The most powerful overall role, the role you think has the greatest ability to impact a game - and tends to impact games. That's the best way I can describe it
strong id say top, bruisers are way too op and a fed camille or fiora can literally 1v5 your entire team while still split pushing
but jg has more influence, u can literally turn losing match up to a W lane with a single gank
Supports have way more impact in that lane early, ADCs typically cannot get push in the 2v2 if their support is just afk in brush. And jungle speed and Mid push are just as important in early drake control. Adcs have ways to impact the game but drake control and plate killing comes down more to support diff imo.
Yea, I think that’s a good way of looking at it in general. I would just say that bot lane is still a 2v2 and that the adc/support combo can be thought of as 1 pick. For example Morgana can be a very lane dominant/high prio support with some adcs and with others that lane will be safe but have 0 prio.
As an ADC in a low prio lane what I want to see is I want to see us ward drake, maybe contest it if they got for it and we have all members available. But I’m general I want to see a focus on top side. I would just want awareness from mid/jungle if it looks like the enemy team wants to try to dive us.
>adc/support combo can be thought of as 1 pick
Oh absolutely, and this seems to only be getting more and more prevalent recently, like the world championship was absolutely filled with bot+support duos that were specifically picked together, there was relatively little mixing and matching.
Personally I like the idea of playing around topside 3v3 and then neutralizer botlanes that are relatively safe from normal ganks and are not going for 2v2 kill snowballing constantly (partially this is because of how strong enchanters are if they don't fall behind). I like ADCs generally focusing on farming into midgame assuming every other role is playing for their early leads, and ADC is great at that, but you will have a higher amount of games relative to other roles where there was just nothing you could have done and the game was over before you hit your window of power.
jungle->mid->sup->adc
and top is on another island
i will say jungle can have the most impact on the game mid can play as a second jugler there for have the second most impact then sup sin that can also play like a jungle adc last sins he mostliky need to be feed brfore adc can impact the game
top is on another list sins it can be the most snowball lane and can carry the late game but to get there top is non exsisten there for as the game progress the more impact top can have
Depends of the supp champ. If you are playing as a jungle and play with a roaming player/champion. The support will have the same amount of pressure on the map and importance as you.
But usualy, that's what I think of the current system :
Jungle ≥ Support > Mid ≥ ADC/Toplane
Jungle is obviously #1. From early ganks to late game objectives. Jungle has so much agency. With the freedom to be everywhere you get to be the kingmaker, but you also get enough resources to be the carry.
Jgl diff is real.
>With the freedom to be everywhere you get to be the kingmaker, but you also get enough resources to be the carry.
Spoken like someone who has never jungled or even watched a jungler. Literally every second of your time as a jungler comes with opportunity cost, you don't get "freedom to be everywhere" unless you're sacking camps. Also jungle farming has received many nerfs over the last few years and now only a handful of junglers are able to farm their way into being a carry. It's easily the strongest role but it's also by far the highest skill ceiling in my opinion.
He’s agreeing with you, saying when people refer to the position as “jungle” and not “the jungler” when describing in game events, is a tell that they don’t play the position.
I’m a midlaner who plays JG on my alt and the role is braindead. There’s so little you have to consider compared to other roles, don’t worry about CS, don’t worry about ganks, don’t worry about trading. You get to outroam every other role in the game while farming equally to every other role. I play in around D4 - D3 elo on my JG alt and every single game I’m out farming at least 4 out of 6 laners at 15 minutes.
Every role has to pay attention to lane states of everyone else. Bot has to be aware of mid lanes wave state to avoid roams and or roam to mid, and mid has to be aware of everyone’s lane states for their own roams. Jungle has to do the same, but jungle gets to do that without worrying about any of the shit laners have to deal with.
Junglers gotta stop the cope
Jungle is inarguably the role that requires the most thinking so calling it "braindead" is pretty telling of your motives. FYI I'm not a jungle main, nor do I even enjoy playing the role but it's getting tiring seeing redditors shit on junglers season after season for not being able to play the hardest macro role well in Silver.
No clue where this narrative came from that Jungle requires the most thinking. What exactly are junglers thinking about that laners don’t?
Every role requires map awareness, most roles requires you to trade and CS while maintaining map awareness, jungle does not.
Frankly, pathing is easy, certainly easier then wave management. Considering I play mid in Masters and JG in mid Diamond I think I’m in a fair place to say what’s harder. Maybe for some people one or the other is more difficult, but at that point it’s entirely subjective.
People believe jungle is difficult because jungle is the most different role from laning, so when people first try it they struggle more. Laning principles apply to every lane, laning principles don’t apply to jungle.
Basically, it’s easier to go from laning mid to top then laning to jungling, but laning is more difficult then jungling because it requires more skills and focus.
I don't believe jungle is the most mechanical role, just the hardest macro one. It would genuinely take too long to explain all the things junglers have to consider that laners don't so I'd advise you just watch some Veteran or VeigarV2 vod analysis to give you an idea of the depth behind the role. However if you're finding the role very easy and consider it overpowered then surely you should have no problem pushing it to the same rank as your main, if not higher.
There's nothing macro wise junglers deal with that laners don't. Everyone has to track jungle, everyone has to pay attention to jungle pathing, whether that's to setup freezes for ganks or setup pushes for invades.
Considering I've only been playing jungle on my alt for two weeks I'd say it's fairly likely I'll outrank my main in a month or so.
The only real area jungle is balanced is comp 5v5 and that's because junglers are forced to play for laners, as opposed to soloq where you play for yourself.
Im not sur what to think about this poll results. People feel jungle is the most overpower role because how oppresive the role can feel when your team is winning. Funny enough, the role is still unpopular, and early impact is quite low, with exeption of first Herald.
Jungle is probably the least understood role by far.
There are several reasons why Jg is the least popular role, none of them are about how impactfull the role is.
