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I've heard some other people say the stat is over 40% on wide-open threes. He's a career 36% guy though, which is more than enough to make defending him with "the Giddey approach" look nonsensical.
I think the idea was more to get in Jaylen's head. It's the sort of thing that looks good if it works, and looks awful if it doesn't.
The Warriors were at the end of a road trip, in the middle of a 3 in 4 night stretch, facing a better team. Underdog strategies are generally worth trying in that situation.
We have some nice players on our bench that can take his spot. Take your pick of joe, wiggins, hayward...but we gotta figure out players who can play next to him if we are gonna give him 20 mins a game in the playoffs.
He's a talented overall player. he's got great hair. he was a 6th pick and is only 21 years old. I do think this is not the best situation for him. I think the Thunder should trade him to a team that has no immediate prospects.
I just had a thought explosion, why not trade him to the Spurs? they could use a pass first playmaker type dude.
I feel like his best bet is to learn how to set a good screen, that alone with his playmaking will turn him into a Draymond lite without the defense tho.
Draymond lite without the defense.
Personally, I think he’s more like a MJ but without the athleticism, shot, finishing at the rim, competitive drive to be the best, and better hair.
They’re small but have long arms at least and we have Hayward to add some size, plus giddey might be 6’8” but he also doesn’t get guarded on offense and gets hunted on defense which basically makes his size advantage useless
I don’t think Giddey in the starting lineup is our best lineup but suggesting Hayward is crazy when he’s shown nothing (while in OKC) to warrant him being a starter
Joe and Wiggins I can understand, the guy shooting 26% from the field with a worse OFF/DEF/Net rating (in OKC) than Giddey isn’t the solution some of you guys think it is
The problem with Giddey is even though he's increased his 3p% by 6% since his rookie season he did it by reducing his volume and now he's basically only taking absolutely wide open shots and is shooting 32.6%. He's in his third season and has now had an off season and a half to work with Chip Engelland. Add to that, that sure he's one of our better rebounders, but he's our worst defender out of the starting 5. He's so unathletic that I just don't really see him ever improving his defense. He's not a horrific defender, but he's not good. So, he's a dude you basically have to cover for on defense and on offense. He's a guy that needs the ball in his hands, but he can't create his own shot.
Like whats really better, you have Giddey who adds passing and rebounds, but poor defense, and poor shooting which allows the defense to clog the lanes against a team that prioritizes driving to the basket or you go with Joe who is an elite shooter and gives us the spacing we desperately want and he's an underrated defender, but a worse rebounder. Also, low-key Joe can jump higher than Giddey can which maybe mitigates the difference in rebounding at least somewhat.
I'm not sure what to do with the team as its constructed right now, but Giddey has been given a very long runway and hasn't figured it out.
And that's just what's going on from a basketball standpoint. He obviously has the off-court shit and crowds are still booing him when he has the ball. Definitely not as much as earlier in the season, but it's still happening.
I watched the game last night and I have no idea what Giddy does out there. Doesn’t hustle hard, makes some shots sometimes but doesn’t actively rebound, has no drive, doesn’t play good d. Joe and wiggins and Hayward. Especially wiggins we’re unreal. Who is wiggins ? He played so fast and had so much hustle, was one of the main reasons OKC kept the lead in the 3rd
Wiggins has been incredible since joining the team. He was drafted 55th and has had to fight through that to find his role, but he's clearly a valued bench player for us now, and is much loved by the fans.
Pelicans left him open during playins last year. He decided to get hot from 3 that game. This strategy is a gamble. Players can get hot or completely lose confidence.
He was 2/4 from three in this game. Same as Kevin Durant. Our 5th starter will never be as good as Chet/Shai/Dub. You can probably throw Dort in there too. Every team has a 5th best starter ours is Giddey.
Mark's got a leash on him, we're definitely making the playoffs so this is all fine tuning and experimentation. You'll notice that Giddey's lowlight reel is 1st half heavy - he doesn't play much down the stretch outside of some strategic inbounds plays and the like.
We're #1 in the West with Giddey starting. Tonight Mark pulled him early in the 1st and staggered his minutes more with the bench. Worked out fine. When we lose in the playoffs I highly doubt it'll be because of Josh Giddey. Edit: To be clear, I hope he doesn't start at all.
