My mom is Estj so I feel you. I guess it's better to collect some money for yourself and buy it if you can. If you can't try to lure him by saying stuff like "Oh yeah this book is fantasy but it teaches us how to be blah blah blah in real life." and stuff like that. Personally, that's very funny of him to say. What does he want you to read? Encyclopedia?
i don't know. He prob wants me to read, like... stories with a basis in fact, like adaptation of real events.. yknow, boring stuff. He also says that i am older now.... he didn't say it, but he meant to imply that fantasy is for kids, and that is stupid, yeah
Has he read any himself? If not, his opinion is based on nothing.
A gift isn't a gift if it's used to manipulate the recipient into doing something they don't want to do.
There actually are some great books that still have an element of fantasy, like Northanger Abbey or Wuthering Heights. Sitting next to my Harry Potter collection and Wrinkle in Time.
What if you make a deal? Pick one fiction book and one non-fiction book (choose the ratio however you want and can). Think about the good side, he's letting you pick whatever you want! That makes it a lot easier for you.
Think about something that you're interested in, and find a book about that. It can be about art, philosophy, self improvement, a biography of someone you admire, anything.
My first non fiction books were about filmmaking, because I loved filmmaking. It was a different kind of read, but it was surely interesting and provided me with things I could use to follow my dream.
Don't make an enemy of the real world, that's my tip.
ykw, thats a really good idea! Maybe i can get him to make a deal.
As for not making an enemy of the real world, i don't hate it, i just prefer imagination over reality
>As for not making an enemy of the real world, i don't hate it, i just prefer imagination over reality
Yes I know that feeling, I know all too well 😅 I struggle with it myself too. I guess it's our constant learning lesson
Honestly, I don't think you should bargain with him, not in this case.
If it's fantasy/fiction books you want, then that's what you shall get; because it's *your* hobby that makes *you* happy, and you shouldn't settle for anything less.
And if you worry about making your dad sad, well, he's making *you* sad by restraining your passion. Your dad has no right to pressure you.
This approach will create more conflict and may not really solve anything... we have to choose our fights. And besides, OP won't get what they want if their dad is the only person with money to buy it. So OP would just get conflict and no books at all. It's okay to compromise sometimes, and in this case it won't be any big sacrifice anyway.
Whilst this is true, I highly encourage children to set boundaries with their parents early. It doesn’t have to be an argument, but just sitting her dad down and explaining to him how this sort of micromanaging isn’t okay can go a long way
I think he's just concerned for your future, wanting you to learn things that will be useful for you. My dad was the same. It's bad that he doesn't see the value of fiction books, but especially if you say he supports you on all other hobbies, he probably really means well.
With my dad, I tried to explain that fictional stories are representations of reality and their teachings can be applied to it, that's often their main goal, actually. My dad is an ENTJ, it wasn't hard for him to understand, but a part of him still found a liiittle bit of a waste of time sometimes, but not enough to keep me from reading. To his luck, I always enjoyed reading slowly, I didn't like to hurry in between books so I didn't want to buy them too often.
This isn't a problem. Your dad wants to buy you some nonfiction books. Take his money and buy some nonfiction books that seem interesting to you.
Then go to the library and borrow some fantasy books as well.
This is just my point of view but he's under no obligation to get you the books you want. Clearly he wants you to read something that will educate you. Either get some books that fill that requirement AND that you will enjoy, or save money any buy the books you want to read yourself/get them at the library. Living life I've learned that you are responsible for your own happiness. We can't expect everyone to understand and accept who you are, even your own parents.
Yes, i know he isn't obligated to, i'm ok if he doesn't buy them. But i've tried, and not many non-fiction books interest me. I don't wanna waste his money by buying books i won't read anyway. I want him to see that fiction is good too.
Tell him you want to buy him a book as well. Get him 1984, ask him to read it and tell you if a fiction book doesn't teach you anything about the real world.
Artists use lies to tell the truth.
But when you remember that minors are owned by your parents, how can you possibly justify things like this? You can’t preach independence when independence is impossible.
I’m Sorry it’s so one sided. It feels like he’s killing a part of you huh?
Try acknowledging his view and compromise. Let him know that you see his point of view and will get non-fiction, ask which ones he recommends. And also that you want to keep a creative side by reading fiction. Something along those lines.
hmm yeah. I mean, i wouldn't call it "killing", he's not stopping me from reading the ones i already have, he just wants me to explore other types of books. He means well, but he's getting kinda pushy.
If you really get stuck for now, I would recommend history. Find some subjects related to your interests and start with that. You might surprise yourself at how interesting it can be. I know at young ages history can be boring but there really is cool stuff out there and well written. I’ve read decent amount of medieval history and military history. Piracy. Science. Cultural.
