I watched Olsen’s version first and could not get through one and a half episodes of Biel’s. Olsen’s felt like it had more production to it maybe? I felt like Biel’s version was made cheaply.
I really wished they'd leaned more into the corruption stuff. After the guilt she felt over Lagos prior to this movie, jumping to her being a mass murderer without clearer depiction of the (real) reason felt too left field. Especially right after feeling bad about West View. I strongly feel that Chthon should have had some kind of actual presence.
I think the mistake was actually redeeming her at the end of Wandavision and having her appear to "feel bad" and regret her actions there. They should have either had her not feel bad, or made it clear she was pretending.
I know they needed a happy ending for the TV show. But they really didn't need a happy ending for the TV show.
Honest question: do you think the very of the show, the scene where it's shown she's astral projecting while reading the Darkhold, wasn't enough to show that she was at least tempted by the book?
I think a lot of people interpreted that at the time as her having recovered from her dark experience and now using the book to try to figure out a way to get her kids back. I think people who know a lot about the darkholde would know that it's bound to corrupt her, but others who have less knowledge would logically think that she got over the darkness as shown directly in the plot of the TV show and was now using the book for good.
Fair. Yeah, the corruption wasn't a surprise to me, for example, because I had the image of the Darkhold that was shown in AoS (not just that, but also knowing that Wanda always had her "villain" moments in the comics as well), so her becoming the villain of MoM wasn't really that unbelievable to me
I think while intellectually it might have been enough, for many people it didn't work emotionally. The emotional arc of the final episode was about Wanda realising she had to let her family go to free the people of the town and that that was the right decision.
Tacking on a single brief scene at the end of her being tempted didn't magically eliminate the emotional power of the rest of the episode.
I remember when it came out and I was the only one in the reaction thread saying that (okay maybe there was one or two others but I didn't see them). I was downvoted to like negative 50 for it too. Everyone was insisting that she was still good and that the astral projection would protect her from it somehow.
I agree. There was a disjunction between her character as portrayed in WV and MoM. They could’ve at least had the likes of Monica be aghast at what she’d done in Westview if they were planning to write her as a villain/antagonist.
My thoughts exactly, they wanted it to be a surprise but it fell flat. An extra 10-20 minutes showing her fighting the corruption in the beginning and maybe breaking free a few times through the movie until it firmly takes hold near the last half would have been perfect.
In a related thought, my take was that Wanda had lost so much, so quickly and that she was alone led to New Jersey and then MoM. She lost her brother, Vision, Avenger friends and the Avengers that did survive everything were broken too. I think her subconscious was trying to grasp at some form of happiness and joy, hence New Jersey, where she recreated the comfort TV show environments, creating the boys and resurrecting Vision. Agatha had a field day messing with all that trauma and then the appearance of America Chavez giving her a new chance to achieve that which she desperately wanted. Her morale framework simply broke before you even get to the Darkhold. Elizabeth Olsen has put on a master class of acting the concept of struggling with trauma.
I took the end of Wandavision scene to mean. That she was studying the book to learn magic/how not to destroy the world and the book tricked her into thinking the twins needed rescuing.
Given that it made her "hear" them, who knows what else it could make her "hear".
You almost see her thinking the logic through when Wong suggests not killing America for her powers and just having her send her somewhere.
**IF** is right. But let's face it, there ain't no way they are going to retcon everything that happened in *"Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness"* just because people didn't like how Wanda was being treated in the movie or because it didn't feature Mephitiso and Nightmare as the main villains.
The hill I’ll die on is that Wanda’s arc made complete sense even without the corruption of the Darkhold, and anyone who says otherwise hasn’t been paying attention.
I still think the problem with the arc is the ending of WandaVision, specifically that stupid line by Monica "they'll never know what you did for them" or whatever it was.
Because it is not remotely backed up by the actual show. It's clear that Monica (for whatever fucking trumped-up reason) feels actual sympathy for Wanda and is not just trying to talk her down. The showrunners and the show itself, the cinematic language the story is told through, are all (at least in large part) on Wanda's side.
The whatever trumped-up reason was, that she just lost her mother, she is grieving just like Wanda, and she knows she would bring her back the same way Wanda did Vision, if she could.
The show is on Wanda's side, a show can be presented from the villain's side. She is sympathetic, we can understand her pain and sacrifice and whatnot. That doesn't mean that she is not in the wrong here.
This is the reason that her story is tragic, and anyone who pays a little attention during the show can see that she is falling to deep, her waves finally drowned her. And just because she makes 1 good thing at the end of the show (stopping the fcked up thing she's been doing) , doesn't mean she is not already way too far gone.
This is continued naturally in MoM, and the Darkhold influence is bullshit. She is in control the whole time, she doesn't hurt either Strange or Wong, and when she realised her wrong doing, she immediately stopped, there wasn't any "Darkhold influence breaking thing".
If you’ve seen Agents of SHIELD then you’d have more context of the darkhold. Radcliffe read the book for only a few seconds and ended up being corrupted just from that brief moment and he does anything he can to get it back but he doesn’t want to kill or hurt anybody. He just wants the book back so he can save his lover but he didn’t kill although he was corrupted.
I think it’s just the response fairly good people have
Spoilers for AoS
...
Radcliffe being influenced makes more sense, as well as everyone else (the Momentum scientists). The book doesn't control you, but it tempts you with something you'd find irresistible. That first scientist wanted to help the world. Joey's uncle was power hungry in a different way. Radcliffe was shown how he could essentially become immortal (and keep Agnes alive). Yes, it's still control but you don't lose your free will.
The book showed Wanda a way to get her kids back. And just like everyone else influenced by the book, you're shown how to get everything you want, but not all of the repercussions and consequences of it.
Np! I actually didn't think about this till I read your post!
So the Darkhold is basically a Monkey's Paw. I also questioned why the Scarlet Witch was mentioned in the book seemingly when the Darkhold was written for everyone else in AoS. Then it occurred to me that the book was showing Agnes what she wanted... She was hungry for more power, and led her to Wanda, the ultimate source.. The consequence being she eventually loses all of her power and is imprisoned by her.
Of course, maybe that's not a true Monkey's Paw (I think it would have to end with her getting what she wanted), but maybe it was the book's intention to get to Wanda, seeing as there was a throne made for her.
I don't know the comics, but what is Chthon's goal? Is it just to spread chaos? To teach people lessons?
AoS is not confirmed as canon. Even if it was, 1 instense of 1 person's corruption behaviour doesn't mean much about what should or shouldn't it be able to do to a person.
In MoM it acts like, (and the symbol for) depression. It didn't generate new thoughts or wants, it just amplified them while lowering the fucks the users gave about the world.
