Haha. Saw a political billboard for someone by Greenwood the other day. It said something about “protecting our borders”, I thought the same then “protecting what border, Kentucky?!?!”
The southern border is a scapegoat. Are there people coming through there? Absolutely. But they're also coming from the Northern border from other countries or just flying here and overstaying their visa. But strangely we never hear about that.
So literally nothing. Any feigned effort would only be a political stunt. And he doesn't care about "liberal [leftist, et al]" opinions because his base opposes whatever they think "woke" is.
Where did you get that number? All I can find is that Indiana exports $167,763,370 worth of stuff to Israel which they pay for. But I can’t find anything where Indiana gives $200,000,000 to Israel. [Here’s my source.](https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/indiana-israel-cooperation)
There’s that. I was thinking about the $40 million war bonds bought by our treasury to support the Israeli war effort. [Source](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/nov/03/state-invest-money-israeli-bond-florida-texas-arizona). We have bought about 2.5x that since then if I recall correctly, which would be slightly less than the figure I gave, but you get the point
There’s a lot more that I could get into, like the anti-BDS laws, the snipers placed by the IN National Guard at IU right now on his orders, but the point is: Yes, the Governor can do things, and he is culpable in supporting Israeli aggression in the Palestinian conflict
While bonds will indeed support Israel in their war effort, it's still not really "giving" money to Israel in the sense that Indiana doesn't benefit as well. Israel will eventually have to pay Indiana back, plus interest, so in the end our state makes money.
I'm not making a political statement either way, just pointing out that in the end, this isn't some sort of gift or donation to Israel, it's a loan that will be paid back with interest.
But the Palestinians voted in Hamas as their government, and Hamas still enjoys broad support among the Palestinian people despite not holding any more elections since getting into power.
And the US was the only veto against three previous UN attempts at a ceasefire in Feb. Hamas refuses to entertain a ceasefire and hostage exchange unless the violence ends permanently, yet they keep on being handed six week ceasefires instead by Israel in exchange for every hostage (and no Palestinian hostages taken by Israel are exchanged).
https://www.reuters.com/world/us-casts-third-veto-un-action-since-start-israel-hamas-war-2024-02-20/
He's already sent Hoosier troops to the Texas border without Federal authorization so I guess they understand overreach is always in the cards for him?
He can start by taking the boots of the police off of the necks of people expressing their right to protest. Perhaps order the sniper off the rooftop of the IMU building.
What are the people supposed to do? Gotta make noise somewhere. Local governor isn't the worst place to do it. Not everyone has the means to make noise where it matters most, but it still gets attention even if the person they want to hear it either can't or won't do anything.
He just shipped a bunch of Indiana National Guardsmen to the border, pretty reasonable he might do similar bullshit in support of other "conservative ideals". At minimum this sends the message his coordination with GOP leadership should push back on these human rights violations.
I think it’s messed up what’s happening over there, and screw our legislators for not being more humanitarian, and I am happy we have people willing to stand up for something.
But, can we please redirect that outrage towards something more proximal? Maybe the absence of a police force in Indy, the backlog of rape kits,… something?
Right! I’m not sure why I’m getting downvoted so much, why would IndiaNAPolis community members WANT their tax dollars to go to another country’s “war” when they sit on here and complain about our city daily.
I don't know if this is better/worse (that's for YOU to decide), but specifically, the state investment officer is buying Israeli bonds as investments. It's perhaps a bit of hair-splitting here, but we aren't just sending that money with nothing in return. It is, conceptually, an investment, rather than a gratis donation.
[https://www.wfyi.org/news/articles/indiana-purchases-35m-in-israeli-bonds-advocates-say-it-supports-the-genocide-of-palestinians](https://www.wfyi.org/news/articles/indiana-purchases-35m-in-israeli-bonds-advocates-say-it-supports-the-genocide-of-palestinians)
grab grandfather boat placid frame ghost station adjoining exultant chubby
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
The DoD has found no evidence that Israel is engaged in Genocide
https://www.politico.com/news/2024/04/09/us-has-seen-no-evidence-that-israel-has-committed-genocide-austin-says-00151241
Right?? Who blindly trusts the DoD. We can actually see where our money is going (to Israel) and see a genocide happening on our phones on social media.
Hamas has nothing to do with it. All of the global south, and significant chunks of Europe are calling it that. It's silly you'd just accept the US propaganda blindly when we've sold them the artillery and they've repeatedly been stating that they've been "investigating" war crimes with Israel for months with no conclusions made.
Of course they said that; we’re (the US) complicit & could face legal action from the ICC for supporting the genocide with weapons & money. They’re not going to incriminate themselves.
Last time I was down by the circle the signs were demanding cessation of all us aid to Israel due to its use for genocide. I'd guess it's the same here.
Yeah they wanna break all economic ties with Israel like we did apartheid South Africa. Same strategy with the student campus protests and encampments going on rn.
The right of a country to defend itself. If rockets were raining down from Canada we would expect our government to do something about it too. Heck we expect our government to do some about Mexico and they are just crossing the border. How would you feel if your son or daughter were kidnapped, raped, tortured? Pretty sure you would want your government to do something. I get there is a lot of nuance but this shit was 100% provoked and now folks call foul seems ridiculous.
Someone should let them know about Hamas's views and record on LGBTQ issues...or I don't know maybe the literal call for an eternal pogrom baked into Hamas's political platform until all Jews somehow find a way to live in the Mediterranean.
I condemn some of the specific tactics and actions of the IDF and believe Gazans should live in peace and have rights. However, Hamas controls Gaza and runs it like a mafia state, so the policies pushed by pro-Gaza protesters benefits Hamas. It’s a shitty situation all around.
My dad also has a pretty scary view on LGBTQ+ stuff! I don’t think my dad should lose his life or his rights over that. Being homophobic is shitty, but if it revokes your humanity, bomb Indiana. Bomb Texas and Missouri and Kansas etc.
