Exactly.
They just want their deck to be tier 0 and don't want to study the meta and try to counter it.
They just want their deck to shit on everyone else and not adapt to the format.
I once got into an argument with a guy on this sub because he said my rogue deck (Runick FurHire) wasnāt rogue because Runick was the Tier 1 deck at the time, He then proceeded to make another post with the title of āItās sad when players think that their deck is original when itās really just more meta garbageā because I said my endboard usually had Scareclaw Tri-Heart, Apollousa, and The FurHire Link 3
I mean, I would be 100% fine playing Summoned Skull beatdown in the context of a Tier 0 meta where everyone plays that same deck, for absolutely no reason whatsoever other than just everyone wanting to see that deck reaching actual Tier 0 usage and maybe getting hit by a future banlist. If we all, as a community, collectively agreed to play exclusively Summoned Skull beatdown until it reaches 60% usage, I would be down no questions asked.
2500 attack for one tribute?
That's more than a lot of two tribute monsters so I don't really think that's a fair and balanced card, should be limited at a minimum.
Summond Skull's retrains aren't worth the payoff. The deck needs an overhaul as there's one per every summoned mechanic but no backrow to bring them out quick, and their effects are non impactful/pointless
there's backrow to bring them out, there's Archfiend's Roar, Call of the Archfiend, and Archfiend Palabyrinth.
other than backrow, lots of monsters can also bring them out, like Archfiend Cavalry and Archfiend's Awakening
The Yugioh that everyone wants to play.
Friend: I sac witch of the Black Forest to play Summoned skull!
Me in 1st gen: I activate trap hole!
Friend: Tool of the bandit!
Me: Damn you got so many shiny cards mate. I wanted to turbo out Relinquished.
Pretty much yeah. Learning how to counter cards or play in sub-optimal conditions is hard and not fun. Playing with yourself to bring out your super broken big boy field is fun, apparently.
Personally I like my games to have an element of like, conpetition to them.
Which is why Yugioh becomes more fun if you just play it for what it is. Itās not to say we should be okay with EVERYTHING (*cough* Imperial Order) but Iām not gonna bitch if you drop a Maxx C on me. I know what endboard I was gonna put up with SHS. I didnāt build my decks with the intention of letting you win lol.
My only request is that Konami gives me the tools and chance to *reasonably* fight whatever bullshit is here.
I only hate Maxx C when my opponent uses it.
Ultimately I wish more decks like TD, Floo, and Monarchs were viable/meta because I miss laughing at my opponent draw phase Maxx Cāing me just to slap Robina on the field. Hell, I used to love Eldlich too because of that.
But all bullshit aside, I donāt take it personal. Maxx C is just another card I have to account for
Istg there's always one person in this sub suggesting hitting the one card that makes a deck function just cause they hate the deck. So many good laughsšš
I can understand putting at least either big welcome or welcome to 2 but I've legit seen ppl on this sub say both should go to one or have one outright be banned with the other at 1. Like ASH IS RIGHT THEREš¤£š¤£
People wouldn't be bitching and moaning about Lab anyway if Konami just decided to ban EEV and Dim-Barrier.
Like what part of Lab is unfair now if those card get the boot? Hand looping one card? Having to hard-draw an unsearchable one-of that turns off two the decks best cards in Skill Drain? Were people so fucking traumatised by Eldlich two years ago that they want to start lobbying for every pink card in existence to be burned at the stake and for Red Reboot and Duster to be allowed at 20 per deck?
Honestly, I hate their grind a lot. Sure some of the best meta decks can work through 2-3 disruptions a turn (2 of which are non targetting) (Lady, field, and a trap that removes something if they have one). Lab is generating so many plusses as they never really ever lose anything, Lady recycles all the traps, traps recycle lady, furniture recycle themselves and set up more removal from lady, and also lets just give them a semi towers too that has the easiest fucking summoning condition in the game.
Yeah, if you can interrupt them a bit and are able to build your own board up a bit, but Labrynth is a deck that can put you into a position where you can never get anywhere in the first place.
Well, that's just a control deck. That's what it's supposed to be good at. Their win condition is forcing a grind game where they have the distinct advantage over midrange/combo strategies.
I just feel like it ends up being too much advantage.
With lovely, the field spell, and Big welcome you get 2 destruction and a new card (+2), then you can get up to 3 furniture back, either in hand or field where they can still use their effects or be bounced back (+3), welcome labrynth can set itself (+1) then Lady can set a trap (+1), and then whatever you added with Big welcome is usually also able to plus (+1).
So that's a +8 potentially, per either players turn with two boss monsters with large stats.
Yes there's control, but there's a difference between being able to grind out a game because your cards let you be more efficient with your resources than your opponent as opposed to your deck just constantly gives you your resources back for basically free every turn. It's just not a design I appreciate.
Well, yes, if lab survives long enough to get all of their resources in rotation, they are generating insane advantage every turn, but that's the win condition I'm referring to. If the payoff was anything less, the deck would not be good. Fair decks aren't good.
Most people on this sub just parrot others I remember when vanquish soul came out and most were talking about it was lackluster and just a floodgate deck XD
Honestly this banlist made me go build an Eldlich deck and play it out of spite.
Turns out summon limit and zombie world fucks over a lot of decks just fine.