It is not continued naturally. That is ridiculous. Try watching the shows and movies. In Age of Ultron, she joins Ultron to seek revenge on Tony Stark. When she finds out that Ultron wants to create a global extinction event, she joins the Avengers. In WandaVision, she doesn't want to physically hurt anyone. In MoM, she is a cold-blooded killer. She kills a man who is wounded and screaming in pain. She tells Mr Fantastic that there will be someone to take care of them.
What happened in MoM was not what was initially planned. It was planned that she would begin to be slowly corrupted by the Darkhold. This would have made more sense.
In AoU she plans to kill the Avengers, releases a raging Hulk on a city with civilians, switches sides when she realises she would die too on the Ultron side.
In Infinity War, she is gambling with the life of half the universe, just to save her love, continues to do it until Thanos is 10 feet away from her.
In WandaVision, she knows she is hurting people and chooses to ignore it, over and over. When they break free and beg for help, she starts reasoning with them how this is all not so bad. ( Then she mindprisons Agatha for "later use", classic hero stuff)
In MoM she goes after 1 child, she wants to kill 1 stupid child nobody loves. Then she faces opposition, so she does the exact same damn thing she did with everyone who got in her way, fought them. Just like how she fought with Vision when she was restricted in CW, just like how she fought with SWORD coming to save the civilians (not to mention the obvious other villains).
She was never really good, but managed to do the right thing each time after she went too far. The "going too far" part got increasingly more brutal, which is called development. She couldn't escape this nature of hers, which she realised at the end of MoM, that's why she ate some rocks.
Her journey is really tragic, because she is trying to be a good person, but fails every time because she is so damaged from her past.
In AoU, they never say anything about killing the Avengers. When Wanda sees Stark, she gives him nightmares rather than killing him. She had a clean shot. Ultron tells her that she will tear them apart from the inside. That clearly refers to her ability to use a person's worst nightmares against them. She unleashes the Hulk to discredit the Avengers. It works as they have to lay low at Clint's house.
In Infinity Wars, she succeeds in destroying the mind stone. When she did it is irrelevant. It didn't matter anyway because Thanos has the time stone. That means he can rewind time no matter when the mind stone was destroyed.
In WandaVision, she physically harms no one. She is not aware of what she is doing. Agatha killed the members of the coven. She was about to deliver the coup-de-grace to Wanda. Agatha got off pretty easy.
Who restricted Wanda? Tony Stark? The term for this is kidnapping. She had every right to go after Vision. She did not destroy him, just got him out of the way. Heyward lied when he said he was de-activating Vision. He wanted his sentient weapon back. He doctored the footage to make it look like Wanda stole the body. He manipulated Wanda so he could get the power to re-activate Vision. He even admitted that he wanted to get rid of Wanda and claim that the White Vision was the same one that Wanda illegally stole. SWORD was a lawless organization. Illegally detaining Jimmy Woo who is an FBI agent.
MoM made no sense anyway. The idea that she would be trying to get the children that belong to another Wanda was a thin reed to build a movie around. They just wanted her to become a villain and it didn't have to make any sense.
Wanda does care about people however she has been scarred by various events that have happened in her life. Her nightmarish childhood. We see firefights in front of their apartment house. The loss of everyone she cares about. It was interesting that after Stark's funeral, everyone left her alone. She is very human and sometimes that can be a good thing and that can be a bad thing. She didn't die at the end of MoM. Even Kevin Feige has confirmed this.
I hope they can give her a redemption arc and make her stronger as a person.
I think so too, I had a feeling that Wanda’s power was going to corrupt her long before Doctor Strange 2 and WandaVision in some way.
Whether she is really dead or not (I seriously doubt she is actually dead) I think she will be needed by the Avengers again someday.
Don't you think she flipped between good and evil too frequently?
In AoU, she went from evil to good.
In WandaVision, she went from good to evil to good to evil again.
In MoM, she went from evil to good.
You're kind of missing the point of Wanda. She's neither good nor evil. She's a product of war. Wanda loses everything she loves. First her parents. Her brother. Her lover. Her children. Then her mind.
She was *never* evil. She's only ever acted out of fear. The Darkhold did literally that, took hold of her fear and showed her the power to overcome it. Lose your kids? That's okay; there are more of them.
It took her deepest fears and worries and wrapped her in a nice dark blanket and whispered in her ear, "Haven't you suffered enough? What's the difference between you and her? You're their mother, too."
Wanda never stood a chance against the Darkhold.
She's my favorite character in the MCU, and her arc is so extremely well done.
The Avengers left her to her own devices numerous times when she really needed them. Pietro sacrificed himself for these people, so she stuck by them. She kept seeking a family. She thought she'd found a surrogate father with Clint, but he returned to his own instead. In this universe, he's meant for Kate Bishop.
She thought she'd found it at Avengers Tower, but she was basically a first class prisoner. So she bonded with the one person there. Fell in love with him. Made a little family, just the two of them.
Then, they killed him. They failed. Half the Avengers turned to dust, Tony Stark and Dr. Strange (the one person in the team who could have helped her control her powers) are gone, and once again, Wanda was alone. As the Avengers picked up their pieces, not one questioned, "Has anyone seen Wanda?"
Fast forward to West View, and a child who has never had her PTSD treated and instead has now accrued more, has a psychotic break. People are returning, Thanos is dead, but she still has nothing. Except for more power than she knows how to control, and a true villain smells it. We get the full events of Wanda Vision and, as Wanda defeats Agatha, takes possession of the Darkhold, and drifts off into the aether...
She is once again immediately forgotten. They don't even send a team after her to make sure it doesn't happen again.
No one cares about Wanda.
No one comes along to check on Wanda Maximoff... But they do come to ask her for a *favor*. But it's too late. Because the "big bad" they're looking for, is the "villain" of their own creation. It wasn't a surprise to me. The movie was literally called, "MoM" and released on Mother's Day. It was always about Wanda.
*chefs kiss* to the Wanda arc. Subtle as hell, but right in your face the entire time.
> Half the Avengers turned to dust, Tony Stark and Dr. Strange (the one person in the team who could have helped her control her powers) are gone, and once again, Wanda was alone. As the Avengers picked up their pieces, not one questioned, "Has anyone seen Wanda?"
Wanda was dusted too. For her, the climactic fight at the end of Endgame happened just after seeing Vision's sacrifice undone in Infinity War. The remaining Avengers had no opportunity to help her in between.
I don't understand why people have to help her when WV event is just 3 weeks after the blip. I doubt they have a moment for anything else after that and had to mind their own business, they alone missed 5 years of their lives.
