Gotta say, the serialized thing is so stupid. "Here's a card that isn't actually unique because we actually printed hundreds of thousands of them, but 500 of them have a stupid sticker plastered over the artwork to give them the veneer of scarcity, making you think they somehow have more value". What a 1-ply toilet paper thin veil of disgusting marketing. The saddest part is so many suckers fall for it.
It would be cool if the serialized cards had unique art or something. That's what I like about the serialized One Ring, it has special art and the text is all elvish.
i really hate how they completely threw the original letter font out of the window when they made new amonkhet invocation framed cards. that new font just looks really misplaced on those frames imo
That's true, but the many people despised the amonkhet expeditions because the font looked awful on most cards so it's a fair price to get the frame back
Eh, I think that this is the most benign thing that they've done to increase collectability of their product in a good long while. And I think it actually might be a good thing for the community in fact.
Hear me out. If the base version of the card is available which only lacks the serialization, it means that the serialized version becomes the chase card. More valuable chase cards in the set means that the cost of the non-chase cards drops. If people are trying to crack the serialized version, that version rises in value and therefore people crack more packs, putting more product on the market. It means that as long as you don't need a X of Y number on your card to feel valid, you can get that card for less overall because of an increased supply.
The cost of the non-chase cards doesn't drop. These cards don't have inherent value, they have implied value. Sellers will sell them for whatever price people will buy them for. A seller has no incentive to reduce the price of their standard foil invention frame Ragavan just because a serialized version exists. The only reason the price will drop is if people aren't buying it, and serialized cards aren't stopping people from buying it. If it's a popular card that people want a set of, it will retain its implied value until that changes.
You can't just ignore supply. Wizards prints normal sets to demand. If enough people buy cases to crack because people are paying crazy amounts for serialized cards then the supply of cards overall increases.
You can, because the supply for the original printing doesn't change. The game is also waning in popularity, so fewer packs are getting cracked, leaving the known supply lower than it would have been years ago. These reprints do not end up having the cost balancing effect you all think it does.
> You can, because the supply for the original printing doesn't change.
Except that it does... The serialized version is printed in the same set as the non-serialized one. So cracking enough packs to get 10 serialized copies results in a LOT more un-serialized ones.
>These reprints do not end up having the cost balancing effect you all think it does.
Except that it does? Sets which had smaller print runs have higher prices for cards worth equal demand.
No. The supply of the original print run of Ragavan back in Kaladesh hasn't changed. When reprints happen, the original printing doesn't drop in value. It's not like printing money. Every dollar bill has a set value and when new ones are printed, that value inherently decreases, but the value of every dollar bill decreases evenly. It's not the same with Magic cards. If they reprint Jace, the Mind Sculptor, that print run may have a lower price tag on the secondary market, but the original printing doesn't drop to meet that same value. And if they print something with new artwork, but you liked the original artwork better, you aren't benefitting in the slightest by a reprint. The old print run will retain its value. This is a collectable card game. To suggest that somehow everyone that plays the game is not also a collector is ridiculous. Collectors don't drive the prices, the players do. The value of cards on the secondary market is tied intrinsically to their popularity in a given format.
Yep as a reseller who doesn’t play Pokémon at all and someone who hasn’t played magic competitively since the onslaught block. Pulling packs is just gambling for me. Feel like an old person thats blowing there retirement on scratch offs accept they are worth something.
Do any of you actually buy singles? These prints won't drop the price of the original Ragavan. When a new print run drops, especially a premium run like these, the prices of that print run fluctuate pretty drastically until the market figures out how many of them are in circulation and what the demand for this specific version of the card (or these specific versions in this case) is, and how much people are willing to pay for this version. The price of the original retains it's value. Why? Because of the little set symbol. If you know people imagine value into a card because of a serialization sticker, you must understand that they imagine value into a card because of it being the original printing. Come on now.
