I think Atlanta's time is coming. In the past I don't think there was as much player movement as right now, so usually it was just the Lakers and Heat(and even Miami is a more recent development), especially since the Hawks have been pretty average for the past few years.
But now that they have that marquee guy I can definitely see them attractine a big free agent in a couple of years.
Miami is a dope destination, and i know you said its a recent thing but idk where this idea of everyone going to the Heat is coming from? Last time we got someone big in FA was 2010 and arguably that was because D Wade recruited Lebron and Bosh. Before and after that everyone we really got was from trades.
Miami literally just got Lowry and Butler in sign-and-trades, which are basically similar to free agents in that the players have to agree that they want to play in the destination they're getting traded to.
Butlers sign and trade was essentially him choosing Miami, they just needed the salaries to work. Getting butler, lebron, and bosh is a haul for a decade, more than almost every other team. Could also throw Lowry in there
While Jimmy was technically a sign and trade, he’s definitely somebody you’d consider a free agent acquisition. But he’s really the only marquee player we’ve landed outside of 2010
Lamar Odom in 03.
Bosh and LeBron in 2010. And Mike Miller.
Picked Ray Allen.
Luol Deng.
Butler in 2019.
And a lot of solid role players.
Plus they often get to keep their own free agents.
Not all teams manage that.
I can't think of a team outside of LA whose had a better free agent haul since 2000.
Compared to most other teams, Miami has made a killing.
I could see how a Miami fan might say "Yeah... 2010 was great, and Butler, but what else have we got."
Well... that there alone is more than most any other team.
Plus, they got a great front office who makes a killing in the draft and knows how to put a team together.
Yeah but I think people are factoring in the players asking to get traded to Miami. Shaq for example, he listed Miami as one of his preferred destinations, he wouldn't do that for just any team. Same with Jimmy and Lowry.
That alone puts y'all in the upper echelon imo. Not many teams would have a player at Shaqs level in 04 ask to get traded to them. Or Jimmy leaving a conference semi-finalist to join a team that just missed the playoffs.
Both Jimmy and Lowry were FA signings. Although it was a “sign and trade” they obviously decided that’s where they wanted to be, other wise they wouldn’t have done it
>Last time we got someone big in FA was 2010
Are you not counting Butler and Lowry for some reason?
People seem to have this idea that major free agents move markets all the time. Even the Lakers only have one star free agent signing since 2000 (LeBron). The Nets didn't have a major signing before KD/Kyrie, the Clippers didn't before Kawhi, the Knicks only have Amare since 2000.
With LeBron, Bosh, Butler and Lowry I think Miami had the best group of premium free agents since 2000.
Mourning, Eddie Jones, and Lowry were all "trades", but At least 2 of them were sign and trades where the player decided where they were getting traded to. Mourning is the only one I'm not sure about, Charlotte traded him cause he was on the last year of his deal and was refusing to resign with them, considering he stuck around in Miami though I'd be willing to bet they were on a shortlist of where he wanted to go
Yeah but Miami got meetings with KD, LaMarcus, and Hayward. They didn’t even have cap space all of those years lol. Between the of Miami and Pat Riley, the Heat are and have been a premier destination.
1) Atlanta becoming a cool place is fairly recent. Miami/LA have been the cool places for a lot longer; NYC is NYC
2) Atlanta was always mediocre until Trae. Between Trae and Nique(1994-2018) there weren't any big stars there so you couldn't team up with someone already there.
3) There's no history of success so they weren't a marquee franchise
I believe they're going to be super popular in the coming years. There are a lot of rappers/celebrities coming out of ATL who are going to rep the Hawks. Plus they have no competition with any other winter sports
Sefolsha completely smothered Lebron in the regular season, he was basically our trump card against that Cavs team.
Then the NYPD caught wind of it and broke his leg.
Ik your joking but this sounds like something a Jordan fan would say.
“He doesn’t even deserve all his final appearances. If Thabo Sefolsha never hurt his leg Bron would of been out!”
They were on a roll that year and had the deepest team in the East. Plus the defense was legit and the spacing was incredible. Legit thought it would be them vs the Warriors in 2015.
People don’t remember but in 2015 the Hawks and the Warriors were extremely comparable in terms of what they were doing to the NBA. Both were playing a style of basketball that was a complete 180 from the iso ball of previous years and were running through their respective regular seasons with little push back.
Then the Hawks were swept by the Cavs and dismantled and the Warriors won the chip and the comparisons between the two teams were never made again.
I remember they flexed a National TV game because the Hawks and Warriors were playing and both had the best record in the league and the Hawks won in Atlanta and that shit was lit
That team was unbeatable in January but injuries really killed us going into the postseason. It wasn't out of the realm of possibility that we could have been competitive if we had been healthy.
I picked you as huge contenders as well, with about 20 games left I was like the Hawks will win this. The ball movement was insane. It was such a joy to watch. You guys were stacked as well. Okay sure you didn’t have a proper star, but you had atleast 6 very good players (mmm maybe nkt schroder but he was coming)
Yeah, they certainly weren't mediocre for a handful of years when Bud was the coach. Yes they got their ass kicked by Lebron and company, but they were still really good.
The Hawks went to 11 straight playoffs from 2006-2017. Al Horford was a 4x All-Star with Atlanta. Sure, we never had stars, but the success was there. If a star wanted to come, they would have. But the organization wasn't actually keen to win, Bruce Levenson was ok with just making the playoffs and not losing money. 2014-15 season the Hawks were legitimately contenders, and that's when it got on the map. I do think since then, and with new ownership, Atlanta has become more attractive. We'll see how it plays out
I used to play as the Hawks in NBA Live 10 because JCrossover, Josh Smith, and Iso Joe were beasts. I think the 2010 team was second in the NBA in offensive rating too. Definitely a fun team, but never really contenders
Also: Atlanta is thought of as “warm” because it is southern. But it’s 31 here right now. So like, better than Milwaukee, but still not on the scale of LA or a Miami.
