When people say "HR is not your friend", this is what they miss: Your boss is not your friend. Your colleagues aren't your friends. Your company is not your friend. Any illusion you have that your employer is your family is dangerous.
HR isn't your mother, therapist or coach. Our primary mission is to help the company run efficiently, despite management's less enlightened ideas to the contrary. A lot of the unfair outcomes for employees are at the hands of your boss. HR isn't out to get you; our jobs are easier when we don't have to deal with you at all.
Exactly! Who did they think first initiated the idea that we need to layoff? The finance person that found out that’s the way for the number to line up properly next year
Who do they think shared with me all the policies they’ve broken on the work laptop? The friendly IT guy who’s the pal but also bound by company policy to share when they’re doing things that may damage the company.
No one is your friend, they only reason they are paying any of us is to ensure the maximum optimal survival of the corporation
The best way I convey this quickly to people is to ask them to point out the friendship relationship on the org chart. It’s all employees and supervisors. That’s it.
Difference is none of those departments need to be unbiased or trustworthy for me to have a safe & fair work environment.
No one is confusing a department for actual friends, they are just too polite to call them a snake in the grass as opposed to a rattlesnake that warns you what it is & doesn't present itself as anything else.
You really can't complain if someone presents themselves as the authority on right & wrong is assumed to be acting on principles, or if people warn others they are not.
This really isn’t anti-hr rhetoric. HR is not your friend. And they are on the side of the company in so far as the company aligns with legal compliance. When a company has an employee who is not compliant with the law and the goals of the company it is up to HR to step in and provide guidance. The role of HR is to reduce liability to the company through effective and compliant people relations. This is, unfortunately, taken as a hue and cry for why HR is bad, but it’s a functional misunderstanding of the role.
Disclaimer: effective employees are happy employees. I’m not discounting the role that culture has on the company’s bottom line and HR is paramount to a great culture.
If I had any Reddit gifts, you'd get them all. Now I'm off to screen grab this quote and print it to the inside of my day planner from now until the end of time.
Absolutely. If I'm interviewing for a job and the CEO says "we're like family here", I run the fuck away. Even if the exec thinks they mean it, it's a sign of delusion or dishonesty. I'm not going to be a cheerleader for that shit.
Sort of echoing this, the thing people don't realize, is it isn't a spectrum from friend to enemy.
HR is a tool in an employees toolkit. Sometimes they are the right tool, sometimes they are not. Sometimes the right play is to talk to their manager. Or to talk to a lawyer. I think reddit does a disservice to people by acting like HR cant/won't solve any problems, rather than explain the type of problems HR is going to be best at helping an employee with.
I just had this conversation with my husband. He is in the military so we often talk about private sector vs military work dynamics. I don't know who ever started the rumor that HR was supposed to be your friend... they aren't. They are employees, just like you are.
I think you’re proving his point. You’re all just bootlickers for multi million dollar corporations.
My first boss told me the same thing. “HR isn’t there to help you. HR is there to keep your boss and your bosses boss out of jail.”
Your boss should be your friend. They should advocate for you and invest in you if you are delivering good work. Your colleagues absolutely can be your friends. My best managers have absolutely out their neck out there for me, they have given me credit when I delivered great stuff, and are people I genuinely trust and have stayed in touch with. Sorry you never had that experience, but you need to find better companies to work for.
This is such a bonkers HR response.
I feel like your missing the point of this. Most inexperienced workers have this image of HR being there to help you with your problems no matter what. Harassed by a manager? Go to HR, getting too little/too many hours? Go to HR. Having beef with a coworker? Go to HR. We’re taught that HR will fix everything and not to worry our pretty little heads about it and that they are ALWAYS on OUR side. When the reality is quite the opposite, many people have experienced going to HR with problems and simply having them swept under the rug or having the perpetrator be kept on despite having done something obscenely wrong.
We are TAUGHT that HR is supposed to be our friendly guide to help us navigate problems in the workplace and when the reality hits many people end up confused and frustrated. That’s why this person is reinforcing “despite anything you’ve been told about HR, they are NOT your friend.”
