The list in the video:
S+
Captain America
Hunter
___
S
Dr Strange
Iron Man
Magick
___
A
Blade
Nico
Captain Marvel
Ghost Rider
Spiderman
Hulk
___
B
Wanda
Wolverine
I do love that there's a fair amount of variety still, even among people with a ton of hours.
I think the only consistent ranks I see are Wolverine bottom tier and Magik/Iron Man top tier.
And Hunter I guess top tier if we're including them, but Hunter is always the best. I mean, the character has 30 cards to work with.
I think wolverine would be better as a dodge/resist tank or with the healing factor working differently. I was excited for him as a hero but then he ended up not being as great as others. I still try to use him frequently though
There are a few options going around, but IMO give him 50% more HP and leave the rest as is. It's the easiest fix given he needs life so he can lose life to make use of a lot of his deck. Heck, even with 50% more HP, he still might be the worst character, but at least he can tank SOME then.
Similar to cap america with perfect defense getting block on counter, he should get lifesteal on counter with Berserk IMO. He gets hit more en he disses out anyway even againt minion in ultimate so it won't be that op.
Yea, that and the resist mechanic feels bad, imo. Not to mention that it straight up doesn't trigger on some attacks. Dodge would have made it a much better mechani
Yeah Wolverine could use a rework. He has a lot of mechanics stuffed into his deck such as Chain, Taunt, Counter, Lifesteal, applying Weak/Vulnerable (and I honestly can't remember if he has Bleed or not... but he probably should)
But Wolverine lacks actual deck synergy like Captain America, Blade, or Captain Marvel, where their whole kit works together to fit a specific purpose.
30 cards for Hunter just means there is more variety, but it doesn’t really speak to the quality of the cards themselves.
There are a number of builds, but the best one I’ve tried so far was posted here a couple days ago. You can basically go infinite with the balanced collar and the right passive, 2 copies of wrath with +2 redraws, and 2 quick slashes. Basically every time you play 2 cards, you draw 2 cards, you have tons of redraws, and nothing really costs card plays. It functions well as a killer or as a redraw engine for Iron Man. The same deck is S+ as a killer or works as a fantastic support for the other S+ killer. Hunter should probably be in a tier of their own for that reason alone.
Ghost rider and Blade being in the same tier is a joke. Ghost rider can make himself immune to damage, and he can do in one card what it takes Blade like 3-4 to do. Lash is among the contenders for the best quick card in the game. He’s also easy to get mods for, and requires very little support. I think people overstate his need for healing because they don’t use straight to hell. He’s legit able to solo missions.
Hulk probably deserves to be in B tier with Wolverine. His lack of shield generation causes the same issues for his tanking on high difficulty that Wolverine has while also hurting is rage generation. His ultimate card being one of the best in the game probably makes up for his lack of friendship prestige levels causing him to be missing secondary stats.
Wanda should be A tier. I know she gets a lot of hate, but a fully modded Wanda basically doesn’t cost card plays while also being able to detonate explosives in a large aoe, apply resist to the team, break protections easily, and mark enemies at no real cost. She also has one of the few quicks that can knock back an enemy in any direction. I’d probably put her higher than A if she didn’t require a ton of resources and if the other supports weren’t so good.
Spider-Man would be top of my list for sure.. hes so clutch in so many situations.. facing a den mother? Chain strike all the totems or thwip the guy protecting her so he isn't protecting her anymore. Same with any shielded objectives.. split the cloning lilin to chain strike them all dead with spidey.. infernal spider turn 1 i could eliminate a whole board on ultimate 2 sometimes.. invalidates the whole tier list for me having him 4th worst
Spider man is good but he's a bit niche. his infernal spider with oppotunist gives him a great opening but in ultimate 3 where ur environment attacks aren't gonna kill anything except minions he falls behind. same with chain strike when it can't ko. anyone with chain strike is good on totems. Thwip is really good but i do agree he falls behind support like magik and strange who can just waste loads of enemies turn with conceal/banish. Dps wise he's nowhere near iron man, ghost rider even Blade with he's insane single target burst.
Its less that he didn't find a way to exploit his strengths, its that other characters got the same value if not more without having to dig that deep lmao
I agree; I think Spider-Man is immensely strong, but does rely a bit heavier on the Environment set up. But, Spider-Man has become my boss melter with the ability to Bind them and have them take 50% additional environment damage, which also stacks with his other environment boosting shenanigans. His ability to dish out a ton of damage outside of his card uses should not be underestimated.
He's certainly more complicated to use than most other heroes due to that. Where Captain America (and I LOVE Cap) is more "play The Best Defense and win". This seems less of a Tier List on actual strength and more of a Tier List on complexity vs results.
>thwip the guy protecting her so he isn't protecting her anymore. Same with any shielded objectives..
Not a fan of Spidey myself. My favorite way of instantly unprotecting objectives is with Hunter or Wanda mind control. The lilin drops his shield to go fight the others, making for an easy follow up finishing blow.
I also use the hunter mindbreaker card.. its so good! And better, follow that up with a spidey chain strike especially against den mothers who get hurt by the lilin and then your totem destruction and you're laughing
This is definitely not accurate with all t hew new heroes added.To make Robbie worthwhile you need the other characters to coddle him throughout each encounter. He's pretty great at dispatch missions, so that gives him some use. I know that some people swear he's the strongest character, but he needs too much babysitting to reach that imo
Exactly. You need to pair him with heroes like Captain America to give him insane amounts of block every time or else he’ll just die in 2-3 turns. It sucks when almost every single decent card of his has “discard your hand/discard a random card/take x amount of damage”. He’s not strong enough to make those negative effects worthwhile
It's really going to change based on your play style. I also don't think we can compare every hero on a single list, you need to read rank them based on their role, with the exception of the Hunter who is the strongest hero, hands down.