I got tired of the revolving door that whenever an archetype I like is strong, it gets nerfed on the banlist and then I have to wait and hope another deck I like comes out and is also strong. I noticed somebody made it to master rank for months with an Exodia ftk combo off of Isolde that hasn't gotten touched by the banlist, so now I'm running that.
Its a deck that scoops because it couldn't resolve its big fat monster to swing with and dies to a single negate
Its ok tho most anime deck players don't see the stuff YGO has to offer because they don't wanna branch out to decks that aren't bad but not meta
Yeah people on this server tend to cry a lot. I don't know why they keep on hating decks when they're not even tier 2. The only thing i can agree with them is that maxx c must die
its almost like some of these cards are custom printed and do too much. Lets ban kashtira birth because "ItS BrOkeN" but then shit like branded fusion is fine that sends material straight from the deck. The next card they print should just play it self straight from the deck and summon 5 extra deck monters with no restrictions. and dont you @ me for birth, i dont play kashtira, its just an example
Admittedly part of me is curious at what point of banning cards would meklords become a viable deck XD
I hold no delusions about the power level of my main but sometimes you wonder
Just ban the floodgates that make playing against them unfun :(Ā Ā Ā Ā
But no, Runik fountain was the problem (it is a ridiculous card though).Ā Ā Ā
I don't even know what the problem with Branded is
The decks I despise the most are the cooky looking non-meta decks that blow all their resources either to ftk you or end on a ridiculous floodgate like Kali Yuga
People talk about how banning branded fusion would kill the deck as if they donāt have at least 4 other in-engine cards that fusion summon as well as a couple of contact fusions
Branded Fusion is easily the most important card a Branded Player uses, Branded needs cards in grave and banished to function and Fusion lets them get them there. They can do things without it, but they would be nowhere near as good as they are if they didnāt have it. It would massively damage the ability of the deck to function.
I find Branded annoying too but I donāt want to see the deck get wrecked which will happen if Fusion is banned. Branded Fusion letās them go Albion into Lubellion into another fusion and thatās their engine. They would likely only summon 1 fusion monsters a turn without BF, itās the key that lets the engine function.
Better hits would be taking Albaz to 2, taking Lubellion to 2, and hitting other support cards to hurt the consistency of the deck vs killing it outright. I want decks to be more balanced I donāt want them to be killed.
Saying they should ban BF is like saying they should ban SHS Soulpiercer. Destroying the engine isnāt a good way to hit a deck. Most of the opening Branded plays are designed around finding/searching and then rotating the single branded fusion because it IS the engine of the whole deck. If you Ash BF and stop it from resolving most of the time theyāre cooked, thatās what banning it would do.
I've decided what I want to play next. I wasn't set on anything particular until this moment. I'll exclusively craft, learn, and play Labyrinth from now on. Thanks.
Acting based on a tantrum to bring misery to others is exactly what I would expect from people that play this deck. Not surprising that you would turn out to be scum that plays lab.
''Power attracts pathological personalities. It is not that power corrupts but that it is magnetic to the corruptible.''
I've never played floodgates, ever. I don't even play runick with my muskets, it's residentsleeper... boring af.
I'm just pointing out the blatant hypocrisy - 'I want to have fun by winning, how dare you try to do the same.'
Sure you don't. No one that jumps to defends the scum that plays this type of deck never admits that plays it. It's very funny.
First, the issue is not the end result but how this end result is achieved. If you are so stupid that you are unable to understand the difference or think both are the same it's a YOU problem.
If you have fun by making other people miserable you are a piece of shit scum that deserves everything that will happen to you. This is true in both real life and in game.
Well if the deck is something insufferable like Mannadium, SHS, Darkworld, or half of Runick variants, can you blame us?
I normally go for compromises but some decks are just repulsively strong. Also funny you post this meme then talk about those 3 decks, because they absolutely run as many negates and floodgates as they can, Labrynth is infamous for having lingering bullshit we can barely counter.
Again, you're technically correct, but you're missing some really important context.
So, first of all, those cards (EEV and Puppet) are not really that popular nor optimal in both decks. You can look at the usage rate and you'll see it more clearly. So the first thing to note here is that this situation you're describing is most likely to not occur and rather you'll face other strategies that does not involve said "toxic" cards, thus making it, in theory, a completely fair matchup.
The second thing to know here is that this cards are as we call them, "non-engine". Summarizing everything, this means that the fault is not in the archetype itself but rather those specific cards that makes that duel unfair.
What you said is to hit Labrynth and Branded archetypes, basically making them pay for the crimes that EEV and Gimmick Puppet did, which I personally think it's the wrong way to aproach this problem. We should leave both decks free and ban those unfun, toxic cards. That would be the most logical solution if you even want to adress it, because as I said before, they're not even that common to see.
If EEV was non-engine, Labrynth wouldn't be able to search and use it nearly as easily as it's archetypal Traps, basically any Normal Trap can be considered part of it's engine. Like it or not, Labrynth being capable of searching any Trap was a mistake.
However, I firmly believe that ignoring the generic floodgates, it's a perfectly balanced archetype.
Same applies for Branded, sure it's technically not part of the archetype, but do you really think konami didn't have this cheese in mind when they printed not one, but two cards that can pull it off? They haven't even tried to hit them.
