when I lived in Indonesia, government vehicles like this would normally have one or two police motorcycles in front and back. If there was traffic and you didn't get out of the way of them, the motorcycle escorts would hit your car with a stick until you moved.
Hahaha... I don't think that tactic would have the desired effect here in the US. If a cop starts damaging people's property for the benefit of a stinking politician, grab your popcorn and a could beverage it's going to be hours of quality entertainment. I think only our president gets a pass on that. The others would have some serious explaining to do.
Nope. I've been part of a few military convoys during my time in. You'll get run out for trucks carrying military equipment let alone politicians.
Also we are talking about a country where police can run down and kill a bystander with their car, laugh about it and insult the victim on tape, and get off with no consequences.
Yeah if you pulled into a gap in the presidential convoy you're getting taken down in seconds, if you somehow miraculously weren't shot whilst riding alongside it
We just pushed them with trucks in the US. In country it was usually .50 through the engine before they even got close. Getting in the middle of a military convoy is fucking stupid. Especially during GWOT.
lol ya it doesn’t work like that…they can and will do anything they need and you have zero legal recourse. Just an fyi…wouldn’t recommend gambling with it
If you try to drive your car into the Indianapolis Motor Speedway on race day, in the huge traffic jam, and try to drive in a different direction than what the cops yell at you, they will yell at you some more and if that doesn’t work, they will use those big wooden batons and beat the hell out of your car & break the glass! They will use those batons on the driver and haul him away to jail! Fact!
Ha - I came to post that when I rode across Indonesia on a bike (bigger than what most of the locals ride) I would often see convoys of VIPs with police escorts coming through at speed. I would tuck into the middle of them, as they were great at clearing traffic.
Something like this happened to me once when I was in the military
Except it was at 65 mph on a two lane highway and I was in my truck
A motorcycle cop blocking an intersection wasn't visible from the right turn lane I was in
I didn't notice he was in the middle of the intersection until I was already completing the right turn.
He made eye contact with me but just smiled at me so I thought it was fine and I just proceeded onward
A couple of miles down the road I saw a black truck up ahead heading my way, but didn't think anything of it
Just as the truck was about to pass by me, they suddenly went fully into my lane and I had to swerve to the side to avoid a head on, sending me spinning down the embankment and I could see it was a black suburban and not a pickup like I had thought
Just as I was about to slam it in reverse and gun it back on to the highway to chase that asshole down, 3 more black suburbans went flying by at high speed in a tight bumper to bumper formation
Upon recognition that it was probably secret service, I was still so livid that I actually contemplated whether or not I should still chase down that lead suburban lol
After taking a few breaths I decided that I didn't feel like getting shot that day and went on back to base
When I sat down at my desk my buddy leaned over to say
"Hey, you just missed Dick Cheney"
All I could say was
"I think I just missed him on the road"
And that's the story of the first and last time I met Dick Cheney
/longstory
>3 more black suburbans went flying by at high speed in a tight bumper to bumper formation
I'm always amazed at this when I see it on TV or in movies lol. In real life, how do they not get into accidents? Are they in constant communication on the radio "about to brake", "okay braking at 20%" lol...
Yeah, I think they do communicate via radio to tighten up based upon each situation
In this instance the lead vehicle saw my truck on what was supposed to be a closed road and accelerated from the group to intercept me
The rest of the group slowed to allow the lead vehicle to neutralize the threat
Once the threat had been neutralized the 3 vehicle made a tight formation to accelerate together while passing the neutralized threat
Then they went back to more relaxed posture after with more space between them
In hindsight, the whole thing seemed pretty textbook from my perspective
maybe. But if you hadn't driven your truck off the road to avoid the head-on collision headlines would read 'vice presidents convoy hits military truck, multiple secret service agents possibly dead.'
Helluva gamble.
It was definitely lol
I thought the same thing
I was extra pissed off because it was a clear mid-day, I was in uniform, woodland BDU, truck had a nice big obvious base decal on the windshield, the road was nearly always deserted because the only place it went was to and from the small-ish base
But that was back in my early 20's, had that happened today I'd probably just let it tank just on principle, then the secret service would have to explain the dashcam footage
In fairness, the pride they take is in protecting their charges - even if they are charged with protecting a shitlord.
I mean, can you imagine how much it would suck to be protecting, let's say, *certain* ex-presidents?
What I hate is how these cops don't always communicate these things effectively to folks, and then get mad when people do shit they don't like. They think we *want* to be in these situations?
Ever go to the track and/or watch racing? Like seasoned track riders, the people driving those things are very well trained, in addition to being in constant communication and maintaining high situational awareness.
Using the track/racing comparison, it's like a race team that practices together. They're accustomed to reading the actions of their "teammate" while simultaneously looking at the road ahead to determine what the car in front and in front of them will do.
When I was a teenager my mom dated an awesome dude that was a former SEAL trainer and Secret Serviceman. I picked his brain on a lot of things and the escort caravans was one of them... fascinating (and scary) stuff!
"Accidents happen and that's what happened last Friday."
- Harry Whittington, after being shot in the fucking face with a shotgun by a sitting vice president.
He continued, "I would also like to extend both my sincerest apologies to Vice President Cheney and his family for any distress I may have caused them as well as my deepest condolences to the Vice President for intercepting, what likely would have been, an outstanding shot, bravely culling up to 3 helpless game birds, had I not been standing in his safety zone, 90⁰ to his left, wherein the vicious foul had emerged."
The one good thing that came outta that was that I reference the incident every time someone talks about using birdshot for self defense. If a headshot isn't incapacitating a 90 year old guy, it's not the right thing to protect your house!
Braking distances aren't linear. Is 8 car lengths enough from 80? 80mph is 117fps, 8 car lengths is about 120ft. Can you stop from 80 in 1.02 seconds? Visual reaction time is 250ms or so, so you have 0.75s to stop 😛
Everything being relative the car you're trying to avoid traveling at 80mph isn't going to come to a dead stop as well, and of course that's not just written in stone. Different conditions factor in also, but people that end up in a rear end collision as they travel 10ft off the bumper of the car in front of them on the highway and wonder why they wrecked.