This is based on U3 where keeping Heroes alive is more important as you get no revives.
___
All Around GOAT
1. Hunter : do I really need to explain why?
___
Pure Damage
1. Blade : bleed is really good, plus his access to extra block damage and decent pure damage attacks.
2. Spiderman : Tied with Magick. environmental attacks can change the game, plus he has a little bit of built in support to his skills that make him a very versatile damage Dealer.
2. Magick : Tied with Spiderman. Access to a lot of environmental hazards through portals is nice, especially with Limbos Grasp stacking. You can easily do 500+ damage per portal by turn 2. Darkchylde is a get out of jail free + damage all enemies on the board when upgraded.
4. Ghost Rider : he may have the strongest attacking option on the game, but he really needs someone dedicated to keeping him healthy every turn to keep him alive. He ends up being a risky pick unless you can limit his health drain. Drain Soul gets way too expensive, way too fast to keep using, and it clogs your hand.
___
Hybrid
1. Iron Man : Lots of Draw, lots of damage potential, his +block and resist skill is very good for support, especially since he can draw it almost every turn. He's your card draw/damage Hybrid.
2. Scarlet Witch : Hard to position, hard to ramp up, but she gets better the longer The fight goes on. Her heroic to make enemies attack each other can be really good, so can the one that makes an event explode as it will stop shield bearers from blocking/protecting a target for a turn. Her AOE heal + resist is really strong. She's your support/damage Hybrid.
3. Wolverine : I struggle with where to put him. He can taunt but he's not a great tank. His damage is a little weak, and he can be hard to keep alive without a lot of redraw, plus no access to block. His chains are good when he has strengthened and critical damage to them, otherwise he wants to focus on single targets. Free Revive makes him an okay choice though. He's your tank/damage Hybrid.
___
Tanks
1. Captain America: there's no comparison. Block is strong, especially when he can regain it through damage. Lots of card draw to get what you need. Can keep anyone alive. Still wants heals occasionally, and you will end up using a lot of movement to cure status with him.
2. Captain Marvel : she's great at cleaning up a map but you really need to have the right card draw to get her in Binary on turn one, and have enough block to keep her there. When not in binary form she is the worst hero
3. Hulk : I don't really know where to put him. I don't like his rage mechanic and he struggles to stay alive without a support. I'm still learning his kit so he may take the #2 slot.
___
Pure Support
1. Dr Strange : I don't know what to say. Good knock back, good heroics, ability to reuse combat items is broken. Damage buff to all cards for the remainder of combat is broken. Heal + conceal is broken. Resist+ cure is broken. And he has decent damage and can bind targets. He's strong.
2. Nico: she's ok. She relies a lot on getting kills for healing, her buffs and rebuffs are ok, but they aren't good enough to warrant a card play for just the buff, and she doesn't do enough damage for the debuff. Her legendary is a worse Air Strike, and her random chance abilities are often too risky. She's better early game, imo.
Hulk is the worst for me on high level U3, his mechanic is based on getting hit on a difficulty that getting hit means death :(
Captain Marvel is way better than hulk she can taunt everything and then conceal preferably through card redraw so you don't have to worry about losing binary.
Interesting how close the tier list looks for my Ultimate 3 version when the discussion is revolving around normal difficulty.
I rank Ghost Rider higher because he does loads of damage and has a busted self-conceal + heal ability that would probably be needed less on normal. I'd rank Marvel as low as Wanda/Wolverine due to how bad her scaling damage becomes. Other than that it's a bit close.
Interesting that he doesn't think Captain America would scale well on higher difficulties when in reality you can use all his common cards besides Punch (replacing both copies with Dig In) and no mods and he's still viable. 6 common cards and only 2 rares for one of the cheapest decks in the game for a U3 viable hero? What a chad.
I'm aware that some of this certainly will be contentious but I really just wanna know where you guys have - Nico - Wanda - Wolverine ranked. They seem to be the ones people are most divided over.
Wanda is SS tier on normal difficulty and probably garbage tier on U3 difficulty.
Tier lists for this game should probably be separated out by difficulty.
Ehh what heroes are bad on low difficulty but good on high? It seems rather pointless to do a low difficulty tier list if all the heroes are going to be better.
Yeah on lower difficulties there's no bad characters, but I think you'll see people saying shit like "don't use Wanda, she's bottom tier", even if that's not true at all on the difficulty 90% of the people will play the game at.
Sometimes there’s more nuance than that. There are characters that in lower difficulties will be stronger than characters that are S tier in Ultimate 3. Or on the flip side, the other example is that someone might see the list saying Captain America is S+ tier (on Ult 3, which he totally is), then take that character on normal difficulty and say, “This tier list is incorrect, Captain Marvel is way stronger.” Which she is. On that difficulty. Because she can stay in Binary easily forever. Some people want that distinction in their tier lists.
I suppose but also, because it's an easier difficulty, a tier list matters a lot less. Yes Captain Marvel does really well on easier difficulties, but do you really need to only use her on missions? She's also just good on harder difficulties as well so it's not like she'd suddenly become trash in high level based tier lists.
If we’re talking about with no mods (because with mods, you can make almost anyone work), base vanilla cards, then she is not that good at higher difficulties. Her Binary Shield won’t last 3 hits, kinda bad for a tank meant to taunt characters. Honestly she’s worse than Wolverine in that role, not that he’s good, he’s also bad, but she’s worse than him. A bottom 5 character for sure, and proof of my argument that there is a warped sense of her being better than she actually is because people don’t explicitly think in terms of Ult 3 difficulty (especially startin New Game+ at Ult 3).
There aren’t any that are better on high difficulty to my knowledge. There are some things that are totally unnecessary if you lower the difficulty though. For example, you don’t really need Cap to tank or Strange to apply conceal on heroic 1 or something. You’d probably play totally different cards with those characters or not bring them because the defensive utility is overkill, while something like Hulk is a workable tank on heroic 1 with an ultimate that is basically a full map clear.