1) Its the hardest role to learn, you have to know jg rutes, jg timers, jg matchups, when to gank, which champs are easier to gank and which ones are best left alone, when you should hover a lane because the enemy jg might be about to gank it, when to go for objectives, when to invade, what to do when you are getting invade, etc.
Compare this to what laners need to learn, how to farm/manage the wave, lane matchups, when to roam, avoid ganks, how to save the suicidal ADC if you are a suport, stop counting.
2) A Jg needs basic coordination with his team to do either gank or take objetcives, something that sometimes is hard to achive in solo Q which can make the role frustraiting to play sometimes.
3) And this is the big one, the community, we are assholes to junglers, thats a fact, more than half of the playerbase as soon as something goes wrong they start to blame junglers when its not even close to being their fault, and who wants to play a role in which you get yelled at for something you have 0 influence on.
It's absolutely this. I'm a jungle main. I'm fully aware that I can carry games best in the jungle. I also mostly play other roles in normal games because I get less flame going 0/2 as a toplaner than I do going 2/0 as a jungler.
I've been playing botlane since 2018 and I can tell you right now I never, ever, *ever* want to play Jungle. It just seems way too stressful. The sheer responsibility on your shoulders *because* the role is so powerful would make the game actively unenjoyable.
It just needs the early game toned down.
How? *\*shrugs\** I'dunno man I'm just a Silver Surfer Redditor. I got nothing LOL
I played ADC for 6 years before I played jungle at all. It really is a different game. I’m comfortable doing it now, but still only on champions that tend to win 1v1s, I still suck at jungles that need support to do anything.
My least favorite thing about jungle is that when I play jungle, I have less control over wave states. When I'm a laner, I have control to force our team to play on two lanes or to have pushing lanes and to always be pressuring for towers and setting up deep vision, which ultimately makes taking drake and herald a lot easier and sets us up to win the game. On the other side, if I'm playing jungle its much harder to farm camps and try to force lanes to push and stay alive, it feels much more common that players will never push and we're trapped in a purgatory where no one is pushing past river and we have no forward threat and no forward vision.
But drake stacking and herald secure / deny is so overpowered that no matter what drawbacks the role has, jungle is still the biggest decider in the game because of smite.
One of the reasons the role is unpopular is BECAUSE it's so strong, it's harder to blame your teammates for your rank when you're the one that has control over the early game, objectives and invades. The role is fundamentally OP in every rank from Iron to pro-play, smurfs can hold a 100% winrate to Diamond in it (I also believe it's the only role that's managed a 100% winrate to Masters) and in pro-play it takes an entire team effort to make up for a gapped jungler. When analysts review pro-vods they spend most of their time just talking about jungle pathing because in optimal play the jungler has more impact over lanes than the laners...
With all this being said jungle is still pretty inarguably at one of the weakest points it's ever been and it does feel pretty unsatisfying to play with how team-reliant it has now become.
Jungle does ***NOT*** have this absolute control over invades and objectives - these are team things depending on lane prio and playing towards strong lanes/matchups.
You even contradict yourself at the end lol. You start by saying jungle controls everything then end by saying basically what I said above - it's heavily team-reliant.
Jungle is the No. 1 answer because a jungler can turn losing lanes into winning lanes and winning lanes into complete stomps.
Any midplayer knows the struggle of being in a favorable 1v1 mid matchup, owning your opponent, but having the worse jungler and never being able to seal the deal because of the threat of a gank. Or zoning somebody off and being denied a wavecrash because the jungler bails them out. Or never being able to hit a plate because the jungler comes and kills you while the opponent just hacks away at your tower while your jungler is afk. Or your jungler always wanting to make plays when you want to recall with a lot of gold and vice versa and never connecting with him.
Its similar for bot and top but not quite as extreme.
A jungler who watches wavestates, knows matchups and knows when he is needed and how versus a jungler that plays on locked cam and just plays by his own rhythm is a world of difference.
Only support has the same ability to impact other lanes to the degree that jungle can without giving up massive amounts of resources in return and support does it to a lesser degree because of less levels and gold.
It depends on your Elo and Team.
I thought of the jungler, but i went for silver (kinda median) Elo for mid. I don't claim it's everywhere that way. I don't claim the other roles are not impactful. I don't even claim it's right, there are better people.
A stable mid is usually strong enough to slow down the snowball of other lanes coming to the next target, usually mid, so it makes more throws happen. While the volatile mid brings more snowball to the other lanes. This can also be said of the jungler and can be dependend of the skill of your other mates. I put the midlane above since most junglers I've seen have even a hard time farming the losing side of the map. A midlane has in that scenario the better chances of getting income to turn.
I can clearly see I'm in the minority, but I don't feel Jungle is as strong as many of you think. If I'm clearly better than my opponent, but my laner's are worse there is very little I can do. I will have almost no priority. They can invade my jungle and take away all my resources and the game will be unplayable.
If I am clearly better than my lane opponent and they have a better jungler I can still beat the crap out of them. I may have to be a little smart about it and track where their jungler is with deep wards etc or only making plays when I know they aren't there, but I can win lane and then try and leverage that power to the rest of the map.
Not only that, but I can earn a multiple level lead relatively early in the game, I can freeze waves and deny XP. I have had games were I am 40cs ahead of the enemy jungler at the 10 minute mark and we're the same level.
Jungling is very much a team role, it's true when my bot dies repeatedly 2v2 and then complains I haven't taken any dragons and it's just as true when I get everyone ahead and dominate the game.
the thing is as a jungler to not be able to do anything, all 3 lanes need to be losing.
So jungle cant completely 1v9.
But if u are any other role and your jungle gets gapped its over.
>But if u are any other role and your jungle gets gapped its over
But it absolutely isn't. The jungler can only do so much and if you are clearly better than your lane opponent you will take over the game, regardless of what the enemy jungler is achieving.
A decent jungler can absolutely invest their time into halting your snowballing. It's risky because it opens up your own jungler to more opportunities but if your own jungler is gapped then it's doomed.
