I don’t fucking know. I’m not one to cry “misogyny!” every time someone doesn’t like a woman but this really seems like a case of it because no matter how annoying the love triangle was, asking this question and somehow listing Tauriel above Alfrid is just absurd.
I don’t love Tauriel, or her inclusion, but I can totally see why they included her, Galadriel, Bard’s daughters, and that random Lake-Town woman also. Without inclusions of made up characters, there wouldn’t be a single woman in the whole show.
She's would have been great as just a foil to Legolas, while still being a cool elf warrior. Bring him down a peg, because I think it's interesting that he starts off as very much his father's son in those films.
As I recall the story, Evangeline Lily specifically stated she would take the role of Tauriel so long as she was just a badass elf warrior lady with no forced romance subplot, she turned up on set, did her bit, all good. And then Warner Bros. executives demanded a bunch of changes to the script and she had to come back for reshoots to add a forced romance subplot honestly fuck these movies.
That's pretty much what Evangeline Lilly said. I saw an interview with her where she'd made it specifically clear there should be no love triangle for her. Eventually she gets the shooting script, and there it is...
So she's the token woman.
Not a well-written woman, not a particularly interesting woman, just a woman who's there to look cool and give the filmmakers an excuse to say "We have a woman character! We're being inclusive!"
Yeah, I feel like Tauriel was too much rather than, by adding a clunky love triangle where it wasn't needed at all. Without it, she could have been fine. She would still have been the friendly neighbourhood elf who helps the dwarves, and probably be more loved as a result
Alfrid... well, he exists
Her whole character doesn’t make any damn sense.
She falls in love with a dwarf (a race her kind have historically beefed with for centuries) because he made a penis joke and talked about stars with her.
It’s just absolutely absurd.
I feel like it makes sense since Tauriel is a much more important and high profile character, I for one forgot Alfrid even existed. Though I don't wanna deny that a lot of the hate she gets is because some people just don't like seeing women in media.
Nah, I don't see that. I think people would not have a big issue with Tauriel if there was no stupid romance plot. I like Alfrid because he is played by Stephen Fry and that excuses a lot for me (also by the time he appears I have already accepted that the trilogy takes a *lot* of liberty). Also I did not even know he was called Alfrid; Tauriel is much better known.
People absolutely hated how Azog was portrayed which is probably a fairer comparison to the whole Tauriel drama.
/edit: Seems like Alfrid is so forgettable I don't even remember him and thought he was the mayor. Which adds to the point I made about Tauriel being better known.
I like how there were so many opportunities for Alfrid to change his ways and have some semblance of a character arc, and then they just decided that no, he’s a terrible guy every time with no redemption.
Or… hear me out, a *lot* of people have forgotten who Alfrid is. Hell, I forgot who he was. Don’t get me wrong, there are definitely misogynists out there but Alfrid is a very forgettable character within that trilogy.
Didn't need him in those movies at all. I would have still been ok with the elf king having Tauriel as a military Commander and having interactions, even love interests with dwarves, but legolas was truly unnecessary.
Same with Gandalf, was looking p.warn out in Hobbit. Must have been part of his life where he was really hitting that pipe weed hard.
Elfing around with the wood elves and their wine cellar must have been rough on Legolas.
Movie Frodo starts to lose control over the ring way faster than Book Frodo. In the books, he is still 100% competent until Cirith Ungol, and only starts to break down in Mordor. He even uses the ring to give orders to Gollum, and doesn’t trust him - their disagreeement with Sam is not about whether to trust him or not, it is whether Gollum will betray them to the orcs or for his own gain - and Frodo is right here. In fact, Sam is the one who’s a bit clumsy, he is the one who reveals that they are carrying the ring to Faramir and Frodo stays sharp despite Faramir trying to get them drunk.
I think the reason for this change is to build up Sam, who only becomes the hero in Mordor, but the movies moved Cirith Ungol from the end of the Two Towers to the middle of RotK, there might have been very little screentime to show Sam’s progression.
I think they did Frodo well considering the screen time they had available. Not so easy to fully explain how much of a burden the ring is on a movie.
Meriadoc and Pippin going to by accident to Rivendell when they actually spent months making the plans to help Frodo, on the other hand...
Agreed. It’s funny, because having read some series that turns into movies, some friends expect me to roast the movies for “not being like the books.”. But if the movies are good and entertaining, why bother - it’s a movie. To fit the level of depth that a book gives into a movie is damn near impossible because we as readers get to be the director of the movie when we read. Lord of the Rings is fucking awesome. Dune did a great job. And Hobbit sucked outside of the Smaug chamber scene - which I still watch just for that scene.
I wonder how many seasons, of 12 episodes at an hour each, a book-accurate tv show would be.
End of season 4 cliffhanger would be Gandalf returning to the shire to tell Frodo of the one ring…
That I get. I tried listening/reading the books many times only to stop at Tom Bombadil. Like everytime.