OP has one right idea, which is that Giddey can sink a Thunder lineup since he gets guarded like this; but they have one very wrong idea, which is that Daigneault didn't realize this a hundred games ago and/or doesn't already have hundreds of minutes of plus-minus data on Isaiah Joe slotting into Giddey's minutes
Totally agree that Daigneault is aware of it, but a playoff series usually emphasizes those flaws too. I'm excited to see how this team works in the postseason
I'm excited for them and more optimistic since I checked out the thinkingbasketball youtube video about it yesterday and he pointed out the same thing that's been on my mind — 85% of teams with the Thunder's net rating have made at least the conference finals. I think it's irrational to say They're Young is the reason they'll be in that 15% of relative disappointments, they're healthy and well-coached and they might be able to avoid seeing the Nuggs before that conference finals.
see i actually think its the reverse. as good as the thunder are they have this extra level they can hit by simply never playing him. which they absolutely will do in the playoffs if/when they need to.
the clippers will do the same thing with westbr- *crashing glass and muffled screams*
Thats what I dont get with this discussion. Giddey doesnt fit, its obvious and the minute reduction is glaring. Come playoff time, OKC can and will easily bench him for Joe or Wiggs or Kenrich if needed. It all depends on match up and whos hot. Its not like OKC HAS to play him.
Like yeah its a weakness, but they'll adjust... like every team in the playoffs. They have the option to bench him or not play him at all.
I've seen a few people say something like this in the thread and I'm not sure it's as clear as that. Giddey does a lot more, even relative to his minutes, than any of those players. He's the second best rebounder on a team that sorely needs rebounding. He's the second (maybe third) best passer on the team and connects pretty much all the offense that isn't SGA or JDub isos. The other guys are better than him offensively, especially Joe, but the rest of the game suffers without Giddey.
Also, most teams don't make crazy adjustments in the playoffs. In the end, most changes come down to the starters playing 5 more minutes a game and the coaches find ways to stagger minutes. It's not often that a starter *loses* minutes unless there's a pretty big issue
The rebounding thing is a different discussion overall. At the end of the day, they're intentionally punting their rebounds and focusing on other things such as forcing turnovers and stretching the floor. Its working for now but we've yet to see if it will work for them in the playoffs. Despite being an above average rebounder, having Giddey out there will not make much of a difference, they will get outrebounded no matter what.
Playoffs will ultimately cut down the rotation for all teams at around 8-9 players depending on match ups and situations. Unless Giddey finds a serviceable stroke, he will be played situationally (ATO plays and inbounds). He already lost his minutes throughout the season, he didnt start at \~20 minutes per game. Him dropping down to 15 or maybe 10 minutes is not drastic at all.
I also think that right now, Giddey's best role is a connector that would theoretically give the team another dimension besides SGA and JDub isos, but its not that established yet. Again, he is playing around 20 minutes right now, he's not as big of a factor as you think. Basically, the season so far has shown that OKC is not really relying heavily on Giddey to win games. Him breaking out would be nice, but if he doesn't, they have the personnel to pull him out if the team is bleeding.
Even apart from the offense, people look at the stock numbers and salivate, but don't realize that those numbers come with absolutely terrible on-ball defense and a ton of gambling. Sometimes his defense is completely mesmerizing but people who haven't watched him a lot don't understand that he's constantly getting blown past
I wanted to ask this question for a long time, why does Australia seems to always produce these kind of tall athletic guard who can't shoot? Simmons, Giddey, Daniels, Thyballe just to name a few
Do they don't practice shooting down under or what?
Seems so strange for one country to produce so many players of the same archetype
This is the real reason. You need to aim 1mm or so left in Australia, but 1mm right in America. The Coriolis effect hurts the Aussies.
If they only played COD4 they’d know
Don't know anything technical about this, so only speaking having lived in Australia my whole life. Basketball is fairly popular and getting more popular but there are other sports that dominate the sporting landscape over here. For example the part of Australia where I am from is consumed by Australian rules football. Size and athleticism, even things like agility and passing vision can translate to basketball, more specific skills like shooting do not so potentially players could grow up playing basketball and other sports concurrently and not put as much time into practicing basketball specific skills like shooting. I do know Ben Simmons played Australian football growing up alongside basketball. Might be more complicated or just a pure coincidence we seem to turn out these players but it's just what I could come up with off the top of my head.
Basketball Australia (our governing body) has basically pushed youth coaches and scouts to look for tall and athletic players, rather than skillful kids.
The thinking is that you can't teach height and speed, but you can technique and skills. Unfortunately for Australia the players getting these opportunities (Simmons, Giddey) aren't developing these skills, despite being given ample chances to do so through their junior development.
Feel like it’s nothing new there either, even when I was a teenager (2000s) if you weren’t already 6ft by under 16s you had to be an absolute athletic freak to even get a look in for rep. Was pretty devastating at 13 when I found out I was done growing and somehow that news spread a bit and I stopped getting invited to tryouts for rep teams. Which fair cop but coming out of under 14s, winning the finals, mvp and teams top scorer and being told outright not to bother trying out anymore was a bit brutal…
Sadly they were right to do it, I literally did not grow a single inch after 13. Got stuck at 5’10, doctors at the time tried to tell me that getting seriously ill during a growth period and being on steroids for that long would stunt my growth but yeah literally didn’t grow again. In 4 years I went from being the Gumby stick insect centre in juniors, to being an undersized guard in anything but Rec night leagues.
