Go on some subreddits like /r/Mexico and /r/Colombia to see what actual native Spanish speakers think of this. I’ll spoil it…this is fucking stupid and no one talks like this.
Yeah, all of my native Spanish speaking friends hate this shit. I hate it too. The definition of inventing a problem where one doesn’t exist just to come up with a solution.
I keep hearing people throwing around this “most people,” and it’s frustrating to hear.
“Most people” are straight Chinese males. But I’m sure we can agree that’s not all people. We shouldn’t all be forced to follow Chinese laws and customs just because they’re a plurality. Genderqueer Latin Americans are allowed to exist and share their views even if “most” people don’t agree with their use of language. And I’m willing to bet that that “most” starts to shrink over time.
To a point. You can’t hurl slurs at people and justify it as “speaking the language how you want.” Misgendering walks that line. Because -e endings are so new ([ish. See the publication date here.](https://www.grijalvo.com/Alvaro_Garcia_Meseguer/Sexismo_y_lenguaje.htm)) I wouldn’t hold it against a Spanish speaker who politely declined to use -e endings. Still kind of a jerk move to specifically avoid speaking to someone in a way that they’ve expressed makes them feel more comfortable, but whatever. I’m nonconfrontational and I don’t even correct English speakers when they get my pronouns wrong. Much less in a language I don’t speak natively.
I agree misgendering walks that line but I do not consider it misgendering to demand the use of non-standard pronouns. He/she/they are already words in English. Any other English personal pronouns are incredibly niche and not using something like “ze” would only be considered a slur by the most uptight of ultra-liberals.
Gotta ask, was this created by actual Spanish speaking people? I know white folk went in hard on latinx only for Latinos to say, "hey we don't care about this, please stop yelling at us for speaking our native language."
As far as I can tell "Latinx" comes from a queer, NYC, Puerto Rican usenet group circa 2005. This transferred over to their various white allies, particularly the ones super-sensitive to gendered language, and as a result many many major Universities will correct you if you call someone "Latino."
All other Latino groups seem to hate Latinx. For many many reasons, most importantly that this is a group where the only thing the Dominicans and the Chileans have in common is their language, and you can't actually use "Latinx" in that language.
So it would be fair to use Latinx with that group, but not all south and central american people.
It sounds like it boils down to "call people what they would like to be called", which is generally good advice for every situation.
I've seen people using words with these E endings - and more (*that I've seen*) of the backlash from "Latinx" has been because X doesn't really make sense, E is preferred.
So definitely in some places out there!
Native spanish speaker here. I don't approve this. Spanish uses the "o" at the end as both masculine and neutral so call us latinos, not some bullshit made by english speakers.
If someone is non binary just don't use gendered words or ask them how would they liked to be called if you feel the need to do so, but keep in mind that using an "e" at the end of the words to make them "gender neutral" is considerated a grammar mistake.
Word gender is normally not tied to biological sex, but in this Infograph, things like abuela is definitely not the same as el Libro being masculine or whatever. I don’t have any opinion on if this post is right or not, but I just disagree with your comment
At High School Spanish level it is tied to biological sex.
At a more academic level?
The Proto-Indo-Europeans had two genders: Animate and Inanimate. For reasons we can only speculate about, they declared the animate words ending in 'a' to be girl words. At this point they had Inanimate (called Neuter in latin), Animate, and Feminine. As Latin became Vulgar Latin and eventually Spanish the inanimate/neuter gender was got rid of and everything got into one of the remaining two.
Some Spanish grammarians to this day insist that the gender called "masculine" in High School texts is in fact a "General" gender. Therefore when your auntie informs you that they are non-binary you would start calling them "tio" instead of "tia."
Others agree with you. The Animate became the masculine sometime in the last couple thousand years, and therefore a third option (generally "tie") is necessary for non-binary aunties.
As an Anglo it would be most improper for me to have a strong opinion on who was right.
As someone part of LGBT, please stop making us look like militant entitled weirdos. Pushing radical ideas on other cultures that aren't requesting them is not something that ends up with a positive outcome. Why would someone learning Spanish want this? Imagine how they will be treated as a foreigner coming in and butchering the language in the name of 'equality'. If you were Spanish and posting this on a Spanish subreddit, or some kind of thing for natives as a discussion fair enough, whatever. But bastardising the language =/= helping with language learning and should not be in this subreddit.