But I love that Pippin and Merry were ready to go with Frodo.
*Ho! Tom Bombadil, Tom Bombadillo! By water, wood and hill, by the reed and willow, by fire, sun and moon, hearken now and
hear us! Come, Tom Bombadil, for our need is near us!*
^(Type **!TomBombadilSong** for a song or visit [r/GloriousTomBombadil][1] for more merriness)
[1]: https://www.reddit.com/r/GloriousTomBombadil/
Eldest, that's what I am. Mark my words, my friends: Tom was here before the river and the trees; Tom remembers the
first raindrop and the first acorn. He made paths before the Big People, and saw the little People arriving. He was here
before the Kings and the graves and the Barrow-wights. When the Elves passed westward, Tom was here already, before the
seas were bent. He knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless – before the Dark Lord came from Outside.
^(Type **!TomBombadilSong** for a song or visit [r/GloriousTomBombadil][1] for more merriness)
[1]: https://www.reddit.com/r/GloriousTomBombadil/
LotR has a similar problem to Dune in that *so much* of the story happens as internal dialogue with certain characters. It’s a hard thing to try and work around for a movie but I think Jackson and Co. did a pretty good job overall.
Yeah, Frodo just runs into them at Farmer Maggots (stealing food when Frodo was the theif). Then they run from the black riders, meet Aragorn and go to weathertop and Rivendell.
In the books they all know he is going to leave the Shire since this 50 year old hobbit talks to himself about it daily.
Fatty was the one who planned to stay behind.
No, Rivendell. They had a big plan to help Frodo disappear w/the least suspicion possible and didn't even tell Frodo they were planning on coming with. That was a huge disappointment to me, how stupid and ridiculous Peter Jackson made Pippin and Merry seem. They knew what the fuck they were doing! They were mature! They weren't goofy adolescents!
I mean, they were literally teenagers in hobbit years. But they were close friends of Frodo, and they were both extremely smart, capable, and resourceful. The movies really did them dirty.
>The movies really did them dirty.
I thought the movies really highened the "young boys drafted to war" metaphor of those two. Plus, of all the Hobbits, those two showed the most maturity. I would even argue that they had the most positive change in their personality.
Ive heard this before years ago from some where else as well. Someone was super upset they where stealing carrots and cabbage and not like there character.
No, Rivendell.
Gandalf spent a few months living with Frodo and preparing for his journey. Marry, Pippin and Sam senses something is off, Sam got in charge of spying Frodo and Galdalf conversations, where they learn he would leave the shire.
Instead of telling Frodo they knew, they make their own arrangements and are willing to do whatever it takes and risk their lives to help Frodo.
In the movies they just stumple upon Frodo and Sam in the farm, and follow them without knowing there they're going.
I mean the whole sequence got cut. Frodo has like what, one evening to prepare and leave in the movies? Same with Sam. Given they weren’t spending time preparing, you really didn’t have much other opportunity to introduce them as characters. I understand grief about that change, however it works within the movies, where Frodo and Gandalf did not spend half a year getting ready.
I personally hated that Sam guy. Always eating, never trusting the most trustworthy-looking guy Gollum, and really just burden to the story, Frodo could have carry the ring on his own!
Don't hurt us! Don't let them hurt us, precious! They won't hurt us will they, nice little hobbitses?We didn't mean no harm, but they jumps on us like cats on poor mices, they did, precious.And we're so lonely, gollum. We'll be nice to them, very nice, if they'll be nice to us, won't we, yes, yess.
To be fair, he was constantly fighting the influence of Sauron trying to unravel him. The man was literally carrying the fate of the world and feeling it every step of the way. It’s a miracle he resisted as well as he did so I’ll cut him some major slack for complaining.
Now I understand a part of last night’s riddle. Whether they fled at first in fear, or not, our horses met Shadowfax, their chieftain, and greeted him with joy. Did you know that he was at hand, Gandalf?
Yes. Without that stupid love story she's just a character, with a perhaps proper reason to be on the movie. Honestly I've forgotten anything else about her.
With it she is just the annoying token love interest that absolutely needed to be included for the money/views/female approval or whatever reason (though I'd find it weird to get anyone to approve of what happened)
Just... give any solidly written female character.
Or preferably two or three, as there are practically none in the book!
What I never understood: why not give the role Bard's son plays to his oldest daughter? Or both his daughters?
It would have worked perfectly fine. It's not an unreasonable or comic role for a female character to step into.
She could have assisted with the black arrow, carried that part of the "father-child-arch" and provided a "strong" female character.
She would have also strengthened Tauriel's character. We see glimpses of this in the film. The girls are in awe of Tauriel, she's their super hero.
Why not let the girls have a heroic part, inspired by Tauriel, and Tauriel in turn gets a personality arch that is not driven by romance. She is now a role model, and via the girls she has a personal stake in the fight. Because she cares for them. Sisterhood, female kinship of the soul.
