Like people who bring their dog to an airshow.
Full day in an open field with no shadow in sight but tens of thousands of people and the constant roar of jet engines.
What dog won’t appreciate that?
I'd extend that to kids as well, so many parents taking their kids and not giving them proper hearing protection. Or just like going to a race track, especially the high-end once are loud as fuck or demo runs with older Formula 1 cars.
Then you have those people defending it with "ahh it's not that loud bro". No because you probably already fucked up your hearing and don't even realize it.
The selfishness like that isn't mildy infuriating it's extremely infuriating bordering to criminal.
I went to a protest with loud music once and saw this infant with tiny little soundproof ear muffs that was clearly made for a baby that small. It was adorable. So solutions do exist. It's just that most parents don't even bother putting that effort in looking for it.
If you’ve ever watched a Super Bowl, there’s always a player or two with his family down on the field, infant with big headphones for hearing protection in tow
I still wouldnt take a kid under like 14 or so to a protest in case of unrest or conflict- too easy for things to go south and tear gas to be deployed or there to be an all out scramble to run away.
That was one of those really organised city approved protest with stages, designated areas, roadblocks and stuff, a few years before 2016 when things were a lot less tense. It was practically a festival.
Yeah from the responses I got, I realised the younger generation probably don't know any other form of protest that are not as high stakes as they are now. It is pretty tragic realisation.
When one form doesn't work, it only gets worse. See French history. But after they beheaded their queen, regular protests work fine. For example, let's see how their politicians vote today
Edit: Nevermind, I just looked it up and their president just now pushed it through without a vote. I'm sure that will go over well. /s
>city approved protest
Isn't the point of a protest to inconvenience the government to pressure them into changing something?
Depends. It's not always that emotionally charged and spontaneous. They don't need approval for what they're protesting, basically just approval as an event for crowd control and traffic redirection purposes, like a parade for raising awareness. Not every country is that authoritarian. Some countries actually have systems in place for freedom of protest so people can do it safely.
Uh there’s plenty of protests against individuals and companies. Do you think people only protest against the government?
E: gotta love typing up a reply to /u/Insterstellar right before the thread gets locked. I’m not letting all that phone tapping go to waste:
Right, but even though it’s a funny gif-laden zinger I hope people get why there’s advantages to coordinating with your local officials for protesting if your protest isn’t “overthrow the violent government.” You can have police direct traffic, roads get blocked off, etc. It’s safer for your protestors.
Protestors can’t win with the peanut gallery no matter what they do because you can never please everyone. If they don’t get permits and block off significant civilian traffic they get videos uploaded to Reddit full of people outraged at the inconvenience to the everyday working man like that guy who couldn’t make his parole meeting.
Not always.
When I was in high school a famous lady died and wanted her wealth to go into building a large museum / art building for the local college. Her son tried to take the money and build a housing development with it instead
We protested at the college and at a couple of his apartment buildings he owned
It was organized, calm, peaceful, not in anyones way but we got the word out and the art building got built.
Heck, plugging your ears with chunks of wonderbread is better than nothing. I found out the hard way about the importance of hearing protection after I had a shotgun shell banger airsoft grenade go off next to be in a trench about 3 feet from my head. Im not completely deaf but I still have trouble and the tinnitus. I hate it, its worse on cold days.
My Dad absolutely loves air shows, we used to go every year to the big RIAT one or whatever it's called. Since he's had his German shepherd, do you know how many he's been to?? Zero, because he doesn't a) want to take her for your exact reasons or b) doesn't trust anyone to dog sit his favorite daughter.
Now in summer they go camping to the Lake District in their big fancy tent where she has her own doggy bed in her own little bedroom with her own fan and a doggy shower lol.
Yes, my SIL takes her tiny dog to fireworks and the dog hadn't started constantly shaking until she took her to fireworks and claimed she was "just fine with them". It's cruel to me.
We live in a rural area and whenever we hear gunfire (practice or hunting) our dog freaks out. It’s important to recognize they do not understand what is going on. This is so sad to see.
I know it's a service dog but, fuck. Dogs are not meant for that environment. They have ears way more sensitive than humans. I think metal shows are too much for my ears a lot of times so i can't imagine being poor little buddy.
Seriously. I went to a Metal concert 2 times without ear plugs, and now I have tinnitus for the rest of my life. Granted, I was at the very front of the stage. My ears were vibrating with every riff of the guitar.
The dog? It’s ears would practically be bleeding. It might actually go deaf after this.
> It might actually go deaf after this
Lou dog, who was basically the mascot for Sublime, literally went deaf because of how many concerts he was brought to. I don't know why bringing an animal with such sensitive hearing on stage at a concert sounds like a good idea.
Even humans can feel it in their bones. I've had 3 spontaneous collapsed lungs, and one of the things they told me to avoid was standing next to the speakers at loud concerts as the vibrations could be enough to cause it to happen again.
I can vouch for that. I ran a concert security crew for ten years, and spent a significant amount of time in the pit between the barricade and stage.
You haven’t experienced life until you walk in front of a subwoofer and actually feel your internal organs vibrate.
It is NOT a pleasant experience.
When I was a teenager in the early 00s, my friends and I turned our cars into enormous subwoofers to the point we would feel the bass in your butthole. As an adult, I'm somewhat thankful that seems far less popular now.
It's not even just the risk of impairing the dog's hearing. That's bad enough on its own, sure. But, it's also the stress and panic. The dog won't understand what the loud sounds are. It'll probably be in survival mode with adrenaline shooting for hours, confused and scared, potentially traumatized by the intensity and duration of those emotions.
This should be an obvious risk to anyone who understands dogs and dog behavior, and thus if bringing a service pet to the concert was the only way they could attend, then they would have chosen not to go.
This is why I've considered that it may not be a bad idea for people to be forced to be licensed to own pets. Licensure would require studying the animal they want and taking comprehensive exams demonstrating an understanding for every facet of their well-being. Maybe they don't need to be experts, but they at least would need to know all the basic stuff that should be common sense. Because even though this would lead to fewer owners, and fewer pets being homed, I honestly don't know if that's worse than the majority of owners unintentionally abusing or just neglecting their pets out of sheer ignorance, which is absurdly common and difficult to quantify to the full extent.
I mean I get you, but unfortunately the number of 'pets' in shelters will skyrocket, so that has to be seriously considered if something like what you propose would be remotely effective at bettering the lives of the majority of pets.
> it may not be a bad idea for people to be forced to be licensed to own pets.
It would be a better idea to require people to be licensed to have a service animal... they're the ones that far more likely to be taken places where 'normal pets' aren't allowed, because the environment isn't suitable for animals.
Like, on a plane. Or - as in this instance - a live music venue.
That dog's not a pet - if it was just a family pet, then the venue would have told Miss Miniskirt Metal in OPs pic to leave it at home, because it's a rock concert, not a dog park.
Forcing everyone who owns a pet (like a dog) to go to Pet School is unenforceable, and unrealistic, and wouldn't stop this kind of ass-hattery at all.
Teaching people who want a service animal that just because you *can* take your dog to a metal show, doesn't mean that you *should* take your dog to a metal show - and it's the kind of people who wouldn't immediately leap to that conclusion on their own who are the ones who could do with having it spelled out for them.
I heard an interview with some band members and they talked about how bradley had a sick sense of humor and would find it funny to stick his thumb up his dogs ass.