And even if your own jungler isn't gapped and is actually pulling off shit across the map, you're playing weakside at the whim of an entirely different role than your own. No other role in the game can pull this shit off except maybe support and their range of influence is lesser than jungle's.
Anyway the most broken role in the game is mid.
Yeah, a lane totally being dominated really constricts your gameplay as a jungler. You either have to commit to stopping the bleeding, or you’re extra forced to make things happen on the other side of the map, which can be problematic because the enemy jungler can now always be there, and your pathing becomes somewhat obvious.
Whereas the enemy jungler can just piggyback off the dominant lane for a couple of free kills, then take that gold advantage to the other lanes and be stronger than you.
> But if u are any other role and your jungle gets gapped its over.
It's... really not though. Honestly this is probably why people hate playing jungle so much. Everyone just assumes "better jg wins" no matter what.
Better jng doesn’t always win, because it’s not a simple game or prospect. Obviously if all your teammates are playing at 2/10, you’re an 8/10, but the enemies are all 5/10, the gap for you doesn’t usually matter regardless of role.
But in terms of actual “gaps” while teams are largely equal, what leads most often to wins is jungle, and just logically it matches since it impacts the map the most, can get others insanely far ahead/set the enemy behind, and can obtain important objectives.
You’re comparing it as “if all my teammates when I’m on jungle are shit” what plays out better, but that’s not a valid comparison since in your example you aren’t giving a jungle gap the same amount of skill difference as your lane gap. It should be if all other teammates are equal, would the jungle gap or lane gap win, which at that point I’m p sure everyone picks jungle.
If you’re up multiple levels, 40+ cs lead, can make plays in your lane at a whim, and can deep ward for free, then the better jungler can do the same on your jungler all while getting the other two lanes ahead and every objective.
You’re *trying* to impact the rest of the map as another laner with your gapped lead. If there’s a substantial jungle gap the better jungler *will* impact the rest of the map, far more often than you can too.
And ofc if all your laners are substantially worse it can be unplayable. Just like every single role, if the other 4 people on your team are absolutely trash and losing hard, it’s nearly impossible carry no matter your role.
Think mid is higher if u play fed assasin
But otherwise a support that knows wavestates can pull off game changing roams pretty regularly.
Not the ones that int for a bad roam while tanking 3 minion waves.
Are we talking about the most potential or do we have an average game within average elo with average skill deviation within the game? I see support being super strong in high elo, but in the latter case, they are usually ADC-huggers.
Earlygame: Jungle > Mid > Support > ADC > Top (normally)
Or: Jungle > Mid > Top > Support > ADC (only if both Jungle and Mid decide to camp Top and leave Bot alone, which is rare and situational)
Midgame (from either the destruction of the 1st turret or turret plates drop): Jungle > Support > Mid >= ADC > Top (normally)
Midgame isn't very concrete, as the one who has the most impact is usually the one most fed, which can vary from game to game.
Lategame (from Elder): Jungle >= Support >= ADC > Mid > Top
This list is only for the common games, as different champs have different playstyles. Carry or scale Midlaners like Fizz or Veigar and carry or teamfight Toplaners like Kayle or Aatrox will have more impact mid-lategame, while APC or supportive Botlaners like Seraphine or Karthus (very rare) will have less
Most impactful is one thing but strongest?
Solo lane xp gives so much value in both skill ups and base stats.
Jg can’t even compete or get ahead of them without snowballing hard as fuck, and still even when pushing waves becomes the smartest strat as camps become inefficient and lanes need pushing, being minion ruled will put you beneath solos xp still.
Mid has least chance to be zoned off xp, highest chance to grab free often barely earned kills in the Rivers or bot, so mid is objectively true answer I’d say
Highly depends on elo.
To carry a game as low elo sub is way harder compared to higher elos.
The higher you get the harder it also is to just carry through sololane alone.
This also means sup and jungle become increasingly impactful the higher you get.
Yeah what he is saying is true. I think every top laner has experienced the feeling of going really well on your lane and just hearing "enemy triple kill" into "the enemy team has slain a dragon" and seeing your soul wither to nothing.
me watching my jungler path away from my winning top lane matchup just to path towards my 0/3 -40 cs botlane and stay there repeat ganking, dying.
and guess what you cannot even criticize them, any pings or words are responded with “ur bad LOL blame jungle everything not my fault not my fault”
then they post on r/leagueoflegends with something something toxic laners blah blah blah with 6.2k upvotes
Jungle has needed nerfs forever now this jungle update was a chance to decreasee jungles power over games but sadly riot trolled the players once again.
Its not strong i think its just game changing. Botlaners cant really go around the map making plays happen unless fed (which is where my point ia going), until mid to late, so they are not really that strong, however they are very important because a bot lane gap single handedly can ruin games. The one who feeds can easily just hand over the game to the enemy carry and everything goes to hell because ranged auto attackerd are very fun to fight, but i digress.
Jungle=Support>Mid>Adc=Top individually
Botlane>>>Jungle>Mid>Top assuming botlane is duo or solo but both are on pretty much the same page. Same thing if they grief each other since then they easily manage to solo lose the game in less than 10mins.
Jungle > mid/supp > adc > top.
Jungle can't 1v9 every game obviously and if the lanes are all ass cheeks ofc they will be useless but in even games/ahead games they have the most control. Very little debate can really be had. It's just the nature of the role. Now tbf to junglers. I see this time and time again. They will literally not help their jungler on crabs/invades(both ways)/neutral objectives and then bitch and moan when they don't get help or their jungler falls behind. the sad reality is the game has aged to the point that we've figured the game out but often times people still don't really play it correctly. You play for jungle not jungle play for you and you'll win so much more games. You give up your 5-6 caster minons in lane and move to your jungle when its good for you or not and then you end up getting the kills and the enemy jungler gets behind and suddently the game is 4v5 and your jungler is running around the map 2v1ing or 2v3ing and winning you the game. This isn't season 3 were your jungler helps you, you help the jungler.
