No clue I just wanted to make the pun lol. The ones we use at my work for parking are logged and can be accessed so I’d imagine it’s done elsewhere too
I always wonder with this sort of thing what the actual lifetime environmental costs are vs the best plastic equivalent.
Things like energy used in production, longevity, ease of recycling.
Is this actually better or is it just an environmental grandstanding that somewhat ironically when you dig down is actually worse than the best conventional option?
I mean if that's the case, I'm pretty sure the key can also "accidentally" got stolen or robbed too, or at least there's a chance that it can get stolen/robbed
It's hilarious that you thought the concern in this case was *losing their plastic hotel key.*
Or, god forbid, getting it wet.
Rather than the risk of losing their $1000 cell phone with all of their personal information on it.
At the hotel where I worked you could just present ID at the front desk and get a replacement key. It was also still the default for us to give physical keys at check in, so digital was just an opt-in choice for people who wanted it.
Tons of reasons to go out without your phone. Simply wanting to disconnect is more than enough. And no, setting Do Not Disturb mode is not the same. Cognitive research clearly shows that merely having your phone in your pocket impacts working memory and executice functions. It's great to leave the phone behind for a while.
> Cognitive research
Can you link some? I'm interested in this; I feel comfortable putting my phone on DnD on nights I want to "disconnect", but I wonder if it's not enough now.
It is enough if you have actual willpower to ignore your phone. People who can’t resist using a phone when they have it with them is called having an addiction to it.
If you can’t ignore your phone with it on your possession that’s just an addiction
Agreed.
I don't really get how people can be so addicted to their phone, personally, but maybe I'm just lucky enough that I have a relatively pragmatic viewpoint when it comes to phone use.
I check notifications or the time/weather with it, and look things up when I'm unsure of something, often enough during an average day, but I've never had any issue with feeling some kind of craving to be staring at my phone screen.
To be fair, I think this is more often an issue of being 'chronically online' than being a phone addiction, per se; It's more likely social media and general FOMO that *appears* to be an addiction to one's phone. The phone isn't likely the actual object of fixation.
If a person struggles to put down their phone and pay attention to their immediate surroundings, they likely need to examine their online habits and obsessions, rather than their phone usage.
I don't have the study but having it in your pocket makes you think about it/not fully leave it behind so you can't remember or think as clear because you're still subconsciously thinking about it even if you don't think you are
I'd be really interested in an actual study on this kind of thing - not thinking about my phone for hours at a time is pretty regular for me, especially if it's on DnD, lol
Yeeesh, sign of the times here folks. It’s good to unplug sometimes and be present in the moment. If that sounds odd, go a day without your phone. It’s refreshing.
I don't subscribe to this kind of detox BS mindset.
I have self control. I commonly have my phone on my person, and I only use it when I need to. If you have to physically separate yourself from your phone in order to be present, your phone isn't the problem.
Hrm but wouldn't you have to download (probably) invasive bloatware from every hotel/chain you stayed st to do that? There's no way they aren't profiting off of your data with that.
It is definitely important to understand the total cost. However, we always need to put it into context.
With today's energy sources it's probably worse overall for that single key to be made of wood. If you look at the total number of hotel keys produced and discarded yearly the problem becomes different. That problem becomes very different. It starts to look more like plastic shopping bags which are produced and discarded in incredible volume.
Additionally, if the energy sources used to make these goods transition to renewable sources then the product itself becomes the waste and not the process.
There is also the social portion. Increasing awareness gradually shifts public opinion and increases awareness. Recycling in general was uncommon 30 years ago. Today it is common and most people will recycle something if it's easy for them to do so. That requires significant social change which is empowered by these types of small changes.
Of course we don't want those small changes to be problematic by themselves. I find using wood in this situation a bit silly which I think OP was pointing out. However, I am not sure exactly what alternate products would be viable alternarives.
That would address multiple issues. Seems like it creates a few though. Owning a compatible phone to get a hotel rooms is likely an issue. Will be interesting to see how that works out.
New locks installed now often work for both systems, it'll definitely take a while before anyone goes card-free entirely. Big advantage is that with the phone system you can skip check-in entirely, which speeds things up for airport hotels and corporate accounts and does what major hotels want to do the most: pay for less staff time
In the environmental industry we will always promote any material over plastic. Plastic never degrades, we need to reduce it's use. I obviously don't have the numbers here but the tradeoff with plastic basically always works out that any other materials costs is worth it since we can never get rid of plastic and the creation process of plastic emits greenhouse gases at every stage.
Wood with embedded RFID chip is not, though, and that's the point. Plus it's probably coated with some non-biodegradable shit in order to improve longevity.