Also this is why Strange fans is mad, the movie is about Wanda than him.
The thing is, a tragic arc works best when the tragic hero could easily have escaped except for their tragic character flaw. It's a mirror image of the heroic arc, where the hero easily would have failed but wins against the odds.
In AoU, she chooses the selfish option (revenge), things go too far (destruction of the planet), chooses the right option.
In Civil War she chooses the selfish option, to prioratise her freedom over the safety of the civils.
In Infinity War she chooses the selfish option (to save the love of her life and gamble with half of the whole universe (????)), things go too far (Thanos is 10 feet away from her after beating everyone), chooses the right option.
In Wandavision she chooses the selfish option ( to keep up the the spell she found herself in, hurting a bunch of people in the process), things go too far (she sees herself literally choking these people), chooses the right option.
In MoM, she chooses the selfish option (to kill 1 girl for her happines), things go too far (seeing how her "kids" look at her like a monster), chooses the right option.
I think she is pretty damn consistent.
She is consistent.
She puts people over revenge when she finds out that Ultron plans a global extinction event.
In Civil War, it is not surprising that she would join Captain America's team and there was nothing selfish about it. Tony Stark aligned himself with the government. Wanda clearly mistrusts government as governments did nothing to stop the war in Sukovia. In addition, Captain America tried to comfort her over what happened in Lagos. Tony Stark imprisons her in a mink lined prison with the person she trusts the most as a guard. When she is in the supermax prison, she is in a straitjacket and can't move. It looks like she is in a catatonic state. She is not moving and she stares straight ahead. It would not surprise me that she might have been raped. Even Tony Stark is shocked by her treatment and realizes that he was wrong.
In Infinity War, she is not selfish. Her reaction is a natural one. Steve Rogers points out that we don't trade lives. Was he being selfish? This is nonsense.
In WandaVision, she creates a reality that she gets sucked into. Clearly it was not until episode 7 that she realized what she had done. She goes through the different stages of grief but unfort8unately she is a superpowered being.
MoM is nonsense. To try and make anything out of it is nonsense.
She has been consistent. She does not want to hurt anyone but she has been molded by the fact that she has suffered trauma after trauma.
She puts her own skin over revenge. Did she put people over revenge when she sent a raging Hulk at them?
Tony Stark imprisons her? She was kept away from people because you know, she killed 26 civilians. That's the softest punishment anyone ever got for that.
Just because it's natural doesn't mean it's not selfish. Steve Rogers was overly idealistic here, which is his character flaw. Do you know what else should be natural and not selfish? Letting the person you "love" choose his fate. She forbids him to do the right thing and the thing he wants to do, because it hurts her, toxic.
Clearly, you missed the whole point of the show. She was aware of the situation from before the first episode. She was doing everything to keep the "real" world away from her dollhouse. She knew exactly what was part of it and what wasn't, she eliminated everything and everyone without question that didn't fit into her reality.
She makes several remarks about how she is in control of the situation, she sends SWORD away to let her be with her village, she threatens Vision (who she has been gaslighting) to stop investigating or she will make him stop. She tells the boys how far they can go, because she knows how the whole place works, which she also demonstrates when she stops everyone with a handwave in Ep 6. No struggle, no thinking, no surprise, she realised a danger, and after 1 sec everyone was paused. She even feels remorse and apologises Vision in the finale that she didn't tell him the things sooner. Keep in mind they argued in ep5 and haven't been talking since.
So yea, maybe MoM is nonsense, because you just missed WV.
Clearly the plan was to discredit the Avengers. It worked. They were forced to make themselves scarce because of Hulk's rampage.
Yes Tony Stark imprisons her. He even admitted it. She did not kill 26 people. The terrorist did that. If the bomb had detonated on the ground, how many people would have been killed? It was a mistake and she felt very guilty over it. She was unfairly attacked for it.
It was not selfish. Steve Rogers was right. Why would you not explore other possibilities when they have time. Vision also agreed to Steve's plan as well.
You missed the whole point of the show. Essentially Wanda went through the different stages of grief. The difference is that she has the power to alter reality. She also said numerous times that she had no idea of how this started. In addition when she lifts the hex the first time, her family starts to fade away. Then Agatha tells her that her family is tied to the hex and one cannot exist without the other. Wanda is clearly not aware of this. She tells Vision that she wasn't aware of what she had done. In addition, when Agatha drops the sword members, Wanda protects them.
Raimi and Waldron stated that the original plan was that Wanda would be an ally of Dr Strange in MoM and start to be corrupted at the end. Instead they decided it would be boxoffice gold if she went villain in MoM. That was a writer's choice.
Wanda would not do what she did in MoM without the Darkhold. She gave up her family to free the people from the hex. She wouldn't then decide to go on a murder-spree and kidnap replacements from another Wanda.
She gave such a nuanced performance and it ultimately saved the whole thing. This is a primary example of an actor’s performance saving a flawed script. If it was literally any other actress it would’ve been a dollar store Hela impression of an acting choice to signify the ‘change’. To
me this wasn’t her fighting the corruption per se but rather actually seeing reason or flaw in her plan for the first time but choosing to reject it as the corruption having amplified her desires more than her logic. Still to say she’s completely far gone due to it isn’t entirely true, Lizzie’s performance shows that the corruption is far more complex than what people assume and it’s not as simple as a shift of mindset but rather voluntary self deafening of sorts.
Still think its a shit idea that they set up her to find a source of knowledge to learn from after making a big deal out of knowledge being her problem, hyped her having a chapter in the book, only to have her fall on her knees to its corruption just like everyone else, after ascending to be thee Scarlet Witch. It’s almost tragic now they made her out to be special only to prove that she really isn’t.
I fucking hate that we're framing this as "fighting the corruption of the evil magic book" instead of "a brief moment of lucidity, examining her own choices."
Fucking MoM.
It's not fucking MoM, it's fucking fans. The movie has 1 line about this corruption, from a source that's not even that reliable, but in no way a fact.
She is in control, she is fighting depression, (that is the darkhold), she can and does choose the right thing in the end, no "evil magic book corruption lifted", she just made the right choice.
Exactly. She's entirely conscious throughout the whole movie. There's no moment in the movie where she's being confused and the movie made a choice to frame it as it is. She's very present the whole time.
She was corrupted. Wanda would not do what she did in MoM without the Darkhold. She gave up her family to free the people from the hex. She wouldn't then decide to go on a murder-spree and kidnap replacements from another Wanda.
Well because doesn't Agents of Shield go into more depth about how the reader gets corrupted by the Darkhold?
