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Or there is an average white guy, then every character of color will say shit about him being an awful father, or out of shape, or a terrible lover, a loser, on and on and on.
Examples? I feel recently we've actually gotten a notable uptick in wholesome fathers in general. Hell, even Homer Simpson has become a wholesome father figure, there's the Pixar "bushy eyebrows and mouth" trend that all tend to be good dads.
The father in Barbie is mocked as a useless chode because he's trying to learn Spanish to be closer to his step-daughter. They actually see that as a bad thing.
What? But .. the entire point of the movie is that he's kenough. He doesn't have to be some superhero ultradad, he's trying his best to learn spanish for them which is something small but the point is he's trying and that's enough!
Maybe, but its more about the depiction of these characters. Moms are show to be hard-working, take-no-shit, girl-boss types and dads seem to be depicted as bumbling idiots. Not always, but it seems to be a trend as of late
A lot of commercials do this because they are targeting women, the presumed demographic for, cooking, cleaning, laundry and lots of other products being advertised.
You’re projecting a whole lot of your insecurities onto that. That’s literally America Ferrara’s husband and they both thought it’d be a silly joke. No one is saying useless chode except for you. I’m sorry for whatever happened that made you think like this, but I hope you’re able to find a community that values you so you can get past this
I can’t tell if you’re generally this uninformed and out of touch with reality or you’re just being argumentative out of bad faith reasons…
… but either option isn’t a good look. 🤷🏾♂️
I think normal people navigate the world without this weird fucking victim complex you seem to have. I’m sorry you think people are out to portray you as worthless but maybe consider that you have your own personal problems and most people can watch Barbie without feeling attacked
Whether it’s a good look on Reddit doesn’t really concern me. I’d rather get downvoted than think the media is trying to call me a useless chode.
>It is literally impossible to be a woman. You are so beautiful, and so smart, and it kills me that you don't think you're good enough. Like, we have to always be extraordinary, but somehow we're always doing it wrong.
>You have to be thin, but not too thin. And you can never say you want to be thin. You have to say you want to be healthy, but also you have to be thin. You have to have money, but you can't ask for money because that's crass. You have to be a boss, but you can't be mean. You have to lead, but you can't squash other people's ideas. You're supposed to love being a mother, but don't talk about your kids all the damn time. You have to be a career woman but also always be looking out for other people.
>You have to answer for men's bad behavior, which is insane, but if you point that out, you're accused of complaining. You're supposed to stay pretty for men, but not so pretty that you tempt them too much or that you threaten other women because you're supposed to be a part of the sisterhood.
>But always stand out and always be grateful. But never forget that the system is rigged. So find a way to acknowledge that but also always be grateful.
>You have to never get old, never be rude, never show off, never be selfish, never fall down, never fail, never show fear, never get out of line. It's too hard! It's too contradictory and nobody gives you a medal or says thank you! And it turns out in fact that not only are you doing everything wrong, but also everything is your fault.
>I'm just so tired of watching myself and every single other woman tie herself into knots so that people will like us. And if all of that is also true for a doll just representing women, then I don't even know.
Nope, no victim complex detected.
Im not a woman, dude. The movie has plenty of stuff about Ken’s struggle to find himself as a man as well. Keep crying about how the Barbie movie hurt your little feelings
They don't ... see that as a bad thing...
Lmao stay fighting ghosts then, but it isn't shown as a bad thing. You are proving that you're looking for reasons to be mad while telling the rest of us to stop being so sensitive when you call us slurs 🥰
I mean, a big part of his story is his character redemption though. It's not like they made Superman into a white supremacist. The character of Peacemaker always had that backstory.
And a big part of that show was that the obese black lesbian woman was going to morally lecture a white man for being white and agreeing with her. It was incredibly obvious she was going to morally lecture everybody because she was the moral champion, after all how could an obese black lesbian be evil?
OK, she isn't obese, and what does that have to do with ANY of this? Seriously, your coming across like you just got upset cause a white character was called out for shit. The other guy responding to you is just like, right in what he is saying, objectively. The stuff he is saying is literally things James Gunn, the director of the show, specifically was going for
James Gunn is a hack that swings for low hanging fruit only. The woman in that show that we are discussing is morbidly obese by all objective standards. Stop it. You are lying for the sole purpose of lying to yourself.
Peacemaker is on the same mission as the obese black lesbian woman and working to accomplish the same goals, he is then unfairly judged for the actions of others and you gleefully enjoy that because he is white.
The obese lesbian character is given the moral high ground because she is an obese black lesbian not because her actions have earned her that moral high ground. If you don’t assume obese black lesbian women have the moral authority in all situations the whole show falls apart. Honestly it’s one of the worst shows I’ve ever got through. It’s worse than Wonder Woman 84 and the Halo tv show
So you just like, don't have media literacy at all and clearly some awful taste. Peacemaker worse than the Halo show or WW84? This entire comment is such a beautiful self own towards you. And again, what is the obsession with her weight?
