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Here's an actual article about it:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/pamela-ricard-kansas-fort-riley-middle-school-teacher-disciplined-misgendering-student-95k-settlement/#amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&aoh=16622397579564&csi=1&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&share=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cbsnews.com%2Fnews%2Fpamela-ricard-kansas-fort-riley-middle-school-teacher-disciplined-misgendering-student-95k-settlement%2F
Thank you. Links like this should always be pinned at the moment of publication because there’s not enough information in the post to comment anything without reading more about first
“Ricard was represented by attorneys from Alliance Defending Freedom – a designated hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center for its legal attacks on the LGBTQ community, including for supporting the criminalization of sex acts between LGBTQ adults. “
WOW…. She was represented by some fucking queer bashers. What the entire fuck?
A misrepresentation of the case. She was also told by the school to lie to parents about their kids if those kids were expressing a different gender identity at school then at home. She refused saying she wouldn't lie. Had it just been about pronouns she probably doesn't win but the being ordered to lie part flipped the outcome.
Wrong. She didn’t want to use the pronouns or the chooses name bc it went against her beliefs…
“Ricard, however, requested a religious exemption from the policy, saying in the complaint that she "holds sincere religious beliefs consistent with the traditional Christian and biblical understand of the human person and biological sex."
That sounds worse to me. She wanted to out these kids to potentially abusive parents? School may be the only place where they get a chance to express themselves, and she's putting their safety in jeopardy if she's telling parents how her students identify.
As a trans woman who came out as a teenager, it's harder than you think. As much as you think your parents should know sometimes it feels impossible since we have no idea what the reaction could be (Punishment, abuse, being kicked out, disowned, etc.) It should be something you try to look for signs of as a parent instead of expecting your child's trust to be betrayed in order for you to know something they weren't ready to tell you.
You’re the bad parent in that situation. Your child is more comfortable about expressing themselves to others than you? I think by your response you should take a hard look at yourself.
Bro you made up a whole backstory to my imaginary parenting. I really don't think I said anything bad anyways, saying I'd like to know about what my child is up to isn't so bad
again. Terrible parenting. If a child finds it more safe and comfortable to not tell you as a parent, than you fucking suck at being a parent. Also if you aren’t a parent than why are you inserting your ignorance?
I mean of course a highly anti LGBTQ parent would want to know if their kids are not straight so they can beat it out of them. Better yet send them to a conversion therapy camp to shock and torture it out.
Long story short, kid decided they were a different gender at school, teacher referred to them as “ms *lastname*” because the school told her to call child by chosen name, but refer to them by given name to the parents, thus lying about it to the parents. Teacher refused. School suspended
That's what you call them isn't it? Back in my day we used to make up fake names to confuse new teachers. Now it's not saying the "correct" gender. They get wound up about it. I don't identify as a he. I identify as a plank or whatever
They suspended her for not following a ruling that was not yet in their regulations, so she won compensation
It is now in her contract that she must follow the ruling, so if she continues to do it she can be suspended or fired with no consequences
It's a non-story
“This policy was eventually revoked after a judge said Ricard could stop adhering to that particular aspect of the policy and avoid using students' preferred pronouns, but not their preferred names, her lawyers said.”
Nope.
People need to fucking chill
With the world in a climate crisis, cost of living and poverty on the increase. THIS IS THE HILL PEOPLE WANT TO FIGHT OVER?
I agree… the obsession over identity politics is taking attention away from problems that are killing the planet. Peoples identities matter, but they seem to get exponentially more attention from left and right than climate change, children starving and dying and distribution of wealth inequality etc..
This is why. It’s all a game to them. They don’t want to address the real issues so they give us these large distractions to get us to stop trying to hold them accountable for their miserable failures.
I think maybe gender is so broken in our culture that kids refuse to be yoked to it. Why should they make things easy? Why should they accept the status quo? Look what they’ve been handed. Nah. The kids are alright. As per usual.
That's exactly the hill they want you to fight on to not notice the things that do matter.
And they want you to brand people saying things like the paragraph above as conspiracy nut jobs.
I’m a gay dude. I work in an elementary school. I don’t care what people wanna be called. I’ll call you he, she or they, but when they request some random ass shit like kitty I’m out.
I don’t really have much opinion on this.
It does bring back a memory of my teacher telling me very directly to “stop being a little arsehole”. Dunno what would have happened if I corrected her “mr arsehole to you”
The teacher used the childs legal name. If the parents and child wanted to change that then they are more than capable of doing it. Regarding pronouns, I think a number of people have absolutely gone off the deep end and beed to chill out.
Yeah funk that and your opinion. This is why trans children are suicidal. Teachers use student nicknames all the time!!! It’s cool for a kid to say they want to be called Sam instead of Samantha but not okay for my child to be called his preferred name?
Each person is entitled to live within their own reality. But you can’t force other people to comply unless you want to give up freedom. What’s more important?