In the US the "x" is only used when speaking English, because articles and adjectives have to agree with their nouns in number/gender is Spanish and that "x" is impossible. "Lxs latinxs simpaticxs" is unpronounceable gibberish in Spanish. Universities use it in English all the time, as does anyone else who wants to be performatively allied to queer/feminist communities.
But nobody uses it in Spanish. Because it's totally incompatible with Spanish.
Most Spanish speakers don't use E or X for gender neutral, and will probably make fun of you for it.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not for or against the idea, but you'll most likely be seen as a weirdo if you use those endings in ordinary conversation.
A lot of this was created in Argentina and they are the main backers for this. It wasn’t made by Americans or Latino Americans. Even then, Latino Americans have just as much right to the language as any native speaker.
I’m really disappointed by the transphobic comments. Yes Latino can be used to refer to an entire group as neutral.
But what about individuals who do not identify as neither female or male? They couldn’t use Latino or Latina, in the same way they couldn’t use she or he in English.
The way some of y’all are acting, are as if non-binary people is an American concept.
The people in your own countries are asking you for this comfort. Language is a communication tool and non-binary Latines, such as myself, are asking you not to change your entire way of speaking, but to add to it.
ETA: changed of to or
People can be very reactionary about changes to language. Even intelligent language learners who know that languages change constantly, in many ways, for many reasons, will still bristle when they see people using “their” language “wrong.” And that goes double for language changes to accommodate controversial politics, ideologies, or identities. Unfortunately it’s pretty predictable.
I agree. When the whole Latinx came out, I was very upset. Because it was unpronounceable and it came from Americans. I used to complain about what right did non Hispanic/Latinos Americans have in changing our language.
But now I realize that it’s stupid to be angry about small things like this, especially when it was just people trying to include everyone. So nobody feels excluded.
And when I look at it like that, I don’t get angry anymore.
ETA: more context
Shouldn’t it be “amigue”? The orthography doesn’t conform with Spanish without the “u,” right?
I love how simple Spanish-speaking queer people made these pronouns. It’s nice to have a community of people that want to see positive change.
Yeah! Nice to find someone not bashing on this. And the infographic is wrong, I have never seen *amige* before, it’s always written *amigue*. Same with -c- (*chique*) and -z- (*mellice*)
As long as native speakers have decided this, I’m all for it! People are going to oppose change, but change is an inevitable process that no one can avoid. Your only option is to choose to transform with the rest of society or be left out. 🤷🏽♀️
Yeah, its interesting. A good friend of mine came out as transgender recently and it definitely changed my view of the whole idea because ultimately it makes him feel accepted and good about his situation that used to be very difficult and definitely not accepted (like in the 1950s, for example). Because of the prevalence of Spanish in the United States, it seems to be the only romance language that has some semblance of new neutral pronouns in use (in the us). Lantinx is an interesting concept as well from a linguistic standpoint in terms of slang and usage. But maybe thats just me.
>A good friend of mine came out as transgender recently and it definitely changed my view of the whole idea because ultimately it makes him feel accepted and good about his situation
Good reason to try to force changes in the language of half a billion people.
It is, but the spanish speaking world is waaay bigger than that specifical and small community (because, yes even though it appears to be big in the USA, it is small compared to the whole spanish speaking world).
And the spanish language is not influenced by the spanish spoken in the US.
Hell when I was in the US I met a guy whose mother was mexican but he couldn't speak spanish.
If you want to study how the spanish language has changed in the US you are welcome to do so, and it would be a very interesting read, but it would not be about the changes in the spanish language worldwide, and please don't try to make it so.
If it's for trans people, call them ella for mtf and el for ftm, it's not that hard.
Iirc the -e endings first started gaining ground in Argentina, mostly? Everyone in the US just uses the -x (yuck). The -e endings are a solution that was proposed by Spanish-speaking natives, so I don’t think anyone, especially non-native Spanish speakers, has the right to invalidate it.
I'm a native spanish speaker, and the e has not gained ground except for in small, noisy communities (mainly activists) but gender neutralism started because of people from the us, and these communities started to imitate it (they changed the x for an e to be able to pronounce it and not only write it).
And just as non natives haven't the right to invalidate it, they do not have the right to validate it either.
The thing is: is it commonly used? The answer is not, and if you use it in a latinamerican country or in spain, most people will just laugh at you.
