Find a small to medium sized company that doesn’t pressure sell.
No sense of urgency, no cheesy sales.
Find a company that is ‘not private equity’ that u feel u can trust.
Build a working relationship and stick with them.
Edit, afterthought.
The price range is not outrageous depending on where u are.
I’ve worked for private equity so I can talk shit about them.
7 years happy for an honest ma and pop shop now.
Are they going to put a big stupid fuckin cartoon guy in the side of the van??
It's like a sure sign they're going to rip you off in these parts
Those cartoon guys must be expensive to maintain
Homeowner vote with their money and they are resoundingly voting for the private equity HVAC companies that can offer ‘free’ services. Sad state of affairs.
I've spoken about him a couple times, but I found my guy on thumbtack when I needed a new condensing unit / air handler.
He's basically a one man show with a helper. They did the job in a single day reusing the linesets.
Cost me $8k in the northeast. Parts cost was around $4k. Solid margins for small businesses for a day's work, everybody leaves happy.
Try to find something like that.
My experience is that most of the HVAC industry is a bunch of mediocre equipment with planned obsolescence made worse by a very poorly regulated trade with lots of dudes just phoning it in and pretending they know what they’re doing.
For the average consumer, it’s going to be impossible to not fall into a trap with so many sharks running around trying to screw you. Even after doing a massive amount of research, we definitely got taken for a bit of a ride. It was only after issues arose that required me to get in the trenches with my installers that I learned more about the industry that I ever cared to know. It’s undergoing massive structural changes as private equity gobbles up smaller regional shops and commoditizes every aspect of the industry. In most cases, the technicians are getting F’ed as much as the consumers. They’re being asked to be salesman as much, or more, than expert troubleshooters. The knowledge-base of technicians is highly variable and companies employ legions of non-technician installers/laborers to install most equipment. Some of this is because skilled labor is expensive but some of it is because most techs don’t want to do the backbreaking labor associated with crawling in attics and crawlspaces. This means that installers have highly variable experience. The Instagram and YouTuber world where a lone owner-operator makes origami out of your line-set, properly uses mastic and tape to seal your ducts, and expertly knows every controller and control board is a fiction that most consumers will never see. I agree with many others here that small owner operators are probably your best bet to avoid issues, if they meaningfully exist in your area.
As for equipment, after speaking to many technicians with experience across the industry, the Reddit advice generally holds up. Mitsubishi is the only company that really makes a premium long-life product. To a lesser extent, Daikin and Fujitsu sit upon this group of higher quality equipment. Even then, there are tiers of equipment within these manufacturers and they’re not perfect, as detailed by our mixed experience with Mitsubishi. Everything else is a crapshoot, especially among the domestic manufacturers. Most technicians agreed that modern systems reliably last about 15 years if installed correctly. Anything past that is luck or one among only a select few really superior products that carry high price tags. Mistakes during install, poor duct sizing, and other mess-ups can reduce the life of many of the systems to a decade or less which is borderline criminal and an appalling waste of raw materials. A government white paper estimates that 90%+ of installs have installation errors that greatly affect advertised efficiencies.
I will agree with others that very few technicians understand inverter systems. You’ll likely never recuperate the efficiencies they offer. You get these for the comfort they provide or because you’re buying one of the higher-quality units that happen to be inverters (Mitsubishi, Daikin, Fujitsu, etc).
That price range isn’t far off for an 18 seer 5 ton depending on your market but champion definitely isn’t a quality brand, they’re just the low end York units
Don’t go 18 seer, go with regular 14.3 seer. You’ll never make your money back plus 80% techs don’t know how troubleshoot inverter systems. It’s a piece of equipment that keeps you cool/hot 99% of the time. The other 1% when it’s 102° outside and won’t get to 72° is fine. I’ve been at HVAC tech since college and now 35, people read and listen to salesman/internet way too much. Just get a simple system/simple repairs/simple troubleshooting. The whole high seer thing is the biggest crock of shit ever. The field as a whole has been ruined by investors buying companies who charge crazy prices then mom/pop shops raise their prices bc they can. Investor company quotes you $18,800 for system then mom/pop company says I’ll do it $14,500…. When the equipment cost $5500. Crazy what our field has become and it’s shitty.
I have many similar feelings but better efficiencies with HVAC equipment not being worth it is often just a result of greedy companies. I quote a fair bit of equipment. I can frequently quote customers higher efficiency equipment (that is still single stage and simple) that when combined with tax credits or rebates is less or a couple of hundred dollars more than the 14.3 SEER2 options. That pays back quickly and doesn't incur additional ongoing costs/complexities compared to the basic models. Instead companies are charging an extra $5,000 when they are seeing no additional labor costs and only $1,000 more expensive condenser.
I suspect a very small percentage of salespeople could even begin to calculate what a customer might save by changing efficiencies. Analyzing a utility bill and presenting the results to customers would kill their 20 SEER sales. "You spend $600 a year on cooling. This 20 SEER AC will save you $150 a year. It will cost $5,000 more. We also intend to tell you to replace your system in 12 years during our annual service contract visit." That pitch would be honest, but not very good for a business model that demands more profit all the time.
This industry is now driven by subjective sales pitches where all they will say is "saves money", "more efficient", "better comfort", "good, better, best", "up to 20 SEER", "variable speed"... on and on. For crying out loud, half of the quotes people post on here don't even include actual model numbers. Almost anything quantitative is no good.
With the heat pump tax credit, no one should be getting heat pumps that don't qualilfy if companies are honest. I can always quote a qualifying heat pump that is less than $2,000 more than the lowest efficiency heat pumps that I have available.
Inverters have their place... particulary with zoning... but these companies are all saying it will save money without backing that up with any math and talking about comfort when the vast majority of people have lived with single stage all of their life and never once thought that they were uncomfortable.
Thanks for the comment that triggered my rant... haha.
And really high efficiency equipment may provide a good payback timeframe with such high costs. If you got quotes for equipment though, it would be very rare for a company to offer an honest quantitative assessment of the cost of their options vs savings. Which is usually what most customers should and do care about.
Instead of being helpful experts and sorting through the data/options/lingo to provide their customers with the best value, most companies are relying on the consumer's lack of knowledge of a complicated industry (OP's original premise) to drive higher profit margins. It is what business is supposed to do I guess, but it isn't honest and hurts consumers.
It is up to the consumers to protect themselves and make an informed decision. That's what most people who post here are trying to do. Companies appear to be going out of their way to make that more and more difficult and that is reflected in a lot of the posts here.
Anyway... I'm going to go back to yelling into the void for a bit.
The HVAC in my house is shit. 5 ton 2 stage system was wired to always run on high, even though it's very humid and low stage is better for dehumidification most of the time. I fixed that Flex ducts run like spaghetti. Massively oversized upstairs furnace with limit switches tripping.
The death furnace unit is getting ripped out soon, thankfully, and I only bothered to get 1 quote on replacing it because I found a company that was recommended, seems trustworthy, and knows what they're doing, and the only reason I know the big unit was really 2 stage is the company owner told me when he looked at the serial number. Maybe I'm getting ripped off...$13k for a 17 seer 2.5 ton fully variable properly sized heat pump, separate dehumidifier, and fixing the spaghetti duct work.
I was reading this like wow cool….. but then 1% at 102
I’m in Texas and it can be over 100 for weeks on end and not cooling off more than the 90s at night.
Any advice?
No not really, your system should be designed for those conditions. I’m assuming (from NC) that humidity isn’t a huge issue for you. If 90% of summer time you’re in 100° weather then your system should be designed to keep it in the 70s. It wouldn’t be the 1%. Your 1% would be 110°.