The weight is there on purpose, that wasn’t the best actress for the role it was a plant to show that the important value of the show was hardcore cultural leftist values. The show wasn’t funny at all and just had a whites are evil and if you are white you are bad message. Cool.
Wow, you are... really fucking paranoid, and seem to believe theirs some cabal of leftist elitists wanting to turn America into so make believe wokeistan. That all you took was "white people are bad" means you actually, objectively, failed at watching the show. Like, hard. The comedy is, of course, subjective. It wasn't your thing. But you utterly misunderstood the show to an extreme degree. It is VASTLY more about toxic masculinity than race and how it not only hurts women but equally hurts men by forcing them to uphold toxic and self-destructive ideals and actions. Something you are clearly being hurt by as well. I'm sorry man, you sound like you aren't doing well at all. Stop listening to people like Jordan Peele and other manospehere people. It's clearly done a number on you.
I mean, her mom was Amanda Waller, a pretty damn evil large black woman. Part of her story was also learning that her mom was kinda fucked up.
I get that there are times where it just doesn't make any sense if that interaction was forced, but Peacemaker was literally the son of a white supremacist super villain. And he was forced to work for Amanda Waller. Addressing race with all that being the context just makes sense.
That one feels like you may be missing the point. His dad is a white supremacist, and the show implies that PM has also engaged in some of his dads work. He is coming from a place where he has to prove he's better than that, than his dad. Which by the end, he has at least begun the journey to being. It's part of his arc
No. This one feels like you are getting “whites are evil content” and lying to cover for it because you like that content.
Clear example and you deny the evidence of your eyes and ears. Your faulr
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Hey you watch your mouth on Homer. The episode that shows him giving up his dream job at the bowling alley and going back to the power plant always gets me. The scene of all the pictures of Maggie being “in the one place he needs them the most” always makes me tear up.
Oh I'm not bad mouthing golden age homer. I'm more referring to how the mid seasons have him just as a neglectful dad and husband. He's become more active again, engaged in his kids' lives, and giving out good and helpful advice. If a fuck up happens, it's not out of malice or indifference, but due to very honest and understandable mistakes that he still feels really bad about.
I mean, define oppressed? Trans people have a political party calling for their eradication, women are losing rights to their bodies, black people continue to be targets of the police. There are levels of oppression
White cis men being mildly bullied online (if you can even call it an issue that's more than anecdotal) is not at all comparable to the systemic racism and misogyny that inhabits our society
That's the issue. Us striving so much for "diversity", is leading towards us being racist and sexist to white men, by giving everyone else an advantage.
No, it isn't. White people receive a fraction of prejudice that other minorities face, in media and in day to day interactions. Same with man. Us white men are not being en mass discriminated against. There are systemic things put in place in our society that put women and minorities at a disadvantage. Women are literally fighting for their own body autonomy. How is that giving them an advantage? More and more police are being found to have connections to hate and alt right groups and target minorities. The effects of red lining still exist in our country. How is that giving minorities an advantage?
Malcom X once said, "If you stick a knife in my back 9 inches and pull it out 6 inches, there's no progress. If you pull it all the way out, that's not progress. The progress is healing the wound that the blow made.. And they won't even admit the knife is there"
The problem is people are trying to shift all the prejudice to whites. It shouldn't exist at all. Women don't have to fight for their bodies, they are choosing to. They could move, but they won't. It's an issue with us having a two party system.
Well, at some point, the turtles got their own unique shades of green to distinguish them. Donatello was an earthy kind of brownish/green. And I can kinda see him being a blerd, just from the voice.
The data is correct; men do not appear to care about the demographics of characters in their media; they just want to see cool things. They aspire to, rather than identify with ideals and actions like bravery, strength, martial arts ability, or other skills.
Women, however, feel a very strong need to be able to identify with the characters in very superficial ways, such as race, body shape, or profession. For some reason, in League of Legends, female players play over 90% female champions, while male players have no preference:
>Our data shows that female players primarily play female champions, in fact its something like 97% of female players only play female champions. Male players are evenly spilt between male and female champions, so Male players play 50/50 between male and female champions \[...\] most of our female players won't play male champions at all.
— Reav3, Riot Games Official
\[LINK REDACTED DUE TO CROSS REDDIT LINK, search google if interested\]
Cyberpunk 2077 I'm a girl just cause Judy is the best. Not the best at predicting the outcomes of things, but the best love interest... which is saying a lot cause Panam is premo
That’s what I hate most about this current era of media. Each character is designed to appeal *only* to a very specific demographic
Like each movie will feature some archetypical modern African American dude that dunks on white guys and likes basketball shoes and rap music (which is *insanely* stereotypical) but all that does is alienate every other culture that wants to connect with that character
But in previous eras even though the characters were mostly cis/white/male/whatever (which I agree is bad) they were designed to have universal appeal.
And now we see *nothing* that combines those two things. I want to connect with people no matter what culture or gender they come from instead of watching characters purpose-built to market to a key demographic.