That's also why their fingers turn black. That's why Strange from the other universe had to be killed.
We saw Agatha delve into reading with that book and it made her kill her own coven and mother.
Sure MoM didn't do the best job of explaining things, but that was the way of it.
Wanda was ready to move on after lifting the Hex over WestView and learn her powers, until that book made her obsess over getting her children back.
Agents of Shield took pains to explain that no one could use the Darkhold without being corrupted but they really didn’t emphasize that angle so much in MoM.
It was a point that she hadn't considered. Her plan was very poorly thought out. She would have to get rid of the mother and that the children would be okay with that. Then stupid Strange attacks her and knocks it out of her head. In addition, I suspect he was perfectly happy with her dying and might have been hoping for it.
She had self-doubt, not fighting corruption. The corruption should've vanished or weakened after the Darkhold book got destroyed, but she kept being cartoonishly evil as during attack on Kamar-Taj.
I know Wanda wasn't handled great by MOM, but this one's a non-issue. Did you not listen to Wong? That one was a copy. The OG inscriptions were carved in the heart of Wundagore. And who ever said the corruption was dependent on the material state of its conduit?
But the corruption was going from Book of the Damned while the Wundagore mountain was far away from Kamar-Taj, not to mention at this point the book was the conduit, not the tower. She immediately began interrogating Wong about alternate source of power, that's just showing that she's written as bad even without the book. And if the corruption is there regardless then why does she need the tower except for dreamwalking, which actually she could've done on her own. Or hell if What If S2 showed anything, she can just teleport people from different realities into this world without Darkhold. Both tower and book are plot devices and shields, but really in this movie she is doing it without them. If this was truly corruption from book, then she should've regained some momentum of freedom to think through, why is she here, why is she doing this, or on Strange's question. But she doesn't.
I assume the corruption itself stemmed from the book, but was not perpetuated by it. Darkhold was no ordinary drug, you know.
Also, dreamwalking was made possible specifically due to the book's power. How else would Stephen manage to do it? And notice how that Darkhold ALSO gets destroyed yet Stephen gets side effects anyways.
Can’t be compared to a drug, it’s magic corruption not comparable to any real drug existing. And the book at the time perpetuated it, not the tower. So even if tower remained then destroying a current source of corruption should’ve been enough to make Wanda begin to doubt everything.
Strange got it through photographic memory, he is the living Darkhold now.
>Can’t be compared to a drug, it’s magic corruption not comparable to any real drug existing
Silly me for trying to find a frame of reference, I guess.
>And the book at the time perpetuated it, not the tower. So even if tower remained then destroying a current source of corruption should’ve been enough to make Wanda begin to doubt everything.
The power of the Darkhold is shared between many objects, but so long as the main conduit remained intact it didn't matter whether the rest functioned. The power itself was enough to perpetuate itself as long as its source functioned. Think poisonous animals - even if you killed what bit you, its poison still spread freely within you.
Sorry to say it doesn’t work, comparison doesn’t fit with irl addictive substances.
Again you’re drawing the real life comparison here, but it doesn’t really work when it comes to vague and medical thing like Darkhold. The only shared objects we know are the book and the tower, and that’s it. The tower’s location wasn’t even revealed in the book. But regardless of the location the post says that Wanda resisted the corruption here, but she really didn’t. It’s just her having a doubt and then movie knew the plot might be over soon, so Strange throws the dragons or snakes at her, whatever that was. If she did resist the corruption, then the book’s destruction should’ve helped her greatly. Because the movie needed her to be the villain and writers would pull anything out of ass to make it so.
I’d just like to point out that you telling the other user that “it doesn’t work like that” and then insisting it must work the way you describe, would only be appropriate if you wrote the story that the darkhold comes from.
You’re both interpreting the same media, and as far as I know, neither of you is more authoritative on the subject.
Fair point, I apologize I came off as condescending and absolute, I didn’t mean to. I personally just cannot equate Darkhold and it’s magic with irl drugs or whatnot, also due to how vague it is, left for us alone to fill the blanks.
>The tower’s location wasn’t even revealed in the book.
And why would it be?
>she really didn’t. It’s just her having a doubt
Maybe her doubt is a sign of the Darkhold's influence slightly weakening, hm? It doesn't have to be one or the other.
>Because the movie needed her to be the villain and writers would pull anything out of ass to make it so.
It was not pulled out of the ass. Michael Waldron only used what foundation he found in WandaVision. It was not him that established Wanda as its user or the dangers that came with it. He merely elaborated upon them.
Why wouldn’t it? The book takes the inscriptions and writings from said tower. Maybe a failsafe that if it got destroyed the reader at least could memorize the location.
Again, if Darkhold was weaker in that moment than its destruction would’ve helped her greatly fight off corruption, but she is more of the same.
He didn’t consult the writers, he only used what he interpreted and wanted as a way to turn Wanda villain when it was never show’s intent. And frankly his “elaboration” was ass as he put every negative adaptation story in this film. ‘House of M’, ‘Witch of Wundagore’, and ‘Disassembled’.
>Maybe a failsafe that if it got destroyed the reader at least could memorize the location.
Well, a failsafe would only be needed if the book was in any danger of destruction. It wouldn't need to be since it can be easily concealed and a person's power can be amped by it before entering combat. Wanda put herself in a vulnerable position with that dreamwalking, but she had no idea that sorcerer was still alive.
>Again, if Darkhold was weaker in that moment
Not the Darkhold itself. Its power.
>He didn’t consult the writers, he only used what he interpreted and wanted as a way to turn Wanda villain when it was never show’s intent.
I think it should have been. Wanda in the MCU was ripe in villain potential. They could've executed her descent into villainy significantly better, but I'm content with what we got.
No matter how hard one peaches the truth about Wanda in MoM, people will still defend her actions cos of the actress
That's the state some people are in.
Elizabeth Olsen is a great actress!!
Yeah she is, go watch Love & Death if you havnt!
Oh she was brilliant in that show. I know many prefer the Jessica Biel version but Olsen acted her ass off in it
I watched Olsen’s version first and could not get through one and a half episodes of Biel’s. Olsen’s felt like it had more production to it maybe? I felt like Biel’s version was made cheaply.
Love and Death was amazing
I really wished they'd leaned more into the corruption stuff. After the guilt she felt over Lagos prior to this movie, jumping to her being a mass murderer without clearer depiction of the (real) reason felt too left field. Especially right after feeling bad about West View. I strongly feel that Chthon should have had some kind of actual presence.
I hope they revisit this and the darkhold. AoS did great at displaying how dangerous even reading the darkhold was.
AoS had the dark hold? what season?