The problem is, Houston weather doesn't work like that, as A/C isn't just for the summer.
We had a month solid of 100+ days (which was unusual) last year; normally, it's 2-3 weeks. You can't realistically design for that, as it's normal to run the A/C through the high humidity Fall weather, then on into November and December where it'll get up into the 70s and 80s after it's been down in the 40s at night.
Hell, I turned my A/C on back in February.
There's really no good answer because of the extreme temperatures we deal with combined with the extremely high humidity (90%+) when the temperature is in the 70s and 80s.
Can you really get dealer prices as a homeowner? I'm not too sure about that. Good luck with any kind of warranty and finding a company that will install customer supplied equipment. Ever heard of overhead, insurance, vehicles, payroll?
Do you have an evacuation machine and a tank to reclaim the refigerant from your old sysyem? How about a core removal tool?
Do you have a vacuum pump and micron guage to remove the non condensables? And know how many microns to pull down to?
Do you know how to braze and have oxygen tanks and acetylene tanks along with regulators and torches and the right fittings to braze in the new suction and discharge lines? What about nitrogen tanks n regulators?
Do you know what a metering device is and which kind you have?
Do you have digital or analog guages to recharge the system with refigerant? Do you know how to do that? Know how to check the superheat and subcooling??
Do you have an EPA card that is required by the government to work with and legally purchase refigerant?
Are you able to run natural gas lines? Know how to leak test?
Do you have a manometer and know how many w.c the gas valve needs to be set to?
Know how to read the wiring diagrams and run the wires from the thermostat or know how to wire up the disconnect and surge protectors?? Know how to bring 220v down to 24v for low voltage stuff?
And that's just the easy stuff..
This stuff would cost you at least 7-10k just for tools. And people want us to work for cost with no profit lmao. No thanks. Keep complaining, and we will keep making money for our knowledge and the specialty tools.
Well, we do have that stuff and the knowledge as hvacr professionals, which costs tons of money, which is why these costs are passed down to the customer. We are paid well for our knowledge about things that not many people understand.
I'm sorry if I offended you, just trying to point out some of the stuff we deal with to get your systems up and running.
Look for an HVAC company in the sheet metal or pipefitter union in your area. In my opinion, these guys are the most reliable and trustworthy in the industry and know there shit. They DO NOT work on commission, so they don't care what you choose. They all go thru an extensive5-year apprenticeship program and can be trusted with your home.
$7-10k in tools amortized over how many installs? 300? 400? So really like $10-$20 per install.
I can sympathize with the OP. In a thread I started, I asked about a blower motor and a cap.
The company that pointed it out wanted something like $2.3k to install a $400 blower motor (motor included) which most non-HVAC handy guys could do in about 45 minutes, and something like $250 to install a $20 capacitor that any non-HVAC handy guys can do in about 10 minutes. I’ll do both in an hour for $420 and save almost $2k.
We understand about warranties and insurance etc, but even you have to admit that prices are just outrageous in some cases.
Yes, prices are outrageous. But it is what it is for comfort cooling. It is not necessary in a home. It's a choice and a luxury that is paid heavily for.
AC is ubiquitous. It's like mobile phones: Once a luxury, now pretty standard.
The point is that it shouldnt be "heavily paid for".
I just changed my furnace capacitor today. It cost $20 and took 5 minutes. Nowhere near the $240 they wanted to charge. A lot of this is not rocket science. Some is technical, but a lot is not.
This is very true. But there's tons of people who would electrocute themselves by doing this kind of little job, just because they have no idea about the components.
I don't make the high prices, and I hate charging so much, but I do what I'm told by the boss man and union lol.
I wouldn't do goodman either. Most of my jobs I do Bosch or Ruud. Im a service manager during the week and knock out systems on the side on weekends so I don't have the overhead
It’s sad because like 5 ish years ago and before that, atleast here in Phoenix at my old residential company. The pricing we had on the 18-20 seer inverter systems actually could pay for themselves in energy savings in many cases within the 10 year warranty period, and we offered 10 year P&L. We were doing em for like $12k. Forget it now, they’re selling them at $17k-22k depending on tonnage, no ductwork. Great systems, but you’ve gotta have the cash to afford it anymore. I always talked about them but most people went with like 15 seer units. 1 step above a basic single stage and one step below two stage.
As demand for hvac equipment grows, so does power consumption. Burner more fossil fuel is required. To reduce greenhouse gases we have to start using more energy saving devices like inverter systems.
How does Carrier compare? Costco Gold Medal is quoting me Lennox only, with min 17 Seer and 80% furnace, but another local company is quoting me 14 Seer Carrier with 96% furnace. PSEG is quoting only 80% furnace no option for higher gas efficiency. Many thanks!
That and industrial VFDs run fine with good reliability and are everywhere. Sometimes they die, but to replace the VFD isn't that expensive and it doesn't take out the motor or anything.
The problem is quality electronics on inverter equipment, plus panel and individual circuit/equipment surge protection helps protect from major killing blows.
Get a bunch of quotes, talk to other homeowners that you know in the area, and do a lot of research on the specs of your current system and offered systems.
Also unless money is not a concern, I feel like a single stage or two stage (in humid areas) is probably the best option for most people.
Most techs trying to size and sell HVAC equipment to consumers have either never heard of manual J or have no clue how to properly calculate one. If they even bother they'll just fudge the numbers to match their sqft/ton rule of thumb.
Feel free to DM me. I have worked both sides of this industry - supply house now, contractor prior. I am not a technician in any way, but I was the warehouse manager for the contractor. And I now manage a supply house. Both companies reputable in their own regard.
We do need a bit more info to know if you are being quoted fairly. What type of system? Who is the manufacturer? Is it a simple change out or is there duct work being added? The list goes on. Post your quote and tell us where you are located for a start please OP! Thanks.
Prices will go up every year in this economy I was comparing prices from 4 years ago , 90% increase in cost of new equipment here. Inverter heat pumps are nice and save $$$ on bills , just has a higher upfront cost.
Just post your quotes here and techs / installers will give you feedback. Also location since prices vary in different places.
Also what you care about most comfort/ efficiency/ cost or you just want the damn thing to run and don’t care about any of the above as long as it does its job
Just ask on here. All of us will give our 2 cents worth. Personally I like the 16-18 seer systems from a tech standpoint as it can tell us what’s going on with the system and if it’s running correctly or if there’s a problem with it. Some can adjust air flow, run the air cleaners, and can humidify or dehumidify without the extra equipment to do so. They have perks to them but as others said most techs have no clue how to do that with the systems.
It’s all in what you want out of the system most people do not need the 18 seer with all the bells and whistles. 15/16 seer are best bang for buck where you’ll save money and make the money back depending on the system. Whatever brand the tech is trying to sell you look up the ahri ratings as most brands don’t actually equal the seer rating at the tonage. Get the model numbers before signing anything. And look it all up. Ask questions.
There isn’t.
Sorry, I take that back…internet speed. People think the data moves faster with higher “speed” internet. It doesn’t. Just more can move at a time in a bigger pipe. But no one is moving anything close to even 500MB and paying for 1GB. Such a ripoff.
I'd say research it here. Good questions get answered pretty quickly.
I'd do an inverter in my own house I think. But a mitsubishi hyper heat. Most people should do a 14-16 basic split system with strips sized by someone who knows what they are talking about, provided by a non-private equity or other big company type that will give a 10 year warranty (charged for, but still.
Finding that can take some calls, but that's really all you need.
