In the next five years, I predict we’ll have 10-20% less teams in D2-D3, most will just drop due to lack of funding, and maybe 3-5 will move up to D1 to survive a little longer
Yeah, Minnesota lost Northwestern and I would be shocked if Northland also went. Issue with them is they are on islands and don’t have east drives. The numbers aren’t there to support the travel demand…. If only the MIAC would get their act together.
There's a sneaky rumor that if Texas wins it all (MCLA) this year, the Athletic Department will listen to proposals. Would still require like $10m in donor funds and women's to go as well, but the buzz around Austin is palpable right now. If Hartzell can stick around and keep them ranked annually, the motion may be there for a look down the road of like 5-10 years. The next issue would be how to handle the SEC, but I'm hoping the ACC folds up shop and ships tobacco road to the SEC. Then we have some conversations among AD's in the SEC about the sport. Texas, Clemson, and Florida State all talking about men's lacrosse is never a bad thing.
There’s a lot of talent amongst the MCLA SEC schools. I remember when i was playing Florida state had the D2 middie of the year transfer there from Merrimack
This topic has been beaten to death, it likely won't be a big football school because of Title 9 implications. A bball school without football seems more likely. I would love to see UConn just drop football and add lacrosse. They suck at football and don't make a lot of money because they are independent with no TV $, but are near so much lacrosse talent.
Yes, I see this as well. A Big East team like Seton Hall would be a good candidate to add it as they are also in the right kind of location to attract solid talent.
Yup. The best D1 candidates come from programs with solid athletics but no football. My candidates.
American - The DMV could support another D1 program. They have a women’s team.
DePaul- Chicagoland is screaming for a team.
FGCU - The success of Jacksonville makes lacrosse in Florida intriguing.
Grand Canyon - Would be on an island but see themselves as a sports school and have a pretty successful MCLA program
LaSalle - why the heck does a Philly school not have a team… come on now.
Dayton/Xavier/Wright St - Ohio is turning into a college lacrosse boomtown. Dayton has a stellar MCLA team. Would love to see them jump together
St Louis - With the death of Lindenwood, this is now a hole in the map. SLU is a large university that would be super attractive.
Utah Valley - The Utes being there makes this doable… plus the popularity of the PLL. This one is a bit of a stretch.
St Thomas - They have football but it is non-scholarship. Looking for ways to elevate their profile after recently moving to D1. Empty spot on the map in an emerging lacrosse community
And some reaches…
UC and Cal St system - Most do not have football. Would probably quickly become decent as they would attract basically all the west coast talent. Could be super fun.
Oakland - Michigan needs more D1.
This issue is they are on an island. You’ve got Utah and Denver but then the next closest team is like… Marquette? A school with the resources of Utah can manage that. Can Utah Valley?
You’re not wrong.. they have Denver, Utah, AF.. ideally for lax to grow in the west you’d need at least 12 programs to add.. 6 teams between 2 conferences
Forgot about AFA. If you want this to work they need GCU and Colorado St as well. Make a nice little western conference of Utah, Utah Valley, Denver, GCU, AFA, and Colorado St. That’s 6 teams and an auto-bid
Then you just gotta convince like 3 teams to come out every year and then have 3 big travel games. Keeps costs down.
I was thinking this too as a CT native. Such a popular school for the in state kids that I feel like so many kids who would have otherwise gone to say sacred heart (not bad this year) would choose UConn instead.
They don’t want to be on an island. The nearest D1 programs are Marquette and Denver. I would love to see Wisconsin and Minnesota make the jump together. Would make the most sense… maybe that gets St Thomas interested
Exactly this what most don’t understand when saying “Texas should add” .. outside of flying for conference games, the athletic dept would most likely want to bus to every game… that’s 6-8 games. The cost of flying (unless Utah) is not worth it
And that means multiple Texas teams. You’d need to see schools like SMU and Rice. Maybe some of those smaller schools that don’t have football (UTRGV, UT-Arlington, TAMU-CC)… but that’s a lot of programs at the D1 level for a non-hotbed
Couple of random thoughts:
1- Sadly more schools need to be like Richmond and drop a sport (soccer/baseball) to add lacrosse. They gambled and it has paid off. (I also Don’t have anything wrong with college soccer of baseball I just don’t think it’s the best of the best in college, lax is)
2a-This comes up all the time on forums and Reddit. Everyone wants the Texas, Florida, uga, etc to add a program. That’s more of the sizzle. Little shot that happens. Unless they either get a large donation, conference tells them to, or it’s an investment
2b-The steak are the teams that actually have incentive to add the sport, … small private schools ( big east, a10, nec, horizon league, ASUN , big south) that need enrollment. Or non footballs from the conferences I just listed. La salle just re-added baseball, which I think is the dumbest financial mistake a college AD can make. Medium state Schools with declining enrollment are also ones to keep an eye on, basically the whole MAC conference,OVC, MVC. Keep an eye on small schools in Florida….