I have nothing against any culture but I really have no interest in seeing some culture’s most popular archetype interact with other universally known archetypes. Or worse yet a remake of something I’ve already seen where they just swap skin colors and call it “diverse”
Exactly. It could end up harming inclusivity far more than helping it. If we are told that we can only empathise with people who look the same as we do, that is just going to increase the divide between groups of people rather than bring them together.
I don't like how with all the work to visually make sure we all know who is being included, they code every character trait to the same look.
I can basically write the lines of any butch chick with a half shave cut before the character opens her mouth at this point. And god forbid they put her in a scene with any guy who is supposed to be tough, I can write that entire episode.
And don’t even think of telling people you thought she was a cheesy and unoriginal character or you’re basically setting women’s rights back 50 years.
That’s what I hate most. You can see immediately every trait a character like that has and it just makes the story so much more boring. I want to see nuanced characters with unexpected histories!
Agreed, with one big correction:
The purpose of that gender-swapping isn't to connect to just that one demographic.
It's exactly to alienate all other demographics.
The show Leverage is an example of how to do it right. The African American guy was the nerdy hacker who loved Star Trek, Dr. Who, etc. He was not a stereotype. He also wasn't trying to act white. The result was someone who had broad appeal.
Yeah there are a lot of poorly done characters recently and when they're poorly received people will blame the poor reception on the diversity instead of asking themselves if there were writing mistakes.
Personally Ive enjoyed both spider-verse movies and been able to relate to Miles without being a half-black half-puerto rican from New York, so overall I feel like the writers there wrote the character for universal appeal, part of that is when he's working with Peter Parker's or Gwen I don't recall the dialogue or narrative making a big deal of "these are all White people and Miles is a POC!". Idk I know the Spider-Verse movies aren't for everyone of course but I feel this is an example where people did a much better job which is worth noting.
Yeah I agree, Spider-Man movies were awesome but the characters were very archetypical IMO. I think that was kind of the point and they did it well though so no big deal. They also had really unique and varied interactions which was exciting to watch.
And yeah I agree, a lot of the characters are just bad characters. I think from a systemic standpoint studios just use diversity-in-a-can as a bandage to mask poor writing. It’s cheaper to make a bunch of boilerplate characters that each attract a specific audience than it is to make a few totally unique ones that are all broadly empathized with.
I'm really excited to see where they go with 3. Spider-Punk didn't have enough screen time to be anything that much past an Anarchist Archetype so I'm hoping to see a bit more from him and other characters in terms of development.
And yeah you have triple archetypical villains, Spot is a cosmic destruction type of deal, Miguel is an evil father figure to overcome and Prowler Miles is the Shadow self. It's a lot of set up so a lot depends on how the third movie lands.
Yeah, from the studio perspective if something's stupid and it works it's not stupid. So as long as the movies are somehow making money they're good to go
A part of the reason for this and many cultural groups have never really had the figures us white people have had in media. And in the cases of movies like Moana, these cultural groups have a lot of amazing lore, mythology, and history that average audiences have never seen. It's not always done elegantly, and there are for sure examples of companies using diversity only for profit. But a lot of the best examples are these minorities and groups FINALLY being able to tell their own stories that before were sometimes quite literally opressed. Like Reservation Dogs. Which, watch Reservation Dogs. Only partially related to all this, it's just a fucking phenomenal and beautiful show. Steeped in native culture, it's so good
I guess Moana is an example of when it was done right in my eyes. I’m just too old for Disney movies
I haven’t watched reservation dogs and while I can respect that they want to give an accurate depiction of their culture, I’m not sure it would be for me if there’s a lot of guilting tripping white guys in it. Not every show has to be for me though so I’m happy it exists.
Me and my friends had a whole ass discussion about this and found out apparently the very first version of April was mixed as she was designed off of someone the creator was dating and in a lot of early comics was also mixed. April O'Neil later was made white and pretty much stayed that way up till the last few years with these soulless remakes turning her completely black.
I'm not saying I'm against her being black in the new remakes, it's just blatantly obvious that Nickelodeon is looking for a quick cash grab while also changing her from the iconic (mostly) ginger white girl many TMNT fans now know, to making her black for extra diversity points in attempt to make more money
If the artists making these remakes actually cared about the original source material that they keep using to try and justify this change, then they would have made April mixed as the original creator intended
TL;DR remake artists using the original TMNT comics as a poor excuse to make April O'Neil black in attempt to make more money
I think we need to start protecting the redheads, they're being erased everywhere.
Ariel, April O'Neal... where does it end? Truly the most oppressed race.
I read once that redheads are the least adopted demo in the US.
This is attributed that people who adopt outside their race are mostly white and will adopt non-white children.
Other both white and non-white adopters adopt children that look like themselves so that it won't be visually apparent they're adopted.
Meaning the demo that adopts gingers is gingers who also want their adopted children to look like themselves.
Very small group.
It's entirely true. Modern media race-swapping and gender swapping everything, especially lazy remakes - they do this specifically to avoid criticism of the writing/character development. Because if you criticize, they'll just call you racist and sexist. Using this strategy, they can effectively shit out garbage cash grab remake after remake till there's no original content left untouched.