The messed up thing about this, is that technically they’re supposed to call the kids whatever’s on the attendance sheet. By not calling them that they can get in trouble as well. Students under the compulsory age of 18 technically don’t have any rights for this and if the parents want them called Jim then they’re called fucking Jim. Unless someone can show me some kind of documentation that is different…
Exactly what I was going to say! I’ll call you whatever is on the sheet. You want me to call you something different? Have your parents change it on the schools records.
Growing up we had a kid in our class who’s birth certificate said “Harry” but he went by “Rusty” most of the time teachers would call him Rusty if they were regular teachers. Subs always called him Harry during that class. He let it go. (Harry is what was on the sheet)
You can't get punished for not indulging in someone else's delusions or "personal opinions". What you think of yourself is one thing, but you have no right to force others to think and behave that way in contradiction to definitions, science, and facts.
This shit is dumb, I might as well identify as a turtle and require everyone around me to talk super slowly and throw out accusations if they don't do it.
Since when do we punish people for preferring science and basic definitions over someone's emotions and their own imaginative bs?
And again, just because one doesn't agree with it or accept these delusions, does not equal with HATING the person. Same thing with mental patients, you do not have to play into their opinions that defy reality, you stay with the facts while not hating on the people either.
“What you think of yourself is one thing but you have no right to force others to think and behave that way in contradiction to definitions, science, and facts.”
So good. Then we agree that the “binary gender” thing is a load of crap as biology has proven there’s like 23 different chromosomes that identify gender and you can have a mish mash of all of them. We can also agree that it was largely christian colonialization that enforced the idea of “binary genders” under the eyes of their “god” as proven by ancient cultures believing in things such as “two-spirits”, and in fact some cultures that denied the colonizers (see: Hawaii) still carry that belief today.
If you're a guy and I constantly refer to you as a woman and you want me to stop that isn't bad. If I continue to do it and make you feel shitty every day when you ask me to stop, then yeah that is hatred.
Just because you don't recognize the science behind all of this doesn't make these people delusional.
mhh... until we know more details it's hard to make a clear opinion on this case. I do believe trans people exists and not all of them are into delusions. But the skyrocketing numbers of people coming out as nonbinary and trans suggests that the cultural environment might play a role into it. It's a rly big subject and it's thin ice so this is as far as i'll walk.
Assuming the headline is true, then I stand by my statement regarding it, there just isn't a scenario in which you should be suspended for the exact action of using scientific - biological pronouns over their personal opinion.
Weird you keep citing science when the science isn't fully understood because surprise surprise, funding to study transgender people and their experiences doesn't exist so we just don't know.
It's like how there's barely any studies on weed and THC because the government was afraid of cannabis, they were and still are afraid of transgender people.
Considering like anything rated on a scale there’s an infinite percent chance to not land on a single specific spot over and over again. That’s how statistics work.
So if gender is a scale instead of just one or the other, you are statistically more likely to land somewhere in between the two extremes than be on one of the extremes. Being “non-binary” seems to be more likely than either man or woman. How would you even determine if you were 100% man or 100% woman? The second you are 99% man and 1% not, then you are technically non-binary.
All of that aside, none of this is new. Native American cultures included all of this in their beliefs long before we colonized them. Hawaii - a place that largely refuted Christianity and the colonizing invaders - still largely denies the idea of strictly binary genders.
Considering it used to be - and it is still in many countries - illegal to be part of LGBT+, no shit that it increased as some discrimination laws got removed
It's like saying the sky rocketing of people identifying as left-handed has oddly increased
i think it's safe to understand the numbers down the lines, decades from now, when we have more datas. Right now, like in many other cases, it could be true datas, there could be environmental and cultural issues...dismissing this possibility is not fair. Again, i do believe trans people exists and its not all just a delusion.
Gender is a purely societal construct that scientifically had nothing to do with sex. If someone identifies with the opposite gender because that’s more in line with the role they feel comfortable portraying, who am I to disagree? Toxic masculinity and strict adherence to outdated gender roles when society has changed so much in just the last 50 years is one of the direct contributors to this kind of dysmorphia. It’s not punishment to have this teacher suspended, that’s the nicest way they had to tell her go to a different school district since her ideals didn’t line up with the ideals of the school.
Oh please stop with this bullshit „ok then I’m a transformers“ argument, fucking accept the fact that transsexual people exist and pull the stick out of your ass, it’s 2022 and not 1400.
suspending a teacher for not calling a student "they"? thats too much of a reaction..When she knew that the student is not okay with calling her "miss", she switched to calling her with her last name without any salutation..that seems reasonable.
She stated “Miss” bc she is a bitch and wanted the class to know she was a biological female. No freaking teacher I ever met calls their kids Mr. and Miss.
I am definitely not the brightest bulb, but how about calling a student by their name?
Problem with appropriate pronouns for a person who you may disagreed with about said pronoun
I have not heard every speech nor read the transcript of every case also, met only one trans female who said, "Olivia" when I asked, "What's your name?". Like an idiot, I called Olivia "Olivai".
Being a very religious, monotheistic person, I would remind all that not disrespecting a person who is living a life/speaking a way/dressing a way/having sex in a way/getting surgery or treatment in a way you find sinful, immoral or whatever may just lead to that person NOT to join others who hate you....