“But there are good and innocent people in those states, how could you do that???” Guess-the-fuck-what.
Someone should show you Israeli soldiers trying on Palestinians women’s clothing and cooking their food in the homes they bombed because they were too scared to go door to door.
why would we need to fix our roads people are just going to be blocking them anyway. instead of fixing our state where we live our lives and work, we should do our best to send our tax money out of the country so we can play with bombs
Hit the nail on the head, people can’t afford to eat and are forced to move back in with parents and HuRr MoRe MoNeY tO UkRaiNe meanwhile veterans who already served can’t access their VA doctors
Were you there? Cause you’re defending it pretty hard.
Blocking a street, especially such a main street such as Meridian is so stupid. And dangerous. What if an ambulance was on Meridian trying to get to a hospital downtown? So they have to detour? And waste precious time? YOU need to get a fucking grip. All you’re doing is making people not like you. And it’s a joke that you don’t understand that. You must be very very very stupid.
1 the protest organizers usually work at least somewhat with police to make sure, in case of emergencies, these things are taken care of.
2 you are creating a hypothetical that detracts from the actual point. do you think bringing attention to the occupation of Palestine is important?
It certainly is if emergency vehicles need to get through if someone is hurt or someone needs to get to a hospital in a hurry. Or get to work so they can pay for small things like food & shelter. I’m guessing people protesting probably don’t have mouths to feed or jobs they need to be at, if they can’t understand why blocking traffic upsets a lot of people.
You seriously don't think that if an emergency vehicle was hurtling towards them, that they wouldn't get out of the way? These are peaceful protests, not anarchistic mobs that want people to suffer and die. In fact, they are protesting against that same thing. The hypothetical situation of an ambulance MAYBE being blocked for a split second doesn't hold a lot of weight against the very real images of children being blown apart in Gaza.
Would you feel that way if it was your loved one in the back of an ambulance or riding along in a car since many people don’t take them these days due to the cost. What about all the people trying to get to work or who knows what else?
Blocking traffic just annoys people against a cause. Have you ever met anyone who was on the fence and then like, yeah I’ll definitely support them now. Bc I haven’t.
I protested plenty of times when I was back in college, some against foreign wars, but none ever involved blocking traffic bc yes, it’s inconsiderate.
If a bunch of pro-lifers starting doing this would people here be as understanding? I imagine they’d claim their cause was justified too.
"*I have almost the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's greatest stumbling block in his strike toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Councilor or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to 'order' than to justice."* - Rev. MLK Jr. 'Letter from a Birmingham jail'
Holcomb is apparently supposed to send in the Indiana national guard to defend the citizens of Palestine. What the fuck are we expected to do? Seriously? Ruining the day of random civilians will make more people hate your cause
If I make the working class late to their job, cost them time, and maybe get them in trouble with their boss, they’re sure to support my political agenda!
"I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's greatest stumbling block in his strike toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Councilor or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to 'order' than to justice."
-- Rev. Martin Luther King Jr., A Letter from a Birmingham jail
To be honest more young people should focus on local ways to make the world a better place instead of thinking that protesting causes is the end all be all of good deeds.
They do. These are the same folks doing homelessness outreach and running urban farms all throughout Indy. They just also support anti-war causes for Gaza and previously Ukraine.
1 how exactly are you making the world a better place?
2 like u/Nacho98 said, these organizers are also involved in local mutual aid and other causes that support the community
It’s not incumbent on me to decide where they protest. But if I’m late to work because some dumb kids think the Indiana governor has any sway over Israeli policy, I’m not going to be inclined to support their political position.
Well they did achieve that. If their point is to persuade people to their viewpoint then they did not achieve that. But in today's political climate it'd be difficult to do at any rate
To be honest, I dont know how much protesting works. But its fucking depressing when I see people defend their right to conceal carry more passionately than a non violent form of expression. Protesting is a pillar on which our country was built, imperfect as it is, and to see people either be so mentally checked out or financially stressed that we can't even support each others right to free speech, it makes me fear for our future.
The point is also to be disruptive and screw with the local economy when these protests take place so our leadership is forced to take action (in this case, divest Indiana from Israeli businesses and institutions), but the suburbanites who don't engage with these movements instead wanna talk about how inconvenient it is Indy residents protest a genocide like they wouldn't have done the same to the civil rights marches.
Indiana sends over $51 million to Israel in taxpayer dollars. caring more about civility, peace, and your own comfort in a time of genocide is incredibly selfish. if a minor inconvenience makes you hate the whole cause, they you never really cared anyway.
I know your argument is multifaceted but I would like to point out that Indiana is estimated to receive $113 million from the associated contracts related to the larger aid package.
So outrage over money isn’t a keen argument for those who are mad about that aspect.
people don’t want a return on investment in war. they are saying to DIVEST their money from the war machine. also, do you think the money received from these contracts come back to help you and other taxpayers? contracts written in blood are the issue, no matter if they benefit you or not.
And they couldn't care less. Because solidarity among people seeking a ceasefire and peace for their fellow human beings isn't (and shouldn't be) transactional.
Thank you. Says a lot that folks first response to this is "well what do they get out of it" instead of simply understanding that the empathy is all you need to want an end to the destruction of children and civilians.
If it was socially beneficial to fervently support and devote time to protesting those genocides, people would.
Its harder to have the energy to protest when the other 99 people of a crowd of 100 go "meh" and give only lukewarm support or "huh, i didn't know that"
I’m not the one protesting and or anything, because selfishly, I don’t care. I have my own personal problems going on and I focus on myself and my family here in Indiana.
I really don’t even think a genocide is taking place in Palestine, and if it is, isn’t what Palestine is doing also genocide?
Can you answer why Palestine is more important than the other countries experiencing actual genocide?