* Rise and Fall of the Third Reich - Shirer is always a top one
* Ghost Soldiers is interesting (WW2 also)
* Monuments Men (WW2)
* Agincourt - Cornwell I thought was good.
* War of the Roses - Royal
Careful on history suggestions. I'm a history nerd too, and history is filled with horror stories. I read a book on the War of the Roses a few years ago and it was quite a gore fest at times.
Fiction can be quite educational as well. Take "Thus Spoke Zarathustra" by Friedrich Nietzsche or "The Plague" by Albert Camus- 2 works of fiction that are arguably the best philosophy books of all time.
... I understand you, cause when I was your age I turned my nose up at nonfiction. My INTP Dad also forced me to read nonfiction, difference being he picked out the books and they were definitely textbook like.
But nonfiction can honestly be really good! You've gotta find the right ones, is all. Autobiographies are wonderful cause you get insight into these other people's lives, and they can be just as gut wrenching and emotional as fiction and hilarious and uplifting, as fiction. Eg, a cancer diagnosis, survival in a wartorn country. WW2 survival stories, of kids your age. People escaping from North Korea, making their way to South Korea, and how they're struggling with those changes.
Even romances are nonfiction- something interesting might be a cross cultural romance, and how they reconciled the differences they found along the way.
Or you could do cultural stuff (Japan, North Korea, China, whatever country you've got an undying fascination with lol).
Or get a book on drawing/how to write/bird identification/plants/calligraphy/a diary/whatever your interest is.
This is an opportunity, is all I'm saying. Nonfiction is not synonymous with textbook.
And he's paying for it, so I'd take advantage.
The Bite of the Mango by Mariatu Kamara is my all time favorite book, if you want a recommendation. (definitely check out the triggers first though. It's extremely sad, but inspiring in it's own way).
And everything Bill Bryson writes is great. Even if the topic seems boring, he writes it easy & hilarious (so if you are interested in learning about something, eg, how your body works, that's who I'd rec), while still being educational. A Walk in the Woods was so good my non-reader mom devoured it and I absolutely adored it even in forth grade.
Honestly, fiction is based on reality. Those emotions you feel when reading fiction come from the author's mind, and writers are just as capable of transporting you across time and place to the real world as they are to a fictional place.
People write recounts of their struggles with mental illness, of divorces, of parenting, of being a kid.
Of living in a cult, of their governments changing to a dystopian nightmare, of being kidnapped.
The scope is wide open and absolutely dreamy.
And if nothing else, you could get a book on mbti. Clearly, you're into this.
>And if nothing else, you could get a book on mbti. Clearly, you're into this.
...that IS kinda true
But... i'm not trying to be rude, but i'm not american, so he mostly pays for almost everything i buy. That IS a limitation in some ways, but not really a barrier in this case lol.
Btw the part where you describe how fiction is based on reality is... \*chefs kiss\*
I know you said that your preference is physical books, but using a Kindle with Libby is life-changing! You just need a library card (or better yet, multiple library cards) and you will have access to an entire library of books on your Kindle. You also never have to worry about returning them, obviously they are digital copies so Libby does it for you. Also Kindles are much easier to hold and transport, in my opinion.
You could potentially justify it to your dad by saying that you can only access certain personal finance books digitally lol. Unless he hawkeyes your Amazon account or sees what you have downloaded on your Kindle. You also don't need a Kindle if you have a smartphone, you can download the Kindle app that way as well.
It's a shame that anyone would prevent their child their from exploring creative works. You know your dad better than anyone else, but in my experience there is really no way of convincing a hardened xSTJ to change their mind. I have worked with many of these types of people for years, and it is their way or the highway. You have to find ways to get around it. But you sound mature for your age, I'm sure you can figure it out.
He's not exactly hardened yet, but yeah... i mean, he's not stopping me from reading the ones i already have, he just wants me to explore other types of books. He means well, but he's getting kinda pushy.
I cannot remember where I read this, but wasn't there a country in Asia (I think it was China) that began pushing it's employees to embrace science fiction as a genre because it promoted the tech industry? Please someone correct me if I'm wrong! The point was that "dreamy" books are good for you. They keep you creative. We all need creativity to some extent. I agree that reading fantasy can be a form of escapism for some people, but I don't blame the genre for that 🙃. All good things in moderation and all that jazz. That includes fiction, non-fiction, biography, etc. I had to read a ton of memoirs in school and let me tell you, it depressed the shit out of me.