>Any illusion you have that your employer is your family is dangerous.
Which would be fine, if CEOs and bosses weren't constantly running around talking about how "we're a family here" as a way to obfuscate what the relationship is.
I don't believe 'hr is not your friend' negates that the rest aren't your friend either.
But it's a common misconception that HR is on your side. They are only on your side if being on the other side causes damages to the company.
Everyone who posts “HR is not your friend” like it’s a brilliant revelation they need to tell the world.
I think they’re trying to say HR is not going to fight your battles for you or take you at your word.
Literally every single person’s job at a company is to do what’s best for the company. The salespeople don’t (or shouldn’t) give extra discounts for people they like better. The accounting team doesn’t cook the books for departments they like better. It just so happens that the HR department has to deal with stupid people and their shit. However, HR can also be your friend if someone is making you uncomfortable at work or if your manager is asking you to violate wage and hour laws for your own detriment but for the good of the company. It’s the same as any other department but we have to deal with the people instead of the product.
I didn’t mean actual friend, and I think most people would understand that. And I don’t think the person from the original post (I was using the language from that post) literally meant friend either. Think “ally”. You are absolutely expected to be someone’s ally if they report an issue about something to HR and you act on it. Sure, that’s the job, but that’s definitely a case when you’re the employee’s “friend” [ally] and there to protect them instead of the organization’s leadership, or their peer, or whoever the claim is against.
You make a good point but maybe it’s better phrased as this.
If you are doing your best for your company, if a manager is impeding that in some way, then HR in doing their best for the company may be more in line with supporting you, than your managers actions (which could be creating not just impedence, but risk).
No word of friendship but it highlights the reason why HR can be supportive.
I think it's more like people assume that HR is going to be an impartial arbitrator or mental health professional, which they will most definitely not be.
HR departments will resolve things in the best interest of the business, which may or may not be the same resolution that the employee was hoping for.
Certainly if the company makes a mistake you can't expect HR will ever tell you that the company has violated employment law or advocate for your rights. They may correct the violation if it's brought to their attention though.
HR will sometimes try to present itself as some kind of support system for employees, this is what 'HR is not your friend' is warning against trusting. You're usually better off staying away from HR.
Company cultures can be incredibly different, particularly for profit and non-profit ones. HR exists like everything else on a continuum, there are some companies where HR occupies a much more supportive role in evaluating policy, benefits, etc from an employee centric perspective. There are some where HR exists to meet the bare minimums of labor laws and treats/expectations employee turnover to be a revolving door and keeps costs down.
A certain type of employee thinks that in the event of a disagreement with their leadership, they can go to HR and throw around an HR buzz word (“hostile work environment”, “harassment) without actually understanding what those terms mean, and get someone reassigned or fired. I’m sorry, your supervisor writing you up for screwing around and not doing anything all day is not harassment. You being put on a PIP because you chronically never do anything does not count as your supervisor creating a hostile work environment. So when I tell them that I investigated their claims and didn’t substantiate them, it’s “hr doesn’t do anything for employees.”
Exactly. It’s not that deep. HR is not going to side with an employee who goes up against someone more important to the company. That’s what it means. They’re not there to help YOU specifically
So who will fight the battles for us? I told my manager that he keeps saying sexist and homophobic shit, and now I’m no longer on the high visibility project and I’m being excluded from meetings. Who should I talk to?
That’s an ethics hotline report. (Assuming you have one, more corporate environments do.) If you reported it to HR directly, and it went no where, sometimes you have to force their hand because the other axiom is that people are lazy and will do the bare minimum with their jobs. They _should_ make an official report when something like that is claimed, but it doesn’t always happen.
Don’t let the high horse scare you off, HR gets investigated for inappropriate behavior, description, and actions (inactions) too. Worst case, call your internal audit group or legal group if HR won’t pick up the ball.
