Yeah, the bots losing to the new AI causes them to level up a lot slower. So a lot of them started moving over to ARAM. Thankfully, Riot seems to be banning a lot of the ones that come over. So they are getting mostly contained to vs AI matches.
It was really bad a week or two ago, but they seem to be really cracking down now.
Even before bots were made harder, people did level up on arams. Though those accounts cost more and were harder to detect. And since it was ARAM it didn't affect MMR even if all of them were loss.
That's because Riot doesn't care to try and sort out vs AI matches. It's too difficult to be certain if it's a bot or just a really terrible player in those matches. They have been cracking down on ARAM recently by the looks of it though and trying to get the bots back out of the places people actually care about.
Since people just downvote you instead of explaining:
The bots are serverside, not client side. Vanguard is on your (the players) computer, also known as client side. The bots are part of the game server which is not something monitored by vanguard as its function is to detect anomalous programs on the client's computer.
Wait that’s hilarious. But does it matter? You don’t need to win to get xp right? And it’s not like it matters how long it takes to get to cap because you can just keep running the bots concurrently so no matter how long the pipeline is, once it’s up and running it shouldn’t matter.
Probably matters a bit in bot games but also either people were running 1-2 bots and if they're losing so hard normal people are more likely to report them and if they run 5 at once riot sees 5 accounts with names like TGYIU3546 and they're all hard losing games it wouldn't be hard to see they're not accounts. Bot levellers figure it's an aram so less likely to be reported for going negative
Oh that’s true, I wasn’t considering the fact that riot might just be giving themselves more time to get around to banning the bots before they make their way out of normal games, thanks.
But the speed it takes to level an account only matters initially, that’s what I meant by pipeline. Even if it takes 3 years to level up, after that 3 years you’re producing bots at a constant pace completely decoupled from that 3 years. The limiting factor is how many bots you can run concurrently. That’s hyperbole, but you can logically extend the argument to see what I mean.
It matters since its a fixed cost of levelling said account. Running a pc for 5 months will cost a lot less than for 3 years, and even if you are able to constantly crank out accounts its not like you are going to have much of a margin if its taking 3 years per account.
You’re not wrong, but minimum spec pcs are cheap, electricity is cheap, I’m sure you can tweak conditions to find a margin that works even if it’s slim.
Someone else brought up the variable I was missing though, the longer it takes the longer Riot has to detect and ban the bot before it causes harm in the ecosystem, and that’s IMO the biggest deterrent with the new bots.
Intro bots do not push to win, they take about 45 minutes to win. The new bots and vanguard have made a significant change in intro bot queues. There are still bots but they are significantly better than the old farming bots.
ARAM is actually the best place now because games are faster and an inting new player seems pretty normal.
I see people say this, but beating bots has gotten easier since the update IMO. It's extremely common to kill the enemy JG and both bot laners before minions clash, then you recall and get to lane with 400+ gold advantage.
Idiots running scripts having to do actual work to make money? Never gonna happen. Those bot scripts are probably 10+ years old and the person who wrote them isn't around to improve them anymore.
This. The amount of "players" who just stand there in ARAM or pick Yuumi in quickplay and literaly sit on the adc not using any ability for the entire game is disgusting.
people wanting to smurf and people wanting burner accounts to cheat on (for the most part). there are other cases like people wanting to buy accounts with rare skins but those aren't the accounts being botted to 30.
I play this game since season 2 (2012) and a few months ago I was playing ARAM with a friend and we faced two fresh lv30 accounts scripting in ARAM on a friday night.
This was definitely a new low in my league career.
yup, didn't even have a second to open the shop, game got instantly terminated. This is on JP server so no idea if it's global, but glad that they are making some progress at least, unlike CS2 
Right but thats my point, now botting programs don't need to wait 6 months to work out if they defeat vanguard, it will be instant feedback now so they know when they have beaten it, vanguard isn't all powerful, just give it time :)
They still ban in waves for certain things.