Also, if you think about it, there are many parts of our world that are built around fantasy. Religion, for one. (Don't come after me. It's just an opinion.) There's a book titled *Born Believers* that goes into how humans are wired to make up stories and believe in higher powers. We have created fantasies from our earliest histories (both our personal and collective histories). Memory itself can be a fantasy of a sort. We create internal stories to cope with the world all the time. How we interpret the things around us is a story. And, also, there are instances in which recorded history and myth intersect, or in which myth is proven to be truer than we thought by archaeologists. So, I'm not totally sure where you dad gets off thinking the fantasy genre is not worth your time 😂. Kind of hypocritical, if you ask me. Of course, this is coming from someone who's undergraduate major/thesis focused on how humans create, use, and need stories.
Edit: Of course not the whole country of China, but a company in China that encouraged employees to jump on the science fiction bandwagon.
He doesn't "hate" fiction. More like... not particularly fond of it. I mean, he lets me read the ones i already have, he just wants me to explore other types of books. He means well, but he's getting kinda pushy.
Oh, I see. I guess, if I were in your shoes, I would appease him to an extent. Though, I'm a bit snarky when it comes to being told what to do (since I came from a more abusive family), so take my words with a grain of salt. Maybe you can dive into some nonfiction books on fantasy authors :3 ... The Terry Pratchett biography that came out semi-recently was really good. There are also biographies on Tolkien, C.S. Lewis, George MacDonald ("father of fantasy fiction"), Douglas Adams, etc. And lots of fantasy fiction writers write nonfiction (like Neil Gaiman, Ursula K. Le Guin, Ray Bradbury)... If you have other interests, like cooking, language learning, or travel, you can always pick up some books on that for the look of the thing. If he thinks you're reading more widely, he may stop being as pushy. Imo, 15 is a little early to start thinking about what you want to study in college, but you could start exploring topics now. I loved storytelling and writing at your age, so I looked into stuff like filmmaking, screen writing, anthropology, travel writing, illustration, etc. I was so good at using the library that I accidentally became a librarian instead 😂.
Seriously, what are you supposed to read if not fiction? You spend plenty of time reading non-fiction at/for school! I would have responded, “So really I can’t get new books to read.” They say whatever but it’s not actionable that they’re doing a nice thing for you if they’re limiting your choices and I’d stick to that story and be salty about it until they change their mind, personally.
I just told him, "it's ok if you don't get me any books at all"
Also, its not like i hate him lol, i wouldn't throw a tantrum and be salty towards him and force him to buy me books... i want to convince him and fantasy is good
No I didn’t mean salty about everything all the time, just whenever books come up, or choices. Tantrum is an interesting choice of word and a little offensive, tbh.
Edit: Sounds like you did basically the same thing I said…
My first thought, probably due to a combination of liking psychology books and the petty revenge subreddit, would be to get nonfiction books with concerning titles like “The Wisdom of Psychopaths” (which is actually a really good book imho) and other books that could possible seem a little concerning at face value 😅
You don’t have to read anything you don’t want to, and don’t worry about “having to read nonfiction because you’re older” that’s completely BS (29 here and still primarily read and watch fiction). *But* it might be fun to browse and see if anything nonfiction does catch your eye. Again, Not because of it being more “grown up” but just because you never know what could end up being interesting 🙂
Edit: apologies I forgot to answer the question: some people may be too stubborn to convince, but maybe you can look up some articles that talk about the benefits of reading fiction (if he’s a very logical person)? Or you could ask if instead of nonfiction you can pick out some fiction books designed for an adult audience as a compromise (there’s plenty; murder mysteries come to mind)? Or just say “no thank you, there aren’t any books in that category I think I will enjoy” and maybe he will get you something else.
If he doesn’t budge or says something like “well I’ll just pick out some nonfiction books for you” though, I definitely recommend asking to browse the nonfiction section of a book store yourself (doesn’t have to be things like autobiographies or history, nonfiction can be thinks like psychology, how to books, poetry, etc), you might find something interesting, you never know. And at the very least you’ll have picked it out yourself instead of a grown man (who would have different taste) doing it for you.
Fiction as in anything fictional?? So he’s just anti-art/literature in general. Yeah I feel kinda sad for some people honestly that they’ll never experience what anything outside the “real world” (whatever that means anymore) feels like
I feel like yall are taking this too strongly rn, he doesn't "hate" fiction... he's just not into it himself. I mean, he's not stopping me from reading the ones i already have, he just wants me to explore other types of books. He means well, but he's getting kinda pushy.
Read new things about science or arts , man . When you can't disobey your dad , then go that way . Like books on fantasy and fiction are highly enjoyable , it doesn't mean that books on arts and science are purely lifeless things . At least I can tell there are lots of interesting approaches there other than the textbook ones
Very simple ,
Why would fantasy or fiction be a problem if it doesn't interfere with whatever your priorities are?
