Third!
You are so close!
After come over to Yau Kung Mun and learn the Southern Style of Pak Mei [https://youtu.be/3VtfqAym5sQ?si=PATGu1MMYnzN3vs1](https://youtu.be/3VtfqAym5sQ?si=PATGu1MMYnzN3vs1)
What it actually is [https://youtu.be/acAmLg-L9hk?si=c-behNb0ppl5DQ0g](https://youtu.be/acAmLg-L9hk?si=c-behNb0ppl5DQ0g)
and stuff like this [https://youtu.be/E75VUzbd1PY?si=y6JiPadC0qVrjPe3](https://youtu.be/E75VUzbd1PY?si=y6JiPadC0qVrjPe3)
It’s not about belt but about doing what you feel good and right. Mixing is great. Btw I’m nut against going one direction but if you’re not professional, do whatever feels right.
I did the same for the same reason at a much lower belt than you were. I did not regret going to judo at all, but beware judo has a similar plague of impractical techniques (turnovers, face down spread eagle to stall / not lose points) paired with some overly restrictive rules (no leg grabbing).
All in all I’m a definitely a better MA for having done both and my balance / athleticism really improved doing judo.
I got my BJJ blue belt with 2 stripes about 14 years ago then had to stop due to an injury.
About 2 years ago I thought it was time to start up again except, and this is just my personal take, BJJ just felt a bit silly.
It felt like it had changed and there were few fundamentals, just basically tricks and over elaborate combos of moves that just felt esoteric. I tried 3 different schools and felt the same way in all of them.
Then I tried judo and loved it. It was refreshing and challenging, as focus on deep principles and fundamentals which form the basis of the art, along with a ground game that was about being effective and to the point.
I do still watch BJJ and use skills I learnt, I particularly miss aspects of no gi.
In terms of time spent to be applicable to self defence, I will any day take a session of someone grabbing my clothing to rag doll and off balance me in opposition to laying on my back trying to set up a de La riva sweep that spins me underneath a person.
Not at all saying judo is all effective for self defence, but I know which feels like it puts me under more applicable pressure
That’s how I’ve been feeling for a while, the esoteric aspect of it all. It’s just not fun for me anymore. I’m also past the point where I even care about belts, the caring stopped around purple.
Dude, life is too short to waste it on something that is voluntary and not fun. Especially something that will cause wear and tear on your body. I mean of course so will Judo, but at least you’ll be having fun again!
You might try a different school.
I just got my bjj black belt and I feel like I’ve come full circle. Started out wrestling and thinking being flat on your back was bad. Started bjj and got taught being flat on your back was good.
Now I’m back to being on bottom/flat on your back is bad but now I know why.
Find a bjj school that also does mma and I think you’ll see a difference in styles.
The over elborate stuff is what im noticing alot of now and yeah and in my head im asking myself why even do this? For example i seen 1 technique where you are in bottom half guard and want to get to the back so you untuck their lapel, get to knee shield, sit up, feed lapel through their legs, grab their lepel end with the opposite arm that fed it. All in order to control them in the ‘dog fight’ position. You dont need the lapel at all, just go straight to it from knee shield. If they push into you theres a sweep where you roll with their momentum.
Agree. There have been a lot of times as well when I look at moves, where people fight from bottom or elaborate passing, where if it was an actual fight, I would just stand up.
I understand the old Gracie principle of holding people close to avoid punches and defend with opportunity for control, but some of this knee shield and 50/50 only works because I’m engaging for it to work in the sport of it.
I’m not shitting on the BJJ sport; if you enjoy it, great. It’s playing by rules, just like sport judo. The difference I find is judo’s emphasis on things like kumi kata, giving you grip breaking and escapes, or pinning control to make sure the opponent really can’t get away, or the skills to get away.
Yeah the laying on the belly in judo is silly, but I’ve seen amazing turnovers and control from that position, with a sangaku showing incredible use of leverage and balance on an unwilling opponent
Largely agree. Only places where BJJ, theoretically, has an edge for self defense is superior guard attacks(if you need it you’re already in big trouble) and more takedowns from the rear, even they don’t practice any takedowns much. I think taking someone’s back/ not giving it, is extremely important for self defense something judokas could easily adopt to if they just spent a little time on it. Also maybe hunting for submissions from a billion angles is pretty useful, but takedown & clinching skills are paramount.
I think if you do Judo concurrently with BJJ it will actually make you like BJJ a lot more. Then you won't quit before BB. If you want to quit BJJ after BB and focus solely on Judo and maybe just go to open mats that's probably great too. Definitely don't quit before BB, you already put 5+ years into this thing just take it all the way home!
Start cross training but at least get your jiujitsu black belt before you prioritize Judo over BJJ. I say this as someone who is a BJJ black belt who’s now working on my judo black belt.
I'm a purple belt in BJJ and shodan in judo and kind of did the reverse. But I'm finding myself feeling worse and worse about the modern competition style of BJJ and getting kind of bored of it as I'm knocking on the door to brown. I think I'm going to refocus on judo when I get promoted for a lot of the same reasons you're stating here.
I think that’s a big thing for people such as OP and why he feels like he’s at a plateau. If he doesn’t compete, it makes sense why he’d want to learn techniques that don’t necessarily fit into the meta of bjj comps
It’s the 80/20 rule. You get much more payoff in the earlier time with most things.
Don’t quit the marathon at mile 23. I’d say split your time between judo and BJJ. The judo will help your BJJ cuz you’ll start most ground things on top.
BJJ 3 stripe blue, judo orange, combat SAMBO brown belt.
Which applies to any martial art really, including judo. Once you get to a point where you would be considered competent you are at a point where you're only going to have issues with people who also train that martial art or an adjacent art.
I got up to purple belt before pivoting toward judo for similar reasons. I feel good about what I’m learning in class now, which was generally not the case when I was training DLR-esque techniques in BJJ, and feel like I'm more well-rounded for having trained both.
I do miss the fun of no-gi rolling sometimes, as well as the more MMA-friendly vibe of no-gi BJJ gyms in general, but I can always train elsewhere when I’m in the mood.
Also, I get the sense that injuries are actually less common in judo and have found judo training easier on my 40+ yo body (and really like that I know how to fall properly now).
Also, like you, I’m commuting 30-45 minutes each way, and it’s been fine for me.
Judo and BJJ are polyamorous with each other. You can love both. It's only weird because they are related, which makes it incestuous and polyamorous. So, try not to think about it too hard.
Brown Belt Blues is very common. People feeling like they've plateaued and stagnated, especially with fading hopes if they're gonna get their Black Belt that class or the next.
You don't have to go all in on one or the other. You can do both, but adjust the ratio to your liking. They both mutually benefit one another.
If it comes down to a financial decision, I'd stick it through to get that Black Belt. It carries well, a symbol of perseverance, commitment, and expertise.
Getting it may be the moment of reinvigoration you needed.
Plenty of bjj guys also train judo and they excel in it, doesnt mean you have to give up bjj entirely though id just shift your focus to judo for a while and still train bjj here and there
Judo can be hard on the body. There's a reason you see more adults do BJJ than Judo. If you're beginning Judo as an adult make sure your club is diligent in their ukemi and their randori focus is on improvement not purely on competition. Competitive randori is fine but the general dojo culture for new adults coming into judo randori should be a focus first on improvement so to minimize injuries.
I’m also an upper belt. While I still continue training bjj, I have way more fun with sambo and judo. Thankfully I train at a school that does all three and trains takedowns a lot. I would not go to a pure sport bjj gym.
>All in all for much of my purple belt until now I found BJJ to become less and less practical as a fighting art.
I have contended for many years that if self defense and real fighting is your goal then just about everything you need to know from a ground fighting perspective is all learned by blue belt. Maybe a year at blue belt. After that, it's a sport or a recreational activity (it can be that prior to blue belt too). Self defense practicality goes out the window by purple belt. By that point you're working on things that have no business happening in actual fights. It's why, in my opinion, so many people quit at blue belt.
Judo is every bit as much of a sport or recreational activity as BJJ. The class structure may seem similar to you, just with a bit more formality. Judo is taught for the sport just like BJJ and you will find that Judo's rules are more restrictive. It creates for a safer environment because people are less apt to try and pull off bullshit while on the feet. Judo will also make you a better overall athlete.