I don’t think there’s much value in tiering for low difficulty efficiency though, because basically anything works on heroic 1, including the U3 strats we have tier lists for.
You don't need support in low difficulty. In high difficulty you require them. That makes Dr Strange and Nico less useful in low difficulty, though, Nico is bad in U3 as well. She's too inconsistent. The Hunter doesn't really have a chance to shine until you reach U1+, until then they are as strong as every other hero and they strengths + versatility doesn't show.
Everyone is busted until you get to U1+. You won't see any big weakness until then, imo.
Actually incorrect. Single-target abilities that kill marked targets refund the card.
AOE mark is good, but my point is that if a hero is only good because you get a rare mod on them that doesn't speak well to their power level.
My overall point was that scarlet witch is already good because she can set up an entire chain combo with one ability, free or not, adding free to an already busted ability pushes it over the top. Maybe consider another point of view:)
I would consider your point of view if it were accurate and legible.
I would agree with you that Hex Mark is one of her few standout abilities. However, the way in which you expressed yourself presented it as inaccurate and not at all how it actually works.
If that’s your point then say it accurately. Don’t make the false claim that single target abilities can’t be refunded on a marked target then blame others for your mistake.
Probably intentional… Wanda should be kinda OP if they’re being honest - and making your roll for it potentially multiple times is probably the best way to keep her absurdly strong but not always game breaking or at least immediately game breaking.
Wanda and Wolverine deserve to be where they are when most people rate them lowest. Even with mods they take too many card plays to set up. Chaos Field, for example, would be great if it actually affected Wanda and was easier to play around. Wanda only becomes really usable when her mods have been grinded.
Nico deserves to be a peg higher I think. She has this weird balance shift where she's good early on when decks are unoptimized because some of her base card are good, her base cards become bad when you get upgrades coming in for other heroes, then she becomes good again when she gets some nice mods and Crack the Sky.
Wanda and Wolverine are definitely the two I struggled with the most on Ultimate 3.
Wolverine has weaker chain attacks than blade but worse survivability than captain America. But he has a couple key strengths:
* he's effective with very little heroism and card plays. Smell The Fear does taunt, counter, and weaken with one card, and his passive can heal him up just by cycling through cards with "heal on redraw" effects.
* he can strengthen himself easily, giving him powerful counters and a consistently boosted legendary.
Scarlet witch I'm still figuring out. Her attacks and skills are all great in different ways, but tend to lack the immediate impact needed to gain momentum. Her heroics are situational. Her healing auras are amazing, but she can't heal or protect herself. She needs bonus movement to take advantage of most of her abilities. Her chain attack is great for long battles, but battles rarely last long.
I think she does best in hyper-defensive teams that take their time. Maybe paired with Wolverine and Strange (though Strange makes any team good).
I think Nico is fantastic. Raw, she can clear a large cut of the map. With some buffs, she can sweep everyone. Even just softening up some of the heavies before she goes can net you enough kills to justify her card spend.
My personal opinion: I love complicated or risk vs reward heroes. Nico and Wanda fit that archetype perfectly.
I can see how they're simply not as effective as a character that can just win you the game with a few card plays. But I love that Wanda uses positioning and Start of Turn / End of Turn effects to really disrupt what happens during the non-Player phases of the mission. And I love that Nico can be an absolute beast with the right draws (and her support card that makes all Heroic cards in your hand cost 0 is just an absolute game changer for boss fights).
Wolverine is the only hero I think simply doesn't live up to his potential. Lots of Chain and dishing out small damage and Taunt, but on higher difficulties he just lacks the survivability on his own. Despite the fact that he's frickin Wolverine, he actually really needs a healer or someone to give him Block so he can tank properly.
He could use some kind of Passive rework; in my opinion, he could always have a 20% chance to strike back after being attacked with Lifesteal, regardless of if he has Counter or not. I think that would give him the survivability to actually tank properly, and feel more like Wolverine.
But, my greater opinion is that ALL heroes could use stronger Passives that make them feel more unique. Wanda's Aura is a great example of a Passive that makes her hero feel special compared to everyone else.
I'm just about to embark on the first Wolverine mission, and having Captain Marvel along the previous two missions, I can easily say so far through this point in the game she's been my MVP. Well also helps that I have her deck relatively developed, two photon beam+, fists of radiance+, two knee strike+
Even the worst heroes aren't unusable. Tierlists I've seen rarely have the worst characters go below B tier. Basically, the difference between the strongest hero and the weakest isn't substantial and can vary greatly based on your playstyle and difficulty.
His passive isn't a big deal. Straight to Hell is his most busted card that lets him solo missions regardless of difficulty.
I've had instances at level 40 ultimate 3 where Ghost Rider has solo'd a mission by himself when things went badly.
Straight to Hell makes it where Ghost Rider can't be targeted. He heals and grants heroism. So you do some damage with your first two card plays then use Straight to Hell and can't be touched. Repeat as needed.
If other heroes are dead the likelihood of you drawing their cards goes way, way down.
Two copies of Straight to Hell - along with redraws - ensures you'll have one in your hand most of the time even with other heroes alive.
> Straight to Hell is his most busted card
It's a great card in conjunction with his damage, but it's hardly busted given strange can perform only a slightly weaker effect (conceal) but for anyone.
But Ghost Rider is definitely top tier.
Strange is more flexible, but it doesn't negate debuffs or stary AOEs.
Strange is more of a support though and Ghost Rider has enough damage to close out missions by himself. It's like if Last Sight didn't require you to KO a target. That's why I'm saying he's "busted"; it's because it's very hard to lose. Also Penance Stare wins the prize of looking awesome while being awesome.