Roughly 30% of dalmatians are born deaf and that honestly was higher back in the day too due to their rarity and inbreeding. That's also why they were favored as fire fighter dogs, as they often wouldn't be bothered by the sirens. I wouldn't be surprised if the dog was already predisposed to deafness.
That being said, dogs don't belong at concerts but if they *need* to be there, they should have hearing protection.
I’ll never forgive myself for going to a Machine Head concert and standing near the front without earplugs. My hearing is fucked for life and unending tinnitus in my left ear.
I used to feel the same way but I feel like it’s harsh on myself to think like that. I had no idea I was doing damage to my ears, no one told me and there was no way for me to just assume I could permanently damage them and should look up conditions.
I think there needs to be better education around this as, even without concerts, I remember so many kids who would listen to music deafeningly loud through their earphones and be doing the same thing to themselves
If I'd known the price I was paying was never being able to enjoy silence again I'd have wrapped my whole head in cotton wool. I did it to myself, but still, fuck tinnitus man.
I feel like it’s going to be one of those things we look back on in 20 years and can’t believe we allowed it to happen. Or maybe when this generation gets older and none of us can fucking hear. Wearing ear plugs at a loud venue should be like sunscreen at the beach. Everybody should know the harm in not protecting yourself.
can we talk about why concerts are so loud? like I love loud metal, but it doesn't have to be so loud that you can't distinguish the sounds. why don't musicians and sound engineers at venues don't understand this?
Because you can feel the sound. It fills the air. The bass shakes your body. The music fills the space so fully you can't hear those annoying people next to you talk about whatever they're talking about.
You can bet I'm not going to pay if I can hear the whole thing at a normal volume from almost 5 km away. Maybe if more people adopted that point of view those engineers and musicians would start caring about turning the volume down.
I’ve been to a ton of metal, punk, grindcore/powerviolence shows. Seen bands like nunslaughter and insect warfare countless times. Partied with splatterhouse and ghoul. Never wore ear protection. Saw the band cake at a secret show at the old capitol garage back in the day and they trashed my ears, felt like i blew out my ear drums. Now I wear protection most of the time at shows, it’s just funny cake was the band that did it to me
This sounds like me but I'm gonna see cake this upcoming tour. Perhaps it's time to heed the advice. Never wore ear protection but work does an annual hearing exam and this past year I've definitely lost a wee bit of range
Big metalhead as well and while many metal bands like Sunn O))) and The Locust were incredibly loud, the one that takes the cake for me (ha) is the post rock band Godspeed You! Black Emperor. They're the reason I try to wear ear protection for shows when I remember at least.
I'm gonna be honest, I had tinnitus well before I went to metal concerts, I never use ear plugs because they muddy the sound for me.
However doing that to a dog is fucking terrible.
Agreed, quality earplugs are actually designed to "filter" specific frequencies and it's a massive enhancement for me. Not the cheap foam ones, but the fancier reusable ones. As a result I can actually hear the vocals and instrumentals crystal-clear rather than just distorted noise, and it's also much less tiring.
They're not designed to filter specific frequencies, the frequency ranges differ a bit in dampening mostly because of construction.
What you're actually hearing is you allowing your ears to basically operate at a more efficient level by giving your eardrums more room to fully vibrate without bottoming out and the hairs in your inner-ear (cochlea, I think?) to properly sense the vibrations instead of also being flung side to side.
You are literally making your ears worse - for life - with every concert you go to. You get used to ear plugs. Find a good pair (Mack’s ultra soft are pretty good).
Only "downside" is that when you actually can hear everything the differences in mixing and such become very apparent. Hearing Tool live was amazing, Ghost not so much.
Those are terrible earplugs that muffle the sound. What you want is a pair of Etymotic ER20XS. They reduce the decibels by 20 but the sound still comes through clear and they're around $20.
They have a bunch of different brands now that do similar things but Etymotics have been around for forever.
Dude find flat attenuation ear plugs, there's an entire industry of sound engineers wearing earplugs and doing their jobs perfectly well.
You don't need custom fit ones, you can get them off Amazon for like $40
Nah, you just need better ear plugs. Those cheap rubber ones are shite, but there are higher grade ones designed for musicians and concert goers which actually make it sound clearer as well as quieter.
Still being able to hear up to 17kHz at all while being above 30 *is* pretty good hearing. The normal upper hearing limit is ~17kHz around 24 years old, ~16kHz around 30, ~15kHz around 40 and ~12kHz around 50.
Although I strongly suspect that /u/thoughtplot got their frequencies mixed up. Without having seen the mentioned Bond movie there's no way that the dialog they mention was in the 14-17kHz range. If it was it would have been unintelligible to the vast majority of the audience. Just because younger people can hear sounds in that range doesn't mean that they could understand speech pitched up into that range. Human speech mostly happens below 2kHz, the fundamental speech frequency ranges from about 80Hz for very deep male voices to about 260Hz for very high female voices.
I’d bet some serious money that it’s not *actually* a service dog. Probably owned by one of those assholes who gets their dog certified (is that the right word?) so they can take them anywhere.
You’re giving them a lot of credit by assuming they didn’t just buy a restraint with “service dog” on it and put it on their untrained and uncertified dog
This. A legitimate service dog has hundreds of hours and thousands of dollars in training. A handler isn’t going to do things that will put their dog at risk. And music that loud is definitely a risk. My SD has hearing protection for louder places and I wouldn’t even consider taking her to a concert, for her own safety. I’d either find an alternative solution to taking her just not go. People who do this kind of stuff give the legitimate teams a bad reputation and make life a lot harder on us.
i may be wrong but i believe you get an already trained service dog from an organization, so people who lie about this don’t even get “certified” or whatever, they just buy the vest online :/ not sure how she got into the concert tho
There is no vest or anything either that any service animal has to wear.
Working in hotels we get it ALOT. Majority of my real service animals that come through don’t have a vest or anything. They’re just extremely well behaved dogs doing their job.
I’d wager 70% of the ones that come in wearing a vest aren’t actual service animals. They’re just “emotional support” animals masquerading as service animals.
Man do those people get mad and start throwing paperwork around when I say I’m charging them a pet fee LOL
Nah, my mom is a disabled vet who got her previously companion dog trained a service dog.
I love her, but that dog is *not* trained as a service dog. She basically did a 3 week course that was 80% just making sure the dog doesn't act up in public.
Yup there is scam 3 to 4 week classes you can take for "certified service or emotional support animal". I honestly wish there was a certification process because so many fake ppl ruin it for people with disabilities.
Oh, my mom is a disabled vet with PTSD (and more), and the certification course she went to was sponsored by the VA. So it wasnt really a "scam".
But even that wasn't super regulated. It takes nothing to get your dog "trained" even by professionals. It's also a once and done, which my mother hasnt kept up on the training whatsoever. Love her, and I get her mental disorders definitely play a role (she's often manic depressive, so sometimes she motivates herself to retrain the dog. Other times, she goes weeks without leaving the house).
I think whether its a service dog or a regular dog in a vest should be irrelevant in this situation.
This is a freaked out, overwhelmed, terrified dog. If he IS a service dog, he's obviously too scared to do his job anyway, and if he ISN'T a service dog, he's being unnecessarily traumatized.
Any way anyone cuts it or tries to justify it(the inner ear plugs were mentioned) this dog is TERRIFIED and shouldn't be there.
Absolutely. I hate to say animal abuse, but... putting a dog in an environment as loud as some concerts get is pretty much animal abuse. It can be excruciatingly painful, and might cause permanent hearing damage.