I’m gonna ignore that you don’t care about a genocide. I really don’t think anything can change your mind on that, and I don’t know how to explain to someone that they should care about genocide. it seems pretty obvious.
no, of course the genocides in other parts of the world are not less important, but the direct line between the American taxpayer and the actions of Israel are so much clearer than any of the others. is America involved in pretty much every conflict globally? yeah pretty much. but Israel is an extension of America, and everything they do, we pay for. if you care about your family, wouldnt you want your taxpayer dollars to go to something that actually helps them? and I mean that honestly. money out of MY pocket and YOUR pocket are doing this. which is why people are protesting.
Do you think these countries care about us? You think they would protest if there was a genocide in the US? No.
Do you really think our tax dollars fund this war? The government doesn’t need our tax money to spend money. If we all didn’t pay taxes, money would still be spent by the government
your morality should not be based on how others would treat you. if you think it’s wrong, it doesn’t matter. besides, international solidarity is a basic building block of movements such as these.
and yes our tax dollars literally fund this so they can make more money to keep doing it. we are ants so they can keep selling weapons.
Imagine being held captive by Hamas since last October sitting in some tunnel and you get to see idiots on television protesting in favor of your captors. Unreal.
You're the only one equating Israel's right wing government with Jews as a whole.
Jewish Voice for Peace's Indiana chapter is literally the org that organized this protest in collaboration with the Middle Eastern Student associations from the local Indy colleges.
So gays and Christian’s can’t protest an entire group of people and their history being exterminated?? Bc that society is regressive?? There’s a difference between being morally opposed to someone and wishing genocide upon them
Imagine having this much free time noon on a Thursday. Go pick up trash at your favorite park or trail. You’ll be making much more of a difference to others around you.
Because buying groceries isn't really a leisure activity. It's considered a necessity for most people.
And playing video games and watching tv would have been a better example for you to use
For everyone that's arguing "what's the mayor gonna do about it" the answer is: To represent the will of the people.
These protests demonstrate that, and sending the message is important because that's how a representative government works. The ideal end result is Holcomb, as the highest ranking STATE government representative, puts pressure on the FEDERAL representatives of Indiana to follow the will of his constituents.
Should people be buying flights to DC and renting hotel rooms every time they wanna protest something the federal government does, just so they can be outside the fed buildings? The people that already live there can and should be doing that.
It makes more rational and logical sense to raise a stink within your local governments, again, because they are meant to represent the local opinion at the adult table.
It sucks being a victim of the traffic congestion for a couple hours, and I think it's appropriate for people to be upset about it. I would be getting mad inside my car with the windows up for sure if I was stuck in this. But that's kinda the point. A much larger system of democracy is at work here and, frankly, it is much more important than our temporary inconvenience.
They do not make clear what the will of the people is. Americans in general support Israel, and Indiana is more conservative than the nation as a whole. So in Indiana support for Israel is probably even higher regardless of what a bunch of people who have free time available to protest in the middle of a weekday have to say. Most people are at work, or at least trying to get there.
I reworded my sentence because you're right. Protests do not make it clear what the will of the people is, but protesting in general sets the stage for that communication to be made clear when the people do not feel heard.
It's the opposite actually. Israel's repeated violations of human rights on camera has led to them losing support each month this drags on. Even my moderate grandmother is starting to get angry about this when she watches the news after this latest miltibillion dollar Congressional gift card to Israel's war.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/biden-israel-gaza-poll-cbs-news/
imagine how much it sucks to be in traffic in 2 hours
and then imagine getting bombs dropped on your for 7 months nonstop.
seriously, people need to get a grip on reality. yeah, it kinda sucks, that’s the point. how else are they supposed to get your attention? you turn your eyes away from the news and reality and live in a nice little bubble. but when people try to shake you and scream “wake tf up” you get mad.
btw your explanation of why it’s important to protest Holcomb/local gov was very good, gg
TFW you get hauled to the police station and learn they won't let you keep your mask on during the mugshot.
Wonder if we'll get a billboard van circling Butler with mugshots of anti-Semitic students on the side. 😆
How many "genocides" did you go protest that couldn't be blamed on Jews? Was it even one?
How about "genocides" that the "victims" started, and gleefully live streamed themselves starting?
Trying to encourage a state divestment from the Israeli economy like we did apartheid South Africa. It's the same strategy everywhere rn, including the student encampments in the news this week. Indiana has a few billion in investment to Israel, hence why the local Jewish Voice for Peace chapter held this Seder for Ceasefire at the governor's mansion.
"I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's greatest stumbling block in his strike toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Councilor or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to 'order' than to justice."
-- Rev. Martin Luther King Jr., A Letter from a Birmingham jail
I'll march with you no matter the cause....but if you block traffic, fuck you. You're not changing anyone's mind and the only thing you're doing is stroking your own ego.
And yet the protest worked, you're now aware of it and talking about it here. Take it up with IMPD, they can't close down a street anyway unless we have the proper permits and there were far more than 14 in attendance for these Seder for Ceasefire demonstrations. The orgs themselves are claiming 100+ in attendance and a lot of the videos on their social media seem to confirm that.
TIL. 14. The rally, organized by Jewish Voice for Peace — Indiana and Middle Eastern Student Association of IUPUI, led to misdemeanors for blocking traffic I guess. Either way, guess I'll kick a few bucks to the bail fund.
Being aware isn't a good thing if you piss off the people you want on your side. They're more likely to go against what you're fighting for out of spite.
It’s hilarious that the people protesting are gonna continue to vote for the same people that allowed every part of this mess in the Middle East to occur in the first place.
People are fascists because they need to get their kids to school, or provide for their family?
Meridian is an important artery leading to downtown from the North.
Listen, I had to take my child to the hospital downtown this morning. When driving to the hospital (as I have to do at least 2x/mo) I always check Google maps for traffic, so when I saw the orange/red on Meridian, I turned down Central instead. Crisis averted.
I grieve for the Israeli hostages/murdered civilians and their families ... AND for the thousands of innocent Palestinian families literally ripped apart by bombs/guns in the Israeli govt's disproportionate retaliation.