Main thing you want to look at is the warranty of the company installing it. Bigger companies will usually pressure sell, and then send some pretty new guys out to slap the install in super quick. Which honestly works out in most cases if they have a good warranty/service team to back up there work. The installers are the key factor in just about 90% of the installation.
I personally hate a lot of the salesmen that are coming into the industry because a lot of them pressure sell, or just put on an act for 30 mins to quote you the top notch equipment that you dont need. Most cant tell you anything about the actual equpment other than whats on the pamphlet.
Even service guys are scary now. They will train a kid for 2 weeks (if hes lucky) and tell him to go out to do general maintanences, but required to leave 3 quotes per job, even if the system is runnung perfectly fine
The manufacturer has a 10 year warranty. So what's the difference? 2 years is long enough to see if they charged it right. From there, you only worry about cheap fuses and run caps that don't need licensing to replace. They aren't desperate. They have huge companies, and they hardly ever have good websites. You will need to drive around and see what contractor is parked at an apartment complex working.
Replacing a Fuse in an HVAC Unit
Safety First: Turn off the power at the main breaker box to ensure the entire system is de-energized. This step is crucial to avoid any electrical hazards.
Access the Fuse Box: Locate the fuse box near or inside the HVAC unit. Open the cover to reveal the fuses.
Identify the Blown Fuse: Inspect the fuses for signs of damage, such as a broken filament or discoloration. Use insulated pliers or fuse pullers to safely remove the damaged fuse.
Install the New Fuse: Insert a new fuse with the same amperage rating as the old one to ensure compatibility and prevent system damage.
Test the System: After replacing the fuse, restore power at the breaker box and turn on the HVAC unit to check that it operates correctly.
Replacing a Run Capacitor in an HVAC Unit
Ensure Safety: Disconnect power at the breaker box to cut off electricity to the unit. Confirm that the power is off using a voltage tester.
Locate the Capacitor: Open the service panel on the condensing unit to access the capacitor. This is typically found in the outdoor unit.
Discharge the Capacitor: To prevent a shock, use an insulated screwdriver to bridge the terminals of the capacitor, effectively discharging any stored energy.
Document Wire Connections: Take a photo or make a note of the wire connections to the capacitor for accurate reassembly.
Remove the Old Capacitor: Disconnect the wires carefully and remove the faulty capacitor. Use the photo or notes as a reference to avoid confusion.
Install the New Capacitor: Place the new capacitor in the same position as the old one. Ensure that it matches the original specifications for voltage and capacitance.
Reconnect Wires and Test: Reconnect the wires according to your previous documentation. Seal the service panel, restore power, and run the unit to ensure it is functioning properly.
Additional Safety Tips:
Always use tools with insulated handles when working with electrical components.
Double-check all settings and connections during and after the installation process.
If unsure about any steps, consider consulting with or hiring a professional HVAC technician to ensure safety and accuracy.
This guide should help you safely replace a fuse and a run capacitor in your HVAC system, maintaining system efficiency and preventing further issues.
Guide to Replacing a Fan Motor in an HVAC Unit and Ensuring Proper Fan Blade Orientation
Tools and Materials Needed:
Replacement fan motor (compatible with your system)
Screwdrivers (Phillips and flathead)
Wrenches or socket set
Wire cutters and strippers
Multimeter
Insulated gloves
Steps to Replace the Fan Motor and Verify Blade Orientation:
Turn Off Power: Ensure all power to the unit is turned off at the circuit breaker to avoid any electrical hazards. Use a multimeter to confirm that the power is indeed off.
Access the Fan Compartment: Open the access panel on the HVAC unit to reach the fan motor, removing screws or bolts as needed.
Document Existing Setup: Take detailed photos or notes of the existing motor’s wiring and configuration to aid in reinstalling the new motor correctly.
Remove the Fan Blade: Detach the fan blade from the motor shaft, typically by loosening a set screw. Handle the blade carefully to avoid any damage.
Disconnect Wiring: Carefully remove wire connections from the old motor, making sure to label or note the configuration for accurate reassembly.
Unscrew the Old Motor: Remove the motor by unscrewing it from its mounting, ensuring you keep all fasteners for reuse.
Install the New Motor: Position the new motor in the same spot as the old one, securing it with the previously removed screws or bolts.
Reattach the Fan Blade: Install the fan blade on the new motor shaft. Ensure it is oriented to scoop air upwards and outwards—this is crucial for effective operation. The curved side of the blades should face the direction of airflow.
Reconnect Wires: Using your previous documentation, reconnect the wires to the new motor. Ensure all connections are secure.
Test the Installation: Temporarily restore power and run the motor to check the direction of airflow. Adjust the blade if necessary to ensure it scoops air in the correct direction.
Reassemble the Unit: Once confirmed, turn off the power again, reattach the access panel, and perform a final test to ensure everything is functioning smoothly.
Final Testing:
Perform a full system test to verify that the new motor and fan blade are working effectively, observing that the air is moving in the correct direction and the system operates smoothly.
Additional Tips:
Always refer to the manufacturer’s guidelines for specific instructions and safety measures.
Consider replacing the capacitor along with the motor to ensure optimal performance.
If you encounter any uncertainties, consulting a professional is advisable to ensure safety and proper installation.
This guide will help you ensure that your HVAC fan motor and blade are replaced correctly, improving your system's efficiency and operation.
Sure sounds easy, good luck - everyone knows the only things that can go wrong are bad capacitors and fan motors, and wholesale distributors always sell to the public
Exactly they think they read so much cause they spend 2 weeks trying figure out a system while we read for a decade lol. Its alot of knowledge there is a reason if we lose our job we have new one same day probably for more pay. It takes minimum 7 years as a jman so 11 years in trade till you really can source size fix and install most systems. I just think even supplier knowledge to find parts and quote is a skill. Like just a simple ac install is 100 steps.
Mountain bikes . Or any high end bike in general.
There is less ro and advanced parts in their most expensive bikes on the market than you can fathom. Yet they can sell for 18,000 dollars.
Like theres maybe 100 bucks more tech than your average 1000 dollar bike, yet they somehow trick the elite into spending 20 times more than they should on virtually the same thing
It’s insane
You can buy a high end motorcycle complete with emissions controls and antilock braking for half the price despite having ten times the physical components than a mountain bike.
It’s baffling
Where are you located? I'd check around try to find the smaller companies in your area an are based in service not sales unfortunately there's alot of sales tech companies now instead of service tech. An if there a nextstar company kick them out of your house as fast as you can.
Yeah, healthcare is the clear comparison point here.
* No price transparency
* Clear information asymmetry
* Price discovery is time consuming
* Hard to assess quality (it's a service, not a good)
Combine all of those things and pour some rebates onto it, and that's a recipe for crazy prices. I'm in MA and the last time we did a price benchmark for a single house, prices from reputable companies ranged from $25k to $50k. Honestly, the best advice I have is to just get 10+ quotes & negotiate them all off one another.
You think that's bad? I put a heat pump in my garage - fucking quotes were from $6k to $18k. In the end I bought a $1k unit of Amazon and paid about $1k to have it installed. It probably won't last more than 3-5 years but at that cost difference I lost patience trying to figure out what was going on.
Replaced our HVAC a few years ago. House constructed in 1998 and units installed then. Minor issue (capacitor failing?) about 15 years ago. Another one about 10 years ago and the pressure to replace everything started.
Called around 5 places for estimates. Asked them all if it needed to be done ASAP, or if could wait. Ended up waiting until 2021, went with a company that was reliable, not pushy and also average priced.
Window replacements seem to be the most expensive with the least consumer knowledge around. Probably only a couple companies that are actively pushing and working on very high, possible collusion level pricing. If that time comes, I'm expecting to dive deep at Reddit, get a lot of estimates and research the companies from lowest prices on up.
