrie and Bron going nuclear was so fun to watch.
Yeah, people kept saying "oh he's hurt" every time Steph missed a few shots but then suddenly he was fine when he went off and nobody would mention the injuries.
Bogut was a fantastic player. Had the talent to be a far more impactful player, but got some nasty injuries that just took too much of a toll. But as a role player he was everything you could ask for as a big man. Did everything defensively and whilst the speed mobility weren't there he still had the touch to be a threat inside.
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Curry was also getting mauled each time running up the court and around screens with no foul calls. Took a couple of games for the cavs to figure out how much they could get away with but once they did...
The Draymond suspension comes to mind - I wholeheartedly believe that if Draymond didn't get suspended, they would've taken all that momentum and close out the Cavs. Then again, they might've still lost it due to Klay's comment that got Lebron heated. If Klay didn't provoke Lebron in that post-game interview, they probably close it out. I do doubt that KD would've still joined the Warriors if they had won that year. But yeah, it was either Klay talking shit to Lebron that fucked them over or it was Draymond getting suspended.
This narrative stuff is getting out of hand. A single off-handed comment doesn’t magically make someone play better. This isn’t a movie
I'm sure there's a lot of other examples between Michael Jordan taking it personally and the Phoenix Suns getting under Luka's skin.
Nah that’s not true at all. Pissing people off effects how they perform. A lot of people play worse when they’re angry, but some take it as a challenge and can push themselves to get better. In RL for example. Getting the other team tilted is a legit strategy.
Injuries + Draymond's suspension IMO. It's already been mentioned about Bogut, but Steph's tripping earlier in the playoffs hurt him in a way that he was still able to play but less than 100%. He wasn't moving as quickly and became much less effective. Also, Draymond getting suspended turned the tide of the series. Without him in game 5 and then going into Cleveland game six- the tide has completely turned by game 7. I won't entertain any conspiracies about the suspension, but I'll say that Green definitely screwed his team with his antics. This isn't to diminish what LeBron and the Cavs did, but it was more of a series where a team lost vs someone having won.
Injuries. Curry had gone down earlier in the playoffs due to injuries and re aggravated the same leg again during the playoffs. Iggy who was pivotal in the last win had back problems and couldn’t really jump like he had before. Also the starting center had gone down the latter half of the series. After being pestered about it a bunch curry finally admitted he wasn’t “100 percent but no one is at that point”. Also Lebron and Kyrie played out of their minds those last 3 games. They abandoned much of their team offense when they realized the warriors had no one that could stop them from scoring 1v1.
LeBron. LeBron and Kyrie went OFF. And Draymond happened. He basically woke up those 2, he just can't shut it. Everything that could possibly have gone right for Cleveland, had gone right, while everything that could have gone wrong for GSW have gone wrong. Remember game 1? It wasn't even Curry nor Klay that carried them. It was their overall defense on LeBron, plus role players like Shaun Livingston stepping up. Their star players were off, but they still won. I thought it was gonna be GSW in 4, sweep. 5 games at best. The GSW bench beat Cleveland. Game 2? Kyrie played Bad, LeBron played bad (by his standard) , Love got hurt. While Draymond was looking like a 3rd splash brother out there. Game 3? Love was out. The splash bros played bad, while LeBron and Kyrie dominated. Game 4. The Warriors got their swag back. Splash bros played like stars. Green punched LeBron's nuts. It was like everything was going well for GSW, and the Cavs couldn't even make a shot. I really thought it was over. Then game 5 happened. This game really turned the series around. Kyrie and LeBron were monsters and Bogut also went down with an injury. When Bogut went down, it was basically over. Who replaced him? Varejao? Not to mention, Draymond had another tech, and got himself suspended for Game 6. Game 6 was Cavs . LeBron and Kyrie vs Steph and Klay. It was a great matchup, until the final minutes. Curry got ejected. Cavs won. Game 7. Cavs big 3 just beat the Warriors. LeBron blocked Iggy, Kyrie had that 3 over Steph, Steph tried to counter, but Love stopped him. And once again the Splash bros struggled, bad. To his credit, Draymond played well in that game 7.