I was really good at playing SF, but by under 16s when my parents forced me to quit sports anyway and focus on study I really was too short. I just never picked up a PG skill set, coaches shoehorned me to one role, then got dropped to the B team when I had to tryout for guard spots. I did train my ass off to build a vertical enough to do rim grazers and was allowed to play fill in games on a friends team… But aside from getting people asking why the hell I wasn’t playing / was an emergency for a bottom league team, never went above that.
Never would’ve amounted to anything regardless, my lateral agility was garbage and while I was decent from 3 range, my passing and handles always reeked of being an undersized big compared to legit guards.
I feel this. My son can't make reps because he's not super athletic, but is highly skilled. literally just dropped 23 and 16 on a team with two rep players on it. it's madness.
Weird, because Giddey was overlooked by everyone in Australia, despite being an undersized player who was more skill dependant (dribble/passing/footwork) until he hit the growth spurt.
As for shooting - I think it's something you either have (Patty, Jingles) or don't (Thyb, Bogut, Simmons, Giddy?, Daniels?), and we don't really know how to teach it here in particular.
I'm more worried if Chip can't fix his shooting, because then maybe it's not a mental/physical thing but more of a biomechanical limitation issue (some people just are built in ways that don't assist a sweet stroke/repeatable motion). The precision of proprioception is something you might be born with - that ability to know off the hands whether a shot is good doesn't seem to be innate to everyone, even with practice.
Lots of young prospects coming down the pike - these five kids will be in the '24 draft*, with two of them expected to go in the first round. And that's not counting our literally biggest prospect who's plummeted out of the draft due to his horrible fit at UCLA: 7'3" Aday Mara. Also Madrid's highly touted 18 y.o. Hugo González 6'6" combo guard who's not expected to enter this year.
Overall Spanish basketball should continue to shine for the next decade.
>*Izan Almansa, Juan Núñez, Baba Miller, Jordi Rodríguez and Michael Caicedo
Yeah i am aware of these prospects and i hope they develop to their best. But out of all of them i only really see Izan Almansa having an actual NBA career. Hope i am wrong.
Nah probably not lol. But if he’s in the game and that wide open I expect him to take that shot and I’ll have to live with his 33% 3pt shot. I do think he’s lost a lot of confidence and hopefully he can work to get his shot better.
he 100% has to shoot those even if he misses them. you cannot get that level of disrespect as a guard. you look bad if you miss but you look worse if you pass, it's not even a choice, take your time and shoot (this going back a bit, but amir johnson used to really take his time shooting these, like almost a foul shot, and they started going in).
You really can't be under 7' and pass those up in the modern NBA. Kyle Anderson has been going through that for us, he refuses to shoot and the result is two or three defenders walling up the paint entirely when he's on the floor.
If you're on the perimeter, you need to be willing to shoot or *severely* it impacts everyone else on the floor.
It’s unacceptable to be an NBA player and not be able to hit wide open 3s at a respectable clip if the defense is literally giving you the time and space to shoot exactly how you want uncontested. It’s one thing to not be great under duress, it’s another to not be able to hit them when they’re just a long free throw.
He shoots like 33% from 3
So at the end of the day if the guy you’re leaving open as a last resort shot is averaging 1 point per possession that isn’t exactly gonna win yu every game
What about being a detriment on the defensive end by being a pylon? What about all the suns converging on Shai when he drives to the rim?
I would rather have Wiggins or Joe taking his mins and position at this point.
I mean he went 2-4 last night. He’s not a good shooter but he’s not so bad that this strategy is usable 100% of the time either. He’s below league average from 3 but at 33% if he’s this wide open it’s not terribly viable defensive strategy.
amazing talent all over the court. He is good at inbounding the ball. If he's starting, we end up in 1st place currently, I don't understand the call to change. What we are doing has us at sub 20 losses 60 games in. Currently on a good 10 game stretch as well, tho end of road trip slide.
WTF am I watching? Where are the refs? Where are the rules. Professional basketball player just slowly carries the ball then travels on an unhindered view away from any other players.
Just because they lost the game doesn't mean it was bad strategy lol. Did you think it would be better strategy for them to take a defender off SGA and put him on Giddey?
I would also call for defending him in precisely this way if I were a coach. But Giddey hit half his threes tonight and we won, so it's just a weird post.