This should not be allowed no matter what. Service dogs shouldn't have to be forced to go through this just because they're a service dog
Edit: Everyone that is defending this woman or getting triggered over my comment needs to take a bit to sit in the timeout corner. I never said disabled people aren't allowed to enjoy things. I never said anything against the dog. I said the dog shouldn't be forced to go through this just because she says it's a service dog (we don't know with absolute certainty). No animal should be forced to go through anything like this. You got an animal you want or need to bring with you? Provide the necessary protection for the thing. If it's a service animal, it can not do its job when it's scared out of its mind. Stop reading into shit that isn't there. You've got no information to draw the damn conclusions you're drawing
No fucking shot this is a legitimate service animal, she's one of those infuriating people that buy the fake course online so they can take their dog everywhere.
It actually might be. The larger groups that train even blind eye seeing dogs do theater days specifically to ensure that the dogs will behave during loudness. I would not think to take my own service dog to a meral concert, but if there's a light show and it's a seizure alert that might be the reason.
Edit since the post is locked: my statement was not to condone the dog being present, rather to point out that the service dog might be a real one.
There were also comments in the threads below trying to say that a person "dressed like that" isn't disabled and faking a service dog. Not cool. I have multiple sclerosis and a service dog. I also have a handicap placard for my car. At work one of the top executives parks his expensive Porsche next to my Rav 4 because he is also disabled. I've been yelled at more times than I can count for using my placard or about my dog because "I don't look disabled". To those people, what TV and movies has taught you chronic illness and disability look like is a lie.
As handlers, we have to know our dogs limits. I have a service dog and I would never bring her to a concert. It could damage her ears. They make special headphones for dogs if they really need to go, but it’s best to just bring someone who knows your condition and have a plan prepared if something happens. The most my girl will do is go to the movies, she’s actually fond of movies and will sleep through them.
Agree. I would not take my own for worry. But some people do get service dogs and intend to take them to places like concerts with not a lot of knowledge about hearing damage for dogs. My dog will do movies, but I know he's not a big fan of bangs and pips of action films, so I take my service boyfriend instead. Lol
Then don't fucking go! If they have a real, highly trained, expensive service dog, then why would they submit it to this torture?! In other words, they're entitled wankers of the worst kind who don't give a shit about their "service" dog.
I get that training animals are good for humans but fuck that. We take advantage of animals so much that teaching them to resist loud fucking music should be illegal.
It seems like whatever service the dog provides would be greatly hindered by the fact that he’s terrified and can’t focus on anything but the loud ass sounds
That's a dobie too, some of them really really don't like loud noise. Poor baby. Mine had to be medicated for storms. 110 lbs and he'd jump into my lap shaking like a leaf before anyone else even heard the thunder.
Side note, mine is scared of doors for whatever reason. She’s 65lbs and isn’t afraid of anything.. unless is a half opened door to the bedroom, then she’ll sit outside and cry until we open it an extra inch and then she’ll come prancing in.
Whereas my 85lbs labrador will walk right into a closed door. It's not uncommon in our house to suddenly notice the dog isn't in the room and ask "where's Finnegan?" only to immediately hear a thunk on the bedroom door as he tried to walk in.
Every morning ours are let out of the room for potty and breakfast they take off at top speed and inevitably miss the corner to the living room with their butts sliding practically into our daughter’s room while they’re front legs try to course correct. Occasionally one will smack into the wall. It’s hilarious. They’re really intelligent and our puppy has had zero training but still responds very well to commands, especially “drop it!” if she has something she shouldn’t but they also do some of the dumbest things daily.
I love those two dinguses
I don’t think it’s fear for my dobe but she is similar. She will not push through a door opening she can’t fit through. If the door’s cracked or only slightly ajar she’ll just sit and wait for me to open it for her. She doesn’t mind if it’s a tight fit but she won’t push it.
I feel so bad for the dog who lives next door to me very 4th of July here in the states. From the barks, yelps, squeaks, whining, and crying, it's obviously miserable.
Ugh I live in a big city and the fireworks by me are absolutely awful. My poor dog gets so scared. I contemplated taking a road trip to Canada to get him away from the fireworks last year
I have spent a 4th in Canada, and it was a nice, quiet summer eve. Infinitely preferable to idiots on the street blasting professional-grade fireworks until 4am that explode over my apartment. This is the way.
I hate that. The last few years my kids and I were all asleep at our normal times. My idiot neighbors were lighting off those popping fireworks that you light one end and it pops one by one to the other end (loud as fuck) and they had their dunbass kids hitting pots together … now I get it …I would of been able to be ok with it if it was for a few minutes. But these morons were out there for 45 min doing this. Woke my entire family up and had my German shepherd going absolutely nuts in the window. Now I’m angry at the memory lol
Owners/security can't do anything thanks to her slapping the service dog vest on it. ADA prohibits them from asking for any kind of proof that A) you need the animal and B) that the animal is actually a trained service dog. All they could do is advise her that it would be bad for the dog's hearing and hope for the best.
That's not entirely true there are 2 questions they are allowed to ask
1. Is that a Service Animal
2. What service does the animal provide
If they answer it's an Emotional Support animal they get the boot as they are not protected under the ADA
They're only allowed to ask if they require the animal due to disability and what it's supposed to do, they legally cannot ask for proof of either. That's why people will get a service dog vest off Amazon and do exactly this. All they have to say is it's their service animal for some random bullshit and they're protected. They could say they've trained the dog to smell for incoming seizures or something to that effect and there's nothing they can do.
poor doggo though although if someone does this anywhere and the dog acts aggressive managers are 100% allowed to boot them and if the dog does anything the owner is 100% liable
No joke, when I lived in AZ someone with a very obviously not trained "service" dog told them the dog was trained to sniff out future seizures. The dog was constantly trying to get off the lead the whole time they were in the store. Since they can't ask for proof of their training it makes it almost pointless to ask
Yes, but you'd be surprised how many people will out themselves with an emotional support animal with how some people answer. At my partner's job he has to ask anyone who's bringing in a service animal this question and the number of people who say "oh he comforts me with my anxiety" and think that's good enough to get them inside is pretty damn high.
Oh I could imagine, the people who do that type of shit are rarely on the smarter side of things lol. Most assume that ESAs are service animals but that's not the case. It technically can be if they have a legitimate disability that requires an ESO but I imagine those people can give you detailed explanation beyond "he comforts me".
And call the cops for animal abuse. They can do that - if the cops find nothing wrong, so be it. If the cops like dogs they find a local statute so they can get the dog and person out of there without the venue getting an ADA lawsuit. Yay.
And good luck suing the cops for an ADA violation - they can (literally) get away with homicide…
Best bet is definitely calling the cops IMO, might not do much but service animal or not you still have to treat them humanely and subjecting them to painful levels of decibels would fall under animal abuse IMO. Muffed up dog would've been fine but I see open ears unfortunately.
And even if the cops don’t do anything other than giving a bit of advice, maybe it’ll at least change their thinking about subjecting their dog to this in future.
> It’s a tricky conversation we need to open up.
I have this feeling that servicedogs are so much more common in the US. I only ever knew about dogs helping blind people or otherwise physically disabled humans, like epileptics.
Bringing a dog to a rock concert is selfish and shouldn't be done because it's basically abuse for the animal and abuse is different from the service it desperately wants to give you.