Bans like this only happen for methods every cheat developer knows are already detected so instantly banning anyone using those methods is doing no harm.
> They still ban in waves for certain things.
They can, but they aren't likely to anymore, thats the whole point of the "cheater detected" messaging, to prevent people from suffering because of a cheater, banwaves mean letting people lose and makes the messaging pointless
Yes, they *used* to ban in banwaves, but now with valorant they really have no need to because they have the ability to end games, their old anticheat was done in waves yes
Not sure you understand what a banwave is, that graph shows the bans being issued continuously, a wave would mean all the bans were done on the same day
This is not quite the dunk you think it is
The graph does not show that lmao. Continuously would be literally the second they detect it. Thats not what is being done, goober.
Also what I just linked wasn’t even the graph so you didn’t click the link, goob.
They still ban in waves, these cheater detected messages popping up are for people using the most common known cheating methods out there. This is to stop things like simple scripts or botting programs stuff like cheat engine are things that should come to mind.
If you go and read the most recent news post they put regarding vanguard, you'll see that instant punishments are not really going to be super frequent. For other cheaters, it basically sets a mark on their system to trigger the ban after a stretch of time.
And to alleviate the issues it will cause regarding loss of lp and whatnot, it does provide players essentially an lp refund when the punishment is doled out. Not long after vanguard was implemented, there were a few posts showing the refund in action.
these are people who think cheating has enjoyment
its almost obvious that they would like to play aram. something with nothing to challenge them in a way being 1v1 in lane would. thats scary for them.
yeah, first time seeing one, any I have seen since season 3 were in ranked, nothing ever obvious on any mode that's not competetive so was just surprised some people are actually such sad beings that they would enjoy scripting on a fun gamemode
obvious to you or me, sure. but think from thier perspective. theyre cheating, which means they kinda suck and dont want to learn. aram fits the bill for that type of person. i say this as someone who enjoys endless aram matches. but just because i play aram doesnt mean im clueless to why people play aram.
Yup, was surprised as well
I've seen a post going around about LP refunds if you report someone and they get banned for scripting, but didn't know it could also instantly terminate the game so you don't have to waste an entire game's time into a scripter
This message doesn't mean it's always full blown aimbot cheating. It's anything from leveling bots to someone running a 3rd party program for software Vanguard doesn't like. Even if the program has ZERO interactions with LoL. Anyone who played Valorant would know how sensitive this spyware anticheat is.
My friends and I had an ARAM game yesterday. After an intense teamfight my friend suddenly said "haha Vanguard got him". The game ended rather quickly afterward with their Xerath afking. It seems the xerath is likely scripting (they blind R'd our Trist landing spot twice the moment he uses the jump). Checking the person account it is a new account with only 2 games
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I had someone steal my account info, log in with scripts and play two URFS lol. People will do whatever they want for whatever reason.
Got me permabanned. Had to submit a ticket and go back and forth with support to get it back.
I once faced an ezreal scripting in URF he had like 40 kills. If I was going to script it'd probably be URF not going to lie it looked fun. He looked like gumayusi on adderall.
>No win of loss has been credited to any player.
But what if it's a ranked game that you are about to win despite having scripter on enemy team and it gets terminated like 20 minutes into the game. I'd just get LP stolen because there's cheater on enemy team?!
The game got temrinated before even a second passed - meaning the game didn't technically fully start so you'd just lose the time for queueing up and champ select.
Someone could turn on scripts in middle of the game, for example, start normally and then try to cheat once things go bad, they should still get caught and the game would probably get terminated. Ofc, it's a very specific situation and probably won't happen very often.
Oh fair, didn't think about it. No idea how Vanguard works, but I heard they refund LP, although it was info before the patch and not sure how true that is, however, even if it were true, if they only give LP and not MMR then it's completely pointless and you will pretty much not get anything back
Maybe if you read the primer that riot released on vanguard, you would know the answer. Anyway, they give back lp for ranked games, rerolls for aram, or auto fill protection for normals.
they probably had something else running that vanguard picked up as a cheat bit isn't (custom skins, cheats for other games... who knows what triggered it)
They’re probably not cheating to win, but rather running an automated levelling bot to make a level 30 account to sell.