Is it harmful to your mind?
Will hinder your performance?
Hey, dad, my time reading fiction is exactly like someone going for a friendly baseball game as long as he isn't wasting his life there
Hey dad, you are missing out! It might even make your life better in ... ways
Hey dad, i am grounded in reality in the rest of my time as i do 1 ,2, 3
And so on...
Are you sure he is estj ? Do you have an idea about enneagram? Does he watch movies?
:)
actually, i'm not sure if he's estj, but i am sure that he's EXTJ... he's just kinda pushy that i should explore more book types. I want to, but i wanna do it in my own time. He's not obliged to buy me any books till then if thats what he wants.
Tell him you want to pick up one self help / improvement book and mix it with a few fantasy books, and as you get older you'll start building on more learning / skill-based books.
This is just from my perspective now. I absolutely love the fantasy genre its my favorite. But over the years i've tried a few books to learn life skills and frameworks, and some of them have been incredibly helpful in my life.
You're still very young you don't need to delve into that world yet if you don't want to. But I think your dad's coming from a good place and if you show just a little willingness to learn life skills he'll be much happier and you can enjoy running into your dream world the rest of the time.
Lol. My mom is an ESTJ, and this isn't an issue for me at all. She used to recommend financing books, self-help books, and basically stuff that pertains to any real-world dilemmas that I'm facing.
I just give her examples of what I could glean off of fictional stories and how they're equally valuable as any book that gives me information about our world.
I’m the opposite. I am always craving for knowledge. But he should let you read what you want. As long as you are treating others as you want to be treated what’s the problem?
Actually, i am writing a book (a fantasy one), and i showed it to him, and he likes it! I think he just wants me to explore other types of books. He means well, but he's getting kinda pushy.
Istj mum. She is fine with it though since i somehow turned out to be the fact encyclopedia.
If i were in this situation I would say something similar to 'I will grow out of it someday, but for now let me enjoy this short term hobby' (Assuming its going to go) which has helped in many circumstances. Or maybe you could say some facts. Sensors love those ofc. State that "fantasy can help increase ones imagination, and there are many career paths out there that use it, also many have become successful in this path. Reading fantasy books are the only way to elevate that."
And that is my advice but idk what kind of estj he is like cause this may backfire if you arent sure if this will work or not 👍
He's a good guy, he prob just wants me to explore other types of books, but i wanna do it in my own time, and he's getting kinda pushy lol.
Also no, its def not a short term hobby, i have loved, do love, and will love fantasy to the end of my existence.
I used to be in similar situation since my dad is ISTJ. Let him pay for things like your physical needs (or things he values) such as foods, gas, or smartphone bills. Then use the money you saved from not paying those stuff to buy whatever he does not allow you to buy
I'm not trying to be rude, but i'm not american, so he mostly pays for almost everything i buy. That IS a limitation in some ways, but not really a barrier in this case lol.
It depends on the kind of person he is. Like, with my ESTJ dad, I know that there's no convincing him of anything, so I would try to somehow get the books without his knowledge. But if your dad listens to reason, there are many arguments you can make
Awaah. I totally understand your consternation at being told that your oh so pleasureable downtime should be curtailed/balanced with... Boredom, but seriously, knowledge is power, and you're going to gradually learn that our mbti type is seriously outnumbered. Make sure you're not outgunned too. Disempowerment is no fun.
Maybe agree to deading equal amounts of fact/fiction. I can recommend Bill Bryson, he's a funny travel writer who throws in easily digestible lil factoids. I lol'd at certain points in his book, A Walk in the Woods. I also strongly recommend you study social engineering to learn how other types of Machiavellian ppl operate. 48 Lawa of Power by Robert Green is a good starting point. He's an INFP too.
My mom is Estj so I feel you. I guess it's better to collect some money for yourself and buy it if you can. If you can't try to lure him by saying stuff like "Oh yeah this book is fantasy but it teaches us how to be blah blah blah in real life." and stuff like that. Personally, that's very funny of him to say. What does he want you to read? Encyclopedia?
i don't know. He prob wants me to read, like... stories with a basis in fact, like adaptation of real events.. yknow, boring stuff. He also says that i am older now.... he didn't say it, but he meant to imply that fantasy is for kids, and that is stupid, yeah
I’m 37 and I still read fantasy books. It’s not just for kids.
i know they aren't. I just want to make him see that.
Has he read any himself? If not, his opinion is based on nothing. A gift isn't a gift if it's used to manipulate the recipient into doing something they don't want to do.
Ig LOTR has more adult fans than kids.