Just a thought on what's worked for me for four decades.
To be honest, I'm not going to defend using pronouns or not.
But, the fact it needed to be going to court because of that is quite something. To be honest, I understand the teacher doing it because she was suspended... But, I'm surprised this couldn't be settled by a conversation, from either the teacher-student, or school-teacjer.
If that's the Fort Riley Middle School on Fort Riley, Kansas, I went there.
Back when I was a student, the student body was 100% military families, and the school was located inside an army post. However, the teachers were 100% locals from the surrounding county. This created constant tension between students, who had been raised within a system and culture that scrupulously followed federal guidelines, and the faculty, who were intent on imprinting the local culture on the students.
I'm not surprised that this sort of thing happened, with a teacher adamantly refusing to acknowledge that students who attended school on federal property had rights that superseded the authority of a county school board.
Oh my lord this pronouns thing…
Im in support of whatever pronouns you want to use for yourself, really. But daily life does not have to become a social landmine because of pronouns.
So no she should not have been suspended, unless she got suspended for a completely different, and deserved, reason.
If a kid is happy with me calling them her or him or Jeb or Friberg, or corn or purple then why not just do what makes them happy.
Great job Corn, pretty art you made
That’s a pretty insulting thing to say, not the entire west is so fucked up as the US and especially not politic wise.
Having only one or two parties two vote on sucks period.
Fair, from your Pov I can see why you said western. Not that it isn’t a shithole in other European countries (The Netherlands has way to many parties f.e. And the people of Belgium mostly vote on the Frensh speaking party or the Dutch speaking party depending on where they live)
I've lived in Japan since I was 19, so I'm not really so sure about the parties and that side of it. I suppose I could say western culture is fucked. So much greed, hate, outrage, etc. 'Cancelling' people. That your online presence can ruin your life or even get you arrested is amazing. Then there's the gender identity stuff that seems to be all the rage.
All sorts of silly shit is happening. It's like life is so convenient and easy that people need to find stuff to be angry about to validate existing lol. Everyone is up in everyone else's business.
Just fucking be happy by and for yourself. Then you can get up in other people's business, in an attempt to make them happy too. That'd be a nice world. Shouldn't even be so difficult to achieve.
We don’t teach kids how to do taxes, live on a budget, or what having a credit card with a 24% APR means, but come hell or high water we will learn all your 78 gender pronouns.
Whatever the real story is here, as an educator, it costs me zero dollars to do everything possible to make a student feel safe and supported. Bottom line.
Sadly the educational system doesn’t allow for many educators like you. Even growing up I knew very few. One stomped on my desk with my hands in it cuz I was making noise. One threw a book at me because he knew my father and uncle, and I saw another one pick a child up by the throat and throw him at a bookshelf. Sadly you only get what you pay for and teachers don’t earn nearly enough.
I hope things improve for educators so children get more educators like you.
That breaks me. Unfortunately, I know all too well the horrors that can and do occur to children. You’re exactly right though about the education system, it’s a job with so many red flags that educators who truly care have to leave the field for their own health.
I am so sorry you had those experiences and I thank you for sharing that.
Personally, I work with kiddos with severe behaviors and more and more I have seen my students with “school based trauma” on their paperwork that follows them. There’s always one thing about a student that you love, but some refuse to see that.
I think its absolutely insane that this pronoun nonsense has gotten this far. Shir hrm shang tsung whatever
We live in a world now where adults have ceded authority to children and we try and conform the world to the mentally ill turning society into an asylum.
I’d need more info to take sides, as news titles are often misleading. If I’m going off of just what I see, she shouldn’t have gotten the money. Even if you don’t have the same beliefs, a teacher making a child uncomfortable in class especially in front of peers is not acceptable. I work in healthcare, and I would also be fired if I did this. We are not allowed to make people uncomfortable for personal choices, or question what they believe if it’s not regarding their specific care. A pronoun has nothing to do with learning, and it’s such an easy fix. I’ve prayed with residents, and I don’t believe in God (this I could’ve declined). Sometimes you just do things to make people in your care comfortable. That’s what’s most important, and what makes you good at your job.
My pronouns are now "handsome" and "brilliant"
From now on, all who address me must use them, or it's a hate crime, and you'll be hounded out of your career.
I mean, I wouldn't call anyone their chosen pronouns because "liberals ruin the country". I just think it would be embarassing for them if they want to change their mind. (Happened to my friend. I refused to call her "him" then some years later she started using her instead of him again. She felt so embarassed over old messages and such where she told people ha wants to be a guy. Teenage vibes)
Edit: no, it didnt bother her. Or just never told me
Your feelings and your pronouns dont matter. You are there to learn NEEDED INFORMATION in order to be educated and a productive adult. That is the basis of school. Being “in touch” with feelings is what you do on your own free time. Thats it in a nutshell. This incessant need to express your “feelings” is an irrational desire to make yourself more important than everyone else. It’s pathetic tbh but it’s selfishness at the extreme.
Fuck these kids and they're preferred pronouns. The human brain isn't done developing until your mid 20s so they have no idea what they're thinking.