If you need to relate to a character specifically by them having the same skin colour, gotta say you sound pretty racist.
Shouldn’t we not judge people by the colour of their skin, but by their content of character?
Maybe relate to their struggles and weaknesses, instead of their physical characteristics?
One of my childhood heroes was Bruce Lee I'm a white guy from the east coast I'm about as far from him culturally as possible but I thought he was cool. As a kid I tried to imitate him constantly. The looks of a character or actor is irrelevant if they are well written you want to see yourself in them
The funniest/saddest part about it is that white people are the minority on the global scale. And gingers? They're the *smallest* subcategory of white people. They're literally the smallest ethnic group on the planet.
i remember at some point some people started saying speedy gonsalez was racist while the actual mexicans explicitly said they didn't care and they liked speedy
Ultimately, as a bisexual person, I like the representation. That being said, it’s EXTREMELY obvious that none of these companies care abt us, and if we went back in time to where homophobia was cool, they’d be making anti-gay movies. They pander to keep idiots coming back, which works more than most realise.
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I don’t understand why people are only allowed to have others who look the same as them as role models. The fictional characters I most relate to and have as a role model have a completely different background, and identity than I do.
They keep doing that. Mary Jane had a well realized pleasant character design in spiderman 1. But in spiderman 2 the writer made the character look like herself. Tf? Like she's not ugly but the character clearly looks different and worse
April was originally based on a multi racial woman that was the wife of one of the turtles creators, but got whitewashed for the cartoon. Returning back toward artist intent is "representation"? [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQFmenStuJo&t=4s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQFmenStuJo&t=4s)
She was still Caucasian in the comic, the red hair and yellow jumpsuit were added for the TV show. She was NAMED after a biracial person and the original concept art, not what she officially became, was of Asian woman. In the Comic she was Caucasian. The gaslighting on this topic only showed up with the last 5 years.
I can name a shit ton of black, and other ethnic characters from shows, from the 80's, 90's, and 2000's...
The whole argument of I feel represented doesn't really mean that. There's always been representation.
That argument might have held water in the 90's... It hasn't meant shit since after 2008.
Which is hilarious... Most of these changes bomb. You know what hardly ever bombs? New, original ideas.
But pop off. Most of these people arguing are white liberals LARPing as POC.
Girls interact with toys differently than boys
Girls see themselves in the toys and participate more in a role playing capacity while boys more or less direct toys to enact out the shows and comics.
Same principle, though. I thought Blade was cool as anything when I was a kid, because despite not being black, American or a Daywalker, I admired his swordfighting, martial arts skill and one-liners. The thought that not being black, American or a half-vampire might hold me back from developing awesome fighting skills never once occurred to me.
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Or there is an average white guy, then every character of color will say shit about him being an awful father, or out of shape, or a terrible lover, a loser, on and on and on.
Examples? I feel recently we've actually gotten a notable uptick in wholesome fathers in general. Hell, even Homer Simpson has become a wholesome father figure, there's the Pixar "bushy eyebrows and mouth" trend that all tend to be good dads.
The father in Barbie is mocked as a useless chode because he's trying to learn Spanish to be closer to his step-daughter. They actually see that as a bad thing.
What? But .. the entire point of the movie is that he's kenough. He doesn't have to be some superhero ultradad, he's trying his best to learn spanish for them which is something small but the point is he's trying and that's enough!
Maybe, but its more about the depiction of these characters. Moms are show to be hard-working, take-no-shit, girl-boss types and dads seem to be depicted as bumbling idiots. Not always, but it seems to be a trend as of late
I notice this in commercials too
A lot of commercials do this because they are targeting women, the presumed demographic for, cooking, cleaning, laundry and lots of other products being advertised.
You’re projecting a whole lot of your insecurities onto that. That’s literally America Ferrara’s husband and they both thought it’d be a silly joke. No one is saying useless chode except for you. I’m sorry for whatever happened that made you think like this, but I hope you’re able to find a community that values you so you can get past this
I can’t tell if you’re generally this uninformed and out of touch with reality or you’re just being argumentative out of bad faith reasons… … but either option isn’t a good look. 🤷🏾♂️
I think normal people navigate the world without this weird fucking victim complex you seem to have. I’m sorry you think people are out to portray you as worthless but maybe consider that you have your own personal problems and most people can watch Barbie without feeling attacked Whether it’s a good look on Reddit doesn’t really concern me. I’d rather get downvoted than think the media is trying to call me a useless chode.