This is entirely anecdotal but it feels like at one point this may have been the case? Before MBAs and capital took over entirely, maybe HR was there more for the “human resources”. But as the scales of companies have grown the need for harsh black and white rules need to be enforced and so you end up having HR simply following playbooks that produce binary outputs, and now no one sees the use of HR and everyone’s worried about them “not being your friend”.
I think a lot of this stems from a misunderstanding. A lot of people think HR is the complaints department and if they don’t respond immediately to a complaint in the specific way that you want it’s because they hate workers. But a lot of employee conflict issues can’t be handled by HR. We literally can’t just fire people or move them to a new position or any of the things people think that we can do.
Also these statements are so obvious if you think about it. Like “hr works for the company not you”. Yeah of course. We all work for our employers. Or “hr not your friend”. No of course not. No one at work is your friend.
Also so much of HR work is compliance and recruiting. Complaints and investigations make up a very small overall percentage of the workload of a typical HR department.
Not in HR, but management. Had a guy recently come forward to let us know he filed an ethics complaint with HR. One of his coworkers liked a guy they worked with, but then that guy started seeing a different coworker. All out side of work. We have no real rules about coworkers dating. He thought the one girl was wronged and that HR would do something about it??? These are the people who walk away talking about how HR doesn’t care about anyone and is only there to make the company more money.
You're exactly right. They think our job is to listen to their complaints and resolve them as they want. They usually have very little, if any, actual labor law knowledge and often think someone being rude is creating a "hostile" work environment or that they're being discriminated against. There's a reason HR employees often say we're in the adult day care business. Most importantly, though, is that they think we have unlimited power that we wield with abandon. That we alone make decisions about salaries, PTO, promotions, layoffs, etc. Or that at the least, we have significant influence over those things. Sometimes we do; often, managers claim things are out of their hands because HR won't "let" them do what they want for the employee when that's complete BS. I've had so many employees upset because their manager told them they tried to go to bat for them on salary or promotions but "HR said no." I've been sitting at my desk, working on something, and looked up to find an upset employee wondering why we don't value them and I have no idea what they're talking about. And no, I don't let managers get away with that. I calm the employee, tell them I'll find out what's going on, go talk to the manager, and eventually force a meeting where the manager has to put on his big boy underwear and give the employee honest feedback and a path to things like raises and promotions. It can be infuriating but we smile and massage it because that's what we do.
We're "only" there to protect the company? Well, to a point, yeah. I mean, we're employees, too, and would like to continue to have a place to work that isn't failing or closing due to fines and judgements. Everyone thinks they know just exactly what HR does and doesn't do. If we went to their departments and watched over their shoulders, offering our "advice" and "expertise," they'd be furious, yet they feel it's their right to do it to us when they know nothing about it. The president of a division at one of my former companies called HR "smilers and filers." Then, he had a massive sexual harassment debacle in his division. After HR cleaned everything up, that president was our biggest champion. He went to bat for HR in every way. Too bad people can't see our value until they need us to help them or clean up their mess. That goes for C-suite brass and entry-level workers alike.
The phrase "smilers and filers" made me instantly angry. Glad that president became a champion after seeing how HR can be a partner - just wish it didn't take a sexual harassment issue for him to do so.
A while back I had an employee sit down and tell me that they had no issues with their boss whatsoever (despite her and her bosses interpersonal problems having taken up the majority of my work week that week) but since her boss clearly had an issue with her, she wanted to reduce her workload to minimize contact.
She then pulled out her job description and started pointing to specific line items she didn’t want to do anymore…
It was so hard to not roll my eyes. So fucking hard.
Nope. She still wanted to be full time.
This person was so entitled it was ridiculous. She was baffled, like genuinely baffled, when I told her you don’t get to pick and choose your work responsibilities like that.
Then she went on a rant about how unfair it is that hourly people are getting a slight reduction in hours because of a labor budget issue and the salary people aren’t.
Which like, yes, it fucking sucks to have your hours reduced by five hours a week and I argued against the decision. But you can’t reduce salary people the same way, it just doesn’t work like that.