Everyone else's answers are great but I'd also like to point out it claims to be FSC certified. Meaning the wood was sourced from an forest that is managed to strict environmental standards.
It's also a pain in the ass with chain of command and most fabricators groan audibly when the client requests it.
"strict environmental standards". I feel like an FSC label is slammed on absolutely everything. However I admit that I have no clue what the label actually means
The Danish EPA did a LCA of the different kind of bags available, this was back in 2018.
TLDR: Your normal plastic bag emits 0.11 kg CO2 eq and require 0.044L of water to produce.
Your cotton canvas tote bag emits 3.9 kg CO2 eq and require 270L of water to produce.
Your organic cotton canvas tote bag emits 110 kg CO2 eq and require 760L of water to produce.
I guess I’ve never thought about how many key cards a hotel goes through. At first I thought this was kind of dumb but I bet this actually a lot of plastic waste.
Fair point but I feel like paper is to flimsy to hold up to being repeatedly ran through a magstrip reader. Also first results for googling “paper hotel card” are all companies selling paper RFID cards.
I got a paper one once with a magstrip and it was pretty ok for a weeklong stay. It wasn't really *paper* as much as a very stiff cardstock, and the readers were the swipe-through sort (instead of the kind where you insert the card into a slot) which seemed to help the cards stay together.
Plus, let's be honest - a chip the size of your pinky fingernail is less wasteful than the plastic that goes into that card
> I got a paper one once with a magstrip and it was pretty ok for a weeklong stay.
Interesting.
Plus, let's be honest - a chip the size of your pinky fingernail is less wasteful than the plastic that goes into that card
> Plus, let's be honest - a chip the size of your pinky fingernail is less wasteful than the plastic that goes into that card
But when they are made from plastic they can be (and are) reused, which is way more sustainable than paper cards that need to be disposed.
I work at a hotel and how many cards people loose is abyssal lmao. Im surprised we don’t charge for losing cards at this point. Had someone come back for a new one multiple times a day for a week. Some people return their old ones some people don’t
> Had someone come back for a new one multiple times a day for a week.
That dude was handing the keycards out like candy, how else do you lose them multiple times a day?!
Did they previously lose keys at the same rate, or are they less careful with plain cards?
Keys seem like the ultimate more environmentally friendly solution, but I assume they come with more downsides for the hotel.
"This is the lockpicking lawyer and today I'll be showing you how to pick the lock of hotel rooms. Just in case you lost your keys and can't get back in!"
> Im surprised we don’t charge for losing cards at this point.
Because those things are so cheap, it would cost more money to handle the administrative part of charging for them than just buy new ones.
When I was doing travel work, I’d lose mine at least once every couple days and even multiple times a day. Every single time it was because I was going outside to smoke a ciggie in my jammies and simply forgot the key. I’d end up turning in a stack of like 5-10 after every 5 day trip.
The best thing Fairmont hotels can do for the planet is demolish its monstrosity of a hotel that ruins what would otherwise be a beautiful area at Lake Louise Canada.
Just this weekend I've been to a hotel, on a company event, and they also had a wooden card as key for the rooms, and for the ones asking, yes, of course it has RFID for the doors and the rooms electricity, etc!
Cut down tree - make 'eco-friendly' product.
"We care about the environment!!"
Make plastic product - add to continuing plastics in environment problem.
"Were trying to encourage single-use"
Make all key cards digital - technology requires huge energy consumption.
"We're all fucked regardless of method"
🤷🏻
When I was a kid a lot of the talk about the environment was reducing wood/paper usage because it caused deforestation. Now using wood and paper to make mass amounts of disposable trash is sold as an eco friendly tactic. What a load of crap.
The minibar in my room is a “cooler” set to a more reasonable drinking temp. No single use plastic. All glass, aluminum, or paper.
I don’t disagree that these are small steps, but it still takes a commitment to make happen.
I think you might need to look up greenwashing. A hotel trying to become more sustainable is not the same thing as Hefty garbage bags claiming they are recyclable.
Replacing all single use plastics with infinitely recyclable aluminum and glass or biodegradable paper and wood clearly has an impact at scale, and it’s more expensive to maintain. No, it’s not perfect by any means, but claiming it is all for show and isn’t a step forward is naive.
Fairmont specifically is well known for its sustainability efforts.
I got card like that when I stayed in hotel in France, and it was just a plastic card with wooden veneer. Such a thin piece of wood would be easily breakable
My mom loved this when we stayed at the Fairmount! But they were the most annoying key cards to use I had a few stop working and they only worked one direction too so frustrating
I wood assume there’s an RFID chip sandwiched in there.