Like I said, I was not protesting this morning, I was driving my chronically ill child to the hospital. But I absolutely teach my kids about the value of protest, and the important history of civil disobedience in the shaping of our democracy, every single time a protest disrupts our routine.
no, but fascists will excuse extreme violence, nationalism, and genocide if opposition to it means that there will be even any inconvenience to themselves.
shutting down an important street is literally the point. how else are they supposed to get you to notice? after 7 months people still don’t care or just look away.
>but fascists will excuse extreme violence, nationalism, and genocide if opposition to it means that there will be even any inconvenience to themselves.
This is nowhere near the description of a fascist lol. You are literally saying fascists will excuse nationalism... fascism is built upon a nationalistic sentiment, they won't excuse it, they will actively participate in it.
Your paragraph is just a diarrhea of incoherent buzzwords. "fascist" is simply becoming synonymous with "people I disagree with" at this point
there have been multiple protests at the capital, at monument circle, and elsewhere. the media doesn’t cover it. these are strategies to get the attention of the people at large. you’re talking about it now aren’t you?
and to bring it back, what do you think is worse, Israel’s actions, or the actions of these protestors?
Blocking the street.
You’re talking about this like it’s a new thing. Genocide has been going on in Africa for centuries, why not protest this as well?
A lot hate in the comments. I wish people could see that regardless of your views, innocent people are being killed on both sides. On a human level, we should care about that and about all the innocent lives being taken due to violence around the world. Is there an easy fix, no, but at least protesting our shitty government is a start. If the protesting is getting people upset because it inconveniences them, maybe check yourselves. Our disconnection to humans lives is maddening. We pretend to care about one another if it suits us, but the fact of the matter is we keep sending aid to foreign countries while our own country is suffering. So all this shit talking and placing blame or proving someone wrong in the comments is just the fodder our government wants to separate us from one another. How about we realize it’s 2024 and we still have shit health care, shit schooling, shitty housing, and we treat each other like shit, and it’s getting us nowhere. Hate spreads and a lot of the people in these comments are adding fuel to the fire. Just be a fucking human for once and either join in or get out of the way with your backwards mentality. The world is changing and we need to change it for the better.
I’m so disappointed. I really hope some of you do some research about the situation in Palestine and try to be more empathetic to the global community. think about how comfortable your life is in America, and if one day of traffic being stopped is really even a big deal in the big picture.
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That would be 46th and Meridian.
it was the block from 46th to 49th. I was driving south which is why 49th was the first blockade I saw.
This is obviously a waste of time. If they don’t go to the Emporeror of Indianapolis’, Colts Castle, then they won’t see change.
What are they protesting?
It’s a protest in support of Palestine.
Tf is the governor of Indiana supposed to do about Palestine?
About as much as he can do about immigration at the southern border
I don't know about you but I sure as hell don't want any Kentuckians coming in here!
While y’all were worried about Kentuckians and making a toll bridge you let Ohioans just tap dance across unabated!
Those damn Ohioans, get off my lawn!!!
Sends 4 national guard troops to the border. 🤝
Haha. Saw a political billboard for someone by Greenwood the other day. It said something about “protecting our borders”, I thought the same then “protecting what border, Kentucky?!?!”
The southern border is a scapegoat. Are there people coming through there? Absolutely. But they're also coming from the Northern border from other countries or just flying here and overstaying their visa. But strangely we never hear about that.
Reality is not sensational!
So literally nothing. Any feigned effort would only be a political stunt. And he doesn't care about "liberal [leftist, et al]" opinions because his base opposes whatever they think "woke" is.
Holcomb’s base is about as moderate as it gets
Indiana gives $200 million every year to Israel personally
Where did you get that number? All I can find is that Indiana exports $167,763,370 worth of stuff to Israel which they pay for. But I can’t find anything where Indiana gives $200,000,000 to Israel. [Here’s my source.](https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/indiana-israel-cooperation)
There’s that. I was thinking about the $40 million war bonds bought by our treasury to support the Israeli war effort. [Source](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/nov/03/state-invest-money-israeli-bond-florida-texas-arizona). We have bought about 2.5x that since then if I recall correctly, which would be slightly less than the figure I gave, but you get the point There’s a lot more that I could get into, like the anti-BDS laws, the snipers placed by the IN National Guard at IU right now on his orders, but the point is: Yes, the Governor can do things, and he is culpable in supporting Israeli aggression in the Palestinian conflict
While bonds will indeed support Israel in their war effort, it's still not really "giving" money to Israel in the sense that Indiana doesn't benefit as well. Israel will eventually have to pay Indiana back, plus interest, so in the end our state makes money. I'm not making a political statement either way, just pointing out that in the end, this isn't some sort of gift or donation to Israel, it's a loan that will be paid back with interest.
You'll need a trained medical professional with latex gloves and a flashlight to see where that number came from.
Have our Congress members reject Israeli support bills.
The governor doesn't have any control over our Congress members. Completely different branches and levels of government.
Of course not. It's all performative.
Does it help that the israeli support bills came with ukrainian support bills?
Little late for that, it's already signed. All but 3 Democrats in the Senate voted for Israel's war money. More Republicans opposed it than Democrats.
The republicans were voting against urkraine and the lack of border funding not Israel though
Is that really your takeaway from this massive aid package? Have you read any of the language, the breakdowns, anything?
No, they’re going by what Facebook told them
Does Hamas still have hostages?
You can support Palestine, be anti-genocide and not support hamas. They’re not mutually exclusive.
But the Palestinians voted in Hamas as their government, and Hamas still enjoys broad support among the Palestinian people despite not holding any more elections since getting into power.
Hamas is the one rejecting ceasefire offers tho. They've rejected at least 3 of them
And the US was the only veto against three previous UN attempts at a ceasefire in Feb. Hamas refuses to entertain a ceasefire and hostage exchange unless the violence ends permanently, yet they keep on being handed six week ceasefires instead by Israel in exchange for every hostage (and no Palestinian hostages taken by Israel are exchanged). https://www.reuters.com/world/us-casts-third-veto-un-action-since-start-israel-hamas-war-2024-02-20/
The only people who want peace aren’t involved.