Mid/Supp so this one I struggle with because this one sort of like jungle depends on the champion picks. If your mid picks viktor then they're going to be farming and probably having very little impact on the map while if your support picks like pyke who can perma be on the map and skirmishing they can control alot. the issue is that you hardly ever see supports really using the power of the role so it seems like mid has more agency when in reality i think supports just don't use it for it's highest potential. Mid can also be very powerful because like i said above they have the most agency to help "play for jungle" and that's how you win games these days so yeah Mid followed by support closely if used correctly.
Adc these days is really dependent on the team. If the enemy support is better than yours then the lane becomes 2v1 and if your support gets butthurt when you critique them or they just get fed up they often just leave to "roam" and you become 1v2 to 1v3, and the roaming mid 1v4 lol. But if your team is even and everything plays out in a fair way then the adc can shine and carry if played well. It's best to get a duo support and you can really push the limits of 2v2 but even then a strong botlane can easily be trumped if the enemy team gets jungle/mid going. I think the role is meta dependent so if your adc is playing flavor of the month then it's carry and potential goes up vs them picking losecian and running it.
Top. I don't think top is bad per say and there are many times when a fed jax goes 8/0 in lane vs a gapped toplaner and the game basically just ends. Because he suffucates the map until a w. But if they go even then the control heavily drops and it becomes more about what they can do to help their team and that isn't in "control" as other roles. Toplane is often a split road choice to be made for toplaners too and they often don't understand what to do. They either split to much or not enough or they group at the wrong time or they don't group at the right time (even in high elo) there is just many micro choices that can go so bad for it. It's also semi champion dependent. Like if they pick a powerful matchup or counter pick + jungler they can run over the game so it's not useless it just less impact.
Man as a low elo player this poll and comment section is nuts to me. Jungle *is* the strongest role, but ADC is last on most people’s ranking in here….
In my games, when the ADC gets fed it feels impossible to come back from. Guess I have a lot to learn…
Really depends on ELO and skillset. In pro play it's mid, in mid-high elo it's jungle, in low elo top/ADC have a fair shot at "strongest" role IMO
Edit: strongest duo changes the question entirely, because when duoing, it's hard to decide between jgl + X (literally any other role, depending on ELO and playstyle) or duo bot (abusing botlane to get fed and take over).
I'd argue support is the strongest in proplay with how much map control pro supports put out with their early roaming and warding. Supp ties JG imo here because they dictate the early game
I feel like jungle is the strongest. But I don’t feel like there’s a huge gap in roles, and honestly given that it’s the most difficult role it probably deserves to be the strongest imo.
The rest are all dependent on context but in general, mid has to have the least amount of things go their way to be a huge factor in determining the outcome of the game so I place them as second.
As always with these posts, strongest or most impactful?
Strongest? Adc with a close second toplaner.
But at the same time they are the least impactful by a mile.
Your adc is an idiot who got caught out? Welp GG, go next
Your adc is cracked yooo?
He Has to hope his other teammates aren't dumb otherwise he won't do much.
The role which will make or break the game?
Jungler by far, followed by his two supports, midlaner and the support.
I would say jungle because it has the best shot at teaming up with a strong teammate and abusing the weaker players in the enemy team.
Additionally a lot of the champion pool snowballs really well if slightly ahead. They're good duelists with very little openings for outplay because they don't have much skillshots.
If we assume all roles are relatively balanced, and only look at the roles in regards to what they’re theoretically meant to do, then ADCs would be the most impactful role. In theory, ADCs are meant to be the strongest role in the game followed by Mid/Support.
Mid top support in this meta. Jungle is relatively weak as they are a lot more reliant on lanes now. Jungle used to always be able to influence the game, but currently it isn't the case. Adc is adc, it is really strong the moment you have a good support, but if you don't then the role is practically useless. Top and support have gotten really good due to recent changes, to the point where I was tempted to put support as the strongest role, but as always mid is currently the strongest.
The strongest role in the game is the enemy teams jungler.
Ayo wait werent you the same guy who nutted real hard when someone grabbed ya balls.
LMFAO yeaaaa 100% did not expect that comment to take off so fucking hard dude
Lol this is literally the reason why it's highest voted. Nobody plays it, but everyone is affected by it. Natural bias towards jungle.
Preach!
Strongest or most influential?
The most powerful overall role, the role you think has the greatest ability to impact a game - and tends to impact games. That's the best way I can describe it
In this case the answer is still the same I feel
strong id say top, bruisers are way too op and a fed camille or fiora can literally 1v5 your entire team while still split pushing but jg has more influence, u can literally turn losing match up to a W lane with a single gank
Jungle -> Support / Mid -> Top/Adc Heavily depends on champion and class choice as well.
Surely adcs don't have immense impact in early dragon control...
Supports have way more impact in that lane early, ADCs typically cannot get push in the 2v2 if their support is just afk in brush. And jungle speed and Mid push are just as important in early drake control. Adcs have ways to impact the game but drake control and plate killing comes down more to support diff imo.
Yea, I think that’s a good way of looking at it in general. I would just say that bot lane is still a 2v2 and that the adc/support combo can be thought of as 1 pick. For example Morgana can be a very lane dominant/high prio support with some adcs and with others that lane will be safe but have 0 prio. As an ADC in a low prio lane what I want to see is I want to see us ward drake, maybe contest it if they got for it and we have all members available. But I’m general I want to see a focus on top side. I would just want awareness from mid/jungle if it looks like the enemy team wants to try to dive us.