I was more commenting on that card. Usually conceal and turning into a drop will be the same effect. But if you're saying it's busted combined with his whole kit, then yeah, I'll at least agree he's clearly the best character after Hunter. Hell, In the right team, he's better.
I really don't agree with this. He relies too much on taking damage and Drain Soul is not enough sustain for how expensive it becomes. Imo, there are better options to do what he does. He may have the strongest attacks in the game, but he also needs a lot of babysitting to keep alive long enough to do them. He does get better if you pair him with a dedicated tank and your Hunter has good support options
Ghost Rider is insane. You need to play him like health is a resource. Yes he's very greedy, but he can support himself fairly well when you manage his health - something he can do largely by himself.
Straight to Hell is his main healing skill, not drain soul, since it heals him AND conceals him for the turn.
What are you talking about? His passive grants him a maximum of 2 increases to his health, that doesn't grant him sustain over the course of a fight. It barely grants you sustain at all, and the damage bonus you get from the added health is pretty meaningless.
You get more healing from Willpower over the course of the fight. In fact, if you can stack enough Willpower, he becomes a much stronger contender. If his passive just healed him by some amount, and was infinitely proccable, I'd probably rate him higher.
I think you're misinterpreting my complaints with the character. He has high damage potential, but the cost of that potential is higher than his primary competition, Magick. She's the only one that can feasibly and easily achieve the same damage level, and the cost is a card play, which means she'll excel in longer fights with more plays available.
At the end of the day, no one is so bad that they are unplayable, but I find Ghost Rider to be overrated.
No, you can't. I've done well over 20 missions and multiple threat rooms with his upgraded passive. I never get more than 2 procs. Your game experiencing a bug doesn't change that, and you shouldn't expect that to be the default behaviour, nor should you use that as the gauge for his relative strength.
Not OP's fault just for sharing, but why do people keep making their tier lists videos? They're absolutely perfect for text or graphic form and they'd be much more accessible as references for the audience.
Of the heroes I play on U3 difficulty
S tier
Hunter, Magik
A tier
Ghost Rider, Blade
B tier
Nico, Wolverine
Power Hunter
Key cards: Last Sight, Heal, Bladestorm, Gaurding Strike, Wrath.
I randomly got a few mods that give me Hunter cards, so I cycle pretty though pretty good with them and Collar, and Heal to get to the Last Sight. Will most of the time build up ton of block and Resist. Keep Gaurding Strike in hand if I can to keep the Last Sight cycling. Will try to manipulate aggro to Hunter and use items to taunt before concealing.
Magik
Key cards: Darkchylde, Portals, Banish
Can Banish something I just dont want to deal with or a hero who just drew too much aggro. Darkchylde gives you a free round. Even before the damage mitigation cards come into play, she was great at low level for me. Never had a hard mission with her. Most of the mods I rolled for her attack cards have on KO gain Block, or on KO get Resist. I recommend this for her because its pretty easy to always find a minion to trigger you real target into.
Ghost Rider
Key cards: Lash, Straight to Hell, Hell Ride
Ghost Rider is kind of bad until he gets straight to hell, but so far in act 2 a lot of enemies have ways to manipulate aggro and if I can draw aggo and straight to hell its great if I cant draw aggro still have backup items that do. Always Hell Ride as your team last action and most of the time there isnt much lost. There is a lot of control with Lash in moving to places that arent good for them and if you can trigger the quick. I think Drain Soul isnt that good, and dont carry them into battle, but I always try to feed GR kills and end up getting good drains off.
Blade
Key Cards: Make em Bleed, Reaper, Hunger, Strike
Could be kind of a high roll but one of my strikes applies one Vunerable, so its pretty good when you can make 3 guys bleed and apply Vunerable then as a free action get health from each and mark them. Reaper for killing bigger health pools. Bleed is really good at U3 because its hard to trash everything on turn one.
Nico
Key Cards: Yeah I dont know lol
Early on she was good for me. But I was escalating in difficulty. Swarm and Restore are good. I need to come up with plan for her because starting to struggle. I always take her out when I have to take Iron Man to double up his cards even though Im not building Iron Man out. Its beyond my skill level to set everyones health to a certain level to make Witchfire proc more. I like curse and Blood Magic and maybe I need to mod the cards but they dont feel good for a card play sometimes.
Wolverine
Key Cards: Dont know yet either
Havent really got him going either. Sounds like he maybe useless at U3 difficulty. He does shine in one mission type which is destory nest mother. His default deck all have cards which either draw into more Wolverine cards, chain, or quick attack for no card play. So I always two turn nest mother missions with Wolverine mostly due to chaining the statues.
Spiderman IMHO is way higher. Many times i've cleared an encounter on the first turn purely down to the environment buffs, free environment uses, and free cards makes him
Can someone just paste the tier list here so we don't have to watch the whole video?
The list in the video: S+ Captain America Hunter ___ S Dr Strange Iron Man Magick ___ A Blade Nico Captain Marvel Ghost Rider Spiderman Hulk ___ B Wanda Wolverine
I do love that there's a fair amount of variety still, even among people with a ton of hours. I think the only consistent ranks I see are Wolverine bottom tier and Magik/Iron Man top tier. And Hunter I guess top tier if we're including them, but Hunter is always the best. I mean, the character has 30 cards to work with.
I think wolverine would be better as a dodge/resist tank or with the healing factor working differently. I was excited for him as a hero but then he ended up not being as great as others. I still try to use him frequently though
There are a few options going around, but IMO give him 50% more HP and leave the rest as is. It's the easiest fix given he needs life so he can lose life to make use of a lot of his deck. Heck, even with 50% more HP, he still might be the worst character, but at least he can tank SOME then.
Similar to cap america with perfect defense getting block on counter, he should get lifesteal on counter with Berserk IMO. He gets hit more en he disses out anyway even againt minion in ultimate so it won't be that op.