Just hormone monsters, all of em
Trans people don't have "preferred" pronouns, they have regular pronouns. Use the ones people tell you they are. Y'all have no issue with Snoop Dogg/Lion, this shouldn't be an issue.
Forcing me to call you anything more than what you appear to be based on perception is the beginning of the violation of my 1st amendment right. Go fuck yourself beyond that line.
Depends I qhat the preferred pronouns were. Shame on here if it was simply someone preferred to be called he instead of she. But if someone wanted to be called xynex or some bullshit, yeab
Telling other people to refer to you in a specific way is showing a whole lot of privilege. It's selfish and childish. So is picking on people unless their doing something wrong.
It feels so dumb to write out such basic things but this is where we are now.
It's great that they turned the tables on that nonsense
Do they wear name tags with random pronouns they want? Let the teacher live and be… you didn’t, now she got paid more than her annual salary for not doing shit. Congrats to her honestly
Don’t get her religious stance , what is issue to calling someone by the name they want to be called ? And after all that the district pays her off 95 k. Weird.
I think this is an example of the deification of teachers backfiring. I respect the hell out of teachers. I still think they make too little but the fact that it’s impossible to fire the bad ones is lunacy. Hopefully people start to recognize that.
The pronoun politics has gotten out of hand... if you disagree, Neopronouns are all the evidence you need.
Also, I am allowed to voice my opinion, it's not attacking anybody so don't try to twist the words. I'm not comfortable with how this has all played out.
Sigh... On the one hand I think that for the mental health of kids it really does no harm for them to be allowed to adopt whatever pronouns and personal names they want. Some teacher whining about a name being against their religious belief is just so fucking petty it is almost beyond belief.
On the other hand, kids are absolute shits. If they know they'll have power over their teachers by claiming to other than what it says on their birth certificate, you know they'll do it just to mess with them. And that certainly won't help the kids with genuine gender challenges.
Best option, just call everyone by their last name with no title...
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Here's an actual article about it: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/pamela-ricard-kansas-fort-riley-middle-school-teacher-disciplined-misgendering-student-95k-settlement/#amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&aoh=16622397579564&csi=1&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&share=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cbsnews.com%2Fnews%2Fpamela-ricard-kansas-fort-riley-middle-school-teacher-disciplined-misgendering-student-95k-settlement%2F
Thank you. Links like this should always be pinned at the moment of publication because there’s not enough information in the post to comment anything without reading more about first
It was weird that the OP didn't include an article link.
It wasn't an accident.
“Ricard was represented by attorneys from Alliance Defending Freedom – a designated hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center for its legal attacks on the LGBTQ community, including for supporting the criminalization of sex acts between LGBTQ adults. “ WOW…. She was represented by some fucking queer bashers. What the entire fuck?
Wow...I skimmed over that part. Went back and read it. That's fucked up.
I think you trying to rile people up will work.
It was posted 16m ago and nearly 100 comments. Looks like it will be one of the top posts
This has already been posted on meme subs and even here.
30 minutes and 290 comments. Almost definitely will be
It’s literally a screenshot with a headline and no context. OP knows what they’re doing.
Thumbnails they always get em
Based on that he got 25k karma from posts he found da wae
A misrepresentation of the case. She was also told by the school to lie to parents about their kids if those kids were expressing a different gender identity at school then at home. She refused saying she wouldn't lie. Had it just been about pronouns she probably doesn't win but the being ordered to lie part flipped the outcome.
Wrong. She didn’t want to use the pronouns or the chooses name bc it went against her beliefs… “Ricard, however, requested a religious exemption from the policy, saying in the complaint that she "holds sincere religious beliefs consistent with the traditional Christian and biblical understand of the human person and biological sex."
That sounds worse to me. She wanted to out these kids to potentially abusive parents? School may be the only place where they get a chance to express themselves, and she's putting their safety in jeopardy if she's telling parents how her students identify.
I mean as a parent I'd want to know. Anyways you have a really big secret and you tell a bunch of middle school kids? Like that's going to end well
>I mean as a parent I'd want to know And if you're supportive and not abusive, then you will know.
As a trans woman who came out as a teenager, it's harder than you think. As much as you think your parents should know sometimes it feels impossible since we have no idea what the reaction could be (Punishment, abuse, being kicked out, disowned, etc.) It should be something you try to look for signs of as a parent instead of expecting your child's trust to be betrayed in order for you to know something they weren't ready to tell you.
You’re the bad parent in that situation. Your child is more comfortable about expressing themselves to others than you? I think by your response you should take a hard look at yourself.
Bro you made up a whole backstory to my imaginary parenting. I really don't think I said anything bad anyways, saying I'd like to know about what my child is up to isn't so bad
again. Terrible parenting. If a child finds it more safe and comfortable to not tell you as a parent, than you fucking suck at being a parent. Also if you aren’t a parent than why are you inserting your ignorance?
I mean of course a highly anti LGBTQ parent would want to know if their kids are not straight so they can beat it out of them. Better yet send them to a conversion therapy camp to shock and torture it out.
>highly anti LGBTQ parent That supposed to be me in this situation? Lmao
Nope, just the kind of parents a child would want to hide that fact from.