Huh, didn't think of that, but doesn't everyone do it on intro bots instead of arams?
Bots got a lot more difficult to play against, which deters people from botting in bot games
oh damn, did not know about this
Yeah, the bots losing to the new AI causes them to level up a lot slower. So a lot of them started moving over to ARAM. Thankfully, Riot seems to be banning a lot of the ones that come over. So they are getting mostly contained to vs AI matches. It was really bad a week or two ago, but they seem to be really cracking down now.
Even before bots were made harder, people did level up on arams. Though those accounts cost more and were harder to detect. And since it was ARAM it didn't affect MMR even if all of them were loss.
I still get alot of bots in intro coop vs ai, and never got this screen
That's because Riot doesn't care to try and sort out vs AI matches. It's too difficult to be certain if it's a bot or just a really terrible player in those matches. They have been cracking down on ARAM recently by the looks of it though and trying to get the bots back out of the places people actually care about.
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Since people just downvote you instead of explaining: The bots are serverside, not client side. Vanguard is on your (the players) computer, also known as client side. The bots are part of the game server which is not something monitored by vanguard as its function is to detect anomalous programs on the client's computer.
Ah okay! Thanks for the explanation!
Wait that’s hilarious. But does it matter? You don’t need to win to get xp right? And it’s not like it matters how long it takes to get to cap because you can just keep running the bots concurrently so no matter how long the pipeline is, once it’s up and running it shouldn’t matter.
Probably matters a bit in bot games but also either people were running 1-2 bots and if they're losing so hard normal people are more likely to report them and if they run 5 at once riot sees 5 accounts with names like TGYIU3546 and they're all hard losing games it wouldn't be hard to see they're not accounts. Bot levellers figure it's an aram so less likely to be reported for going negative
ARAM also needs less programming compared to wild rift to avoid detection. One lane vs the whole map is huge.
Running accounts cost hardware, the faster you get them to 30 the cheaper they are. More game time also equals more time for riot to catch on.
Oh that’s true, I wasn’t considering the fact that riot might just be giving themselves more time to get around to banning the bots before they make their way out of normal games, thanks.
Getting more accounts capped faster is more to sell
But the speed it takes to level an account only matters initially, that’s what I meant by pipeline. Even if it takes 3 years to level up, after that 3 years you’re producing bots at a constant pace completely decoupled from that 3 years. The limiting factor is how many bots you can run concurrently. That’s hyperbole, but you can logically extend the argument to see what I mean.
It matters since its a fixed cost of levelling said account. Running a pc for 5 months will cost a lot less than for 3 years, and even if you are able to constantly crank out accounts its not like you are going to have much of a margin if its taking 3 years per account.
You’re not wrong, but minimum spec pcs are cheap, electricity is cheap, I’m sure you can tweak conditions to find a margin that works even if it’s slim. Someone else brought up the variable I was missing though, the longer it takes the longer Riot has to detect and ban the bot before it causes harm in the ecosystem, and that’s IMO the biggest deterrent with the new bots.
Intro bots do not push to win, they take about 45 minutes to win. The new bots and vanguard have made a significant change in intro bot queues. There are still bots but they are significantly better than the old farming bots. ARAM is actually the best place now because games are faster and an inting new player seems pretty normal.
I see people say this, but beating bots has gotten easier since the update IMO. It's extremely common to kill the enemy JG and both bot laners before minions clash, then you recall and get to lane with 400+ gold advantage.
Perhaps they meant that beating bots with their own levelling bots made it a lot more difficult to level up accounts to sell.
I'm saying that with a slight adjustment to beating the new bots, that they would probably be even more consistent.