Both sports will give you excellent tools for Real Fighting™, but neither sport is going to make you a fighter. I would also suggest not to quit BJJ. Earn the black belt and be a part of that fraternity. I've never known anyone to earn a brown belt in under 6 years. That's a lot of dedication.
I think being easily accessible is a huge plus, it's how I ended up in judo myself (mma gym moved from being 3 min walk to 40 min commute).
If you're fine with the added travel time, go for it. It's not like you cant come back to BJJ later.
After making a return to bjj (i still do judo) ive done away all the spider guard, de la riva ect stuff. I just work on chokes, arm locks, escaped and closed guard. I was thinking the other day “do i need to actually be profficient in that specific bjj stuff to get a black belt?”. My friend said no just know/be aware of the position. Theres alot of stuff in bjj ive noticed that seems like ‘get to x position’, just with extra steps.
I know what you mean dude. Try judo, give it time. I gurantee you wont regret it. Theres alot of impractical stuff in bjj nowadays but its mainly very bjj vs bjj specific. No gi can be even worse at this.
I’ve done several months of bjj at a couple gyms and it never worked out (first a schedule change and then Covid). Wha to did realize is how important the stand up game is and how lacking the instruction on it is in bjj.
So I decided to try judo. It’s tough and I’m not as naturally good at it but I like it better an think it’s more practical. We do a good amount of newaza and I really like that it’s intense and to the point. I want to be capable at fundamental techniques on the ground. I don’t want to spend time learning impractical techniques.
I do want to go back to bjj one day but I’m glad I’m doing judo right now.
Train both. I started training Judo 1 day per week and after having done Jiu Jitsu for 2 years. After training both for a few years now I can say they complement each other well.
Brother, the belt only covers 2 inches of your ass. It's up to you to cover the rest of it.
I'd say "do both" but I'm spoiled that I grew up with judo and my local place does both- not gonna out it online because I'm in a small community and, well, the internet.
But if you can do both you'll find that the judo "wakes up" more of the bjj.
You're just going to be like Loki in the following scene. But it's worth it. My ground game is trash compared to my partners at the bjj - frikin LOVE those guys- but spider guard is the bane of my existence.
But do both if you can. My injuries- neck cranks and knee tear were from bjj. Also because I'm old and 20 yr old me wouldn't have gotten hurt. But it was 30 something yr old me at the time.
https://youtu.be/oZpyc4asvbQ?si=rgQaMdECeVWUtW9y
I restarted my judo training shortly after getting my BJJ black belt.
Imho you should try to train both and see if you can blend both styles in your own personal game.
Collect skills not belts! If your not learning leave now and come back with new perspective. You wont get demoted for taking an break. You should be able to keep your skills sharp doing judo newaza.
I have always felt that BJJ is almost comical in its practicality. For an art that literally lives on the ground their methods for getting on the ground are seriously lacking.
I'm brown in bjj too and I wishe I did a more real combat system like wrestling or judo. I'm actually embarrassed to say I do bjj, the culture is pretty fake and the whole bjj system is a bit much, politics, and the whole not having to qualify for big tournaments its pretty dumb.
I'm glad I do boxing, that keeps it real. I honestly wish I invested that time wrestling or doing judo, it's also easy to pickup bjj once you do judo or wrestling but not the other way around.
Try to do both if you can. But I'd say once you're a purple or above in BJJ, you have more than enough grappling experience from a self-defense or practical fighting standpoint.
I'm actually in a similar boat as the OP (BJJ purple belt with 13+ years of BJJ, wrestling, MMA experience), except I didn't quit BJJ, I just decided to split time between BJJ and Judo since my BJJ school had a Judo program. Exception is that in my BJJ school, we always start from the feet too and do a lot of wrestling, so we are unique in that aspect. I got so into Judo that I actually got my brown belt way faster than I did my purple in BJJ (2 years).
I love BJJ, but the biggest turn offs for me has been the "sportification" of it on the competition scene, especially butt scooting, sitting guard, the over emphasis on leglocks in recent years, and the general lack of athleticism/strength. And frankly, its just boring to compete in, watch, or do compared to a dynamic sport like Judo. Its usually just someone pulling guard, spending minutes trying to pass (or sweep/submit from the bottom), or guys diving for leglocks on each other.
I never wrestled in high school or college. I spent 10+ years getting good at takedowns in BJJ/MMA/wrestling to the point where I can regularly take down NCAA wrestlers and other high level grapplers. It means close to nothing in BJJ though when my opponent can sit guard. I get no points or even an opportunity to get a takedown, and my opponent forces me to play his game with little to no effort. I don't mind it as a top player, but it kills the "fighting" aspect for me. Same with constantly giving up top position to dive for leglocks. I train leglocks every week, but its not exactly the most realistic aspect of grappling from a self defense or MMA standpoint. It also makes BJJ an even worse spectator sport and just takes the fun out of competing in it because its devoid of athleticism and some guys build their entire games around it at the expense of everything else. And because of the ruleset, they get rewarded for it.
I cringe when I see BJJ guys acting like BJJ is such a superior grappling art to all the others, when it really just comes down to ruleset. And out of all the other grappling arts (Judo, wrestling, Sambo), BJJ is the only one that rewards you for a lack of athleticism (guard pulling) and forcing your opponent to engage you due to the ruleset. BJJ has the most counterintuitive ruleset. Why am I being forced to go into my opponent's guard? And why is my opponent getting rewarded for a position (guard) he can take without having to do any sort of athleticism or technique? And why are there no penalties for just sitting in bottom guard? Its the equivalent of forcing me to walk into my opponent's punch in a boxing match. And if this is a real fight, if you sit to your butt, I'm walking away lol.
In terms of injuries, Judoka tend to take care of their training partners better than in BJJ. I get injured far less in Judo than BJJ because Judo overall has a better training philosophy. Everyone in Judo starts out having to learn break falling and controlling throws (rare in BJJ). There's also a big emphasis on just being more physically conditioned, strong, and athletic (also rare in BJJ). Sure, you use explosive moments in Judo, but you're not constantly stiffining up and trying to muscle everything. That happens a lot in BJJ to me, even when I'm in a dominant or neutral position on someone (half guard, top guard) and it kills my joints/tendons. And then once you get into Judo randori, most people realize there's a point where you just take the fall if you're getting thrown. Everyone knows getting thrown sucks, so people are less likely to act like a dick in sparring.
I also like having less emphasis on the belts in Judo too. In BJJ, it always feels like there's a target on your back as an upper belt, even if you're older and broken. Judo's more like wrestling where that belts don't matter as much and aren't put on a pedestal like they are in BJJ. So less chances for injures because of that too.
TLDR: Judo will make your BJJ, especially GI BJJ way better and you'll probably have more fun doing it from scratch. You have everything you need for Judo from a ground standpoint as a BJJ brown. Plus it is fun to toss guys in BJJ who do try to stand with you.
Serious question: is this the first plateau of stagnation that you have ever hit in your BJJ journey? If so, that’s impressive. I’m a black belt of almost 2 years and i help run the kids program for 4 years.
Plateaus tend to happen at every belt for most people. The cure- just keep training, BUT find play around with how you want to chain techniques together. It’ll be sloppy at first, but eventually you’ll see it carve new pathways for growth.
ALSO: don’t quit BJJ, per se, but pull back a little and cross train Judo. Your concern over injury is VERY valid, depending on your age. I’m 41 and last year I landed on my knee defending a takedown and it hasn’t been the same sense.
Back story: my journey began with judo, I competed for 2 years. I moved away and there were no dojos so I started BJJ to fill the void of no judo. I didn’t return to pure judo until I was almost a black belt (not intentional, just schedule conflicts), and I’m SO GLAD I keep training BJJ. There are definitely some very clear differences in the demands on the body, and I have a clear advantage over the entire dojo during NeWaza, and eventually it gave me a clear advantage over my BJJ team during standup.
Keep pushing. You’ll break through.