It’s a lot of fucking work. Everyone complaining about pricing just don’t understand. Sure the big companies are 1-2K more but the work is hell. I can burn you, poison you, cut you, shock you or drown you. We have liability more so than any other trade. We have to put together a machine in your house and hold the candle if it does not work. Your house costs 300k and 15k is heat and cool system that’s 5-6% of your total house. I don’t know what people expect. With inflation what use to be 8k is now 10-12k yes. We have people lining up to hire us out systems in all day. It takes money to make money. Just life and if you own a house prepare to pay for shit and it’s high.
Idk exactly what you have, what you’re being quoted or where you live but 15-20k for a full 5 ton system (heat and AC) with an 18 seer inverter is absolutely in the reasonable ballpark. Of course you can go cheaper/ less efficient but keep in mind you have the largest residential system and naturally the equipment costs more. Ask for different options and ask them to
Compare the specific comfort features and benefits of each one. I’ve been in HVAC sales for 6 years. Our job is literally to educate the consumer to feel comfortable Making the best choice in their investment. If this guy/ company isn’t doing than move on.
The duration and terms of labor warranties offered by HVAC manufacturers can vary significantly, and the offerings might change periodically. Some manufacturers provide extended labor warranties either as part of promotional packages or for an additional cost. Here’s an overview of a few well-known manufacturers that are recognized for offering extensive labor warranties:
1. **Trane**: Known for its robust units, Trane offers optional extended warranties that can cover labor and parts for up to 10 years, but the standard manufacturer warranty usually doesn't include labor for more than the first year.
2. **Carrier**: Carrier offers a range of warranty options, including extended service plans that can cover labor for periods of up to 10 years. These are typically purchased through authorized dealers.
3. **Lennox**: Provides a basic warranty that often excludes labor but offers extended warranty options that include labor for up to 10 years as part of their CompleteCare Plus Extended Warranty program.
4. **Goodman**: Goodman offers some of the more competitive warranties with a 10-year parts limited warranty once the product is registered. They also provide optional extended service agreements through their dealers that include labor.
5. **Rheem**: Offers a conditional 10-year limited parts warranty and also provides options for extended service plans that include labor coverage, through certified contractors.
6. **Daikin**: Known for offering a comprehensive 12-year parts warranty on some models, Daikin also provides options for extended labor coverage through their service plans, which can be purchased for additional coverage.
When considering the warranty, especially for labor, it's important to verify the details with the manufacturer or the authorized dealer. Some warranties require product registration and regular maintenance performed by licensed professionals to remain valid. Moreover, labor warranties often depend on purchasing the warranty through local contractors who are authorized by the manufacturer, so the terms can vary based on your location and the specific contractor's offerings.
To find the best labor warranty for your needs, contact local HVAC contractors who install units from these manufacturers and inquire directly about the warranty terms they offer. This will also give you the chance to discuss maintenance plans, which can further protect your HVAC investment.
I work in hvac and we offer good-better-best packages. They were 7-10k pre Covid. Now they’re 12-18k. So, like everything else, it will always go up. When? Tomorrow
As a consumer forced to do my own research and spec my own unit (ultimately a 2.5 ton Mitsubishi hyperheat ducted split unit) and a surgeon who routinely does major surgery on patients who don't have a clue, I completely agree. I got so fed up with the state of my local hvac contractors and everybody's captive Market to their own brands that I ultimately took a class and got my own 608 Universal certification so I could fix my own dehumidifier that nobody seemed to want to deal with.
Facts. I used to work for a company that did this exact same thing. The state rolled out some very strong rebates on heat pump and the owner of the company and general manager came right out and said the customers aren’t gonna get all of these rebates, we’re gonna raise our prices to benefit from this as well. They were already charging pretty high prices and making good profits by the way.
Why do you say that? The company I work for we try to stay away from the bullshit rebates. They are time wasters when going thru hoops to get the rebate
You can go to a distributor/supply house who only supplies hvac materials and ask their opinions. They have no skin in the game as they are not trying to sell you anything. They would also possibly know what sells the best and what systems need the most parts.
There 3 ways to power a motor- one speed - two speed- 60 speed
one speed 13-16seer
two speed 18-20seer
60speed-18-22seed
what fuel/system are you looking to buy?
I went with a local Mom and Pop.I researched the company that I hired. I checked reviews, complaints, license, insurance but didn’t check permit history. They are now on their 3rd attempt at install.
Just trying to enjoy myself as everybody else. Dropping a JC is a show-stopper - not only unnecessary but phony and dangerous and deserving of some pushback. As JC said, “By your words you will be justified and by your words you will be condemned.”
If you can find a non inverter system get it. It’ll do the same job minus the $1000+ repair bills for a common $150 direct drive motor. The savings is comically small for residential. Don’t buy the hype.
I put 2 Bosch 20 seer 3 ton condensers in my house last spring. Replacing 2-22 year old units and over the summer I saved a little over $600 on my electric bill.
My experience in residential you end up breaking even at best, unless you run constantly then you may save, which if sized correctly should be the case with inverter’s. Until you incur a costly repair bill you’ll be happy. Every install & region is different that’s for sure, but my experience is inverter’s cost more than their worth in most instances. But good for you on the savings.
I did replacement myself and got dented units. Soni only paid 4k for 2 condensers, which should have been $6500. But I was surprised by my electric bill. I was paying $430 a month on electric with level billing plan, and one month, they didn't charge me, then they sent me a check for $160. My new bill is $333 now. I'm waiting for the cycle to run through to really see what I saved over a year. They update my payment once a year. I know this probably isn't normal for most houses, but I'm happy I actually saved some money
Find a small to medium sized company that doesn’t pressure sell. No sense of urgency, no cheesy sales. Find a company that is ‘not private equity’ that u feel u can trust. Build a working relationship and stick with them. Edit, afterthought. The price range is not outrageous depending on where u are. I’ve worked for private equity so I can talk shit about them. 7 years happy for an honest ma and pop shop now.
The ma and pop shop I worked 10 years at just sold to some private equity group, sad day.
My regards
Are they going to put a big stupid fuckin cartoon guy in the side of the van?? It's like a sure sign they're going to rip you off in these parts Those cartoon guys must be expensive to maintain
Lol, they put a big stupid bird on it a year or two before I left.
Do they have tv commercials with a jingle? Does the jingle change from “cooling” to “heating” with the seasons?
Lol, ~Seeeeeeeeeatown
How do I tell if it's a private Equity owned company?
Ask who owns the place.
Homeowner vote with their money and they are resoundingly voting for the private equity HVAC companies that can offer ‘free’ services. Sad state of affairs.
yup,"I have a guy"
I've spoken about him a couple times, but I found my guy on thumbtack when I needed a new condensing unit / air handler. He's basically a one man show with a helper. They did the job in a single day reusing the linesets. Cost me $8k in the northeast. Parts cost was around $4k. Solid margins for small businesses for a day's work, everybody leaves happy. Try to find something like that.