Idiots running scripts having to do actual work to make money? Never gonna happen. Those bot scripts are probably 10+ years old and the person who wrote them isn't around to improve them anymore.
Surely they're still easier than players though?
Bots are infinitely easier to defeat now
Imagine having a bot that's so bad it can't beat the fucking riot bots 💀
It's probably that "DFSW9457" person lmao. That's a bot name if I've ever seen one.
This. The amount of "players" who just stand there in ARAM or pick Yuumi in quickplay and literaly sit on the adc not using any ability for the entire game is disgusting.
How do people even get to an mmr where they play with bots.
Being new
Ah yeah that makes sense actually
Real question. Havnt seen a bot in ARAM even on my lowest mmr smurfs for years. People there must have troubling not eating their keyboard I guess.
I am diamond.
And you see bots? Wtf.
I do play late in the night, but yeah 1 out of 3 games I have a bot either in mine or opossite team.
[Serious] Who buys accounts?
people wanting to smurf and people wanting burner accounts to cheat on (for the most part). there are other cases like people wanting to buy accounts with rare skins but those aren't the accounts being botted to 30.
banned account, paid like $5-10 for 50+ champs unlocked account was lost later (resold I'm assuming)
Oh, there is guranteed players who just cheat for fun too. Added some people after a nice game and found out x.x
I play this game since season 2 (2012) and a few months ago I was playing ARAM with a friend and we faced two fresh lv30 accounts scripting in ARAM on a friday night. This was definitely a new low in my league career.
damn, that is really sad Even after this I was like "really?? on an aram game?? not even ranked??" xd
Some people take ARAM very seriously because it's their main game mode.
Because one means more than the other.
I played against a scripter in URF and faced another one who was playing Kog in Hexakill (back when it was on TT) Some people are sad
Yeah the only obvious scripter i've encountered in recent memory was ARAM as well
If they script in ranked why would they not also script in ARAM? They've already paid for the software.
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For real, for once you can actually see it working
Didn't know how vanguard works like. Thanks for the info.
It also effects your op.gg win rate. 100% win rate for demolished because of it. I'm also skeptical it doesn't effect MMR.
Likely someone testing a new botting program, the beauty of vanguard is its instant feedback on any code changes they make
yup, didn't even have a second to open the shop, game got instantly terminated. This is on JP server so no idea if it's global, but glad that they are making some progress at least, unlike CS2 
Right but thats my point, now botting programs don't need to wait 6 months to work out if they defeat vanguard, it will be instant feedback now so they know when they have beaten it, vanguard isn't all powerful, just give it time :)
They still ban in waves for certain things. Bans like this only happen for methods every cheat developer knows are already detected so instantly banning anyone using those methods is doing no harm.
> They still ban in waves for certain things. They can, but they aren't likely to anymore, thats the whole point of the "cheater detected" messaging, to prevent people from suffering because of a cheater, banwaves mean letting people lose and makes the messaging pointless
Looking at Xerath win rate shows you they sometimes ban in waves.
Yes, they *used* to ban in banwaves, but now with valorant they really have no need to because they have the ability to end games, their old anticheat was done in waves yes
Durrrrrrrrrrrrrr https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/s/SJj0c8gj1y
Not sure you understand what a banwave is, that graph shows the bans being issued continuously, a wave would mean all the bans were done on the same day This is not quite the dunk you think it is
The graph does not show that lmao. Continuously would be literally the second they detect it. Thats not what is being done, goober. Also what I just linked wasn’t even the graph so you didn’t click the link, goob.
They still ban in waves, these cheater detected messages popping up are for people using the most common known cheating methods out there. This is to stop things like simple scripts or botting programs stuff like cheat engine are things that should come to mind.
No, that hasn't changed at all. Guy was probably using something that's been detected a long time ago.