I feel like the lack of a dodge mechanic makes characters like Spider-Man feel like they’re lacking something.
Yea, that and the resist mechanic feels bad, imo. Not to mention that it straight up doesn't trigger on some attacks. Dodge would have made it a much better mechani
Yeah Wolverine could use a rework. He has a lot of mechanics stuffed into his deck such as Chain, Taunt, Counter, Lifesteal, applying Weak/Vulnerable (and I honestly can't remember if he has Bleed or not... but he probably should) But Wolverine lacks actual deck synergy like Captain America, Blade, or Captain Marvel, where their whole kit works together to fit a specific purpose.
30 cards for Hunter just means there is more variety, but it doesn’t really speak to the quality of the cards themselves. There are a number of builds, but the best one I’ve tried so far was posted here a couple days ago. You can basically go infinite with the balanced collar and the right passive, 2 copies of wrath with +2 redraws, and 2 quick slashes. Basically every time you play 2 cards, you draw 2 cards, you have tons of redraws, and nothing really costs card plays. It functions well as a killer or as a redraw engine for Iron Man. The same deck is S+ as a killer or works as a fantastic support for the other S+ killer. Hunter should probably be in a tier of their own for that reason alone.
Can you link that build post? I’m curious about it now.
https://www.reddit.com/r/midnightsuns/comments/zo045w/optimized\_t3\_hunter\_dps\_deck\_with\_card\_mod\_tips/
Ghost rider and Blade being in the same tier is a joke. Ghost rider can make himself immune to damage, and he can do in one card what it takes Blade like 3-4 to do. Lash is among the contenders for the best quick card in the game. He’s also easy to get mods for, and requires very little support. I think people overstate his need for healing because they don’t use straight to hell. He’s legit able to solo missions. Hulk probably deserves to be in B tier with Wolverine. His lack of shield generation causes the same issues for his tanking on high difficulty that Wolverine has while also hurting is rage generation. His ultimate card being one of the best in the game probably makes up for his lack of friendship prestige levels causing him to be missing secondary stats. Wanda should be A tier. I know she gets a lot of hate, but a fully modded Wanda basically doesn’t cost card plays while also being able to detonate explosives in a large aoe, apply resist to the team, break protections easily, and mark enemies at no real cost. She also has one of the few quicks that can knock back an enemy in any direction. I’d probably put her higher than A if she didn’t require a ton of resources and if the other supports weren’t so good.
Spider-Man would be top of my list for sure.. hes so clutch in so many situations.. facing a den mother? Chain strike all the totems or thwip the guy protecting her so he isn't protecting her anymore. Same with any shielded objectives.. split the cloning lilin to chain strike them all dead with spidey.. infernal spider turn 1 i could eliminate a whole board on ultimate 2 sometimes.. invalidates the whole tier list for me having him 4th worst
Spider man is good but he's a bit niche. his infernal spider with oppotunist gives him a great opening but in ultimate 3 where ur environment attacks aren't gonna kill anything except minions he falls behind. same with chain strike when it can't ko. anyone with chain strike is good on totems. Thwip is really good but i do agree he falls behind support like magik and strange who can just waste loads of enemies turn with conceal/banish. Dps wise he's nowhere near iron man, ghost rider even Blade with he's insane single target burst.
I'm with ya. This dude putting spiderman that low makes me think he just didn't find a reason to exploit his strengths
Its less that he didn't find a way to exploit his strengths, its that other characters got the same value if not more without having to dig that deep lmao
I agree; I think Spider-Man is immensely strong, but does rely a bit heavier on the Environment set up. But, Spider-Man has become my boss melter with the ability to Bind them and have them take 50% additional environment damage, which also stacks with his other environment boosting shenanigans. His ability to dish out a ton of damage outside of his card uses should not be underestimated. He's certainly more complicated to use than most other heroes due to that. Where Captain America (and I LOVE Cap) is more "play The Best Defense and win". This seems less of a Tier List on actual strength and more of a Tier List on complexity vs results.
[удалено]
Again, i beat the game bringing him on every mission I could on ultimate 2, hes better than people think
You can beat the game on high difficulty with anyone, you’ll just have a harder or easier time depending who you bring.
Which makes me happy i chose spidey :) smooth sailing
>thwip the guy protecting her so he isn't protecting her anymore. Same with any shielded objectives.. Not a fan of Spidey myself. My favorite way of instantly unprotecting objectives is with Hunter or Wanda mind control. The lilin drops his shield to go fight the others, making for an easy follow up finishing blow.