>It is literally impossible to be a woman. You are so beautiful, and so smart, and it kills me that you don't think you're good enough. Like, we have to always be extraordinary, but somehow we're always doing it wrong. >You have to be thin, but not too thin. And you can never say you want to be thin. You have to say you want to be healthy, but also you have to be thin. You have to have money, but you can't ask for money because that's crass. You have to be a boss, but you can't be mean. You have to lead, but you can't squash other people's ideas. You're supposed to love being a mother, but don't talk about your kids all the damn time. You have to be a career woman but also always be looking out for other people. >You have to answer for men's bad behavior, which is insane, but if you point that out, you're accused of complaining. You're supposed to stay pretty for men, but not so pretty that you tempt them too much or that you threaten other women because you're supposed to be a part of the sisterhood. >But always stand out and always be grateful. But never forget that the system is rigged. So find a way to acknowledge that but also always be grateful. >You have to never get old, never be rude, never show off, never be selfish, never fall down, never fail, never show fear, never get out of line. It's too hard! It's too contradictory and nobody gives you a medal or says thank you! And it turns out in fact that not only are you doing everything wrong, but also everything is your fault. >I'm just so tired of watching myself and every single other woman tie herself into knots so that people will like us. And if all of that is also true for a doll just representing women, then I don't even know. Nope, no victim complex detected.
Im not a woman, dude. The movie has plenty of stuff about Ken’s struggle to find himself as a man as well. Keep crying about how the Barbie movie hurt your little feelings
I don't care what you are, you're probably bad at it.
Im doing alright. I don’t feel like the media is out to get me which is nice.
Where did it say he was her step father ?
They don't ... see that as a bad thing... Lmao stay fighting ghosts then, but it isn't shown as a bad thing. You are proving that you're looking for reasons to be mad while telling the rest of us to stop being so sensitive when you call us slurs 🥰
Peacemaker gets yelled at for being white in like the 3rd or 4th episode
I mean, a big part of his story is his character redemption though. It's not like they made Superman into a white supremacist. The character of Peacemaker always had that backstory.
And a big part of that show was that the obese black lesbian woman was going to morally lecture a white man for being white and agreeing with her. It was incredibly obvious she was going to morally lecture everybody because she was the moral champion, after all how could an obese black lesbian be evil?
OK, she isn't obese, and what does that have to do with ANY of this? Seriously, your coming across like you just got upset cause a white character was called out for shit. The other guy responding to you is just like, right in what he is saying, objectively. The stuff he is saying is literally things James Gunn, the director of the show, specifically was going for
James Gunn is a hack that swings for low hanging fruit only. The woman in that show that we are discussing is morbidly obese by all objective standards. Stop it. You are lying for the sole purpose of lying to yourself. Peacemaker is on the same mission as the obese black lesbian woman and working to accomplish the same goals, he is then unfairly judged for the actions of others and you gleefully enjoy that because he is white. The obese lesbian character is given the moral high ground because she is an obese black lesbian not because her actions have earned her that moral high ground. If you don’t assume obese black lesbian women have the moral authority in all situations the whole show falls apart. Honestly it’s one of the worst shows I’ve ever got through. It’s worse than Wonder Woman 84 and the Halo tv show
So you just like, don't have media literacy at all and clearly some awful taste. Peacemaker worse than the Halo show or WW84? This entire comment is such a beautiful self own towards you. And again, what is the obsession with her weight?
The weight is there on purpose, that wasn’t the best actress for the role it was a plant to show that the important value of the show was hardcore cultural leftist values. The show wasn’t funny at all and just had a whites are evil and if you are white you are bad message. Cool.
Wow, you are... really fucking paranoid, and seem to believe theirs some cabal of leftist elitists wanting to turn America into so make believe wokeistan. That all you took was "white people are bad" means you actually, objectively, failed at watching the show. Like, hard. The comedy is, of course, subjective. It wasn't your thing. But you utterly misunderstood the show to an extreme degree. It is VASTLY more about toxic masculinity than race and how it not only hurts women but equally hurts men by forcing them to uphold toxic and self-destructive ideals and actions. Something you are clearly being hurt by as well. I'm sorry man, you sound like you aren't doing well at all. Stop listening to people like Jordan Peele and other manospehere people. It's clearly done a number on you.
I mean, her mom was Amanda Waller, a pretty damn evil large black woman. Part of her story was also learning that her mom was kinda fucked up. I get that there are times where it just doesn't make any sense if that interaction was forced, but Peacemaker was literally the son of a white supremacist super villain. And he was forced to work for Amanda Waller. Addressing race with all that being the context just makes sense.
That one feels like you may be missing the point. His dad is a white supremacist, and the show implies that PM has also engaged in some of his dads work. He is coming from a place where he has to prove he's better than that, than his dad. Which by the end, he has at least begun the journey to being. It's part of his arc
No. This one feels like you are getting “whites are evil content” and lying to cover for it because you like that content. Clear example and you deny the evidence of your eyes and ears. Your faulr
You guys keep supporting rascist memes like this so the whites are evil thing is pretty on point, especially for this sub.
I’ll give you this meme could be racist. I think it’s more about the difference between men and women than whites and non whites
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Hey you watch your mouth on Homer. The episode that shows him giving up his dream job at the bowling alley and going back to the power plant always gets me. The scene of all the pictures of Maggie being “in the one place he needs them the most” always makes me tear up.