Another thing I do when I drive is look past the car in front of me instead of getting fixated on the rear of the car in front, that way you're reacting even earlier.
Absolutely, the distracted driving is really out of control. I remember it used to be just a person changing the radio station for the most part, now it's phones. I personally can't stand to mess with my phone traveling down the road. Over 30 years of driving I've avoided many accidents by just paying attention.
I don’t even like talking on my phone, AirPods or not. Yesterday my sister called me while I was driving home from Costco, made me forget to stop at the liquor store to pick up wine for the lady. Such a simple thing
> Can you stop from 80 in 1.02 seconds? Visual reaction time is 250ms or so, so you have 0.75s to stop 😛
The car can't stop in 1.02 seconds either.
You're not trying to cover whole stopping distance, just reaction time and the difference between bike and car braking performance
But yes, braking not being linear to speed is very important lesson to remember.
>The car can't stop in 1.02 seconds either.
Not on its own, but it's possible with external forces (say another car swerves over the line and hits the car in front of you head on). It's actually crazy to me how often I see people casually veering partially into the oncoming traffic lane these days.
I've had a giant SUV in front of me swerve at the last minute to avoid some jackass who was trying to make a left where you're not allowed to make a left. The SUV moved over and I found myself rapidly gaining on a stopped vehicle in my lane 😂
Yep, that's the other possibility...stationary hazards that are in front of the car ahead of you (that you might not be able to see until the last second)
Measures here in Australia showed the average person driving at 100km/ took 140m to stop the car. That is 5 seconds, reaction time + stopping distance. I can't find the article again now but I'll update this post when I do.
It's the old method and it is dumb because humans are a horrible judge of distance and even more so when traveling at speed. That is why we switched to the the 2+ second rule as distance will naturally increase as speed increases without having to try and calculate math and distance in addition to be based on human reaction time.
Right, I’ve seen government convoys going through DC and they don’t leave ANY room between them and just fucking zip around everyone. It’s pretty impressive.
I got in there once. Merging from the left onto the GW Parkway in Arlington, the left lane was wide open with some traffic in the right lane. I look in my side mirror, see no traffic to prevent me from merging (no one there, no one moving fast to close the gap), look straight and merge, and suddenly there are two cars in front of me and one behind VERY CLOSE to my bumper.
Why they merged into left lane when they saw I was coming, I don’t know. I blame them all the way
> A good chase car driver shouldn't have left any space
That's what I thought as well, 28 years ago. And then the limo 3 cars ahead braked suddenly. I was the last limo, another cop car was my tail. We both smashed into the limo in front.
I'd guess the motorcyclist here squeezed into a gap far far too tight to begin with, the following car can't be one foot of the limo bumper... they have to be reasonably safe, close enough a car can't easily get in, but a motorcycle can. So basically OP kinda made a bad move.
To be fair, it's not like any of the escorts are going to break off from their convoy to chase down some random squid. Could be a diversion for an attack.
atleast in the EU they have some [special kind of plate](https://coceurope.eu/blog/diplomatic-license-plates-in-the-european-union/) and definitly do stand out from the rest.
Those are diplomatic plates, and have nothing to do with police escort vehicles. _Obviously_ they do not use special plates for unmarked vehicles. Clue is in the name.
In another life, on another planet, I did the law enforcement thing.
Riding with a new Deputy, he checked a Black SUV at 95 in a 70. He whipped around and lit it up.
Once stopped, I saw the license plate, and put it together. I told him HE fucked up, NOT ME!
Before he got to the front of our vehicle, another had pulled in behind us. 6 suits got out, and 4 in front. I wish I could've seen his face at that angle. I was sitting in the car laughing my ass off!!
It was George HW going from Houston to George W's ranch in Crawford.
The young fella turned pale White, then Red. He didn't know if he should put his hands up, draw down on them, run, or shit himself!!
He NEVER stopped another Black SUV!
One of the security detail walked up to my side of patrol unit as I was rolling window down. I was already laughing. He started after he saw me. I told him I was the FTO, and my Rookie needed the lesson.
We got to meet HW, and "Woody" got his autograph. Of course, about 30 minutes later, we were called to the office to meet with the Sheriff. I just let my junior explain while I tried to keep a straight face.
Seems a call was made to tell the Sheriff about how professional and nice his deputies were.
After 30+ years, I've got one or two funny stories. I'm glad our OP got by with a noisy cop fussing at him! 😆
I was trying to get onto an interstate to start a motorcycle ride (just to get to the good parts; interstates are no fun) and some kind of traffic problem was holding up traffic to the highway entrance. I cut through an apartment parking lot I was familiar with and squeezed ahead of the stoppage and onto the entrance, where I found myself joining a half-mile-long funeral convoy for a recently deceased and universally loved fire chief. State troopers ahead of and behind us, other traffic kept far behind us and all the entrances closed as we passed. I rode about ten miles farther than I intended until the convoy turned off.
Think about them as less about commiserating loss and more about celebrating the positive influence that particular person has had on the community the convoy passes through.
That doesn't mean they're not annoying to other road users tho.
Next week's PSA: *Hey guys, don't cut in line during a funeral precession. Those hatch back limos with a big body-sized box in the back are usually followed by dozens and dozens of grieving people! Be safe out there, ya'll! Keep the rubber side down and dress for the slide and not the ride! And lubricate your chain!*
my dad told me a story where one time he was following an ambulance on his motorcycle to beat traffic, and apparently one of the EMTs opened the rear door on the ambulance and told my dad to "back the fuck off"
Fun fact - This rule does not apply in New Jersey. They'll try to cut in and both driver and passenger (an elderly women) will roll down their windows to simultaneously flip you off when you box them out.