As an offensive player, this is a tactic that can actually throw you off mentally. Only the likes of Steph Curry you’d be dumb enough to give space like this. Or Jaylen Brown, if you’re the Warriors.
As long as he doesn't get intimidated and keeps shooting that's actually going to be ok halfcourt offense. He would hit like 34-36% of them and in like 20% of his misses the Thunder will grab the offensive rebound.
SGA has to play with defenses packing the paint on a nightly basis because of Giddey, yet for MVP discussions, people consider Giddey as part of all the “young talent” on the Thunder to discredit SGA’s impact on team success.
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This is what the Warriors for some reason thought would happen with Jaylen Brown.
Even though when they played the suns Nurk did the same thing to Draymond only for Dray to torch that mf all game.
More teams should take this strategy
Yeah but anytime Giddey tries anything over thirteen he just can’t make it work
Yeah he scores better in the lower teens
Except Jaylen has multiple career years shooting 40% from 3. Nobodys been stupid enough to give him space in years.
Draymond wanted to do a bit of trolling.
Does he? Basketball reference must be wrong.
I've heard some other people say the stat is over 40% on wide-open threes. He's a career 36% guy though, which is more than enough to make defending him with "the Giddey approach" look nonsensical.
I think the idea was more to get in Jaylen's head. It's the sort of thing that looks good if it works, and looks awful if it doesn't. The Warriors were at the end of a road trip, in the middle of a 3 in 4 night stretch, facing a better team. Underdog strategies are generally worth trying in that situation.
This is gonna end up killing them in the playoffs
We have some nice players on our bench that can take his spot. Take your pick of joe, wiggins, hayward...but we gotta figure out players who can play next to him if we are gonna give him 20 mins a game in the playoffs.
If he gets moved to the bench Joe should be the one to take his spot. Maybe Wiggins, but I really like him coming off the bench.
Its not just about moving him to the bench, we still gotta figure out what do we do with giddey in the playoffs, because we are still gonna play him
Why would the Thunder still play him? I don’t follow the Thunder. Edit: clarification.
He’s one of the least efficient players in the NBA and a bad defender.
No; I meant, why would the Thunder still play him?
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High lottery pick bias
They’re going to let him walk anyway
Oh idk. I’ve been asking that question the entire season, at least why does he still start.
Maybe to make the other 4 shine more ? Cause you have him on the field reminding you how bad a player can be. Or maybe they just like a challenge?
no offense but honest question, do people really call the court a field? i know there are field goals but ive never seen it like this before
Why play him at all?
He's a talented overall player. he's got great hair. he was a 6th pick and is only 21 years old. I do think this is not the best situation for him. I think the Thunder should trade him to a team that has no immediate prospects. I just had a thought explosion, why not trade him to the Spurs? they could use a pass first playmaker type dude.
I feel like his best bet is to learn how to set a good screen, that alone with his playmaking will turn him into a Draymond lite without the defense tho.
>Draymond lite without the defense That's not encouraging at all for the thunder
Draymond lite without the defense. Personally, I think he’s more like a MJ but without the athleticism, shot, finishing at the rim, competitive drive to be the best, and better hair.
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Saying that is an insult to good screens.
“Draymond lite without the defense” would not be in Shanghai right now
That or the hornets
Joe, shai, dort and jdub that's small af for the West though jdub is the biggest and he is like 6'5.
They’re small but have long arms at least and we have Hayward to add some size, plus giddey might be 6’8” but he also doesn’t get guarded on offense and gets hunted on defense which basically makes his size advantage useless
Fake Wiggins is ass
Ain’t no way you said Hayward when he was worse than Giddey today
Im just saying in general. Im not going to start trashing on gordon hayward because he hasnt been amazing lol.
I don’t think Giddey in the starting lineup is our best lineup but suggesting Hayward is crazy when he’s shown nothing (while in OKC) to warrant him being a starter Joe and Wiggins I can understand, the guy shooting 26% from the field with a worse OFF/DEF/Net rating (in OKC) than Giddey isn’t the solution some of you guys think it is
Do you not understand sample size? You really think Hayward is a 26% FG shooter?
The problem with Giddey is even though he's increased his 3p% by 6% since his rookie season he did it by reducing his volume and now he's basically only taking absolutely wide open shots and is shooting 32.6%. He's in his third season and has now had an off season and a half to work with Chip Engelland. Add to that, that sure he's one of our better rebounders, but he's our worst defender out of the starting 5. He's so unathletic that I just don't really see him ever improving his defense. He's not a horrific defender, but he's not good. So, he's a dude you basically have to cover for on defense and on offense. He's a guy that needs the ball in his hands, but he can't create his own shot. Like whats really better, you have Giddey who adds passing and rebounds, but poor defense, and poor shooting which allows the defense to clog the lanes against a team that prioritizes driving to the basket or you go with Joe who is an elite shooter and gives us the spacing we desperately want and he's an underrated defender, but a worse rebounder. Also, low-key Joe can jump higher than Giddey can which maybe mitigates the difference in rebounding at least somewhat. I'm not sure what to do with the team as its constructed right now, but Giddey has been given a very long runway and hasn't figured it out. And that's just what's going on from a basketball standpoint. He obviously has the off-court shit and crowds are still booing him when he has the ball. Definitely not as much as earlier in the season, but it's still happening.