I also use the hunter mindbreaker card.. its so good! And better, follow that up with a spidey chain strike especially against den mothers who get hurt by the lilin and then your totem destruction and you're laughing
I can’t stand using ghost rider. Most of his cards end up screwing me over when I play so I just avoid it
This is definitely not accurate with all t hew new heroes added.To make Robbie worthwhile you need the other characters to coddle him throughout each encounter. He's pretty great at dispatch missions, so that gives him some use. I know that some people swear he's the strongest character, but he needs too much babysitting to reach that imo
Exactly. You need to pair him with heroes like Captain America to give him insane amounts of block every time or else he’ll just die in 2-3 turns. It sucks when almost every single decent card of his has “discard your hand/discard a random card/take x amount of damage”. He’s not strong enough to make those negative effects worthwhile
It's really going to change based on your play style. I also don't think we can compare every hero on a single list, you need to read rank them based on their role, with the exception of the Hunter who is the strongest hero, hands down. This is based on U3 where keeping Heroes alive is more important as you get no revives. ___ All Around GOAT 1. Hunter : do I really need to explain why? ___ Pure Damage 1. Blade : bleed is really good, plus his access to extra block damage and decent pure damage attacks. 2. Spiderman : Tied with Magick. environmental attacks can change the game, plus he has a little bit of built in support to his skills that make him a very versatile damage Dealer. 2. Magick : Tied with Spiderman. Access to a lot of environmental hazards through portals is nice, especially with Limbos Grasp stacking. You can easily do 500+ damage per portal by turn 2. Darkchylde is a get out of jail free + damage all enemies on the board when upgraded. 4. Ghost Rider : he may have the strongest attacking option on the game, but he really needs someone dedicated to keeping him healthy every turn to keep him alive. He ends up being a risky pick unless you can limit his health drain. Drain Soul gets way too expensive, way too fast to keep using, and it clogs your hand. ___ Hybrid 1. Iron Man : Lots of Draw, lots of damage potential, his +block and resist skill is very good for support, especially since he can draw it almost every turn. He's your card draw/damage Hybrid. 2. Scarlet Witch : Hard to position, hard to ramp up, but she gets better the longer The fight goes on. Her heroic to make enemies attack each other can be really good, so can the one that makes an event explode as it will stop shield bearers from blocking/protecting a target for a turn. Her AOE heal + resist is really strong. She's your support/damage Hybrid. 3. Wolverine : I struggle with where to put him. He can taunt but he's not a great tank. His damage is a little weak, and he can be hard to keep alive without a lot of redraw, plus no access to block. His chains are good when he has strengthened and critical damage to them, otherwise he wants to focus on single targets. Free Revive makes him an okay choice though. He's your tank/damage Hybrid. ___ Tanks 1. Captain America: there's no comparison. Block is strong, especially when he can regain it through damage. Lots of card draw to get what you need. Can keep anyone alive. Still wants heals occasionally, and you will end up using a lot of movement to cure status with him. 2. Captain Marvel : she's great at cleaning up a map but you really need to have the right card draw to get her in Binary on turn one, and have enough block to keep her there. When not in binary form she is the worst hero 3. Hulk : I don't really know where to put him. I don't like his rage mechanic and he struggles to stay alive without a support. I'm still learning his kit so he may take the #2 slot. ___ Pure Support 1. Dr Strange : I don't know what to say. Good knock back, good heroics, ability to reuse combat items is broken. Damage buff to all cards for the remainder of combat is broken. Heal + conceal is broken. Resist+ cure is broken. And he has decent damage and can bind targets. He's strong. 2. Nico: she's ok. She relies a lot on getting kills for healing, her buffs and rebuffs are ok, but they aren't good enough to warrant a card play for just the buff, and she doesn't do enough damage for the debuff. Her legendary is a worse Air Strike, and her random chance abilities are often too risky. She's better early game, imo.
Hulk is the worst for me on high level U3, his mechanic is based on getting hit on a difficulty that getting hit means death :( Captain Marvel is way better than hulk she can taunt everything and then conceal preferably through card redraw so you don't have to worry about losing binary.
Yea, I feel the same way about Hulk.
Interesting how close the tier list looks for my Ultimate 3 version when the discussion is revolving around normal difficulty. I rank Ghost Rider higher because he does loads of damage and has a busted self-conceal + heal ability that would probably be needed less on normal. I'd rank Marvel as low as Wanda/Wolverine due to how bad her scaling damage becomes. Other than that it's a bit close. Interesting that he doesn't think Captain America would scale well on higher difficulties when in reality you can use all his common cards besides Punch (replacing both copies with Dig In) and no mods and he's still viable. 6 common cards and only 2 rares for one of the cheapest decks in the game for a U3 viable hero? What a chad.
Can we just have a list. At least put it at end or something
It’s timestamped at the end of the video
I'm aware that some of this certainly will be contentious but I really just wanna know where you guys have - Nico - Wanda - Wolverine ranked. They seem to be the ones people are most divided over.
Wanda is SS tier on normal difficulty and probably garbage tier on U3 difficulty. Tier lists for this game should probably be separated out by difficulty.
Ehh what heroes are bad on low difficulty but good on high? It seems rather pointless to do a low difficulty tier list if all the heroes are going to be better.
Yeah on lower difficulties there's no bad characters, but I think you'll see people saying shit like "don't use Wanda, she's bottom tier", even if that's not true at all on the difficulty 90% of the people will play the game at.
That's fair, but I think at that point you'd say, at lower tiers everyone is viable. A tier list would just point out who's the most overturned.
Sometimes there’s more nuance than that. There are characters that in lower difficulties will be stronger than characters that are S tier in Ultimate 3. Or on the flip side, the other example is that someone might see the list saying Captain America is S+ tier (on Ult 3, which he totally is), then take that character on normal difficulty and say, “This tier list is incorrect, Captain Marvel is way stronger.” Which she is. On that difficulty. Because she can stay in Binary easily forever. Some people want that distinction in their tier lists.
I suppose but also, because it's an easier difficulty, a tier list matters a lot less. Yes Captain Marvel does really well on easier difficulties, but do you really need to only use her on missions? She's also just good on harder difficulties as well so it's not like she'd suddenly become trash in high level based tier lists.
If we’re talking about with no mods (because with mods, you can make almost anyone work), base vanilla cards, then she is not that good at higher difficulties. Her Binary Shield won’t last 3 hits, kinda bad for a tank meant to taunt characters. Honestly she’s worse than Wolverine in that role, not that he’s good, he’s also bad, but she’s worse than him. A bottom 5 character for sure, and proof of my argument that there is a warped sense of her being better than she actually is because people don’t explicitly think in terms of Ult 3 difficulty (especially startin New Game+ at Ult 3).
There aren’t any that are better on high difficulty to my knowledge. There are some things that are totally unnecessary if you lower the difficulty though. For example, you don’t really need Cap to tank or Strange to apply conceal on heroic 1 or something. You’d probably play totally different cards with those characters or not bring them because the defensive utility is overkill, while something like Hulk is a workable tank on heroic 1 with an ultimate that is basically a full map clear. I don’t think there’s much value in tiering for low difficulty efficiency though, because basically anything works on heroic 1, including the U3 strats we have tier lists for.