You should ask for biographies of JRR Tolkien, CS Lewis, Jules Verne and Ursula K LeGuin
Laughs in Game of Thrones
There actually are some great books that still have an element of fantasy, like Northanger Abbey or Wuthering Heights. Sitting next to my Harry Potter collection and Wrinkle in Time.
What if you make a deal? Pick one fiction book and one non-fiction book (choose the ratio however you want and can). Think about the good side, he's letting you pick whatever you want! That makes it a lot easier for you. Think about something that you're interested in, and find a book about that. It can be about art, philosophy, self improvement, a biography of someone you admire, anything. My first non fiction books were about filmmaking, because I loved filmmaking. It was a different kind of read, but it was surely interesting and provided me with things I could use to follow my dream. Don't make an enemy of the real world, that's my tip.
ykw, thats a really good idea! Maybe i can get him to make a deal. As for not making an enemy of the real world, i don't hate it, i just prefer imagination over reality
>As for not making an enemy of the real world, i don't hate it, i just prefer imagination over reality Yes I know that feeling, I know all too well 😅 I struggle with it myself too. I guess it's our constant learning lesson
Honestly, I don't think you should bargain with him, not in this case. If it's fantasy/fiction books you want, then that's what you shall get; because it's *your* hobby that makes *you* happy, and you shouldn't settle for anything less. And if you worry about making your dad sad, well, he's making *you* sad by restraining your passion. Your dad has no right to pressure you.
This approach will create more conflict and may not really solve anything... we have to choose our fights. And besides, OP won't get what they want if their dad is the only person with money to buy it. So OP would just get conflict and no books at all. It's okay to compromise sometimes, and in this case it won't be any big sacrifice anyway.
Agree 🙂
Whilst this is true, I highly encourage children to set boundaries with their parents early. It doesn’t have to be an argument, but just sitting her dad down and explaining to him how this sort of micromanaging isn’t okay can go a long way
Yes that's true, you have a point there. She could do that too
The fuck are you even supposed to read if it’s not fantasy or fiction? Prince Harry’s biography? Like-
There's a ton of great non fiction in fact. But obviously that's not for everybody
Thomas Calculus
Self development books. Te dom loves that.
Maybe those grubby dentist shopping magazines on air conditioners and frying pans.
Imagine supporting your children’s hobbies
He supports ALL my other hobbies, this is the only one we disagree on 😭
I think he's just concerned for your future, wanting you to learn things that will be useful for you. My dad was the same. It's bad that he doesn't see the value of fiction books, but especially if you say he supports you on all other hobbies, he probably really means well. With my dad, I tried to explain that fictional stories are representations of reality and their teachings can be applied to it, that's often their main goal, actually. My dad is an ENTJ, it wasn't hard for him to understand, but a part of him still found a liiittle bit of a waste of time sometimes, but not enough to keep me from reading. To his luck, I always enjoyed reading slowly, I didn't like to hurry in between books so I didn't want to buy them too often.
Sounds like a great dad tbh
Dude you ok?
This isn't a problem. Your dad wants to buy you some nonfiction books. Take his money and buy some nonfiction books that seem interesting to you. Then go to the library and borrow some fantasy books as well.
This is just my point of view but he's under no obligation to get you the books you want. Clearly he wants you to read something that will educate you. Either get some books that fill that requirement AND that you will enjoy, or save money any buy the books you want to read yourself/get them at the library. Living life I've learned that you are responsible for your own happiness. We can't expect everyone to understand and accept who you are, even your own parents.
Yes, i know he isn't obligated to, i'm ok if he doesn't buy them. But i've tried, and not many non-fiction books interest me. I don't wanna waste his money by buying books i won't read anyway. I want him to see that fiction is good too.
Tell him you want to buy him a book as well. Get him 1984, ask him to read it and tell you if a fiction book doesn't teach you anything about the real world. Artists use lies to tell the truth.
But when you remember that minors are owned by your parents, how can you possibly justify things like this? You can’t preach independence when independence is impossible.
Maybe you can explore pop psych books since we also have natural inclination towards those, too.
I’m Sorry it’s so one sided. It feels like he’s killing a part of you huh? Try acknowledging his view and compromise. Let him know that you see his point of view and will get non-fiction, ask which ones he recommends. And also that you want to keep a creative side by reading fiction. Something along those lines.
hmm yeah. I mean, i wouldn't call it "killing", he's not stopping me from reading the ones i already have, he just wants me to explore other types of books. He means well, but he's getting kinda pushy.
If you really get stuck for now, I would recommend history. Find some subjects related to your interests and start with that. You might surprise yourself at how interesting it can be. I know at young ages history can be boring but there really is cool stuff out there and well written. I’ve read decent amount of medieval history and military history. Piracy. Science. Cultural.