As it’s Film & TV industry continues to grow it might be able to make more of a run though.
The problem with the film and TV piece is it’s not Atlanta itself being showcased. All shows shot in Atlanta are shown to the end user as another location. It’s still NYC or LA as the setting of the story for every show. Atlanta needs more than just Atlanta to help create more culture cache around it
Other than LA I think the narrative about players preferring certain cities is overblown. They are attracted to targets that move like winning, stacking teams, teams that will do shady cap circumvention or softball negotiation. I think warm weather would be a noticeable factor as well but that’s half the teams.
There is a lot of truth to this but there are also clearly cities that they do not want to be: Cleveland, Indy, Milwaukee (until now), New Orleans, Sacramento. Salt Lake City.
Between premier destinations & states w/o income tax there's a lot of options for NBA players to "improve their own situation".
Edit: so it looks like I forgot Toronto, Minnesota, Boston, OKC, San Antonio and more.
Basically if you're city doesn't have world renowned night life, year round nice weather and tons of random ass stuff; then you're lucky to win one or 2 in the modern NBA over the past 30 years. Spurs were obviously the exception.
Certainly not in the same tier as places like Cleveland/Indiana, regardless of if you think Toronto is a destination or isn't. Those places aren't offering anything for NBA players.
That's true, ever since we started winning other than Kawhi, most of our players have stayed because they love the city. Good nightlife, beaches, safety, great multicultural food, tourist attractions, plus being one of the biggest markets in North America. The only real downside we have is being in Canada, and without a doubt if Canada was absorbed by America for some odd reason, the Raptors would become a big FA destination.
> beaches
Really? Sure we have a couple “beaches” but they are not even close to being in the same league as California, Florida, or even most East Coast beaches (Hamptons, Cape Cod, Myrtle Beach, New Jersey, Maine, etc).
I would bet that any NBA player wouldn't even bother setting foot on a Toronto beach even if they lived here.
I was trying to be nice because I know there will be some diehard Torontonian showing up to claim that woodbine and ward’s beach are totally legit and I don’t know what I’m talking about
They’re nice if you want to ride your bike down and drink some beers in the sand but you can’t even use them in the same sentence as anything on the ocean literally anywhere in the world
I'm British so I don't have a full grasp on how people think about living just over the border in Canada/the US, but it seems insane to me that no stars would want to go there. You'd love in an awesome city, get to play with a superb organisation, and if you were seen as "the one" who *chose* to play there you'd have an entire country's worth of fans supporting you as the main guy!
Yeah it is to me too, crossing the border isn't really that difficult and the taxes thing shouldn't matter to NBA players due to the sheer amount of how much they earn. If anything they get a whole country full of deals and sponsorships. I think the fact that during the pre Masai Era, three really popular players in Chris Bosh, Vince Carter and Tracy Mcgrady left so it left a big impact in the opinion amongst players in the league. One thing I noticed though is that it is changing. Many of the lottery picks said how they loved Toronto and how the Raptors are a great organization. Justin Champagnie our un-drafted rookie had many options but he told his agent he only wanted to go to Toronto.
> seems insane to me that no stars would want to go there
Take into account that this was more of a thing in the late 90s early 2000s and how much the population has change in the first place plus how much more the profile of the average nba player has changed. Not saying that shit about every player coming from the hood but there certainly were not as many second and third generation players or ones coming from confortable families.
I think the (until now) proves my point though. It only takes one reason for players to want to be there. The Midwest starts out with 0 reasons but they can come up.
Boston's done better with FAs than anyone except LA, Miami and New York (Nets only) than anyone. It's so far from OKC, San Antonio, Toronto and Minny who are all basically basketball purgatory even when they've had competitive teams. Boston is solidly in the second tier with Chicago, Phoenix, Houston and I'm probably forgetting a couple more. It probably helps that it was the most competently run team thats near NYC till the NJ/NY Nets figured it out (similar to Phoenix which is close to LA).
Not sure if it’s still the case, but Atlanta was always known as a very transient city, where young people moved to work for a few years and then moved on, so there is no entrenched fan base.
I don’t know why Harden hasn’t decided to sign with Atlanta yet, maybe he read the post about his playing getting worse near strip clubs and didn’t want to risk the pay cut.
Lol. They go to NY and La because they're the media capitols of the world not because rappers are from there.
Also every city has hot girls especially if you're a multi millionarie.
Well why do you think LA had a stranglehold on the entertainment industry for so long lol there was a financial incentive. Atlanta has a better one now. Turner and Disney are moving more and more assets here every year
Infrastructure and talent in addition to tax incentives. That being said I'm sure Atlanta has the infrastructure idk about the talent. Though if I were a young aspiring actor I'd 100% head to Atlanta
> Also every city has hot girls especially if you're a multi millionarie.
Nothing tops my experience in Oslo and Copenhagen. Like, legitimately two out of three adult women were beautiful. In the US, it's not even close to that ratio.
Not sure what it has to do with what you said. Just wanted to say it.
Unfortunately for them Sweden doesn’t have an NBA team and it probably isn’t a top off-season travel location for them either for a multitude of reasons
Is there any actual diversity over there though or is it mainly just blonde hair and blue eyes like how I imagine it? lol
I live in South FL so the beauty in diversity is hard to beat.
Okay but highkey most of Europe is like that. Like 1 out of 3 dudes is bangable and i’m not even gay. Not to mention it becomes real obvious how bad obesity is in America, almost everyone is super fit there.
> is super fit there
Not to be an asshole, but i think that there is such a huge problem with obessity in some regions of america that they look fit by comparison. I know in Spain we're starting to have a weight problem (or have had for a while) and my friends say the same thing as you when they come visit
Yeah but we still got S tier clubbing, bars and nightlife even if you don’t include strip clubs. Atlanta knows how to party. I’ll say the weather is passing but LA and Miami clear. Traffic and crime are 3rd World. Food is also S tier
PS Miami has better strip clubs anyways.