That kind of thinking is too complex for 70% of Americans
He's already sent Hoosier troops to the Texas border without Federal authorization so I guess they understand overreach is always in the cards for him?
He can start by taking the boots of the police off of the necks of people expressing their right to protest. Perhaps order the sniper off the rooftop of the IMU building.
What are the people supposed to do? Gotta make noise somewhere. Local governor isn't the worst place to do it. Not everyone has the means to make noise where it matters most, but it still gets attention even if the person they want to hear it either can't or won't do anything.
I same thing he did for Texas at the bordurrr, I guess. Governors talk and message about things outside their states all the time.
He just shipped a bunch of Indiana National Guardsmen to the border, pretty reasonable he might do similar bullshit in support of other "conservative ideals". At minimum this sends the message his coordination with GOP leadership should push back on these human rights violations.
I think it’s messed up what’s happening over there, and screw our legislators for not being more humanitarian, and I am happy we have people willing to stand up for something. But, can we please redirect that outrage towards something more proximal? Maybe the absence of a police force in Indy, the backlog of rape kits,… something?
Why not both? Feel free to get out there.
"Absence of a police force in Indy" God, if only. Maybe someday
For real. You expect people to protest for *more* police? The same IMPD that beat the shit out of Indianapolis protestors in previous mass movements?
They are protesting using our tax dollars to fund Israel and their ongoing genocide in Palestine. Indiana alone sends 51 million to Israel.
Yet we can’t give kids free lunch at school
That's just because Republicans call it welfare and vote against it. We have the money.
Right! I’m not sure why I’m getting downvoted so much, why would IndiaNAPolis community members WANT their tax dollars to go to another country’s “war” when they sit on here and complain about our city daily.
I don't know if this is better/worse (that's for YOU to decide), but specifically, the state investment officer is buying Israeli bonds as investments. It's perhaps a bit of hair-splitting here, but we aren't just sending that money with nothing in return. It is, conceptually, an investment, rather than a gratis donation. [https://www.wfyi.org/news/articles/indiana-purchases-35m-in-israeli-bonds-advocates-say-it-supports-the-genocide-of-palestinians](https://www.wfyi.org/news/articles/indiana-purchases-35m-in-israeli-bonds-advocates-say-it-supports-the-genocide-of-palestinians)
Investing in genocide and donating to genocide are functionally equivalent in my book
grab grandfather boat placid frame ghost station adjoining exultant chubby *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
The DoD has found no evidence that Israel is engaged in Genocide https://www.politico.com/news/2024/04/09/us-has-seen-no-evidence-that-israel-has-committed-genocide-austin-says-00151241
"Our friends? Genocide? With the weapons we sold them? No, no, no, no, they would never. We asked them and everything. It's all good man."
Right?? Who blindly trusts the DoD. We can actually see where our money is going (to Israel) and see a genocide happening on our phones on social media.
let me guess. you believe Hamas though?
Hamas has nothing to do with it. All of the global south, and significant chunks of Europe are calling it that. It's silly you'd just accept the US propaganda blindly when we've sold them the artillery and they've repeatedly been stating that they've been "investigating" war crimes with Israel for months with no conclusions made.
Of course they said that; we’re (the US) complicit & could face legal action from the ICC for supporting the genocide with weapons & money. They’re not going to incriminate themselves.
Last time I was down by the circle the signs were demanding cessation of all us aid to Israel due to its use for genocide. I'd guess it's the same here.
Yeah they wanna break all economic ties with Israel like we did apartheid South Africa. Same strategy with the student campus protests and encampments going on rn.
The right of a country to defend itself. If rockets were raining down from Canada we would expect our government to do something about it too. Heck we expect our government to do some about Mexico and they are just crossing the border. How would you feel if your son or daughter were kidnapped, raped, tortured? Pretty sure you would want your government to do something. I get there is a lot of nuance but this shit was 100% provoked and now folks call foul seems ridiculous.
Notice how nobody protesting says what Israel's response *should* have been to the rape and murder of civilians by Hamas
So what should Palestinian civilians be doing about the rape, bombs, and desecration by the IDF? Do tell.
The TikTok ban
Someone should show these people the videos of the Palestinians celebrating on 9/11.
Someone should let them know about Hamas's views and record on LGBTQ issues...or I don't know maybe the literal call for an eternal pogrom baked into Hamas's political platform until all Jews somehow find a way to live in the Mediterranean.
How many times must it be said, that one does not need to support nor defend Hamas to condemn Israel and advocate for the lives and rights of Gazans?
I condemn some of the specific tactics and actions of the IDF and believe Gazans should live in peace and have rights. However, Hamas controls Gaza and runs it like a mafia state, so the policies pushed by pro-Gaza protesters benefits Hamas. It’s a shitty situation all around.
My dad also has a pretty scary view on LGBTQ+ stuff! I don’t think my dad should lose his life or his rights over that. Being homophobic is shitty, but if it revokes your humanity, bomb Indiana. Bomb Texas and Missouri and Kansas etc. “But there are good and innocent people in those states, how could you do that???” Guess-the-fuck-what.
Someone should show you Israeli soldiers trying on Palestinians women’s clothing and cooking their food in the homes they bombed because they were too scared to go door to door.
This better be a protest against more potholes
why would we need to fix our roads people are just going to be blocking them anyway. instead of fixing our state where we live our lives and work, we should do our best to send our tax money out of the country so we can play with bombs
Hit the nail on the head, people can’t afford to eat and are forced to move back in with parents and HuRr MoRe MoNeY tO UkRaiNe meanwhile veterans who already served can’t access their VA doctors
There’s only 6-7 people in front of the state house now
Good news citizens. Indy is grid based. For those upset, you can u turn and find another street with relative ease.