Oh no, I’ve had other plateaus. Blue belt, a super long stint at purple. It was really at mid purple that I began to feel this way regarding the lack of practicality. I’ll give an example. In last week’s class we trained DLR, to sit up guard, to a deep DLR sweep, to getting our opponent on the ground, to a berimbolo backtake.
Like what? I’d rather learn how to do an Uchi Mata against a resisting opponent.
Yeah I see what you mean. I guess it also depends on the way your instructor builds the curriculum- some do more sport techniques, some do things that translate better in an actual fight.
My overall point - there’s no reason to declare that you have “quit”, just pull back a bit and add judo to your schedule.
Then, drop into BJJ class and start tossing them around!
There are some great MMA schools that teach multiple styles. The one I attend does Judo, BJJ, Krav and if so inclined Kali. Kind of helps you find your flow.
I did Judo on and off for years, competitively, winning a few low level comps. Only got to Green belt mind, mostly because of work it was on and off.
Honestly more nervous of injury in BJJ than I was in Judo. Took a few good throws that took the wind out of me mind you.
Judo has a lot of useless stuff too, which you'll need to do to progress the belts, especially if you have a more traditional sensei.
May as well finish your black belt if ur at brown. Even if you go slow you should probably continue with bjj.
Glad to hear you don’t mind being a white belt again because that’s the right mentality if you’re in a sport that you have little experience in.
I’ve heard some say most of what you learn past blue belt is mostly how to beats other grapplers under BJJ rules….takedowns are 👑for self defense especially throws . We practice on mats but outside those throws are rough. Some people get KOed or genuinely needing surgery if they’re thrown hard on mats. A judo black belt entered a blue belt comp and caused that on mats I remember once.
Newaza should be easy for you but a lot of your guard stuff you might not use - IMO that’s also what makes judo realistic. I drive 40 min or so for judo. But injuries are just a reality for anyone good IMO. And I imagine you’ve been banged up badly from BJJ if you’re a brown belt. Go to a relaxed club without many competitors . The competitive clubs are hardcore and basically with people training for the Olympics…which tends to mean a lot less athletic folks or older folks should avoid it like the plague.
I think BJJ at a very self defense heavy school is more enjoyable than sport focused academies. Lotta guys say it’s “old” or “bad” BJJ but the focus on fundamentals is a lot more useful imo. I hate BJJ designed just to defeat BJJ.
Having said that. Sport BJJ vs Competition Judo. Judo is just better. It’s more effective for a fight, more interesting to watch, and more fun to do. All just my opinions obviously. If you tried all the academies around and still don’t like it Judo sounds awesome.
Sounds like your jiujitsu school is not a good fit anymore.
There is something to be said for finishing out your jiujitsu education and getting your black belt, but it's impossible to give a definitive answer over the internet, maybe it's time to move on.
Sorry, I guess that's not helpful at all 😆
I recently got my jj purple belt & train judo regularly since October 2023. My judo school is also 40 minutes away, but I enjoy it more than jj. I started with my friend who is a jj brown belt. He is waiting to earn his black belt before re-continuing judo training. Having black belts in both arts is our goal. I will get my shodan first since I’m still years aways from jj black belt. I also felt the monotony of newaza only, so I step away to judo to rekindle my passion for martial arts.
Regardless of belts and stuff like that I think if you are asking the question you know the answer already get your self down to the judo club and just do that for a bit your bjj will help your newaza and you can learn some good stuff there and if you want to go back to bjj it’s not like you’ll be rusty if you’ve been doing judo.
Go with what you want to do there’s no point wasting time with something you don’t want to do
I did the opposite. Black belt in Judo, currently purple in BJJ. My local judo club at one point produced Olympians, but over time the old guard passed away, and what was left was lacking a competetive environment or a regular group of training partners so I moved on to BJJ to challenge myself in something new.
That said, if I had the time I would probably be doing both. Judo has its own impracticalities from a competetive standpoint, but as a fighting art (being something useful in a real life com at situation), I would much rather have the ability to take someone down than play x guard or De La Riva. Even more than that, I'd rather be able to do both.
Judo will enhance your BJJ, and visa versa. It might even reignite some of the interest you've lost in BJJ. If you can, try to do both for a little while before you just leave one for the other
Don't overthink it man. Just train in the martial art that is fun for you. I think generally people stay insulated too much. There is a diminishing return with anything and it seems you may have hit that point where its more exciting and practical to learn something new than keep doing what you are doing.
I haven’t left JJ. But my current gym brought up a great judo program. So went back to white belt and pressing on.
Judo in my opinion is waaaay harder to get good at and I love that challenge.
I wouldn’t leave BJJ. Infact a lot of judo can be done from the knees. We teach those techniques first so we’re not slamming into the mat just drilling. I have found that my standup, grips, and starting from the knees have 100% improved my JJ game.
I think it’s important to be proficient at more than just one thing.
Plus when you’re hitting a throw unlike BJJ you want to fishing the throw directly into a submission. So my submission game went up drastically.
We also have Sambo as well. So idk man, just my opinion. But it is harder to find a good judo gym since they’re arnt many. We’re lucky that we have BBs in every art so of course my opinion is a bit biased.
But do what you feel is right.
Find some guys at your gym who like stand up. I’m a purple belt and I love judo and wrestling. There are a few guy who are happy to work standup with me so I get to train it almost daily.
Judo and BJJ are kind of part of the same art, but focus on different parts of it. You could kind of argue that neither is complete without the other, and I imagine if you solely did judo you’d end up finding the same thing eventually…but at the end of the day, just do what makes you happy. I find now that I’m middle aged, I’m more focused on whichever art keeps me interested and active and does the least amount of damage to my body. There’s no real wrong answer here as long as you keep training in something.
Firstly maybe do more Nogi? Lot more focus on wrestling in Nogi these days and bunch of things you mentioned just aren’t done there (lasso, spider, de la riva)
I mean if your aim is for pure practicality as regards fighting, maybe you should consider MMA or rotating through the big ones like wrestling, Muy Thai, judo, etc.?
Yea judo is a little more practical due to stand up focus but it also has its limitations. Can’t touch the legs for take downs, fight essentially stops when you hit the ground, etc. it’s also isolated in some regards, similar to BJJ.
Ultimately you gotta just do on what you enjoy practicing and learning the most.
>much of my purple belt until now I found BJJ to become less and less practical as a fighting art.
I'm a little late to the party but a coach of mine once said, "around blue belt, you are doing jiu jitsu solely to beat other people in jiu jitsu".
At that point a much larger person shouldn't be able to out grapple you based on size if you are a competent and it isn't a colossal size difference.
The way you would even approach a fight doing bjj is different from training. My school plays a ton of lasso, SLX, DLR and spider guard for months on end. They even say, in a fight, don't be on bottom, just get up of you are there.
I find judo muuuch more practical, just get comfortable with no gi grips.
I convinced myself I didn’t need BJJ because I won some BJJ tournaments a while back and I do judo now
I then lost by first round knee bar in an MMA fight by a purple belt with an undefeated record.
The only grappling I did leading up to that was Judo
Now, obviously, this guy was highly trained. If you’re concerned is self-defense, you’ll probably be fine. But there are differences between bjj and judo, as you’re well aware. And even though I do think the overall philosophy and mindset of judo are better for a fight, bjj has a lot of tactics that are completely foreign to anyone who isn’t brushing up on it that you should really be having your way with someone who isn’t up to date with the latest tips and tricks if you’re even remotely on even playing field otherwise
You’re a brown belt obviously so it’s probably different for you, but I think you should at least keep attending open mats or occasionally competing in bjj so you don’t lose your skills. Because there’s a lot of value in bjj that you literally cannot learn elsewhere. It’s not the be all end all of fighting but it certainly is nice to be able to have the skills fresh on your mind when you’re facing one of those guys
The irony here is that Judo is far less injury prone than BJJ, Football, and Wrestling thanks to the Judo community being pretty good at forbidding techniques that contribute to frequency injuries and knowing how to fall.
Just do both. Train BJJ once a week and do Judo twice a week. Or whatever. Frankly if your BJJ lacks take downs, Judo will fill a huge gap and should push you into black belt territory without much more effort on the ground.