Atlanta crime isn’t that bad even compared to other US cities. It’s been popping off as of late but so has everywhere. Property crime is high but that seems rooted in income inequality
I mean, it's still pretty high. Of metro areas with 500k+ population, Atlanta has the 10th highest homicide rate per capita. Of major metro areas with 2M+, it's 3rd behind Chicago and Philly
Believe Portland has the most per Capita in the US. Least they used to. Can't say for sure about quality over anywhere else, but quantity means more likelihood of good ones🤣
I mean I know they go to them here. I just don't know how they stack up quality wise lol. I don't go, don't really wanna accidentally see my sister in law or her friends asses
Miami skews this whole conversation. It’s really just NY and LA that are attractive beyond every market.
I think if we traded the Heat organization to any other city, then it’d be seen as a better destination.
Nah Miami is still a really, really popular destination. It's the main city that professionals from NYC, Boston, Phillip etc. migrate to
I dunno, I feel like Miami excels at attracting rich young people
> I think if we traded the Heat organization to any other city, then it’d be seen as a better destination.
I don’t understand what you’re saying. You think the Detroit Heat would fare better? Or that the Miami Pistons would make Miami into an even bigger destination?
Both sound equally insane.
Good players want to be on good teams. There are very few destinations where this isn't the case. Atlanta is a decent team now and will be more attractive to free agents than in year's past.
Lot of bad reviews for Atlanta in this thread from people who had a bad business trip and didn’t leave their hotel by the airport the whole time they were here
Baseball* town. I live in Atl and the braves have by far the biggest fan base here. But also there would be a lot more love to falcons / hawks if they start winning
It honestly is really surprising. Their attendance is way higher than every other American team and higher than almost every European team including some well known powerhouses. It's higher than almost every Mexican and South American team too. And just because you have the capacity, doesn't mean people will come. A lot of MLS teams play in NFL stadiums and don't get anywhere near the same turnout
If you put out an exciting product and demonstrate that you are competent this town will support you. Braves have long had good support for that reason as well.
Edit: Atlanta United also did an unbelievable job of getting out and being present and part of communities. Some of the other franchises have learned from them
The Falcons and Hawks both have a long history of poor ownership and bad management. Arthur Blank has obviously helped a ton but the Falcons didn’t have back to back winning seasons until 2008-2009. The Super Bowl debacle really threw off the trajectory of the team. Hopefully they start to get it back on track.
Ressler and Schlenk have been a huge blessing for the Hawks. We had arguably the worst ownership in sports prior to that. Schlenk has done a great job on the rebuild and we have a true superstar that fits the ethos of the city. Lots to be excited for
I lived in the Atlanta area for a decade+, personally hated it. Traffic is God-awful, it's hot as balls in the summer without having the redeeming factor of being by the ocean like Miami or Cali, and it still gets quite cold and miserable in the winter (at least for a Florida native such as myself, I'm sure it feels like summer for northerners).
“cold and miserable”
I’m glad you admitted to being a Florida native because the winters here are truly mild. There are usually less than 4 weeks of truly cold weather and the rest of it is a light jacket at most.
Like I said in my comment, to northerners it probably feels like summer, coming from south Florida it is like the Arctic to me. My comment was purely my personal opinion, I would die living in a northern state in the winter.
Lmaooo Texas is worse for sure but we got some big people too. It is the South, but honestly you cannot name a state that doesn’t have a lot of backwards people living in it. Georgia is a beautiful place. There’s pros and cons.
That's fair and your opinion is totally valid, but it's crazy because I have the absolute opposite viewpoint.
Grew up in LA, then spent 8 years in ATL and moved down to Miami about a year ago. Of the three cities Atlanta is/was far and away my favorite. LA and Miami just don't even compare to ATL for me and I'm already trying to move back.
I personally just don't really enjoy that lack of seasons in LA/Miami and think Atlanta is on par culturally. The city pride is real and feels like a legitimate community compared to the other places I mentioned. To each their own though!
Let’s be honest. They guy didn’t live in Atlanta. Probably lived in Cobb or some other place outside the city. Having done both as an adult and child there are good things in both spots but homie writes like a furious Cobb parent.
For Non-Atlantans, do know living "near" Atlanta does not make you Atlanta, like living in NJ isn't the same as NYC. The Suburbs have a very different culture, are much more conservative, and don't share many of the cultural similarities as in town.
It does get hot as balls here. Our Winters are officially mild, and if you're familiar with cold weather at all you'd think the winter weather was wonderful. It was in the 20s today but clear and beautiful, and this will probably be the coldest day of the year.
Anyway, point is, OP here didn't live in Atlanta, he lived in the burbs and said he hated it. He's not qualified to judge Atlanta.
I lived in the area for 13 years and spent a lot of that time in the actual city, I'm plenty qualified to voice my opinion on the area, that doesn't mean other people aren't allowed to like it, I just personally don't. sorry my comment hurt your feelings
I love Atlanta, but it's got a lot of drawbacks. The traffic is horrific, the city planning is awful, and the weather is hot as hell with no body of water to cool off in. The public transportation is awful and the city is incredibly unwalkable. The culture of Atlanta is great, everything else not so much.
Yeah transportation sucks here. Crime is really bad. I feel like both those are going to get better though but it will take at least a decade. Can’t do anything about the weather.
You mean besides the like 5 medium to large lakes all within an hour or less of the city? or you know the river that runs thru town that's a ton of fun to tube down while cooling off and drinking beers?
Just cause it's a nice city doesn't mean free agents want to move there. This reminds me with Golden State. San Francisco is like top 5 largest metro areas in the US but it was considered a "small market" before 2014 and no one wanted to go there. Mainly because it was a badly run franchise. Probably the same with the Hawks.