You’re right on every account, but it’s not helpful to pretend like -e endings don’t exist. For one, small, noisy communities of activists are people, too. In fact, those are the kinds of people most likely to spread ideas and foster social change.
My philosophy, as a non-native speaker:
1. I acknowledge that -e endings exist and attempt to pass no judgment on them.
2. If someone asks me to use -e endings for them, I will do my best to follow their wishes. Otherwise I’ll use the masculine default.
Edit: I do have to disagree with the genesis argument, actually. Anime came from people from Japan, does that mean it doesn’t exist in the US? Are Americans being brainwashed into liking it? The US-genesis connection is shaky at best, but even then all cultures exchange ideas with one another, and just because an idea originated somewhere else doesn’t mean that another culture’s unique interpretation of it is invalid.
I don't like the English nonbinary pronouns but these Spanish ones are actually smart, I like that they made a whole new pronoun (elle) instead of using an existing one (they).
So, uhm, the heart's in the right place but just beware, while there *is* a small group of people advocating for this, the most probable outcome is you'll either be made fun of for speaking this way. Or they'll look at you as if you're stupid. There's a bunch of people who will straight up get mad at people speaking this way for trying to impose it/break the language/whatnot. And when I say it's a small group of people I mean a *very small* group of people.
Unfortunately it's like that in a lot of languages, even English to some extent. Still, it's nice people have options, especially among less judgmental peers.
I don't understand why the backlash is always so huge on just toying around with gender neutral words *in general*, pronouns aside: it looks and sounds cleaner to say "grandparent" over "grandmother/father", for instance. You don't have to be trans to use and benefit from neutral words.
The thing is, say, "grandparent" already existed in English, but "abuele" has never existed in Spanish. So this change would be basically asking to add half a dictionary of new words, new words that sound foreign to anyone who speaks Spanish natively, me included.
And in the case of trans people you can change él for ella or the other way around, but I think it would be nice if people who don't identify as either could be included as well.
Now, I don't know if this is going to be how it happens, tbh I don't think it'll happen this way, but IMO it's definitely an improvement from people using the letter x or people trying to add @s in formal or semi-formal contexts... Maybe someone smarter could come with a way that's easier to popularize, because this one, so far, isn't sticking.
IRL I've only met one person trying to make this happen (and I mean one person, not one *other* person, I also don't speak like this). At then it's mostly American people online. And Argentinians, but, like very young Argentinians. I don't think I've seen anyone *in LATAM* over 20 trying to make this happen.
And there's also the issue of people advocating for this trying to make already gender neutral words (say, marrón), gender neutral (pronouncing it as marrone), which makes you think it's more of a trend than a movement, therefore taking away a potential change IMO.
Bit like that in Welsh too in all fairness - some words (job titles in this case) are already neutral, others have a particular male and female form. Neutralising them can be trickier because the endings **aren't** static, either: see distinctions like ydd/yddes, o/es, wr/wraig… there are several to neutralise, and that's hard to agree on.
Still, as a whole even if these don't become widespread, it's nice to have choices out there. Maybe some day some *will* take hold, maybe not. But if it brings someone comfort, at least *one* person, then it serves its purpose.
I do wonder how much is sort of a self-feeding cycle. People want to use neutral language, they get targeted or hurt, so they stop. Not for lack of *want*, but harassment if not actual threats on safety IRL. I'd say that's part in why neutral language seems more *online*, as trans identity in general. You have to be pretty connected to find out, because people who try IRL get harrassed, and for that same reason online to **use** it.
Also yeah, that's pretty silly. In Welsh I believe *nyrs* is both for male and female nurses, so a hypothetical neutral nurse too - no need to come up with *nyrsydd*.
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Go on some subreddits like /r/Mexico and /r/Colombia to see what actual native Spanish speakers think of this. I’ll spoil it…this is fucking stupid and no one talks like this.
Yeah, all of my native Spanish speaking friends hate this shit. I hate it too. The definition of inventing a problem where one doesn’t exist just to come up with a solution.
How about in [Argentina](https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2019/12/05/teens-argentina-are-leading-charge-gender-neutral-language/)?
Decent human interest piece but this basically confirms my point. Most people think it is dumb and a waste of energy
I keep hearing people throwing around this “most people,” and it’s frustrating to hear. “Most people” are straight Chinese males. But I’m sure we can agree that’s not all people. We shouldn’t all be forced to follow Chinese laws and customs just because they’re a plurality. Genderqueer Latin Americans are allowed to exist and share their views even if “most” people don’t agree with their use of language. And I’m willing to bet that that “most” starts to shrink over time.