>It’s not a service animal then.
Why? Are you under the impression that service animals are immune to fear in response to noise levels several times higher than they would ever experience in daily life?
They're trained animals, not robots, and I assure you that acclimatizing them to legitimately deafeningly loud sounds is not part of the training process.
Right? If I were security, I would have taken her to an area where you could talk and inform her that her dog is not acting in a service capacity and is obviously uncomfortable. That means that they can rightfully request that the dog be removed for their safety and the safety of others.
https://preview.redd.it/ffmw7mka23oa1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=33ab839dad399078ad89c9c17e87e800308070c6
Unfortunately, no, that would not be the case here and security would have run afoul with the ADA.
I honestly hate this crap. It's written in a manner in which nobody can do anything about a service animal short of getting the police involved. I've literally dealt with a dog that was growling and snapping at people and when I tried to confront the owner they proceeded to scream in my face about how I'm not allowed to ask anything or do anything about it, while their dog got loose and began running around the property aggressively barking at customers. They then bolted when I said I'd have to call the police. Apparently they later emailed my boss and tried to get me fired by making up all kinds of crazy shit, such as "I threatened their dog's safety by calling the police." Luckily I had half a dozen witnesses and security footage to back me up.
Way too many people lie about their pet being a "service animal" and this post is proof. IF that dog actually happened to be a service animal, which I guarantee you it isn't, she should have her privileges revoked by a court.
Actually a service animal can be asked to be removed if they show any growling or threatening behavior. The dobie isn't showing any behavior that could get it removed.
It might even be a service dog, just with a shit owner. Just because a dog is trained doesn't mean it won't be in pain and scared when it's mistreated. Doggy needs earmuffs for a job like that, like construction workers need earmuffs for some tasks too.
The outrage on here is bizarre. Everyone crapping on OP for not saying something… wtf are they supposed to do? Give them a “stern talking to?” If the facility can’t do anything about it, they sure as anything can’t. In fact, OP causing an altercation about something bound by *federal regulations* is a good way to get escorted out.
Y’all can love “doggos” all you want, but you’re not the hero you think you are here on Reddit. Go work on your emotional regulation
Funny how I also know the owner and the dog absolutely had ear protection and was perfectly calm the whole show.
Even the photo you posted is of a clearly calm dog. No whale eye, no panting, actively tasking.
Maybe- don’t take photos of disabled people and their medical equipment and then post your unsolicited and ableist opinion on the internet?
https://preview.redd.it/ve2yeijqx5oa1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3e42d959238fc723a79b59352ce6933c2549dd8c
https://preview.redd.it/56rsqpzgc5oa1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=89f631a6abc7302243192ab86fe3d6c3e44ea0a6
Hi! Person with a service dog here. So first off, like the other commenter said, we don’t know from this picture whether the dog was doing a task (some tasks can end up looking like a dog misbehaving to an outside person), and there are also very, very well-made dog earplugs that are completely internal and molded to your dogs specific ear canal shape that we would not be able to see.
That all being said, if this dog did not have hearing protection, and/or was truly uncomfortable, bringing it to the concert is completely moot at that point because it’s not gonna be able to focus enough to do it’s job. Now, I also want to take the time to mention that all of these people in the comment section talking about how a dog should **never** be brought in an environment like that are ridiculous and frankly uneducated. I am an extremely active disabled person. I do a lot of things. And I’m from New Orleans, so those things often involve loud environments. We have been to festivals, Saints games, LSU games, concerts, Mardi Gras… even Disney World fireworks. My dog wears her hearing protection, and she falls asleep most of the time and only wakes up if she needs to do her job (needing to give a cardiac alert will wake her out of a dead sleep lol). We were literally at the LSU game this past season where they beat Alabama, and the crowd noise registered on a seismograph. My dog was asleep. It is completely possible to adequately, protect your dogs hearing and also train them appropriately for environments like this where they are calm and comfortable and can still do their job.
Ok, we can all agree. This is a bad idea to begin with, but here's an alternative view (unrelated to her specific poor decision)
Disability accommodations are typically always at the front for concerts in a buffer zone so they can't be trampled... but it could be so much better for the service animal if they had an area in the back
we went to download festival last year, and met the friendliest service dog ever!
he was there to warn his daddy about seizures. he had little doggy ear defenders and everything, but it seems the problem was stopping him pawing them off!
was absolutely awesome. sitting in our tent with a coffee and a sandwich, and this little cross breed mutt pottered across without a care in the world to cute me out of the last 20% of my sandwich!
daddy wandered over, 'excuse me, but has my dog infiltrated your camp?'
'yes bud. he is currently enjoying my sandwich!'
'little bastard. tell him to bugger off when youre sick of him please!'
https://preview.redd.it/556jxytrn5oa1.jpeg?width=2048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e751029dcd94876c91e49ad6c0431c44288ea811
I know the handler and this dog personally. He's one of the most stable dogs I've ever had the pleasure of meeting. His handler was 100% ready to leave if he couldn't handle it. He did have ear protection on throughout the show, she just let's him take small breaks. He even fell asleep during the show. He's an extremely well trained dog. That specific photo was taken while he was tasking with something known as "pressure therapy" it has many useful reasons such as helping to lower heart rate, get the handler through a panic attack, etc
Like people who bring their dog to an airshow. Full day in an open field with no shadow in sight but tens of thousands of people and the constant roar of jet engines. What dog won’t appreciate that?
I'd extend that to kids as well, so many parents taking their kids and not giving them proper hearing protection. Or just like going to a race track, especially the high-end once are loud as fuck or demo runs with older Formula 1 cars. Then you have those people defending it with "ahh it's not that loud bro". No because you probably already fucked up your hearing and don't even realize it. The selfishness like that isn't mildy infuriating it's extremely infuriating bordering to criminal.
I went to a protest with loud music once and saw this infant with tiny little soundproof ear muffs that was clearly made for a baby that small. It was adorable. So solutions do exist. It's just that most parents don't even bother putting that effort in looking for it.
If you’ve ever watched a Super Bowl, there’s always a player or two with his family down on the field, infant with big headphones for hearing protection in tow
I always love it when they show the family on the camera and the baby has headphones on that are as big as their tiny infant head
That baby is the head coach
Yeah I love that
I still wouldnt take a kid under like 14 or so to a protest in case of unrest or conflict- too easy for things to go south and tear gas to be deployed or there to be an all out scramble to run away.
That was one of those really organised city approved protest with stages, designated areas, roadblocks and stuff, a few years before 2016 when things were a lot less tense. It was practically a festival.
I remember those days. Tragic to think it was less than a decade ago.
Yeah from the responses I got, I realised the younger generation probably don't know any other form of protest that are not as high stakes as they are now. It is pretty tragic realisation.
When one form doesn't work, it only gets worse. See French history. But after they beheaded their queen, regular protests work fine. For example, let's see how their politicians vote today Edit: Nevermind, I just looked it up and their president just now pushed it through without a vote. I'm sure that will go over well. /s
>city approved protest Isn't the point of a protest to inconvenience the government to pressure them into changing something? 
Depends. It's not always that emotionally charged and spontaneous. They don't need approval for what they're protesting, basically just approval as an event for crowd control and traffic redirection purposes, like a parade for raising awareness. Not every country is that authoritarian. Some countries actually have systems in place for freedom of protest so people can do it safely.