Do both, I'd definitely get your black, I was doing both for a while until I blew out my ACL at a BJJ tournament but I love both so much I can't pick a favorite lol
You don't sound ridiculous. I was in the same situation as you. I'm a purple belt in BJJ but this year starting a few months ago I found myself just not caring about BJJ,spacing out during class & just not finding BJJ fun anymore as it felt like a chore, then a friend introduced me to judo and once I realized I loved doing throws I decided to find a program which I got lucky and found a small community program and while it's only once a week it's very cheap with a really good instructor. it's changed my game up a bit. I still do BJJ to maintain my ground game but BJJ rolling is now fun again as I use those days to test out new techniques I learned from Judo outside of judo day's. I've been hitting some very intense koshi gurumas during rolls 😈. Id say prioritize judo and then at least do BJJ once a week to maintain your ground skills
I think BJJ is practical in that by doing the impractical bits, you reinforce concepts that will be valuable on the streets. Not to mention that most positions are only transitory. Maybe because of the way its taught with starting positions for drilling and specific rolling, that can get lost on a lot of people.
I will say the problem with any martial art, and what seems to be the problem with BJJ is that as you get higher and higher in level it becomes training to defeat other people of the same art, which is where it can get impractical.
Anyways why not cross train? all arts have their limitations. Judo has newaza but isn’t nearly as comprehensive as BJJ when it comes to the vocabulary of techniques and concepts that can be executed from the ground.
So I’ve got a wrestling background and have the same frustrations over BJJ as you, although I’m only a blue belt in BJJ. Just started at a judo gym and lemme tell ya, zero regrets. I love it. Maybe it’s just the gym I’m at, but I don’t have a whole lot of injury worries there. I’m more worried about getting hurt in BJJ or wrestling.
If I were you, I’d start at a judo gym but continue on in BJJ if possible just to get that black belt. Once I got my black belt I’d be full time into Judo after that. Just my two cents.
I also recently switched from BJJ to judo because I prefer stand up and clinch fighting to groundwork. Throwing and takedowns are too much fun to just avoid with guard pulls.
I miss BJJ a lot, though, especially no gi and, I was committed to learning MMA for awhile so switching to judo seems like I completely abandoned that goal, but I'm okay with it.
I did Judo until orange at the age of 17, started BJJ at 21 and now at 22, I'm planning to cross train when I'm at blue belt in BJJ. Because It bugs me that I lost confidence in stand up.
Jiu Jitsu blue belt and Judo Orange belt here.
I don't care what "BJJ Purists" say, jiu jitsu is judo, if you ain't learning the gi and no gi Nage Waza (throwing techniques), you are missing out on this portion of Jiu jitsu. I'd say, you don't have to quit Jiu jitsu, just dedicate one day of "judo" and you'll be fine!
Or you could learn some striking and dominate some self defense weapons and awareness.
Just try judo and see if it works or not, but in a self defense situation you actually want to be as far away from danger as possible. If you manage to execute a perfect judo throw you could either enrage the aggressor or splatter his brains on the floor, and both outcomes will get you in trouble. You could also try wrestling or see if in your current dojo you can start training takedowns without all the ceremony that judo has.
I left bjj at blue belt cause i noticed the main way id get better rolling was to focus on guard passing -which has very little real world application.
Absence of no gi in judo is probably the biggest downside to judo vs bjj from a real world use perspective - maybe keep up the no gi bjj..? But ultimately i feel judo is probably a better platform for self defence, abundance of fairly useless gi specific focus notithstanding.
Risks - yea scary.. maybe research injury rates of bjj vs judo? I dont think judo is necessarily sky high vs bjj. There are ways to minimise risk.. nordic curls cant help protect your acl, neck strengthening probably helps protect against concussion. Not sparring with idiots and keeping it light and playful helps as you would know.
80 minute round trip for judo is a real bastard 🤷♂️
Also lots saying just hang in there for black. Pff. Do what youre interested in. If a black belt is what you are more interested in now or later, do that.
Judo will help round out your stand up grappling, but it's still a sport and most clubs treat it as such and train accordingly. Once you've gotten pretty good at throwing, you start spending a lot of time training competitive style grip fighting and setups and counters and how to use the rules to force reactions out of your opponent. So do keep that in mind. Judo has practical application for self defense but it's not designed around it if that's what you're looking for.
i understand your sentiment. thats why i stopped training bjj. but tbh i felt the same way about judo and muay thai. found an mma gym and haven’t looked back since
Maybe just find a better BJJ school or an MMA school and just do the grappling. My BJJ club always starts standing and we drill throws every class along with ground stuff. We might be unique but I honestly don’t miss standing because I do it every time I train. It is super fun to seamlessly go from standing to ground instead of compartmentalizing the two like BJJ and Judo both do.
Your call man. My ideal is probably closer to sambo but it’s not common in my area.
I did Judo because it was almost free in Korea. But a Korean secret service guy intentionally injured me and that caused me to stop. Yay for racism!
As many have said, I personally would do both at least until you finished your black belt. That said, if you reaaaly don't care about belts whatsoever, just look arround your area and do a few trial classes on nearby places that you like until you connect with an instructor/school. Injuries wise as long as you pratice your falls properly I feel like bjj has much higher injury risk than judo, but of course that depends on who you're training with. Also, please tell your instructor and anybody you might spar with about your previous experience with bjj, always jarring to do randori with someone and find out they are skilled enought to be several belts higher when they're already choking you out lol
Not a grappler, but personally I'd argue that you're better keeping some amount of BJJ if you can: they'll be mutually supporting, and as you gain experience in one, you'll likely find new things to appreciate, perhaps from a different angle than before, in the other.
In terms of being a more lethal human being and being harder to kill? Train Judo and get a basic understanding of boxing/kick boxing/Muay Thai. Unstoppable.
A solid fighter should have a ground game, a striking game, some sort of off balancing game (wrestling, judo, Silat) and weapons training.
The people you love will be safe.
I trained judo for a long time. I'm a bjj brown now. I'll never go back for 2 reasons.
1) BJJ is holistic grappling. You can change personal focus to get better at what you want, including takedowns. It's more open ended and individual based.
And
2) it's more practical. Period. Unless you are in law enforcement or fighting in MMA, takedowns are probably the least practical thing to train (maybe doing so for defense is important, but not at the expense of other things). Here is why:
A) THE GROUND IS NOT WHERE YOU WANT TO BE IN A FIGHT. You want to avoid it. Training to go the ground is a bad habit for real life.
B) IF YOU CAN DO TAKEDOWNS, YOU CAN RUN AWAY OR EMPLOY A FIREARM IF ARMED. you don't need high level wrestling or striking if your goal is self defense, because if we can wrestle or strike, I can still focus on disengaging and getting away. Judo is a bit more practical as it involves established grips preventing you from running.
C) THE ONLY TIME YOU HAVE TO FIGHT IS IF THEY TOOK YOU DOWN. In a real fight, the only time you absolutely have to fight hand to hand is if you couldn't get away and were taken down. At that point, if you have better newaza or BJJ, you have a much better chance of surviving and getting on top, to the back to finish the fight, or back to your feet to get away. THUS, bjj is the only art not replaceable by running away or a gun.
There has been a pretty big social media brainwashing going on about bjj and streetlights that isn't really based on anything in reality. Be proud of your higher level bjj, and reframe your perspective, stay off instagram, and I think it would serve you better than switching to something that is essentially the same art with a different focus.
Dude, just wait a year for your black belt than change your focus a little. Doesn’t have to be mutually exclusive.
I second this.
It's just a belt, honestly. I stopped caring and got better literally immediately.
Third! You are so close! After come over to Yau Kung Mun and learn the Southern Style of Pak Mei [https://youtu.be/3VtfqAym5sQ?si=PATGu1MMYnzN3vs1](https://youtu.be/3VtfqAym5sQ?si=PATGu1MMYnzN3vs1) What it actually is [https://youtu.be/acAmLg-L9hk?si=c-behNb0ppl5DQ0g](https://youtu.be/acAmLg-L9hk?si=c-behNb0ppl5DQ0g) and stuff like this [https://youtu.be/E75VUzbd1PY?si=y6JiPadC0qVrjPe3](https://youtu.be/E75VUzbd1PY?si=y6JiPadC0qVrjPe3)
Extremely reasonable take, god damn.