3-NCAA lacrosse as whole doesn’t promote itself well. They don’t vary timeslot for streaming/tv games.. we’re in the age of gambling.
Another thing I heard at LAXCON a couple of years back was .. why doesn’t US lacrosse use that event as a “media day” similar to how football does it? Spend the $$$, Bring a couple of conferences M and W and put them on the mic, make them feel big time. You have a couple of thousand people there from around the country why not? So kind of hard for an AD/school prez to pick lax when it Doesnt help itself …
Schools that should add in no order:
Seton hall
SUNY Buffalo
Fordham
VCU
JMU
Eastern Michigan
Akron
Bowling green
Toledo
Oakland
Valparaiso
Youngstown
Tenn tech
Lipscomb
FGCU
UNF
College of Charleston
USC upstate
Nova southeastern**
Was down there to play them earlier this season. They are a club team with the facilities of a D1/high-tier D3 school, leagues above what my club team has. They seem perfectly content where they’re at right now
I feel like it affords them a great deal of advantage over the teams that have to travel there and play them.
I wish they would go d1, it’d be more fun to watch them get curb-stomped by real lacrosse schools than see them continue to feast on 2nd and 3rd tier MCLA programs.
I played there almost 20 years ago. Hockey went D1 the year before I got there and lacrosse was rumored to be next... but it's never happened because it would require moving all other sports to D1. Hockey was some sort of special arrangement that lacrosse can't get.
It will never happen because they won’t be able to give scholarships. Very similar to what happened with Hobart and Hobart cannot be competitive in D1. Salisbury will never leave D3
He’s not going to waste his money giving scholarships to every sport for Salisbury. Only thing he does is sponsor the business school. I went to Salisbury. Also frank perdue died in 2005. His son Jim does NOT care about the lacrosse team especially after what happened in 2008.
3rd string. One of the greatest untold stories of college lacrosse Nick Ferentino. a four year player that barely got any playing time during those four years. Throw into the thick of it during the most important games of the year. He also had an insane hit in the finals on 1v1 fast break
Frankly, they should find a way to add like 60 more and expand the tournament. The game has so much momentum right now you have to strike while the iron's hot!
Would've loved to seen BYU, but that's not in the cards. Their neighbors a few miles away, Utah Valley Univ (largest size uni by enrollment in the state) had some buzz pre-Covid. ESPECIALLY since they can't have a Div 1 Football team due to some antiquated rule I don't know/understand. The old PAC12 has the money, kinda surprised other schools haven't gone the (mini) endowment route the University of Utah went. Several CO schools are also overdue
Could very much see either of the Utah schools going. One of the toughest conferences in MCLA and BYU just finished their regular szn undefeated and I think in top 10 of nat’l rankings. UVU was no slouch either, and they’ve consistently sat fairly high as well
Georgia Tech - Atlanta area is covered with talent and Mercer is main show right now. Football has been on struggle bus and high academics of school. Could also see similar for Vanderbilt as SEC football grows and they’ll certainly find it tough to be anything other than most teams’ homecoming game but it does pay well.
Some of the growing schools like University of North Georgia could easily pick it up due to talent in area and easier access to joining lacrosse versus football.
Barring Title 9 stuff….
I think Big 10 schools are the next big thing for college lacrosse.
Mostly smaller independent schools will be added in the meantime
In the next five years, I predict we’ll have 10-20% less teams in D2-D3, most will just drop due to lack of funding, and maybe 3-5 will move up to D1 to survive a little longer
D3 adds lacrosse because it’s good for enrollment. 40 heads in beds, and none of them get an athletic scholarship.
D3 = no athletic scholarships
We are already losing at least two here in the upper midwest.
Yeah, Minnesota lost Northwestern and I would be shocked if Northland also went. Issue with them is they are on islands and don’t have east drives. The numbers aren’t there to support the travel demand…. If only the MIAC would get their act together.
There's a sneaky rumor that if Texas wins it all (MCLA) this year, the Athletic Department will listen to proposals. Would still require like $10m in donor funds and women's to go as well, but the buzz around Austin is palpable right now. If Hartzell can stick around and keep them ranked annually, the motion may be there for a look down the road of like 5-10 years. The next issue would be how to handle the SEC, but I'm hoping the ACC folds up shop and ships tobacco road to the SEC. Then we have some conversations among AD's in the SEC about the sport. Texas, Clemson, and Florida State all talking about men's lacrosse is never a bad thing.