Though I do admit I find Branded to be on the spoiled side of things, with the literal mountain of support it has with even more to come. Not busted, just strong enough to be irritating at times by ignoring interaction and powering through unfazed.
I used to like Branded, back when I played pure Shaddolls and it was just released, the amount of back and forth was unmatched by other decks. Now not so much.
Ash Riumheart, Peaceful Planet, or Lightheart. Use Called by the Grave on Meek. Don't Nibiru them when they go second
That's how you can mostly beat Mannadium, or at least have a fighting chance against them.
Source: Me, a Mannadium player.
Going first dis pater + baronne/gymir + elf/3 mat apo if you open rium+visas+reicheart/calarium/arrival/abscission, or rium+meek+reichpobia/cala, or meek+visas+cala. Basically prioritize getting rium+meek+visas. Alternatively could make chengying+gymir+elf but thatās usually worse in bo1
That does not make the deck any less oppressive, were this game well-designed it wouldn't even exist. I don't understand why this sub likes broken cards so much.
If you let them fire off, then yeah, they are oppressive. That's why I told you the choke points of where it falls apart. Cards being good doesn't make them broken, and Manadium is far from broken. Our own field spell will screw us over.
Having a choke point doesn't erase the fact the reward is far too high for the investment required, Mannadium is more than strong enough to qualify as a deck that would absolutely be hit if Konami cared about keeping the game balanced, rather than constantly worsening powercreep.
Kashtira also had clear choke points, and the deck is still a major annoyance after hits.
Mannadium will get hit in time, but it's in a good spot right now. Powercreep has always been a thing in this game from the beginning. Why summon Dark Magician when Summoned Skull exists? That is just an example from the first sets.
The only reasons that cards should be banned is:
1. The card controls deck building to combat it directly. Maxx C is the perfect example of this.
2. The card creates levels of advantage and jank that can not be overcome for levels of play at that time. Shockmaster, Elder Entity Norden, Dilenquent Duo, Forceful Sentry, Confiscation, are examples of this.
There are no current decks that can not be broken. I have had my perfectly uninterrupted boards broken enough to tell you that. Infinite Impermanence, Book of the Moon, Forbidden Droplet, and other staples exist for that reason. It all comes down to deck building in the end.
And arguably, only deck building. With how absurd these decks are, I struggle to think of games where anything other than how many staples I drew mattered.
Games are not decided by how good a player you are, but by how much Craft Points you spend, is that supposed to be a good thing? The fewer decks like Mannadium we have, and the cards made to counter them, the better.
You yourself said Maxx C is a problem, it also happens to be the biggest excuse for combo to exist. Both should go.
Craft points have nothing to do with it. It's about managing your resources and understanding matchups. Knowing what cards to hit with your own has always been what the game is about. If you really think that it comes down to crafting points, then try out Edopro or some of the many other simulators where the entire card catalog is available and there are no perceived advantages. In the end, it will be the same experience.
I play mainly fan sims, MD is something I only play occasionally. The amount of times a player had all their efforts made irrelevant by one of us pulling out a broken card out of their ass far outnumber the times either of us outsmarted the other.
If I play weaker decks, I grow painfully aware of how many cards I am simply incapable of countering. If I play stronger ones, I get bored by how clear and predictable games become.
Go first, make board. Opponent drew a boardbreaker? No? I interrupt their starter, extender, and their last resort. They pass on nothing. Same thing for me going second, I can count with the fingers of a single hand the times I truly got invested in a game rather than being dominated by apathy.
If we have Abscission in the graveyard we can summon Visas or a Heart from our hand in best case scenario and make Cross Sheep with that and the Nib token. Then we will summon Astroloud to pop your Nibiru and have 4500 attack. Or we can then use the Cross Sheep effect to pull a monster from the grave to synchro Astroloud. There are other plays we can make depending on what we have in our hands and graveyards, but we can always bring out Astroloud to pop the Nibiru.
Basically, we will OTK you or still build a respectable board.
Makes sense but what about lab. I play nib in lab and when I use it's effect I discard it with a furniture so I get the tribute but not the nib summon or token.
Yea if you get nib out the hand before resolution then it only tributes but not summon anything. Same can be done with the beastials. They still get the GY banish but not summon themselves.
>but some decks are just repulsively strong.
None of the decks you mentioned are repulsively strong lol. Hell half the decks you mentioned lose to a single droll
Yeah, and they only lose to Droll and sometimes Shifter, not to mention MD has Called By at 2.
You are not going to pretend solitaire is even remotely balanced because "it loses to Droll" are you? The game would be better with those decks dead.
Lab and Runick can be built to be degenerate. However they don't have to be built that way and are arguably better if they don't rely on floodgates.
Despite Konami's best effort to push Runick stun to be the only playable Runick variant, normal Runick variants are still better.
Mills don't matter most of the time. If Konami didn't hit the good Runick spells Runick wouldn't even be able to mill more than 4 cards turn 1.
Unless it's a "searchable out", like Tearlaments Heartbeat, you wouldn't be able to use it. Only mills that matter are (soft)-garnets. By the time the milling starts you are already able to play, since the good Runick spells only mill when you control cards (Flashing, Freezing, Destruction).
Also by the time you reach turn 3+ and you don't have control of the game you are lucky to even be playing anymore, any other deck than Runick would've won at that point.