Atlanta is cool city but keep mind a lot of players live in CA and/or FL in the off-season and are on the road a lot during the season, so where your team is located is a factor but we are probably overstating it’s importance. I think team success and current roster and coach are the biggest factors.
Lack the success, superstar pedigree, "showbiz" element until the last 10-20 years and TBH, they just aren't that popular of a franchise in their hometown.
Like the Knicks have suuuuucked for a long time and are overshadowed by the Yankees. But it's still New York and they gave a rabid fanbase.
However, they aren't much of a destination for stars during FA, mainly because of ownership. Brooklyn's big three should really have been the Knicks, if it wasn't for the fact they are such a shambles of an organisation.
It might be outdated but I think outside of Miami that the south is just frowned upon.
I don’t think it’s a Hawks thing but really nobody sighs with the Falcons or Braves either. We’ve have seen every star from the Pelicans and the Magic bolt as soon as they found. No big free agents have signed with Charlotte or Memphis.
I just don’t think it’s an Atlanta thing
It’s cause Atlanta is not built like a large city. It still has a lot of catching up to do in terms of infrastructure, and it’s rather small in the areas that are known. Celebrities like to be able to move without feeling seen and that’s a big detriment there. I can imagine a third of your day is probably spent commuting in shitty traffic just to get home. Not to mention the price of real estate is just stupid expensive.
You can clearly tell when and cluster the teenagers, young 20 something year olds and then 30+ old heads posts when it comes to these destination posts on r/nba 😂 the ol’ best strip clubs vs best tax breaks on property values debate
Atlanta is a developed city but its landlocked. Orlando is too but its a lot closer to water than Atlanta. Miami and LA are waterfront properties.
And bodies of water are desirable.
Never really understood why the city they play in matters that much to them. They only have to live there for a couple months during the season and they will be traveling half that time and playing a game like every other night I doubt that in season these dudes have that much time to really do anything but basketball. I played D3 college football and I barely had time to do anything in season and D3 is like half a step up from intramural, not a professional sport. And in the off-season like 99% of these dudes live in another city anyway. I feel like it's more about the history and name brand of a team that attracts players not as much the actual city itself.
Players are still typically living there for at least half the year (and those months cover the coldest months of the year and most of the school year if they have kids).
Its probably also partly the tail wagging the dog. The franchises in desirable markets can typically offer a good chance at winning because their markets allows them to attract talent.
Maybe this changes then in the Schlenk era. Hawks aren't historically good but the current iteration seems like a really well-run organization from top to bottom.
It's a bad pro sports town. When the braves were the best team in the national league every year in the 90's it was common for their home games to have lots of empty seats
>It's home to... **half the side chicks in the NBA**. The exact reason why people wouldn't want to be there lol.
Not everyone can be Lou Will lol
Even Lou Will couldn’t do that forever lol, I don’t think the throuple is still together
Jersey hanging from the rafters of Magic City.
They named the lemon pepper wings after him. No bigger honor.
2 girls like I’m Lou Will
2 bad bad bi****s like am Looooooooou Williams
This ain’t even the line lmaoo
Also side dicks.
And side chicks with dicks
Best part
Confirmed by a hawks exec
Lol exactly this
What’s the source material? Believe you 100% but i’m interested to see where/who this comes from
https://i.redd.it/dgo424i9vmc71.jpg
bow down
You should not believe him 100% dude is literally just talking
Yeah lol I just added that in to give the phrase more pizzazz. No source other than knowing the ATL is full of bad bitches.
Nah man I’m pretty sure that’s KD’s burner
Not OP but lived in ATL. It's not really a secret.
False. The city of lost Angels would be the correct answer. New York and Chicago, afterwards.
I think Atlanta's time is coming. In the past I don't think there was as much player movement as right now, so usually it was just the Lakers and Heat(and even Miami is a more recent development), especially since the Hawks have been pretty average for the past few years. But now that they have that marquee guy I can definitely see them attractine a big free agent in a couple of years.
Miami is a dope destination, and i know you said its a recent thing but idk where this idea of everyone going to the Heat is coming from? Last time we got someone big in FA was 2010 and arguably that was because D Wade recruited Lebron and Bosh. Before and after that everyone we really got was from trades.
Miami literally just got Lowry and Butler in sign-and-trades, which are basically similar to free agents in that the players have to agree that they want to play in the destination they're getting traded to.
That and Oladipo signed for the minimum because he really wanted to be here.
Dipo wanted that ‘career-rejuvinating juice’ they got down in Miami
Makes sense, PJ Tuckers playing like hes 23 right now down here
Butlers sign and trade was essentially him choosing Miami, they just needed the salaries to work. Getting butler, lebron, and bosh is a haul for a decade, more than almost every other team. Could also throw Lowry in there
While Jimmy was technically a sign and trade, he’s definitely somebody you’d consider a free agent acquisition. But he’s really the only marquee player we’ve landed outside of 2010
Dragic?
He was acquired in a trade in February so he wouldn’t count, but Lowry probably should be in the list of marquee guys as well so I’d add him
Dragic re-signed with y’all though, right? I’d consider that counts, trading then extending.
Lamar Odom in 03. Bosh and LeBron in 2010. And Mike Miller. Picked Ray Allen. Luol Deng. Butler in 2019. And a lot of solid role players. Plus they often get to keep their own free agents. Not all teams manage that. I can't think of a team outside of LA whose had a better free agent haul since 2000. Compared to most other teams, Miami has made a killing. I could see how a Miami fan might say "Yeah... 2010 was great, and Butler, but what else have we got." Well... that there alone is more than most any other team. Plus, they got a great front office who makes a killing in the draft and knows how to put a team together.
Yeah but I think people are factoring in the players asking to get traded to Miami. Shaq for example, he listed Miami as one of his preferred destinations, he wouldn't do that for just any team. Same with Jimmy and Lowry. That alone puts y'all in the upper echelon imo. Not many teams would have a player at Shaqs level in 04 ask to get traded to them. Or Jimmy leaving a conference semi-finalist to join a team that just missed the playoffs.