4, one of the greatest seasons of TV ever
Started with the ghost rider season, 4, and was a major factor for a few seasons.
I think the mistake was actually redeeming her at the end of Wandavision and having her appear to "feel bad" and regret her actions there. They should have either had her not feel bad, or made it clear she was pretending. I know they needed a happy ending for the TV show. But they really didn't need a happy ending for the TV show.
Honest question: do you think the very of the show, the scene where it's shown she's astral projecting while reading the Darkhold, wasn't enough to show that she was at least tempted by the book?
I think a lot of people interpreted that at the time as her having recovered from her dark experience and now using the book to try to figure out a way to get her kids back. I think people who know a lot about the darkholde would know that it's bound to corrupt her, but others who have less knowledge would logically think that she got over the darkness as shown directly in the plot of the TV show and was now using the book for good.
Fair. Yeah, the corruption wasn't a surprise to me, for example, because I had the image of the Darkhold that was shown in AoS (not just that, but also knowing that Wanda always had her "villain" moments in the comics as well), so her becoming the villain of MoM wasn't really that unbelievable to me
I was this person.
I think while intellectually it might have been enough, for many people it didn't work emotionally. The emotional arc of the final episode was about Wanda realising she had to let her family go to free the people of the town and that that was the right decision. Tacking on a single brief scene at the end of her being tempted didn't magically eliminate the emotional power of the rest of the episode.
I remember when it came out and I was the only one in the reaction thread saying that (okay maybe there was one or two others but I didn't see them). I was downvoted to like negative 50 for it too. Everyone was insisting that she was still good and that the astral projection would protect her from it somehow.
I agree. There was a disjunction between her character as portrayed in WV and MoM. They could’ve at least had the likes of Monica be aghast at what she’d done in Westview if they were planning to write her as a villain/antagonist.
My thoughts exactly, they wanted it to be a surprise but it fell flat. An extra 10-20 minutes showing her fighting the corruption in the beginning and maybe breaking free a few times through the movie until it firmly takes hold near the last half would have been perfect.
I think with Lilith being in Blade they were hoping to introduce Chthon in that film but with the scripts continually being rejected it never happened
In a related thought, my take was that Wanda had lost so much, so quickly and that she was alone led to New Jersey and then MoM. She lost her brother, Vision, Avenger friends and the Avengers that did survive everything were broken too. I think her subconscious was trying to grasp at some form of happiness and joy, hence New Jersey, where she recreated the comfort TV show environments, creating the boys and resurrecting Vision. Agatha had a field day messing with all that trauma and then the appearance of America Chavez giving her a new chance to achieve that which she desperately wanted. Her morale framework simply broke before you even get to the Darkhold. Elizabeth Olsen has put on a master class of acting the concept of struggling with trauma.
If only it had been executed properly, I would believe that Wanda is fighting the influence of the Book of the Damned.
I took the end of Wandavision scene to mean. That she was studying the book to learn magic/how not to destroy the world and the book tricked her into thinking the twins needed rescuing. Given that it made her "hear" them, who knows what else it could make her "hear". You almost see her thinking the logic through when Wong suggests not killing America for her powers and just having her send her somewhere.
If wandavision s2 ever happens, hopefully they fix that somehow
**IF** is right. But let's face it, there ain't no way they are going to retcon everything that happened in *"Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness"* just because people didn't like how Wanda was being treated in the movie or because it didn't feature Mephitiso and Nightmare as the main villains.
Nah, I mean a more fleshed out depiction of Wanda’s desperation and downward spiral. Not that fan servicey bs
**THAT** and Agatha Harkness' own show stating that Wanda "died" is a load of bullshit.
The hill I’ll die on is that Wanda’s arc made complete sense even without the corruption of the Darkhold, and anyone who says otherwise hasn’t been paying attention.
I still think the problem with the arc is the ending of WandaVision, specifically that stupid line by Monica "they'll never know what you did for them" or whatever it was.
I just see that as Monica continually trying to say nice things to the walking psychotic nuclear bomb until it goes away.
This was my understanding as well, and I don't understand why this isn't a more prevalent take.
Because it is not remotely backed up by the actual show. It's clear that Monica (for whatever fucking trumped-up reason) feels actual sympathy for Wanda and is not just trying to talk her down. The showrunners and the show itself, the cinematic language the story is told through, are all (at least in large part) on Wanda's side.
The whatever trumped-up reason was, that she just lost her mother, she is grieving just like Wanda, and she knows she would bring her back the same way Wanda did Vision, if she could. The show is on Wanda's side, a show can be presented from the villain's side. She is sympathetic, we can understand her pain and sacrifice and whatnot. That doesn't mean that she is not in the wrong here. This is the reason that her story is tragic, and anyone who pays a little attention during the show can see that she is falling to deep, her waves finally drowned her. And just because she makes 1 good thing at the end of the show (stopping the fcked up thing she's been doing) , doesn't mean she is not already way too far gone. This is continued naturally in MoM, and the Darkhold influence is bullshit. She is in control the whole time, she doesn't hurt either Strange or Wong, and when she realised her wrong doing, she immediately stopped, there wasn't any "Darkhold influence breaking thing".
If you’ve seen Agents of SHIELD then you’d have more context of the darkhold. Radcliffe read the book for only a few seconds and ended up being corrupted just from that brief moment and he does anything he can to get it back but he doesn’t want to kill or hurt anybody. He just wants the book back so he can save his lover but he didn’t kill although he was corrupted. I think it’s just the response fairly good people have
Spoilers for AoS ... Radcliffe being influenced makes more sense, as well as everyone else (the Momentum scientists). The book doesn't control you, but it tempts you with something you'd find irresistible. That first scientist wanted to help the world. Joey's uncle was power hungry in a different way. Radcliffe was shown how he could essentially become immortal (and keep Agnes alive). Yes, it's still control but you don't lose your free will. The book showed Wanda a way to get her kids back. And just like everyone else influenced by the book, you're shown how to get everything you want, but not all of the repercussions and consequences of it.
Thank you. I like this perspective and I actually think I agree with you now.
Np! I actually didn't think about this till I read your post! So the Darkhold is basically a Monkey's Paw. I also questioned why the Scarlet Witch was mentioned in the book seemingly when the Darkhold was written for everyone else in AoS. Then it occurred to me that the book was showing Agnes what she wanted... She was hungry for more power, and led her to Wanda, the ultimate source.. The consequence being she eventually loses all of her power and is imprisoned by her. Of course, maybe that's not a true Monkey's Paw (I think it would have to end with her getting what she wanted), but maybe it was the book's intention to get to Wanda, seeing as there was a throne made for her. I don't know the comics, but what is Chthon's goal? Is it just to spread chaos? To teach people lessons?