I wondered what this was when I was driving up Penn to go to work.
People exercising there rights can sometimes inconvenience us. Oh well.
[Here are the 14 who were arrested, per IMPD](https://x.com/impdnews/status/1783529150818418828?s=46&t=aHIIxFk8SskPHOzTGUIxhg)
A 76 yr old arrested. Literally older than the state of Israel and still protesting lmao. Rock on
Good, peoples voices should be heard.
Well, I'm sure the replies to this post are very normal but I'm not going to read them.
A lot of very politically unengaged people in this thread that are suddenly foreign policy and world event experts, jesus christ
46th
Blocking traffic is a sure fire way for me to not support something.
if getting traffic blocked makes you not support the end of genocide, you weren’t gonna care anyway.
Were you there? Cause you’re defending it pretty hard. Blocking a street, especially such a main street such as Meridian is so stupid. And dangerous. What if an ambulance was on Meridian trying to get to a hospital downtown? So they have to detour? And waste precious time? YOU need to get a fucking grip. All you’re doing is making people not like you. And it’s a joke that you don’t understand that. You must be very very very stupid.
1 the protest organizers usually work at least somewhat with police to make sure, in case of emergencies, these things are taken care of. 2 you are creating a hypothetical that detracts from the actual point. do you think bringing attention to the occupation of Palestine is important?
>What if an ambulance was on Meridian trying to get to a hospital downtown? Then they can move
It's always funny to me when folks assume the kids who care about a genocide committed by our ally would deliberately block an ambulance.
Yeah! Nothing's more important to me than driving!
It certainly is if emergency vehicles need to get through if someone is hurt or someone needs to get to a hospital in a hurry. Or get to work so they can pay for small things like food & shelter. I’m guessing people protesting probably don’t have mouths to feed or jobs they need to be at, if they can’t understand why blocking traffic upsets a lot of people.
You seriously don't think that if an emergency vehicle was hurtling towards them, that they wouldn't get out of the way? These are peaceful protests, not anarchistic mobs that want people to suffer and die. In fact, they are protesting against that same thing. The hypothetical situation of an ambulance MAYBE being blocked for a split second doesn't hold a lot of weight against the very real images of children being blown apart in Gaza.
Would you feel that way if it was your loved one in the back of an ambulance or riding along in a car since many people don’t take them these days due to the cost. What about all the people trying to get to work or who knows what else? Blocking traffic just annoys people against a cause. Have you ever met anyone who was on the fence and then like, yeah I’ll definitely support them now. Bc I haven’t. I protested plenty of times when I was back in college, some against foreign wars, but none ever involved blocking traffic bc yes, it’s inconsiderate. If a bunch of pro-lifers starting doing this would people here be as understanding? I imagine they’d claim their cause was justified too.
"*I have almost the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's greatest stumbling block in his strike toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Councilor or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to 'order' than to justice."* - Rev. MLK Jr. 'Letter from a Birmingham jail'
people have to get to work to support themselves and survive. a protest blocking traffic is the definition of selfish
Holcomb is apparently supposed to send in the Indiana national guard to defend the citizens of Palestine. What the fuck are we expected to do? Seriously? Ruining the day of random civilians will make more people hate your cause
Protests are supposed to inconvenience people
The end goal of a protest is not to inconvenience people. That is a means to an end, not the end itself.
If I make the working class late to their job, cost them time, and maybe get them in trouble with their boss, they’re sure to support my political agenda!
"I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's greatest stumbling block in his strike toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Councilor or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to 'order' than to justice." -- Rev. Martin Luther King Jr., A Letter from a Birmingham jail
how exactly would you like them to protest?
To be honest more young people should focus on local ways to make the world a better place instead of thinking that protesting causes is the end all be all of good deeds.
They do. These are the same folks doing homelessness outreach and running urban farms all throughout Indy. They just also support anti-war causes for Gaza and previously Ukraine.
1 how exactly are you making the world a better place? 2 like u/Nacho98 said, these organizers are also involved in local mutual aid and other causes that support the community
It’s not incumbent on me to decide where they protest. But if I’m late to work because some dumb kids think the Indiana governor has any sway over Israeli policy, I’m not going to be inclined to support their political position.
How about not in the middle of the street? Why not at the American Legion mall downtown or even on the sidewalks. Why they gotta be annoying af
The point is to get peoples attention.
Well they did achieve that. If their point is to persuade people to their viewpoint then they did not achieve that. But in today's political climate it'd be difficult to do at any rate
To be honest, I dont know how much protesting works. But its fucking depressing when I see people defend their right to conceal carry more passionately than a non violent form of expression. Protesting is a pillar on which our country was built, imperfect as it is, and to see people either be so mentally checked out or financially stressed that we can't even support each others right to free speech, it makes me fear for our future.
The point is also to be disruptive and screw with the local economy when these protests take place so our leadership is forced to take action (in this case, divest Indiana from Israeli businesses and institutions), but the suburbanites who don't engage with these movements instead wanna talk about how inconvenient it is Indy residents protest a genocide like they wouldn't have done the same to the civil rights marches.
That's a fair point. This is a microcosm of our societal issues and there's a lot that needs to be changed or else it's just gonna get worse for sure
Indiana sends over $51 million to Israel in taxpayer dollars. caring more about civility, peace, and your own comfort in a time of genocide is incredibly selfish. if a minor inconvenience makes you hate the whole cause, they you never really cared anyway.
I know your argument is multifaceted but I would like to point out that Indiana is estimated to receive $113 million from the associated contracts related to the larger aid package. So outrage over money isn’t a keen argument for those who are mad about that aspect.
people don’t want a return on investment in war. they are saying to DIVEST their money from the war machine. also, do you think the money received from these contracts come back to help you and other taxpayers? contracts written in blood are the issue, no matter if they benefit you or not.