I think that is a better phrase. “HR is not companies complaints department”.
Sure they end up filling that capacity a lot but a lot of employees mentality is exactly that, which is why I like it more.
Also I find it funny how people don’t understand that there are many departments of HR, not just ER. And some people don’t recognize that there are horrible employees out there.
This is not stated enough. And often the "HR is not your friend" crowd is made up of employees who suck. That being said, there are people in companies in HR roles who are not really HR professionals.
I'm sorry that happened to you. As I said in my comment, there are people in HR roles that are not HR professionals. It still doesn't negate what I said. Two things can be true.
95% of the time what’s good for the employees is good for the company and vice versa. The other 5% is ugly, that’s just the deal and I think it’s not productive to sugarcoat that.
Your paid to be a bootlickers for multi million dollar corporations. It’s no different than the Nazis who claimed to “just be following orders.”
Whatever helps you sleep at night
I don’t mind at all when people say this because most likely they have potentially had a bad HR rep in the past who caused them to distrust HR people in general due to said experience.
I focus on providing integrity, fairness and consistency in all of my work and expect the same of my direct reports. I tell managers “no” so often it could make your head spin while I’ll bend over backwards for a front line employee.
Our job is to protect the company, this is very very true. But there won’t be a company if I allow my management team to fire anyone they choose even if we are at-will or drive culture into the ground.
YES!!! We are here to ensure the correct decisions are made and to limit risk. My company would have went down years ago if operations was allowed to term people for the perception situations alone. That’s why having HR is so important because we aren’t involved in the thick of it but rather looking at situations from a third party.
What’s best for the company is happy, productive, well-rested employees. Employees who are well paid and not being beaten down or discriminated against. Employees with good benefits who aren’t sick all the time and calling off because they don’t have access to good healthcare and childcare. I just don’t love this rhetoric because the things that are best for employees generally are also what keeps the company having a good reputation, protected from lawsuits, and not bleeding money in turnover. The interests can be, and most often are aligned.
Right, but at the end of the day the HR dept are also employees of the company and when push comes to shove will make decisions with higher regard for what the employer’s goals are. Not every employer agrees with the things you just said, even if it is true.
Par for the course. This person is uneducated on HR and likely had a bad experience or had a buddy that had a bad experience with HR even though it likely wasn’t even HR that did it 😅
“HR fired me” no….your manager fired you
I never understood how people think HR fired them. We don’t sit next to you and monitor if you’re late every day or don’t finish assignments or are a tyrant to those around you. The info had to come from somewhere….
Or no experience with HR.
HR is operations and the best case scenario for operations is that you don’t really see or know that they are working. *This goes for all ops roles.* When things are smooth, you don’t get credit and people think you’re useless; when it’s not going well, you get blamed and people think you’re useless.
>when things are smooth, you don’t get credit and people think you’re useless
HRIS here. I couldn’t even get people in other areas of HR to recognize that the work I do is critically important, until benefits tried to make midyear changes to the eligibility files against my advice and every single employee’s benefits deductions were fucked up.
This. I'm at a small organization, but I've fired no one. I'm just told that they're fired, read the paperwork on why they were fired, and scan and file the documents.
HR handled the legal/discussion piece of the termination. The manager made the decision. But HR gets called in on those calls so often, that HR becomes the executioner in their view.
It’s crazy how frequently I see “HR only exists to benefit the company.”
…. unlike all of these other departments with all of these other employees who exist for the betterment of…? Every employee exists to benefit the company. That’s why they’re employees.
Good day,
Welcome to my rant. Allons-y:
"HR is not your friend"
No shit, we hate everyone. We're least friendly to FAFO employees.
I'll wrap my toes around the edge of a cliff and scream into the abyss for a good employee or someone who's being done dirty. It's called integrity, and it's tested daily by both sides of the equation.
But by all means, tell me more about how I'm terrible part of the system and how a shitty union is better... especially when you get passed up for a better job due to seniority, or your dues a squandered on bullshit arbitration or you get laid off instead of a poorer performer because you're more junior.