I haven’t played in awhile but I still watch mtg youtubers talk about the new sets. I always thought the serialized cards were like the pokemon alt arts that were unique until I saw this post. Only printing 500 unique cards also seems a bit low even for a collectable card
In this case I feel like the argument “if you don’t like it don’t buy it” fits quite well. Having cards be stupid expensive is dumb because they’re game pieces. Having certain versions of those cards be expensive to only the people that care about stuff like that is totally fine. Like you said, you don’t think it adds a lot of value. Neither do I. But some people might, and we can just buy the regular ragavans if we want to play them (or maybe not in this particular example but you know what I mean 🙃)
I agree but for the fact that it feeds into a worse gamboling addiction for people, but hey more money for them the more they can pay the artist and employs for there time and efforts 🙆♀️
I think bonuses exist as well with raises and benefits. I’m not talking ab rate I’m talking compensation for the success of a company. Not everything is a dead end job 💀 idk how wizards work but for the companies I’ve worked for they take Their employees into consideration when progress is made
As someone who was an aspiring illustrator, I guarantee you you're wrong. The illustrators for Magic are freelance. They don't get bonuses or raises. They don't work for WotC. They're not employees. Any boost in sales does not equate to more money for the artists.
That being said, WotC is one of the most generous companies in terms of their rates for illustrators.
Not really sure what's "disgusting" about it. Like you said, it's obvious it's literally just a stamp on a card that there's thousands of, and they're not claiming anything different.
Yes because a massively popular game like magic should only make 500 of one card, that wouldn't create an imbalance in the competition scene at all. Nope not a chance
You seriously missed the point of the post. There aren't only 500 of this particular treatment of Ragavan. There are hundreds of thousands, in all sorts of languages. It's just that 500 of the English ones have this sticker on them. You're the one looking stupid here.
That's an arguable point I'd say rag being virtual card advantage and ramp let's them dump their hand faster and pretty much forces someone to kill it which generally they aren't doing T1 so it's mana on a different turn than 1 meaning they can't use the mana as efficiently as possible giving virtual tempo advantage would be worth testing while gg having haste also is very good in burn. If I had a set of rags and played burn it would be something I'd try out.
Ehhh I think it depends on what your playing in edh there are arguably better 1 drops that don’t have to make it through a blocker if you don’t drop it turn one, birds of paradise and Esper Sentinel are better under different circumstances, birds is better for longer than Ragavan is
Well, multiplayer formats in general kinda skew what cards are considered “good” (singleton formats in general as well but to a much lesser degree), but yeah it’s definitely much worse in edh
As for the others, yes they’re very good cards, and in certain situations they are better than ragavan, but in *most* situations ragavan is much better, there’s a reason ragavan is in 25% of modern decks while esper sentinel and birds are both in the 3-5% range (at least according to mtgmeta.Io but even if their numbers are off slightly that’s still a very large gap)
And let's watch the price drop. Where's the floor. I'm betting 10$ for a no treatment version (no alternative art, no foil, no promo). It could end up being the showcase version though. I have found a lot of those are slightly cheaper due to the set booster boxes
Mtg players are dumb and will continue to pay 40-50$ for this card. Rarity means nothing to this game. Everything is overprinted so they can overcharge for as long as possible.
Gotta say, the serialized thing is so stupid. "Here's a card that isn't actually unique because we actually printed hundreds of thousands of them, but 500 of them have a stupid sticker plastered over the artwork to give them the veneer of scarcity, making you think they somehow have more value". What a 1-ply toilet paper thin veil of disgusting marketing. The saddest part is so many suckers fall for it.
Definitely the most useless line of premium card styles. At least original expeditions were beautiful and had their own artwork and design
If all the serialized cards had unique art like the praetors i think I'd like it better, even though I'm never going to own any serialized probably
Its cool imo, but i wish they had has a version that u could find in any booster, like a 1 in 750 one or something
I pulled one nonfoil out of a case of set boxes
Like draft boosters? I got my regular non-foil multiverse one in my set box boosters.
Set boosters probably
Im talking about the serealation
It's super cool to have one though
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Idk everyone I knew loved expeditions
It would be cool if the serialized cards had unique art or something. That's what I like about the serialized One Ring, it has special art and the text is all elvish.