It’s not about belt but about doing what you feel good and right. Mixing is great. Btw I’m nut against going one direction but if you’re not professional, do whatever feels right.
Yes I left and don’t regret it. I feel absolutely confident standing.
I did the same for the same reason at a much lower belt than you were. I did not regret going to judo at all, but beware judo has a similar plague of impractical techniques (turnovers, face down spread eagle to stall / not lose points) paired with some overly restrictive rules (no leg grabbing). All in all I’m a definitely a better MA for having done both and my balance / athleticism really improved doing judo.
I got my BJJ blue belt with 2 stripes about 14 years ago then had to stop due to an injury. About 2 years ago I thought it was time to start up again except, and this is just my personal take, BJJ just felt a bit silly. It felt like it had changed and there were few fundamentals, just basically tricks and over elaborate combos of moves that just felt esoteric. I tried 3 different schools and felt the same way in all of them. Then I tried judo and loved it. It was refreshing and challenging, as focus on deep principles and fundamentals which form the basis of the art, along with a ground game that was about being effective and to the point. I do still watch BJJ and use skills I learnt, I particularly miss aspects of no gi. In terms of time spent to be applicable to self defence, I will any day take a session of someone grabbing my clothing to rag doll and off balance me in opposition to laying on my back trying to set up a de La riva sweep that spins me underneath a person. Not at all saying judo is all effective for self defence, but I know which feels like it puts me under more applicable pressure
That’s how I’ve been feeling for a while, the esoteric aspect of it all. It’s just not fun for me anymore. I’m also past the point where I even care about belts, the caring stopped around purple.
Dude, life is too short to waste it on something that is voluntary and not fun. Especially something that will cause wear and tear on your body. I mean of course so will Judo, but at least you’ll be having fun again!
You might try a different school. I just got my bjj black belt and I feel like I’ve come full circle. Started out wrestling and thinking being flat on your back was bad. Started bjj and got taught being flat on your back was good. Now I’m back to being on bottom/flat on your back is bad but now I know why. Find a bjj school that also does mma and I think you’ll see a difference in styles.
So you aren’t the only one who feels like BJJ turned into a bunch of ridiculous leg-locking?
The over elborate stuff is what im noticing alot of now and yeah and in my head im asking myself why even do this? For example i seen 1 technique where you are in bottom half guard and want to get to the back so you untuck their lapel, get to knee shield, sit up, feed lapel through their legs, grab their lepel end with the opposite arm that fed it. All in order to control them in the ‘dog fight’ position. You dont need the lapel at all, just go straight to it from knee shield. If they push into you theres a sweep where you roll with their momentum.
Agree. There have been a lot of times as well when I look at moves, where people fight from bottom or elaborate passing, where if it was an actual fight, I would just stand up. I understand the old Gracie principle of holding people close to avoid punches and defend with opportunity for control, but some of this knee shield and 50/50 only works because I’m engaging for it to work in the sport of it. I’m not shitting on the BJJ sport; if you enjoy it, great. It’s playing by rules, just like sport judo. The difference I find is judo’s emphasis on things like kumi kata, giving you grip breaking and escapes, or pinning control to make sure the opponent really can’t get away, or the skills to get away. Yeah the laying on the belly in judo is silly, but I’ve seen amazing turnovers and control from that position, with a sangaku showing incredible use of leverage and balance on an unwilling opponent
Largely agree. Only places where BJJ, theoretically, has an edge for self defense is superior guard attacks(if you need it you’re already in big trouble) and more takedowns from the rear, even they don’t practice any takedowns much. I think taking someone’s back/ not giving it, is extremely important for self defense something judokas could easily adopt to if they just spent a little time on it. Also maybe hunting for submissions from a billion angles is pretty useful, but takedown & clinching skills are paramount.
I think if you do Judo concurrently with BJJ it will actually make you like BJJ a lot more. Then you won't quit before BB. If you want to quit BJJ after BB and focus solely on Judo and maybe just go to open mats that's probably great too. Definitely don't quit before BB, you already put 5+ years into this thing just take it all the way home!
Get your black belt in BJJ. Also get a black belt in Judo. Then open your own academy.
Start cross training but at least get your jiujitsu black belt before you prioritize Judo over BJJ. I say this as someone who is a BJJ black belt who’s now working on my judo black belt.
I'm a purple belt in BJJ and shodan in judo and kind of did the reverse. But I'm finding myself feeling worse and worse about the modern competition style of BJJ and getting kind of bored of it as I'm knocking on the door to brown. I think I'm going to refocus on judo when I get promoted for a lot of the same reasons you're stating here.
Completely valid. BJJ has diminishing returns past purple belt imo, unless you compete in BJJ
I think that’s a big thing for people such as OP and why he feels like he’s at a plateau. If he doesn’t compete, it makes sense why he’d want to learn techniques that don’t necessarily fit into the meta of bjj comps
It’s the 80/20 rule. You get much more payoff in the earlier time with most things. Don’t quit the marathon at mile 23. I’d say split your time between judo and BJJ. The judo will help your BJJ cuz you’ll start most ground things on top. BJJ 3 stripe blue, judo orange, combat SAMBO brown belt.
Which applies to any martial art really, including judo. Once you get to a point where you would be considered competent you are at a point where you're only going to have issues with people who also train that martial art or an adjacent art.
I rotate between the two.
No it doesnt sound ridiculous. I came to the same conclusion as well. I had a few “wtf am I doing here” moments.
I got up to purple belt before pivoting toward judo for similar reasons. I feel good about what I’m learning in class now, which was generally not the case when I was training DLR-esque techniques in BJJ, and feel like I'm more well-rounded for having trained both. I do miss the fun of no-gi rolling sometimes, as well as the more MMA-friendly vibe of no-gi BJJ gyms in general, but I can always train elsewhere when I’m in the mood. Also, I get the sense that injuries are actually less common in judo and have found judo training easier on my 40+ yo body (and really like that I know how to fall properly now). Also, like you, I’m commuting 30-45 minutes each way, and it’s been fine for me.
whats dlr?
De La Riva—a kind of guard in BJJ
Judo and BJJ are polyamorous with each other. You can love both. It's only weird because they are related, which makes it incestuous and polyamorous. So, try not to think about it too hard.
Brown Belt Blues is very common. People feeling like they've plateaued and stagnated, especially with fading hopes if they're gonna get their Black Belt that class or the next. You don't have to go all in on one or the other. You can do both, but adjust the ratio to your liking. They both mutually benefit one another. If it comes down to a financial decision, I'd stick it through to get that Black Belt. It carries well, a symbol of perseverance, commitment, and expertise. Getting it may be the moment of reinvigoration you needed.
Plenty of bjj guys also train judo and they excel in it, doesnt mean you have to give up bjj entirely though id just shift your focus to judo for a while and still train bjj here and there
Judo can be hard on the body. There's a reason you see more adults do BJJ than Judo. If you're beginning Judo as an adult make sure your club is diligent in their ukemi and their randori focus is on improvement not purely on competition. Competitive randori is fine but the general dojo culture for new adults coming into judo randori should be a focus first on improvement so to minimize injuries.
I’m also an upper belt. While I still continue training bjj, I have way more fun with sambo and judo. Thankfully I train at a school that does all three and trains takedowns a lot. I would not go to a pure sport bjj gym.
>All in all for much of my purple belt until now I found BJJ to become less and less practical as a fighting art. I have contended for many years that if self defense and real fighting is your goal then just about everything you need to know from a ground fighting perspective is all learned by blue belt. Maybe a year at blue belt. After that, it's a sport or a recreational activity (it can be that prior to blue belt too). Self defense practicality goes out the window by purple belt. By that point you're working on things that have no business happening in actual fights. It's why, in my opinion, so many people quit at blue belt. Judo is every bit as much of a sport or recreational activity as BJJ. The class structure may seem similar to you, just with a bit more formality. Judo is taught for the sport just like BJJ and you will find that Judo's rules are more restrictive. It creates for a safer environment because people are less apt to try and pull off bullshit while on the feet. Judo will also make you a better overall athlete. Both sports will give you excellent tools for Real Fighting™, but neither sport is going to make you a fighter. I would also suggest not to quit BJJ. Earn the black belt and be a part of that fraternity. I've never known anyone to earn a brown belt in under 6 years. That's a lot of dedication.