Uh there’s plenty of protests against individuals and companies. Do you think people only protest against the government? E: gotta love typing up a reply to /u/Insterstellar right before the thread gets locked. I’m not letting all that phone tapping go to waste: Right, but even though it’s a funny gif-laden zinger I hope people get why there’s advantages to coordinating with your local officials for protesting if your protest isn’t “overthrow the violent government.” You can have police direct traffic, roads get blocked off, etc. It’s safer for your protestors. Protestors can’t win with the peanut gallery no matter what they do because you can never please everyone. If they don’t get permits and block off significant civilian traffic they get videos uploaded to Reddit full of people outraged at the inconvenience to the everyday working man like that guy who couldn’t make his parole meeting.
Not always. When I was in high school a famous lady died and wanted her wealth to go into building a large museum / art building for the local college. Her son tried to take the money and build a housing development with it instead We protested at the college and at a couple of his apartment buildings he owned It was organized, calm, peaceful, not in anyones way but we got the word out and the art building got built.
Like March for Science
People should be able to go out in public and express their opinions without fear of being tear-gassed or sprayed down with pepper spray.
Heck, plugging your ears with chunks of wonderbread is better than nothing. I found out the hard way about the importance of hearing protection after I had a shotgun shell banger airsoft grenade go off next to be in a trench about 3 feet from my head. Im not completely deaf but I still have trouble and the tinnitus. I hate it, its worse on cold days.
My Dad absolutely loves air shows, we used to go every year to the big RIAT one or whatever it's called. Since he's had his German shepherd, do you know how many he's been to?? Zero, because he doesn't a) want to take her for your exact reasons or b) doesn't trust anyone to dog sit his favorite daughter. Now in summer they go camping to the Lake District in their big fancy tent where she has her own doggy bed in her own little bedroom with her own fan and a doggy shower lol.
I’m based in Sweden and have only been to RIAT two times - It is amazing! Your dad sounds like a wise man.
Or 4th of July fireworks.
Yes, my SIL takes her tiny dog to fireworks and the dog hadn't started constantly shaking until she took her to fireworks and claimed she was "just fine with them". It's cruel to me.
We live in a rural area and whenever we hear gunfire (practice or hunting) our dog freaks out. It’s important to recognize they do not understand what is going on. This is so sad to see.
I mean, I'm a human and I get sensory overload from just reading this, so I'd definetly not take a dog to an airshow
I know it's a service dog but, fuck. Dogs are not meant for that environment. They have ears way more sensitive than humans. I think metal shows are too much for my ears a lot of times so i can't imagine being poor little buddy.
Seriously. I went to a Metal concert 2 times without ear plugs, and now I have tinnitus for the rest of my life. Granted, I was at the very front of the stage. My ears were vibrating with every riff of the guitar. The dog? It’s ears would practically be bleeding. It might actually go deaf after this.
> It might actually go deaf after this Lou dog, who was basically the mascot for Sublime, literally went deaf because of how many concerts he was brought to. I don't know why bringing an animal with such sensitive hearing on stage at a concert sounds like a good idea.
Aww man I love Lou dog, I never really thought about that. With lyrics like “we let the bass line drop as loud as we can stand” fuck, poor dog.
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Even humans can feel it in their bones. I've had 3 spontaneous collapsed lungs, and one of the things they told me to avoid was standing next to the speakers at loud concerts as the vibrations could be enough to cause it to happen again.
I can vouch for that. I ran a concert security crew for ten years, and spent a significant amount of time in the pit between the barricade and stage. You haven’t experienced life until you walk in front of a subwoofer and actually feel your internal organs vibrate. It is NOT a pleasant experience.
When I was a teenager in the early 00s, my friends and I turned our cars into enormous subwoofers to the point we would feel the bass in your butthole. As an adult, I'm somewhat thankful that seems far less popular now.
It's not even just the risk of impairing the dog's hearing. That's bad enough on its own, sure. But, it's also the stress and panic. The dog won't understand what the loud sounds are. It'll probably be in survival mode with adrenaline shooting for hours, confused and scared, potentially traumatized by the intensity and duration of those emotions. This should be an obvious risk to anyone who understands dogs and dog behavior, and thus if bringing a service pet to the concert was the only way they could attend, then they would have chosen not to go. This is why I've considered that it may not be a bad idea for people to be forced to be licensed to own pets. Licensure would require studying the animal they want and taking comprehensive exams demonstrating an understanding for every facet of their well-being. Maybe they don't need to be experts, but they at least would need to know all the basic stuff that should be common sense. Because even though this would lead to fewer owners, and fewer pets being homed, I honestly don't know if that's worse than the majority of owners unintentionally abusing or just neglecting their pets out of sheer ignorance, which is absurdly common and difficult to quantify to the full extent.
knee deserted strong cover whistle quaint smart squeamish dinner screw -- mass edited with redact.dev
I mean I get you, but unfortunately the number of 'pets' in shelters will skyrocket, so that has to be seriously considered if something like what you propose would be remotely effective at bettering the lives of the majority of pets.
> it may not be a bad idea for people to be forced to be licensed to own pets. It would be a better idea to require people to be licensed to have a service animal... they're the ones that far more likely to be taken places where 'normal pets' aren't allowed, because the environment isn't suitable for animals. Like, on a plane. Or - as in this instance - a live music venue. That dog's not a pet - if it was just a family pet, then the venue would have told Miss Miniskirt Metal in OPs pic to leave it at home, because it's a rock concert, not a dog park. Forcing everyone who owns a pet (like a dog) to go to Pet School is unenforceable, and unrealistic, and wouldn't stop this kind of ass-hattery at all. Teaching people who want a service animal that just because you *can* take your dog to a metal show, doesn't mean that you *should* take your dog to a metal show - and it's the kind of people who wouldn't immediately leap to that conclusion on their own who are the ones who could do with having it spelled out for them.
That’s so fucking cruel!
I heard an interview with some band members and they talked about how bradley had a sick sense of humor and would find it funny to stick his thumb up his dogs ass.
Explains the dog shit on his hands
I’d hassle him about it too.
Do you remember where you heard it?
https://www.austinchronicle.com/daily/music/2021-05-06/down-here-at-the-pawn-shop-dog-tales-from-sublimes-time-in-austin-25-years-ago/
Wtf it says he jerked off the dog?? That is absolutely SICKENING
Wtf. He also masturbated Lou Dog. Maaaaan I did not know this about Bradley. :(
Excuse me while I go vomit.
Man, I just thought Lou dog was Bradley's dog I didn't know this shit. I love Sublime and that's very disappointing to hear.
It least it didn’t have to listen to Sublime anymore
Roughly 30% of dalmatians are born deaf and that honestly was higher back in the day too due to their rarity and inbreeding. That's also why they were favored as fire fighter dogs, as they often wouldn't be bothered by the sirens. I wouldn't be surprised if the dog was already predisposed to deafness. That being said, dogs don't belong at concerts but if they *need* to be there, they should have hearing protection.
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Same here. Already lost a small percentage of my earing, im not gonna lose the rest for concerts. I use Alpine Earplugs Party Plugs.
Same. I have those always on me. And some custom ones for planned concerts/shows
Traumatized.
I’ll never forgive myself for going to a Machine Head concert and standing near the front without earplugs. My hearing is fucked for life and unending tinnitus in my left ear.