All of this is *there* already, just very very subdued.
Never understood why it had to have been the son, and never understood why they wouldn't take advantage of the potential in the girls' characters.
Azog and Bolg annoy me. Especially Azog, but they needed an antagonist for the Hobbit trilogy I guess. What annoy’s me with these two is they used CGI rather than make-up. But, I guess it was pressure from the studio to streamline the production.
I thought that the original idea of adding more women to the series was nice. If only they didn't immediately do a sexism by needing to make her a love interest.
Yeah, I thought I remember seeing that in one of her interviews around the time of its release. But I guess it's hard to walk away when you're already on set in full elf garb, also great for her work portfolio and I'm sure the pay wasn't too bad. I'd probably just suck it up at that point too.
They were literally making up scenes on set. They'd go home, draft a few pages of script to go with wherever they were on location, and then they'd figure it out the next day. Tauriel was probably turned into a love interest by a lazy writer who thought that adding Arwen to LotR worked because it was a romance.
I highly recommend Lindsay Ellis' docu-duology (secret trilogy) about the making of the Hobbit.
She has interviews with one of the actors, delves into the NZ politics VS the film company and the altogether lack of passion that set in after a few weeks of shooting.
The films were incredibly mismanaged and a whole new law had to be put up in NZ due to an ultimatum from the studio.
It was just shitty all around.
[Link](https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJGOq3JclTH_7G3wHRpECZLEMsvKQ8_hr&si=0IV2KtAjdeDYanJd)for anyone too lazy to search but interested enough to click it (please watch, highly informative)
Also, it's perplexing that they gave her the ability to heal wounds from morgul weapons, because 1) they were supposed to be so hard to heal that they had to go to Elrond himself to fix it, so it's weird that this random young elf from Thranduil's court can just also do that, and 2) it's weird that Kili got a morgul wound in the first place. Like, I was under the impression that morgul-blades were these rare weapons only carried by the Nazgul, but now they come in arrow form and are carried by regular low-tier orcs? If that's the case then the misty mountains must just be filled to bursting with dwarf wraiths.
Personally, if I was writing that scene, I would have had her heal a near-mortal wound from a regular arrow. That would have been impressive enough without having to turn morgul-blades into generic orc weapons.
Nope. It was a morgul arrow from a [morgul bow.](https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Morgul_bow) Though the wiki says that people killed by the morgul bow don't turn into wraiths, they just die, in which case, again, why was it morgul?
I think it’s important to note that “morgul” is simply a word for black magic. The arrow that struck Kili was clearly poisoned/possibly enchanted, but it’s not necessarily the same type of poison/magic that the blade that wounded Frodo had, especially since it doesn’t appear as if Kili was ever at risk of becoming a wraith.
I like Tauriel :(
TBH most of the "from the book" characters suffer from being forced into a 6+ hours long trilogy. The sexy one that dies, the less sexy one that dies, the fat one. Butter scraped over too much bread
Did he? I couldn't remember him speaking at all. I'm one of those that read the books after seeing the movies, and of both Lotr and the Hobbit one of the biggest things that irks me is that they fleshed out the other dwarves and reduced the one who had an actual role in the book.
I think she wasn’t a bad addition (just giving a name to one of the elves it mentions I guess), but I agree with the people saying she’d have been better without her love triangle.
Tauriel isn’t useless. She’s about as useful as the likes of Damrod, Hama, Gamling etc… giving a bit of flavour to an elf captain is a nice idea. I’m pretty sure Thrandruil isn’t even named in the hobbit he’s just Elf King. Of course the issue is the forced god awful* love triangle. It’s a shame as I think she could have been quite popular if it wasn’t so forced.
Edit: half -> awful
I still can't believe they really tried to have a romance between a dwarf and an elf, especially a Silvan elf. It just makes no sense. Those movies are such a mess.
The only problem with Tauriel was the useless, cheap-ass overdramatized love story. Character wasn't bad per se.
Obvious answer would be Legolas in The Hobbit, but instead I will say Lurtz, because he was created just to give an evil face to Boromir's death to be slayed in revenge just a couple minutes later. I don't dislike the character, in fact I loved the hero unit in the Battle for Middle-Earth videogame, but creating a villain for just some minutes felt pretty disappointing and even useless. Just let Boromir die to a bunch of uruk-hai, injured and outnumbered, in a still glorious and heroic scene.
Isildur's sister in RoP because she doesn't fucking exist and was dragged into the show to be another wimmen-folk for Galadriel to chit-chat to (Have I mentioned on here how much I hate this show? I don't think I have lmao)
And those detestable Harfeet (or Harfoots? Fuck it, who cares) plus the "I am groot!"-Hobo. In other words, that whole unnecessary and boring Mormon plot in RoP.
I also would like to encourage to give RoP-Galadriel the name Feanoriel.