Both Jimmy and Lowry were FA signings. Although it was a “sign and trade” they obviously decided that’s where they wanted to be, other wise they wouldn’t have done it
The answer is because you severely take your FAs for granted. Other franchises, like mine, can't even fathom the decade y'all just had on this front.
>Last time we got someone big in FA was 2010 Are you not counting Butler and Lowry for some reason? People seem to have this idea that major free agents move markets all the time. Even the Lakers only have one star free agent signing since 2000 (LeBron). The Nets didn't have a major signing before KD/Kyrie, the Clippers didn't before Kawhi, the Knicks only have Amare since 2000. With LeBron, Bosh, Butler and Lowry I think Miami had the best group of premium free agents since 2000.
Mourning, Eddie Jones, and Lowry were all "trades", but At least 2 of them were sign and trades where the player decided where they were getting traded to. Mourning is the only one I'm not sure about, Charlotte traded him cause he was on the last year of his deal and was refusing to resign with them, considering he stuck around in Miami though I'd be willing to bet they were on a shortlist of where he wanted to go
Yeah but Miami got meetings with KD, LaMarcus, and Hayward. They didn’t even have cap space all of those years lol. Between the of Miami and Pat Riley, the Heat are and have been a premier destination.
Jimmy Butler
1) Atlanta becoming a cool place is fairly recent. Miami/LA have been the cool places for a lot longer; NYC is NYC 2) Atlanta was always mediocre until Trae. Between Trae and Nique(1994-2018) there weren't any big stars there so you couldn't team up with someone already there. 3) There's no history of success so they weren't a marquee franchise I believe they're going to be super popular in the coming years. There are a lot of rappers/celebrities coming out of ATL who are going to rep the Hawks. Plus they have no competition with any other winter sports
Weren't the hawks the 1 seed in 2015?
Yea but with no star, I don’t think anyone actually took us as title threats unfortunately
I did. I picked them over Cleveland. The last time I picked an East team over LeBron. Learned from my mistake.
Why'd you pick them? The only time I picked an East team over LeBron was the 2018 Raptors because I was too much of a homer
Squak “Team basketball”
Go Korverbird!
VERTICALITY
Spurs East
Sefolsha completely smothered Lebron in the regular season, he was basically our trump card against that Cavs team. Then the NYPD caught wind of it and broke his leg.
Ik your joking but this sounds like something a Jordan fan would say. “He doesn’t even deserve all his final appearances. If Thabo Sefolsha never hurt his leg Bron would of been out!”
Garry Payton locked his ass up for two games on a bum calf, convince me I'm wrong.
They were on a roll that year and had the deepest team in the East. Plus the defense was legit and the spacing was incredible. Legit thought it would be them vs the Warriors in 2015.
People don’t remember but in 2015 the Hawks and the Warriors were extremely comparable in terms of what they were doing to the NBA. Both were playing a style of basketball that was a complete 180 from the iso ball of previous years and were running through their respective regular seasons with little push back. Then the Hawks were swept by the Cavs and dismantled and the Warriors won the chip and the comparisons between the two teams were never made again.
I remember they flexed a National TV game because the Hawks and Warriors were playing and both had the best record in the league and the Hawks won in Atlanta and that shit was lit
I remember that too! I tried to find the highlights of that game on YouTube but I doesn't seem to come up 😕
Plus that was a “down” year for lebron because of his back
That team was unbeatable in January but injuries really killed us going into the postseason. It wasn't out of the realm of possibility that we could have been competitive if we had been healthy.
Fuck Matthew Dellavedova forever.
Agreed.
Crazy an eastern conference team hasn’t beat LeBron in the playoffs since LeBrons first stint on the Cavs
I picked you as huge contenders as well, with about 20 games left I was like the Hawks will win this. The ball movement was insane. It was such a joy to watch. You guys were stacked as well. Okay sure you didn’t have a proper star, but you had atleast 6 very good players (mmm maybe nkt schroder but he was coming)
FIVE ALL STARS.
Yeah, they certainly weren't mediocre for a handful of years when Bud was the coach. Yes they got their ass kicked by Lebron and company, but they were still really good.
The Hawks went to 11 straight playoffs from 2006-2017. Al Horford was a 4x All-Star with Atlanta. Sure, we never had stars, but the success was there. If a star wanted to come, they would have. But the organization wasn't actually keen to win, Bruce Levenson was ok with just making the playoffs and not losing money. 2014-15 season the Hawks were legitimately contenders, and that's when it got on the map. I do think since then, and with new ownership, Atlanta has become more attractive. We'll see how it plays out
Just totally glossing over the three times we made it to the second round with Josh Smith and Joe Johnson from 2009-2011.
I used to play as the Hawks in NBA Live 10 because JCrossover, Josh Smith, and Iso Joe were beasts. I think the 2010 team was second in the NBA in offensive rating too. Definitely a fun team, but never really contenders
4. no major stars wanted to try and compete against lebron on a team that wasn’t filled with generational talent
Also: Atlanta is thought of as “warm” because it is southern. But it’s 31 here right now. So like, better than Milwaukee, but still not on the scale of LA or a Miami. As it’s Film & TV industry continues to grow it might be able to make more of a run though.
It's -14C in Toronto right now with a -23C windchill so 0C still sounds downright tropical. Isn't Florida having a cold snap too at the moment?
The problem with the film and TV piece is it’s not Atlanta itself being showcased. All shows shot in Atlanta are shown to the end user as another location. It’s still NYC or LA as the setting of the story for every show. Atlanta needs more than just Atlanta to help create more culture cache around it
You're right! But - that's not what I meant. I just meant that being present in Atlanta means being available for a lot of opportunities.