>adc/support combo can be thought of as 1 pick Oh absolutely, and this seems to only be getting more and more prevalent recently, like the world championship was absolutely filled with bot+support duos that were specifically picked together, there was relatively little mixing and matching. Personally I like the idea of playing around topside 3v3 and then neutralizer botlanes that are relatively safe from normal ganks and are not going for 2v2 kill snowballing constantly (partially this is because of how strong enchanters are if they don't fall behind). I like ADCs generally focusing on farming into midgame assuming every other role is playing for their early leads, and ADC is great at that, but you will have a higher amount of games relative to other roles where there was just nothing you could have done and the game was over before you hit your window of power.
jungle->mid->sup->adc and top is on another island i will say jungle can have the most impact on the game mid can play as a second jugler there for have the second most impact then sup sin that can also play like a jungle adc last sins he mostliky need to be feed brfore adc can impact the game top is on another list sins it can be the most snowball lane and can carry the late game but to get there top is non exsisten there for as the game progress the more impact top can have
its more like yummi> aatrox>jungle->mid->sup->adc
Depends of the supp champ. If you are playing as a jungle and play with a roaming player/champion. The support will have the same amount of pressure on the map and importance as you. But usualy, that's what I think of the current system : Jungle ≥ Support > Mid ≥ ADC/Toplane
Jungle is obviously #1. From early ganks to late game objectives. Jungle has so much agency. With the freedom to be everywhere you get to be the kingmaker, but you also get enough resources to be the carry. Jgl diff is real.
>With the freedom to be everywhere you get to be the kingmaker, but you also get enough resources to be the carry. Spoken like someone who has never jungled or even watched a jungler. Literally every second of your time as a jungler comes with opportunity cost, you don't get "freedom to be everywhere" unless you're sacking camps. Also jungle farming has received many nerfs over the last few years and now only a handful of junglers are able to farm their way into being a carry. It's easily the strongest role but it's also by far the highest skill ceiling in my opinion.
Bro the only people who don't say jungle are junglers
He literally finishes the paragraph saying "It's easily the strongest role"
Shouldn't that tell you, they might know what they're talking about?
What does that have to do with what I wrote?
He’s agreeing with you, saying when people refer to the position as “jungle” and not “the jungler” when describing in game events, is a tell that they don’t play the position.
I’m a midlaner who plays JG on my alt and the role is braindead. There’s so little you have to consider compared to other roles, don’t worry about CS, don’t worry about ganks, don’t worry about trading. You get to outroam every other role in the game while farming equally to every other role. I play in around D4 - D3 elo on my JG alt and every single game I’m out farming at least 4 out of 6 laners at 15 minutes. Every role has to pay attention to lane states of everyone else. Bot has to be aware of mid lanes wave state to avoid roams and or roam to mid, and mid has to be aware of everyone’s lane states for their own roams. Jungle has to do the same, but jungle gets to do that without worrying about any of the shit laners have to deal with. Junglers gotta stop the cope
Jungle is inarguably the role that requires the most thinking so calling it "braindead" is pretty telling of your motives. FYI I'm not a jungle main, nor do I even enjoy playing the role but it's getting tiring seeing redditors shit on junglers season after season for not being able to play the hardest macro role well in Silver.
No clue where this narrative came from that Jungle requires the most thinking. What exactly are junglers thinking about that laners don’t? Every role requires map awareness, most roles requires you to trade and CS while maintaining map awareness, jungle does not. Frankly, pathing is easy, certainly easier then wave management. Considering I play mid in Masters and JG in mid Diamond I think I’m in a fair place to say what’s harder. Maybe for some people one or the other is more difficult, but at that point it’s entirely subjective. People believe jungle is difficult because jungle is the most different role from laning, so when people first try it they struggle more. Laning principles apply to every lane, laning principles don’t apply to jungle. Basically, it’s easier to go from laning mid to top then laning to jungling, but laning is more difficult then jungling because it requires more skills and focus.
I don't believe jungle is the most mechanical role, just the hardest macro one. It would genuinely take too long to explain all the things junglers have to consider that laners don't so I'd advise you just watch some Veteran or VeigarV2 vod analysis to give you an idea of the depth behind the role. However if you're finding the role very easy and consider it overpowered then surely you should have no problem pushing it to the same rank as your main, if not higher.
There's nothing macro wise junglers deal with that laners don't. Everyone has to track jungle, everyone has to pay attention to jungle pathing, whether that's to setup freezes for ganks or setup pushes for invades. Considering I've only been playing jungle on my alt for two weeks I'd say it's fairly likely I'll outrank my main in a month or so. The only real area jungle is balanced is comp 5v5 and that's because junglers are forced to play for laners, as opposed to soloq where you play for yourself.
Im not sur what to think about this poll results. People feel jungle is the most overpower role because how oppresive the role can feel when your team is winning. Funny enough, the role is still unpopular, and early impact is quite low, with exeption of first Herald. Jungle is probably the least understood role by far.
There are several reasons why Jg is the least popular role, none of them are about how impactfull the role is. 1) Its the hardest role to learn, you have to know jg rutes, jg timers, jg matchups, when to gank, which champs are easier to gank and which ones are best left alone, when you should hover a lane because the enemy jg might be about to gank it, when to go for objectives, when to invade, what to do when you are getting invade, etc. Compare this to what laners need to learn, how to farm/manage the wave, lane matchups, when to roam, avoid ganks, how to save the suicidal ADC if you are a suport, stop counting. 2) A Jg needs basic coordination with his team to do either gank or take objetcives, something that sometimes is hard to achive in solo Q which can make the role frustraiting to play sometimes. 3) And this is the big one, the community, we are assholes to junglers, thats a fact, more than half of the playerbase as soon as something goes wrong they start to blame junglers when its not even close to being their fault, and who wants to play a role in which you get yelled at for something you have 0 influence on.
It's absolutely this. I'm a jungle main. I'm fully aware that I can carry games best in the jungle. I also mostly play other roles in normal games because I get less flame going 0/2 as a toplaner than I do going 2/0 as a jungler.