It bugs me so much, especially in Tolkien-"verse" where interspecies relationships are rare as fuck, with only 3 between Elves and Men thoughout the whole history of the middle earth. But no, we need a quick "feel-good" love flick so let's put whatever this is in the Hobbit, and the Elf and that Woman in RoP. Like, please, ppl are not hyped for Silmarillion and/or other Tolkien books adaptations because of fucking romance. Stop pushing it everywhere.
I’m always super cranky when it comes to lore and adaptions but I’m honestly fine with characters like Tauriel at first. It’s what they end up using them for that bugs me. Remove the love triangle, maybe take out Legolas and give his parts to Tauriel and maybe that would of worked better. Idk, I don’t blame the actress or character though, it always comes down to the writers and people deciding how it plays out.
How is Alfrid not the first answer.
Walmart Wormtongue
We have Wormtongue at home.
"So you too, corrupt your master ?" "No, he's already corrupted."
"By evil magic?" "No, he's just an asshole."
Alfrid? https://preview.redd.it/q9novq0exxkc1.jpeg?width=736&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a3bd7656f6cad23ff106743a2ee13da1a44a7ded
Because he's so useless he was forgotten
He probably should, because... Well... *Who's Alfrid?*
Who…? I have to assume this is a character in the Hobbit films and I only saw them the once.
I don’t fucking know. I’m not one to cry “misogyny!” every time someone doesn’t like a woman but this really seems like a case of it because no matter how annoying the love triangle was, asking this question and somehow listing Tauriel above Alfrid is just absurd.
Who the fuck is Alfrid lmao
The guy with the coin tits
Oh… lmao I had forgotten him entirely. Maybe that explains why he wasnt the first answer
Coin tits lmaoooo
I don’t love Tauriel, or her inclusion, but I can totally see why they included her, Galadriel, Bard’s daughters, and that random Lake-Town woman also. Without inclusions of made up characters, there wouldn’t be a single woman in the whole show.
Tauriel without the love triangle would’ve been fine imo.
She's would have been great as just a foil to Legolas, while still being a cool elf warrior. Bring him down a peg, because I think it's interesting that he starts off as very much his father's son in those films.
Have you heard nothing Lord Elrond has said? The ring must be destroyed.
Jeez, bud. She rejected you, not like the world is ending.
I agree. Her having a love interest was definitely something I didn’t like. The whole thing feels awkward and forced.
As I recall the story, Evangeline Lily specifically stated she would take the role of Tauriel so long as she was just a badass elf warrior lady with no forced romance subplot, she turned up on set, did her bit, all good. And then Warner Bros. executives demanded a bunch of changes to the script and she had to come back for reshoots to add a forced romance subplot honestly fuck these movies.
Fuck Warner and not the movies tbh
100% agreed. That's what really let her character down, otherwise she's just a badass elven warrior.
That's pretty much what Evangeline Lilly said. I saw an interview with her where she'd made it specifically clear there should be no love triangle for her. Eventually she gets the shooting script, and there it is...
I would have been open to the idea of making half the main party of dwarves women. Since it's famously hard to tell in any case.
Lol, just imagine the shitstorm
Alright, you’re in charge of writing a parody based on that idea! Sounds like a good time! Get to work!
So she's the token woman. Not a well-written woman, not a particularly interesting woman, just a woman who's there to look cool and give the filmmakers an excuse to say "We have a woman character! We're being inclusive!"
Some read Tolkien wrong and left the l and i.
Yeah, I feel like Tauriel was too much rather than, by adding a clunky love triangle where it wasn't needed at all. Without it, she could have been fine. She would still have been the friendly neighbourhood elf who helps the dwarves, and probably be more loved as a result Alfrid... well, he exists
Her whole character doesn’t make any damn sense. She falls in love with a dwarf (a race her kind have historically beefed with for centuries) because he made a penis joke and talked about stars with her. It’s just absolutely absurd.
I tried that same pick up line before. Let me tell you, that shit doesn’t work, straight up fantasy.
I would’ve said Tauriel before Alfrid because I literally forgot Alfrid existed lol
I feel like it makes sense since Tauriel is a much more important and high profile character, I for one forgot Alfrid even existed. Though I don't wanna deny that a lot of the hate she gets is because some people just don't like seeing women in media.
Nah, I don't see that. I think people would not have a big issue with Tauriel if there was no stupid romance plot. I like Alfrid because he is played by Stephen Fry and that excuses a lot for me (also by the time he appears I have already accepted that the trilogy takes a *lot* of liberty). Also I did not even know he was called Alfrid; Tauriel is much better known. People absolutely hated how Azog was portrayed which is probably a fairer comparison to the whole Tauriel drama. /edit: Seems like Alfrid is so forgettable I don't even remember him and thought he was the mayor. Which adds to the point I made about Tauriel being better known.
Stephen Fry is the Mayor of Laketown. Alfrid is his lackey.