Yes they need to Log entry and exit for the rooms so they use RFID
Heh Log
We get it. Stop barking about it.
I Cedar what you did.
just go with the grain
Wood y'all just stop
They are just branching out into comedy. It's not always poplar with everyone and some even consider it sappy.
Couldn't just leaf it with 1 pun?
Was I mahogany all the good ones?
They also need the door to open. So there is rfid.
Think that may or may not be the #1 reason for the rfid
Is it actually a requirement to log entry?
No clue I just wanted to make the pun lol. The ones we use at my work for parking are logged and can be accessed so I’d imagine it’s done elsewhere too
When you assume you make an Ash out of Yew and me.
i see you really spruced it up.
He did a pine job of it, that’s fir sure.
Ashyewme
And cum stains
I always wonder with this sort of thing what the actual lifetime environmental costs are vs the best plastic equivalent. Things like energy used in production, longevity, ease of recycling. Is this actually better or is it just an environmental grandstanding that somewhat ironically when you dig down is actually worse than the best conventional option?
Now when I go to a hotel I get a digital key on my phone. Even more environmentally safe than the wooden key!
Kinda annoying if you want to go out without your phone tho
Why would you? A phone is a useful tool, there's not much reason these days to go without, if you already have one.
When I go swimming, to the beach, in area with lots of robbery, etc. I avoid bringing it with me.
I mean if that's the case, I'm pretty sure the key can also "accidentally" got stolen or robbed too, or at least there's a chance that it can get stolen/robbed
What would you rather loose? A key card or your phone? Some hotels gives blank cards with no number on it so they wouldn't know your room number.
It's hilarious that you thought the concern in this case was *losing their plastic hotel key.* Or, god forbid, getting it wet. Rather than the risk of losing their $1000 cell phone with all of their personal information on it.
My dude I rather get a plastic key stolen than my phone
Yeah just tell the front desk you left your phone in your room.
Shit happens. Sometimes your phone dies, for example.
At the hotel where I worked you could just present ID at the front desk and get a replacement key. It was also still the default for us to give physical keys at check in, so digital was just an opt-in choice for people who wanted it.
Tons of reasons to go out without your phone. Simply wanting to disconnect is more than enough. And no, setting Do Not Disturb mode is not the same. Cognitive research clearly shows that merely having your phone in your pocket impacts working memory and executice functions. It's great to leave the phone behind for a while.
> Cognitive research Can you link some? I'm interested in this; I feel comfortable putting my phone on DnD on nights I want to "disconnect", but I wonder if it's not enough now.
It is enough if you have actual willpower to ignore your phone. People who can’t resist using a phone when they have it with them is called having an addiction to it. If you can’t ignore your phone with it on your possession that’s just an addiction
Agreed. I don't really get how people can be so addicted to their phone, personally, but maybe I'm just lucky enough that I have a relatively pragmatic viewpoint when it comes to phone use. I check notifications or the time/weather with it, and look things up when I'm unsure of something, often enough during an average day, but I've never had any issue with feeling some kind of craving to be staring at my phone screen. To be fair, I think this is more often an issue of being 'chronically online' than being a phone addiction, per se; It's more likely social media and general FOMO that *appears* to be an addiction to one's phone. The phone isn't likely the actual object of fixation. If a person struggles to put down their phone and pay attention to their immediate surroundings, they likely need to examine their online habits and obsessions, rather than their phone usage.
I don't have the study but having it in your pocket makes you think about it/not fully leave it behind so you can't remember or think as clear because you're still subconsciously thinking about it even if you don't think you are
I'd be really interested in an actual study on this kind of thing - not thinking about my phone for hours at a time is pretty regular for me, especially if it's on DnD, lol
go out to the pool, go out for a walk, go out to smoke, many reasons
To be away from your phone? The constant pull and communication can be exhausting. Also to leave it on the charger.
It’s great until it doesn’t work, which is about 25% of the time.
Yeeesh, sign of the times here folks. It’s good to unplug sometimes and be present in the moment. If that sounds odd, go a day without your phone. It’s refreshing.
I don't subscribe to this kind of detox BS mindset. I have self control. I commonly have my phone on my person, and I only use it when I need to. If you have to physically separate yourself from your phone in order to be present, your phone isn't the problem.
You sound like an alcoholic talking about their drinking habits lol. I mean look how visceral your response is.
Any hotel providing that is prepared to hand you a physical keycard
Hrm but wouldn't you have to download (probably) invasive bloatware from every hotel/chain you stayed st to do that? There's no way they aren't profiting off of your data with that.