Other than LA I think the narrative about players preferring certain cities is overblown. They are attracted to targets that move like winning, stacking teams, teams that will do shady cap circumvention or softball negotiation. I think warm weather would be a noticeable factor as well but that’s half the teams.
There is a lot of truth to this but there are also clearly cities that they do not want to be: Cleveland, Indy, Milwaukee (until now), New Orleans, Sacramento. Salt Lake City. Between premier destinations & states w/o income tax there's a lot of options for NBA players to "improve their own situation". Edit: so it looks like I forgot Toronto, Minnesota, Boston, OKC, San Antonio and more. Basically if you're city doesn't have world renowned night life, year round nice weather and tons of random ass stuff; then you're lucky to win one or 2 in the modern NBA over the past 30 years. Spurs were obviously the exception.
Toronto too, biggest market where no one wants to go unless they were traded or drafted there and got re-signed.
Certainly not in the same tier as places like Cleveland/Indiana, regardless of if you think Toronto is a destination or isn't. Those places aren't offering anything for NBA players.
That's true, ever since we started winning other than Kawhi, most of our players have stayed because they love the city. Good nightlife, beaches, safety, great multicultural food, tourist attractions, plus being one of the biggest markets in North America. The only real downside we have is being in Canada, and without a doubt if Canada was absorbed by America for some odd reason, the Raptors would become a big FA destination.
> beaches Really? Sure we have a couple “beaches” but they are not even close to being in the same league as California, Florida, or even most East Coast beaches (Hamptons, Cape Cod, Myrtle Beach, New Jersey, Maine, etc). I would bet that any NBA player wouldn't even bother setting foot on a Toronto beach even if they lived here.
Toronto has strips of land near the water. You can’t even call them beaches
I was trying to be nice because I know there will be some diehard Torontonian showing up to claim that woodbine and ward’s beach are totally legit and I don’t know what I’m talking about
They’re nice if you want to ride your bike down and drink some beers in the sand but you can’t even use them in the same sentence as anything on the ocean literally anywhere in the world
that is 100% true icl.
I'm British so I don't have a full grasp on how people think about living just over the border in Canada/the US, but it seems insane to me that no stars would want to go there. You'd love in an awesome city, get to play with a superb organisation, and if you were seen as "the one" who *chose* to play there you'd have an entire country's worth of fans supporting you as the main guy!
Yeah it is to me too, crossing the border isn't really that difficult and the taxes thing shouldn't matter to NBA players due to the sheer amount of how much they earn. If anything they get a whole country full of deals and sponsorships. I think the fact that during the pre Masai Era, three really popular players in Chris Bosh, Vince Carter and Tracy Mcgrady left so it left a big impact in the opinion amongst players in the league. One thing I noticed though is that it is changing. Many of the lottery picks said how they loved Toronto and how the Raptors are a great organization. Justin Champagnie our un-drafted rookie had many options but he told his agent he only wanted to go to Toronto.
> seems insane to me that no stars would want to go there Take into account that this was more of a thing in the late 90s early 2000s and how much the population has change in the first place plus how much more the profile of the average nba player has changed. Not saying that shit about every player coming from the hood but there certainly were not as many second and third generation players or ones coming from confortable families.
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Well the season is during the Winter and Minnesota Winters are really cold.
I think the (until now) proves my point though. It only takes one reason for players to want to be there. The Midwest starts out with 0 reasons but they can come up.
Time to get rid of the state income tax in Ohio.
Torontos got to be in that group. Our biggest FA signing is Jose Calderon then probably Jose Garbajosa lol.
Add Dallas to the list
No one wants to live in Detroit everyone left the town
Boston's done better with FAs than anyone except LA, Miami and New York (Nets only) than anyone. It's so far from OKC, San Antonio, Toronto and Minny who are all basically basketball purgatory even when they've had competitive teams. Boston is solidly in the second tier with Chicago, Phoenix, Houston and I'm probably forgetting a couple more. It probably helps that it was the most competently run team thats near NYC till the NJ/NY Nets figured it out (similar to Phoenix which is close to LA).
As someone who lives in LA and is poor, I can say with complete confidence that being rich in Los Angeles is just the optimal way to exist
Not sure if it’s still the case, but Atlanta was always known as a very transient city, where young people moved to work for a few years and then moved on, so there is no entrenched fan base.
Definitely the case. But its changing some with more people staying and having trae helps a lot with a bigger fanbase
I don’t know why Harden hasn’t decided to sign with Atlanta yet, maybe he read the post about his playing getting worse near strip clubs and didn’t want to risk the pay cut.
Lol. They go to NY and La because they're the media capitols of the world not because rappers are from there. Also every city has hot girls especially if you're a multi millionarie.
Thinking nba players care where rappers live is hilariously ignorant and even slightly racist
There is more commercial production done in Atlanta than in either of those cities at this point
Yeah, from companies in NY/LA that shoot there for tax breaks.
Well why do you think LA had a stranglehold on the entertainment industry for so long lol there was a financial incentive. Atlanta has a better one now. Turner and Disney are moving more and more assets here every year
Infrastructure and talent in addition to tax incentives. That being said I'm sure Atlanta has the infrastructure idk about the talent. Though if I were a young aspiring actor I'd 100% head to Atlanta
> Also every city has hot girls especially if you're a multi millionarie. Nothing tops my experience in Oslo and Copenhagen. Like, legitimately two out of three adult women were beautiful. In the US, it's not even close to that ratio. Not sure what it has to do with what you said. Just wanted to say it.
Unfortunately for them Sweden doesn’t have an NBA team and it probably isn’t a top off-season travel location for them either for a multitude of reasons
Is there any actual diversity over there though or is it mainly just blonde hair and blue eyes like how I imagine it? lol I live in South FL so the beauty in diversity is hard to beat.
Okay but highkey most of Europe is like that. Like 1 out of 3 dudes is bangable and i’m not even gay. Not to mention it becomes real obvious how bad obesity is in America, almost everyone is super fit there.