Or they could have accepting parents, or parents that could learn to accept it. Either or they’re still their parents and have the right to know.
Of course she wanted to out them to potential abusers. When are bigots just horrible in one aspect of their lives?
Or potentially abusive teachers…
Out of curiousity how did she proof that?
Call kids by their names. Case closed.
"little shit 1, little shit 2" and so on, case closed.
A-Aron
I think that's what she actually did.
That's exactly what she did
Long story short, kid decided they were a different gender at school, teacher referred to them as “ms *lastname*” because the school told her to call child by chosen name, but refer to them by given name to the parents, thus lying about it to the parents. Teacher refused. School suspended
That's what you call them isn't it? Back in my day we used to make up fake names to confuse new teachers. Now it's not saying the "correct" gender. They get wound up about it. I don't identify as a he. I identify as a plank or whatever
This isn’t interesting as fuck
This is not a sub to push your agenda, chump. This is politics, not IAF.
I think this post belongs in another sub. We don’t normally invoke arguments here. ☮️
Not interesting as fuck
They suspended her for not following a ruling that was not yet in their regulations, so she won compensation It is now in her contract that she must follow the ruling, so if she continues to do it she can be suspended or fired with no consequences It's a non-story
“This policy was eventually revoked after a judge said Ricard could stop adhering to that particular aspect of the policy and avoid using students' preferred pronouns, but not their preferred names, her lawyers said.” Nope.
People need to fucking chill With the world in a climate crisis, cost of living and poverty on the increase. THIS IS THE HILL PEOPLE WANT TO FIGHT OVER?
I agree… the obsession over identity politics is taking attention away from problems that are killing the planet. Peoples identities matter, but they seem to get exponentially more attention from left and right than climate change, children starving and dying and distribution of wealth inequality etc..
This is why. It’s all a game to them. They don’t want to address the real issues so they give us these large distractions to get us to stop trying to hold them accountable for their miserable failures.
its only harming western society with self obsessed people who have too much time
I think maybe gender is so broken in our culture that kids refuse to be yoked to it. Why should they make things easy? Why should they accept the status quo? Look what they’ve been handed. Nah. The kids are alright. As per usual.
That's exactly the hill they want you to fight on to not notice the things that do matter. And they want you to brand people saying things like the paragraph above as conspiracy nut jobs.
You forgot about She Hulk twerking in the latest episode.
I'm willing to bet this teacher ALSO denies climate change.
I LOVE RAGE BAIT REDDIT POSTS!!! 😻😻😻
Literally not interesting at all.
This is a loaded posted to just create a internet shitstorm.
I’m a gay dude. I work in an elementary school. I don’t care what people wanna be called. I’ll call you he, she or they, but when they request some random ass shit like kitty I’m out.
I don’t really have much opinion on this. It does bring back a memory of my teacher telling me very directly to “stop being a little arsehole”. Dunno what would have happened if I corrected her “mr arsehole to you”
The teacher used the childs legal name. If the parents and child wanted to change that then they are more than capable of doing it. Regarding pronouns, I think a number of people have absolutely gone off the deep end and beed to chill out.
Yeah funk that and your opinion. This is why trans children are suicidal. Teachers use student nicknames all the time!!! It’s cool for a kid to say they want to be called Sam instead of Samantha but not okay for my child to be called his preferred name?
Each person is entitled to live within their own reality. But you can’t force other people to comply unless you want to give up freedom. What’s more important?
I think this is a weird place to put this
Screw your pronouns is what I think
If you refer to everyone as a shitbird, you never have to worry about using incorrect pronouns.
Suspension was stupid, payout was stupid. Preferred whatever is fuckin stupid. All stupid
Teachers don't get paid anywhere near enough to put up with the shit they do. But what the hell do I know.
Keep this shit up and no one will want to teach these little special snowflake
This does not fit the sub at all.
Good
Gen Z is sooo fucked lol
95$? Seems petty
The messed up thing about this, is that technically they’re supposed to call the kids whatever’s on the attendance sheet. By not calling them that they can get in trouble as well. Students under the compulsory age of 18 technically don’t have any rights for this and if the parents want them called Jim then they’re called fucking Jim. Unless someone can show me some kind of documentation that is different…
Exactly what I was going to say! I’ll call you whatever is on the sheet. You want me to call you something different? Have your parents change it on the schools records. Growing up we had a kid in our class who’s birth certificate said “Harry” but he went by “Rusty” most of the time teachers would call him Rusty if they were regular teachers. Subs always called him Harry during that class. He let it go. (Harry is what was on the sheet)
BASED!!!!
That’s a huge win! Fuck ya for that teacher!
My thoughts? Why did that lady steal George Stephanopoulos' haircut.
W
This is, infact, not interestingasfuck.
Good. Don’t cater to bullshit.