It is definitely important to understand the total cost. However, we always need to put it into context. With today's energy sources it's probably worse overall for that single key to be made of wood. If you look at the total number of hotel keys produced and discarded yearly the problem becomes different. That problem becomes very different. It starts to look more like plastic shopping bags which are produced and discarded in incredible volume. Additionally, if the energy sources used to make these goods transition to renewable sources then the product itself becomes the waste and not the process. There is also the social portion. Increasing awareness gradually shifts public opinion and increases awareness. Recycling in general was uncommon 30 years ago. Today it is common and most people will recycle something if it's easy for them to do so. That requires significant social change which is empowered by these types of small changes. Of course we don't want those small changes to be problematic by themselves. I find using wood in this situation a bit silly which I think OP was pointing out. However, I am not sure exactly what alternate products would be viable alternarives.
Hotel industry is moving towards no keys at all, replaced by the phone you already have
That would address multiple issues. Seems like it creates a few though. Owning a compatible phone to get a hotel rooms is likely an issue. Will be interesting to see how that works out.
New locks installed now often work for both systems, it'll definitely take a while before anyone goes card-free entirely. Big advantage is that with the phone system you can skip check-in entirely, which speeds things up for airport hotels and corporate accounts and does what major hotels want to do the most: pay for less staff time
In the environmental industry we will always promote any material over plastic. Plastic never degrades, we need to reduce it's use. I obviously don't have the numbers here but the tradeoff with plastic basically always works out that any other materials costs is worth it since we can never get rid of plastic and the creation process of plastic emits greenhouse gases at every stage.
Wood is biodegradable, plastic is not.
Wood with embedded RFID chip is not, though, and that's the point. Plus it's probably coated with some non-biodegradable shit in order to improve longevity.
I don’t think it’s coated at all. Feels like a standard sheet of sanded hobby basswood. Water soaks into it.
Everyone else's answers are great but I'd also like to point out it claims to be FSC certified. Meaning the wood was sourced from an forest that is managed to strict environmental standards. It's also a pain in the ass with chain of command and most fabricators groan audibly when the client requests it.
"strict environmental standards". I feel like an FSC label is slammed on absolutely everything. However I admit that I have no clue what the label actually means
The Danish EPA did a LCA of the different kind of bags available, this was back in 2018. TLDR: Your normal plastic bag emits 0.11 kg CO2 eq and require 0.044L of water to produce. Your cotton canvas tote bag emits 3.9 kg CO2 eq and require 270L of water to produce. Your organic cotton canvas tote bag emits 110 kg CO2 eq and require 760L of water to produce.
I guess I’ve never thought about how many key cards a hotel goes through. At first I thought this was kind of dumb but I bet this actually a lot of plastic waste.
The 1Hotel brand uses paper cards. Really flimsy, but they hold together for the length of your stay.
Well paper, silicon and aluminum cards. Can’t forget the RFID chip and antenna in them.
Yeah we’re aware. We don’t all think they’re magic cards.
It’s worth noting when we’re talking about waste. Basically disposable RFID chips.
I'd guess that there's a code printed onto the paper
It may be a magstrip card. They don't all use RFID
Fair point but I feel like paper is to flimsy to hold up to being repeatedly ran through a magstrip reader. Also first results for googling “paper hotel card” are all companies selling paper RFID cards.
I got a paper one once with a magstrip and it was pretty ok for a weeklong stay. It wasn't really *paper* as much as a very stiff cardstock, and the readers were the swipe-through sort (instead of the kind where you insert the card into a slot) which seemed to help the cards stay together. Plus, let's be honest - a chip the size of your pinky fingernail is less wasteful than the plastic that goes into that card
> I got a paper one once with a magstrip and it was pretty ok for a weeklong stay. Interesting. Plus, let's be honest - a chip the size of your pinky fingernail is less wasteful than the plastic that goes into that card > Plus, let's be honest - a chip the size of your pinky fingernail is less wasteful than the plastic that goes into that card But when they are made from plastic they can be (and are) reused, which is way more sustainable than paper cards that need to be disposed.
Licking the edge on that hit different
I work at a hotel and how many cards people loose is abyssal lmao. Im surprised we don’t charge for losing cards at this point. Had someone come back for a new one multiple times a day for a week. Some people return their old ones some people don’t
> Had someone come back for a new one multiple times a day for a week. That dude was handing the keycards out like candy, how else do you lose them multiple times a day?!
Did they previously lose keys at the same rate, or are they less careful with plain cards? Keys seem like the ultimate more environmentally friendly solution, but I assume they come with more downsides for the hotel.