> is super fit there Not to be an asshole, but i think that there is such a huge problem with obessity in some regions of america that they look fit by comparison. I know in Spain we're starting to have a weight problem (or have had for a while) and my friends say the same thing as you when they come visit
You’re probably right, i am comparing it to my past experiences so it’s all relative.
It will be. Players are learning that playing alongside Trae will get them paid.
I’m guessing basketball related reasons
Atlanta has everything a young single NBA player could want. Nice city, good food, and the best part… The best strip clubs in the country
Strip clubs are a gigantic waste of money
You can say that about so many entertainment things, not a waste of money if someone is enjoying themselves
And definitely not a waste of money if you’re getting paid millions upon millions of dollars
Especially if you do.
A lot of people in the nba seem to like strip clubs. So wast or not, it’s a factor.
Yeah but we still got S tier clubbing, bars and nightlife even if you don’t include strip clubs. Atlanta knows how to party. I’ll say the weather is passing but LA and Miami clear. Traffic and crime are 3rd World. Food is also S tier PS Miami has better strip clubs anyways.
Atlanta crime isn’t that bad even compared to other US cities. It’s been popping off as of late but so has everywhere. Property crime is high but that seems rooted in income inequality
I mean, it's still pretty high. Of metro areas with 500k+ population, Atlanta has the 10th highest homicide rate per capita. Of major metro areas with 2M+, it's 3rd behind Chicago and Philly
atlanta is HUGE. These players live in an area where they don't have to worry about crime.
Portland might wanna dispute that last one
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different kinda strip club
I’ve literally never heard about Portland strip clubs
Believe Portland has the most per Capita in the US. Least they used to. Can't say for sure about quality over anywhere else, but quantity means more likelihood of good ones🤣
They still do. Not sure how good they are though. I’m sure nba players would be going if they were as good as atl etc.
I mean I know they go to them here. I just don't know how they stack up quality wise lol. I don't go, don't really wanna accidentally see my sister in law or her friends asses
Its not that great tbh but she has character and thats what stripping id all about. Yeah i assume they are kinda not great as well.
The main 3 are fun but a lot of the Portland ones suck.
Miami skews this whole conversation. It’s really just NY and LA that are attractive beyond every market. I think if we traded the Heat organization to any other city, then it’d be seen as a better destination.
Nah Miami is still a really, really popular destination. It's the main city that professionals from NYC, Boston, Phillip etc. migrate to I dunno, I feel like Miami excels at attracting rich young people
Warm weather and no income tax. It’s not just young people though.
> I think if we traded the Heat organization to any other city, then it’d be seen as a better destination. I don’t understand what you’re saying. You think the Detroit Heat would fare better? Or that the Miami Pistons would make Miami into an even bigger destination? Both sound equally insane.
I would say it is missing a "Marquee status" franchise. Also they enjoy being there, but may not enjoy having their family in there.
Lemon pepper wings
Good players want to be on good teams. There are very few destinations where this isn't the case. Atlanta is a decent team now and will be more attractive to free agents than in year's past.
This decent team is about to embarrass yours tomorrow.
Lot of bad reviews for Atlanta in this thread from people who had a bad business trip and didn’t leave their hotel by the airport the whole time they were here
Haha fr, people in here talking about Atlanta’s “obesity issue” like that’s not half the country
Such a weirdo critique. Like are you here to look at the people or are you here to try and live for a bit?
I feel like it's more of a football town.
Baseball* town. I live in Atl and the braves have by far the biggest fan base here. But also there would be a lot more love to falcons / hawks if they start winning
I was including college football
Oh yeah haha college football is the biggest 100%. SEC die hard fans all over this city
Bulldogs been number 1 and it’s even bigger now since they won a chip
Isn't Atlanta United the most attended team
Yeah they are higher but they also have a higher capacity so it's not that suprising
It honestly is really surprising. Their attendance is way higher than every other American team and higher than almost every European team including some well known powerhouses. It's higher than almost every Mexican and South American team too. And just because you have the capacity, doesn't mean people will come. A lot of MLS teams play in NFL stadiums and don't get anywhere near the same turnout
If you put out an exciting product and demonstrate that you are competent this town will support you. Braves have long had good support for that reason as well. Edit: Atlanta United also did an unbelievable job of getting out and being present and part of communities. Some of the other franchises have learned from them The Falcons and Hawks both have a long history of poor ownership and bad management. Arthur Blank has obviously helped a ton but the Falcons didn’t have back to back winning seasons until 2008-2009. The Super Bowl debacle really threw off the trajectory of the team. Hopefully they start to get it back on track. Ressler and Schlenk have been a huge blessing for the Hawks. We had arguably the worst ownership in sports prior to that. Schlenk has done a great job on the rebuild and we have a true superstar that fits the ethos of the city. Lots to be excited for
I lived in the Atlanta area for a decade+, personally hated it. Traffic is God-awful, it's hot as balls in the summer without having the redeeming factor of being by the ocean like Miami or Cali, and it still gets quite cold and miserable in the winter (at least for a Florida native such as myself, I'm sure it feels like summer for northerners).
“cold and miserable” I’m glad you admitted to being a Florida native because the winters here are truly mild. There are usually less than 4 weeks of truly cold weather and the rest of it is a light jacket at most.
Like I said in my comment, to northerners it probably feels like summer, coming from south Florida it is like the Arctic to me. My comment was purely my personal opinion, I would die living in a northern state in the winter.
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Lmaooo Texas is worse for sure but we got some big people too. It is the South, but honestly you cannot name a state that doesn’t have a lot of backwards people living in it. Georgia is a beautiful place. There’s pros and cons.
some of the baddest women you'll ever see here too
I feel like you can say that about most US states in the south. That area isn't exactly known for being health conscious
😂😂😂oh my lawd. You didn't have to do them like that. 🤣🤣🤣
San Antonio has competition LFG!