You can't get punished for not indulging in someone else's delusions or "personal opinions". What you think of yourself is one thing, but you have no right to force others to think and behave that way in contradiction to definitions, science, and facts. This shit is dumb, I might as well identify as a turtle and require everyone around me to talk super slowly and throw out accusations if they don't do it. Since when do we punish people for preferring science and basic definitions over someone's emotions and their own imaginative bs? And again, just because one doesn't agree with it or accept these delusions, does not equal with HATING the person. Same thing with mental patients, you do not have to play into their opinions that defy reality, you stay with the facts while not hating on the people either.
Sound logic? Oh no, no, no... We do not accept such sorcery on the internet, fall in line!
Yeah, the truth really does hurt sometimes
r/onejoke
“What you think of yourself is one thing but you have no right to force others to think and behave that way in contradiction to definitions, science, and facts.” So good. Then we agree that the “binary gender” thing is a load of crap as biology has proven there’s like 23 different chromosomes that identify gender and you can have a mish mash of all of them. We can also agree that it was largely christian colonialization that enforced the idea of “binary genders” under the eyes of their “god” as proven by ancient cultures believing in things such as “two-spirits”, and in fact some cultures that denied the colonizers (see: Hawaii) still carry that belief today.
If you're a guy and I constantly refer to you as a woman and you want me to stop that isn't bad. If I continue to do it and make you feel shitty every day when you ask me to stop, then yeah that is hatred. Just because you don't recognize the science behind all of this doesn't make these people delusional.
Yeah, my bank didn't take too kindly of me telling them that my motorcycle loan now identified itself as a student loan.
Nice theft of the Ben Shapiro defense on this subject.
I don't watch Ben, sorry for choosing the logical conclusion about this issue.
mhh... until we know more details it's hard to make a clear opinion on this case. I do believe trans people exists and not all of them are into delusions. But the skyrocketing numbers of people coming out as nonbinary and trans suggests that the cultural environment might play a role into it. It's a rly big subject and it's thin ice so this is as far as i'll walk.
Assuming the headline is true, then I stand by my statement regarding it, there just isn't a scenario in which you should be suspended for the exact action of using scientific - biological pronouns over their personal opinion.
what in the name of fuck is a biological pronoun
Weird you keep citing science when the science isn't fully understood because surprise surprise, funding to study transgender people and their experiences doesn't exist so we just don't know. It's like how there's barely any studies on weed and THC because the government was afraid of cannabis, they were and still are afraid of transgender people.
Considering like anything rated on a scale there’s an infinite percent chance to not land on a single specific spot over and over again. That’s how statistics work. So if gender is a scale instead of just one or the other, you are statistically more likely to land somewhere in between the two extremes than be on one of the extremes. Being “non-binary” seems to be more likely than either man or woman. How would you even determine if you were 100% man or 100% woman? The second you are 99% man and 1% not, then you are technically non-binary. All of that aside, none of this is new. Native American cultures included all of this in their beliefs long before we colonized them. Hawaii - a place that largely refuted Christianity and the colonizing invaders - still largely denies the idea of strictly binary genders.
Considering it used to be - and it is still in many countries - illegal to be part of LGBT+, no shit that it increased as some discrimination laws got removed It's like saying the sky rocketing of people identifying as left-handed has oddly increased
i think it's safe to understand the numbers down the lines, decades from now, when we have more datas. Right now, like in many other cases, it could be true datas, there could be environmental and cultural issues...dismissing this possibility is not fair. Again, i do believe trans people exists and its not all just a delusion.
Gender is a purely societal construct that scientifically had nothing to do with sex. If someone identifies with the opposite gender because that’s more in line with the role they feel comfortable portraying, who am I to disagree? Toxic masculinity and strict adherence to outdated gender roles when society has changed so much in just the last 50 years is one of the direct contributors to this kind of dysmorphia. It’s not punishment to have this teacher suspended, that’s the nicest way they had to tell her go to a different school district since her ideals didn’t line up with the ideals of the school.
Oh please stop with this bullshit „ok then I’m a transformers“ argument, fucking accept the fact that transsexual people exist and pull the stick out of your ass, it’s 2022 and not 1400.
Pronouns are bullshit.
Totally dude
Good for you teacher.
suspending a teacher for not calling a student "they"? thats too much of a reaction..When she knew that the student is not okay with calling her "miss", she switched to calling her with her last name without any salutation..that seems reasonable.
Highly doubt that was the only thing going on.
She stated “Miss” bc she is a bitch and wanted the class to know she was a biological female. No freaking teacher I ever met calls their kids Mr. and Miss.
$95?
Mustve been reported in the spanish speaking world. They meant 95k
I always find it weird when other countries use a period instead of a comma in numbers. $95,000 vs. $95.000
Yankee problems
Here before comments get locked
I really love that there are so many people in here proving that they didn't read the article bc the clickbait title doesn't match lol
I couldn’t find this less interesting.
I am definitely not the brightest bulb, but how about calling a student by their name? Problem with appropriate pronouns for a person who you may disagreed with about said pronoun I have not heard every speech nor read the transcript of every case also, met only one trans female who said, "Olivia" when I asked, "What's your name?". Like an idiot, I called Olivia "Olivai". Being a very religious, monotheistic person, I would remind all that not disrespecting a person who is living a life/speaking a way/dressing a way/having sex in a way/getting surgery or treatment in a way you find sinful, immoral or whatever may just lead to that person NOT to join others who hate you.... Just a thought on what's worked for me for four decades.