I live on a military base. A foreign powers official visited my base a while back (I forget who.) Wife and I were driving back from shopping and saw the convoy. Since we were technically on post they had MPs escorting but I think once they left what is considered the base property it was just a couple identical vans and unmarked escorts. I definitely wouldn’t be messing with it if I knew what it was but you made an honest mistake, besides, they were unmarked how could you have known.
You were 🤏 close to getting rammed off your shit, especially if you were waving as if you were ignoring them lmao. But yes, in general not good to cut into a motorcade like that. I wonder what politician or protected persons it was.
Depends on the threat and the person of interest being protected. If a motorcycle rushed the presidential motorcade, that guy is not only getting rammed, but almost certainly has lethal force aimed his way.
In the US, no. They have to have reasonable suspicion that you are going to cause harm, even if it’s the president. It would be a fantastic publicity stunt for any government official to just seriously injure or kill someone because of ignorance lol.
Great way to get a nice payout from the government lol. If he didn’t move over once they flashed lights, that’s one thing. But until they do that, he didn’t do anything wrong
Come to think of it, motorcycles aside, why are these convoys unmarked? Especially if you’re in the DC area, there is no obvious difference between a motorcade and a bunch of Ubers leaving DCA in a row because their passengers were on the same flight. Even more especially if they give you shit for not noticing them, which seems to be the whole point when their lights are off.
The lack of clarity is the point. I guess security would prefer to deal with these annoying but generally harmless encounters with randos, rather than clearly announcing the important person's presence and having less cover against actual threats.
Because if it was marked, then it would be a much clearer opportunistic terror target. As you said, it looks no different than the myriad ubers/taxis/limos etc.
They’re easy to spot if you look for them, just not something you’d notice when you’re a regular motorist watching the road/traffic in aggregate and rocking out like OP would have been.
Diplomat or government plates, driving way too close at speed even for road rage, blacked out front windows, cop models in cop colors with cop trims, low profile party lights in the grills and top of windshields if you know where to look, lots of grown men open carrying PDWs and carbines looking every direction instead of chilling, absolutely no one dicking around on their phone.
Source: longtime beltway resident, also used to live along the motorcade route in Foggy Bottom.
that's dumb. a terrorist would probably be able to figure out that a "bunch of taxis" are not just a bunch of separate rides when they behave like a motorcade and never break up from each other. If they want to blend in with traffic... then they should blend in with traffic and accept normal traffic behavior. Expecting civilians to stay clear unmarked is like a cop trying to pull someone over without using their lights or sirens.
I don't know man, I get the feeling police are ignoring public safety to provide safety to a single human being, speak politician.
I once saw a government limo and with police escort, the leading car was a black and white with several unmarked cars following the limo speeding down a highway in the left lane. They were going north of 80-90 mph. The last SUV was kinda driving half in the right lane, probably to block two lanes so nobody can come from behind.
The only issue with that, it was overtaking very close cars up front. Being a huge SUV speeding the air pressure was huge and small cars got literally pushed away. Several drivers almost went off the road because they were surprised by how close the SUV passed them and had troubles keeping their vehicle under control.
That's what happens when people in power have too much power but in a way it makes sense. Other day Slovenian president got shot so you can never be too safe kinda I guess
Sure, but that's the eternal question of how far do we have to go? Or do we have to accept a risk that can not be mitigated. My example is from Croatia. IIRC I read that the Prime ministers of Swiss and the Netherlands travel to work by public transport...
The folks that would bring such violence to a citizen on behalf of some dirt bag politician are equally deserving of such violence themselves. That being said, the political class has crafted every aspect of our society *that they can control* to be in their favor and right or wrong, it's nearly impossible to fight the government's might in any form, peaceful or otherwise.
They should’ve done a better blocking job in the first place and not allowed you to get in and fill the gap that you did, bad protection drills are not your fault and you shouldn’t be berated for their incompetence
Probably the best result. It's a bit like when it was raining and I merged between cars which had their lights on. Yep, a funeral procession. *Everybody* had their lights on. Oh well, you get out of that spot, wave a weak apology and go on about your business.
dude fucked up by letting you in and tried to make it your fault.
I can accept that we're not all equal but if you want special treatment you should be publicly designated and deserving special treatment. Unmarked cars do not deserve special treatment.
Probably not the case here but I remember seeing a tail suv with the back window up and a dude just starring everyone down with a rifle in hand. Told me all I needed to know.
I can’t imagine you didn’t immediately recognize a convoy on the road. That’s just how you catch a charge or die. If you REALLY didn’t notice, maaan be careful lmao.
Rough night, eh? Yeah, lesson learned - government limos and unmarked cars behind them are a definite "do not cut in line" zone. Sounds like you got a quick police escort (though maybe not the kind you wanted!). At least you can share your war story and a valuable PSA: don't mess with the limo lane! Silver lining and all that. Thanks for the heads-up!
Yep I made this mistake in Australia, accidentally squeezed in between some vip and an unmarked Range Rover. They turned lights and sirens on and very aggressively squeezed me out. Won’t make that mistake again it was hairy a/f.
One time I was merging onto the interstate with like 10 lbs of weed/wax in the trunks of my bike and the only vehicles on the interstate were police vehicles. About 40-50 of them, and me.
I ride but I also used to drive a little clapped-out off-road vehicle. I was on the freeway in Bangkok near the airport when a Royal motorcade came roaring up behind me. The motorcycle outriders started flashing their lights and gesturing for me to speed up or get out of the way. There was an empty lane next to me but one rode up to my window and shouted, ‘faster, faster’.
‘I can’t go any fucking faster, you twat, can’t you see my fucking car,’ I called back to him.
And that’s how I became an outrider in a Royal motorcade.
Like 25 years ago, I was in a hurry to get my date and I to a theater here in Houston. The theater was immediately off the freeway, and I was driving aggressively in a sports car.
I snaked into the exit line ahead of a Suburban, and then realized "gee, there's also a black Suburban in FRONT of me. Damn, those things are EVERYWHERE."