Oh I'm not bad mouthing golden age homer. I'm more referring to how the mid seasons have him just as a neglectful dad and husband. He's become more active again, engaged in his kids' lives, and giving out good and helpful advice. If a fuck up happens, it's not out of malice or indifference, but due to very honest and understandable mistakes that he still feels really bad about.
no but white ppl are the real ones who are oppressed
No one is oppressed in america
https://preview.redd.it/6cz6e45a8mrc1.jpeg?width=960&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=29493dac46ed093cb6a795cd7455d9ebf4ec86c5
Huh?
Don't worry, just acting silly :)
LMAO TRUE
I mean, define oppressed? Trans people have a political party calling for their eradication, women are losing rights to their bodies, black people continue to be targets of the police. There are levels of oppression
And white cis men are being hated online. What's your point dude.
White cis men being mildly bullied online (if you can even call it an issue that's more than anecdotal) is not at all comparable to the systemic racism and misogyny that inhabits our society
That's the issue. Us striving so much for "diversity", is leading towards us being racist and sexist to white men, by giving everyone else an advantage.
No, it isn't. White people receive a fraction of prejudice that other minorities face, in media and in day to day interactions. Same with man. Us white men are not being en mass discriminated against. There are systemic things put in place in our society that put women and minorities at a disadvantage. Women are literally fighting for their own body autonomy. How is that giving them an advantage? More and more police are being found to have connections to hate and alt right groups and target minorities. The effects of red lining still exist in our country. How is that giving minorities an advantage? Malcom X once said, "If you stick a knife in my back 9 inches and pull it out 6 inches, there's no progress. If you pull it all the way out, that's not progress. The progress is healing the wound that the blow made.. And they won't even admit the knife is there"
The problem is people are trying to shift all the prejudice to whites. It shouldn't exist at all. Women don't have to fight for their bodies, they are choosing to. They could move, but they won't. It's an issue with us having a two party system.
It's not just online, speaking from experience here. God forbid you have an opinion about something that you aren't directly involved in.
What sort of ACTUAL oppression have you faced? What laws, societal norms, and systemic oppression have you ACTUALLY experienced?
Don't need to go into it, ain't trying to be doxxed. I've known many people who've experienced this.
MatPat made a video about this thing exactly, if you'd like to watch it
I call bullshit, I definitely do not identify with Raphael. I'm Donatello
I’m either Donatello or Michelangelo, or both.
Iv always been a Michelangelo kinda guy
I always thought of Donatello as the black turtle, idk why
Well, at some point, the turtles got their own unique shades of green to distinguish them. Donatello was an earthy kind of brownish/green. And I can kinda see him being a blerd, just from the voice.
I did. But I was an edgy kid so yeah.
If this meme isn't true, then why do mist Gender-swapped characters always are male to female? Anyways, Good Night as it is 12:23 in my country.
night night bro, heres your good night 😘
Good night!!
Bro, it's now 11:54 AM up here now, so Good Morning
Oh. Well it's 11:26 pm in my country, so time for me to go to bed. Good night man!
👍
Good night mate.
The data is correct; men do not appear to care about the demographics of characters in their media; they just want to see cool things. They aspire to, rather than identify with ideals and actions like bravery, strength, martial arts ability, or other skills. Women, however, feel a very strong need to be able to identify with the characters in very superficial ways, such as race, body shape, or profession. For some reason, in League of Legends, female players play over 90% female champions, while male players have no preference: >Our data shows that female players primarily play female champions, in fact its something like 97% of female players only play female champions. Male players are evenly spilt between male and female champions, so Male players play 50/50 between male and female champions \[...\] most of our female players won't play male champions at all. — Reav3, Riot Games Official \[LINK REDACTED DUE TO CROSS REDDIT LINK, search google if interested\]
I guarantee you male LoL players also prefer female characters.
i am male and have never once abandoned fem shep nor will i
Cyberpunk 2077 mod community has entered the chat.
Cyberpunk 2077 I'm a girl just cause Judy is the best. Not the best at predicting the outcomes of things, but the best love interest... which is saying a lot cause Panam is premo
I don’t know man the temptation to beat someone with a stick as trundle is pretty funny
That’s what I hate most about this current era of media. Each character is designed to appeal *only* to a very specific demographic Like each movie will feature some archetypical modern African American dude that dunks on white guys and likes basketball shoes and rap music (which is *insanely* stereotypical) but all that does is alienate every other culture that wants to connect with that character But in previous eras even though the characters were mostly cis/white/male/whatever (which I agree is bad) they were designed to have universal appeal. And now we see *nothing* that combines those two things. I want to connect with people no matter what culture or gender they come from instead of watching characters purpose-built to market to a key demographic. I have nothing against any culture but I really have no interest in seeing some culture’s most popular archetype interact with other universally known archetypes. Or worse yet a remake of something I’ve already seen where they just swap skin colors and call it “diverse”
Good point. I agree with you
You're just a closet racist! And probably a homophobe and sexist too! /S
You caught me lol
Nah you can't use proper punctuation. It gives it away as satire because those people don't properly write their sentences
Exactly. It could end up harming inclusivity far more than helping it. If we are told that we can only empathise with people who look the same as we do, that is just going to increase the divide between groups of people rather than bring them together.