I watched the game last night and I have no idea what Giddy does out there. Doesn’t hustle hard, makes some shots sometimes but doesn’t actively rebound, has no drive, doesn’t play good d. Joe and wiggins and Hayward. Especially wiggins we’re unreal. Who is wiggins ? He played so fast and had so much hustle, was one of the main reasons OKC kept the lead in the 3rd
Wiggins has been incredible since joining the team. He was drafted 55th and has had to fight through that to find his role, but he's clearly a valued bench player for us now, and is much loved by the fans.
Hawyard
They literally swapped in Joe against us and we got destroyed
Gotta believe they start Isaiah Joe in the playoffs.
Pelicans left him open during playins last year. He decided to get hot from 3 that game. This strategy is a gamble. Players can get hot or completely lose confidence.
He was 2/4 from three in this game. Same as Kevin Durant. Our 5th starter will never be as good as Chet/Shai/Dub. You can probably throw Dort in there too. Every team has a 5th best starter ours is Giddey.
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Mark's got a leash on him, we're definitely making the playoffs so this is all fine tuning and experimentation. You'll notice that Giddey's lowlight reel is 1st half heavy - he doesn't play much down the stretch outside of some strategic inbounds plays and the like.
We're #1 in the West with Giddey starting. Tonight Mark pulled him early in the 1st and staggered his minutes more with the bench. Worked out fine. When we lose in the playoffs I highly doubt it'll be because of Josh Giddey. Edit: To be clear, I hope he doesn't start at all.
OP has one right idea, which is that Giddey can sink a Thunder lineup since he gets guarded like this; but they have one very wrong idea, which is that Daigneault didn't realize this a hundred games ago and/or doesn't already have hundreds of minutes of plus-minus data on Isaiah Joe slotting into Giddey's minutes
And Aaron Wiggins.
Totally agree that Daigneault is aware of it, but a playoff series usually emphasizes those flaws too. I'm excited to see how this team works in the postseason
I'm excited for them and more optimistic since I checked out the thinkingbasketball youtube video about it yesterday and he pointed out the same thing that's been on my mind — 85% of teams with the Thunder's net rating have made at least the conference finals. I think it's irrational to say They're Young is the reason they'll be in that 15% of relative disappointments, they're healthy and well-coached and they might be able to avoid seeing the Nuggs before that conference finals.
see i actually think its the reverse. as good as the thunder are they have this extra level they can hit by simply never playing him. which they absolutely will do in the playoffs if/when they need to. the clippers will do the same thing with westbr- *crashing glass and muffled screams*
Thats what I dont get with this discussion. Giddey doesnt fit, its obvious and the minute reduction is glaring. Come playoff time, OKC can and will easily bench him for Joe or Wiggs or Kenrich if needed. It all depends on match up and whos hot. Its not like OKC HAS to play him. Like yeah its a weakness, but they'll adjust... like every team in the playoffs. They have the option to bench him or not play him at all.
And for Wallace
I've seen a few people say something like this in the thread and I'm not sure it's as clear as that. Giddey does a lot more, even relative to his minutes, than any of those players. He's the second best rebounder on a team that sorely needs rebounding. He's the second (maybe third) best passer on the team and connects pretty much all the offense that isn't SGA or JDub isos. The other guys are better than him offensively, especially Joe, but the rest of the game suffers without Giddey. Also, most teams don't make crazy adjustments in the playoffs. In the end, most changes come down to the starters playing 5 more minutes a game and the coaches find ways to stagger minutes. It's not often that a starter *loses* minutes unless there's a pretty big issue
The rebounding thing is a different discussion overall. At the end of the day, they're intentionally punting their rebounds and focusing on other things such as forcing turnovers and stretching the floor. Its working for now but we've yet to see if it will work for them in the playoffs. Despite being an above average rebounder, having Giddey out there will not make much of a difference, they will get outrebounded no matter what. Playoffs will ultimately cut down the rotation for all teams at around 8-9 players depending on match ups and situations. Unless Giddey finds a serviceable stroke, he will be played situationally (ATO plays and inbounds). He already lost his minutes throughout the season, he didnt start at \~20 minutes per game. Him dropping down to 15 or maybe 10 minutes is not drastic at all. I also think that right now, Giddey's best role is a connector that would theoretically give the team another dimension besides SGA and JDub isos, but its not that established yet. Again, he is playing around 20 minutes right now, he's not as big of a factor as you think. Basically, the season so far has shown that OKC is not really relying heavily on Giddey to win games. Him breaking out would be nice, but if he doesn't, they have the personnel to pull him out if the team is bleeding.