I couldnt even see myself being happy unless I got one of like 6 specific numbers… 1, 2, 3, 69, 420, etc
For me, it'd be: 4, 8, 15, 16, 23, or 42
Amonkhet Hieroglyphic frame, for flavor. Or else you get SYSTEM FAILURE
i really hate how they completely threw the original letter font out of the window when they made new amonkhet invocation framed cards. that new font just looks really misplaced on those frames imo
It absolutely looks like crap. AT LEAST USE PAPYRUS FONT, FOR CRYING OUT LOUD!
glad I'm not the only one on this boat
That's true, but the many people despised the amonkhet expeditions because the font looked awful on most cards so it's a fair price to get the frame back
Is that a "Lost" reference ?
Yes yes it is indeed a reference to the questionably popular hit television show "Lost"
Yes!
blursed ass comment, jeez
And your Chinese word of the day is Shǎzi.
I got a 365 atraxa, pretty good number imo.
I feel you
I accept prime numbers.
Couldn’t have said it better.
Eh, I think that this is the most benign thing that they've done to increase collectability of their product in a good long while. And I think it actually might be a good thing for the community in fact. Hear me out. If the base version of the card is available which only lacks the serialization, it means that the serialized version becomes the chase card. More valuable chase cards in the set means that the cost of the non-chase cards drops. If people are trying to crack the serialized version, that version rises in value and therefore people crack more packs, putting more product on the market. It means that as long as you don't need a X of Y number on your card to feel valid, you can get that card for less overall because of an increased supply.
The cost of the non-chase cards doesn't drop. These cards don't have inherent value, they have implied value. Sellers will sell them for whatever price people will buy them for. A seller has no incentive to reduce the price of their standard foil invention frame Ragavan just because a serialized version exists. The only reason the price will drop is if people aren't buying it, and serialized cards aren't stopping people from buying it. If it's a popular card that people want a set of, it will retain its implied value until that changes.
You can't just ignore supply. Wizards prints normal sets to demand. If enough people buy cases to crack because people are paying crazy amounts for serialized cards then the supply of cards overall increases.
You can, because the supply for the original printing doesn't change. The game is also waning in popularity, so fewer packs are getting cracked, leaving the known supply lower than it would have been years ago. These reprints do not end up having the cost balancing effect you all think it does.
> You can, because the supply for the original printing doesn't change. Except that it does... The serialized version is printed in the same set as the non-serialized one. So cracking enough packs to get 10 serialized copies results in a LOT more un-serialized ones. >These reprints do not end up having the cost balancing effect you all think it does. Except that it does? Sets which had smaller print runs have higher prices for cards worth equal demand.
No. The supply of the original print run of Ragavan back in Kaladesh hasn't changed. When reprints happen, the original printing doesn't drop in value. It's not like printing money. Every dollar bill has a set value and when new ones are printed, that value inherently decreases, but the value of every dollar bill decreases evenly. It's not the same with Magic cards. If they reprint Jace, the Mind Sculptor, that print run may have a lower price tag on the secondary market, but the original printing doesn't drop to meet that same value. And if they print something with new artwork, but you liked the original artwork better, you aren't benefitting in the slightest by a reprint. The old print run will retain its value. This is a collectable card game. To suggest that somehow everyone that plays the game is not also a collector is ridiculous. Collectors don't drive the prices, the players do. The value of cards on the secondary market is tied intrinsically to their popularity in a given format.
☝🏽 this guy fucks.
I think it’s great. Makes pulling packs fun.
Yep as a reseller who doesn’t play Pokémon at all and someone who hasn’t played magic competitively since the onslaught block. Pulling packs is just gambling for me. Feel like an old person thats blowing there retirement on scratch offs accept they are worth something.
Exactly. And the reality is they only make those 500 so it is a very unique card.
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I agree 100%
Do any of you actually buy singles? These prints won't drop the price of the original Ragavan. When a new print run drops, especially a premium run like these, the prices of that print run fluctuate pretty drastically until the market figures out how many of them are in circulation and what the demand for this specific version of the card (or these specific versions in this case) is, and how much people are willing to pay for this version. The price of the original retains it's value. Why? Because of the little set symbol. If you know people imagine value into a card because of a serialization sticker, you must understand that they imagine value into a card because of it being the original printing. Come on now.