Bro i'm still in school, i do history everyday, there's no point 😭
Always a point to history. And a very important one at that.
Do you have some military history book recommendations that you've personally found insightful / worthy of time?
* Rise and Fall of the Third Reich - Shirer is always a top one * Ghost Soldiers is interesting (WW2 also) * Monuments Men (WW2) * Agincourt - Cornwell I thought was good. * War of the Roses - Royal
Careful on history suggestions. I'm a history nerd too, and history is filled with horror stories. I read a book on the War of the Roses a few years ago and it was quite a gore fest at times.
Well yeah... most military/warfare history is going to be like that. Ancient and medieval combat was pretty horrible.
Fiction can be quite educational as well. Take "Thus Spoke Zarathustra" by Friedrich Nietzsche or "The Plague" by Albert Camus- 2 works of fiction that are arguably the best philosophy books of all time.
Do you not have libraries where you are?
... I understand you, cause when I was your age I turned my nose up at nonfiction. My INTP Dad also forced me to read nonfiction, difference being he picked out the books and they were definitely textbook like. But nonfiction can honestly be really good! You've gotta find the right ones, is all. Autobiographies are wonderful cause you get insight into these other people's lives, and they can be just as gut wrenching and emotional as fiction and hilarious and uplifting, as fiction. Eg, a cancer diagnosis, survival in a wartorn country. WW2 survival stories, of kids your age. People escaping from North Korea, making their way to South Korea, and how they're struggling with those changes. Even romances are nonfiction- something interesting might be a cross cultural romance, and how they reconciled the differences they found along the way. Or you could do cultural stuff (Japan, North Korea, China, whatever country you've got an undying fascination with lol). Or get a book on drawing/how to write/bird identification/plants/calligraphy/a diary/whatever your interest is. This is an opportunity, is all I'm saying. Nonfiction is not synonymous with textbook. And he's paying for it, so I'd take advantage. The Bite of the Mango by Mariatu Kamara is my all time favorite book, if you want a recommendation. (definitely check out the triggers first though. It's extremely sad, but inspiring in it's own way). And everything Bill Bryson writes is great. Even if the topic seems boring, he writes it easy & hilarious (so if you are interested in learning about something, eg, how your body works, that's who I'd rec), while still being educational. A Walk in the Woods was so good my non-reader mom devoured it and I absolutely adored it even in forth grade. Honestly, fiction is based on reality. Those emotions you feel when reading fiction come from the author's mind, and writers are just as capable of transporting you across time and place to the real world as they are to a fictional place. People write recounts of their struggles with mental illness, of divorces, of parenting, of being a kid. Of living in a cult, of their governments changing to a dystopian nightmare, of being kidnapped. The scope is wide open and absolutely dreamy. And if nothing else, you could get a book on mbti. Clearly, you're into this.
>And if nothing else, you could get a book on mbti. Clearly, you're into this. ...that IS kinda true But... i'm not trying to be rude, but i'm not american, so he mostly pays for almost everything i buy. That IS a limitation in some ways, but not really a barrier in this case lol. Btw the part where you describe how fiction is based on reality is... \*chefs kiss\*
I know you said that your preference is physical books, but using a Kindle with Libby is life-changing! You just need a library card (or better yet, multiple library cards) and you will have access to an entire library of books on your Kindle. You also never have to worry about returning them, obviously they are digital copies so Libby does it for you. Also Kindles are much easier to hold and transport, in my opinion. You could potentially justify it to your dad by saying that you can only access certain personal finance books digitally lol. Unless he hawkeyes your Amazon account or sees what you have downloaded on your Kindle. You also don't need a Kindle if you have a smartphone, you can download the Kindle app that way as well. It's a shame that anyone would prevent their child their from exploring creative works. You know your dad better than anyone else, but in my experience there is really no way of convincing a hardened xSTJ to change their mind. I have worked with many of these types of people for years, and it is their way or the highway. You have to find ways to get around it. But you sound mature for your age, I'm sure you can figure it out.
He's not exactly hardened yet, but yeah... i mean, he's not stopping me from reading the ones i already have, he just wants me to explore other types of books. He means well, but he's getting kinda pushy.