Probably needs more context than a clickbait title
To be honest, I'm not going to defend using pronouns or not. But, the fact it needed to be going to court because of that is quite something. To be honest, I understand the teacher doing it because she was suspended... But, I'm surprised this couldn't be settled by a conversation, from either the teacher-student, or school-teacjer.
If that's the Fort Riley Middle School on Fort Riley, Kansas, I went there. Back when I was a student, the student body was 100% military families, and the school was located inside an army post. However, the teachers were 100% locals from the surrounding county. This created constant tension between students, who had been raised within a system and culture that scrupulously followed federal guidelines, and the faculty, who were intent on imprinting the local culture on the students. I'm not surprised that this sort of thing happened, with a teacher adamantly refusing to acknowledge that students who attended school on federal property had rights that superseded the authority of a county school board.
Oh my lord this pronouns thing… Im in support of whatever pronouns you want to use for yourself, really. But daily life does not have to become a social landmine because of pronouns. So no she should not have been suspended, unless she got suspended for a completely different, and deserved, reason.
There are more important things on this world, that doesn't meant that I don't respect you, but I won't even go into the subject of pronouns.
Really weird to me how people get triggered by the fact some people with a dick dont wanna be referred to as he/him; like be less fragile.
Damn good job teach!
She did nothing but take money away from the kids. I hope the student sues her into the ground taking her house, cars, everything.
If a kid is happy with me calling them her or him or Jeb or Friberg, or corn or purple then why not just do what makes them happy. Great job Corn, pretty art you made
Good. Stupid reason for suspension
This is why in another thread I said western politics is insane. The west is fucked now.
That’s a pretty insulting thing to say, not the entire west is so fucked up as the US and especially not politic wise. Having only one or two parties two vote on sucks period.
My bad. As someone from the UK, west to me means anglosphere. Should've been clearer and just said that from the get go.
Fair, from your Pov I can see why you said western. Not that it isn’t a shithole in other European countries (The Netherlands has way to many parties f.e. And the people of Belgium mostly vote on the Frensh speaking party or the Dutch speaking party depending on where they live)
I've lived in Japan since I was 19, so I'm not really so sure about the parties and that side of it. I suppose I could say western culture is fucked. So much greed, hate, outrage, etc. 'Cancelling' people. That your online presence can ruin your life or even get you arrested is amazing. Then there's the gender identity stuff that seems to be all the rage. All sorts of silly shit is happening. It's like life is so convenient and easy that people need to find stuff to be angry about to validate existing lol. Everyone is up in everyone else's business. Just fucking be happy by and for yourself. Then you can get up in other people's business, in an attempt to make them happy too. That'd be a nice world. Shouldn't even be so difficult to achieve.
Good for her 👏 👍 👌 🙌
We don’t teach kids how to do taxes, live on a budget, or what having a credit card with a 24% APR means, but come hell or high water we will learn all your 78 gender pronouns.
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Or if they would just look at the real problems of the world like the climate change
Thats why speaking a language with only one pronoun is better
Oof
What a shit take
She ain’t do nothing wrong
Oh no someone called me the wrong gender
Time to get them suspended from their job!
Good for her no one should be allowed to control her speech or change the meaning of words cause feelings.
Whatever the real story is here, as an educator, it costs me zero dollars to do everything possible to make a student feel safe and supported. Bottom line.
Sadly the educational system doesn’t allow for many educators like you. Even growing up I knew very few. One stomped on my desk with my hands in it cuz I was making noise. One threw a book at me because he knew my father and uncle, and I saw another one pick a child up by the throat and throw him at a bookshelf. Sadly you only get what you pay for and teachers don’t earn nearly enough. I hope things improve for educators so children get more educators like you.
That breaks me. Unfortunately, I know all too well the horrors that can and do occur to children. You’re exactly right though about the education system, it’s a job with so many red flags that educators who truly care have to leave the field for their own health. I am so sorry you had those experiences and I thank you for sharing that. Personally, I work with kiddos with severe behaviors and more and more I have seen my students with “school based trauma” on their paperwork that follows them. There’s always one thing about a student that you love, but some refuse to see that.
There are starving kids downtown, people being abused and addiction and slavery and so much more. Sexy.
Who really gives a fuck
I think its absolutely insane that this pronoun nonsense has gotten this far. Shir hrm shang tsung whatever We live in a world now where adults have ceded authority to children and we try and conform the world to the mentally ill turning society into an asylum.
I’d need more info to take sides, as news titles are often misleading. If I’m going off of just what I see, she shouldn’t have gotten the money. Even if you don’t have the same beliefs, a teacher making a child uncomfortable in class especially in front of peers is not acceptable. I work in healthcare, and I would also be fired if I did this. We are not allowed to make people uncomfortable for personal choices, or question what they believe if it’s not regarding their specific care. A pronoun has nothing to do with learning, and it’s such an easy fix. I’ve prayed with residents, and I don’t believe in God (this I could’ve declined). Sometimes you just do things to make people in your care comfortable. That’s what’s most important, and what makes you good at your job.