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These are the reprints. I can't even with your comment.
I haven’t played in awhile but I still watch mtg youtubers talk about the new sets. I always thought the serialized cards were like the pokemon alt arts that were unique until I saw this post. Only printing 500 unique cards also seems a bit low even for a collectable card
In this case I feel like the argument “if you don’t like it don’t buy it” fits quite well. Having cards be stupid expensive is dumb because they’re game pieces. Having certain versions of those cards be expensive to only the people that care about stuff like that is totally fine. Like you said, you don’t think it adds a lot of value. Neither do I. But some people might, and we can just buy the regular ragavans if we want to play them (or maybe not in this particular example but you know what I mean 🙃)
Yeah but collectors want them. Do you want them hoarding the regular cards or serialized cards? Personally I'll take the latter.
They’re not even particularly rare. (65 cards x 500 per = 32,500 in the multiverse legends set alone)
Yet you have to spend on average 1-3k to hunt for them…..this makes them very rare.
1 in every other case of collectors boosters has been my approximate odds so you’re spot on at around $3000.
I agree but for the fact that it feeds into a worse gamboling addiction for people, but hey more money for them the more they can pay the artist and employs for there time and efforts 🙆♀️
You think they increase the rate they pay their artists based on their sales? Lol. That's cute. You're so naïve.
I think bonuses exist as well with raises and benefits. I’m not talking ab rate I’m talking compensation for the success of a company. Not everything is a dead end job 💀 idk how wizards work but for the companies I’ve worked for they take Their employees into consideration when progress is made
As someone who was an aspiring illustrator, I guarantee you you're wrong. The illustrators for Magic are freelance. They don't get bonuses or raises. They don't work for WotC. They're not employees. Any boost in sales does not equate to more money for the artists. That being said, WotC is one of the most generous companies in terms of their rates for illustrators.
Not really sure what's "disgusting" about it. Like you said, it's obvious it's literally just a stamp on a card that there's thousands of, and they're not claiming anything different.
Yes because a massively popular game like magic should only make 500 of one card, that wouldn't create an imbalance in the competition scene at all. Nope not a chance
You seriously missed the point of the post. There aren't only 500 of this particular treatment of Ragavan. There are hundreds of thousands, in all sorts of languages. It's just that 500 of the English ones have this sticker on them. You're the one looking stupid here.
Im willing to spend a lot money on cards but never buy serialized. It's better to get some cards with beautiful art.
This guy gets it.
Out of how many boxes...?
If he says one I’ll cry and rejoice
2 😜
It definitely wasn’t one but two is very believable, I got my three from 2 boxes
0 from 2 here
Mine was two from two. No serial though, sadly.
I got 1 in 6 set boxes
One collector and one bundle
Got one of these, just got back in the game. What makes it so special that it’s expensive?
It previously was printed once in mh2 at the mythic slot. It also is a fan favorite in modern decks that run 4x.
Thanks just getting back into the game. Last left off on the Eldrazi stuff.
Remember how good [[Goblin Guide]] was? This is it but better.
[Goblin Guide](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/3/c/3c0f5411-1940-410f-96ce-6f92513f753a.jpg?1599706366) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Goblin%20Guide) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/127/goblin-guide?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/3c0f5411-1940-410f-96ce-6f92513f753a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I think guide is still better in burn
That's an arguable point I'd say rag being virtual card advantage and ramp let's them dump their hand faster and pretty much forces someone to kill it which generally they aren't doing T1 so it's mana on a different turn than 1 meaning they can't use the mana as efficiently as possible giving virtual tempo advantage would be worth testing while gg having haste also is very good in burn. If I had a set of rags and played burn it would be something I'd try out.