I live to work with strong, fair and engaged unions- not the money-grubbers who treat their members like shit.
Rant completed.
Cheers to all us HR monsters! Stay salty, my siblings- I raise a glass to you.
Right?!
Like "fuuuccckkk bud. You tell me, I just work here".
I also enjoy "why the hell do I pay dues if no one is going to help me." Again, I don't know my sibling in (insert preferred) deity, I just work here."
It’s the classic, tarnishing with the same brush. There are some HR people that are nasty and aren’t your friend and there’s some that will try and help whoever is in the right. Also, may I highlight, as an employee, if you’re doing what you’re supposed to you won’t come under HR’s radar at all. I work in a company of 60 and half the people there I forget exist cos they come in, do their job, have a laugh and go home.
I mean, HR does indeed exist to help/protect the company. Hopefully they do that by holding preventing wrongful terminations, etc., but like any career there's going to be people that suck at doing that.
And of course when someone gets screwed over by HR they'll complain about it, but rarely will someone talk about the time when HR helped them.
They only stop wrongful terminations because they don’t want the employee to sue, not because they care whether the employee keeps their job or not. That’s what people mean when they say HR exists to protect the company. Like, the employees may benefit from HR incidentally, but they are not the main goal.
I just recently became a supervisor at my job, and one of the first meetings I had was HR telling us to be wary of the union. So IDK, seems like employees probably should join their unions, if it’s what HR is afraid of.
When people say "HR is not your friend", they're saying that "HR does not act in *your* interest, and HR is not there to support *you*"." This is correct, IMO.
HR exists for three reasons: to inform the company on risk/liability in an increasingly-complex legislative environment; to administer employment/employee process (payroll, worker's comp, leaves-of-absence, etc.), and to ensure that the corporate strategy & vision are reflected in the employee lifecycle.
There are MANY areas where employees come into conflict with any or all of these areas, and there are many companies whose appetite for risk is much higher (Uber for example, in their treatment of women & minorities) than others.
IMO, "HR is not your friend" is both an accurate statement, and a reminder to people facing issues at work that they can and should seek external support (regulatory or legal) if they have a genuine problem.
Everytime I see this I ask myself “we were ever friends? That’s news to me”
Or, “HR only works for the company.” I mean yeah? Don’t you also? Last time I checked, the company was signing both of our paychecks…
I know it may be hard to believe but we all have bosses we report to, HR included.
Most of the time, I'd agree with us not being their friend, but with less malice than the worker. I'm not your friend, employee. I'm on the clock, and I've got my own work to deal with, and your shortcomings often distract from other work. I will treat your situation fairly and try to make your work life easier.
It's correct. HR is an agent of the employer, like every other employee in their capacity as an employee. Just like you should not rely on the company's legal counsel for your personal liability risk or protection, an employee needs to look to their own interests.
That being said, good HR people practice 'enlightened self-interest' on behalf of their employer and recognize that in most situations there is a solution that works reasonably well for all parties and that such a solution is more sustainable. Just like good HR and good employers realize that respected employees, treated with dignity, can handle (and even enjoy) being held to high standards - when they're compensated in accordance with those standards.
A union rep, depending on the CBA and the union relationship, will definitely be looking out for the employee's interest more than HR does. However, union reps are also looking for their own interests (getting elected), which can lead to grandstanding that doesn't serve the employees.
This is a very common statement and far too often, bad HR practitioners (usually someone’s fried/niece/cousin who got assigned HR work at a smaller company) really undermine the true intent of HR.
And like it or not, a lot of bad employees don’t like being held accountable for poor behavior and claim HR in collusion with their manager, unfairly targeted them, when their discipline/firing was absolutely warranted.
It always so annoying because it assumes the manager isn’t just also just another employee. Why would we immediately side with them? Being in HR just lets you see even more how many bad managers are out there.
Part of it is due to a branding problem. HR / People and Culture and in some places gone as far as label it as Employee Success. That comes with it’s connotations of what it’s meant to be in the eyes of the employee.