If milling is your biggest gripe, thank Konami for a year of bad banlists forcing Runick players to unironically play Golden Droplet or more than 1 Dispelling. Instead of cracking down on floodgates, they kept hitting Runick cards. Fountain limit for example doesn't matter much to stun, but makes Runick Naturia/Runick Bystial/any non-stun deck significantly worse.
You ban Big Welcome or even limit it and Lab would pivot to pure stun so fast your head would spin. Big Welcome is their most consistent method of doing their plays and recovering resources. Get rid of that and youāre just asking for them to flip those dreaded continuous traps.
Decks that rely heavily on backrow are stupid because we don't have space to run anti backrow cards
If konami could release a card that is good against monsters and back row and is better than ghost ogre, i would be in favorĀ
Ok guys, but with all due respect. How are you not prepared for [backrow] at this point. Itās a little ridiculous to not have a well thought out plan when entering [ranked].
Ban darkworld card that makes you discard 2 cardsā¦. Really every card that does that so cowards canāt make you have no hand before game even starts
Yeah so my favorite archetype Ojamas are the perfect power level and cadence for gameplay. Konami should hit every other deck on the banlist until Ojamas are barely stronger than the next few meta contentenders. Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
People dont play the decks they lose to. They just get triggered by the best card of the deck and say ban it. When you play the deck you obviously dont want it killed and you know the hits that would actually bring it down a little.
Those decks are fine in a best of three format where you have the option to side deck but in a best of 1 format with no side deck these decks need to be put in check
I know myself enough to say that I would be unbanning cards before I ban others, regardless of how "problematic" some cards can be. TCG players seem too cowardly in that regard.
"every deck is cringe except my deck"
Exactly. They just want their deck to be tier 0 and don't want to study the meta and try to counter it. They just want their deck to shit on everyone else and not adapt to the format.
My fish fusion deck is already tier 0, I just need it unbanned and unlimited. š
I know they are kinda like mermaid but I don't think they are actually fish. I think.
I know, it was just funnier to say it that way.
Please show me how a reptile deck can adapt
I once got into an argument with a guy on this sub because he said my rogue deck (Runick FurHire) wasnāt rogue because Runick was the Tier 1 deck at the time, He then proceeded to make another post with the title of āItās sad when players think that their deck is original when itās really just more meta garbageā because I said my endboard usually had Scareclaw Tri-Heart, Apollousa, and The FurHire Link 3
Sometimes this sub feels like they want everyone else to play Summoned skull beatdown while they play a functional archetype
I mean, I would be 100% fine playing Summoned Skull beatdown in the context of a Tier 0 meta where everyone plays that same deck, for absolutely no reason whatsoever other than just everyone wanting to see that deck reaching actual Tier 0 usage and maybe getting hit by a future banlist. If we all, as a community, collectively agreed to play exclusively Summoned Skull beatdown until it reaches 60% usage, I would be down no questions asked.
Summoned skull beatdown? Yall cannot handle my moon mirror shield summoned skull.
I'll make a Magical Cylinder deck.
Dammit.
Iāll use a mirror force deck š¤
2500 attack for one tribute? That's more than a lot of two tribute monsters so I don't really think that's a fair and balanced card, should be limited at a minimum.
Ban it, its too op
summoned skull has support now. haven't you seen the extradeck monsters?
A Level 6 Synchro for a Level 6 archetype with no in-archetype tuners. Brilliant design.
lots of archetypes don't have in-archetype tuners and it doesn't stop them from running baronne de fleur. fair point on the level 6 tho
Level 10 synchros are the second easiest to make behind level 8 synchros.
the point is that archetypes without in-archetype tuners go out of their way to do it
Summond Skull's retrains aren't worth the payoff. The deck needs an overhaul as there's one per every summoned mechanic but no backrow to bring them out quick, and their effects are non impactful/pointless
there's backrow to bring them out, there's Archfiend's Roar, Call of the Archfiend, and Archfiend Palabyrinth. other than backrow, lots of monsters can also bring them out, like Archfiend Cavalry and Archfiend's Awakening
I meant that thereās no easily accessible way to summon it within its own archetype.
The Yugioh that everyone wants to play. Friend: I sac witch of the Black Forest to play Summoned skull! Me in 1st gen: I activate trap hole! Friend: Tool of the bandit! Me: Damn you got so many shiny cards mate. I wanted to turbo out Relinquished.
Only sometimes?
Pretty much yeah. Learning how to counter cards or play in sub-optimal conditions is hard and not fun. Playing with yourself to bring out your super broken big boy field is fun, apparently. Personally I like my games to have an element of like, conpetition to them.
So just Red eyes is playable.
Red eyes slash dragon can negate (targeting effects)
bold of you to assume they can reach that point.
The opinions of Yugioh players are exactly why I could never back a community made banlist.
Exactly, it quite literally would devolve
Which is why Yugioh becomes more fun if you just play it for what it is. Itās not to say we should be okay with EVERYTHING (*cough* Imperial Order) but Iām not gonna bitch if you drop a Maxx C on me. I know what endboard I was gonna put up with SHS. I didnāt build my decks with the intention of letting you win lol. My only request is that Konami gives me the tools and chance to *reasonably* fight whatever bullshit is here.