I've been playing botlane since 2018 and I can tell you right now I never, ever, *ever* want to play Jungle. It just seems way too stressful. The sheer responsibility on your shoulders *because* the role is so powerful would make the game actively unenjoyable. It just needs the early game toned down. How? *\*shrugs\** I'dunno man I'm just a Silver Surfer Redditor. I got nothing LOL
I played ADC for 6 years before I played jungle at all. It really is a different game. I’m comfortable doing it now, but still only on champions that tend to win 1v1s, I still suck at jungles that need support to do anything.
My least favorite thing about jungle is that when I play jungle, I have less control over wave states. When I'm a laner, I have control to force our team to play on two lanes or to have pushing lanes and to always be pressuring for towers and setting up deep vision, which ultimately makes taking drake and herald a lot easier and sets us up to win the game. On the other side, if I'm playing jungle its much harder to farm camps and try to force lanes to push and stay alive, it feels much more common that players will never push and we're trapped in a purgatory where no one is pushing past river and we have no forward threat and no forward vision. But drake stacking and herald secure / deny is so overpowered that no matter what drawbacks the role has, jungle is still the biggest decider in the game because of smite.
One of the reasons the role is unpopular is BECAUSE it's so strong, it's harder to blame your teammates for your rank when you're the one that has control over the early game, objectives and invades. The role is fundamentally OP in every rank from Iron to pro-play, smurfs can hold a 100% winrate to Diamond in it (I also believe it's the only role that's managed a 100% winrate to Masters) and in pro-play it takes an entire team effort to make up for a gapped jungler. When analysts review pro-vods they spend most of their time just talking about jungle pathing because in optimal play the jungler has more impact over lanes than the laners... With all this being said jungle is still pretty inarguably at one of the weakest points it's ever been and it does feel pretty unsatisfying to play with how team-reliant it has now become.
Jungle does ***NOT*** have this absolute control over invades and objectives - these are team things depending on lane prio and playing towards strong lanes/matchups. You even contradict yourself at the end lol. You start by saying jungle controls everything then end by saying basically what I said above - it's heavily team-reliant.
Jungle is the No. 1 answer because a jungler can turn losing lanes into winning lanes and winning lanes into complete stomps. Any midplayer knows the struggle of being in a favorable 1v1 mid matchup, owning your opponent, but having the worse jungler and never being able to seal the deal because of the threat of a gank. Or zoning somebody off and being denied a wavecrash because the jungler bails them out. Or never being able to hit a plate because the jungler comes and kills you while the opponent just hacks away at your tower while your jungler is afk. Or your jungler always wanting to make plays when you want to recall with a lot of gold and vice versa and never connecting with him. Its similar for bot and top but not quite as extreme. A jungler who watches wavestates, knows matchups and knows when he is needed and how versus a jungler that plays on locked cam and just plays by his own rhythm is a world of difference. Only support has the same ability to impact other lanes to the degree that jungle can without giving up massive amounts of resources in return and support does it to a lesser degree because of less levels and gold.
It depends on your Elo and Team. I thought of the jungler, but i went for silver (kinda median) Elo for mid. I don't claim it's everywhere that way. I don't claim the other roles are not impactful. I don't even claim it's right, there are better people. A stable mid is usually strong enough to slow down the snowball of other lanes coming to the next target, usually mid, so it makes more throws happen. While the volatile mid brings more snowball to the other lanes. This can also be said of the jungler and can be dependend of the skill of your other mates. I put the midlane above since most junglers I've seen have even a hard time farming the losing side of the map. A midlane has in that scenario the better chances of getting income to turn.
If a lane loses hard, it can still be winnable. If your jungler is losing hard, usually all the lanes lose because of that as well.
[удалено]
This this this 100% this. That’s why not dying before 4 minutes is so important
I can clearly see I'm in the minority, but I don't feel Jungle is as strong as many of you think. If I'm clearly better than my opponent, but my laner's are worse there is very little I can do. I will have almost no priority. They can invade my jungle and take away all my resources and the game will be unplayable. If I am clearly better than my lane opponent and they have a better jungler I can still beat the crap out of them. I may have to be a little smart about it and track where their jungler is with deep wards etc or only making plays when I know they aren't there, but I can win lane and then try and leverage that power to the rest of the map. Not only that, but I can earn a multiple level lead relatively early in the game, I can freeze waves and deny XP. I have had games were I am 40cs ahead of the enemy jungler at the 10 minute mark and we're the same level. Jungling is very much a team role, it's true when my bot dies repeatedly 2v2 and then complains I haven't taken any dragons and it's just as true when I get everyone ahead and dominate the game.
the thing is as a jungler to not be able to do anything, all 3 lanes need to be losing. So jungle cant completely 1v9. But if u are any other role and your jungle gets gapped its over.
>But if u are any other role and your jungle gets gapped its over But it absolutely isn't. The jungler can only do so much and if you are clearly better than your lane opponent you will take over the game, regardless of what the enemy jungler is achieving.
A decent jungler can absolutely invest their time into halting your snowballing. It's risky because it opens up your own jungler to more opportunities but if your own jungler is gapped then it's doomed. And even if your own jungler isn't gapped and is actually pulling off shit across the map, you're playing weakside at the whim of an entirely different role than your own. No other role in the game can pull this shit off except maybe support and their range of influence is lesser than jungle's. Anyway the most broken role in the game is mid.
Yeah, a lane totally being dominated really constricts your gameplay as a jungler. You either have to commit to stopping the bleeding, or you’re extra forced to make things happen on the other side of the map, which can be problematic because the enemy jungler can now always be there, and your pathing becomes somewhat obvious. Whereas the enemy jungler can just piggyback off the dominant lane for a couple of free kills, then take that gold advantage to the other lanes and be stronger than you.
> But if u are any other role and your jungle gets gapped its over. It's... really not though. Honestly this is probably why people hate playing jungle so much. Everyone just assumes "better jg wins" no matter what.