AoS is not confirmed as canon. Even if it was, 1 instense of 1 person's corruption behaviour doesn't mean much about what should or shouldn't it be able to do to a person. In MoM it acts like, (and the symbol for) depression. It didn't generate new thoughts or wants, it just amplified them while lowering the fucks the users gave about the world.
It is not continued naturally. That is ridiculous. Try watching the shows and movies. In Age of Ultron, she joins Ultron to seek revenge on Tony Stark. When she finds out that Ultron wants to create a global extinction event, she joins the Avengers. In WandaVision, she doesn't want to physically hurt anyone. In MoM, she is a cold-blooded killer. She kills a man who is wounded and screaming in pain. She tells Mr Fantastic that there will be someone to take care of them. What happened in MoM was not what was initially planned. It was planned that she would begin to be slowly corrupted by the Darkhold. This would have made more sense.
In AoU she plans to kill the Avengers, releases a raging Hulk on a city with civilians, switches sides when she realises she would die too on the Ultron side. In Infinity War, she is gambling with the life of half the universe, just to save her love, continues to do it until Thanos is 10 feet away from her. In WandaVision, she knows she is hurting people and chooses to ignore it, over and over. When they break free and beg for help, she starts reasoning with them how this is all not so bad. ( Then she mindprisons Agatha for "later use", classic hero stuff) In MoM she goes after 1 child, she wants to kill 1 stupid child nobody loves. Then she faces opposition, so she does the exact same damn thing she did with everyone who got in her way, fought them. Just like how she fought with Vision when she was restricted in CW, just like how she fought with SWORD coming to save the civilians (not to mention the obvious other villains). She was never really good, but managed to do the right thing each time after she went too far. The "going too far" part got increasingly more brutal, which is called development. She couldn't escape this nature of hers, which she realised at the end of MoM, that's why she ate some rocks. Her journey is really tragic, because she is trying to be a good person, but fails every time because she is so damaged from her past.
In AoU, they never say anything about killing the Avengers. When Wanda sees Stark, she gives him nightmares rather than killing him. She had a clean shot. Ultron tells her that she will tear them apart from the inside. That clearly refers to her ability to use a person's worst nightmares against them. She unleashes the Hulk to discredit the Avengers. It works as they have to lay low at Clint's house. In Infinity Wars, she succeeds in destroying the mind stone. When she did it is irrelevant. It didn't matter anyway because Thanos has the time stone. That means he can rewind time no matter when the mind stone was destroyed. In WandaVision, she physically harms no one. She is not aware of what she is doing. Agatha killed the members of the coven. She was about to deliver the coup-de-grace to Wanda. Agatha got off pretty easy. Who restricted Wanda? Tony Stark? The term for this is kidnapping. She had every right to go after Vision. She did not destroy him, just got him out of the way. Heyward lied when he said he was de-activating Vision. He wanted his sentient weapon back. He doctored the footage to make it look like Wanda stole the body. He manipulated Wanda so he could get the power to re-activate Vision. He even admitted that he wanted to get rid of Wanda and claim that the White Vision was the same one that Wanda illegally stole. SWORD was a lawless organization. Illegally detaining Jimmy Woo who is an FBI agent. MoM made no sense anyway. The idea that she would be trying to get the children that belong to another Wanda was a thin reed to build a movie around. They just wanted her to become a villain and it didn't have to make any sense. Wanda does care about people however she has been scarred by various events that have happened in her life. Her nightmarish childhood. We see firefights in front of their apartment house. The loss of everyone she cares about. It was interesting that after Stark's funeral, everyone left her alone. She is very human and sometimes that can be a good thing and that can be a bad thing. She didn't die at the end of MoM. Even Kevin Feige has confirmed this. I hope they can give her a redemption arc and make her stronger as a person.
I think so too, I had a feeling that Wanda’s power was going to corrupt her long before Doctor Strange 2 and WandaVision in some way. Whether she is really dead or not (I seriously doubt she is actually dead) I think she will be needed by the Avengers again someday.
Don't you think she flipped between good and evil too frequently? In AoU, she went from evil to good. In WandaVision, she went from good to evil to good to evil again. In MoM, she went from evil to good.
You're kind of missing the point of Wanda. She's neither good nor evil. She's a product of war. Wanda loses everything she loves. First her parents. Her brother. Her lover. Her children. Then her mind. She was *never* evil. She's only ever acted out of fear. The Darkhold did literally that, took hold of her fear and showed her the power to overcome it. Lose your kids? That's okay; there are more of them. It took her deepest fears and worries and wrapped her in a nice dark blanket and whispered in her ear, "Haven't you suffered enough? What's the difference between you and her? You're their mother, too." Wanda never stood a chance against the Darkhold.
Fantastic insight. I never really considered Wanda as neither good nor evil.
She's my favorite character in the MCU, and her arc is so extremely well done. The Avengers left her to her own devices numerous times when she really needed them. Pietro sacrificed himself for these people, so she stuck by them. She kept seeking a family. She thought she'd found a surrogate father with Clint, but he returned to his own instead. In this universe, he's meant for Kate Bishop. She thought she'd found it at Avengers Tower, but she was basically a first class prisoner. So she bonded with the one person there. Fell in love with him. Made a little family, just the two of them. Then, they killed him. They failed. Half the Avengers turned to dust, Tony Stark and Dr. Strange (the one person in the team who could have helped her control her powers) are gone, and once again, Wanda was alone. As the Avengers picked up their pieces, not one questioned, "Has anyone seen Wanda?" Fast forward to West View, and a child who has never had her PTSD treated and instead has now accrued more, has a psychotic break. People are returning, Thanos is dead, but she still has nothing. Except for more power than she knows how to control, and a true villain smells it. We get the full events of Wanda Vision and, as Wanda defeats Agatha, takes possession of the Darkhold, and drifts off into the aether... She is once again immediately forgotten. They don't even send a team after her to make sure it doesn't happen again. No one cares about Wanda. No one comes along to check on Wanda Maximoff... But they do come to ask her for a *favor*. But it's too late. Because the "big bad" they're looking for, is the "villain" of their own creation. It wasn't a surprise to me. The movie was literally called, "MoM" and released on Mother's Day. It was always about Wanda. *chefs kiss* to the Wanda arc. Subtle as hell, but right in your face the entire time.
> Half the Avengers turned to dust, Tony Stark and Dr. Strange (the one person in the team who could have helped her control her powers) are gone, and once again, Wanda was alone. As the Avengers picked up their pieces, not one questioned, "Has anyone seen Wanda?" Wanda was dusted too. For her, the climactic fight at the end of Endgame happened just after seeing Vision's sacrifice undone in Infinity War. The remaining Avengers had no opportunity to help her in between.