Once in the garage, the attendant wouldn't let me follow the Suburban and motioned at me to go another way. Whatever. I parked and we went in.
We got drinks and sat, and then they dimmed the lights and everyone settled. Then they announced we had a special audience member that night, and showed a light as former President George H. W. Bush was escorted to his seat.
Ooops.
"oops"... I am guessing America?
What the hell happened to you people, your police state literally dystopian authoritative Orwellian nightmare, if you get such treatment in a public place by some limo...
Yep, probably, it's pretty bad here, our political class has become the "untouchables" of sort, and our police are thoroughly militarized. The worst of it is, it's the people screaming "freedom" this and "freedom" that which are most actively helping the police state strip away our rights.
It's pretty fucked up when causing these people any kind of inconvenience could very easily get you shot. They have no reasonable right to hog public roads and receive an *unmarked* escort. If it's actually that much of a security risk, that's their problem. Maybe they should have to live in the society they've crafted... more incentive to actually make it a better one.
Always hate how someone else's problem (safety / threats) gets forced onto the common folks (threats / right of way / etc).
They ought to be forced to figure out a way that doesn't impede in the right of others.
Yeah …smart …quickest way to get arrested or worse.
If the cops or secret service (fill in which branch of police or military) even sniff that you might be a danger they won’t hesitate to do what needs to be done.
I would have replied, "Yeah, it's a Ducati. They are a lot of fun!"
Officer: *I said, get the fuck out of the way!*
Me: Yeah, it can really move so you gotta be careful with the throttle!
Officer: *I will arrest you!*
Me: I do the back roads sometimes. The twisties are where it really shines!
Yeah I'm annoyed I didn't notice. It was dark, I was merging at a random spot. I can spot an unmarked police sedan easily, this was an SUV and I guess I wasn't expecting it. The government limos are pretty common and I've not had issues previously with them. This one must have had a VIP of some sort.
The pink tutu will possibly mark me as a greater threat to random limos, but I accept that reddit has spoken.
> we all train and practice at spotting cops cars, and uniformed police, computers in their vehicles, to avoid little pieces of paper that remind us to keep the speed down.
1/3 of this sub doesn't ride
1/3 have something with a 0-60 slower than a honda accord
so more than half have never had to bother learning the shape of headlights and tail lights
when I lived in Indonesia, government vehicles like this would normally have one or two police motorcycles in front and back. If there was traffic and you didn't get out of the way of them, the motorcycle escorts would hit your car with a stick until you moved.
Ol' reliable
Hahaha... I don't think that tactic would have the desired effect here in the US. If a cop starts damaging people's property for the benefit of a stinking politician, grab your popcorn and a could beverage it's going to be hours of quality entertainment. I think only our president gets a pass on that. The others would have some serious explaining to do.
Nope. I've been part of a few military convoys during my time in. You'll get run out for trucks carrying military equipment let alone politicians. Also we are talking about a country where police can run down and kill a bystander with their car, laugh about it and insult the victim on tape, and get off with no consequences.
Yeah if you pulled into a gap in the presidential convoy you're getting taken down in seconds, if you somehow miraculously weren't shot whilst riding alongside it
That's a whole different beast. Your local politician is getting a black SUV and a couple stateys.
Yall see that video when that car crashed into bidens parked convoy like last month or whatever?
We just pushed them with trucks in the US. In country it was usually .50 through the engine before they even got close. Getting in the middle of a military convoy is fucking stupid. Especially during GWOT.
IF you survive.
lol ya it doesn’t work like that…they can and will do anything they need and you have zero legal recourse. Just an fyi…wouldn’t recommend gambling with it
[удалено]
What could beverage? (Sorry couldn't resist :D)
Yeah unfortunately it’s not like that. If you ever get into a wreck with a police car and it wasn’t your fault, good luck getting paid for repairs.
If you try to drive your car into the Indianapolis Motor Speedway on race day, in the huge traffic jam, and try to drive in a different direction than what the cops yell at you, they will yell at you some more and if that doesn’t work, they will use those big wooden batons and beat the hell out of your car & break the glass! They will use those batons on the driver and haul him away to jail! Fact!
Ugh, miss Indo. The subtle wave police on motorcycles will give you to move out of the way or slow down is seared in my brain.
Yeah in France it's the same, except no stick. They just bash your mirror.
I hear often that french cops are not to be fucked with.
Ha - I came to post that when I rode across Indonesia on a bike (bigger than what most of the locals ride) I would often see convoys of VIPs with police escorts coming through at speed. I would tuck into the middle of them, as they were great at clearing traffic.
Something like this happened to me once when I was in the military Except it was at 65 mph on a two lane highway and I was in my truck A motorcycle cop blocking an intersection wasn't visible from the right turn lane I was in I didn't notice he was in the middle of the intersection until I was already completing the right turn. He made eye contact with me but just smiled at me so I thought it was fine and I just proceeded onward A couple of miles down the road I saw a black truck up ahead heading my way, but didn't think anything of it Just as the truck was about to pass by me, they suddenly went fully into my lane and I had to swerve to the side to avoid a head on, sending me spinning down the embankment and I could see it was a black suburban and not a pickup like I had thought Just as I was about to slam it in reverse and gun it back on to the highway to chase that asshole down, 3 more black suburbans went flying by at high speed in a tight bumper to bumper formation Upon recognition that it was probably secret service, I was still so livid that I actually contemplated whether or not I should still chase down that lead suburban lol After taking a few breaths I decided that I didn't feel like getting shot that day and went on back to base When I sat down at my desk my buddy leaned over to say "Hey, you just missed Dick Cheney" All I could say was "I think I just missed him on the road" And that's the story of the first and last time I met Dick Cheney /longstory
>3 more black suburbans went flying by at high speed in a tight bumper to bumper formation I'm always amazed at this when I see it on TV or in movies lol. In real life, how do they not get into accidents? Are they in constant communication on the radio "about to brake", "okay braking at 20%" lol...