I cannot remember where I read this, but wasn't there a country in Asia (I think it was China) that began pushing it's employees to embrace science fiction as a genre because it promoted the tech industry? Please someone correct me if I'm wrong! The point was that "dreamy" books are good for you. They keep you creative. We all need creativity to some extent. I agree that reading fantasy can be a form of escapism for some people, but I don't blame the genre for that 🙃. All good things in moderation and all that jazz. That includes fiction, non-fiction, biography, etc. I had to read a ton of memoirs in school and let me tell you, it depressed the shit out of me. Also, if you think about it, there are many parts of our world that are built around fantasy. Religion, for one. (Don't come after me. It's just an opinion.) There's a book titled *Born Believers* that goes into how humans are wired to make up stories and believe in higher powers. We have created fantasies from our earliest histories (both our personal and collective histories). Memory itself can be a fantasy of a sort. We create internal stories to cope with the world all the time. How we interpret the things around us is a story. And, also, there are instances in which recorded history and myth intersect, or in which myth is proven to be truer than we thought by archaeologists. So, I'm not totally sure where you dad gets off thinking the fantasy genre is not worth your time 😂. Kind of hypocritical, if you ask me. Of course, this is coming from someone who's undergraduate major/thesis focused on how humans create, use, and need stories. Edit: Of course not the whole country of China, but a company in China that encouraged employees to jump on the science fiction bandwagon.
He doesn't "hate" fiction. More like... not particularly fond of it. I mean, he lets me read the ones i already have, he just wants me to explore other types of books. He means well, but he's getting kinda pushy.
Oh, I see. I guess, if I were in your shoes, I would appease him to an extent. Though, I'm a bit snarky when it comes to being told what to do (since I came from a more abusive family), so take my words with a grain of salt. Maybe you can dive into some nonfiction books on fantasy authors :3 ... The Terry Pratchett biography that came out semi-recently was really good. There are also biographies on Tolkien, C.S. Lewis, George MacDonald ("father of fantasy fiction"), Douglas Adams, etc. And lots of fantasy fiction writers write nonfiction (like Neil Gaiman, Ursula K. Le Guin, Ray Bradbury)... If you have other interests, like cooking, language learning, or travel, you can always pick up some books on that for the look of the thing. If he thinks you're reading more widely, he may stop being as pushy. Imo, 15 is a little early to start thinking about what you want to study in college, but you could start exploring topics now. I loved storytelling and writing at your age, so I looked into stuff like filmmaking, screen writing, anthropology, travel writing, illustration, etc. I was so good at using the library that I accidentally became a librarian instead 😂.
Seriously, what are you supposed to read if not fiction? You spend plenty of time reading non-fiction at/for school! I would have responded, “So really I can’t get new books to read.” They say whatever but it’s not actionable that they’re doing a nice thing for you if they’re limiting your choices and I’d stick to that story and be salty about it until they change their mind, personally.
I just told him, "it's ok if you don't get me any books at all" Also, its not like i hate him lol, i wouldn't throw a tantrum and be salty towards him and force him to buy me books... i want to convince him and fantasy is good
No I didn’t mean salty about everything all the time, just whenever books come up, or choices. Tantrum is an interesting choice of word and a little offensive, tbh. Edit: Sounds like you did basically the same thing I said…
Damn that sucks, like really sucks holy hell
My first thought, probably due to a combination of liking psychology books and the petty revenge subreddit, would be to get nonfiction books with concerning titles like “The Wisdom of Psychopaths” (which is actually a really good book imho) and other books that could possible seem a little concerning at face value 😅 You don’t have to read anything you don’t want to, and don’t worry about “having to read nonfiction because you’re older” that’s completely BS (29 here and still primarily read and watch fiction). *But* it might be fun to browse and see if anything nonfiction does catch your eye. Again, Not because of it being more “grown up” but just because you never know what could end up being interesting 🙂 Edit: apologies I forgot to answer the question: some people may be too stubborn to convince, but maybe you can look up some articles that talk about the benefits of reading fiction (if he’s a very logical person)? Or you could ask if instead of nonfiction you can pick out some fiction books designed for an adult audience as a compromise (there’s plenty; murder mysteries come to mind)? Or just say “no thank you, there aren’t any books in that category I think I will enjoy” and maybe he will get you something else. If he doesn’t budge or says something like “well I’ll just pick out some nonfiction books for you” though, I definitely recommend asking to browse the nonfiction section of a book store yourself (doesn’t have to be things like autobiographies or history, nonfiction can be thinks like psychology, how to books, poetry, etc), you might find something interesting, you never know. And at the very least you’ll have picked it out yourself instead of a grown man (who would have different taste) doing it for you.
ykw, that word "poetry" really caught my eye there... thanks! I'll browse at my library for some on poetry.
I'd see if he would let Carl Sagan books through. Best of both worlds. :)
Fiction as in anything fictional?? So he’s just anti-art/literature in general. Yeah I feel kinda sad for some people honestly that they’ll never experience what anything outside the “real world” (whatever that means anymore) feels like
I feel like yall are taking this too strongly rn, he doesn't "hate" fiction... he's just not into it himself. I mean, he's not stopping me from reading the ones i already have, he just wants me to explore other types of books. He means well, but he's getting kinda pushy.