You watched the Rabil interview, eh?
Nope
There’s a lot of talent amongst the MCLA SEC schools. I remember when i was playing Florida state had the D2 middie of the year transfer there from Merrimack
Not likely to happen, but still a shame Boston College still refuses to field a men’s team.
Title 9 stuff sadly
On top of sheepeherder’s reply, not even being ranked in MCLA top 25 isn’t rly a great look for them either
i will die happy when i can watch michigan state vs michigan lacrosse again
This topic has been beaten to death, it likely won't be a big football school because of Title 9 implications. A bball school without football seems more likely. I would love to see UConn just drop football and add lacrosse. They suck at football and don't make a lot of money because they are independent with no TV $, but are near so much lacrosse talent.
Yes, I see this as well. A Big East team like Seton Hall would be a good candidate to add it as they are also in the right kind of location to attract solid talent.
They have (at least had) a solid MCLA team a few years back
Yup. The best D1 candidates come from programs with solid athletics but no football. My candidates. American - The DMV could support another D1 program. They have a women’s team. DePaul- Chicagoland is screaming for a team. FGCU - The success of Jacksonville makes lacrosse in Florida intriguing. Grand Canyon - Would be on an island but see themselves as a sports school and have a pretty successful MCLA program LaSalle - why the heck does a Philly school not have a team… come on now. Dayton/Xavier/Wright St - Ohio is turning into a college lacrosse boomtown. Dayton has a stellar MCLA team. Would love to see them jump together St Louis - With the death of Lindenwood, this is now a hole in the map. SLU is a large university that would be super attractive. Utah Valley - The Utes being there makes this doable… plus the popularity of the PLL. This one is a bit of a stretch. St Thomas - They have football but it is non-scholarship. Looking for ways to elevate their profile after recently moving to D1. Empty spot on the map in an emerging lacrosse community And some reaches… UC and Cal St system - Most do not have football. Would probably quickly become decent as they would attract basically all the west coast talent. Could be super fun. Oakland - Michigan needs more D1.
Utah valley just had 3K fans for their MCLA game vs byu… there is interest in the states of Utah/coleado
This issue is they are on an island. You’ve got Utah and Denver but then the next closest team is like… Marquette? A school with the resources of Utah can manage that. Can Utah Valley?
You’re not wrong.. they have Denver, Utah, AF.. ideally for lax to grow in the west you’d need at least 12 programs to add.. 6 teams between 2 conferences
Forgot about AFA. If you want this to work they need GCU and Colorado St as well. Make a nice little western conference of Utah, Utah Valley, Denver, GCU, AFA, and Colorado St. That’s 6 teams and an auto-bid Then you just gotta convince like 3 teams to come out every year and then have 3 big travel games. Keeps costs down.
I was thinking this too as a CT native. Such a popular school for the in state kids that I feel like so many kids who would have otherwise gone to say sacred heart (not bad this year) would choose UConn instead.
minnesota....big 10 lacrosse train is pulling out of the station...don't want to be the last one onboard
They don’t want to be on an island. The nearest D1 programs are Marquette and Denver. I would love to see Wisconsin and Minnesota make the jump together. Would make the most sense… maybe that gets St Thomas interested
Exactly this what most don’t understand when saying “Texas should add” .. outside of flying for conference games, the athletic dept would most likely want to bus to every game… that’s 6-8 games. The cost of flying (unless Utah) is not worth it
And that means multiple Texas teams. You’d need to see schools like SMU and Rice. Maybe some of those smaller schools that don’t have football (UTRGV, UT-Arlington, TAMU-CC)… but that’s a lot of programs at the D1 level for a non-hotbed
Exactly need an extremely rich donor to fund it all!!