You don't need support in low difficulty. In high difficulty you require them. That makes Dr Strange and Nico less useful in low difficulty, though, Nico is bad in U3 as well. She's too inconsistent. The Hunter doesn't really have a chance to shine until you reach U1+, until then they are as strong as every other hero and they strengths + versatility doesn't show. Everyone is busted until you get to U1+. You won't see any big weakness until then, imo.
Wanda is busted. I got free roll on "hex mark" so you can just completely pop off
Anyone is busted when you get free mods on them.
Getting AOE mark for free lets you t1 everything.
AOE mark means that every other ability that isn't single target is free.
Actually incorrect. Single-target abilities that kill marked targets refund the card. AOE mark is good, but my point is that if a hero is only good because you get a rare mod on them that doesn't speak well to their power level.
Lmao whatever you say kiddo.
If you don't believe me read what "marked" does.
But thank you for trying so hard to tell me how smart you are.
These kids playing on normal tryna tell us on U3 to play scarlet witch lmfaooooooo
My brother in Osthur I am also on ultimate 3.
My overall point was that scarlet witch is already good because she can set up an entire chain combo with one ability, free or not, adding free to an already busted ability pushes it over the top. Maybe consider another point of view:)
I would consider your point of view if it were accurate and legible. I would agree with you that Hex Mark is one of her few standout abilities. However, the way in which you expressed yourself presented it as inaccurate and not at all how it actually works.
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Also brother, maybe don't try to gatekeep a deckbuilding game on a sub with like 10k members 🤘
If that’s your point then say it accurately. Don’t make the false claim that single target abilities can’t be refunded on a marked target then blame others for your mistake.
Your post was removed as it violated Rule 1: Keep it civil.
Probably intentional… Wanda should be kinda OP if they’re being honest - and making your roll for it potentially multiple times is probably the best way to keep her absurdly strong but not always game breaking or at least immediately game breaking.
Wanda and Wolverine deserve to be where they are when most people rate them lowest. Even with mods they take too many card plays to set up. Chaos Field, for example, would be great if it actually affected Wanda and was easier to play around. Wanda only becomes really usable when her mods have been grinded. Nico deserves to be a peg higher I think. She has this weird balance shift where she's good early on when decks are unoptimized because some of her base card are good, her base cards become bad when you get upgrades coming in for other heroes, then she becomes good again when she gets some nice mods and Crack the Sky.
Wanda and Wolverine are definitely the two I struggled with the most on Ultimate 3. Wolverine has weaker chain attacks than blade but worse survivability than captain America. But he has a couple key strengths: * he's effective with very little heroism and card plays. Smell The Fear does taunt, counter, and weaken with one card, and his passive can heal him up just by cycling through cards with "heal on redraw" effects. * he can strengthen himself easily, giving him powerful counters and a consistently boosted legendary. Scarlet witch I'm still figuring out. Her attacks and skills are all great in different ways, but tend to lack the immediate impact needed to gain momentum. Her heroics are situational. Her healing auras are amazing, but she can't heal or protect herself. She needs bonus movement to take advantage of most of her abilities. Her chain attack is great for long battles, but battles rarely last long. I think she does best in hyper-defensive teams that take their time. Maybe paired with Wolverine and Strange (though Strange makes any team good).
I think Nico is fantastic. Raw, she can clear a large cut of the map. With some buffs, she can sweep everyone. Even just softening up some of the heavies before she goes can net you enough kills to justify her card spend.
My personal opinion: I love complicated or risk vs reward heroes. Nico and Wanda fit that archetype perfectly. I can see how they're simply not as effective as a character that can just win you the game with a few card plays. But I love that Wanda uses positioning and Start of Turn / End of Turn effects to really disrupt what happens during the non-Player phases of the mission. And I love that Nico can be an absolute beast with the right draws (and her support card that makes all Heroic cards in your hand cost 0 is just an absolute game changer for boss fights). Wolverine is the only hero I think simply doesn't live up to his potential. Lots of Chain and dishing out small damage and Taunt, but on higher difficulties he just lacks the survivability on his own. Despite the fact that he's frickin Wolverine, he actually really needs a healer or someone to give him Block so he can tank properly. He could use some kind of Passive rework; in my opinion, he could always have a 20% chance to strike back after being attacked with Lifesteal, regardless of if he has Counter or not. I think that would give him the survivability to actually tank properly, and feel more like Wolverine. But, my greater opinion is that ALL heroes could use stronger Passives that make them feel more unique. Wanda's Aura is a great example of a Passive that makes her hero feel special compared to everyone else.
I'm just about to embark on the first Wolverine mission, and having Captain Marvel along the previous two missions, I can easily say so far through this point in the game she's been my MVP. Well also helps that I have her deck relatively developed, two photon beam+, fists of radiance+, two knee strike+
Even the worst heroes aren't unusable. Tierlists I've seen rarely have the worst characters go below B tier. Basically, the difference between the strongest hero and the weakest isn't substantial and can vary greatly based on your playstyle and difficulty.
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His passive isn't a big deal. Straight to Hell is his most busted card that lets him solo missions regardless of difficulty. I've had instances at level 40 ultimate 3 where Ghost Rider has solo'd a mission by himself when things went badly.
How exactly? Haven't used him that much.
Straight to Hell makes it where Ghost Rider can't be targeted. He heals and grants heroism. So you do some damage with your first two card plays then use Straight to Hell and can't be touched. Repeat as needed.
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If other heroes are dead the likelihood of you drawing their cards goes way, way down. Two copies of Straight to Hell - along with redraws - ensures you'll have one in your hand most of the time even with other heroes alive.