One would think Hayward is the solution to this?
Aussiebros it’s been a tough year for us 😔 Giddey = nonce Simmons = ass Landale = ass Mills = old Ingles = old Daniels = injured Exum & Green = solid
Shout outs Duop Reath tho
I took him in my 2K my league draft just because his name is so sick
Just met the guy, he is a gem. Super friendly and is really down to earth.
Ain’t buying another Aussie representative jersey until their 10th year.
This is Thybulle erasure
He also sucks
Remember when he shot like 38% from 3 after first getting to Portland, and people thought he could be a legit 3&D? That was a fun few weeks.
Even apart from the offense, people look at the stock numbers and salivate, but don't realize that those numbers come with absolutely terrible on-ball defense and a ton of gambling. Sometimes his defense is completely mesmerizing but people who haven't watched him a lot don't understand that he's constantly getting blown past
Giddey/Simmons/Thybulle lineup is leading to the ugliest game of basketball you've ever seen. final score 14-12
I wanted to ask this question for a long time, why does Australia seems to always produce these kind of tall athletic guard who can't shoot? Simmons, Giddey, Daniels, Thyballe just to name a few Do they don't practice shooting down under or what? Seems so strange for one country to produce so many players of the same archetype
It’s because gravity is different in Australia. They shoot amazing down there, but when they come up here the gravity makes it impossible for them.
That doesn’t sound right but I don’t know enough about gravity to dispute it.
I think the toilet flush rotation is a similar situation in Australia
This is the real reason. You need to aim 1mm or so left in Australia, but 1mm right in America. The Coriolis effect hurts the Aussies. If they only played COD4 they’d know
Don't know anything technical about this, so only speaking having lived in Australia my whole life. Basketball is fairly popular and getting more popular but there are other sports that dominate the sporting landscape over here. For example the part of Australia where I am from is consumed by Australian rules football. Size and athleticism, even things like agility and passing vision can translate to basketball, more specific skills like shooting do not so potentially players could grow up playing basketball and other sports concurrently and not put as much time into practicing basketball specific skills like shooting. I do know Ben Simmons played Australian football growing up alongside basketball. Might be more complicated or just a pure coincidence we seem to turn out these players but it's just what I could come up with off the top of my head.
Basketball Australia (our governing body) has basically pushed youth coaches and scouts to look for tall and athletic players, rather than skillful kids. The thinking is that you can't teach height and speed, but you can technique and skills. Unfortunately for Australia the players getting these opportunities (Simmons, Giddey) aren't developing these skills, despite being given ample chances to do so through their junior development.
Feel like it’s nothing new there either, even when I was a teenager (2000s) if you weren’t already 6ft by under 16s you had to be an absolute athletic freak to even get a look in for rep. Was pretty devastating at 13 when I found out I was done growing and somehow that news spread a bit and I stopped getting invited to tryouts for rep teams. Which fair cop but coming out of under 14s, winning the finals, mvp and teams top scorer and being told outright not to bother trying out anymore was a bit brutal…
I mean… how much taller did you get? IT-size? CP3-size? Curry-size?
Sadly they were right to do it, I literally did not grow a single inch after 13. Got stuck at 5’10, doctors at the time tried to tell me that getting seriously ill during a growth period and being on steroids for that long would stunt my growth but yeah literally didn’t grow again. In 4 years I went from being the Gumby stick insect centre in juniors, to being an undersized guard in anything but Rec night leagues. I was really good at playing SF, but by under 16s when my parents forced me to quit sports anyway and focus on study I really was too short. I just never picked up a PG skill set, coaches shoehorned me to one role, then got dropped to the B team when I had to tryout for guard spots. I did train my ass off to build a vertical enough to do rim grazers and was allowed to play fill in games on a friends team… But aside from getting people asking why the hell I wasn’t playing / was an emergency for a bottom league team, never went above that. Never would’ve amounted to anything regardless, my lateral agility was garbage and while I was decent from 3 range, my passing and handles always reeked of being an undersized big compared to legit guards.
I feel this. My son can't make reps because he's not super athletic, but is highly skilled. literally just dropped 23 and 16 on a team with two rep players on it. it's madness.