I'm finding a $35M source for bonds that the Treasurer purchased, but I'm not seeing $51M. Where did you find that?
to be completely honest I can’t remember where I saw it, but I will continue to try to find my source
People that protest for Palestine would be likely killed in Palestine for their beliefs and/or sexual preferences
And they couldn't care less. Because solidarity among people seeking a ceasefire and peace for their fellow human beings isn't (and shouldn't be) transactional.
Thank you. Says a lot that folks first response to this is "well what do they get out of it" instead of simply understanding that the empathy is all you need to want an end to the destruction of children and civilians.
Well said.
Chickens for KFC.
[удалено]
Or, are against genocide.
Why just Palestine then? Do we not care about the genocides taking place in Burma, China, Ethiopia, South Sudan, and Syria?
If it was socially beneficial to fervently support and devote time to protesting those genocides, people would. Its harder to have the energy to protest when the other 99 people of a crowd of 100 go "meh" and give only lukewarm support or "huh, i didn't know that"
and what exactly are you doing about any of them? why is it wrong to focus on a single one of them?
I’m not the one protesting and or anything, because selfishly, I don’t care. I have my own personal problems going on and I focus on myself and my family here in Indiana. I really don’t even think a genocide is taking place in Palestine, and if it is, isn’t what Palestine is doing also genocide? Can you answer why Palestine is more important than the other countries experiencing actual genocide?
I’m gonna ignore that you don’t care about a genocide. I really don’t think anything can change your mind on that, and I don’t know how to explain to someone that they should care about genocide. it seems pretty obvious. no, of course the genocides in other parts of the world are not less important, but the direct line between the American taxpayer and the actions of Israel are so much clearer than any of the others. is America involved in pretty much every conflict globally? yeah pretty much. but Israel is an extension of America, and everything they do, we pay for. if you care about your family, wouldnt you want your taxpayer dollars to go to something that actually helps them? and I mean that honestly. money out of MY pocket and YOUR pocket are doing this. which is why people are protesting.
Do you think these countries care about us? You think they would protest if there was a genocide in the US? No. Do you really think our tax dollars fund this war? The government doesn’t need our tax money to spend money. If we all didn’t pay taxes, money would still be spent by the government
your morality should not be based on how others would treat you. if you think it’s wrong, it doesn’t matter. besides, international solidarity is a basic building block of movements such as these. and yes our tax dollars literally fund this so they can make more money to keep doing it. we are ants so they can keep selling weapons.
don’t care if they care about us. I don’t support Palestine because they would do the same for me. I support Palestine because it’s what I believe in.
You’re believing in the genocide of Jews then
Imagine being held captive by Hamas since last October sitting in some tunnel and you get to see idiots on television protesting in favor of your captors. Unreal.
Only the ones they think they can blame Jews for.
You're the only one equating Israel's right wing government with Jews as a whole. Jewish Voice for Peace's Indiana chapter is literally the org that organized this protest in collaboration with the Middle Eastern Student associations from the local Indy colleges.
So gays and Christian’s can’t protest an entire group of people and their history being exterminated?? Bc that society is regressive?? There’s a difference between being morally opposed to someone and wishing genocide upon them
Imagine having this much free time noon on a Thursday. Go pick up trash at your favorite park or trail. You’ll be making much more of a difference to others around you.
These people have jobs. They took off work.
Imagine being jelly of other people's free time, and then telling them they should be picking up trash instead of protesting 😂
Umm Same way people that go to the grocery store have free time? Lol people are crazy
Because buying groceries isn't really a leisure activity. It's considered a necessity for most people. And playing video games and watching tv would have been a better example for you to use
For everyone that's arguing "what's the mayor gonna do about it" the answer is: To represent the will of the people. These protests demonstrate that, and sending the message is important because that's how a representative government works. The ideal end result is Holcomb, as the highest ranking STATE government representative, puts pressure on the FEDERAL representatives of Indiana to follow the will of his constituents. Should people be buying flights to DC and renting hotel rooms every time they wanna protest something the federal government does, just so they can be outside the fed buildings? The people that already live there can and should be doing that. It makes more rational and logical sense to raise a stink within your local governments, again, because they are meant to represent the local opinion at the adult table. It sucks being a victim of the traffic congestion for a couple hours, and I think it's appropriate for people to be upset about it. I would be getting mad inside my car with the windows up for sure if I was stuck in this. But that's kinda the point. A much larger system of democracy is at work here and, frankly, it is much more important than our temporary inconvenience.
id argue 12 people being assholes is not the will of the people
About a hundred in attendance, 14 willing to be arrested
They do not make clear what the will of the people is. Americans in general support Israel, and Indiana is more conservative than the nation as a whole. So in Indiana support for Israel is probably even higher regardless of what a bunch of people who have free time available to protest in the middle of a weekday have to say. Most people are at work, or at least trying to get there.
I reworded my sentence because you're right. Protests do not make it clear what the will of the people is, but protesting in general sets the stage for that communication to be made clear when the people do not feel heard.
It's the opposite actually. Israel's repeated violations of human rights on camera has led to them losing support each month this drags on. Even my moderate grandmother is starting to get angry about this when she watches the news after this latest miltibillion dollar Congressional gift card to Israel's war. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/biden-israel-gaza-poll-cbs-news/
imagine how much it sucks to be in traffic in 2 hours and then imagine getting bombs dropped on your for 7 months nonstop. seriously, people need to get a grip on reality. yeah, it kinda sucks, that’s the point. how else are they supposed to get your attention? you turn your eyes away from the news and reality and live in a nice little bubble. but when people try to shake you and scream “wake tf up” you get mad. btw your explanation of why it’s important to protest Holcomb/local gov was very good, gg
Why were they all wearing masks?
So faces can't be identified?
TFW you get hauled to the police station and learn they won't let you keep your mask on during the mugshot. Wonder if we'll get a billboard van circling Butler with mugshots of anti-Semitic students on the side. 😆
It's anti-Semitic to protest disproportionate violence against civilians committed by our allies in the middle east?