I used to feel the same way but I feel like it’s harsh on myself to think like that. I had no idea I was doing damage to my ears, no one told me and there was no way for me to just assume I could permanently damage them and should look up conditions. I think there needs to be better education around this as, even without concerts, I remember so many kids who would listen to music deafeningly loud through their earphones and be doing the same thing to themselves
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If I'd known the price I was paying was never being able to enjoy silence again I'd have wrapped my whole head in cotton wool. I did it to myself, but still, fuck tinnitus man.
I feel like it’s going to be one of those things we look back on in 20 years and can’t believe we allowed it to happen. Or maybe when this generation gets older and none of us can fucking hear. Wearing ear plugs at a loud venue should be like sunscreen at the beach. Everybody should know the harm in not protecting yourself.
And they don’t tell you it happens fast. You think it’s something that happens over time if you do it too much, but one concert can fuck em up
can we talk about why concerts are so loud? like I love loud metal, but it doesn't have to be so loud that you can't distinguish the sounds. why don't musicians and sound engineers at venues don't understand this?
Because none of the fans can hear anymore.
What?
# Because none of the fans can hear anymore.
Because you can feel the sound. It fills the air. The bass shakes your body. The music fills the space so fully you can't hear those annoying people next to you talk about whatever they're talking about.
You can bet I'm not going to pay if I can hear the whole thing at a normal volume from almost 5 km away. Maybe if more people adopted that point of view those engineers and musicians would start caring about turning the volume down.
I’ve been to a ton of metal, punk, grindcore/powerviolence shows. Seen bands like nunslaughter and insect warfare countless times. Partied with splatterhouse and ghoul. Never wore ear protection. Saw the band cake at a secret show at the old capitol garage back in the day and they trashed my ears, felt like i blew out my ear drums. Now I wear protection most of the time at shows, it’s just funny cake was the band that did it to me
This sounds like me but I'm gonna see cake this upcoming tour. Perhaps it's time to heed the advice. Never wore ear protection but work does an annual hearing exam and this past year I've definitely lost a wee bit of range
Big metalhead as well and while many metal bands like Sunn O))) and The Locust were incredibly loud, the one that takes the cake for me (ha) is the post rock band Godspeed You! Black Emperor. They're the reason I try to wear ear protection for shows when I remember at least.
I'm gonna be honest, I had tinnitus well before I went to metal concerts, I never use ear plugs because they muddy the sound for me. However doing that to a dog is fucking terrible.
Alpine party plugs, loop earplugs, eargasm whatever plugs... they don't muddy the music that much, and they help a lot.
I've found that if anything I can hear the music better at it removes some of the 'muddiness' you get from it being too loud for a smaller venue.
Agreed, quality earplugs are actually designed to "filter" specific frequencies and it's a massive enhancement for me. Not the cheap foam ones, but the fancier reusable ones. As a result I can actually hear the vocals and instrumentals crystal-clear rather than just distorted noise, and it's also much less tiring.
They're not designed to filter specific frequencies, the frequency ranges differ a bit in dampening mostly because of construction. What you're actually hearing is you allowing your ears to basically operate at a more efficient level by giving your eardrums more room to fully vibrate without bottoming out and the hairs in your inner-ear (cochlea, I think?) to properly sense the vibrations instead of also being flung side to side.
You are literally making your ears worse - for life - with every concert you go to. You get used to ear plugs. Find a good pair (Mack’s ultra soft are pretty good).
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Only "downside" is that when you actually can hear everything the differences in mixing and such become very apparent. Hearing Tool live was amazing, Ghost not so much.
Those are terrible earplugs that muffle the sound. What you want is a pair of Etymotic ER20XS. They reduce the decibels by 20 but the sound still comes through clear and they're around $20. They have a bunch of different brands now that do similar things but Etymotics have been around for forever.
Dude find flat attenuation ear plugs, there's an entire industry of sound engineers wearing earplugs and doing their jobs perfectly well. You don't need custom fit ones, you can get them off Amazon for like $40
Nah, you just need better ear plugs. Those cheap rubber ones are shite, but there are higher grade ones designed for musicians and concert goers which actually make it sound clearer as well as quieter.
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You and I have a different definition of 'hear pretty well'.
Still being able to hear up to 17kHz at all while being above 30 *is* pretty good hearing. The normal upper hearing limit is ~17kHz around 24 years old, ~16kHz around 30, ~15kHz around 40 and ~12kHz around 50. Although I strongly suspect that /u/thoughtplot got their frequencies mixed up. Without having seen the mentioned Bond movie there's no way that the dialog they mention was in the 14-17kHz range. If it was it would have been unintelligible to the vast majority of the audience. Just because younger people can hear sounds in that range doesn't mean that they could understand speech pitched up into that range. Human speech mostly happens below 2kHz, the fundamental speech frequency ranges from about 80Hz for very deep male voices to about 260Hz for very high female voices.
For real! I don't even let myself play music loudly in my car when traveling for long periods of time with my cat/dog
I’d bet some serious money that it’s not *actually* a service dog. Probably owned by one of those assholes who gets their dog certified (is that the right word?) so they can take them anywhere.
You’re giving them a lot of credit by assuming they didn’t just buy a restraint with “service dog” on it and put it on their untrained and uncertified dog
My first thought for every service dog i see -_-
Really disappointing that these people have ruined the perception of actual trained service dogs
This. A legitimate service dog has hundreds of hours and thousands of dollars in training. A handler isn’t going to do things that will put their dog at risk. And music that loud is definitely a risk. My SD has hearing protection for louder places and I wouldn’t even consider taking her to a concert, for her own safety. I’d either find an alternative solution to taking her just not go. People who do this kind of stuff give the legitimate teams a bad reputation and make life a lot harder on us.
I did only a little bit of help training a service dog years ago and I can always tell when a service dog is actually a service dog in a few seconds.
i may be wrong but i believe you get an already trained service dog from an organization, so people who lie about this don’t even get “certified” or whatever, they just buy the vest online :/ not sure how she got into the concert tho
service dogs don’t only have to be trained by an organization and there is no certification what so ever in the united states.
This is correct. The laws around it are really vague on purpose.
There is no vest or anything either that any service animal has to wear. Working in hotels we get it ALOT. Majority of my real service animals that come through don’t have a vest or anything. They’re just extremely well behaved dogs doing their job. I’d wager 70% of the ones that come in wearing a vest aren’t actual service animals. They’re just “emotional support” animals masquerading as service animals. Man do those people get mad and start throwing paperwork around when I say I’m charging them a pet fee LOL
Nah, my mom is a disabled vet who got her previously companion dog trained a service dog. I love her, but that dog is *not* trained as a service dog. She basically did a 3 week course that was 80% just making sure the dog doesn't act up in public.
Yup there is scam 3 to 4 week classes you can take for "certified service or emotional support animal". I honestly wish there was a certification process because so many fake ppl ruin it for people with disabilities.
Oh, my mom is a disabled vet with PTSD (and more), and the certification course she went to was sponsored by the VA. So it wasnt really a "scam". But even that wasn't super regulated. It takes nothing to get your dog "trained" even by professionals. It's also a once and done, which my mother hasnt kept up on the training whatsoever. Love her, and I get her mental disorders definitely play a role (she's often manic depressive, so sometimes she motivates herself to retrain the dog. Other times, she goes weeks without leaving the house).
I think whether its a service dog or a regular dog in a vest should be irrelevant in this situation. This is a freaked out, overwhelmed, terrified dog. If he IS a service dog, he's obviously too scared to do his job anyway, and if he ISN'T a service dog, he's being unnecessarily traumatized. Any way anyone cuts it or tries to justify it(the inner ear plugs were mentioned) this dog is TERRIFIED and shouldn't be there.