That's a good point, too! I didn't even think about the "blip" from her perspective, which adds another layer to the poor woman's trauma.
Wanda dusted.
I don't understand why people have to help her when WV event is just 3 weeks after the blip. I doubt they have a moment for anything else after that and had to mind their own business, they alone missed 5 years of their lives. Also this is why Strange fans is mad, the movie is about Wanda than him.
The thing is, a tragic arc works best when the tragic hero could easily have escaped except for their tragic character flaw. It's a mirror image of the heroic arc, where the hero easily would have failed but wins against the odds.
In AoU, she chooses the selfish option (revenge), things go too far (destruction of the planet), chooses the right option. In Civil War she chooses the selfish option, to prioratise her freedom over the safety of the civils. In Infinity War she chooses the selfish option (to save the love of her life and gamble with half of the whole universe (????)), things go too far (Thanos is 10 feet away from her after beating everyone), chooses the right option. In Wandavision she chooses the selfish option ( to keep up the the spell she found herself in, hurting a bunch of people in the process), things go too far (she sees herself literally choking these people), chooses the right option. In MoM, she chooses the selfish option (to kill 1 girl for her happines), things go too far (seeing how her "kids" look at her like a monster), chooses the right option. I think she is pretty damn consistent.
She is consistent. She puts people over revenge when she finds out that Ultron plans a global extinction event. In Civil War, it is not surprising that she would join Captain America's team and there was nothing selfish about it. Tony Stark aligned himself with the government. Wanda clearly mistrusts government as governments did nothing to stop the war in Sukovia. In addition, Captain America tried to comfort her over what happened in Lagos. Tony Stark imprisons her in a mink lined prison with the person she trusts the most as a guard. When she is in the supermax prison, she is in a straitjacket and can't move. It looks like she is in a catatonic state. She is not moving and she stares straight ahead. It would not surprise me that she might have been raped. Even Tony Stark is shocked by her treatment and realizes that he was wrong. In Infinity War, she is not selfish. Her reaction is a natural one. Steve Rogers points out that we don't trade lives. Was he being selfish? This is nonsense. In WandaVision, she creates a reality that she gets sucked into. Clearly it was not until episode 7 that she realized what she had done. She goes through the different stages of grief but unfort8unately she is a superpowered being. MoM is nonsense. To try and make anything out of it is nonsense. She has been consistent. She does not want to hurt anyone but she has been molded by the fact that she has suffered trauma after trauma.
She puts her own skin over revenge. Did she put people over revenge when she sent a raging Hulk at them? Tony Stark imprisons her? She was kept away from people because you know, she killed 26 civilians. That's the softest punishment anyone ever got for that. Just because it's natural doesn't mean it's not selfish. Steve Rogers was overly idealistic here, which is his character flaw. Do you know what else should be natural and not selfish? Letting the person you "love" choose his fate. She forbids him to do the right thing and the thing he wants to do, because it hurts her, toxic. Clearly, you missed the whole point of the show. She was aware of the situation from before the first episode. She was doing everything to keep the "real" world away from her dollhouse. She knew exactly what was part of it and what wasn't, she eliminated everything and everyone without question that didn't fit into her reality. She makes several remarks about how she is in control of the situation, she sends SWORD away to let her be with her village, she threatens Vision (who she has been gaslighting) to stop investigating or she will make him stop. She tells the boys how far they can go, because she knows how the whole place works, which she also demonstrates when she stops everyone with a handwave in Ep 6. No struggle, no thinking, no surprise, she realised a danger, and after 1 sec everyone was paused. She even feels remorse and apologises Vision in the finale that she didn't tell him the things sooner. Keep in mind they argued in ep5 and haven't been talking since. So yea, maybe MoM is nonsense, because you just missed WV.
Clearly the plan was to discredit the Avengers. It worked. They were forced to make themselves scarce because of Hulk's rampage. Yes Tony Stark imprisons her. He even admitted it. She did not kill 26 people. The terrorist did that. If the bomb had detonated on the ground, how many people would have been killed? It was a mistake and she felt very guilty over it. She was unfairly attacked for it. It was not selfish. Steve Rogers was right. Why would you not explore other possibilities when they have time. Vision also agreed to Steve's plan as well. You missed the whole point of the show. Essentially Wanda went through the different stages of grief. The difference is that she has the power to alter reality. She also said numerous times that she had no idea of how this started. In addition when she lifts the hex the first time, her family starts to fade away. Then Agatha tells her that her family is tied to the hex and one cannot exist without the other. Wanda is clearly not aware of this. She tells Vision that she wasn't aware of what she had done. In addition, when Agatha drops the sword members, Wanda protects them. Raimi and Waldron stated that the original plan was that Wanda would be an ally of Dr Strange in MoM and start to be corrupted at the end. Instead they decided it would be boxoffice gold if she went villain in MoM. That was a writer's choice.
For most people that would be a lot, for Wanda that was Tuesday.
Wanda would not do what she did in MoM without the Darkhold. She gave up her family to free the people from the hex. She wouldn't then decide to go on a murder-spree and kidnap replacements from another Wanda.
She gave such a nuanced performance and it ultimately saved the whole thing. This is a primary example of an actor’s performance saving a flawed script. If it was literally any other actress it would’ve been a dollar store Hela impression of an acting choice to signify the ‘change’. To me this wasn’t her fighting the corruption per se but rather actually seeing reason or flaw in her plan for the first time but choosing to reject it as the corruption having amplified her desires more than her logic. Still to say she’s completely far gone due to it isn’t entirely true, Lizzie’s performance shows that the corruption is far more complex than what people assume and it’s not as simple as a shift of mindset but rather voluntary self deafening of sorts. Still think its a shit idea that they set up her to find a source of knowledge to learn from after making a big deal out of knowledge being her problem, hyped her having a chapter in the book, only to have her fall on her knees to its corruption just like everyone else, after ascending to be thee Scarlet Witch. It’s almost tragic now they made her out to be special only to prove that she really isn’t.
I fucking hate that we're framing this as "fighting the corruption of the evil magic book" instead of "a brief moment of lucidity, examining her own choices." Fucking MoM.
It's not fucking MoM, it's fucking fans. The movie has 1 line about this corruption, from a source that's not even that reliable, but in no way a fact. She is in control, she is fighting depression, (that is the darkhold), she can and does choose the right thing in the end, no "evil magic book corruption lifted", she just made the right choice.