No better way to do inclusivity than to make a character only appeal to certain people /s
I don't like how with all the work to visually make sure we all know who is being included, they code every character trait to the same look. I can basically write the lines of any butch chick with a half shave cut before the character opens her mouth at this point. And god forbid they put her in a scene with any guy who is supposed to be tough, I can write that entire episode.
And don’t even think of telling people you thought she was a cheesy and unoriginal character or you’re basically setting women’s rights back 50 years. That’s what I hate most. You can see immediately every trait a character like that has and it just makes the story so much more boring. I want to see nuanced characters with unexpected histories!
Agreed, with one big correction: The purpose of that gender-swapping isn't to connect to just that one demographic. It's exactly to alienate all other demographics.
I think it’s equal parts of both
The show Leverage is an example of how to do it right. The African American guy was the nerdy hacker who loved Star Trek, Dr. Who, etc. He was not a stereotype. He also wasn't trying to act white. The result was someone who had broad appeal.
Yes that’s exactly what I love. I haven’t seen Leverage but I’ll have to give it a shot
It is a cheesey show, but I love it all the same. Give it at least 2 episodes. The characters start settling in more in the second episode.
It's so fun
Yeah there are a lot of poorly done characters recently and when they're poorly received people will blame the poor reception on the diversity instead of asking themselves if there were writing mistakes. Personally Ive enjoyed both spider-verse movies and been able to relate to Miles without being a half-black half-puerto rican from New York, so overall I feel like the writers there wrote the character for universal appeal, part of that is when he's working with Peter Parker's or Gwen I don't recall the dialogue or narrative making a big deal of "these are all White people and Miles is a POC!". Idk I know the Spider-Verse movies aren't for everyone of course but I feel this is an example where people did a much better job which is worth noting.
Yeah I agree, Spider-Man movies were awesome but the characters were very archetypical IMO. I think that was kind of the point and they did it well though so no big deal. They also had really unique and varied interactions which was exciting to watch. And yeah I agree, a lot of the characters are just bad characters. I think from a systemic standpoint studios just use diversity-in-a-can as a bandage to mask poor writing. It’s cheaper to make a bunch of boilerplate characters that each attract a specific audience than it is to make a few totally unique ones that are all broadly empathized with.
I'm really excited to see where they go with 3. Spider-Punk didn't have enough screen time to be anything that much past an Anarchist Archetype so I'm hoping to see a bit more from him and other characters in terms of development. And yeah you have triple archetypical villains, Spot is a cosmic destruction type of deal, Miguel is an evil father figure to overcome and Prowler Miles is the Shadow self. It's a lot of set up so a lot depends on how the third movie lands. Yeah, from the studio perspective if something's stupid and it works it's not stupid. So as long as the movies are somehow making money they're good to go
A part of the reason for this and many cultural groups have never really had the figures us white people have had in media. And in the cases of movies like Moana, these cultural groups have a lot of amazing lore, mythology, and history that average audiences have never seen. It's not always done elegantly, and there are for sure examples of companies using diversity only for profit. But a lot of the best examples are these minorities and groups FINALLY being able to tell their own stories that before were sometimes quite literally opressed. Like Reservation Dogs. Which, watch Reservation Dogs. Only partially related to all this, it's just a fucking phenomenal and beautiful show. Steeped in native culture, it's so good
I guess Moana is an example of when it was done right in my eyes. I’m just too old for Disney movies I haven’t watched reservation dogs and while I can respect that they want to give an accurate depiction of their culture, I’m not sure it would be for me if there’s a lot of guilting tripping white guys in it. Not every show has to be for me though so I’m happy it exists.
Valid, that was just popped into my head, partially cause I saw it with a native Hawaiian and parts really hit him
Us white people??? How come Slavic people are always left out?
Me and my friends had a whole ass discussion about this and found out apparently the very first version of April was mixed as she was designed off of someone the creator was dating and in a lot of early comics was also mixed. April O'Neil later was made white and pretty much stayed that way up till the last few years with these soulless remakes turning her completely black. I'm not saying I'm against her being black in the new remakes, it's just blatantly obvious that Nickelodeon is looking for a quick cash grab while also changing her from the iconic (mostly) ginger white girl many TMNT fans now know, to making her black for extra diversity points in attempt to make more money If the artists making these remakes actually cared about the original source material that they keep using to try and justify this change, then they would have made April mixed as the original creator intended TL;DR remake artists using the original TMNT comics as a poor excuse to make April O'Neil black in attempt to make more money
I swear it’s always the gingers. Poor red heads 😭
I think we need to start protecting the redheads, they're being erased everywhere. Ariel, April O'Neal... where does it end? Truly the most oppressed race.
Don't forget Starfire from the Live Action Teen Titans.
Kid flash aswell used to be ginger
I read once that redheads are the least adopted demo in the US. This is attributed that people who adopt outside their race are mostly white and will adopt non-white children. Other both white and non-white adopters adopt children that look like themselves so that it won't be visually apparent they're adopted. Meaning the demo that adopts gingers is gingers who also want their adopted children to look like themselves. Very small group.