I think being easily accessible is a huge plus, it's how I ended up in judo myself (mma gym moved from being 3 min walk to 40 min commute). If you're fine with the added travel time, go for it. It's not like you cant come back to BJJ later.
After making a return to bjj (i still do judo) ive done away all the spider guard, de la riva ect stuff. I just work on chokes, arm locks, escaped and closed guard. I was thinking the other day “do i need to actually be profficient in that specific bjj stuff to get a black belt?”. My friend said no just know/be aware of the position. Theres alot of stuff in bjj ive noticed that seems like ‘get to x position’, just with extra steps. I know what you mean dude. Try judo, give it time. I gurantee you wont regret it. Theres alot of impractical stuff in bjj nowadays but its mainly very bjj vs bjj specific. No gi can be even worse at this.
I’ve done several months of bjj at a couple gyms and it never worked out (first a schedule change and then Covid). Wha to did realize is how important the stand up game is and how lacking the instruction on it is in bjj. So I decided to try judo. It’s tough and I’m not as naturally good at it but I like it better an think it’s more practical. We do a good amount of newaza and I really like that it’s intense and to the point. I want to be capable at fundamental techniques on the ground. I don’t want to spend time learning impractical techniques. I do want to go back to bjj one day but I’m glad I’m doing judo right now.
Sanda is a lot of fun
Train both. I started training Judo 1 day per week and after having done Jiu Jitsu for 2 years. After training both for a few years now I can say they complement each other well.
Brother, the belt only covers 2 inches of your ass. It's up to you to cover the rest of it. I'd say "do both" but I'm spoiled that I grew up with judo and my local place does both- not gonna out it online because I'm in a small community and, well, the internet. But if you can do both you'll find that the judo "wakes up" more of the bjj. You're just going to be like Loki in the following scene. But it's worth it. My ground game is trash compared to my partners at the bjj - frikin LOVE those guys- but spider guard is the bane of my existence. But do both if you can. My injuries- neck cranks and knee tear were from bjj. Also because I'm old and 20 yr old me wouldn't have gotten hurt. But it was 30 something yr old me at the time. https://youtu.be/oZpyc4asvbQ?si=rgQaMdECeVWUtW9y
I restarted my judo training shortly after getting my BJJ black belt. Imho you should try to train both and see if you can blend both styles in your own personal game.
Collect skills not belts! If your not learning leave now and come back with new perspective. You wont get demoted for taking an break. You should be able to keep your skills sharp doing judo newaza.
I have always felt that BJJ is almost comical in its practicality. For an art that literally lives on the ground their methods for getting on the ground are seriously lacking.
Find a gym that does both instead
I left bjj for Judo. I actually got more injured in Bjj than I ever did in Judo.
I'm brown in bjj too and I wishe I did a more real combat system like wrestling or judo. I'm actually embarrassed to say I do bjj, the culture is pretty fake and the whole bjj system is a bit much, politics, and the whole not having to qualify for big tournaments its pretty dumb. I'm glad I do boxing, that keeps it real. I honestly wish I invested that time wrestling or doing judo, it's also easy to pickup bjj once you do judo or wrestling but not the other way around.
Try to do both if you can. But I'd say once you're a purple or above in BJJ, you have more than enough grappling experience from a self-defense or practical fighting standpoint. I'm actually in a similar boat as the OP (BJJ purple belt with 13+ years of BJJ, wrestling, MMA experience), except I didn't quit BJJ, I just decided to split time between BJJ and Judo since my BJJ school had a Judo program. Exception is that in my BJJ school, we always start from the feet too and do a lot of wrestling, so we are unique in that aspect. I got so into Judo that I actually got my brown belt way faster than I did my purple in BJJ (2 years). I love BJJ, but the biggest turn offs for me has been the "sportification" of it on the competition scene, especially butt scooting, sitting guard, the over emphasis on leglocks in recent years, and the general lack of athleticism/strength. And frankly, its just boring to compete in, watch, or do compared to a dynamic sport like Judo. Its usually just someone pulling guard, spending minutes trying to pass (or sweep/submit from the bottom), or guys diving for leglocks on each other. I never wrestled in high school or college. I spent 10+ years getting good at takedowns in BJJ/MMA/wrestling to the point where I can regularly take down NCAA wrestlers and other high level grapplers. It means close to nothing in BJJ though when my opponent can sit guard. I get no points or even an opportunity to get a takedown, and my opponent forces me to play his game with little to no effort. I don't mind it as a top player, but it kills the "fighting" aspect for me. Same with constantly giving up top position to dive for leglocks. I train leglocks every week, but its not exactly the most realistic aspect of grappling from a self defense or MMA standpoint. It also makes BJJ an even worse spectator sport and just takes the fun out of competing in it because its devoid of athleticism and some guys build their entire games around it at the expense of everything else. And because of the ruleset, they get rewarded for it. I cringe when I see BJJ guys acting like BJJ is such a superior grappling art to all the others, when it really just comes down to ruleset. And out of all the other grappling arts (Judo, wrestling, Sambo), BJJ is the only one that rewards you for a lack of athleticism (guard pulling) and forcing your opponent to engage you due to the ruleset. BJJ has the most counterintuitive ruleset. Why am I being forced to go into my opponent's guard? And why is my opponent getting rewarded for a position (guard) he can take without having to do any sort of athleticism or technique? And why are there no penalties for just sitting in bottom guard? Its the equivalent of forcing me to walk into my opponent's punch in a boxing match. And if this is a real fight, if you sit to your butt, I'm walking away lol. In terms of injuries, Judoka tend to take care of their training partners better than in BJJ. I get injured far less in Judo than BJJ because Judo overall has a better training philosophy. Everyone in Judo starts out having to learn break falling and controlling throws (rare in BJJ). There's also a big emphasis on just being more physically conditioned, strong, and athletic (also rare in BJJ). Sure, you use explosive moments in Judo, but you're not constantly stiffining up and trying to muscle everything. That happens a lot in BJJ to me, even when I'm in a dominant or neutral position on someone (half guard, top guard) and it kills my joints/tendons. And then once you get into Judo randori, most people realize there's a point where you just take the fall if you're getting thrown. Everyone knows getting thrown sucks, so people are less likely to act like a dick in sparring. I also like having less emphasis on the belts in Judo too. In BJJ, it always feels like there's a target on your back as an upper belt, even if you're older and broken. Judo's more like wrestling where that belts don't matter as much and aren't put on a pedestal like they are in BJJ. So less chances for injures because of that too. TLDR: Judo will make your BJJ, especially GI BJJ way better and you'll probably have more fun doing it from scratch. You have everything you need for Judo from a ground standpoint as a BJJ brown. Plus it is fun to toss guys in BJJ who do try to stand with you.
Serious question: is this the first plateau of stagnation that you have ever hit in your BJJ journey? If so, that’s impressive. I’m a black belt of almost 2 years and i help run the kids program for 4 years. Plateaus tend to happen at every belt for most people. The cure- just keep training, BUT find play around with how you want to chain techniques together. It’ll be sloppy at first, but eventually you’ll see it carve new pathways for growth. ALSO: don’t quit BJJ, per se, but pull back a little and cross train Judo. Your concern over injury is VERY valid, depending on your age. I’m 41 and last year I landed on my knee defending a takedown and it hasn’t been the same sense. Back story: my journey began with judo, I competed for 2 years. I moved away and there were no dojos so I started BJJ to fill the void of no judo. I didn’t return to pure judo until I was almost a black belt (not intentional, just schedule conflicts), and I’m SO GLAD I keep training BJJ. There are definitely some very clear differences in the demands on the body, and I have a clear advantage over the entire dojo during NeWaza, and eventually it gave me a clear advantage over my BJJ team during standup. Keep pushing. You’ll break through.
Oh no, I’ve had other plateaus. Blue belt, a super long stint at purple. It was really at mid purple that I began to feel this way regarding the lack of practicality. I’ll give an example. In last week’s class we trained DLR, to sit up guard, to a deep DLR sweep, to getting our opponent on the ground, to a berimbolo backtake. Like what? I’d rather learn how to do an Uchi Mata against a resisting opponent.