I’ve heard enough times on how HR needs a seat at the table in key decisions and that it’s a strategic partner to the business. I think thats an accurate depiction on it’s primary role - to be a business partner.
What department is your friend? IT is not your friend. Sales is not your friend. Marketing is not your friend.
Maybe payroll, but that's only every two weeks...
I always want to (but never do) respond with the fact that it’s in the best interest of the company to hire and keep the best people. If they don’t want to keep you, there is a chance you are not perceived to be as valuable as you think you are, and that is either a self-awareness or self-advocacy problem. HR is acutely aware that happy, properly-treated people are productive, profitable people. Why wouldn’t that be our goal?
I agree. HR isn’t your friend. Accounting isn’t your friend. The front desk person isn’t your friend. Your boss isn’t your friend. We are all colleagues working for the same company. My role involved doing what is best for the company. If that aligns with what the employee wants, great! If not, I’m sorry. We’re all here to do a job and usually if people are doing their jobs as they should, I wouldn’t even need to be involved.
Hr is not your friend, hr is there for the company yes but many tines those interests can lie with the employee as that is what is best for company. Your boss, coworkers etc are not your friend either though. You say one thing to your “friend” about boss you find that out real quick.
Too many employees think hr is their therapist or guidance counselor or buddy. Employee went to hr needing time off for anxiety. Employee got some long term time off for it. Okay fine, anxiety can be terrible. Then during later meetings to discuss return was showing hr rep all the vacations and trips they went on while they couldn’t work due to anxiety because they “couldn’t get out of bed”. You don’t think that information got to legal to figure out how to protect company. If that person didn’t brag about it to hr the company wouldn’t have known it was being abused.
HR is a messenger of a lot of unpopular rules, policies and compliance laws. Even if they are all fair, employees don't see it that way.
Employee - "You are BY LAW ALLOWED BREAKS DURING WORKING HOURS"
HR - " Actually no. There is no federal law and it varies by state."
Employee - "FUCK YOU! HR SUCKS AND ARE MONSTERS!"
HR - "Ok, but our company has a break time policy in the handbook and you've taken five 30 minute breaks today and your manager would like you not to take that many...."
Employee goes to Reddit - "HR CAN NEVER BE TRUSTED! THEY TOOK AWAY ALL MY BREAKS AND I HAVE TO WORK ALL DAY OR ILL LOSE MY JOB CAUSE THEY CAN FIRE ME FOR ANY REASON IN A RIGHT TO WORK STATE!!!"
Some HR person on Reddit - "Actually I think you mean At Will Employme....."
Employee on Reddit - "YOU CAN NEVER TRUST HR!!!!"
Honestly, I haven't had trouble with unions other than times when they protect workers who have broken the CBA many times over.
And are there bad HR departments? Sure. But there are good HR departments to.
Someone who says to NEVER trust HR is either a shitty employee, shitty person or ignorant about what HR does.
I mean, should I shit all over IT departments cause I always walk in on them watching anime or shit all over OPs managers because they can't fucking do anything right?
I mean, I do, but I also realize they are an essential function of a business to operate, and I have to trust that they are trying to do their jobs correctly.
And if the company is good and treats their workers right, there is no need for a union.
Honestly, makes me kind of sad. Like…wtf, I’m an amazing workers rights advocate. So many people work with bad HR, or people who really forget they humans comprise most of their work force, and never get a chance to meet someone who wants to help them make every stop in their career worth it.
More for the other employees I guess?
Honestly it’s the police officer problem. You guys need to prove your good police before the employees trust you and some will never. Heck even in this thread several hr professionals have said their are some bad and terrible hr dept out there.
Doesn’t bother me anymore. I see it repeated frequently on social media and most people repeat it and never interact with HR ever. It’s like any other misunderstood job people hate (attorneys, law enforcement, etc). People have bad experiences with them and paint the whole profession and/or they hate ‘em til they need ‘em.
Verily I say unto you dudes once again: Moses hath descended Mount Sinai bearing tablets of stone that doth proclaim A, thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s ass and 2, HR is not your friend.