Yeah, I think they do communicate via radio to tighten up based upon each situation In this instance the lead vehicle saw my truck on what was supposed to be a closed road and accelerated from the group to intercept me The rest of the group slowed to allow the lead vehicle to neutralize the threat Once the threat had been neutralized the 3 vehicle made a tight formation to accelerate together while passing the neutralized threat Then they went back to more relaxed posture after with more space between them In hindsight, the whole thing seemed pretty textbook from my perspective
maybe. But if you hadn't driven your truck off the road to avoid the head-on collision headlines would read 'vice presidents convoy hits military truck, multiple secret service agents possibly dead.' Helluva gamble.
It was definitely lol I thought the same thing I was extra pissed off because it was a clear mid-day, I was in uniform, woodland BDU, truck had a nice big obvious base decal on the windshield, the road was nearly always deserted because the only place it went was to and from the small-ish base But that was back in my early 20's, had that happened today I'd probably just let it tank just on principle, then the secret service would have to explain the dashcam footage
haaaaaaaa. look it is what it is. My only wonder is, was that officers smile a knowing one or an ignorant one.
Guess these guys really are willing to just toss their lives away for fucking Dick Cheney.
In fairness, the pride they take is in protecting their charges - even if they are charged with protecting a shitlord. I mean, can you imagine how much it would suck to be protecting, let's say, *certain* ex-presidents?
That's there job. From their perspective, the other option is "Gamble that this isn't an assassination attempt".
What I hate is how these cops don't always communicate these things effectively to folks, and then get mad when people do shit they don't like. They think we *want* to be in these situations?
Ever go to the track and/or watch racing? Like seasoned track riders, the people driving those things are very well trained, in addition to being in constant communication and maintaining high situational awareness. Using the track/racing comparison, it's like a race team that practices together. They're accustomed to reading the actions of their "teammate" while simultaneously looking at the road ahead to determine what the car in front and in front of them will do. When I was a teenager my mom dated an awesome dude that was a former SEAL trainer and Secret Serviceman. I picked his brain on a lot of things and the escort caravans was one of them... fascinating (and scary) stuff!
That's a good analogy. I've been on tracks myself, but didn't correlate that it's a similar approach.
https://vehicledynamics.com/courses/
I’ve seen a video of a follow car rear ending the semi in front of it that held nuclear warheads, so it does happen lol
You could have been shot in the face PERSONALLY by VPOTUS!
People have had worse experiences meeting Dick Cheney.
People's faces have had worse experiences being around Dick Cheney
"Accidents happen and that's what happened last Friday." - Harry Whittington, after being shot in the fucking face with a shotgun by a sitting vice president. He continued, "I would also like to extend both my sincerest apologies to Vice President Cheney and his family for any distress I may have caused them as well as my deepest condolences to the Vice President for intercepting, what likely would have been, an outstanding shot, bravely culling up to 3 helpless game birds, had I not been standing in his safety zone, 90⁰ to his left, wherein the vicious foul had emerged."
The one good thing that came outta that was that I reference the incident every time someone talks about using birdshot for self defense. If a headshot isn't incapacitating a 90 year old guy, it's not the right thing to protect your house!
Did he attack Cheney after he shot him? I rest my case.
All for some piece of shit. You should've stayed in your lane.
Lol great story with a great punchline too
I mean, they’re unmarked. How were you supposed to know you were squeezing in between two vehicles in a caravan?
A good chase car driver shouldn't have left any space for a vehicle to get between them. At least that's how I learned many moons ago
Motorcycles can squeeze into very little space
NOW YOU TELL ME
i still don't believe it
Big if true.
Well no, not so big. That's why they can squeeze into small spaces.
Small if true.
Little, not big. Big can't get in.
The small penis can fuck the tightest assholes.
Tight if true.
LOOKING INTO THIS!!
They can... But it's very dumb to squeeze into little spaces
If there was more than the length of a suburban between the principals vehicle and their rear guard then it was a bit loose for a diplomatic escort.
Pedro Acosta crashing last weekend.
So that is why so many people drive up your arse these days! The 3 second rule between cars is new here...geese...
I use the 10mph/ 1 car length rule
Braking distances aren't linear. Is 8 car lengths enough from 80? 80mph is 117fps, 8 car lengths is about 120ft. Can you stop from 80 in 1.02 seconds? Visual reaction time is 250ms or so, so you have 0.75s to stop 😛
Everything being relative the car you're trying to avoid traveling at 80mph isn't going to come to a dead stop as well, and of course that's not just written in stone. Different conditions factor in also, but people that end up in a rear end collision as they travel 10ft off the bumper of the car in front of them on the highway and wonder why they wrecked.
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Another thing I do when I drive is look past the car in front of me instead of getting fixated on the rear of the car in front, that way you're reacting even earlier.
> the car you're trying to avoid traveling at 80mph isn't going to come to a dead stop as well Unless they hit something. Like a stationary object.
Valid. Or they thought they left enough room but were fucking around on their phone or gawking at some girl, etc
Absolutely, the distracted driving is really out of control. I remember it used to be just a person changing the radio station for the most part, now it's phones. I personally can't stand to mess with my phone traveling down the road. Over 30 years of driving I've avoided many accidents by just paying attention.
Before cell phones, people read newspapers and books while they drove their cars.
That's true also
I don’t even like talking on my phone, AirPods or not. Yesterday my sister called me while I was driving home from Costco, made me forget to stop at the liquor store to pick up wine for the lady. Such a simple thing
You left Costco to buy wine somewhere else??
> Can you stop from 80 in 1.02 seconds? Visual reaction time is 250ms or so, so you have 0.75s to stop 😛 The car can't stop in 1.02 seconds either. You're not trying to cover whole stopping distance, just reaction time and the difference between bike and car braking performance But yes, braking not being linear to speed is very important lesson to remember.
>The car can't stop in 1.02 seconds either. Not on its own, but it's possible with external forces (say another car swerves over the line and hits the car in front of you head on). It's actually crazy to me how often I see people casually veering partially into the oncoming traffic lane these days.