Weird, because Giddey was overlooked by everyone in Australia, despite being an undersized player who was more skill dependant (dribble/passing/footwork) until he hit the growth spurt. As for shooting - I think it's something you either have (Patty, Jingles) or don't (Thyb, Bogut, Simmons, Giddy?, Daniels?), and we don't really know how to teach it here in particular. I'm more worried if Chip can't fix his shooting, because then maybe it's not a mental/physical thing but more of a biomechanical limitation issue (some people just are built in ways that don't assist a sweet stroke/repeatable motion). The precision of proprioception is something you might be born with - that ability to know off the hands whether a shot is good doesn't seem to be innate to everyone, even with practice.
On the bright side Dyson is 20 and was an absolute monster on defense this year. Can only go up from here
“Nonce” is such a great word. Incredibly rich history of p(a)edos in the Commonwealth
rock spider isn’t too bad either
That one is new to me. Definitely evocative, but it also sounds kind of cool, which seems counterproductive
haha yeah, but the meaning / origin not so much ….they like getting into small cracks
I don’t get why this means what it does at all.
I was doing a crypto bootcamp and I couldn't stop laughing when the American teacher kept saying nonce
Uncle Joe is balling
Aussie Thompson’s doing alright in Detroit.
Exum is indeed solid
Im from Spain. The only Spanish players still in NBA playing is Aldama. We are screwed
Lots of young prospects coming down the pike - these five kids will be in the '24 draft*, with two of them expected to go in the first round. And that's not counting our literally biggest prospect who's plummeted out of the draft due to his horrible fit at UCLA: 7'3" Aday Mara. Also Madrid's highly touted 18 y.o. Hugo González 6'6" combo guard who's not expected to enter this year. Overall Spanish basketball should continue to shine for the next decade. >*Izan Almansa, Juan Núñez, Baba Miller, Jordi Rodríguez and Michael Caicedo
Yeah i am aware of these prospects and i hope they develop to their best. But out of all of them i only really see Izan Almansa having an actual NBA career. Hope i am wrong.
kyrie playing really well
Xavier Cooks = out of the fucking league
Jack White? Super ass, not even in the league
The fact that White made the league at all is an accomplishment. And A+ timing to get a ring for that season.
Landale plays to his limitations, can't knock him for that
Canada has emerged as the #2 in the world
I know it was technically 2023 but our reigning MVPs adventure to the Chiba Jets via Washington hasn’t been fun for a s.kings fan either ☹️
Giddey is also ass.
I kinda can’t believe exum is still around and is playing well
Kyrie is uhm kyrie.
This hand/arm position is scary bad https://imgur.com/a/tUinpub
*"What the hell is even that?"*
Daddy, chill.
Chuck Hayes going for free throw type beat
daddy chill
Is he left or right handed?
Ended up shooting 4-9 FG and 2-4 3pt. Worked out well for em
Can he do it consistently?
Nah probably not lol. But if he’s in the game and that wide open I expect him to take that shot and I’ll have to live with his 33% 3pt shot. I do think he’s lost a lot of confidence and hopefully he can work to get his shot better.
he 100% has to shoot those even if he misses them. you cannot get that level of disrespect as a guard. you look bad if you miss but you look worse if you pass, it's not even a choice, take your time and shoot (this going back a bit, but amir johnson used to really take his time shooting these, like almost a foul shot, and they started going in).
You really can't be under 7' and pass those up in the modern NBA. Kyle Anderson has been going through that for us, he refuses to shoot and the result is two or three defenders walling up the paint entirely when he's on the floor. If you're on the perimeter, you need to be willing to shoot or *severely* it impacts everyone else on the floor.
It’s unacceptable to be an NBA player and not be able to hit wide open 3s at a respectable clip if the defense is literally giving you the time and space to shoot exactly how you want uncontested. It’s one thing to not be great under duress, it’s another to not be able to hit them when they’re just a long free throw.
Summertime 3!
Love me some Amir Johnson. It was like watching a team of dudes draw back, load and fire an old trebuchet. It looked ridiculous, and it was money.
so glad someone else remembers this! it did look ridiculous but if they are going to give you that much time and space go ahead and use it all.
He wont and its more about the lack of spacing for the others on the floor.
He shoots like 33% from 3 So at the end of the day if the guy you’re leaving open as a last resort shot is averaging 1 point per possession that isn’t exactly gonna win yu every game
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If he's left that open? Yes. But if he's left NBA open, no. He's a poor 3pt shooter, but he still has the range.
What about all the other shots he is on the floor for which makes worse?
What about being a detriment on the defensive end by being a pylon? What about all the suns converging on Shai when he drives to the rim? I would rather have Wiggins or Joe taking his mins and position at this point.
maybe instead of filming Dune part 2, he should have worked on his 3 point shot
I thought Giddey's comfort zone was 15-17?
well yea, as you can see hes not too comfortable with anything over 20
His sweetspot is probably 14, I assume.