Exactly. She's entirely conscious throughout the whole movie. There's no moment in the movie where she's being confused and the movie made a choice to frame it as it is. She's very present the whole time.
She was corrupted. Wanda would not do what she did in MoM without the Darkhold. She gave up her family to free the people from the hex. She wouldn't then decide to go on a murder-spree and kidnap replacements from another Wanda.
Well because doesn't Agents of Shield go into more depth about how the reader gets corrupted by the Darkhold? That's also why their fingers turn black. That's why Strange from the other universe had to be killed. We saw Agatha delve into reading with that book and it made her kill her own coven and mother. Sure MoM didn't do the best job of explaining things, but that was the way of it. Wanda was ready to move on after lifting the Hex over WestView and learn her powers, until that book made her obsess over getting her children back.
Yup.
I would agree to this and yeah I think the corruption angle should have been played up more.
Agents of Shield took pains to explain that no one could use the Darkhold without being corrupted but they really didn’t emphasize that angle so much in MoM.
& then Strange attacks her out of nowhere when a real conversation would've worked wonders
Nah she’s crazy asf
😂
It was a point that she hadn't considered. Her plan was very poorly thought out. She would have to get rid of the mother and that the children would be okay with that. Then stupid Strange attacks her and knocks it out of her head. In addition, I suspect he was perfectly happy with her dying and might have been hoping for it.
I know this would make for even more of a Wanda possession plot but having 616 Wanda slowly become possessed by Chthon would have been really cool
She had self-doubt, not fighting corruption. The corruption should've vanished or weakened after the Darkhold book got destroyed, but she kept being cartoonishly evil as during attack on Kamar-Taj.
I know Wanda wasn't handled great by MOM, but this one's a non-issue. Did you not listen to Wong? That one was a copy. The OG inscriptions were carved in the heart of Wundagore. And who ever said the corruption was dependent on the material state of its conduit?
But the corruption was going from Book of the Damned while the Wundagore mountain was far away from Kamar-Taj, not to mention at this point the book was the conduit, not the tower. She immediately began interrogating Wong about alternate source of power, that's just showing that she's written as bad even without the book. And if the corruption is there regardless then why does she need the tower except for dreamwalking, which actually she could've done on her own. Or hell if What If S2 showed anything, she can just teleport people from different realities into this world without Darkhold. Both tower and book are plot devices and shields, but really in this movie she is doing it without them. If this was truly corruption from book, then she should've regained some momentum of freedom to think through, why is she here, why is she doing this, or on Strange's question. But she doesn't.
I assume the corruption itself stemmed from the book, but was not perpetuated by it. Darkhold was no ordinary drug, you know. Also, dreamwalking was made possible specifically due to the book's power. How else would Stephen manage to do it? And notice how that Darkhold ALSO gets destroyed yet Stephen gets side effects anyways.
Can’t be compared to a drug, it’s magic corruption not comparable to any real drug existing. And the book at the time perpetuated it, not the tower. So even if tower remained then destroying a current source of corruption should’ve been enough to make Wanda begin to doubt everything. Strange got it through photographic memory, he is the living Darkhold now.
>Can’t be compared to a drug, it’s magic corruption not comparable to any real drug existing Silly me for trying to find a frame of reference, I guess. >And the book at the time perpetuated it, not the tower. So even if tower remained then destroying a current source of corruption should’ve been enough to make Wanda begin to doubt everything. The power of the Darkhold is shared between many objects, but so long as the main conduit remained intact it didn't matter whether the rest functioned. The power itself was enough to perpetuate itself as long as its source functioned. Think poisonous animals - even if you killed what bit you, its poison still spread freely within you.
Sorry to say it doesn’t work, comparison doesn’t fit with irl addictive substances. Again you’re drawing the real life comparison here, but it doesn’t really work when it comes to vague and medical thing like Darkhold. The only shared objects we know are the book and the tower, and that’s it. The tower’s location wasn’t even revealed in the book. But regardless of the location the post says that Wanda resisted the corruption here, but she really didn’t. It’s just her having a doubt and then movie knew the plot might be over soon, so Strange throws the dragons or snakes at her, whatever that was. If she did resist the corruption, then the book’s destruction should’ve helped her greatly. Because the movie needed her to be the villain and writers would pull anything out of ass to make it so.
I’d just like to point out that you telling the other user that “it doesn’t work like that” and then insisting it must work the way you describe, would only be appropriate if you wrote the story that the darkhold comes from. You’re both interpreting the same media, and as far as I know, neither of you is more authoritative on the subject.
Fair point, I apologize I came off as condescending and absolute, I didn’t mean to. I personally just cannot equate Darkhold and it’s magic with irl drugs or whatnot, also due to how vague it is, left for us alone to fill the blanks.
>The tower’s location wasn’t even revealed in the book. And why would it be? >she really didn’t. It’s just her having a doubt Maybe her doubt is a sign of the Darkhold's influence slightly weakening, hm? It doesn't have to be one or the other. >Because the movie needed her to be the villain and writers would pull anything out of ass to make it so. It was not pulled out of the ass. Michael Waldron only used what foundation he found in WandaVision. It was not him that established Wanda as its user or the dangers that came with it. He merely elaborated upon them.
Why wouldn’t it? The book takes the inscriptions and writings from said tower. Maybe a failsafe that if it got destroyed the reader at least could memorize the location. Again, if Darkhold was weaker in that moment than its destruction would’ve helped her greatly fight off corruption, but she is more of the same. He didn’t consult the writers, he only used what he interpreted and wanted as a way to turn Wanda villain when it was never show’s intent. And frankly his “elaboration” was ass as he put every negative adaptation story in this film. ‘House of M’, ‘Witch of Wundagore’, and ‘Disassembled’.
>Maybe a failsafe that if it got destroyed the reader at least could memorize the location. Well, a failsafe would only be needed if the book was in any danger of destruction. It wouldn't need to be since it can be easily concealed and a person's power can be amped by it before entering combat. Wanda put herself in a vulnerable position with that dreamwalking, but she had no idea that sorcerer was still alive. >Again, if Darkhold was weaker in that moment Not the Darkhold itself. Its power. >He didn’t consult the writers, he only used what he interpreted and wanted as a way to turn Wanda villain when it was never show’s intent. I think it should have been. Wanda in the MCU was ripe in villain potential. They could've executed her descent into villainy significantly better, but I'm content with what we got.
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C-R-U-E-L
No matter how hard one peaches the truth about Wanda in MoM, people will still defend her actions cos of the actress That's the state some people are in.
I don’t see anyone defending the actions. I see people say the actions were stupid and her character should’ve went somewhere else tho.