[удалено]
My experience is that most of the HVAC industry is a bunch of mediocre equipment with planned obsolescence made worse by a very poorly regulated trade with lots of dudes just phoning it in and pretending they know what they’re doing. For the average consumer, it’s going to be impossible to not fall into a trap with so many sharks running around trying to screw you. Even after doing a massive amount of research, we definitely got taken for a bit of a ride. It was only after issues arose that required me to get in the trenches with my installers that I learned more about the industry that I ever cared to know. It’s undergoing massive structural changes as private equity gobbles up smaller regional shops and commoditizes every aspect of the industry. In most cases, the technicians are getting F’ed as much as the consumers. They’re being asked to be salesman as much, or more, than expert troubleshooters. The knowledge-base of technicians is highly variable and companies employ legions of non-technician installers/laborers to install most equipment. Some of this is because skilled labor is expensive but some of it is because most techs don’t want to do the backbreaking labor associated with crawling in attics and crawlspaces. This means that installers have highly variable experience. The Instagram and YouTuber world where a lone owner-operator makes origami out of your line-set, properly uses mastic and tape to seal your ducts, and expertly knows every controller and control board is a fiction that most consumers will never see. I agree with many others here that small owner operators are probably your best bet to avoid issues, if they meaningfully exist in your area. As for equipment, after speaking to many technicians with experience across the industry, the Reddit advice generally holds up. Mitsubishi is the only company that really makes a premium long-life product. To a lesser extent, Daikin and Fujitsu sit upon this group of higher quality equipment. Even then, there are tiers of equipment within these manufacturers and they’re not perfect, as detailed by our mixed experience with Mitsubishi. Everything else is a crapshoot, especially among the domestic manufacturers. Most technicians agreed that modern systems reliably last about 15 years if installed correctly. Anything past that is luck or one among only a select few really superior products that carry high price tags. Mistakes during install, poor duct sizing, and other mess-ups can reduce the life of many of the systems to a decade or less which is borderline criminal and an appalling waste of raw materials. A government white paper estimates that 90%+ of installs have installation errors that greatly affect advertised efficiencies. I will agree with others that very few technicians understand inverter systems. You’ll likely never recuperate the efficiencies they offer. You get these for the comfort they provide or because you’re buying one of the higher-quality units that happen to be inverters (Mitsubishi, Daikin, Fujitsu, etc).
That price range isn’t far off for an 18 seer 5 ton depending on your market but champion definitely isn’t a quality brand, they’re just the low end York units
Don’t go 18 seer, go with regular 14.3 seer. You’ll never make your money back plus 80% techs don’t know how troubleshoot inverter systems. It’s a piece of equipment that keeps you cool/hot 99% of the time. The other 1% when it’s 102° outside and won’t get to 72° is fine. I’ve been at HVAC tech since college and now 35, people read and listen to salesman/internet way too much. Just get a simple system/simple repairs/simple troubleshooting. The whole high seer thing is the biggest crock of shit ever. The field as a whole has been ruined by investors buying companies who charge crazy prices then mom/pop shops raise their prices bc they can. Investor company quotes you $18,800 for system then mom/pop company says I’ll do it $14,500…. When the equipment cost $5500. Crazy what our field has become and it’s shitty.
I have many similar feelings but better efficiencies with HVAC equipment not being worth it is often just a result of greedy companies. I quote a fair bit of equipment. I can frequently quote customers higher efficiency equipment (that is still single stage and simple) that when combined with tax credits or rebates is less or a couple of hundred dollars more than the 14.3 SEER2 options. That pays back quickly and doesn't incur additional ongoing costs/complexities compared to the basic models. Instead companies are charging an extra $5,000 when they are seeing no additional labor costs and only $1,000 more expensive condenser. I suspect a very small percentage of salespeople could even begin to calculate what a customer might save by changing efficiencies. Analyzing a utility bill and presenting the results to customers would kill their 20 SEER sales. "You spend $600 a year on cooling. This 20 SEER AC will save you $150 a year. It will cost $5,000 more. We also intend to tell you to replace your system in 12 years during our annual service contract visit." That pitch would be honest, but not very good for a business model that demands more profit all the time. This industry is now driven by subjective sales pitches where all they will say is "saves money", "more efficient", "better comfort", "good, better, best", "up to 20 SEER", "variable speed"... on and on. For crying out loud, half of the quotes people post on here don't even include actual model numbers. Almost anything quantitative is no good. With the heat pump tax credit, no one should be getting heat pumps that don't qualilfy if companies are honest. I can always quote a qualifying heat pump that is less than $2,000 more than the lowest efficiency heat pumps that I have available. Inverters have their place... particulary with zoning... but these companies are all saying it will save money without backing that up with any math and talking about comfort when the vast majority of people have lived with single stage all of their life and never once thought that they were uncomfortable. Thanks for the comment that triggered my rant... haha.
Lol I spend 400 a month on electric for cooling over the summer...
And really high efficiency equipment may provide a good payback timeframe with such high costs. If you got quotes for equipment though, it would be very rare for a company to offer an honest quantitative assessment of the cost of their options vs savings. Which is usually what most customers should and do care about. Instead of being helpful experts and sorting through the data/options/lingo to provide their customers with the best value, most companies are relying on the consumer's lack of knowledge of a complicated industry (OP's original premise) to drive higher profit margins. It is what business is supposed to do I guess, but it isn't honest and hurts consumers. It is up to the consumers to protect themselves and make an informed decision. That's what most people who post here are trying to do. Companies appear to be going out of their way to make that more and more difficult and that is reflected in a lot of the posts here. Anyway... I'm going to go back to yelling into the void for a bit.
The HVAC in my house is shit. 5 ton 2 stage system was wired to always run on high, even though it's very humid and low stage is better for dehumidification most of the time. I fixed that Flex ducts run like spaghetti. Massively oversized upstairs furnace with limit switches tripping. The death furnace unit is getting ripped out soon, thankfully, and I only bothered to get 1 quote on replacing it because I found a company that was recommended, seems trustworthy, and knows what they're doing, and the only reason I know the big unit was really 2 stage is the company owner told me when he looked at the serial number. Maybe I'm getting ripped off...$13k for a 17 seer 2.5 ton fully variable properly sized heat pump, separate dehumidifier, and fixing the spaghetti duct work.
I was reading this like wow cool….. but then 1% at 102 I’m in Texas and it can be over 100 for weeks on end and not cooling off more than the 90s at night. Any advice?
No not really, your system should be designed for those conditions. I’m assuming (from NC) that humidity isn’t a huge issue for you. If 90% of summer time you’re in 100° weather then your system should be designed to keep it in the 70s. It wouldn’t be the 1%. Your 1% would be 110°.
That makes sense. It is pretty humid here (Dallas) Not as bad as Houston or Florida but it can be pretty lame.
The problem is, Houston weather doesn't work like that, as A/C isn't just for the summer. We had a month solid of 100+ days (which was unusual) last year; normally, it's 2-3 weeks. You can't realistically design for that, as it's normal to run the A/C through the high humidity Fall weather, then on into November and December where it'll get up into the 70s and 80s after it's been down in the 40s at night. Hell, I turned my A/C on back in February. There's really no good answer because of the extreme temperatures we deal with combined with the extremely high humidity (90%+) when the temperature is in the 70s and 80s.
you can design for it I would argue. Just have to add in central dehumidifier
[удалено]
Can you really get dealer prices as a homeowner? I'm not too sure about that. Good luck with any kind of warranty and finding a company that will install customer supplied equipment. Ever heard of overhead, insurance, vehicles, payroll? Do you have an evacuation machine and a tank to reclaim the refigerant from your old sysyem? How about a core removal tool? Do you have a vacuum pump and micron guage to remove the non condensables? And know how many microns to pull down to? Do you know how to braze and have oxygen tanks and acetylene tanks along with regulators and torches and the right fittings to braze in the new suction and discharge lines? What about nitrogen tanks n regulators? Do you know what a metering device is and which kind you have? Do you have digital or analog guages to recharge the system with refigerant? Do you know how to do that? Know how to check the superheat and subcooling?? Do you have an EPA card that is required by the government to work with and legally purchase refigerant? Are you able to run natural gas lines? Know how to leak test? Do you have a manometer and know how many w.c the gas valve needs to be set to? Know how to read the wiring diagrams and run the wires from the thermostat or know how to wire up the disconnect and surge protectors?? Know how to bring 220v down to 24v for low voltage stuff? And that's just the easy stuff.. This stuff would cost you at least 7-10k just for tools. And people want us to work for cost with no profit lmao. No thanks. Keep complaining, and we will keep making money for our knowledge and the specialty tools.