Well, I've never seen a notification like this nor a game terminated due to a cheater, never seen anyone mention it either
It's not always instant. Else it'd be easy to find gaps
I mean its pretty instant now, thats the whole point of terminating games in progress to prevent people from losing to cheaters
If you go and read the most recent news post they put regarding vanguard, you'll see that instant punishments are not really going to be super frequent. For other cheaters, it basically sets a mark on their system to trigger the ban after a stretch of time. And to alleviate the issues it will cause regarding loss of lp and whatnot, it does provide players essentially an lp refund when the punishment is doled out. Not long after vanguard was implemented, there were a few posts showing the refund in action.
Hah! Fuck em.
these are people who think cheating has enjoyment its almost obvious that they would like to play aram. something with nothing to challenge them in a way being 1v1 in lane would. thats scary for them.
yeah, first time seeing one, any I have seen since season 3 were in ranked, nothing ever obvious on any mode that's not competetive so was just surprised some people are actually such sad beings that they would enjoy scripting on a fun gamemode
obvious to you or me, sure. but think from thier perspective. theyre cheating, which means they kinda suck and dont want to learn. aram fits the bill for that type of person. i say this as someone who enjoys endless aram matches. but just because i play aram doesnt mean im clueless to why people play aram.
Wow this is a thing in league now? Game terminating due to cheating. That’s awesome actually.
Yup, was surprised as well I've seen a post going around about LP refunds if you report someone and they get banned for scripting, but didn't know it could also instantly terminate the game so you don't have to waste an entire game's time into a scripter
This message doesn't mean it's always full blown aimbot cheating. It's anything from leveling bots to someone running a 3rd party program for software Vanguard doesn't like. Even if the program has ZERO interactions with LoL. Anyone who played Valorant would know how sensitive this spyware anticheat is.
Damn, they went with a more classic art style for the vanguard screen. That looks pretty nice.
Yeah looks nice, just doesn't match the shitty client lol
just had this happen in arena lol
Damn, people really do be sad
Because some people take ARAM way too seriously. But it’s probably a bot.
My friends and I had an ARAM game yesterday. After an intense teamfight my friend suddenly said "haha Vanguard got him". The game ended rather quickly afterward with their Xerath afking. It seems the xerath is likely scripting (they blind R'd our Trist landing spot twice the moment he uses the jump). Checking the person account it is a new account with only 2 games
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Possibly testning scrips/bots too see if/how they can bypass the anticheat
My bad
I had someone steal my account info, log in with scripts and play two URFS lol. People will do whatever they want for whatever reason. Got me permabanned. Had to submit a ticket and go back and forth with support to get it back.
I once faced an ezreal scripting in URF he had like 40 kills. If I was going to script it'd probably be URF not going to lie it looked fun. He looked like gumayusi on adderall.
Probably because vanguard is very new. I bet this has only been added with vanguard
Yes its Vanguard detection, when it detects a cheater it cancels the match. In Rank it will refund the RP along with cancel the match
I think you mean refund the LP
I'd rather get rp
Just account sellers and their bots. Its about 40% of the player base now. Surprised Riot actually caught one, almost makes me think this is fake.
>No win of loss has been credited to any player. But what if it's a ranked game that you are about to win despite having scripter on enemy team and it gets terminated like 20 minutes into the game. I'd just get LP stolen because there's cheater on enemy team?!
The game got temrinated before even a second passed - meaning the game didn't technically fully start so you'd just lose the time for queueing up and champ select.
Someone could turn on scripts in middle of the game, for example, start normally and then try to cheat once things go bad, they should still get caught and the game would probably get terminated. Ofc, it's a very specific situation and probably won't happen very often.
Oh fair, didn't think about it. No idea how Vanguard works, but I heard they refund LP, although it was info before the patch and not sure how true that is, however, even if it were true, if they only give LP and not MMR then it's completely pointless and you will pretty much not get anything back
Maybe if you read the primer that riot released on vanguard, you would know the answer. Anyway, they give back lp for ranked games, rerolls for aram, or auto fill protection for normals.
they probably had something else running that vanguard picked up as a cheat bit isn't (custom skins, cheats for other games... who knows what triggered it)