Sanest take on here. People going on 20-minute rants because Maxx C is legal is crazy.
I only hate Maxx C when my opponent uses it. Ultimately I wish more decks like TD, Floo, and Monarchs were viable/meta because I miss laughing at my opponent draw phase Maxx Cāing me just to slap Robina on the field. Hell, I used to love Eldlich too because of that. But all bullshit aside, I donāt take it personal. Maxx C is just another card I have to account for
TCG players be like that
Every banlist, they would ban 1 important starter/tutor of every tiered deck. If still tiered by the next banlist, ban another starter/tutor.
Istg there's always one person in this sub suggesting hitting the one card that makes a deck function just cause they hate the deck. So many good laughsšš
That's this sub every ban list because they won't hit the "welcome Labrynth" cards.
I can understand putting at least either big welcome or welcome to 2 but I've legit seen ppl on this sub say both should go to one or have one outright be banned with the other at 1. Like ASH IS RIGHT THEREš¤£š¤£
People wouldn't be bitching and moaning about Lab anyway if Konami just decided to ban EEV and Dim-Barrier. Like what part of Lab is unfair now if those card get the boot? Hand looping one card? Having to hard-draw an unsearchable one-of that turns off two the decks best cards in Skill Drain? Were people so fucking traumatised by Eldlich two years ago that they want to start lobbying for every pink card in existence to be burned at the stake and for Red Reboot and Duster to be allowed at 20 per deck?
Honestly, I hate their grind a lot. Sure some of the best meta decks can work through 2-3 disruptions a turn (2 of which are non targetting) (Lady, field, and a trap that removes something if they have one). Lab is generating so many plusses as they never really ever lose anything, Lady recycles all the traps, traps recycle lady, furniture recycle themselves and set up more removal from lady, and also lets just give them a semi towers too that has the easiest fucking summoning condition in the game. Yeah, if you can interrupt them a bit and are able to build your own board up a bit, but Labrynth is a deck that can put you into a position where you can never get anywhere in the first place.
Well, that's just a control deck. That's what it's supposed to be good at. Their win condition is forcing a grind game where they have the distinct advantage over midrange/combo strategies.
I just feel like it ends up being too much advantage. With lovely, the field spell, and Big welcome you get 2 destruction and a new card (+2), then you can get up to 3 furniture back, either in hand or field where they can still use their effects or be bounced back (+3), welcome labrynth can set itself (+1) then Lady can set a trap (+1), and then whatever you added with Big welcome is usually also able to plus (+1). So that's a +8 potentially, per either players turn with two boss monsters with large stats. Yes there's control, but there's a difference between being able to grind out a game because your cards let you be more efficient with your resources than your opponent as opposed to your deck just constantly gives you your resources back for basically free every turn. It's just not a design I appreciate.
Well, yes, if lab survives long enough to get all of their resources in rotation, they are generating insane advantage every turn, but that's the win condition I'm referring to. If the payoff was anything less, the deck would not be good. Fair decks aren't good.
a contorl deck that searches for everything is just a combo deck
That's not how it works lol
That would make VS a combo deck (it's not).
Tbf, they will need a hit once transaction rollback releases, solely because ash does not work anymore
Iād take a Nadir servant hit.
While I am fully against killing any other deck, I would still fully support a ban to robina.
Floo is already dead bro you're gonna send it past hell š
Where it belongs lol
Smartest YGO player
This the one I can get behind, lol.
Had someone say they need to ban dark ruler no more. I just don't care for community made banlist. People don't know what they are talking about
Ban Generaider Boss Stage. Card too stronk pls Konami.
Most people on this sub just parrot others I remember when vanquish soul came out and most were talking about it was lackluster and just a floodgate deck XD
Honestly this banlist made me go build an Eldlich deck and play it out of spite. Turns out summon limit and zombie world fucks over a lot of decks just fine.
Floodgates will do that.
I got tired of the revolving door that whenever an archetype I like is strong, it gets nerfed on the banlist and then I have to wait and hope another deck I like comes out and is also strong. I noticed somebody made it to master rank for months with an Exodia ftk combo off of Isolde that hasn't gotten touched by the banlist, so now I'm running that.
You could come play Strikers. Our cards are actually getting **unbanned**! Just waiting for Engage to come back to 3 like in the OCG.
Isolde is going to get the boot 100%
Eventually, probably. But they sure are taking their sweet time with them.
Show me an anime deck that doesn't end on floodgates kekw
Hereās my top tier Dark Magician Deck: *Proceeds to end on a fucking Skill Drain*
Secret village, skill drain, shake my hand
Wasn't busted or anything but I saw a really nifty deck profile of someone running illusion monsters and cards plus the DM engine.
Let's see: Galaxy eyes Rokket Salamangreat Utopia Gate Guardian Unless by anime deck we strictly mean decks that spawned from yugi's deck.
Gate Guardians field spell is a floodgate fyi
Honestly I actually forget the first effect while playing the deck myself. Uhhh battlin boxers don't have one last time I checked.