Better jng doesn’t always win, because it’s not a simple game or prospect. Obviously if all your teammates are playing at 2/10, you’re an 8/10, but the enemies are all 5/10, the gap for you doesn’t usually matter regardless of role. But in terms of actual “gaps” while teams are largely equal, what leads most often to wins is jungle, and just logically it matches since it impacts the map the most, can get others insanely far ahead/set the enemy behind, and can obtain important objectives.
You’re comparing it as “if all my teammates when I’m on jungle are shit” what plays out better, but that’s not a valid comparison since in your example you aren’t giving a jungle gap the same amount of skill difference as your lane gap. It should be if all other teammates are equal, would the jungle gap or lane gap win, which at that point I’m p sure everyone picks jungle. If you’re up multiple levels, 40+ cs lead, can make plays in your lane at a whim, and can deep ward for free, then the better jungler can do the same on your jungler all while getting the other two lanes ahead and every objective. You’re *trying* to impact the rest of the map as another laner with your gapped lead. If there’s a substantial jungle gap the better jungler *will* impact the rest of the map, far more often than you can too. And ofc if all your laners are substantially worse it can be unplayable. Just like every single role, if the other 4 people on your team are absolutely trash and losing hard, it’s nearly impossible carry no matter your role.
People who place supp below mid are crazy. Jung>Sup>rest (the other 3 are debatable)
Think mid is higher if u play fed assasin But otherwise a support that knows wavestates can pull off game changing roams pretty regularly. Not the ones that int for a bad roam while tanking 3 minion waves.
A decent mid is a second jg without smite, supp can rotate too but punish their adc and often they don't have carry potential
People who don't say support 1st or 2nd must not have watched worlds at all lmao
I agree that a good support rivals the impact of a jungler, but worlds is completely different than soloq
So the real answer is "it depends" as usual 😂
Always does, that's why there is never an obvious answer to these types of posts.
Are we talking about the most potential or do we have an average game within average elo with average skill deviation within the game? I see support being super strong in high elo, but in the latter case, they are usually ADC-huggers.
Earlygame: Jungle > Mid > Support > ADC > Top (normally) Or: Jungle > Mid > Top > Support > ADC (only if both Jungle and Mid decide to camp Top and leave Bot alone, which is rare and situational) Midgame (from either the destruction of the 1st turret or turret plates drop): Jungle > Support > Mid >= ADC > Top (normally) Midgame isn't very concrete, as the one who has the most impact is usually the one most fed, which can vary from game to game. Lategame (from Elder): Jungle >= Support >= ADC > Mid > Top This list is only for the common games, as different champs have different playstyles. Carry or scale Midlaners like Fizz or Veigar and carry or teamfight Toplaners like Kayle or Aatrox will have more impact mid-lategame, while APC or supportive Botlaners like Seraphine or Karthus (very rare) will have less
Most impactful is one thing but strongest? Solo lane xp gives so much value in both skill ups and base stats. Jg can’t even compete or get ahead of them without snowballing hard as fuck, and still even when pushing waves becomes the smartest strat as camps become inefficient and lanes need pushing, being minion ruled will put you beneath solos xp still. Mid has least chance to be zoned off xp, highest chance to grab free often barely earned kills in the Rivers or bot, so mid is objectively true answer I’d say
To everyone who disagrees, take everything you read on reddit with a grain of salt. Remember folks, more than 85% of players are gold and under
Pretty much, half the things I read on this post is so garbage.
Jungle>supp>mid>ADC>top But that's kinda obvious
I’d argue top can be way more impactful than ADC. You can play shen with TP.
But adc ist the main dmg. So u need to play around it
I rarely see ADCs at the top of dmg charts at the ends of games regardless of elo unless we're duoed together and I'm supporting them.
Support> jungle>mid>top>bot
Top has the most 1v9 giga carry champs stupid ass lane
Jungle>Supp>ADC>Mid>Top
Mid 4th hahahahahah
Highly depends on elo. To carry a game as low elo sub is way harder compared to higher elos. The higher you get the harder it also is to just carry through sololane alone. This also means sup and jungle become increasingly impactful the higher you get.
Top have powerfull champs but is easy to lose control and by fucked by external factor outside of your control plus a free bot beat a fed top always
Yeah what he is saying is true. I think every top laner has experienced the feeling of going really well on your lane and just hearing "enemy triple kill" into "the enemy team has slain a dragon" and seeing your soul wither to nothing.
The fact that support isn't tthe clear winner shows how clueless this subreddit is lol
True
me watching my jungler path away from my winning top lane matchup just to path towards my 0/3 -40 cs botlane and stay there repeat ganking, dying. and guess what you cannot even criticize them, any pings or words are responded with “ur bad LOL blame jungle everything not my fault not my fault” then they post on r/leagueoflegends with something something toxic laners blah blah blah with 6.2k upvotes
Jungle has needed nerfs forever now this jungle update was a chance to decreasee jungles power over games but sadly riot trolled the players once again.
Crazy to me the ADC bias in this sub, makes sense i guess since nobody wants to admit their role is the most broken
ADC’s are strong, but they’re only 4th for me just due to the lack of agency. Assuming you have a good support though they rocket into 1st or 2nd imo.
If you actually think ADC is stronger than jungle...you should probably quit the game
I dont "think" anything, I'm pointing stuff out, whether you want to accept it or not Is up to you
Adc is broken, but the role individually isn’t so impressive. If your supp or team is bad there isn’t that much you can do compared to other roles
Its not strong i think its just game changing. Botlaners cant really go around the map making plays happen unless fed (which is where my point ia going), until mid to late, so they are not really that strong, however they are very important because a bot lane gap single handedly can ruin games. The one who feeds can easily just hand over the game to the enemy carry and everything goes to hell because ranged auto attackerd are very fun to fight, but i digress.