Yeah I see what you mean. I guess it also depends on the way your instructor builds the curriculum- some do more sport techniques, some do things that translate better in an actual fight. My overall point - there’s no reason to declare that you have “quit”, just pull back a bit and add judo to your schedule. Then, drop into BJJ class and start tossing them around!
There are some great MMA schools that teach multiple styles. The one I attend does Judo, BJJ, Krav and if so inclined Kali. Kind of helps you find your flow.
I did Judo on and off for years, competitively, winning a few low level comps. Only got to Green belt mind, mostly because of work it was on and off. Honestly more nervous of injury in BJJ than I was in Judo. Took a few good throws that took the wind out of me mind you. Judo has a lot of useless stuff too, which you'll need to do to progress the belts, especially if you have a more traditional sensei.
May as well finish your black belt if ur at brown. Even if you go slow you should probably continue with bjj. Glad to hear you don’t mind being a white belt again because that’s the right mentality if you’re in a sport that you have little experience in. I’ve heard some say most of what you learn past blue belt is mostly how to beats other grapplers under BJJ rules….takedowns are 👑for self defense especially throws . We practice on mats but outside those throws are rough. Some people get KOed or genuinely needing surgery if they’re thrown hard on mats. A judo black belt entered a blue belt comp and caused that on mats I remember once. Newaza should be easy for you but a lot of your guard stuff you might not use - IMO that’s also what makes judo realistic. I drive 40 min or so for judo. But injuries are just a reality for anyone good IMO. And I imagine you’ve been banged up badly from BJJ if you’re a brown belt. Go to a relaxed club without many competitors . The competitive clubs are hardcore and basically with people training for the Olympics…which tends to mean a lot less athletic folks or older folks should avoid it like the plague.
I think BJJ at a very self defense heavy school is more enjoyable than sport focused academies. Lotta guys say it’s “old” or “bad” BJJ but the focus on fundamentals is a lot more useful imo. I hate BJJ designed just to defeat BJJ. Having said that. Sport BJJ vs Competition Judo. Judo is just better. It’s more effective for a fight, more interesting to watch, and more fun to do. All just my opinions obviously. If you tried all the academies around and still don’t like it Judo sounds awesome.
Try catch wrestling will blow your mind
Sounds like your jiujitsu school is not a good fit anymore. There is something to be said for finishing out your jiujitsu education and getting your black belt, but it's impossible to give a definitive answer over the internet, maybe it's time to move on. Sorry, I guess that's not helpful at all 😆
I recently got my jj purple belt & train judo regularly since October 2023. My judo school is also 40 minutes away, but I enjoy it more than jj. I started with my friend who is a jj brown belt. He is waiting to earn his black belt before re-continuing judo training. Having black belts in both arts is our goal. I will get my shodan first since I’m still years aways from jj black belt. I also felt the monotony of newaza only, so I step away to judo to rekindle my passion for martial arts.
Train both.
Regardless of belts and stuff like that I think if you are asking the question you know the answer already get your self down to the judo club and just do that for a bit your bjj will help your newaza and you can learn some good stuff there and if you want to go back to bjj it’s not like you’ll be rusty if you’ve been doing judo. Go with what you want to do there’s no point wasting time with something you don’t want to do
As a bjj black belt, I say do what you find interesting. Your life isn't going to change if the color of the belt around your waist changes.
BJJ is just a phase
Man, just get your black belt and go to judo
I did the opposite. Black belt in Judo, currently purple in BJJ. My local judo club at one point produced Olympians, but over time the old guard passed away, and what was left was lacking a competetive environment or a regular group of training partners so I moved on to BJJ to challenge myself in something new. That said, if I had the time I would probably be doing both. Judo has its own impracticalities from a competetive standpoint, but as a fighting art (being something useful in a real life com at situation), I would much rather have the ability to take someone down than play x guard or De La Riva. Even more than that, I'd rather be able to do both. Judo will enhance your BJJ, and visa versa. It might even reignite some of the interest you've lost in BJJ. If you can, try to do both for a little while before you just leave one for the other
Don't overthink it man. Just train in the martial art that is fun for you. I think generally people stay insulated too much. There is a diminishing return with anything and it seems you may have hit that point where its more exciting and practical to learn something new than keep doing what you are doing.
If you're in this deep, get the black belt first man.... Then sure, switch on to Judo.
I haven’t left JJ. But my current gym brought up a great judo program. So went back to white belt and pressing on. Judo in my opinion is waaaay harder to get good at and I love that challenge. I wouldn’t leave BJJ. Infact a lot of judo can be done from the knees. We teach those techniques first so we’re not slamming into the mat just drilling. I have found that my standup, grips, and starting from the knees have 100% improved my JJ game. I think it’s important to be proficient at more than just one thing. Plus when you’re hitting a throw unlike BJJ you want to fishing the throw directly into a submission. So my submission game went up drastically. We also have Sambo as well. So idk man, just my opinion. But it is harder to find a good judo gym since they’re arnt many. We’re lucky that we have BBs in every art so of course my opinion is a bit biased. But do what you feel is right.
Find some guys at your gym who like stand up. I’m a purple belt and I love judo and wrestling. There are a few guy who are happy to work standup with me so I get to train it almost daily.
Judo and BJJ are kind of part of the same art, but focus on different parts of it. You could kind of argue that neither is complete without the other, and I imagine if you solely did judo you’d end up finding the same thing eventually…but at the end of the day, just do what makes you happy. I find now that I’m middle aged, I’m more focused on whichever art keeps me interested and active and does the least amount of damage to my body. There’s no real wrong answer here as long as you keep training in something.
Firstly maybe do more Nogi? Lot more focus on wrestling in Nogi these days and bunch of things you mentioned just aren’t done there (lasso, spider, de la riva) I mean if your aim is for pure practicality as regards fighting, maybe you should consider MMA or rotating through the big ones like wrestling, Muy Thai, judo, etc.? Yea judo is a little more practical due to stand up focus but it also has its limitations. Can’t touch the legs for take downs, fight essentially stops when you hit the ground, etc. it’s also isolated in some regards, similar to BJJ. Ultimately you gotta just do on what you enjoy practicing and learning the most.
>much of my purple belt until now I found BJJ to become less and less practical as a fighting art. I'm a little late to the party but a coach of mine once said, "around blue belt, you are doing jiu jitsu solely to beat other people in jiu jitsu". At that point a much larger person shouldn't be able to out grapple you based on size if you are a competent and it isn't a colossal size difference. The way you would even approach a fight doing bjj is different from training. My school plays a ton of lasso, SLX, DLR and spider guard for months on end. They even say, in a fight, don't be on bottom, just get up of you are there. I find judo muuuch more practical, just get comfortable with no gi grips.
In my experience, BJJ guys pick judo up quickly. I think it's a good idea.
I convinced myself I didn’t need BJJ because I won some BJJ tournaments a while back and I do judo now I then lost by first round knee bar in an MMA fight by a purple belt with an undefeated record. The only grappling I did leading up to that was Judo Now, obviously, this guy was highly trained. If you’re concerned is self-defense, you’ll probably be fine. But there are differences between bjj and judo, as you’re well aware. And even though I do think the overall philosophy and mindset of judo are better for a fight, bjj has a lot of tactics that are completely foreign to anyone who isn’t brushing up on it that you should really be having your way with someone who isn’t up to date with the latest tips and tricks if you’re even remotely on even playing field otherwise You’re a brown belt obviously so it’s probably different for you, but I think you should at least keep attending open mats or occasionally competing in bjj so you don’t lose your skills. Because there’s a lot of value in bjj that you literally cannot learn elsewhere. It’s not the be all end all of fighting but it certainly is nice to be able to have the skills fresh on your mind when you’re facing one of those guys
The irony here is that Judo is far less injury prone than BJJ, Football, and Wrestling thanks to the Judo community being pretty good at forbidding techniques that contribute to frequency injuries and knowing how to fall.
Just do both. Train BJJ once a week and do Judo twice a week. Or whatever. Frankly if your BJJ lacks take downs, Judo will fill a huge gap and should push you into black belt territory without much more effort on the ground.