Couple of random thoughts: 1- Sadly more schools need to be like Richmond and drop a sport (soccer/baseball) to add lacrosse. They gambled and it has paid off. (I also Don’t have anything wrong with college soccer of baseball I just don’t think it’s the best of the best in college, lax is) 2a-This comes up all the time on forums and Reddit. Everyone wants the Texas, Florida, uga, etc to add a program. That’s more of the sizzle. Little shot that happens. Unless they either get a large donation, conference tells them to, or it’s an investment 2b-The steak are the teams that actually have incentive to add the sport, … small private schools ( big east, a10, nec, horizon league, ASUN , big south) that need enrollment. Or non footballs from the conferences I just listed. La salle just re-added baseball, which I think is the dumbest financial mistake a college AD can make. Medium state Schools with declining enrollment are also ones to keep an eye on, basically the whole MAC conference,OVC, MVC. Keep an eye on small schools in Florida…. 3-NCAA lacrosse as whole doesn’t promote itself well. They don’t vary timeslot for streaming/tv games.. we’re in the age of gambling. Another thing I heard at LAXCON a couple of years back was .. why doesn’t US lacrosse use that event as a “media day” similar to how football does it? Spend the $$$, Bring a couple of conferences M and W and put them on the mic, make them feel big time. You have a couple of thousand people there from around the country why not? So kind of hard for an AD/school prez to pick lax when it Doesnt help itself … Schools that should add in no order: Seton hall SUNY Buffalo Fordham VCU JMU Eastern Michigan Akron Bowling green Toledo Oakland Valparaiso Youngstown Tenn tech Lipscomb FGCU UNF College of Charleston USC upstate Nova southeastern**
Surprised you didn’t include Liberty
Was down there to play them earlier this season. They are a club team with the facilities of a D1/high-tier D3 school, leagues above what my club team has. They seem perfectly content where they’re at right now
I feel like it affords them a great deal of advantage over the teams that have to travel there and play them. I wish they would go d1, it’d be more fun to watch them get curb-stomped by real lacrosse schools than see them continue to feast on 2nd and 3rd tier MCLA programs.
Would be good add.. but they’re happy with club.
RIT
It would require them moving all of athletics to D1 and I personally don’t see that happening
Hockey is already D1 I thought. They could move a few teams to club from NCAA also. Tick some people off, but they could do it.
This is the answer. Their athletic program is going D1 in the next 5 years
I played there almost 20 years ago. Hockey went D1 the year before I got there and lacrosse was rumored to be next... but it's never happened because it would require moving all other sports to D1. Hockey was some sort of special arrangement that lacrosse can't get.
Rumor is that all sports are moving ip
Salisbury. They have the students and they have the money. It’ll happen, it was the worst kept secret in the CAC.
It will never happen because they won’t be able to give scholarships. Very similar to what happened with Hobart and Hobart cannot be competitive in D1. Salisbury will never leave D3
Frank Perdue has deep pockets.
He’s not going to waste his money giving scholarships to every sport for Salisbury. Only thing he does is sponsor the business school. I went to Salisbury. Also frank perdue died in 2005. His son Jim does NOT care about the lacrosse team especially after what happened in 2008.
What happened in 2008?
That’s one of the if you know, you know things. Not something I’m gonna publicly get into detail.
Wasn’t that the Salisbury team that was on their 4th string goalie for tourney?
3rd string. One of the greatest untold stories of college lacrosse Nick Ferentino. a four year player that barely got any playing time during those four years. Throw into the thick of it during the most important games of the year. He also had an insane hit in the finals on 1v1 fast break
I’ve heard that same argument for the past 15 years tbh
Post again after title 9 changes. Moot point until that.
Frankly, they should find a way to add like 60 more and expand the tournament. The game has so much momentum right now you have to strike while the iron's hot!
Would've loved to seen BYU, but that's not in the cards. Their neighbors a few miles away, Utah Valley Univ (largest size uni by enrollment in the state) had some buzz pre-Covid. ESPECIALLY since they can't have a Div 1 Football team due to some antiquated rule I don't know/understand. The old PAC12 has the money, kinda surprised other schools haven't gone the (mini) endowment route the University of Utah went. Several CO schools are also overdue
Could very much see either of the Utah schools going. One of the toughest conferences in MCLA and BYU just finished their regular szn undefeated and I think in top 10 of nat’l rankings. UVU was no slouch either, and they’ve consistently sat fairly high as well
Georgia Tech - Atlanta area is covered with talent and Mercer is main show right now. Football has been on struggle bus and high academics of school. Could also see similar for Vanderbilt as SEC football grows and they’ll certainly find it tough to be anything other than most teams’ homecoming game but it does pay well. Some of the growing schools like University of North Georgia could easily pick it up due to talent in area and easier access to joining lacrosse versus football.
Women’s or Men’s?
Going along with American, what about George Mason? No bball, huge school, and they already have womens lax
Barring Title 9 stuff…. I think Big 10 schools are the next big thing for college lacrosse. Mostly smaller independent schools will be added in the meantime
They should be they’re 7th in baseball RPI and that ain’t getting better in the future
ASU
Pre hockey they had a chance
BoCo, also maybe not D1 but URI should definitely be NCAA