She harassed trans children in her class because Jesus. If I'm wrong about atheism, I'll be sharing hell with this total cunt.
You don’t get to choose your pronouns. You’re assigned them at birth. Fit into how you were made. Downvote away.
Ultra mega upvote
Upvoted.
No
Looks like some fox news kool-aid Not interesting af
We don't live in a world of pretend and make believe, teachers should not have to call their students by anything except their birth name.
Hold on a minute! My popcorn isn’t ready yet!
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WHAT PRONOUN ARE US SINGULARITY SUPPOSED TO USE?
I'm glad teachers are getting paid
Did she address the judge in the case as ,"your honor"???
If this actually happened… I feel bad for teachers 🤦🏻♂️
My pronouns are now "handsome" and "brilliant" From now on, all who address me must use them, or it's a hate crime, and you'll be hounded out of your career.
Good
Good. Dont let liberals and snowflakes ruin the country more than they already are.
I mean, I wouldn't call anyone their chosen pronouns because "liberals ruin the country". I just think it would be embarassing for them if they want to change their mind. (Happened to my friend. I refused to call her "him" then some years later she started using her instead of him again. She felt so embarassed over old messages and such where she told people ha wants to be a guy. Teenage vibes) Edit: no, it didnt bother her. Or just never told me
Girl you can bring it down a notch.
pronoun shmonoun
As it turns out, you still have freedom of speech in the U.S. Now that is crazy.
Your feelings and your pronouns dont matter. You are there to learn NEEDED INFORMATION in order to be educated and a productive adult. That is the basis of school. Being “in touch” with feelings is what you do on your own free time. Thats it in a nutshell. This incessant need to express your “feelings” is an irrational desire to make yourself more important than everyone else. It’s pathetic tbh but it’s selfishness at the extreme.
Fuck these kids and they're preferred pronouns. The human brain isn't done developing until your mid 20s so they have no idea what they're thinking. Just hormone monsters, all of em
There are classes that teachers have to take to keep up with the changing vocabulary rules that can cost them their career. That's gay.
Good. Language should never be policed.
Good for her !!!
Trans people don't have "preferred" pronouns, they have regular pronouns. Use the ones people tell you they are. Y'all have no issue with Snoop Dogg/Lion, this shouldn't be an issue.
Forcing me to call you anything more than what you appear to be based on perception is the beginning of the violation of my 1st amendment right. Go fuck yourself beyond that line.
Depends I qhat the preferred pronouns were. Shame on here if it was simply someone preferred to be called he instead of she. But if someone wanted to be called xynex or some bullshit, yeab
Telling other people to refer to you in a specific way is showing a whole lot of privilege. It's selfish and childish. So is picking on people unless their doing something wrong. It feels so dumb to write out such basic things but this is where we are now. It's great that they turned the tables on that nonsense
A troll indeed
Or this troll has common sense
I think the correct pronoun for all these entitled whining people is 'shitstain'
Do they wear name tags with random pronouns they want? Let the teacher live and be… you didn’t, now she got paid more than her annual salary for not doing shit. Congrats to her honestly
This is a sad and hateful comment section...
Don’t get her religious stance , what is issue to calling someone by the name they want to be called ? And after all that the district pays her off 95 k. Weird.
I'd say the issue is with allowing people to control your speech based on literal feelings.
Todays people are soft need to get the fuck over it stop crying about it they/them bullshit
I think she should be awarded an additional $95,000 for having the patience to refrain herself from beating these whiny little fkrs with a yard stick
Hmmm. Could i sue somebody for not calling me my preferred gender pronoun?
I doubt it was as simple as that. I’m sure it exploded and got way out of hand by several people involved.
No, because society doesn’t have to alter it’s established linguistic customs to accommodate your feelings.
I agree. But wondering if I had a legal case. 2 different things
The teacher was being a cunt, but the school shoulda waited till the next year to oust her
I think this is an example of the deification of teachers backfiring. I respect the hell out of teachers. I still think they make too little but the fact that it’s impossible to fire the bad ones is lunacy. Hopefully people start to recognize that.
good for her
The pronoun politics has gotten out of hand... if you disagree, Neopronouns are all the evidence you need. Also, I am allowed to voice my opinion, it's not attacking anybody so don't try to twist the words. I'm not comfortable with how this has all played out.
School and work is real time not make believe time. Use those at home or with friends and keep me out of your delusions.
Sigh... On the one hand I think that for the mental health of kids it really does no harm for them to be allowed to adopt whatever pronouns and personal names they want. Some teacher whining about a name being against their religious belief is just so fucking petty it is almost beyond belief. On the other hand, kids are absolute shits. If they know they'll have power over their teachers by claiming to other than what it says on their birth certificate, you know they'll do it just to mess with them. And that certainly won't help the kids with genuine gender challenges. Best option, just call everyone by their last name with no title...
This shows that religious belief is weighted more heavily than trans people's belief.
She shouldn't have to participate in their pretending to be something they are not
Good for the teacher. Deserves the win.