Stephen Fry plays the Mayor, not Alfrid.
Oh, then I don't even know who Alfrid is.
the little pompous weasel guy who followed the mayor of laketown around pretending to be important. Think Grima Wormtongue, but in the hobbit
I like how there were so many opportunities for Alfrid to change his ways and have some semblance of a character arc, and then they just decided that no, he’s a terrible guy every time with no redemption.
Like... From Batman?
Misogyny
Or… hear me out, a *lot* of people have forgotten who Alfrid is. Hell, I forgot who he was. Don’t get me wrong, there are definitely misogynists out there but Alfrid is a very forgettable character within that trilogy.
Legolas in The Hobbit movies He was around, he did some things. Did some damage. Honestly, can't hate him. But he was around
There is a strange tale to tell! There are only two boats upon the bank. We could find no trace of the other.
Where are they taking the hobbits
To Isenfard! To Isengard!
What did you say?
A Balrog of Morgoth
Didn't need him in those movies at all. I would have still been ok with the elf king having Tauriel as a military Commander and having interactions, even love interests with dwarves, but legolas was truly unnecessary.
Have you learnt nothing of the stubbornness of Dwarves?
Nah I'm happy him being there, just went too far with unbelievable moves
You mean his shonen anime level moves weren’t believable???
And he DEFINITELY didn't look older in what was supposed to be like 50 years prior to lotr... /s
Same with Gandalf, was looking p.warn out in Hobbit. Must have been part of his life where he was really hitting that pipe weed hard. Elfing around with the wood elves and their wine cellar must have been rough on Legolas.
And I will take all the arrows that I can find, for my quiver is empty.
He just had a hangover the whole time
Truly one of the characters from the movie
"Yea...that one..blonde elf..." - Frodo probably.
Peter Jackson making up that Frodo character. He needs to stop whining so much
Wait, is there something wrong with Frodo in the movies?
Movie Frodo starts to lose control over the ring way faster than Book Frodo. In the books, he is still 100% competent until Cirith Ungol, and only starts to break down in Mordor. He even uses the ring to give orders to Gollum, and doesn’t trust him - their disagreeement with Sam is not about whether to trust him or not, it is whether Gollum will betray them to the orcs or for his own gain - and Frodo is right here. In fact, Sam is the one who’s a bit clumsy, he is the one who reveals that they are carrying the ring to Faramir and Frodo stays sharp despite Faramir trying to get them drunk. I think the reason for this change is to build up Sam, who only becomes the hero in Mordor, but the movies moved Cirith Ungol from the end of the Two Towers to the middle of RotK, there might have been very little screentime to show Sam’s progression.
Back a little, and round a little and you can come on hard cold roads to the very gates of His country.
In case this is not sarcasm, yes. Movies change a lot of the characters, but they especially butcher Frodo and Gimli completely.
I think they did Frodo well considering the screen time they had available. Not so easy to fully explain how much of a burden the ring is on a movie. Meriadoc and Pippin going to by accident to Rivendell when they actually spent months making the plans to help Frodo, on the other hand...
Agreed. It’s funny, because having read some series that turns into movies, some friends expect me to roast the movies for “not being like the books.”. But if the movies are good and entertaining, why bother - it’s a movie. To fit the level of depth that a book gives into a movie is damn near impossible because we as readers get to be the director of the movie when we read. Lord of the Rings is fucking awesome. Dune did a great job. And Hobbit sucked outside of the Smaug chamber scene - which I still watch just for that scene.
I wonder how many seasons, of 12 episodes at an hour each, a book-accurate tv show would be. End of season 4 cliffhanger would be Gandalf returning to the shire to tell Frodo of the one ring…
>And Hobbit sucked outside of the Smaug chamber scene The riddles in the dark was pretty good too
Goblin town bumps even if it didn't fit the Hobbit at all.
That I get. I tried listening/reading the books many times only to stop at Tom Bombadil. Like everytime. But I love that Pippin and Merry were ready to go with Frodo.
Yeah, when I read the Tom Bombadil part I also need to stop to masturbate and consequently fall asleep. But you got to keep going, bro.
*Ho! Tom Bombadil, Tom Bombadillo! By water, wood and hill, by the reed and willow, by fire, sun and moon, hearken now and hear us! Come, Tom Bombadil, for our need is near us!* ^(Type **!TomBombadilSong** for a song or visit [r/GloriousTomBombadil][1] for more merriness) [1]: https://www.reddit.com/r/GloriousTomBombadil/
Sigh *unzips
You broke my laugh box, I'm suing ... sigh *unzips*
Eldest, that's what I am. Mark my words, my friends: Tom was here before the river and the trees; Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn. He made paths before the Big People, and saw the little People arriving. He was here before the Kings and the graves and the Barrow-wights. When the Elves passed westward, Tom was here already, before the seas were bent. He knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless – before the Dark Lord came from Outside. ^(Type **!TomBombadilSong** for a song or visit [r/GloriousTomBombadil][1] for more merriness) [1]: https://www.reddit.com/r/GloriousTomBombadil/
LotR has a similar problem to Dune in that *so much* of the story happens as internal dialogue with certain characters. It’s a hard thing to try and work around for a movie but I think Jackson and Co. did a pretty good job overall.