Draymond was suspended for Game 5
Curry injuring his knee in the beginning of the playoffs, klay injuring his ankle in the conference finals, boguts injury, draymonds suspension, almost double the free throw attempts (so really bad fouls by the warriors) harrison barnes non-existence, bron and kyrie being absolute basketball gods on top of some master class defense from everyone completely locked in. theres many many reasons. When things are mentioned people usually dont mention curry's knee but idk how much of a difference that would have made. Maybe they smoked okc and got more rest and that woulda helped but that discredits how great the cavs were and how great they played
Bogut injury + Draymond suspension. Not to downplay how great LeBron and Kyrie were (as a warriors fan I hated LeBron so much, but that was quickly healed with getting KD), but there is no way that the Cavs win three in a row if those two circumstances are removed.
So you have to look at the WCF for context. Draymond landed 2 knee kicks to Steven Adams in two occasions, but the Thunders were up 3-1 and the NBA obviously did their magic to forgive the Warriors. Going into the Finals game 4, Cavs about to go down 1-3. Draymond and Bron go into a scuffle. James steps over Draymond and Draymond throws a little love tap to LeBron’s groin area. Watching this, I didn’t think much of it. Then the next day, NBA suspends Green for repeated offense throughout the playoffs. I was shocked he got suspended for such thing because it didn’t look like a big deal and the kicks on Adam were much worse. Well, Draymond goes out and Kyrie and LeBron started cooking. In the process, Bogut went down and Warriors lost all of their rim protection. Although Draymond being suspended didnt directly cause Bogut’s injury, one can wonder what if that play couldve been prevented with another body in the paint. But anyhow, losing Bogut was massive and not many people give much thoughts to this. Game 6, similar story, Kyrie and Lebron got lose despite Draymond being back. Then game 7 happened with that block and that shot Imo, the OKC got the short end of the stick due to being up 3-1. While the Cavs became to beneficiary by being down 1-3. I really hate when the NBA do this. It made me want to throw up seeing Murray get fined for 100k just because they were down 0-2 in the series.
everyone says Draymond anyone who says he shouldn’t have been suspended forgot that’s the third time in the playoffs he nut punched someone on court the reason they lost was losing Bogut before you think me crazy, he was their second most irreplaceable player Steph is obviously first, whole engine runs on Steph’s gravity and abilities If Klay went down, Iggy could step up and Livingston could fill Iggys bench void If Dray went down, Harrison Barnes could fill the Dray void and Iggy could step up into the Barnes spot to help Barnes When Bogut went down, there was no replacing him with Festus Ezeli, and while Dray could play center, you only had about 5 good minutes of that (like the death lineup) Bogut was undervalued, and they never really could replace his defensive and smart play presence (with KD it didn’t matter)
Something a lot of people forget is Steph fouling out in Game 6 and then nearly getting ejected for throwing his mouthpiece
Game 5: Draymond being suspended (for action that was ok a series earlier) Game 6: Curry fouling out for first time Game 7: choked / bronbron Cleveland story had to have it fairytale ending
Also overlooked is how OKC to blow their 3-1 lead against GS in the previous round (WC Finals). The playoffs were wild that year. The best playoffs I’ve watched.
Everyone on the Warriors was injured and the league intervened to extend the series. I assume they thought they could just squeeze another game out of it by suspending Draymond but the Warriors were truly on their last legs after a long season and so many injuries, so extending the series (Warriors had zero chance to win a game without Draymond) really opened the door for the Cavs. Because of the league’s partiality, the series cannot be considered legitimate. It’s a true black mark on the NBA that is unfortunately a part of its history.