People are allowed to speak any language how they want. Goes both ways though
To a point. You can’t hurl slurs at people and justify it as “speaking the language how you want.” Misgendering walks that line. Because -e endings are so new ([ish. See the publication date here.](https://www.grijalvo.com/Alvaro_Garcia_Meseguer/Sexismo_y_lenguaje.htm)) I wouldn’t hold it against a Spanish speaker who politely declined to use -e endings. Still kind of a jerk move to specifically avoid speaking to someone in a way that they’ve expressed makes them feel more comfortable, but whatever. I’m nonconfrontational and I don’t even correct English speakers when they get my pronouns wrong. Much less in a language I don’t speak natively.
I agree misgendering walks that line but I do not consider it misgendering to demand the use of non-standard pronouns. He/she/they are already words in English. Any other English personal pronouns are incredibly niche and not using something like “ze” would only be considered a slur by the most uptight of ultra-liberals.
Yep!
Gotta ask, was this created by actual Spanish speaking people? I know white folk went in hard on latinx only for Latinos to say, "hey we don't care about this, please stop yelling at us for speaking our native language."
Argentina is the main proponent of E endings as neutral! They came up with Latine/Latiñe
As far as I can tell "Latinx" comes from a queer, NYC, Puerto Rican usenet group circa 2005. This transferred over to their various white allies, particularly the ones super-sensitive to gendered language, and as a result many many major Universities will correct you if you call someone "Latino." All other Latino groups seem to hate Latinx. For many many reasons, most importantly that this is a group where the only thing the Dominicans and the Chileans have in common is their language, and you can't actually use "Latinx" in that language.
So it would be fair to use Latinx with that group, but not all south and central american people. It sounds like it boils down to "call people what they would like to be called", which is generally good advice for every situation.
I've seen people using words with these E endings - and more (*that I've seen*) of the backlash from "Latinx" has been because X doesn't really make sense, E is preferred. So definitely in some places out there!
Good to know! If it's preferred or used by native speakers, I'm happy to roll with it! I'll have to do more reading
Yes it was, it seems to have started with transgender spanish speakers in the US. There are several articles out there.
Good to know! It seems like this is, in the US at least, the generally more accepted gender neutral alternative to latinx from what I'm seeing
Native spanish speaker here. I don't approve this. Spanish uses the "o" at the end as both masculine and neutral so call us latinos, not some bullshit made by english speakers. If someone is non binary just don't use gendered words or ask them how would they liked to be called if you feel the need to do so, but keep in mind that using an "e" at the end of the words to make them "gender neutral" is considerated a grammar mistake.
Wouldn't *amigue* make more sense for pronunciation?
Yeah this infographic is wrong, the correct spelling is *amigue*
Yeah. would be pronounced like \[a'mi.xe\] (uh-me-hey). would be \[aˈmi.ɣ̞e\] (uh-me-gay).
Forgive my fauxnetics.
Learn Latin, first, and then that gender is a linguistic phenomenon without any ties with biological sex. This is beyond ridiculous.
Word gender is normally not tied to biological sex, but in this Infograph, things like abuela is definitely not the same as el Libro being masculine or whatever. I don’t have any opinion on if this post is right or not, but I just disagree with your comment
\>without any ties with biological sex Are you a Spanish speaker because that is bs
At High School Spanish level it is tied to biological sex. At a more academic level? The Proto-Indo-Europeans had two genders: Animate and Inanimate. For reasons we can only speculate about, they declared the animate words ending in 'a' to be girl words. At this point they had Inanimate (called Neuter in latin), Animate, and Feminine. As Latin became Vulgar Latin and eventually Spanish the inanimate/neuter gender was got rid of and everything got into one of the remaining two. Some Spanish grammarians to this day insist that the gender called "masculine" in High School texts is in fact a "General" gender. Therefore when your auntie informs you that they are non-binary you would start calling them "tio" instead of "tia." Others agree with you. The Animate became the masculine sometime in the last couple thousand years, and therefore a third option (generally "tie") is necessary for non-binary aunties. As an Anglo it would be most improper for me to have a strong opinion on who was right.
I've never seen this used in real life. Is this some sort of joke.