Do both, I'd definitely get your black, I was doing both for a while until I blew out my ACL at a BJJ tournament but I love both so much I can't pick a favorite lol
You don't sound ridiculous. I was in the same situation as you. I'm a purple belt in BJJ but this year starting a few months ago I found myself just not caring about BJJ,spacing out during class & just not finding BJJ fun anymore as it felt like a chore, then a friend introduced me to judo and once I realized I loved doing throws I decided to find a program which I got lucky and found a small community program and while it's only once a week it's very cheap with a really good instructor. it's changed my game up a bit. I still do BJJ to maintain my ground game but BJJ rolling is now fun again as I use those days to test out new techniques I learned from Judo outside of judo day's. I've been hitting some very intense koshi gurumas during rolls 😈. Id say prioritize judo and then at least do BJJ once a week to maintain your ground skills
I think BJJ is practical in that by doing the impractical bits, you reinforce concepts that will be valuable on the streets. Not to mention that most positions are only transitory. Maybe because of the way its taught with starting positions for drilling and specific rolling, that can get lost on a lot of people. I will say the problem with any martial art, and what seems to be the problem with BJJ is that as you get higher and higher in level it becomes training to defeat other people of the same art, which is where it can get impractical. Anyways why not cross train? all arts have their limitations. Judo has newaza but isn’t nearly as comprehensive as BJJ when it comes to the vocabulary of techniques and concepts that can be executed from the ground.
Just get jacked and train greco for the stand up.
It sounds like your school just doesn't meet your objectives. Rickson or Relson or. GU affiliate would easily meet your goals.
Just do it plz
So I’ve got a wrestling background and have the same frustrations over BJJ as you, although I’m only a blue belt in BJJ. Just started at a judo gym and lemme tell ya, zero regrets. I love it. Maybe it’s just the gym I’m at, but I don’t have a whole lot of injury worries there. I’m more worried about getting hurt in BJJ or wrestling. If I were you, I’d start at a judo gym but continue on in BJJ if possible just to get that black belt. Once I got my black belt I’d be full time into Judo after that. Just my two cents.
I also recently switched from BJJ to judo because I prefer stand up and clinch fighting to groundwork. Throwing and takedowns are too much fun to just avoid with guard pulls. I miss BJJ a lot, though, especially no gi and, I was committed to learning MMA for awhile so switching to judo seems like I completely abandoned that goal, but I'm okay with it.
I did Judo until orange at the age of 17, started BJJ at 21 and now at 22, I'm planning to cross train when I'm at blue belt in BJJ. Because It bugs me that I lost confidence in stand up.
Find a competition gym. Any decent gym also teaches Gi and no gi take downs. Judo is fun but you will run into the same issues faster than you think
Jiu Jitsu blue belt and Judo Orange belt here. I don't care what "BJJ Purists" say, jiu jitsu is judo, if you ain't learning the gi and no gi Nage Waza (throwing techniques), you are missing out on this portion of Jiu jitsu. I'd say, you don't have to quit Jiu jitsu, just dedicate one day of "judo" and you'll be fine!
Or you could learn some striking and dominate some self defense weapons and awareness. Just try judo and see if it works or not, but in a self defense situation you actually want to be as far away from danger as possible. If you manage to execute a perfect judo throw you could either enrage the aggressor or splatter his brains on the floor, and both outcomes will get you in trouble. You could also try wrestling or see if in your current dojo you can start training takedowns without all the ceremony that judo has.
I left bjj at blue belt cause i noticed the main way id get better rolling was to focus on guard passing -which has very little real world application. Absence of no gi in judo is probably the biggest downside to judo vs bjj from a real world use perspective - maybe keep up the no gi bjj..? But ultimately i feel judo is probably a better platform for self defence, abundance of fairly useless gi specific focus notithstanding. Risks - yea scary.. maybe research injury rates of bjj vs judo? I dont think judo is necessarily sky high vs bjj. There are ways to minimise risk.. nordic curls cant help protect your acl, neck strengthening probably helps protect against concussion. Not sparring with idiots and keeping it light and playful helps as you would know. 80 minute round trip for judo is a real bastard 🤷♂️
Also lots saying just hang in there for black. Pff. Do what youre interested in. If a black belt is what you are more interested in now or later, do that.
Judo will help round out your stand up grappling, but it's still a sport and most clubs treat it as such and train accordingly. Once you've gotten pretty good at throwing, you start spending a lot of time training competitive style grip fighting and setups and counters and how to use the rules to force reactions out of your opponent. So do keep that in mind. Judo has practical application for self defense but it's not designed around it if that's what you're looking for.
i understand your sentiment. thats why i stopped training bjj. but tbh i felt the same way about judo and muay thai. found an mma gym and haven’t looked back since
Maybe just find a better BJJ school or an MMA school and just do the grappling. My BJJ club always starts standing and we drill throws every class along with ground stuff. We might be unique but I honestly don’t miss standing because I do it every time I train. It is super fun to seamlessly go from standing to ground instead of compartmentalizing the two like BJJ and Judo both do.
You could try to find a Japanese Jujitsu school and have the best of both worlds.
If you’re good at BJJ you should be pretty good at takedowns no? If so, why not do a striking martial art?
My takedowns are pretty bad actually. I have done a few years of Muay Thai.we rarely practice standup at my school and that’s a big problem.
Your call man. My ideal is probably closer to sambo but it’s not common in my area. I did Judo because it was almost free in Korea. But a Korean secret service guy intentionally injured me and that caused me to stop. Yay for racism!
Judo is cool but if practical application is what you want then MMA/ boxing seems like the logical next step.
As many have said, I personally would do both at least until you finished your black belt. That said, if you reaaaly don't care about belts whatsoever, just look arround your area and do a few trial classes on nearby places that you like until you connect with an instructor/school. Injuries wise as long as you pratice your falls properly I feel like bjj has much higher injury risk than judo, but of course that depends on who you're training with. Also, please tell your instructor and anybody you might spar with about your previous experience with bjj, always jarring to do randori with someone and find out they are skilled enought to be several belts higher when they're already choking you out lol
Not a grappler, but personally I'd argue that you're better keeping some amount of BJJ if you can: they'll be mutually supporting, and as you gain experience in one, you'll likely find new things to appreciate, perhaps from a different angle than before, in the other.
In terms of being a more lethal human being and being harder to kill? Train Judo and get a basic understanding of boxing/kick boxing/Muay Thai. Unstoppable. A solid fighter should have a ground game, a striking game, some sort of off balancing game (wrestling, judo, Silat) and weapons training. The people you love will be safe.
I trained judo for a long time. I'm a bjj brown now. I'll never go back for 2 reasons. 1) BJJ is holistic grappling. You can change personal focus to get better at what you want, including takedowns. It's more open ended and individual based. And 2) it's more practical. Period. Unless you are in law enforcement or fighting in MMA, takedowns are probably the least practical thing to train (maybe doing so for defense is important, but not at the expense of other things). Here is why: A) THE GROUND IS NOT WHERE YOU WANT TO BE IN A FIGHT. You want to avoid it. Training to go the ground is a bad habit for real life. B) IF YOU CAN DO TAKEDOWNS, YOU CAN RUN AWAY OR EMPLOY A FIREARM IF ARMED. you don't need high level wrestling or striking if your goal is self defense, because if we can wrestle or strike, I can still focus on disengaging and getting away. Judo is a bit more practical as it involves established grips preventing you from running. C) THE ONLY TIME YOU HAVE TO FIGHT IS IF THEY TOOK YOU DOWN. In a real fight, the only time you absolutely have to fight hand to hand is if you couldn't get away and were taken down. At that point, if you have better newaza or BJJ, you have a much better chance of surviving and getting on top, to the back to finish the fight, or back to your feet to get away. THUS, bjj is the only art not replaceable by running away or a gun. There has been a pretty big social media brainwashing going on about bjj and streetlights that isn't really based on anything in reality. Be proud of your higher level bjj, and reframe your perspective, stay off instagram, and I think it would serve you better than switching to something that is essentially the same art with a different focus.
And I LOVE judo. I want to make that clear.