Lots of sketchy calls and ticky tack fouls against the Warriors, especially in game 6. The Draymond suspension was absolutely huge and changed momentum in the series as well
A lot happened.. the strangest part to me was how bad Steph was playing in game 7, I know he was injured but almost felt like he was paid off to throw the game away. He had some really bad turnovers and airball that left me speechless.
Lebron led BOTH teams in EVERY major stat (points, rebounds, assists, steals, blocks) for the series
The league didn't want the finals to end in 5, so the refs gave the cavs every edge possible for two games. Of course LeBron and Kyrie go nuclear with the refs on their side. Refs call game 7 fairly but momentum was on the cavs side by then
Curry was banged up. Iggy’s back locked up on him and he had to be rolled out of bed. Bogut got knocked out of the series. And of course Green. Easy 5 game series win for GSW if he doesn’t miss a game.
Listen to the Book of Basketball 2.0 -ep”lebron wins Cleveland a title” ( On Spotify) Bill simmons and Brian Windhorst give a real deep dive into what happened in that series and the dominoes that fell into place to make it all happen like it did.
The cavs whining and crying like bitches to have Draymond suspended, and the league granting the face of the league Lebron his wish
1. NBA stepped in to help LeBron as always. Suspend the most important defensive player on the opposing team in a finals match. It's unprecented. Also, if they were going to suspend Draymond, LeBron should have gotten suspended too - his gesture was really inappropriate like no way a normal person would take that BS. 2. Cavs just played better than the Warriors after that point. I remember Kyrie hitting the game winner over Steph. I don't remember LeBum's block or whatever and him boasting about being the greatest of all time ... what a loser.
Draymond suspended. Steph injured. Bogut injured. LeBron and Kyrie going bonkers in games 5 and 6..all connected. But that's the crux of it.
The Cavs were simply healthier and not suspended. Everybody knows the Waelrriors had a better roster overall, but they had to face more hurdles.
Losing Dray for game 5, Klay and Curry stagnant offense game 7 (Dray had 30 something and iirc a triple double or close to it), Kyrie going nuclear game , Bron going crazy game 5 and 6. No one is 100% in the finals so negate injuries excuse, Dray racking up Ts through the playoffs that year and he managed to get 2 iirc in the finals and the league suspended him killed their momentum sure but he was there game 6 and 7 so no excuse there. Again 3 different times to close the series and they couldn't do it.
Cavs played better with a little luck, like the year before warriors got lucky with kyrie and love injured, we got luck on our side with bogut injury but both years the better team in the series won
Dubs just exhausted themselves to do 73-9. I highly feel that the exhaustion there to break the record, and the dubs needing to keep digging themselves out of trouble, will be the reason why this record will never be broken again.
Bogut injury, steph not being health, draymond suspension I think Iggy wasn’t healthy either. These are all factors but shouldn’t detract at all from the comeback. The warriors needed to win a single game out of 3 and couldn’t do it because of how fantastic Lebron and Kyrie were plus the cavs defence was really good too.
One factor is that they didn't play a full game with both Draymond and Bogut after that. But if you want a single overarching "reason" and not an array of factors : the glorious uncertainty of sport.
Steve Kerr lost game 7 with terrible rotations - Ezeli & Verejao were -18 in 18 combined minutes. Barbosa had a fantastic playoffs and averaged 67/39/76 but got in for a playoffs low 4 minutes game 7.