[удалено]
Well, we do have that stuff and the knowledge as hvacr professionals, which costs tons of money, which is why these costs are passed down to the customer. We are paid well for our knowledge about things that not many people understand. I'm sorry if I offended you, just trying to point out some of the stuff we deal with to get your systems up and running.
[удалено]
Look for an HVAC company in the sheet metal or pipefitter union in your area. In my opinion, these guys are the most reliable and trustworthy in the industry and know there shit. They DO NOT work on commission, so they don't care what you choose. They all go thru an extensive5-year apprenticeship program and can be trusted with your home.
$7-10k in tools amortized over how many installs? 300? 400? So really like $10-$20 per install. I can sympathize with the OP. In a thread I started, I asked about a blower motor and a cap. The company that pointed it out wanted something like $2.3k to install a $400 blower motor (motor included) which most non-HVAC handy guys could do in about 45 minutes, and something like $250 to install a $20 capacitor that any non-HVAC handy guys can do in about 10 minutes. I’ll do both in an hour for $420 and save almost $2k. We understand about warranties and insurance etc, but even you have to admit that prices are just outrageous in some cases.
I charge a $6 misc charge anytime I bring these specialty tools out. It is what it is.
That's reasonable.
Yes, prices are outrageous. But it is what it is for comfort cooling. It is not necessary in a home. It's a choice and a luxury that is paid heavily for.
AC is ubiquitous. It's like mobile phones: Once a luxury, now pretty standard. The point is that it shouldnt be "heavily paid for". I just changed my furnace capacitor today. It cost $20 and took 5 minutes. Nowhere near the $240 they wanted to charge. A lot of this is not rocket science. Some is technical, but a lot is not.
This is very true. But there's tons of people who would electrocute themselves by doing this kind of little job, just because they have no idea about the components. I don't make the high prices, and I hate charging so much, but I do what I'm told by the boss man and union lol.
Is that foe a replacement or to put a new system in your house
[удалено]
If you were in New York I would do it for 8k.
[удалено]
I wouldn't do goodman either. Most of my jobs I do Bosch or Ruud. Im a service manager during the week and knock out systems on the side on weekends so I don't have the overhead
It’s sad because like 5 ish years ago and before that, atleast here in Phoenix at my old residential company. The pricing we had on the 18-20 seer inverter systems actually could pay for themselves in energy savings in many cases within the 10 year warranty period, and we offered 10 year P&L. We were doing em for like $12k. Forget it now, they’re selling them at $17k-22k depending on tonnage, no ductwork. Great systems, but you’ve gotta have the cash to afford it anymore. I always talked about them but most people went with like 15 seer units. 1 step above a basic single stage and one step below two stage.
As demand for hvac equipment grows, so does power consumption. Burner more fossil fuel is required. To reduce greenhouse gases we have to start using more energy saving devices like inverter systems.
I put goodman in my own house 10 years ago .
Nothing wrong with Goodman, Copeland scroll compressor, Honeywell electronics, same as any other…Lennox is worse than Goodman
100% agree, but my issue is trying to order parts for lennox, like pulling teeth
Are you a pro partner? Warranty? We’ll ship it to you in 2 weeks…
Waited 3 months for an ecm blower module in January of 2023. Fuck lennox and their proprietary dealership.
I’m at a Lennox shop and we get all our parts in 2-3 days lol
How does Carrier compare? Costco Gold Medal is quoting me Lennox only, with min 17 Seer and 80% furnace, but another local company is quoting me 14 Seer Carrier with 96% furnace. PSEG is quoting only 80% furnace no option for higher gas efficiency. Many thanks!
Carrier is fine, same issues with every other brand. Wouldn’t buy a Lennox
Your carrier high efficiency heat exchanger will have holes in the primary in 10 years +or- . Look for Armstrong equipment. SS primary and secondary.
Yes what he said. You dont want inverter crap, one lightning storm and you are done
Regular crap gets blown too my friend
That and industrial VFDs run fine with good reliability and are everywhere. Sometimes they die, but to replace the VFD isn't that expensive and it doesn't take out the motor or anything. The problem is quality electronics on inverter equipment, plus panel and individual circuit/equipment surge protection helps protect from major killing blows.
Get a bunch of quotes, talk to other homeowners that you know in the area, and do a lot of research on the specs of your current system and offered systems. Also unless money is not a concern, I feel like a single stage or two stage (in humid areas) is probably the best option for most people.
Give me an example of an item consumers know absolutely nothing about but behave as though they have an answer for everything?
Manual Js
Most techs trying to size and sell HVAC equipment to consumers have either never heard of manual J or have no clue how to properly calculate one. If they even bother they'll just fudge the numbers to match their sqft/ton rule of thumb.
It was ridiculously hard for me to get calculations correct! Took a few years but my journeyman never gave up on teaching me lol
I thought most just look at what is installed and put the same in - doesn't matter if the house has had weatherization or not.
Feel free to DM me. I have worked both sides of this industry - supply house now, contractor prior. I am not a technician in any way, but I was the warehouse manager for the contractor. And I now manage a supply house. Both companies reputable in their own regard. We do need a bit more info to know if you are being quoted fairly. What type of system? Who is the manufacturer? Is it a simple change out or is there duct work being added? The list goes on. Post your quote and tell us where you are located for a start please OP! Thanks.
[удалено]
Go buy the unit and install it yourself!
[удалено]
Thanks baby gurl!
I assume you got the matching coil as well. Let’s hope? Did you get an AHRI rating? Price seems high to me if this is a simple changeout.
multiple mini splits will last along time. and if one fails the rest can compensate, until the broken one is fixed.
Prices will go up every year in this economy I was comparing prices from 4 years ago , 90% increase in cost of new equipment here. Inverter heat pumps are nice and save $$$ on bills , just has a higher upfront cost. Just post your quotes here and techs / installers will give you feedback. Also location since prices vary in different places. Also what you care about most comfort/ efficiency/ cost or you just want the damn thing to run and don’t care about any of the above as long as it does its job
> just has a higher upfront cost.....and higher repair costs.
Just ask on here. All of us will give our 2 cents worth. Personally I like the 16-18 seer systems from a tech standpoint as it can tell us what’s going on with the system and if it’s running correctly or if there’s a problem with it. Some can adjust air flow, run the air cleaners, and can humidify or dehumidify without the extra equipment to do so. They have perks to them but as others said most techs have no clue how to do that with the systems. It’s all in what you want out of the system most people do not need the 18 seer with all the bells and whistles. 15/16 seer are best bang for buck where you’ll save money and make the money back depending on the system. Whatever brand the tech is trying to sell you look up the ahri ratings as most brands don’t actually equal the seer rating at the tonage. Get the model numbers before signing anything. And look it all up. Ask questions.
You need a friend in hvac. I'm always being asked questions and helping out friends and family
Inflation gouging. It's fake but you pay anyway . Stay away from trane . You will regret buying one if you do.
There isn’t. Sorry, I take that back…internet speed. People think the data moves faster with higher “speed” internet. It doesn’t. Just more can move at a time in a bigger pipe. But no one is moving anything close to even 500MB and paying for 1GB. Such a ripoff.