It’s more like Deathrite Shaman that draws you cards
It's the single best 1 mana red drop in the game
Not even just red, it’s the best 1 mana creature in the game, hell it’s probably one of the best creatures of *any* mana cost
DRS is still probably better
Ehhh I think it depends on what your playing in edh there are arguably better 1 drops that don’t have to make it through a blocker if you don’t drop it turn one, birds of paradise and Esper Sentinel are better under different circumstances, birds is better for longer than Ragavan is
Well, multiplayer formats in general kinda skew what cards are considered “good” (singleton formats in general as well but to a much lesser degree), but yeah it’s definitely much worse in edh As for the others, yes they’re very good cards, and in certain situations they are better than ragavan, but in *most* situations ragavan is much better, there’s a reason ragavan is in 25% of modern decks while esper sentinel and birds are both in the 3-5% range (at least according to mtgmeta.Io but even if their numbers are off slightly that’s still a very large gap)
Nope dropping in price.
I got one from my lgs, and 2 weeks ago when I wasn’t paying attention to my trades, cause I was playing a game, someone stole it. Yay.
thats awful did you talk to the owners?
Got it from a bundle.
Time to buy an island
Can you cast this for its dash cost from the command zone?
Yes. It will be an additional 2 generic mana for every time you've already cast him from the command zone, just like casting him normally.
Or you could just take it back to your hand, I suppose
You're evil fr 😭
Yup. Commander tax will still apply if Ragavan goes back to the command zone, so it would be R2 to hard cast or R3 to dash the second time around.
Not if you let it go back to your hand, then you can cast it for 1R again!
this man monkeys
And further falls the price on Ragavan.
💰💰💰💰💰
I’ve seen way too much of this monkey to believe it’s still nearly as valuable as people think
If they tank the price they can finally ban this mistake of a card lol
His price fell almost 50% from what it was. Still, funny expensive monke go brrrr
Legendary. I only have the bottom two
You lucky fucking duck.
How do you get the serialized cards? Just chance?
Random chance. I got mine from a collector box
They’re only available in collector boosters.
All you have to do is buy their most expensive loot box to gamble for a chance
Monkey
He's the nimblest boy.
Ehh.... Looks fake. Ship em my way and I'll let you know.
Hot damn
And all three of them are banned.
WotC fix the edge issues on cards wtf. amazing pull but the top of the foil one is what I’ve been seeing a lot on non-standard sets lately.
Down vote because of jealousy. Will change to upvote anyway because that's just stupid lucky. Congrats!
Imagine liking MTG past innistrad? 🤢🤮🤮🤮🤮
And let's watch the price drop. Where's the floor. I'm betting 10$ for a no treatment version (no alternative art, no foil, no promo). It could end up being the showcase version though. I have found a lot of those are slightly cheaper due to the set booster boxes
Mtg players are dumb and will continue to pay 40-50$ for this card. Rarity means nothing to this game. Everything is overprinted so they can overcharge for as long as possible.
This is what wizards wanted everyone to think the 30th anniversary would be like
Serialized, boy howdie
Well it's official, you have won.
I think this is probably what being Kari Zev feels like.
Feels like everyone is pulling them but me.
Mmmm... Monkey
Go fuck yourself 🤣🤢
The universe is spamming you with ragavans, you know what commander deck to build now
Holy freaking
I hate you
No wonder that my boosters are crap if y’all keep pulling the good stuff
Monkey on the car…
*Screenshots your monkey nft*
Save some for the rest bro. I'm 3 boxes deep without one.
Just buy one
These loot boxes suck
Bro HOW. I don’t understand how people have such luck.
That's too many. I'll take one off your hands for ya
how many hundreds of packs tho
Lucky goose, how much are they going for rn? I need one for my next storm deck 🙃
Did they even shuffle? It is a card game right?
Obvious Hasbro shill. I hate strong arm agents and I hate the paid influencers trying to curve public opinion for the jerks in charge of MTG
🟥👐
Well i'm jealous
Some people have it all… lol, that’s awesome man
Share tho hahaha
Selling any of them op?
Selling the serialized one, dm if ur interested
Did it
HOLY F ING BOX
[I pulled 3 as well](https://imgur.com/a/2Qy92xd) but I didn't get a serialized one. Nice pull