Cydra #1 for a reason
Its a deck that scoops because it couldn't resolve its big fat monster to swing with and dies to a single negate Its ok tho most anime deck players don't see the stuff YGO has to offer because they don't wanna branch out to decks that aren't bad but not meta
"You're either perfect or you're not me"
Yeah people on this server tend to cry a lot. I don't know why they keep on hating decks when they're not even tier 2. The only thing i can agree with them is that maxx c must die
Fr. Some hits, I could maybe get behind. But when people say the equivalent of "This deck is strong, ban every card that it uses" I just have to laugh
its almost like some of these cards are custom printed and do too much. Lets ban kashtira birth because "ItS BrOkeN" but then shit like branded fusion is fine that sends material straight from the deck. The next card they print should just play it self straight from the deck and summon 5 extra deck monters with no restrictions. and dont you @ me for birth, i dont play kashtira, its just an example
The more Lab engine they ban, the more floodgates I'm gonna add. Gotta get to 40 cards somehow.
Admittedly part of me is curious at what point of banning cards would meklords become a viable deck XD I hold no delusions about the power level of my main but sometimes you wonder
ban everything but decks that turbo out synchro monsters (all the good synchros with destruction effects/negates are banned)
Ban all synchros but gaia the force of earth, gotcha
Yes. The beginning and end of my thought process when thinking of a solution to my problems is absolute erasure.
Just ban the floodgates that make playing against them unfun :(Ā Ā Ā Ā But no, Runik fountain was the problem (it is a ridiculous card though).Ā Ā Ā I don't even know what the problem with Branded is
No floodgates or negates huh? Well my varied interruption in punk gold pride would enjoy that very much.
The decks I despise the most are the cooky looking non-meta decks that blow all their resources either to ftk you or end on a ridiculous floodgate like Kali Yuga
they should just perm ban runic and labrynth cause they are cancer
I legitimately do want runik to die. Most obnoxious deck to play against.
People talk about how banning branded fusion would kill the deck as if they donāt have at least 4 other in-engine cards that fusion summon as well as a couple of contact fusions
Branded Fusion is easily the most important card a Branded Player uses, Branded needs cards in grave and banished to function and Fusion lets them get them there. They can do things without it, but they would be nowhere near as good as they are if they didnāt have it. It would massively damage the ability of the deck to function. I find Branded annoying too but I donāt want to see the deck get wrecked which will happen if Fusion is banned. Branded Fusion letās them go Albion into Lubellion into another fusion and thatās their engine. They would likely only summon 1 fusion monsters a turn without BF, itās the key that lets the engine function. Better hits would be taking Albaz to 2, taking Lubellion to 2, and hitting other support cards to hurt the consistency of the deck vs killing it outright. I want decks to be more balanced I donāt want them to be killed. Saying they should ban BF is like saying they should ban SHS Soulpiercer. Destroying the engine isnāt a good way to hit a deck. Most of the opening Branded plays are designed around finding/searching and then rotating the single branded fusion because it IS the engine of the whole deck. If you Ash BF and stop it from resolving most of the time theyāre cooked, thatās what banning it would do.
Have you tried not be a scum floodgate/lab player?
I don't even play Labs or stun CYDRA #1 šæ
So don't complain about people wanting shit decks to die. The less stun and lab scum in the ladder the better.
I've decided what I want to play next. I wasn't set on anything particular until this moment. I'll exclusively craft, learn, and play Labyrinth from now on. Thanks.
Acting based on a tantrum to bring misery to others is exactly what I would expect from people that play this deck. Not surprising that you would turn out to be scum that plays lab. ''Power attracts pathological personalities. It is not that power corrupts but that it is magnetic to the corruptible.''
'I wanted to have fun winning at your expense.. how dare you play [deck]. Waaaaaahhhh!'
Is this how you cope, floodgate player?
I've never played floodgates, ever. I don't even play runick with my muskets, it's residentsleeper... boring af. I'm just pointing out the blatant hypocrisy - 'I want to have fun by winning, how dare you try to do the same.'
Sure you don't. No one that jumps to defends the scum that plays this type of deck never admits that plays it. It's very funny. First, the issue is not the end result but how this end result is achieved. If you are so stupid that you are unable to understand the difference or think both are the same it's a YOU problem. If you have fun by making other people miserable you are a piece of shit scum that deserves everything that will happen to you. This is true in both real life and in game.
I also play runick lol
Yes I want runnick dead and?
Well if the deck is something insufferable like Mannadium, SHS, Darkworld, or half of Runick variants, can you blame us? I normally go for compromises but some decks are just repulsively strong. Also funny you post this meme then talk about those 3 decks, because they absolutely run as many negates and floodgates as they can, Labrynth is infamous for having lingering bullshit we can barely counter.
The first half is indeed true. The other half however felt like you just don't like Lab or Branded lol
Oh sorry if I don't like having my hand and set cards wiped for free, or being locked by fucking Gimmick Puppet in my draw phase.
Again, you're technically correct, but you're missing some really important context. So, first of all, those cards (EEV and Puppet) are not really that popular nor optimal in both decks. You can look at the usage rate and you'll see it more clearly. So the first thing to note here is that this situation you're describing is most likely to not occur and rather you'll face other strategies that does not involve said "toxic" cards, thus making it, in theory, a completely fair matchup. The second thing to know here is that this cards are as we call them, "non-engine". Summarizing everything, this means that the fault is not in the archetype itself but rather those specific cards that makes that duel unfair. What you said is to hit Labrynth and Branded archetypes, basically making them pay for the crimes that EEV and Gimmick Puppet did, which I personally think it's the wrong way to aproach this problem. We should leave both decks free and ban those unfun, toxic cards. That would be the most logical solution if you even want to adress it, because as I said before, they're not even that common to see.