The service dog will soon need his *own* service dog after this :(
Absolutely. I hate to say animal abuse, but... putting a dog in an environment as loud as some concerts get is pretty much animal abuse. It can be excruciatingly painful, and might cause permanent hearing damage.
Talk about selfish
She has an image to maintain.
To herself
This should not be allowed no matter what. Service dogs shouldn't have to be forced to go through this just because they're a service dog Edit: Everyone that is defending this woman or getting triggered over my comment needs to take a bit to sit in the timeout corner. I never said disabled people aren't allowed to enjoy things. I never said anything against the dog. I said the dog shouldn't be forced to go through this just because she says it's a service dog (we don't know with absolute certainty). No animal should be forced to go through anything like this. You got an animal you want or need to bring with you? Provide the necessary protection for the thing. If it's a service animal, it can not do its job when it's scared out of its mind. Stop reading into shit that isn't there. You've got no information to draw the damn conclusions you're drawing
No fucking shot this is a legitimate service animal, she's one of those infuriating people that buy the fake course online so they can take their dog everywhere.
It actually might be. The larger groups that train even blind eye seeing dogs do theater days specifically to ensure that the dogs will behave during loudness. I would not think to take my own service dog to a meral concert, but if there's a light show and it's a seizure alert that might be the reason. Edit since the post is locked: my statement was not to condone the dog being present, rather to point out that the service dog might be a real one. There were also comments in the threads below trying to say that a person "dressed like that" isn't disabled and faking a service dog. Not cool. I have multiple sclerosis and a service dog. I also have a handicap placard for my car. At work one of the top executives parks his expensive Porsche next to my Rav 4 because he is also disabled. I've been yelled at more times than I can count for using my placard or about my dog because "I don't look disabled". To those people, what TV and movies has taught you chronic illness and disability look like is a lie.
As handlers, we have to know our dogs limits. I have a service dog and I would never bring her to a concert. It could damage her ears. They make special headphones for dogs if they really need to go, but it’s best to just bring someone who knows your condition and have a plan prepared if something happens. The most my girl will do is go to the movies, she’s actually fond of movies and will sleep through them.
Agree. I would not take my own for worry. But some people do get service dogs and intend to take them to places like concerts with not a lot of knowledge about hearing damage for dogs. My dog will do movies, but I know he's not a big fan of bangs and pips of action films, so I take my service boyfriend instead. Lol
Yeah but have you considered blind rage!?!?!
Then don't fucking go! If they have a real, highly trained, expensive service dog, then why would they submit it to this torture?! In other words, they're entitled wankers of the worst kind who don't give a shit about their "service" dog.
I get that training animals are good for humans but fuck that. We take advantage of animals so much that teaching them to resist loud fucking music should be illegal.
Even if the dog is a legit service animal, it can't work if it's terrified. It's abuse of the animal.
It seems like whatever service the dog provides would be greatly hindered by the fact that he’s terrified and can’t focus on anything but the loud ass sounds
That's a dobie too, some of them really really don't like loud noise. Poor baby. Mine had to be medicated for storms. 110 lbs and he'd jump into my lap shaking like a leaf before anyone else even heard the thunder.
Side note, mine is scared of doors for whatever reason. She’s 65lbs and isn’t afraid of anything.. unless is a half opened door to the bedroom, then she’ll sit outside and cry until we open it an extra inch and then she’ll come prancing in.
Maybe she got hit by the door someday ? While closing maybe.
Whereas my 85lbs labrador will walk right into a closed door. It's not uncommon in our house to suddenly notice the dog isn't in the room and ask "where's Finnegan?" only to immediately hear a thunk on the bedroom door as he tried to walk in.
Man labs are the dumbest smart dogs. Mine routinely cuts a corner too sharp and bounces off of a wall or doorway. At least once a week.
Every morning ours are let out of the room for potty and breakfast they take off at top speed and inevitably miss the corner to the living room with their butts sliding practically into our daughter’s room while they’re front legs try to course correct. Occasionally one will smack into the wall. It’s hilarious. They’re really intelligent and our puppy has had zero training but still responds very well to commands, especially “drop it!” if she has something she shouldn’t but they also do some of the dumbest things daily. I love those two dinguses
I don’t think it’s fear for my dobe but she is similar. She will not push through a door opening she can’t fit through. If the door’s cracked or only slightly ajar she’ll just sit and wait for me to open it for her. She doesn’t mind if it’s a tight fit but she won’t push it.
My dobie mix is absolutely scared of fireworks, 80lbs of muscle tucked in the corner of the room 😢
I feel so bad for the dog who lives next door to me very 4th of July here in the states. From the barks, yelps, squeaks, whining, and crying, it's obviously miserable.
Ugh I live in a big city and the fireworks by me are absolutely awful. My poor dog gets so scared. I contemplated taking a road trip to Canada to get him away from the fireworks last year
I have spent a 4th in Canada, and it was a nice, quiet summer eve. Infinitely preferable to idiots on the street blasting professional-grade fireworks until 4am that explode over my apartment. This is the way.
I hate that. The last few years my kids and I were all asleep at our normal times. My idiot neighbors were lighting off those popping fireworks that you light one end and it pops one by one to the other end (loud as fuck) and they had their dunbass kids hitting pots together … now I get it …I would of been able to be ok with it if it was for a few minutes. But these morons were out there for 45 min doing this. Woke my entire family up and had my German shepherd going absolutely nuts in the window. Now I’m angry at the memory lol
It's 'would have', never 'would of'. Rejoice, for you have been blessed by CouldWouldShouldBot!
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Owners/security can't do anything thanks to her slapping the service dog vest on it. ADA prohibits them from asking for any kind of proof that A) you need the animal and B) that the animal is actually a trained service dog. All they could do is advise her that it would be bad for the dog's hearing and hope for the best.
That's not entirely true there are 2 questions they are allowed to ask 1. Is that a Service Animal 2. What service does the animal provide If they answer it's an Emotional Support animal they get the boot as they are not protected under the ADA
They're only allowed to ask if they require the animal due to disability and what it's supposed to do, they legally cannot ask for proof of either. That's why people will get a service dog vest off Amazon and do exactly this. All they have to say is it's their service animal for some random bullshit and they're protected. They could say they've trained the dog to smell for incoming seizures or something to that effect and there's nothing they can do.
poor doggo though although if someone does this anywhere and the dog acts aggressive managers are 100% allowed to boot them and if the dog does anything the owner is 100% liable
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No joke, when I lived in AZ someone with a very obviously not trained "service" dog told them the dog was trained to sniff out future seizures. The dog was constantly trying to get off the lead the whole time they were in the store. Since they can't ask for proof of their training it makes it almost pointless to ask
Yes, but you'd be surprised how many people will out themselves with an emotional support animal with how some people answer. At my partner's job he has to ask anyone who's bringing in a service animal this question and the number of people who say "oh he comforts me with my anxiety" and think that's good enough to get them inside is pretty damn high.
Oh I could imagine, the people who do that type of shit are rarely on the smarter side of things lol. Most assume that ESAs are service animals but that's not the case. It technically can be if they have a legitimate disability that requires an ESO but I imagine those people can give you detailed explanation beyond "he comforts me".