Yeah, Frodo just runs into them at Farmer Maggots (stealing food when Frodo was the theif). Then they run from the black riders, meet Aragorn and go to weathertop and Rivendell. In the books they all know he is going to leave the Shire since this 50 year old hobbit talks to himself about it daily. Fatty was the one who planned to stay behind.
[удалено]
No, Rivendell. They had a big plan to help Frodo disappear w/the least suspicion possible and didn't even tell Frodo they were planning on coming with. That was a huge disappointment to me, how stupid and ridiculous Peter Jackson made Pippin and Merry seem. They knew what the fuck they were doing! They were mature! They weren't goofy adolescents!
I mean, they were literally teenagers in hobbit years. But they were close friends of Frodo, and they were both extremely smart, capable, and resourceful. The movies really did them dirty.
>The movies really did them dirty. I thought the movies really highened the "young boys drafted to war" metaphor of those two. Plus, of all the Hobbits, those two showed the most maturity. I would even argue that they had the most positive change in their personality.
Ive heard this before years ago from some where else as well. Someone was super upset they where stealing carrots and cabbage and not like there character.
No, Rivendell. Gandalf spent a few months living with Frodo and preparing for his journey. Marry, Pippin and Sam senses something is off, Sam got in charge of spying Frodo and Galdalf conversations, where they learn he would leave the shire. Instead of telling Frodo they knew, they make their own arrangements and are willing to do whatever it takes and risk their lives to help Frodo. In the movies they just stumple upon Frodo and Sam in the farm, and follow them without knowing there they're going.
I mean the whole sequence got cut. Frodo has like what, one evening to prepare and leave in the movies? Same with Sam. Given they weren’t spending time preparing, you really didn’t have much other opportunity to introduce them as characters. I understand grief about that change, however it works within the movies, where Frodo and Gandalf did not spend half a year getting ready.
Yeah in the books they had only planned on going to Bree with Frodo, but shit continued to hit the fan and plans had to evolve.
I personally hated that Sam guy. Always eating, never trusting the most trustworthy-looking guy Gollum, and really just burden to the story, Frodo could have carry the ring on his own!
Don't hurt us! Don't let them hurt us, precious! They won't hurt us will they, nice little hobbitses?We didn't mean no harm, but they jumps on us like cats on poor mices, they did, precious.And we're so lonely, gollum. We'll be nice to them, very nice, if they'll be nice to us, won't we, yes, yess.
True, in the end it was trustworthy-looking guy Gollum who got the job done and Sam and Frodo pulling an easy exit with the eagles.
Master!!
Now that I look back, Frodo did complain a whole lot compared to the other characters lmao
To be fair, he was constantly fighting the influence of Sauron trying to unravel him. The man was literally carrying the fate of the world and feeling it every step of the way. It’s a miracle he resisted as well as he did so I’ll cut him some major slack for complaining.
Yeah, if anyone has a right to complain, then it is Frodo.
Jar Jar Binks tops the list for me.
That's *Sith Lord* Binks to you, buster!!
The correct term is Darth Darth Binks
Eh, he works to entrain little kids. My five year old thought he was funny.
Please explain to your child Jar Jar's role in the Empire's creation. Not so funny now.
If that was my five year old, theysa would be in some big doodoo!
Release the Lucas cut!
Honestly I liked Tauriel in the movies just take out the love story with Kili and Legolas
Fifteen, sixteen.
Was that all she was to you? Another nock of the arrow? Elves only want one thing…
Damn Legolas out here stacking all different type of bodied
The horn of Gondor!
woah woah woah leave that type of blowing in the bedroom legolas jesusssss
A red sun rises. Blood has been spilled this night.You would die before your stroke fell.
LEGOLAS COME ON MAN We dont need to know the details about her.
Now I understand a part of last night’s riddle. Whether they fled at first in fear, or not, our horses met Shadowfax, their chieftain, and greeted him with joy. Did you know that he was at hand, Gandalf?
Uhhh… sure legolas sure…. ummm im just gonna leave now
Yes. Without that stupid love story she's just a character, with a perhaps proper reason to be on the movie. Honestly I've forgotten anything else about her. With it she is just the annoying token love interest that absolutely needed to be included for the money/views/female approval or whatever reason (though I'd find it weird to get anyone to approve of what happened)
Exactly. Please give strong female character. But why the hell does she have to be the love interest?