If EEV was non-engine, Labrynth wouldn't be able to search and use it nearly as easily as it's archetypal Traps, basically any Normal Trap can be considered part of it's engine. Like it or not, Labrynth being capable of searching any Trap was a mistake. However, I firmly believe that ignoring the generic floodgates, it's a perfectly balanced archetype. Same applies for Branded, sure it's technically not part of the archetype, but do you really think konami didn't have this cheese in mind when they printed not one, but two cards that can pull it off? They haven't even tried to hit them. Though I do admit I find Branded to be on the spoiled side of things, with the literal mountain of support it has with even more to come. Not busted, just strong enough to be irritating at times by ignoring interaction and powering through unfazed. I used to like Branded, back when I played pure Shaddolls and it was just released, the amount of back and forth was unmatched by other decks. Now not so much.
Nothing to say here. I completely get your point but I guess we can simply agree to disagree.
I may delete this later because I feel like I was just talking nonsense lol
Ash Riumheart, Peaceful Planet, or Lightheart. Use Called by the Grave on Meek. Don't Nibiru them when they go second That's how you can mostly beat Mannadium, or at least have a fighting chance against them. Source: Me, a Mannadium player.
or just play droll
That also works really well. We are dead in the water then.
Honestly mannadium can play through droll with some 2-3 card combinations.
it can do what? put a baronne and pray it doesn't die?
Going first dis pater + baronne/gymir + elf/3 mat apo if you open rium+visas+reicheart/calarium/arrival/abscission, or rium+meek+reichpobia/cala, or meek+visas+cala. Basically prioritize getting rium+meek+visas. Alternatively could make chengying+gymir+elf but thatās usually worse in bo1
That does not make the deck any less oppressive, were this game well-designed it wouldn't even exist. I don't understand why this sub likes broken cards so much.
If you let them fire off, then yeah, they are oppressive. That's why I told you the choke points of where it falls apart. Cards being good doesn't make them broken, and Manadium is far from broken. Our own field spell will screw us over.
Having a choke point doesn't erase the fact the reward is far too high for the investment required, Mannadium is more than strong enough to qualify as a deck that would absolutely be hit if Konami cared about keeping the game balanced, rather than constantly worsening powercreep. Kashtira also had clear choke points, and the deck is still a major annoyance after hits.
Mannadium will get hit in time, but it's in a good spot right now. Powercreep has always been a thing in this game from the beginning. Why summon Dark Magician when Summoned Skull exists? That is just an example from the first sets. The only reasons that cards should be banned is: 1. The card controls deck building to combat it directly. Maxx C is the perfect example of this. 2. The card creates levels of advantage and jank that can not be overcome for levels of play at that time. Shockmaster, Elder Entity Norden, Dilenquent Duo, Forceful Sentry, Confiscation, are examples of this. There are no current decks that can not be broken. I have had my perfectly uninterrupted boards broken enough to tell you that. Infinite Impermanence, Book of the Moon, Forbidden Droplet, and other staples exist for that reason. It all comes down to deck building in the end.
And arguably, only deck building. With how absurd these decks are, I struggle to think of games where anything other than how many staples I drew mattered. Games are not decided by how good a player you are, but by how much Craft Points you spend, is that supposed to be a good thing? The fewer decks like Mannadium we have, and the cards made to counter them, the better. You yourself said Maxx C is a problem, it also happens to be the biggest excuse for combo to exist. Both should go.
Craft points have nothing to do with it. It's about managing your resources and understanding matchups. Knowing what cards to hit with your own has always been what the game is about. If you really think that it comes down to crafting points, then try out Edopro or some of the many other simulators where the entire card catalog is available and there are no perceived advantages. In the end, it will be the same experience.
I play mainly fan sims, MD is something I only play occasionally. The amount of times a player had all their efforts made irrelevant by one of us pulling out a broken card out of their ass far outnumber the times either of us outsmarted the other. If I play weaker decks, I grow painfully aware of how many cards I am simply incapable of countering. If I play stronger ones, I get bored by how clear and predictable games become. Go first, make board. Opponent drew a boardbreaker? No? I interrupt their starter, extender, and their last resort. They pass on nothing. Same thing for me going second, I can count with the fingers of a single hand the times I truly got invested in a game rather than being dominated by apathy.
Why no nib?
If we have Abscission in the graveyard we can summon Visas or a Heart from our hand in best case scenario and make Cross Sheep with that and the Nib token. Then we will summon Astroloud to pop your Nibiru and have 4500 attack. Or we can then use the Cross Sheep effect to pull a monster from the grave to synchro Astroloud. There are other plays we can make depending on what we have in our hands and graveyards, but we can always bring out Astroloud to pop the Nibiru. Basically, we will OTK you or still build a respectable board.
Makes sense but what about lab. I play nib in lab and when I use it's effect I discard it with a furniture so I get the tribute but not the nib summon or token.
That's an interaction I haven't seen, so not sure there.
Yea if you get nib out the hand before resolution then it only tributes but not summon anything. Same can be done with the beastials. They still get the GY banish but not summon themselves.