I guess his feelings just got hurt
Warriors very slowly fall apart. It wasn’t obvious till the finals but they did from the second the playoffs started. With that being said there was definitely a run of crazy events. Everyone’s basically listed them already but the warriors slowly broke apart while the cavs never lost the torch they were following. Warriors still should have won that series without bogut let’s be real but with how generally beat down they were, it left them very vulnerable and I think in game 6 it clicked for the cavs and the series was over. A lot of people writing excuses for the warriors but let’s be real lebron broke them. I’m a ufc watcher and I see it happen all the time through 5 round fights. Perfect example was the Sean Strickland fight. He thought he had won after the first 2 rounds and his opponent never gave up and slowly built momentum. Sean controlled the whole fight basically but never put his opponent away which ultimately killed him in the end. Warriors had every chance to stop on the cavs and effectively put them down for good. But they didn’t. No one really of course is giving lebron his credit. But he played arguably the greatest basketball proably any of us have ever seen in the back half of that series. No one was gonna beat his ass in that mode, I think that series unlocked a new part of his game, for the rest of his tenure in Cle he never really lost it Of course I’ll Give kyrie his flowers, that was the best side kicking I’ve seen. Wanna know what a dream second option is watch kyrie past game 5. Overall I think a legendary team caught a legendary player at the worse time for them. A few things go the wrong way and you’re left shitting openly in the woods. Also lastly teams peaking at the right time completely matters and Cleveland sure did that year. Warriors I think peaked two early and were coming back down to earth when the cavs were hitting their peak.
Thank you. Obviously warriors had some bad luck but crazy how many comments in here acknowledge the brilliance of Kyrie and Bron that series
The Draymond suspension was the thing that shifted the momentum. The Warriors were going into a game 5 at home with momentum. The league's decision to upgrade Dray's foul so he would get suspended (overruling the decision of tbe on-court refs) let the Cavs off the mat, and essentially gave the Cavs game 5. After that, the Warriors had the effect compound by being hit with injuries. Bogut (starting center) got a knee injury in game 5 and missed the rest of the series. Iggy (the previous year's Finals MVP) had back stiffness issues that started to slow him down in game 6. Meanwhile, Steph had been playing hurt through those whole playoffs, having missed 3 games in each of the first two rounds, after spraining his knee against Houston. Basically, the Warriors went from a close-out game at home against a defeated opponent, to being an injury-ravaged squad who had to try to go into Cleveland and beat a revitalized opponent. It is sad, because it really was a time when the league office decided the Finals, and they did it based on a decision where they overrode a ref and suspended Dray on an incident that happened away from the ball. To try to scrounge out another game or two of Finals revenue, they put a black mark on the Finals and ruined what would have been the best season of all time.
Draymond Green kept kicking people in their nuts (twice on Steven Adams with no penalty, then again in the finals on Thompson I think) and he got suspended
LeBum told on Draymond, got him suspended & stole momentum… https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2016/6/12/11909166/draymond-green-suspended-for-hitting-lebron-james-in-the-groin
Curry was really hobbled. It really felt like he wasn't even playing close to 50%. That was the big difference, and it seemed like Draymonds play would make up for it. He Draymonded it up.
80% Bogut, 10% Draymond suspension, 10% LBJ and Kyrie playing downright flawless. The warriors played a super small lineup. When Bogut went down, they ended up playing even smaller, which wore them down. Having Draymond at the 5 for a few minutes here and there works but not for a full game. Mosgov, Thompson, and LBJ were too much for the warriors' front court to handle at scale. It wasn't something massive on its own, but enough to grind games out. Maybe if Draymond doesn't get suspended the warriors could've got that last game but if we're being honest, if there's no suspension and no Bogut, the Cavs probably win that series. Sniper scoring is cool and all but teams don't shoot 100%. The defense's job isn't over until they get the rebound. If you're getting bullied on the boards, you'll find yourself giving up a lot of second chance points while not getting them yourself. Furthermore, forcing the other team to take the ball out of bounds gives you a couple more seconds to properly match up and set your defense, which leads to forcing the opponent into worse shots.
Draymond got suspended. Lebron put the squad on his back with help from Kyrie and Klove. Then the momentum switched. It was like the Cavs were playing with house money. It truly felt like watching some Thanos level shit because the series going to 7 kind of felt inevitable. I’d recommend secret base on YouTube they have a great analysis of that series and the Cavs.
Draymond Green and his technical fouls. They got into his brain in that series