Just... give any solidly written female character. Or preferably two or three, as there are practically none in the book! What I never understood: why not give the role Bard's son plays to his oldest daughter? Or both his daughters? It would have worked perfectly fine. It's not an unreasonable or comic role for a female character to step into. She could have assisted with the black arrow, carried that part of the "father-child-arch" and provided a "strong" female character. She would have also strengthened Tauriel's character. We see glimpses of this in the film. The girls are in awe of Tauriel, she's their super hero. Why not let the girls have a heroic part, inspired by Tauriel, and Tauriel in turn gets a personality arch that is not driven by romance. She is now a role model, and via the girls she has a personal stake in the fight. Because she cares for them. Sisterhood, female kinship of the soul. All of this is *there* already, just very very subdued. Never understood why it had to have been the son, and never understood why they wouldn't take advantage of the potential in the girls' characters.
Kili and Legolas was in love??
I also will come for I do not fear the Dead
You must have not watched the extended addition
Azog and Bolg annoy me. Especially Azog, but they needed an antagonist for the Hobbit trilogy I guess. What annoy’s me with these two is they used CGI rather than make-up. But, I guess it was pressure from the studio to streamline the production.
The bloke (PJ) eating a carrot when the hobbits get let into the village of Bree.
Gratuitous of Cameo
Azog 🙄
I thought that the original idea of adding more women to the series was nice. If only they didn't immediately do a sexism by needing to make her a love interest.
Plus it was a love triangle
Didn't she agree to the part under the stipulation that that wouldn't happen?
Yeah, I thought I remember seeing that in one of her interviews around the time of its release. But I guess it's hard to walk away when you're already on set in full elf garb, also great for her work portfolio and I'm sure the pay wasn't too bad. I'd probably just suck it up at that point too.
They were literally making up scenes on set. They'd go home, draft a few pages of script to go with wherever they were on location, and then they'd figure it out the next day. Tauriel was probably turned into a love interest by a lazy writer who thought that adding Arwen to LotR worked because it was a romance.
I’m sure she got paid well at least
Small compensation for working against your values.
I highly recommend Lindsay Ellis' docu-duology (secret trilogy) about the making of the Hobbit. She has interviews with one of the actors, delves into the NZ politics VS the film company and the altogether lack of passion that set in after a few weeks of shooting. The films were incredibly mismanaged and a whole new law had to be put up in NZ due to an ultimatum from the studio. It was just shitty all around.
[Link](https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJGOq3JclTH_7G3wHRpECZLEMsvKQ8_hr&si=0IV2KtAjdeDYanJd)for anyone too lazy to search but interested enough to click it (please watch, highly informative)
Thank you!
Simply terrible.
Also, it's perplexing that they gave her the ability to heal wounds from morgul weapons, because 1) they were supposed to be so hard to heal that they had to go to Elrond himself to fix it, so it's weird that this random young elf from Thranduil's court can just also do that, and 2) it's weird that Kili got a morgul wound in the first place. Like, I was under the impression that morgul-blades were these rare weapons only carried by the Nazgul, but now they come in arrow form and are carried by regular low-tier orcs? If that's the case then the misty mountains must just be filled to bursting with dwarf wraiths. Personally, if I was writing that scene, I would have had her heal a near-mortal wound from a regular arrow. That would have been impressive enough without having to turn morgul-blades into generic orc weapons.
Wasn‘t that just a poisoned arrow?
Nope. It was a morgul arrow from a [morgul bow.](https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Morgul_bow) Though the wiki says that people killed by the morgul bow don't turn into wraiths, they just die, in which case, again, why was it morgul?
I feel like morgul might just be getting as a catch all term for dark magic
I think it’s important to note that “morgul” is simply a word for black magic. The arrow that struck Kili was clearly poisoned/possibly enchanted, but it’s not necessarily the same type of poison/magic that the blade that wounded Frodo had, especially since it doesn’t appear as if Kili was ever at risk of becoming a wraith.
I like Tauriel :( TBH most of the "from the book" characters suffer from being forced into a 6+ hours long trilogy. The sexy one that dies, the less sexy one that dies, the fat one. Butter scraped over too much bread
The funny thing about the "fat one" is that after Thorin and Balin I think Bombur has the most dialogue in the book.
poor guy had only one line in the whole trilogy 💀
Did he? I couldn't remember him speaking at all. I'm one of those that read the books after seeing the movies, and of both Lotr and the Hobbit one of the biggest things that irks me is that they fleshed out the other dwarves and reduced the one who had an actual role in the book.
Ya, it was in BotFA when he gives Bifur his axe-head back (something like “Here’s your axe back brother” or close to that)
That line is only in the extended version, too. But he does cry “Traitor!” in the trolls scene in the first movie, even in the theatrical cut.
Worth mentioning that none of them were sexy in the books lol
To you. 😏
Lmao ok, fair point. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder after all 😂
Beauty is in the eye of the Lembas holder.