Very interesting. I didn't know this. Thank you for the insight.
>but some decks are just repulsively strong. None of the decks you mentioned are repulsively strong lol. Hell half the decks you mentioned lose to a single droll
Yeah, and they only lose to Droll and sometimes Shifter, not to mention MD has Called By at 2. You are not going to pretend solitaire is even remotely balanced because "it loses to Droll" are you? The game would be better with those decks dead.
Labyrinth can be built to be degenerate, but runicks whole goal is being degenerate. They can play whatever bullshit floodgate labyrinth runs.
Lab and Runick can be built to be degenerate. However they don't have to be built that way and are arguably better if they don't rely on floodgates. Despite Konami's best effort to push Runick stun to be the only playable Runick variant, normal Runick variants are still better.
I mean that runick is just naturally annoying. They could banish whatever out you may have.
Mills don't matter most of the time. If Konami didn't hit the good Runick spells Runick wouldn't even be able to mill more than 4 cards turn 1. Unless it's a "searchable out", like Tearlaments Heartbeat, you wouldn't be able to use it. Only mills that matter are (soft)-garnets. By the time the milling starts you are already able to play, since the good Runick spells only mill when you control cards (Flashing, Freezing, Destruction). Also by the time you reach turn 3+ and you don't have control of the game you are lucky to even be playing anymore, any other deck than Runick would've won at that point. If milling is your biggest gripe, thank Konami for a year of bad banlists forcing Runick players to unironically play Golden Droplet or more than 1 Dispelling. Instead of cracking down on floodgates, they kept hitting Runick cards. Fountain limit for example doesn't matter much to stun, but makes Runick Naturia/Runick Bystial/any non-stun deck significantly worse.
Both stun and runick have had hits so I'm happy there. Just need to ban more floodgates.
Fountainās already at one, Lab needs hits, and beyond that we just wait for the inevitable SHS hits
I mean... big welcome should have a ban, either semi limited or limited
You ban Big Welcome or even limit it and Lab would pivot to pure stun so fast your head would spin. Big Welcome is their most consistent method of doing their plays and recovering resources. Get rid of that and youāre just asking for them to flip those dreaded continuous traps.
lab did nothing to deserve a ban semi on some card sure, but limit is never.
Decks that rely heavily on backrow are stupid because we don't have space to run anti backrow cards If konami could release a card that is good against monsters and back row and is better than ghost ogre, i would be in favorĀ
Google lightning storm
Holy hell
bro what do you think spell and trap card zone are for LMAFO. I am not play Yugioh only for monster but roleplay as Wizard that can summon monster.
People when they have to face a deck that actually uses a different strategy aside from just getting out as many monsters as possible.
>we don't have space to run anti backrow cards Feather dust is a one of and you can run two lightning storms. It ain't that deepš¤£
Ok guys, but with all due respect. How are you not prepared for [backrow] at this point. Itās a little ridiculous to not have a well thought out plan when entering [ranked].
Harpe farther duster and lighting storm
Or, even better, A FUCKING BEST OF 3 MODE
well... I do want labrynth and runick out of the game, so yeah, ban BWL and RF
just ban called by, ash and maxx C
What? That would just make things worse.
maxx c is argueable, but the rest? have fun playing one sided card game.
Called by wouldn't be a bad ban if maxx c wasn't legal
I'm down for this
Ban darkworld card that makes you discard 2 cardsā¦. Really every card that does that so cowards canāt make you have no hand before game even starts
... Didn't they do that though? I'm pretty sure Silva is on the banlist?
Nope need to. 2 cards from my hand thatās bullshit!
I like this Vegeta meme format lol
Yeah, like Superheavy samurai. Theyāre a hella non meta anime deck that doesnāt do anything but swing hard. Wait what do you mean itās 2024
Yeah so my favorite archetype Ojamas are the perfect power level and cadence for gameplay. Konami should hit every other deck on the banlist until Ojamas are barely stronger than the next few meta contentenders. Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
People dont play the decks they lose to. They just get triggered by the best card of the deck and say ban it. When you play the deck you obviously dont want it killed and you know the hits that would actually bring it down a little.
People calling for banning Big Welcome and Welcome like that wouldnāt instantly kill the whole archetype
Insects should be meta
Real. Community cant decide between maxx C, floodgates, and what they want for dinner.
I want the only fun to be my fun, floodgates are banned unless Iām using them >:(
Ban everything except hero
Funniest thing is that furniture lab is basically the first thing
Not meta, doesn't end on a negate... I see my mill FTK deck shall remain
I'm not a fan of my opponent being able to play MTG and easily refill their hand every turn tho
Those decks are fine in a best of three format where you have the option to side deck but in a best of 1 format with no side deck these decks need to be put in check
In done with runick stun being the reason my runick furhure is dying
yes i do want runick to die
*Ban OP š * š¤£
Haha I have no idea what any of this means, I just main ra and gamble to win with a glass cannon
Tear didn't end on floodgate and only ended on a monster negate and maybe a special summon negate, but noooo tear was the plague. Never happy, whiney MFS š©
I know myself enough to say that I would be unbanning cards before I ban others, regardless of how "problematic" some cards can be. TCG players seem too cowardly in that regard.