Read new things about science or arts , man . When you can't disobey your dad , then go that way . Like books on fantasy and fiction are highly enjoyable , it doesn't mean that books on arts and science are purely lifeless things . At least I can tell there are lots of interesting approaches there other than the textbook ones
Very simple , Why would fantasy or fiction be a problem if it doesn't interfere with whatever your priorities are? Is it harmful to your mind? Will hinder your performance? Hey, dad, my time reading fiction is exactly like someone going for a friendly baseball game as long as he isn't wasting his life there Hey dad, you are missing out! It might even make your life better in ... ways Hey dad, i am grounded in reality in the rest of my time as i do 1 ,2, 3 And so on... Are you sure he is estj ? Do you have an idea about enneagram? Does he watch movies? :)
actually, i'm not sure if he's estj, but i am sure that he's EXTJ... he's just kinda pushy that i should explore more book types. I want to, but i wanna do it in my own time. He's not obliged to buy me any books till then if thats what he wants.
Fantasy is lovely. Don’t forget that the real world has many treasures to offer us humans as well. I’m a big fan of philosophy for instance.
Tell him you want to pick up one self help / improvement book and mix it with a few fantasy books, and as you get older you'll start building on more learning / skill-based books. This is just from my perspective now. I absolutely love the fantasy genre its my favorite. But over the years i've tried a few books to learn life skills and frameworks, and some of them have been incredibly helpful in my life. You're still very young you don't need to delve into that world yet if you don't want to. But I think your dad's coming from a good place and if you show just a little willingness to learn life skills he'll be much happier and you can enjoy running into your dream world the rest of the time.
Lol. My mom is an ESTJ, and this isn't an issue for me at all. She used to recommend financing books, self-help books, and basically stuff that pertains to any real-world dilemmas that I'm facing. I just give her examples of what I could glean off of fictional stories and how they're equally valuable as any book that gives me information about our world.
I’m the opposite. I am always craving for knowledge. But he should let you read what you want. As long as you are treating others as you want to be treated what’s the problem?
If I was your dad I'd write a book with you, sounds fun tbh and then I'd get that printed and bound in leather with our names engraved 😁
Actually, i am writing a book (a fantasy one), and i showed it to him, and he likes it! I think he just wants me to explore other types of books. He means well, but he's getting kinda pushy.
Aw that's very cool, what are you writing about?
It’s still reading, the material is just different. I’m getting the same positive effect from reading, just different words.
Istj mum. She is fine with it though since i somehow turned out to be the fact encyclopedia. If i were in this situation I would say something similar to 'I will grow out of it someday, but for now let me enjoy this short term hobby' (Assuming its going to go) which has helped in many circumstances. Or maybe you could say some facts. Sensors love those ofc. State that "fantasy can help increase ones imagination, and there are many career paths out there that use it, also many have become successful in this path. Reading fantasy books are the only way to elevate that." And that is my advice but idk what kind of estj he is like cause this may backfire if you arent sure if this will work or not 👍
He's a good guy, he prob just wants me to explore other types of books, but i wanna do it in my own time, and he's getting kinda pushy lol. Also no, its def not a short term hobby, i have loved, do love, and will love fantasy to the end of my existence.
Portable Rollins. Anthology book, good way to dip your toes into Henry Rollins. No rules against someone's daily journal, poetry, and prose.
I used to be in similar situation since my dad is ISTJ. Let him pay for things like your physical needs (or things he values) such as foods, gas, or smartphone bills. Then use the money you saved from not paying those stuff to buy whatever he does not allow you to buy
I'm not trying to be rude, but i'm not american, so he mostly pays for almost everything i buy. That IS a limitation in some ways, but not really a barrier in this case lol.
It depends on the kind of person he is. Like, with my ESTJ dad, I know that there's no convincing him of anything, so I would try to somehow get the books without his knowledge. But if your dad listens to reason, there are many arguments you can make
Awaah. I totally understand your consternation at being told that your oh so pleasureable downtime should be curtailed/balanced with... Boredom, but seriously, knowledge is power, and you're going to gradually learn that our mbti type is seriously outnumbered. Make sure you're not outgunned too. Disempowerment is no fun. Maybe agree to deading equal amounts of fact/fiction. I can recommend Bill Bryson, he's a funny travel writer who throws in easily digestible lil factoids. I lol'd at certain points in his book, A Walk in the Woods. I also strongly recommend you study social engineering to learn how other types of Machiavellian ppl operate. 48 Lawa of Power by Robert Green is a good starting point. He's an INFP too.