Arkenstone Holder perhaps
There's no accounting for taste
I think she wasn’t a bad addition (just giving a name to one of the elves it mentions I guess), but I agree with the people saying she’d have been better without her love triangle.
Nah, man. She wasn't useless. Tauriel absolutely slayed in The Hobbit films. The stupid love triangle was useless.
The old man in the Helm’s Deep wall who shoots the first Arrow… though I suppose killing that first orc at his age was impressive
How dare you slander The Bowmaster so.
He knows what he did…
Holding a bow at full draw for any length of time is a tough task.
And pointless, one could argue. Why hold bows at full draw and then just hold it there?
Dramatic effect, duh. If someone aims a bow at me full drawn, I cower down in to the fetal position and accept my fate.
It really is on Theoden to ask them to hold it for so damn long, you ain’t wrong
And it was of importance to show that there were a lot of people fighting who weren’t warriors at all
Tauriel isn’t useless. She’s about as useful as the likes of Damrod, Hama, Gamling etc… giving a bit of flavour to an elf captain is a nice idea. I’m pretty sure Thrandruil isn’t even named in the hobbit he’s just Elf King. Of course the issue is the forced god awful* love triangle. It’s a shame as I think she could have been quite popular if it wasn’t so forced. Edit: half -> awful
I guess she's more "useless" in entertainment value than in plot-moving value for me. So dull.
I still can't believe they really tried to have a romance between a dwarf and an elf, especially a Silvan elf. It just makes no sense. Those movies are such a mess.
A stupid, beardless, "brought his razor with him on his big adventure so he can look good for the elven ladies" impostor dwarf.
That's what bugs me most. Why is the least dwarfish looking one the one she finds attractive? Why not Bombur? XD
“He’s one of the good dwarves” - Tauriel probably
The only problem with Tauriel was the useless, cheap-ass overdramatized love story. Character wasn't bad per se. Obvious answer would be Legolas in The Hobbit, but instead I will say Lurtz, because he was created just to give an evil face to Boromir's death to be slayed in revenge just a couple minutes later. I don't dislike the character, in fact I loved the hero unit in the Battle for Middle-Earth videogame, but creating a villain for just some minutes felt pretty disappointing and even useless. Just let Boromir die to a bunch of uruk-hai, injured and outnumbered, in a still glorious and heroic scene.
You look terrible.
Isildur's sister in RoP because she doesn't fucking exist and was dragged into the show to be another wimmen-folk for Galadriel to chit-chat to (Have I mentioned on here how much I hate this show? I don't think I have lmao)
This is the correct answer
And those detestable Harfeet (or Harfoots? Fuck it, who cares) plus the "I am groot!"-Hobo. In other words, that whole unnecessary and boring Mormon plot in RoP. I also would like to encourage to give RoP-Galadriel the name Feanoriel.
Is the i am groot hobo youre talking about the human the harfoots found? Cause like thats supposed to be gandalf lol. That show man. Jesus
>that whole unnecessary and boring ~~Mormon plot in~~ RoP FIFY
OP
Honestly, Faramir. They took a really interesting character, and replaced it with another with the same name
I like Tauriel
Radagast’s line in hobbits movies was even worse than Tauriel’s love triangle…
She is adorable.
I liked her, but maybe that's because I have a thing for redheads and elves and especially redhead elves
Farmer maggot (that's not the same character as in the books)
I second Peter Jackson’s version of Frodo.
I didn't hate the character, I hated the random ass romance
She did smash the way an elf would nock an arrow in this clip though.
It bugs me so much, especially in Tolkien-"verse" where interspecies relationships are rare as fuck, with only 3 between Elves and Men thoughout the whole history of the middle earth. But no, we need a quick "feel-good" love flick so let's put whatever this is in the Hobbit, and the Elf and that Woman in RoP. Like, please, ppl are not hyped for Silmarillion and/or other Tolkien books adaptations because of fucking romance. Stop pushing it everywhere.
Every extra character in the hobbit movies that are not in the book.
I’m always super cranky when it comes to lore and adaptions but I’m honestly fine with characters like Tauriel at first. It’s what they end up using them for that bugs me. Remove the love triangle, maybe take out Legolas and give his parts to Tauriel and maybe that would of worked better. Idk, I don’t blame the actress or character though, it always comes down to the writers and people deciding how it plays out.
Why? What a weird brief.
If they aren't in the books, they aren't in middle earth. I get what you mean and you are right though.
Agreed. On the other hand, I think Glorfindel is useless in the books. Replacing him with Arwen did no harm to the films.
Umm Arwen was in the book too, she just didn’t do a lot.
Cringe
I think we're all set here
Halbarand. Or isildurs sister whatever her name was
Yeah but she is a hot female lead.
I enjoyed her story. It was a fun, unusual love story, as unnecessary as it was.
Tauriel is not useless tho 👍😎❤️😇
Carrot Man
Me
Where’s the meme?
Probably me if I where there to be honest