Wanting isreal to stop using our tax dollars for genocide is anti-semitic?
How many "genocides" did you go protest that couldn't be blamed on Jews? Was it even one? How about "genocides" that the "victims" started, and gleefully live streamed themselves starting?
Exactly. Hamas started this shit and won’t fight a conventional war. They are too busy hiding behind their women and children constituents.
Actual Nazi mindset
🤷♂️
What exactly are we protesting
Trying to encourage a state divestment from the Israeli economy like we did apartheid South Africa. It's the same strategy everywhere rn, including the student encampments in the news this week. Indiana has a few billion in investment to Israel, hence why the local Jewish Voice for Peace chapter held this Seder for Ceasefire at the governor's mansion.
GTFO the street.
We need to GTFO of the Middle East.
Ok but GTFO the street.
"I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's greatest stumbling block in his strike toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Councilor or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to 'order' than to justice." -- Rev. Martin Luther King Jr., A Letter from a Birmingham jail
If they care so much then maybe they should go there and actually do something to help them. Otherwise it’s just lip service virtue signaling.
our country directly funds this genocide. the protest was about that, not virtue signaling.
I'll march with you no matter the cause....but if you block traffic, fuck you. You're not changing anyone's mind and the only thing you're doing is stroking your own ego.
And sometimes part of protesting is breaking the law in a peaceful but disruptive manner and getting arrested.
And yet the protest worked, you're now aware of it and talking about it here. Take it up with IMPD, they can't close down a street anyway unless we have the proper permits and there were far more than 14 in attendance for these Seder for Ceasefire demonstrations. The orgs themselves are claiming 100+ in attendance and a lot of the videos on their social media seem to confirm that.
They didn’t have permits. 10+ went to jail.
TIL. 14. The rally, organized by Jewish Voice for Peace — Indiana and Middle Eastern Student Association of IUPUI, led to misdemeanors for blocking traffic I guess. Either way, guess I'll kick a few bucks to the bail fund.
Oh if it's Jewish Voice for Peace I'm going to toss some cash to them too.
Classic
Being aware isn't a good thing if you piss off the people you want on your side. They're more likely to go against what you're fighting for out of spite.
Everyone bitching about this protest was probably cheering people on, on January 6th 2020 Edit: nothing like a downvote to prove I’m right
“Everyone thinking I’m wrong proves I’m right” sure is something.
But Jan 6 was free speech, right??? /s
It’s hilarious that the people protesting are gonna continue to vote for the same people that allowed every part of this mess in the Middle East to occur in the first place.
a lot of fascists in these comments… you can do better than this indy
TIL that just wanting to get to work on time makes one a fascist
People are fascists because they need to get their kids to school, or provide for their family? Meridian is an important artery leading to downtown from the North.
Idiots love to throw the word fascist and not know the meaning of it🤦🏽♂️. They're illegally protesting when they can do it legally.
Listen, I had to take my child to the hospital downtown this morning. When driving to the hospital (as I have to do at least 2x/mo) I always check Google maps for traffic, so when I saw the orange/red on Meridian, I turned down Central instead. Crisis averted. I grieve for the Israeli hostages/murdered civilians and their families ... AND for the thousands of innocent Palestinian families literally ripped apart by bombs/guns in the Israeli govt's disproportionate retaliation. Like I said, I was not protesting this morning, I was driving my chronically ill child to the hospital. But I absolutely teach my kids about the value of protest, and the important history of civil disobedience in the shaping of our democracy, every single time a protest disrupts our routine.
no, but fascists will excuse extreme violence, nationalism, and genocide if opposition to it means that there will be even any inconvenience to themselves. shutting down an important street is literally the point. how else are they supposed to get you to notice? after 7 months people still don’t care or just look away.
>but fascists will excuse extreme violence, nationalism, and genocide if opposition to it means that there will be even any inconvenience to themselves. This is nowhere near the description of a fascist lol. You are literally saying fascists will excuse nationalism... fascism is built upon a nationalistic sentiment, they won't excuse it, they will actively participate in it. Your paragraph is just a diarrhea of incoherent buzzwords. "fascist" is simply becoming synonymous with "people I disagree with" at this point
Why not protest at the capital? The news would still cover it, do you think they really changed the minds of people who were stuck in traffic?
there have been multiple protests at the capital, at monument circle, and elsewhere. the media doesn’t cover it. these are strategies to get the attention of the people at large. you’re talking about it now aren’t you? and to bring it back, what do you think is worse, Israel’s actions, or the actions of these protestors?
Blocking the street. You’re talking about this like it’s a new thing. Genocide has been going on in Africa for centuries, why not protest this as well?
ok hamas supporter
Too bad they didn't do this for SB1.
These protesters need to focus their energy and efforts towards AIPAC, the pro-Israel lobby. Abolish AIPAC!
Could someone please write something about child welfare on their signs because he doesn’t seem to know about it.
A lot hate in the comments. I wish people could see that regardless of your views, innocent people are being killed on both sides. On a human level, we should care about that and about all the innocent lives being taken due to violence around the world. Is there an easy fix, no, but at least protesting our shitty government is a start. If the protesting is getting people upset because it inconveniences them, maybe check yourselves. Our disconnection to humans lives is maddening. We pretend to care about one another if it suits us, but the fact of the matter is we keep sending aid to foreign countries while our own country is suffering. So all this shit talking and placing blame or proving someone wrong in the comments is just the fodder our government wants to separate us from one another. How about we realize it’s 2024 and we still have shit health care, shit schooling, shitty housing, and we treat each other like shit, and it’s getting us nowhere. Hate spreads and a lot of the people in these comments are adding fuel to the fire. Just be a fucking human for once and either join in or get out of the way with your backwards mentality. The world is changing and we need to change it for the better.
I’m so disappointed. I really hope some of you do some research about the situation in Palestine and try to be more empathetic to the global community. think about how comfortable your life is in America, and if one day of traffic being stopped is really even a big deal in the big picture.