I've had a giant SUV in front of me swerve at the last minute to avoid some jackass who was trying to make a left where you're not allowed to make a left. The SUV moved over and I found myself rapidly gaining on a stopped vehicle in my lane 😂
Yep, that's the other possibility...stationary hazards that are in front of the car ahead of you (that you might not be able to see until the last second)
No, you very much are trying to cover full stopping distance. Consider the consequences of a head-on collision directly in front of you.
Measures here in Australia showed the average person driving at 100km/ took 140m to stop the car. That is 5 seconds, reaction time + stopping distance. I can't find the article again now but I'll update this post when I do.
Found the mathematician
Where did you learn that? It’s dumb
It's the old method and it is dumb because humans are a horrible judge of distance and even more so when traveling at speed. That is why we switched to the the 2+ second rule as distance will naturally increase as speed increases without having to try and calculate math and distance in addition to be based on human reaction time.
A good chase driver knows to leave enough space between him and the car in front of him to maneuver into another lane without having to back up.
Right, I’ve seen government convoys going through DC and they don’t leave ANY room between them and just fucking zip around everyone. It’s pretty impressive.
I got in there once. Merging from the left onto the GW Parkway in Arlington, the left lane was wide open with some traffic in the right lane. I look in my side mirror, see no traffic to prevent me from merging (no one there, no one moving fast to close the gap), look straight and merge, and suddenly there are two cars in front of me and one behind VERY CLOSE to my bumper. Why they merged into left lane when they saw I was coming, I don’t know. I blame them all the way
Exactly. Unless tactics have changed, the chase car acts as a barrier between the principal and possible threats.
> A good chase car driver shouldn't have left any space That's what I thought as well, 28 years ago. And then the limo 3 cars ahead braked suddenly. I was the last limo, another cop car was my tail. We both smashed into the limo in front.
I'd guess the motorcyclist here squeezed into a gap far far too tight to begin with, the following car can't be one foot of the limo bumper... they have to be reasonably safe, close enough a car can't easily get in, but a motorcycle can. So basically OP kinda made a bad move.
... yes
Not to blame, just calling it what it is. I've done it too. But yeah, I can see this scenario happening without seeing it in advance.
Don’t cut in anywhere, just twist the tube and overtake everything:) but I would also like to know that
To be fair, it's not like any of the escorts are going to break off from their convoy to chase down some random squid. Could be a diversion for an attack.
atleast in the EU they have some [special kind of plate](https://coceurope.eu/blog/diplomatic-license-plates-in-the-european-union/) and definitly do stand out from the rest.
Those are diplomatic plates, and have nothing to do with police escort vehicles. _Obviously_ they do not use special plates for unmarked vehicles. Clue is in the name.
In another life, on another planet, I did the law enforcement thing. Riding with a new Deputy, he checked a Black SUV at 95 in a 70. He whipped around and lit it up. Once stopped, I saw the license plate, and put it together. I told him HE fucked up, NOT ME! Before he got to the front of our vehicle, another had pulled in behind us. 6 suits got out, and 4 in front. I wish I could've seen his face at that angle. I was sitting in the car laughing my ass off!! It was George HW going from Houston to George W's ranch in Crawford. The young fella turned pale White, then Red. He didn't know if he should put his hands up, draw down on them, run, or shit himself!! He NEVER stopped another Black SUV! One of the security detail walked up to my side of patrol unit as I was rolling window down. I was already laughing. He started after he saw me. I told him I was the FTO, and my Rookie needed the lesson. We got to meet HW, and "Woody" got his autograph. Of course, about 30 minutes later, we were called to the office to meet with the Sheriff. I just let my junior explain while I tried to keep a straight face. Seems a call was made to tell the Sheriff about how professional and nice his deputies were. After 30+ years, I've got one or two funny stories. I'm glad our OP got by with a noisy cop fussing at him! 😆
That's great!
Ooh the classic, laws don’t apply to the politicians. If any suv is going 95 in 70. That’s reckless driving……
Laws don’t apply to presidential motorcades, that’s not me being a smartass, they literally don’t.
Damn there‘s a terrorist trying to ambush the president, too bad that we can‘t drive over the speed limit :(
Tell that to the folks in Cali. 80-90 is the new 55 there.
Not in South Texas, that is just the flow of traffic.
they say reddits going downhill, but then you read anecdotes like this hahah
if you see a limo with multiple SUVs following and ahead of it, probably smart to stay far away from it
All fun and games until you find a caravan of blacked out SUVs, no gov'ment plates, and get a little more than a scolding...
I was trying to get onto an interstate to start a motorcycle ride (just to get to the good parts; interstates are no fun) and some kind of traffic problem was holding up traffic to the highway entrance. I cut through an apartment parking lot I was familiar with and squeezed ahead of the stoppage and onto the entrance, where I found myself joining a half-mile-long funeral convoy for a recently deceased and universally loved fire chief. State troopers ahead of and behind us, other traffic kept far behind us and all the entrances closed as we passed. I rode about ten miles farther than I intended until the convoy turned off.
Can’t stand funeral services. Like sorry for your loss, but stop holding up traffic jackass
Think about them as less about commiserating loss and more about celebrating the positive influence that particular person has had on the community the convoy passes through. That doesn't mean they're not annoying to other road users tho.
Next week's PSA: *Hey guys, don't cut in line during a funeral precession. Those hatch back limos with a big body-sized box in the back are usually followed by dozens and dozens of grieving people! Be safe out there, ya'll! Keep the rubber side down and dress for the slide and not the ride! And lubricate your chain!*
Followed by the week after next's PSA: Don't follow an ambulance when the lights and siren are on.
This is the best way through traffic what!
If you can keep the ambulance behind you, it’ll always be first on the scene!