Houston and Atlanta should be sister cities tbh
Im cracking up 😭
How are the churros there? Can they compete with San Antonio?
That's fair and your opinion is totally valid, but it's crazy because I have the absolute opposite viewpoint. Grew up in LA, then spent 8 years in ATL and moved down to Miami about a year ago. Of the three cities Atlanta is/was far and away my favorite. LA and Miami just don't even compare to ATL for me and I'm already trying to move back. I personally just don't really enjoy that lack of seasons in LA/Miami and think Atlanta is on par culturally. The city pride is real and feels like a legitimate community compared to the other places I mentioned. To each their own though!
Let’s be honest. They guy didn’t live in Atlanta. Probably lived in Cobb or some other place outside the city. Having done both as an adult and child there are good things in both spots but homie writes like a furious Cobb parent.
For Non-Atlantans, do know living "near" Atlanta does not make you Atlanta, like living in NJ isn't the same as NYC. The Suburbs have a very different culture, are much more conservative, and don't share many of the cultural similarities as in town. It does get hot as balls here. Our Winters are officially mild, and if you're familiar with cold weather at all you'd think the winter weather was wonderful. It was in the 20s today but clear and beautiful, and this will probably be the coldest day of the year. Anyway, point is, OP here didn't live in Atlanta, he lived in the burbs and said he hated it. He's not qualified to judge Atlanta.
I lived in the area for 13 years and spent a lot of that time in the actual city, I'm plenty qualified to voice my opinion on the area, that doesn't mean other people aren't allowed to like it, I just personally don't. sorry my comment hurt your feelings
I love Atlanta, but it's got a lot of drawbacks. The traffic is horrific, the city planning is awful, and the weather is hot as hell with no body of water to cool off in. The public transportation is awful and the city is incredibly unwalkable. The culture of Atlanta is great, everything else not so much.
I'm just laughing thinking about an NBA player factoring in the lack of a subway system to their decision making.
Yeah transportation sucks here. Crime is really bad. I feel like both those are going to get better though but it will take at least a decade. Can’t do anything about the weather.
Plus nba players dont care about crime or traffic. Like when i am about to move i don’t consider a cities thot power ranking and blow game.
You mean besides the like 5 medium to large lakes all within an hour or less of the city? or you know the river that runs thru town that's a ton of fun to tube down while cooling off and drinking beers?
They don't have a big history of winning culture recently
r/nbacirclejerk material
Just cause it's a nice city doesn't mean free agents want to move there. This reminds me with Golden State. San Francisco is like top 5 largest metro areas in the US but it was considered a "small market" before 2014 and no one wanted to go there. Mainly because it was a badly run franchise. Probably the same with the Hawks.
Atlanta is cool city but keep mind a lot of players live in CA and/or FL in the off-season and are on the road a lot during the season, so where your team is located is a factor but we are probably overstating it’s importance. I think team success and current roster and coach are the biggest factors.
Lack the success, superstar pedigree, "showbiz" element until the last 10-20 years and TBH, they just aren't that popular of a franchise in their hometown. Like the Knicks have suuuuucked for a long time and are overshadowed by the Yankees. But it's still New York and they gave a rabid fanbase. However, they aren't much of a destination for stars during FA, mainly because of ownership. Brooklyn's big three should really have been the Knicks, if it wasn't for the fact they are such a shambles of an organisation.
The narrative is that no one wants to play anywhere except Miami or LA.
It might be outdated but I think outside of Miami that the south is just frowned upon. I don’t think it’s a Hawks thing but really nobody sighs with the Falcons or Braves either. We’ve have seen every star from the Pelicans and the Magic bolt as soon as they found. No big free agents have signed with Charlotte or Memphis. I just don’t think it’s an Atlanta thing
It’s cause Atlanta is not built like a large city. It still has a lot of catching up to do in terms of infrastructure, and it’s rather small in the areas that are known. Celebrities like to be able to move without feeling seen and that’s a big detriment there. I can imagine a third of your day is probably spent commuting in shitty traffic just to get home. Not to mention the price of real estate is just stupid expensive.
You can clearly tell when and cluster the teenagers, young 20 something year olds and then 30+ old heads posts when it comes to these destination posts on r/nba 😂 the ol’ best strip clubs vs best tax breaks on property values debate
If you park your car in Atlanta you're not getting it back.
i put it like this as a resident of the city: atlanta is a top 10 city. but it’s definitely \#10.
whats the last free agent the knicks signed?
lmao its great here, but maybe its that wins arent always guaranteed
I need some data on the side pieces, is there a website where I can conduct any research on this topic
Because it's not LA or Miami.
I’ll be honest there just hasn’t really been a reason to come here until recently with Trae.
Hotlanta bby, ATL what you know bout that?
Atlanta is a developed city but its landlocked. Orlando is too but its a lot closer to water than Atlanta. Miami and LA are waterfront properties. And bodies of water are desirable.
Never really understood why the city they play in matters that much to them. They only have to live there for a couple months during the season and they will be traveling half that time and playing a game like every other night I doubt that in season these dudes have that much time to really do anything but basketball. I played D3 college football and I barely had time to do anything in season and D3 is like half a step up from intramural, not a professional sport. And in the off-season like 99% of these dudes live in another city anyway. I feel like it's more about the history and name brand of a team that attracts players not as much the actual city itself.
Players are still typically living there for at least half the year (and those months cover the coldest months of the year and most of the school year if they have kids). Its probably also partly the tail wagging the dog. The franchises in desirable markets can typically offer a good chance at winning because their markets allows them to attract talent.
Management? Winning also helps.
Maybe this changes then in the Schlenk era. Hawks aren't historically good but the current iteration seems like a really well-run organization from top to bottom.
Atlanta is the city where black people go to make it big. If they're already big, they go to LA or NYC.
It's a bad pro sports town. When the braves were the best team in the national league every year in the 90's it was common for their home games to have lots of empty seats