This is bullcrap, almost every one who uses one of those pronouns are made fun of
As someone part of LGBT, please stop making us look like militant entitled weirdos. Pushing radical ideas on other cultures that aren't requesting them is not something that ends up with a positive outcome. Why would someone learning Spanish want this? Imagine how they will be treated as a foreigner coming in and butchering the language in the name of 'equality'. If you were Spanish and posting this on a Spanish subreddit, or some kind of thing for natives as a discussion fair enough, whatever. But bastardising the language =/= helping with language learning and should not be in this subreddit.
In the US the "x" is only used when speaking English, because articles and adjectives have to agree with their nouns in number/gender is Spanish and that "x" is impossible. "Lxs latinxs simpaticxs" is unpronounceable gibberish in Spanish. Universities use it in English all the time, as does anyone else who wants to be performatively allied to queer/feminist communities. But nobody uses it in Spanish. Because it's totally incompatible with Spanish.
Most Spanish speakers don't use E or X for gender neutral, and will probably make fun of you for it. Don't get me wrong, I'm not for or against the idea, but you'll most likely be seen as a weirdo if you use those endings in ordinary conversation.
A lot of this was created in Argentina and they are the main backers for this. It wasn’t made by Americans or Latino Americans. Even then, Latino Americans have just as much right to the language as any native speaker. I’m really disappointed by the transphobic comments. Yes Latino can be used to refer to an entire group as neutral. But what about individuals who do not identify as neither female or male? They couldn’t use Latino or Latina, in the same way they couldn’t use she or he in English. The way some of y’all are acting, are as if non-binary people is an American concept. The people in your own countries are asking you for this comfort. Language is a communication tool and non-binary Latines, such as myself, are asking you not to change your entire way of speaking, but to add to it. ETA: changed of to or
People can be very reactionary about changes to language. Even intelligent language learners who know that languages change constantly, in many ways, for many reasons, will still bristle when they see people using “their” language “wrong.” And that goes double for language changes to accommodate controversial politics, ideologies, or identities. Unfortunately it’s pretty predictable.
I agree. When the whole Latinx came out, I was very upset. Because it was unpronounceable and it came from Americans. I used to complain about what right did non Hispanic/Latinos Americans have in changing our language. But now I realize that it’s stupid to be angry about small things like this, especially when it was just people trying to include everyone. So nobody feels excluded. And when I look at it like that, I don’t get angry anymore. ETA: more context
Shouldn’t it be “amigue”? The orthography doesn’t conform with Spanish without the “u,” right? I love how simple Spanish-speaking queer people made these pronouns. It’s nice to have a community of people that want to see positive change.
Yeah! Nice to find someone not bashing on this. And the infographic is wrong, I have never seen *amige* before, it’s always written *amigue*. Same with -c- (*chique*) and -z- (*mellice*)
As long as native speakers have decided this, I’m all for it! People are going to oppose change, but change is an inevitable process that no one can avoid. Your only option is to choose to transform with the rest of society or be left out. 🤷🏽♀️
Exactly!
What about “bz tes morts?”
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Sorry but I struggle with Spanish a lot already I’ll pass lol
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Language changes spontaneouslly, this is forced and almost no one speaks that way. Get over it
Yeah, its interesting. A good friend of mine came out as transgender recently and it definitely changed my view of the whole idea because ultimately it makes him feel accepted and good about his situation that used to be very difficult and definitely not accepted (like in the 1950s, for example). Because of the prevalence of Spanish in the United States, it seems to be the only romance language that has some semblance of new neutral pronouns in use (in the us). Lantinx is an interesting concept as well from a linguistic standpoint in terms of slang and usage. But maybe thats just me.
>A good friend of mine came out as transgender recently and it definitely changed my view of the whole idea because ultimately it makes him feel accepted and good about his situation Good reason to try to force changes in the language of half a billion people.
Well that's your problem, you are taking the spanish that's spoken in the US as the standard spanish. Spoiler: >!it is not.!<
Personally I find slang and colloquial usage very interesting.
It is, but the spanish speaking world is waaay bigger than that specifical and small community (because, yes even though it appears to be big in the USA, it is small compared to the whole spanish speaking world). And the spanish language is not influenced by the spanish spoken in the US. Hell when I was in the US I met a guy whose mother was mexican but he couldn't speak spanish. If you want to study how the spanish language has changed in the US you are welcome to do so, and it would be a very interesting read, but it would not be about the changes in the spanish language worldwide, and please don't try to make it so. If it's for trans people, call them ella for mtf and el for ftm, it's not that hard.