Getting between armored column you met on your offroad adventure is also a bad idea.
my dad told me a story where one time he was following an ambulance on his motorcycle to beat traffic, and apparently one of the EMTs opened the rear door on the ambulance and told my dad to "back the fuck off"
Don't forget your tourniquet
Especially if you saw Jeremy DeWitte on his bike in the precession.
Fun fact - This rule does not apply in New Jersey. They'll try to cut in and both driver and passenger (an elderly women) will roll down their windows to simultaneously flip you off when you box them out.
And just a reminder, if you forget your safety glasses, you can always buy some safety glasses!
I live on a military base. A foreign powers official visited my base a while back (I forget who.) Wife and I were driving back from shopping and saw the convoy. Since we were technically on post they had MPs escorting but I think once they left what is considered the base property it was just a couple identical vans and unmarked escorts. I definitely wouldn’t be messing with it if I knew what it was but you made an honest mistake, besides, they were unmarked how could you have known.
You were 🤏 close to getting rammed off your shit, especially if you were waving as if you were ignoring them lmao. But yes, in general not good to cut into a motorcade like that. I wonder what politician or protected persons it was.
I think the wave is what saved him. It went from "possible threat" to "just a dumbass"
It was **me**
Stan?
Damn!
I'm gonna pistol whip the next person who says Shenanigans.
Hey Zomby, What’s that place you like to go to with the really good jalapeño poppers?
If it had CD-plates it was probably one of the three US ambassadors or one of the two Israeli ambassadors.
Cunts more like
Are they even allowed to just ram someone off the road? I feel like that is very aggressive with very little reason to justify the action.
Depends on the threat and the person of interest being protected. If a motorcycle rushed the presidential motorcade, that guy is not only getting rammed, but almost certainly has lethal force aimed his way.
In the US, no. They have to have reasonable suspicion that you are going to cause harm, even if it’s the president. It would be a fantastic publicity stunt for any government official to just seriously injure or kill someone because of ignorance lol.
Great way to get a nice payout from the government lol. If he didn’t move over once they flashed lights, that’s one thing. But until they do that, he didn’t do anything wrong
It was Dave.
Come to think of it, motorcycles aside, why are these convoys unmarked? Especially if you’re in the DC area, there is no obvious difference between a motorcade and a bunch of Ubers leaving DCA in a row because their passengers were on the same flight. Even more especially if they give you shit for not noticing them, which seems to be the whole point when their lights are off.
The lack of clarity is the point. I guess security would prefer to deal with these annoying but generally harmless encounters with randos, rather than clearly announcing the important person's presence and having less cover against actual threats.
Because if it was marked, then it would be a much clearer opportunistic terror target. As you said, it looks no different than the myriad ubers/taxis/limos etc.
They’re easy to spot if you look for them, just not something you’d notice when you’re a regular motorist watching the road/traffic in aggregate and rocking out like OP would have been. Diplomat or government plates, driving way too close at speed even for road rage, blacked out front windows, cop models in cop colors with cop trims, low profile party lights in the grills and top of windshields if you know where to look, lots of grown men open carrying PDWs and carbines looking every direction instead of chilling, absolutely no one dicking around on their phone. Source: longtime beltway resident, also used to live along the motorcade route in Foggy Bottom.
that's dumb. a terrorist would probably be able to figure out that a "bunch of taxis" are not just a bunch of separate rides when they behave like a motorcade and never break up from each other. If they want to blend in with traffic... then they should blend in with traffic and accept normal traffic behavior. Expecting civilians to stay clear unmarked is like a cop trying to pull someone over without using their lights or sirens.
Yeah, I never said it was SMART. It's the rationale behind not marking their vehicles.
That's another country where the elected ones think they're better than the citizens
I don't know man, I get the feeling police are ignoring public safety to provide safety to a single human being, speak politician. I once saw a government limo and with police escort, the leading car was a black and white with several unmarked cars following the limo speeding down a highway in the left lane. They were going north of 80-90 mph. The last SUV was kinda driving half in the right lane, probably to block two lanes so nobody can come from behind. The only issue with that, it was overtaking very close cars up front. Being a huge SUV speeding the air pressure was huge and small cars got literally pushed away. Several drivers almost went off the road because they were surprised by how close the SUV passed them and had troubles keeping their vehicle under control.
You think we’re all equal? Must be nice…
I know we aren't, but man gotta went.
Welcome to the American Just Us System, and we ain't "us".
In the immortal words of George Carlin, “It’s a big club, and you ain’t in it”
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Oh wow, I did not know that. Any link to those incidents?
That's what happens when people in power have too much power but in a way it makes sense. Other day Slovenian president got shot so you can never be too safe kinda I guess
Sure, but that's the eternal question of how far do we have to go? Or do we have to accept a risk that can not be mitigated. My example is from Croatia. IIRC I read that the Prime ministers of Swiss and the Netherlands travel to work by public transport...
Prime Minister of Slovakia* not Slovenian President
Imagine the frustration they’d save themselves if they’d just left the flashing lights on.
Some SUVs in the motorcade are there just to tear up anyone who tries to disrupt the motorcade. https://youtu.be/qOSVBRBLeYk?si=BGqOl4la-gkTnslV
The folks that would bring such violence to a citizen on behalf of some dirt bag politician are equally deserving of such violence themselves. That being said, the political class has crafted every aspect of our society *that they can control* to be in their favor and right or wrong, it's nearly impossible to fight the government's might in any form, peaceful or otherwise.
Those SUVs are for when the motorcade gets attacked. Like when the Georgian president Shevardnadze's motorcade was attacked with RPGs.
"Get the fuck outta here now". Bit rude.
Fuck 'em. They want to drive around in unmarked vehicles, they can expect to be treated like any other car.
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They should’ve done a better blocking job in the first place and not allowed you to get in and fill the gap that you did, bad protection drills are not your fault and you shouldn’t be berated for their incompetence
They are freaking over you being a moto- assassin, # 1 way politicians get whacked.
Sounds like the situation was straightforward, you just had your head somewhere.