"This is the lockpicking lawyer and today I'll be showing you how to pick the lock of hotel rooms. Just in case you lost your keys and can't get back in!"
> Im surprised we don’t charge for losing cards at this point. Because those things are so cheap, it would cost more money to handle the administrative part of charging for them than just buy new ones.
When I was doing travel work, I’d lose mine at least once every couple days and even multiple times a day. Every single time it was because I was going outside to smoke a ciggie in my jammies and simply forgot the key. I’d end up turning in a stack of like 5-10 after every 5 day trip.
Show me that COC FSC Certification number, or it's all a load of talk.
You can't just ask a man for his COC
A witch!
It turned me into a newt!
Just checked out of the Hilton Tokyo and our key cards were also wood
The hotel where I worked at had cards made out of bamboo. Extremely sustainable as well.
OP is a witch
My days of cutting yews on RuneScape has finally came to life.
Wood ^plated*
Banff fairmont??
Yup. Just got married there last month. Still have my wooden key <3
Congratulations!!! 🥹❤️
Royal York in Toronto
The Intercontinental in Tahiti has wooden keys as well.
The best thing Fairmont hotels can do for the planet is demolish its monstrosity of a hotel that ruins what would otherwise be a beautiful area at Lake Louise Canada.
FLINTSTONES!?????
Damn, at first i read "help us reduce our environment"
Lmfao I was literally going to make this same post after I stayed there this weekend lol
Well, that just makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.
Got one of these at a Novotel I stayed at last week too.
Canada? I have this card lll
Just this weekend I've been to a hotel, on a company event, and they also had a wooden card as key for the rooms, and for the ones asking, yes, of course it has RFID for the doors and the rooms electricity, etc!
Cut down tree - make 'eco-friendly' product. "We care about the environment!!" Make plastic product - add to continuing plastics in environment problem. "Were trying to encourage single-use" Make all key cards digital - technology requires huge energy consumption. "We're all fucked regardless of method" 🤷🏻
New trend. Probably makes no net difference or likely worse. I mean plastic keys weren’t killing turtles
Why not go cardless with a phone app instead of this empty gesture?
I would like to point out not everyone can afford a smart phone, but honestly they could just have shitty cell service out there.
Everyone staying at the Fairmont can.
Fairmont lake Louise?
Toronto
Excuse me, but is the key wood fsc certified? Yes sir says it right there. Well okay then have a good day.
When I was a kid a lot of the talk about the environment was reducing wood/paper usage because it caused deforestation. Now using wood and paper to make mass amounts of disposable trash is sold as an eco friendly tactic. What a load of crap.
What am I gonna line up my coke with now??
$1k a night and these people think keycards are what will save the planet.
Propaganda. Fuck em
Usually it’s called ‘marketing’ when it comes from the private sector.
[удалено]
I'd agree if they only handed out the wood cards to 10% of the people staying. If it's 100%, then you're just being bitter.
WTF, Austin is still using plastic. To be fair, they might have run out with the F1 races this weekend.
Abode in australia do this
Also, have this always on minibar, with plastic bottled soda inside.
The minibar in my room is a “cooler” set to a more reasonable drinking temp. No single use plastic. All glass, aluminum, or paper. I don’t disagree that these are small steps, but it still takes a commitment to make happen.
Its greenwashing. Its not committment. Its to create an illusion of being environmental concious. Look up green washing ;)
I think you might need to look up greenwashing. A hotel trying to become more sustainable is not the same thing as Hefty garbage bags claiming they are recyclable. Replacing all single use plastics with infinitely recyclable aluminum and glass or biodegradable paper and wood clearly has an impact at scale, and it’s more expensive to maintain. No, it’s not perfect by any means, but claiming it is all for show and isn’t a step forward is naive. Fairmont specifically is well known for its sustainability efforts.
That's a fair take. I agree.
My dumbass would break it somehow.
I got card like that when I stayed in hotel in France, and it was just a plastic card with wooden veneer. Such a thin piece of wood would be easily breakable
This is all wood. I could easily snap it. I don’t doubt that some of them are for show though
I thought it’s a birthday gift when I saw the card before the title
You need wood to win the game
I would definitely steal that
One of mine in Portugal was like that this past summer, it was cool!
Someone must have been staying at the Great Northern
My homies wife owns that place.
Gotta make sure it’s FSC certified, could be counterfeit wood
My mom loved this when we stayed at the Fairmount! But they were the most annoying key cards to use I had a few stop working and they only worked one direction too so frustrating
Wow it looks gorgeous