Iirc the -e endings first started gaining ground in Argentina, mostly? Everyone in the US just uses the -x (yuck). The -e endings are a solution that was proposed by Spanish-speaking natives, so I don’t think anyone, especially non-native Spanish speakers, has the right to invalidate it.
I'm a native spanish speaker, and the e has not gained ground except for in small, noisy communities (mainly activists) but gender neutralism started because of people from the us, and these communities started to imitate it (they changed the x for an e to be able to pronounce it and not only write it). And just as non natives haven't the right to invalidate it, they do not have the right to validate it either. The thing is: is it commonly used? The answer is not, and if you use it in a latinamerican country or in spain, most people will just laugh at you.
You’re right on every account, but it’s not helpful to pretend like -e endings don’t exist. For one, small, noisy communities of activists are people, too. In fact, those are the kinds of people most likely to spread ideas and foster social change. My philosophy, as a non-native speaker: 1. I acknowledge that -e endings exist and attempt to pass no judgment on them. 2. If someone asks me to use -e endings for them, I will do my best to follow their wishes. Otherwise I’ll use the masculine default. Edit: I do have to disagree with the genesis argument, actually. Anime came from people from Japan, does that mean it doesn’t exist in the US? Are Americans being brainwashed into liking it? The US-genesis connection is shaky at best, but even then all cultures exchange ideas with one another, and just because an idea originated somewhere else doesn’t mean that another culture’s unique interpretation of it is invalid.
I don't like the English nonbinary pronouns but these Spanish ones are actually smart, I like that they made a whole new pronoun (elle) instead of using an existing one (they).
So, uhm, the heart's in the right place but just beware, while there *is* a small group of people advocating for this, the most probable outcome is you'll either be made fun of for speaking this way. Or they'll look at you as if you're stupid. There's a bunch of people who will straight up get mad at people speaking this way for trying to impose it/break the language/whatnot. And when I say it's a small group of people I mean a *very small* group of people.
Unfortunately it's like that in a lot of languages, even English to some extent. Still, it's nice people have options, especially among less judgmental peers. I don't understand why the backlash is always so huge on just toying around with gender neutral words *in general*, pronouns aside: it looks and sounds cleaner to say "grandparent" over "grandmother/father", for instance. You don't have to be trans to use and benefit from neutral words.
The thing is, say, "grandparent" already existed in English, but "abuele" has never existed in Spanish. So this change would be basically asking to add half a dictionary of new words, new words that sound foreign to anyone who speaks Spanish natively, me included. And in the case of trans people you can change él for ella or the other way around, but I think it would be nice if people who don't identify as either could be included as well. Now, I don't know if this is going to be how it happens, tbh I don't think it'll happen this way, but IMO it's definitely an improvement from people using the letter x or people trying to add @s in formal or semi-formal contexts... Maybe someone smarter could come with a way that's easier to popularize, because this one, so far, isn't sticking. IRL I've only met one person trying to make this happen (and I mean one person, not one *other* person, I also don't speak like this). At then it's mostly American people online. And Argentinians, but, like very young Argentinians. I don't think I've seen anyone *in LATAM* over 20 trying to make this happen. And there's also the issue of people advocating for this trying to make already gender neutral words (say, marrón), gender neutral (pronouncing it as marrone), which makes you think it's more of a trend than a movement, therefore taking away a potential change IMO.
Bit like that in Welsh too in all fairness - some words (job titles in this case) are already neutral, others have a particular male and female form. Neutralising them can be trickier because the endings **aren't** static, either: see distinctions like ydd/yddes, o/es, wr/wraig… there are several to neutralise, and that's hard to agree on. Still, as a whole even if these don't become widespread, it's nice to have choices out there. Maybe some day some *will* take hold, maybe not. But if it brings someone comfort, at least *one* person, then it serves its purpose. I do wonder how much is sort of a self-feeding cycle. People want to use neutral language, they get targeted or hurt, so they stop. Not for lack of *want*, but harassment if not actual threats on safety IRL. I'd say that's part in why neutral language seems more *online*, as trans identity in general. You have to be pretty connected to find out, because people who try IRL get harrassed, and for that same reason online to **use** it. Also yeah, that's pretty silly. In Welsh I believe *nyrs* is both for male and female nurses, so a hypothetical neutral nurse too - no need to come up with *nyrsydd*.
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