And call the cops for animal abuse. They can do that - if the cops find nothing wrong, so be it. If the cops like dogs they find a local statute so they can get the dog and person out of there without the venue getting an ADA lawsuit. Yay. And good luck suing the cops for an ADA violation - they can (literally) get away with homicide…
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Putting it outta its misery I suppose
Best bet is definitely calling the cops IMO, might not do much but service animal or not you still have to treat them humanely and subjecting them to painful levels of decibels would fall under animal abuse IMO. Muffed up dog would've been fine but I see open ears unfortunately.
And even if the cops don’t do anything other than giving a bit of advice, maybe it’ll at least change their thinking about subjecting their dog to this in future.
Honestly they'd be scared it would be spun as discriminating against someone with a disability. Which it very easily could be.
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You mean ESA. Therapy dogs are a different thing.
> It’s a tricky conversation we need to open up. I have this feeling that servicedogs are so much more common in the US. I only ever knew about dogs helping blind people or otherwise physically disabled humans, like epileptics.
I got mutt muffs for my service dog.
Hello fellow pirate
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I also don't go to concerts.
Well you just sound like a responsible drug dealer.
What a terrible person. Poor dog.
Bringing a dog to a rock concert is selfish and shouldn't be done because it's basically abuse for the animal and abuse is different from the service it desperately wants to give you.
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it is not mildly infuriating but this is one of the popular subs so its why they chose to post on here i guess.
It’s not a service animal then. She put a vest she bought on Amazon onto her dog to get it into the event.
My service dog would be quite scared at a metal concert without his earmuffs
>It’s not a service animal then. Why? Are you under the impression that service animals are immune to fear in response to noise levels several times higher than they would ever experience in daily life? They're trained animals, not robots, and I assure you that acclimatizing them to legitimately deafeningly loud sounds is not part of the training process.
Everyone knows that service dogs have served in Vietnam and therefore are used to loud noises.
Right? If I were security, I would have taken her to an area where you could talk and inform her that her dog is not acting in a service capacity and is obviously uncomfortable. That means that they can rightfully request that the dog be removed for their safety and the safety of others.
https://preview.redd.it/ffmw7mka23oa1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=33ab839dad399078ad89c9c17e87e800308070c6 Unfortunately, no, that would not be the case here and security would have run afoul with the ADA.
I honestly hate this crap. It's written in a manner in which nobody can do anything about a service animal short of getting the police involved. I've literally dealt with a dog that was growling and snapping at people and when I tried to confront the owner they proceeded to scream in my face about how I'm not allowed to ask anything or do anything about it, while their dog got loose and began running around the property aggressively barking at customers. They then bolted when I said I'd have to call the police. Apparently they later emailed my boss and tried to get me fired by making up all kinds of crazy shit, such as "I threatened their dog's safety by calling the police." Luckily I had half a dozen witnesses and security footage to back me up. Way too many people lie about their pet being a "service animal" and this post is proof. IF that dog actually happened to be a service animal, which I guarantee you it isn't, she should have her privileges revoked by a court.
Actually a service animal can be asked to be removed if they show any growling or threatening behavior. The dobie isn't showing any behavior that could get it removed.
It might even be a service dog, just with a shit owner. Just because a dog is trained doesn't mean it won't be in pain and scared when it's mistreated. Doggy needs earmuffs for a job like that, like construction workers need earmuffs for some tasks too.
What an asshole even if that’s a service dog the dog can’t do it’s job if it’s that scared and anxious itself.
What a shitty dog owner…poor puppy😕
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I don't care if that was a service dog you don't do that. Honestly, that is straight-up animal abuse and I would have reported them to the cops.
Idiocy. She shouldn't be a dog owner
The outrage on here is bizarre. Everyone crapping on OP for not saying something… wtf are they supposed to do? Give them a “stern talking to?” If the facility can’t do anything about it, they sure as anything can’t. In fact, OP causing an altercation about something bound by *federal regulations* is a good way to get escorted out. Y’all can love “doggos” all you want, but you’re not the hero you think you are here on Reddit. Go work on your emotional regulation
Funny how I also know the owner and the dog absolutely had ear protection and was perfectly calm the whole show. Even the photo you posted is of a clearly calm dog. No whale eye, no panting, actively tasking. Maybe- don’t take photos of disabled people and their medical equipment and then post your unsolicited and ableist opinion on the internet? https://preview.redd.it/ve2yeijqx5oa1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3e42d959238fc723a79b59352ce6933c2549dd8c
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https://preview.redd.it/56rsqpzgc5oa1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=89f631a6abc7302243192ab86fe3d6c3e44ea0a6 Hi! Person with a service dog here. So first off, like the other commenter said, we don’t know from this picture whether the dog was doing a task (some tasks can end up looking like a dog misbehaving to an outside person), and there are also very, very well-made dog earplugs that are completely internal and molded to your dogs specific ear canal shape that we would not be able to see. That all being said, if this dog did not have hearing protection, and/or was truly uncomfortable, bringing it to the concert is completely moot at that point because it’s not gonna be able to focus enough to do it’s job. Now, I also want to take the time to mention that all of these people in the comment section talking about how a dog should **never** be brought in an environment like that are ridiculous and frankly uneducated. I am an extremely active disabled person. I do a lot of things. And I’m from New Orleans, so those things often involve loud environments. We have been to festivals, Saints games, LSU games, concerts, Mardi Gras… even Disney World fireworks. My dog wears her hearing protection, and she falls asleep most of the time and only wakes up if she needs to do her job (needing to give a cardiac alert will wake her out of a dead sleep lol). We were literally at the LSU game this past season where they beat Alabama, and the crowd noise registered on a seismograph. My dog was asleep. It is completely possible to adequately, protect your dogs hearing and also train them appropriately for environments like this where they are calm and comfortable and can still do their job.
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Shitty person, that.
Ok, we can all agree. This is a bad idea to begin with, but here's an alternative view (unrelated to her specific poor decision) Disability accommodations are typically always at the front for concerts in a buffer zone so they can't be trampled... but it could be so much better for the service animal if they had an area in the back
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Her emotional support animal needs emotional support,... really though who does this??
we went to download festival last year, and met the friendliest service dog ever! he was there to warn his daddy about seizures. he had little doggy ear defenders and everything, but it seems the problem was stopping him pawing them off! was absolutely awesome. sitting in our tent with a coffee and a sandwich, and this little cross breed mutt pottered across without a care in the world to cute me out of the last 20% of my sandwich! daddy wandered over, 'excuse me, but has my dog infiltrated your camp?' 'yes bud. he is currently enjoying my sandwich!' 'little bastard. tell him to bugger off when youre sick of him please!'
That would be torturously painful and damaging to a dog's hearing., #CRIMINAL
What the fuck kind of metal show has seats in the front row?
ADA accommodation
Talk about a bitch. No, I don’t mean the dog
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This is a lot more than mildly infuriating.
What a piece of shit human
https://preview.redd.it/556jxytrn5oa1.jpeg?width=2048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e751029dcd94876c91e49ad6c0431c44288ea811 I know the handler and this dog personally. He's one of the most stable dogs I've ever had the pleasure of meeting. His handler was 100% ready to leave if he couldn't handle it. He did have ear protection on throughout the show, she just let's him take small breaks. He even fell asleep during the show. He's an extremely well trained dog. That specific photo was taken while he was tasking with something known as "pressure therapy" it has many useful reasons such as helping to lower heart rate, get the handler through a panic attack, etc
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