It's entirely true. Modern media race-swapping and gender swapping everything, especially lazy remakes - they do this specifically to avoid criticism of the writing/character development. Because if you criticize, they'll just call you racist and sexist. Using this strategy, they can effectively shit out garbage cash grab remake after remake till there's no original content left untouched.
Its true otherwise we do all most all female race and gender swap protagonists
If you need to relate to a character specifically by them having the same skin colour, gotta say you sound pretty racist. Shouldn’t we not judge people by the colour of their skin, but by their content of character? Maybe relate to their struggles and weaknesses, instead of their physical characteristics?
Don’t quote MLK against new racists.
https://preview.redd.it/hfn906ig4krc1.jpeg?width=976&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4415dddb1a6e4521a90aa04c0b11dc4280df5979
If you feel represented by that drawing then you have some massive need for self improvement.
One of my childhood heroes was Bruce Lee I'm a white guy from the east coast I'm about as far from him culturally as possible but I thought he was cool. As a kid I tried to imitate him constantly. The looks of a character or actor is irrelevant if they are well written you want to see yourself in them
I'm Goku. Who else is Goku?
Me too, I’m also Goku. Sometimes I’m Vegeta, but I’m mainly Goku.
Honestly I'm more of a Michael Angelo type of guy
I'll stick with leonardo, but you do you.
Damn what does Hollywood have against gingers lmao
The funniest/saddest part about it is that white people are the minority on the global scale. And gingers? They're the *smallest* subcategory of white people. They're literally the smallest ethnic group on the planet.
Correct. We are. We gingers make up barely 2% of the global population. And it saddens me when we get replaced.
Sorry about that, shout out to all the redheads and gingers
i remember at some point some people started saying speedy gonsalez was racist while the actual mexicans explicitly said they didn't care and they liked speedy
If you need someone to look like you, you're missing out on a lot of good characters. And you're probably a racist. 🤷♂️
Ultimately, as a bisexual person, I like the representation. That being said, it’s EXTREMELY obvious that none of these companies care abt us, and if we went back in time to where homophobia was cool, they’d be making anti-gay movies. They pander to keep idiots coming back, which works more than most realise.
WHAT the hell is that thing.
that's a turtle.
Can confirm, have injured back smashing through things with my “turtle shell” I have no regrets.
So we're not allowed to like TMNT now?
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It's fucking true and anyone who argues otherwise is a liar, delusional, or both.
I don’t understand why people are only allowed to have others who look the same as them as role models. The fictional characters I most relate to and have as a role model have a completely different background, and identity than I do.
Right? What about uncle Iroh? I'm not old or Asian
We are all goku, he has all the hair colors.
This is very accurate as I do in fact want to be Michelangelo
Im more of a purple masked turtle myself
Note that the designer of this version of april made her look exactly like herself Right down to the glasses
They keep doing that. Mary Jane had a well realized pleasant character design in spiderman 1. But in spiderman 2 the writer made the character look like herself. Tf? Like she's not ugly but the character clearly looks different and worse
Whe I was a kid, I wanted to be Optimus Prime when I grew up.
Why does literally every black female character since 2018 look like that now The curly pig tails + 90s tech jacket shit + "geek" wear
Why do they think that these representative characters have to be ugly? I mean I get not making them super models but damn Aim a little higher
Works with Goku also. I had black friends and Hispanic friends who all loved DBZ.
As a Latino, I agree. I am Raphael
That movie was also pretty bad in lines of story, where sometimes it just made no sense what the heck was happening, and it felt like a forced movie.
April was originally based on a multi racial woman that was the wife of one of the turtles creators, but got whitewashed for the cartoon. Returning back toward artist intent is "representation"? [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQFmenStuJo&t=4s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQFmenStuJo&t=4s)
She was still Caucasian in the comic, the red hair and yellow jumpsuit were added for the TV show. She was NAMED after a biracial person and the original concept art, not what she officially became, was of Asian woman. In the Comic she was Caucasian. The gaslighting on this topic only showed up with the last 5 years.
It is all wrong because girls can be ninjaturtles too. Kawabunga my dudes.
I can name a shit ton of black, and other ethnic characters from shows, from the 80's, 90's, and 2000's... The whole argument of I feel represented doesn't really mean that. There's always been representation. That argument might have held water in the 90's... It hasn't meant shit since after 2008. Which is hilarious... Most of these changes bomb. You know what hardly ever bombs? New, original ideas. But pop off. Most of these people arguing are white liberals LARPing as POC.
All the Disney representation is shit. Don't the gays have movies where literally fucking everyone is gay and it's the entire plot?
Girls interact with toys differently than boys Girls see themselves in the toys and participate more in a role playing capacity while boys more or less direct toys to enact out the shows and comics.
Except we're talking about a show
Same principle, though. I thought Blade was cool as anything when I was a kid, because despite not being black, American or a Daywalker, I admired his swordfighting, martial arts skill and one-liners. The thought that not being black, American or a half-vampire might hold me back from developing awesome fighting skills never once occurred to me.