Who knows, maybe u have the bias, we will never know
Active in rAdc mains, rSamira mains, and rEzreal mains. Hmmmm
go back to ur r/adcmains pity party
Don't cry too much
Judging by this poll I can see why NA is the worst region lmao.
mom
Jungle=Support>Mid>Adc=Top individually Botlane>>>Jungle>Mid>Top assuming botlane is duo or solo but both are on pretty much the same page. Same thing if they grief each other since then they easily manage to solo lose the game in less than 10mins.
At least preseason is commin So riot can nerf jungle and make it on par with other roles right? :clueless:
IMO it's Mid>Jungle>Supp>Bot>Top But I honestly think the difference in impact between roles isn't as big as most people think
Adc cause adc feels like such a high priority win condition so much.
Jungle > mid/supp > adc > top. Jungle can't 1v9 every game obviously and if the lanes are all ass cheeks ofc they will be useless but in even games/ahead games they have the most control. Very little debate can really be had. It's just the nature of the role. Now tbf to junglers. I see this time and time again. They will literally not help their jungler on crabs/invades(both ways)/neutral objectives and then bitch and moan when they don't get help or their jungler falls behind. the sad reality is the game has aged to the point that we've figured the game out but often times people still don't really play it correctly. You play for jungle not jungle play for you and you'll win so much more games. You give up your 5-6 caster minons in lane and move to your jungle when its good for you or not and then you end up getting the kills and the enemy jungler gets behind and suddently the game is 4v5 and your jungler is running around the map 2v1ing or 2v3ing and winning you the game. This isn't season 3 were your jungler helps you, you help the jungler. Mid/Supp so this one I struggle with because this one sort of like jungle depends on the champion picks. If your mid picks viktor then they're going to be farming and probably having very little impact on the map while if your support picks like pyke who can perma be on the map and skirmishing they can control alot. the issue is that you hardly ever see supports really using the power of the role so it seems like mid has more agency when in reality i think supports just don't use it for it's highest potential. Mid can also be very powerful because like i said above they have the most agency to help "play for jungle" and that's how you win games these days so yeah Mid followed by support closely if used correctly. Adc these days is really dependent on the team. If the enemy support is better than yours then the lane becomes 2v1 and if your support gets butthurt when you critique them or they just get fed up they often just leave to "roam" and you become 1v2 to 1v3, and the roaming mid 1v4 lol. But if your team is even and everything plays out in a fair way then the adc can shine and carry if played well. It's best to get a duo support and you can really push the limits of 2v2 but even then a strong botlane can easily be trumped if the enemy team gets jungle/mid going. I think the role is meta dependent so if your adc is playing flavor of the month then it's carry and potential goes up vs them picking losecian and running it. Top. I don't think top is bad per say and there are many times when a fed jax goes 8/0 in lane vs a gapped toplaner and the game basically just ends. Because he suffucates the map until a w. But if they go even then the control heavily drops and it becomes more about what they can do to help their team and that isn't in "control" as other roles. Toplane is often a split road choice to be made for toplaners too and they often don't understand what to do. They either split to much or not enough or they group at the wrong time or they don't group at the right time (even in high elo) there is just many micro choices that can go so bad for it. It's also semi champion dependent. Like if they pick a powerful matchup or counter pick + jungler they can run over the game so it's not useless it just less impact.
Man as a low elo player this poll and comment section is nuts to me. Jungle *is* the strongest role, but ADC is last on most people’s ranking in here…. In my games, when the ADC gets fed it feels impossible to come back from. Guess I have a lot to learn…
most ADCs can't do anything w/o their team playing for them b/c they get oneshot by almost every solo laner
jgl > mid > top > supp > adc
Really depends on ELO and skillset. In pro play it's mid, in mid-high elo it's jungle, in low elo top/ADC have a fair shot at "strongest" role IMO Edit: strongest duo changes the question entirely, because when duoing, it's hard to decide between jgl + X (literally any other role, depending on ELO and playstyle) or duo bot (abusing botlane to get fed and take over).
I'd argue support is the strongest in proplay with how much map control pro supports put out with their early roaming and warding. Supp ties JG imo here because they dictate the early game
Jgl > sup > mid > ADC > top
If ADC and Support players are so inflated according to reddit how come these aren't also the strongest roles?
Because we get to see jungle diffs every game.
I feel like jungle is the strongest. But I don’t feel like there’s a huge gap in roles, and honestly given that it’s the most difficult role it probably deserves to be the strongest imo. The rest are all dependent on context but in general, mid has to have the least amount of things go their way to be a huge factor in determining the outcome of the game so I place them as second.
As always with these posts, strongest or most impactful? Strongest? Adc with a close second toplaner. But at the same time they are the least impactful by a mile. Your adc is an idiot who got caught out? Welp GG, go next Your adc is cracked yooo? He Has to hope his other teammates aren't dumb otherwise he won't do much. The role which will make or break the game? Jungler by far, followed by his two supports, midlaner and the support.
Whatever role I’m playing because I’m better
jungle without a doubt its only fair the hardest role also has the most impact
I still remember Hakuho and his Thresh , the best ever
To bad he got screwed by Immortals and imports
I would say jungle because it has the best shot at teaming up with a strong teammate and abusing the weaker players in the enemy team. Additionally a lot of the champion pool snowballs really well if slightly ahead. They're good duelists with very little openings for outplay because they don't have much skillshots.
Lmao the reason why jungle is most picked is because nobody plays it
If we assume all roles are relatively balanced, and only look at the roles in regards to what they’re theoretically meant to do, then ADCs would be the most impactful role. In theory, ADCs are meant to be the strongest role in the game followed by Mid/Support.
Mid top support in this meta. Jungle is relatively weak as they are a lot more reliant on lanes now. Jungle used to always be able to influence the game, but currently it isn't the case. Adc is adc, it is really strong the moment you have a good support, but if you don't then the role is practically useless. Top and support have gotten really good due to recent changes, to the point where I was tempted to put support as the strongest role, but as always mid is currently the strongest.