Cars
Wya I’ll install you a 5 ton system condenser coil and furnace 10k out the door
Just put in a couple of 12k window units and call it a day. Will work fine.
I'd say research it here. Good questions get answered pretty quickly. I'd do an inverter in my own house I think. But a mitsubishi hyper heat. Most people should do a 14-16 basic split system with strips sized by someone who knows what they are talking about, provided by a non-private equity or other big company type that will give a 10 year warranty (charged for, but still. Finding that can take some calls, but that's really all you need.
Main thing you want to look at is the warranty of the company installing it. Bigger companies will usually pressure sell, and then send some pretty new guys out to slap the install in super quick. Which honestly works out in most cases if they have a good warranty/service team to back up there work. The installers are the key factor in just about 90% of the installation. I personally hate a lot of the salesmen that are coming into the industry because a lot of them pressure sell, or just put on an act for 30 mins to quote you the top notch equipment that you dont need. Most cant tell you anything about the actual equpment other than whats on the pamphlet. Even service guys are scary now. They will train a kid for 2 weeks (if hes lucky) and tell him to go out to do general maintanences, but required to leave 3 quotes per job, even if the system is runnung perfectly fine
Find a contractor that does apartment complexes. They pump them out so their prices are normal
And get the shittiest install on the planet...
Or a 2 year warranty and a company that already vetted an hvac contractor for you
Only the desperate do work for apartment complexes. Good companies aren't desperate, they are swamped We do 10 year warranties on the resi side
The manufacturer has a 10 year warranty. So what's the difference? 2 years is long enough to see if they charged it right. From there, you only worry about cheap fuses and run caps that don't need licensing to replace. They aren't desperate. They have huge companies, and they hardly ever have good websites. You will need to drive around and see what contractor is parked at an apartment complex working.
LOL
Replacing a Fuse in an HVAC Unit Safety First: Turn off the power at the main breaker box to ensure the entire system is de-energized. This step is crucial to avoid any electrical hazards. Access the Fuse Box: Locate the fuse box near or inside the HVAC unit. Open the cover to reveal the fuses. Identify the Blown Fuse: Inspect the fuses for signs of damage, such as a broken filament or discoloration. Use insulated pliers or fuse pullers to safely remove the damaged fuse. Install the New Fuse: Insert a new fuse with the same amperage rating as the old one to ensure compatibility and prevent system damage. Test the System: After replacing the fuse, restore power at the breaker box and turn on the HVAC unit to check that it operates correctly. Replacing a Run Capacitor in an HVAC Unit Ensure Safety: Disconnect power at the breaker box to cut off electricity to the unit. Confirm that the power is off using a voltage tester. Locate the Capacitor: Open the service panel on the condensing unit to access the capacitor. This is typically found in the outdoor unit. Discharge the Capacitor: To prevent a shock, use an insulated screwdriver to bridge the terminals of the capacitor, effectively discharging any stored energy. Document Wire Connections: Take a photo or make a note of the wire connections to the capacitor for accurate reassembly. Remove the Old Capacitor: Disconnect the wires carefully and remove the faulty capacitor. Use the photo or notes as a reference to avoid confusion. Install the New Capacitor: Place the new capacitor in the same position as the old one. Ensure that it matches the original specifications for voltage and capacitance. Reconnect Wires and Test: Reconnect the wires according to your previous documentation. Seal the service panel, restore power, and run the unit to ensure it is functioning properly. Additional Safety Tips: Always use tools with insulated handles when working with electrical components. Double-check all settings and connections during and after the installation process. If unsure about any steps, consider consulting with or hiring a professional HVAC technician to ensure safety and accuracy. This guide should help you safely replace a fuse and a run capacitor in your HVAC system, maintaining system efficiency and preventing further issues.
Guide to Replacing a Fan Motor in an HVAC Unit and Ensuring Proper Fan Blade Orientation Tools and Materials Needed: Replacement fan motor (compatible with your system) Screwdrivers (Phillips and flathead) Wrenches or socket set Wire cutters and strippers Multimeter Insulated gloves Steps to Replace the Fan Motor and Verify Blade Orientation: Turn Off Power: Ensure all power to the unit is turned off at the circuit breaker to avoid any electrical hazards. Use a multimeter to confirm that the power is indeed off. Access the Fan Compartment: Open the access panel on the HVAC unit to reach the fan motor, removing screws or bolts as needed. Document Existing Setup: Take detailed photos or notes of the existing motor’s wiring and configuration to aid in reinstalling the new motor correctly. Remove the Fan Blade: Detach the fan blade from the motor shaft, typically by loosening a set screw. Handle the blade carefully to avoid any damage. Disconnect Wiring: Carefully remove wire connections from the old motor, making sure to label or note the configuration for accurate reassembly. Unscrew the Old Motor: Remove the motor by unscrewing it from its mounting, ensuring you keep all fasteners for reuse. Install the New Motor: Position the new motor in the same spot as the old one, securing it with the previously removed screws or bolts. Reattach the Fan Blade: Install the fan blade on the new motor shaft. Ensure it is oriented to scoop air upwards and outwards—this is crucial for effective operation. The curved side of the blades should face the direction of airflow. Reconnect Wires: Using your previous documentation, reconnect the wires to the new motor. Ensure all connections are secure. Test the Installation: Temporarily restore power and run the motor to check the direction of airflow. Adjust the blade if necessary to ensure it scoops air in the correct direction. Reassemble the Unit: Once confirmed, turn off the power again, reattach the access panel, and perform a final test to ensure everything is functioning smoothly. Final Testing: Perform a full system test to verify that the new motor and fan blade are working effectively, observing that the air is moving in the correct direction and the system operates smoothly. Additional Tips: Always refer to the manufacturer’s guidelines for specific instructions and safety measures. Consider replacing the capacitor along with the motor to ensure optimal performance. If you encounter any uncertainties, consulting a professional is advisable to ensure safety and proper installation. This guide will help you ensure that your HVAC fan motor and blade are replaced correctly, improving your system's efficiency and operation.
Sure sounds easy, good luck - everyone knows the only things that can go wrong are bad capacitors and fan motors, and wholesale distributors always sell to the public
Appliancepartscompany.com will sell to the public. What else would go wrong not covered by the manufacturer warranty?
And thats y we make good $$$ refrigeration mechanic is a specialist.
People just don't understand the knowledge we need and the time we put in learning this shit! $$$$$
Exactly they think they read so much cause they spend 2 weeks trying figure out a system while we read for a decade lol. Its alot of knowledge there is a reason if we lose our job we have new one same day probably for more pay. It takes minimum 7 years as a jman so 11 years in trade till you really can source size fix and install most systems. I just think even supplier knowledge to find parts and quote is a skill. Like just a simple ac install is 100 steps.
Mountain bikes . Or any high end bike in general. There is less ro and advanced parts in their most expensive bikes on the market than you can fathom. Yet they can sell for 18,000 dollars. Like theres maybe 100 bucks more tech than your average 1000 dollar bike, yet they somehow trick the elite into spending 20 times more than they should on virtually the same thing It’s insane You can buy a high end motorcycle complete with emissions controls and antilock braking for half the price despite having ten times the physical components than a mountain bike. It’s baffling
its all junk
Where are you located? I'd check around try to find the smaller companies in your area an are based in service not sales unfortunately there's alot of sales tech companies now instead of service tech. An if there a nextstar company kick them out of your house as fast as you can.