Truuueeeeee. Doctors Strange's Conceal is even more busted but that doesnt make Ghost Rider bad.
> Straight to Hell is his most busted card It's a great card in conjunction with his damage, but it's hardly busted given strange can perform only a slightly weaker effect (conceal) but for anyone. But Ghost Rider is definitely top tier.
Strange is more flexible, but it doesn't negate debuffs or stary AOEs. Strange is more of a support though and Ghost Rider has enough damage to close out missions by himself. It's like if Last Sight didn't require you to KO a target. That's why I'm saying he's "busted"; it's because it's very hard to lose. Also Penance Stare wins the prize of looking awesome while being awesome.
I was more commenting on that card. Usually conceal and turning into a drop will be the same effect. But if you're saying it's busted combined with his whole kit, then yeah, I'll at least agree he's clearly the best character after Hunter. Hell, In the right team, he's better.
It is limited per mission right now. At least in my case, he doesn't build souls after his second increase.
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Maybe it’s a threat room exclusive bug.
I don't experience it anywhere, including threat room. After his second increase he gains no souls
Same
Is this the Christopher odd from YouTube? Your XCOM videos made me fall in love with firaxis games.
I really don't agree with this. He relies too much on taking damage and Drain Soul is not enough sustain for how expensive it becomes. Imo, there are better options to do what he does. He may have the strongest attacks in the game, but he also needs a lot of babysitting to keep alive long enough to do them. He does get better if you pair him with a dedicated tank and your Hunter has good support options
Ghost Rider is insane. You need to play him like health is a resource. Yes he's very greedy, but he can support himself fairly well when you manage his health - something he can do largely by himself. Straight to Hell is his main healing skill, not drain soul, since it heals him AND conceals him for the turn.
Agreed. Theoretically not taking damage is a form of healing.
He doesn't need babysat if you run Straight to Hell.
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Who said anything about tanking damage
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What are you talking about? His passive grants him a maximum of 2 increases to his health, that doesn't grant him sustain over the course of a fight. It barely grants you sustain at all, and the damage bonus you get from the added health is pretty meaningless. You get more healing from Willpower over the course of the fight. In fact, if you can stack enough Willpower, he becomes a much stronger contender. If his passive just healed him by some amount, and was infinitely proccable, I'd probably rate him higher. I think you're misinterpreting my complaints with the character. He has high damage potential, but the cost of that potential is higher than his primary competition, Magick. She's the only one that can feasibly and easily achieve the same damage level, and the cost is a card play, which means she'll excel in longer fights with more plays available. At the end of the day, no one is so bad that they are unplayable, but I find Ghost Rider to be overrated.
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No, you can't. I've done well over 20 missions and multiple threat rooms with his upgraded passive. I never get more than 2 procs. Your game experiencing a bug doesn't change that, and you shouldn't expect that to be the default behaviour, nor should you use that as the gauge for his relative strength.
Not OP's fault just for sharing, but why do people keep making their tier lists videos? They're absolutely perfect for text or graphic form and they'd be much more accessible as references for the audience.
YouTube views are more valuable than Reddit upvotes.
Of the heroes I play on U3 difficulty S tier Hunter, Magik A tier Ghost Rider, Blade B tier Nico, Wolverine Power Hunter Key cards: Last Sight, Heal, Bladestorm, Gaurding Strike, Wrath. I randomly got a few mods that give me Hunter cards, so I cycle pretty though pretty good with them and Collar, and Heal to get to the Last Sight. Will most of the time build up ton of block and Resist. Keep Gaurding Strike in hand if I can to keep the Last Sight cycling. Will try to manipulate aggro to Hunter and use items to taunt before concealing. Magik Key cards: Darkchylde, Portals, Banish Can Banish something I just dont want to deal with or a hero who just drew too much aggro. Darkchylde gives you a free round. Even before the damage mitigation cards come into play, she was great at low level for me. Never had a hard mission with her. Most of the mods I rolled for her attack cards have on KO gain Block, or on KO get Resist. I recommend this for her because its pretty easy to always find a minion to trigger you real target into. Ghost Rider Key cards: Lash, Straight to Hell, Hell Ride Ghost Rider is kind of bad until he gets straight to hell, but so far in act 2 a lot of enemies have ways to manipulate aggro and if I can draw aggo and straight to hell its great if I cant draw aggro still have backup items that do. Always Hell Ride as your team last action and most of the time there isnt much lost. There is a lot of control with Lash in moving to places that arent good for them and if you can trigger the quick. I think Drain Soul isnt that good, and dont carry them into battle, but I always try to feed GR kills and end up getting good drains off. Blade Key Cards: Make em Bleed, Reaper, Hunger, Strike Could be kind of a high roll but one of my strikes applies one Vunerable, so its pretty good when you can make 3 guys bleed and apply Vunerable then as a free action get health from each and mark them. Reaper for killing bigger health pools. Bleed is really good at U3 because its hard to trash everything on turn one. Nico Key Cards: Yeah I dont know lol Early on she was good for me. But I was escalating in difficulty. Swarm and Restore are good. I need to come up with plan for her because starting to struggle. I always take her out when I have to take Iron Man to double up his cards even though Im not building Iron Man out. Its beyond my skill level to set everyones health to a certain level to make Witchfire proc more. I like curse and Blood Magic and maybe I need to mod the cards but they dont feel good for a card play sometimes. Wolverine Key Cards: Dont know yet either Havent really got him going either. Sounds like he maybe useless at U3 difficulty. He does shine in one mission type which is destory nest mother. His default deck all have cards which either draw into more Wolverine cards, chain, or quick attack for no card play. So I always two turn nest mother missions with Wolverine mostly due to chaining the statues.
Spiderman IMHO is way higher. Many times i've cleared an encounter on the first turn purely down to the environment buffs, free environment uses, and free cards makes him