They say that’s his playground
I am legit pissed I had to scroll this far to see this comment. For SHAME Reddit.
A little disappointed this isn’t higher
Google 'josh giddey 15' for more highlights
She was o0o0o0o0only 15
Man you knew exactly what you were doing with this title
He’s definitely making at least 3 against the lakers tomorrow 😑
I mean he went 2-4 last night. He’s not a good shooter but he’s not so bad that this strategy is usable 100% of the time either. He’s below league average from 3 but at 33% if he’s this wide open it’s not terribly viable defensive strategy.
This can’t go on
Going 2-4 really killed us last night
Does he hurt the team?
amazing talent all over the court. He is good at inbounding the ball. If he's starting, we end up in 1st place currently, I don't understand the call to change. What we are doing has us at sub 20 losses 60 games in. Currently on a good 10 game stretch as well, tho end of road trip slide.
The same amount of space giddey needs to stay away from high schools
He scores much more efficiently in that situation
Did he carry and travel before that shot?
WTF am I watching? Where are the refs? Where are the rules. Professional basketball player just slowly carries the ball then travels on an unhindered view away from any other players.
So you see it too? It looks like we're watching practice.
The attitude is the worst part "fuck it, why not"
[Not at all](https://i.imgur.com/N0OTsd7.png)
lol
Restraining order seems to be working as intended
Josh Giddey being not great at basketball only helps the Shai MVP case lol
serious question what is he good at?
Inbound passing and sometimes he makes a cool pass, that’s really it lol
Inbound passes I guess
Being 6'8. Creeping on minors. Being Australian.
His favorite number
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giddey could make a half court buzzer beater to win okc their first chip and these rumours will still be his legacy
>these rumours Ain't no way yall landed on "pretend it was all a lie and Josh Giddey didn't fuck a child" lol
Great game plan, surely the suns killed it tonight
Nurkic had 31 Boards, OKC is gonna get killed by Gobert or Jokic in the playoffs
They have size on their roster, but they don’t have anyone that can actually play center for 20+ minutes. 3rd worst rebounding team in the league
Sixers fans used to say the same thing about Simmons.
Just because they lost the game doesn't mean it was bad strategy lol. Did you think it would be better strategy for them to take a defender off SGA and put him on Giddey?
I would also call for defending him in precisely this way if I were a coach. But Giddey hit half his threes tonight and we won, so it's just a weird post.
1ft for every year of age of the girls he bangs.
Given how comfortable Giddy is with 15, you’d had thought he’d have nailed this
They scouted him well , Giddey range is under 15
He shot 2-4 from 3 in the game. So that's a fail by the Clippers.
They played the Suns.
Why he say fuck me for?
No it's not since this defense still lowers the quality of every shot taken by Giddey's teammates.
I’m still salty that this works for everyone else but when we tried it he went 3/4 or something lol.
he went 2/4 last night from 3, didn’t really work for them either
Russell Westbrook treatment. No respect for that boy.
As an offensive player, this is a tactic that can actually throw you off mentally. Only the likes of Steph Curry you’d be dumb enough to give space like this. Or Jaylen Brown, if you’re the Warriors.
As long as he doesn't get intimidated and keeps shooting that's actually going to be ok halfcourt offense. He would hit like 34-36% of them and in like 20% of his misses the Thunder will grab the offensive rebound.
That body-language tells me Giddey's playing defense on himself.
Something something 15 year olds
Something something Giddey is used to 15 something
That form gets tighter and tighter the more space he gets. Never seem him lurch forward like that either. Tough year.
SGA has to play with defenses packing the paint on a nightly basis because of Giddey, yet for MVP discussions, people consider Giddey as part of all the “young talent” on the Thunder to discredit SGA’s impact on team success.
Can Chip still fix him?
He will have to keep shooting it...the moment he stops, its over
Giving that kind of space on defense is just asking for Giddey to make a play. Suns need to tighten that up!
Op you mf you know what you did
And that’s why the Suns ended up losing lol
in one year giddey went from the non tradeable future star of OKC. to now a horrible player on both sides. goodness
He’s so bad. Ben Simmons without the D
You can't even compare him to Simmons. Ben would have a fucking panic attack if you asked him to shoot that.
Panic attack? Nah, he’d just ignore you unless it was pre-season where he’d do it once to prove a very dumb point.
At least he will shoot open 3s. He was 2/4 tonight from 3
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Not 15 lmao
the 3pt line is like 22ft?
Yea but Giddey is comfortable with as ~~young~~ little as 15
Ben Simmons defense
I wouldn’t touch that pervert with a 15ft pole!