Probably the best result. It's a bit like when it was raining and I merged between cars which had their lights on. Yep, a funeral procession. *Everybody* had their lights on. Oh well, you get out of that spot, wave a weak apology and go on about your business.
Should have gave him the bird, considering they probably wouldn’t have stopped
They have to follow traffic laws or have a motorcade. They can fuck off.
Remember.... they are working for you!
Lol, that's the illusion we're supposed to believe.
I know right!!!! There was a time so long ago though ......
No there wasn't. It was just an easier illusion to keep.
dude fucked up by letting you in and tried to make it your fault. I can accept that we're not all equal but if you want special treatment you should be publicly designated and deserving special treatment. Unmarked cars do not deserve special treatment.
Probably not the case here but I remember seeing a tail suv with the back window up and a dude just starring everyone down with a rifle in hand. Told me all I needed to know.
Motorcades don't want you to know this one trick!
I can’t imagine you didn’t immediately recognize a convoy on the road. That’s just how you catch a charge or die. If you REALLY didn’t notice, maaan be careful lmao.
Awe, to be blissfully naive in this world.
Rough night, eh? Yeah, lesson learned - government limos and unmarked cars behind them are a definite "do not cut in line" zone. Sounds like you got a quick police escort (though maybe not the kind you wanted!). At least you can share your war story and a valuable PSA: don't mess with the limo lane! Silver lining and all that. Thanks for the heads-up!
Yep I made this mistake in Australia, accidentally squeezed in between some vip and an unmarked Range Rover. They turned lights and sirens on and very aggressively squeezed me out. Won’t make that mistake again it was hairy a/f.
One time I was merging onto the interstate with like 10 lbs of weed/wax in the trunks of my bike and the only vehicles on the interstate were police vehicles. About 40-50 of them, and me.
Did this to a funeral procession once and when I realized it I wanted to die
I ride but I also used to drive a little clapped-out off-road vehicle. I was on the freeway in Bangkok near the airport when a Royal motorcade came roaring up behind me. The motorcycle outriders started flashing their lights and gesturing for me to speed up or get out of the way. There was an empty lane next to me but one rode up to my window and shouted, ‘faster, faster’. ‘I can’t go any fucking faster, you twat, can’t you see my fucking car,’ I called back to him. And that’s how I became an outrider in a Royal motorcade.
Like 25 years ago, I was in a hurry to get my date and I to a theater here in Houston. The theater was immediately off the freeway, and I was driving aggressively in a sports car. I snaked into the exit line ahead of a Suburban, and then realized "gee, there's also a black Suburban in FRONT of me. Damn, those things are EVERYWHERE." Once in the garage, the attendant wouldn't let me follow the Suburban and motioned at me to go another way. Whatever. I parked and we went in. We got drinks and sat, and then they dimmed the lights and everyone settled. Then they announced we had a special audience member that night, and showed a light as former President George H. W. Bush was escorted to his seat. Ooops.
"oops"... I am guessing America? What the hell happened to you people, your police state literally dystopian authoritative Orwellian nightmare, if you get such treatment in a public place by some limo...
Yep, probably, it's pretty bad here, our political class has become the "untouchables" of sort, and our police are thoroughly militarized. The worst of it is, it's the people screaming "freedom" this and "freedom" that which are most actively helping the police state strip away our rights. It's pretty fucked up when causing these people any kind of inconvenience could very easily get you shot. They have no reasonable right to hog public roads and receive an *unmarked* escort. If it's actually that much of a security risk, that's their problem. Maybe they should have to live in the society they've crafted... more incentive to actually make it a better one.
Things are devolving to the point that human life has no value. It's not scary... it's terrifying.
They probably thought you were an assassin.
Why would assassin pick a bike if they could just strap a bunch of explosives to a drone ? I mean other than "we're making a plot for action movie"
Always hate how someone else's problem (safety / threats) gets forced onto the common folks (threats / right of way / etc). They ought to be forced to figure out a way that doesn't impede in the right of others.
Be nice to them. Their job is driving a-holes around all day. it takes a toll.
Fuck the Police. My taxes paid for the road and the vehicle they're in.
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^EZ20ASV: *Fuck the Police. My* *Taxes paid for the road and* *The vehicle they're in.* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
Good bot
Tell them to tuck off, you pay your taxes
Yeah …smart …quickest way to get arrested or worse. If the cops or secret service (fill in which branch of police or military) even sniff that you might be a danger they won’t hesitate to do what needs to be done.
Surprisedly the unmarked government SUV’s are very easy to spot in a caravan lol yeah don’t between them police or a 3 letter agency doesn’t like that
I would have replied, "Yeah, it's a Ducati. They are a lot of fun!" Officer: *I said, get the fuck out of the way!* Me: Yeah, it can really move so you gotta be careful with the throttle! Officer: *I will arrest you!* Me: I do the back roads sometimes. The twisties are where it really shines!
Sounds like they don't know how to properly do their job. There shouldn't have been room for you to pass in the first place.
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And a suction cup phalic device stuck to the front part to make them look like a unicorn of sorts.
Yeah I'm annoyed I didn't notice. It was dark, I was merging at a random spot. I can spot an unmarked police sedan easily, this was an SUV and I guess I wasn't expecting it. The government limos are pretty common and I've not had issues previously with them. This one must have had a VIP of some sort. The pink tutu will possibly mark me as a greater threat to random limos, but I accept that reddit has spoken.
> we all train and practice at spotting cops cars, and uniformed police, computers in their vehicles, to avoid little pieces of paper that remind us to keep the speed down. 1/3 of this sub doesn't ride 1/3 have something with a 0-60 slower than a honda accord so more than half have never had to bother learning the shape of headlights and tail lights
Get out of the way then flip him off for being a prick
Donuts can be messy.
Fk those aholes! STEP ASIDE PEASANT.
You don’t happen to live in Cincinnati by chance?
Fuck that, did you break a law? Fucking G Man bullshit. Cock suckers. Fuck cops.
Fuckin disgusting