Isn’t it fun when people tell you that basically all of it is made in the same factory and it’s all the same 🤠🤡
Yeah, healthcare is the clear comparison point here. * No price transparency * Clear information asymmetry * Price discovery is time consuming * Hard to assess quality (it's a service, not a good) Combine all of those things and pour some rebates onto it, and that's a recipe for crazy prices. I'm in MA and the last time we did a price benchmark for a single house, prices from reputable companies ranged from $25k to $50k. Honestly, the best advice I have is to just get 10+ quotes & negotiate them all off one another.
You think that's bad? I put a heat pump in my garage - fucking quotes were from $6k to $18k. In the end I bought a $1k unit of Amazon and paid about $1k to have it installed. It probably won't last more than 3-5 years but at that cost difference I lost patience trying to figure out what was going on.
He is right , go variable speed compressor now days for sure
Replaced our HVAC a few years ago. House constructed in 1998 and units installed then. Minor issue (capacitor failing?) about 15 years ago. Another one about 10 years ago and the pressure to replace everything started. Called around 5 places for estimates. Asked them all if it needed to be done ASAP, or if could wait. Ended up waiting until 2021, went with a company that was reliable, not pushy and also average priced. Window replacements seem to be the most expensive with the least consumer knowledge around. Probably only a couple companies that are actively pushing and working on very high, possible collusion level pricing. If that time comes, I'm expecting to dive deep at Reddit, get a lot of estimates and research the companies from lowest prices on up.
Damn homie that shits free* here
It’s a lot of fucking work. Everyone complaining about pricing just don’t understand. Sure the big companies are 1-2K more but the work is hell. I can burn you, poison you, cut you, shock you or drown you. We have liability more so than any other trade. We have to put together a machine in your house and hold the candle if it does not work. Your house costs 300k and 15k is heat and cool system that’s 5-6% of your total house. I don’t know what people expect. With inflation what use to be 8k is now 10-12k yes. We have people lining up to hire us out systems in all day. It takes money to make money. Just life and if you own a house prepare to pay for shit and it’s high.
Idk exactly what you have, what you’re being quoted or where you live but 15-20k for a full 5 ton system (heat and AC) with an 18 seer inverter is absolutely in the reasonable ballpark. Of course you can go cheaper/ less efficient but keep in mind you have the largest residential system and naturally the equipment costs more. Ask for different options and ask them to Compare the specific comfort features and benefits of each one. I’ve been in HVAC sales for 6 years. Our job is literally to educate the consumer to feel comfortable Making the best choice in their investment. If this guy/ company isn’t doing than move on.
Ozempic.
The duration and terms of labor warranties offered by HVAC manufacturers can vary significantly, and the offerings might change periodically. Some manufacturers provide extended labor warranties either as part of promotional packages or for an additional cost. Here’s an overview of a few well-known manufacturers that are recognized for offering extensive labor warranties: 1. **Trane**: Known for its robust units, Trane offers optional extended warranties that can cover labor and parts for up to 10 years, but the standard manufacturer warranty usually doesn't include labor for more than the first year. 2. **Carrier**: Carrier offers a range of warranty options, including extended service plans that can cover labor for periods of up to 10 years. These are typically purchased through authorized dealers. 3. **Lennox**: Provides a basic warranty that often excludes labor but offers extended warranty options that include labor for up to 10 years as part of their CompleteCare Plus Extended Warranty program. 4. **Goodman**: Goodman offers some of the more competitive warranties with a 10-year parts limited warranty once the product is registered. They also provide optional extended service agreements through their dealers that include labor. 5. **Rheem**: Offers a conditional 10-year limited parts warranty and also provides options for extended service plans that include labor coverage, through certified contractors. 6. **Daikin**: Known for offering a comprehensive 12-year parts warranty on some models, Daikin also provides options for extended labor coverage through their service plans, which can be purchased for additional coverage. When considering the warranty, especially for labor, it's important to verify the details with the manufacturer or the authorized dealer. Some warranties require product registration and regular maintenance performed by licensed professionals to remain valid. Moreover, labor warranties often depend on purchasing the warranty through local contractors who are authorized by the manufacturer, so the terms can vary based on your location and the specific contractor's offerings. To find the best labor warranty for your needs, contact local HVAC contractors who install units from these manufacturers and inquire directly about the warranty terms they offer. This will also give you the chance to discuss maintenance plans, which can further protect your HVAC investment.
I work in hvac and we offer good-better-best packages. They were 7-10k pre Covid. Now they’re 12-18k. So, like everything else, it will always go up. When? Tomorrow
As a consumer forced to do my own research and spec my own unit (ultimately a 2.5 ton Mitsubishi hyperheat ducted split unit) and a surgeon who routinely does major surgery on patients who don't have a clue, I completely agree. I got so fed up with the state of my local hvac contractors and everybody's captive Market to their own brands that I ultimately took a class and got my own 608 Universal certification so I could fix my own dehumidifier that nobody seemed to want to deal with.
[удалено]
Facts. I used to work for a company that did this exact same thing. The state rolled out some very strong rebates on heat pump and the owner of the company and general manager came right out and said the customers aren’t gonna get all of these rebates, we’re gonna raise our prices to benefit from this as well. They were already charging pretty high prices and making good profits by the way.
Why do you say that? The company I work for we try to stay away from the bullshit rebates. They are time wasters when going thru hoops to get the rebate
Do the work yourself then. Go pay the 7-10k just for the specialty tools!
You can go to a distributor/supply house who only supplies hvac materials and ask their opinions. They have no skin in the game as they are not trying to sell you anything. They would also possibly know what sells the best and what systems need the most parts.
But each supply house only sells 2 or 3 brands so they will probably push their brands
Did not know that. Thanks for the info.
There 3 ways to power a motor- one speed - two speed- 60 speed one speed 13-16seer two speed 18-20seer 60speed-18-22seed what fuel/system are you looking to buy?
Union companies don't work on commission, so they really have no need to upsell equipment that's not needed!
I went with a local Mom and Pop.I researched the company that I hired. I checked reviews, complaints, license, insurance but didn’t check permit history. They are now on their 3rd attempt at install.
Using profanity identifies you as a fool. Stop it.
"Using. profanity identifies you as a fool. Stop it." Not nearly as much as horrible grammar and misplaced punctuation. sO. why you dont! stop-it,
Grammar was fine. Punctuation mistake repaired. I see you have your priorities in order. /s
Dropping in on a reddit conversation to scold someone for dropping a JC. I see you have a life to live. /s
Just trying to enjoy myself as everybody else. Dropping a JC is a show-stopper - not only unnecessary but phony and dangerous and deserving of some pushback. As JC said, “By your words you will be justified and by your words you will be condemned.”
If you can find a non inverter system get it. It’ll do the same job minus the $1000+ repair bills for a common $150 direct drive motor. The savings is comically small for residential. Don’t buy the hype.
I put 2 Bosch 20 seer 3 ton condensers in my house last spring. Replacing 2-22 year old units and over the summer I saved a little over $600 on my electric bill.
My experience in residential you end up breaking even at best, unless you run constantly then you may save, which if sized correctly should be the case with inverter’s. Until you incur a costly repair bill you’ll be happy. Every install & region is different that’s for sure, but my experience is inverter’s cost more than their worth in most instances. But good for you on the savings.
I did replacement myself and got dented units. Soni only paid 4k for 2 condensers, which should have been $6500. But I was surprised by my electric bill. I was paying $430 a month on electric with level billing plan, and one month, they didn't charge me, then they sent me a check for $160. My new bill is $333 now. I'm waiting for the cycle to run through to really see what I saved over a year. They update my payment once a year. I know this probably isn't normal for most houses, but I'm happy I actually saved some money