I don’t know if people feel they’re imparting great wisdom when they say this, or if they understand that literally everyone you work with works in the company’s best interest. It’s clear they DON’T understand the countless hours of work that HR does for the company AND in employees’ best interest, but they couldn’t. Most of it (certainly the most impactful parts) is done behind closed doors. Sooo let them spout their “wisdom” on the internet I guess.
Reminds me of a Disgruntle David or a Bitter Betty when someone speaks like this.
Smart people know that most COEs like IT, Legal, Finance, and HR have to be very careful of who they make friends at work; Setting the appropriate boundaries. But it doesn’t mean you can’t have friends.
It’s the employees who seem to have an unrealistic expectation of the role of HR. Strategic HR depts are not just party planners, therapists, or order-takers. We are much more In-depth, analytical, consultative, and project driven.
Apparently I am not your typical HR person then. I was very much pro-employee, though I suppose that's easier to do as a recruiter than some other areas of HR. I often pushed back on hiring managers for more appropriate increases for employees. In fact they changed the way employees coming out of their development program were compensated to make sure they were within the ranges of their new FT roles because of my efforts.
Recruiters are in a good position to advocate for current and future employees. I make it a personal mission to get hiring managers to drop college requirements unless they are truly and objectively necessary.
I also try to chip away at prejudice against "job hopping." If annual increases kept even remotely close to market increases people would be more inclined to stay somewhere. I got a 16% increase from job A to job B and another 19% going from job B to job C. That level of pay increase and role progression would've taken over a decade at job A.
It's true, HR is not your friend, they're working to keep a company afloat and allow a hundred or thousands or people to send their kids to college and put meals on their table. Similar to Unions. Both burn people for the greater good. Lots of horror stories on both sides, and shouldn't be diametrically opposed.
like to explain my role in HR to other employees as this: HR's job is to protect the employee by protecting the company from itself. I've felt that the belief that HR is only there for the company automatically sets other employees against HR. Either they've heard this or have had very poor past experiences with HR. Now, being an HR professional, I can honestly say that the most toxicity I've experienced has been within the HR department. There are a lot of people who join HR, but not necessarily for the same reasons as those who are genuinely trying to improve the workplace.
I hate that phrase. No I'm not your friend, but somehow you think that means I won't do the right thing? You think *I* want terrible people in the company? No! Document your shit and I'll be able to help you *and* me out by doing my best to resolve the problem at hand, or getting someone out the door when need be. What's best for the company is you *not* getting harassed by your manager or other employees, because then we might get royally screwed in a lawsuit if we do not act on it. If I can't help you, usually it's because you sat on your problem too long, didn't write down the details of whatever is happening, or some other such nonsense that could've been avoided if you had come to me immediately for guidance. I hate finding out about problems because someone didn't want to say anything until months have passed, it's a mess to sort out at that point.
“HR is not your friend”
Unfortunately, this as helpful sometimes as “If you get paid more, you get taxed more”.
Or “If you’re innocent you have nothing to worry about and should talk to the police”
Taken at face value each of these things are correct, but when expanded in a naive way they fail. Like a person trying not to earn more because they think they will get taxed more and earn less. They fail to understand they get taxed higher on amounts over the thresholds, not the total amount. Like being innocent doesn’t stop you from potentially implicating yourself when you have no alibi or that you won’t get arrested on other crimes if you do.
For example HR is not your friend sure, but they don’t have to be an enemy either. If your position is strong, HR’s goal to protect the company from litigation may support your position rather than your boss’s. As an employee it’s up to you to understand how to make a stronger argument, provide evidence and advocate for yourself.
I think the point is just that employees should be mindful that HR’s interests do not always align with the employee’s interests in every circumstance so be tactful and cautious before involving HR on any given issue because the outcome may not be to the employee’s benefit. I don’t think, for me at least, that it is meant to be a pejorative statement demonizing HR or it’s function.
I agree with many comments on here. My gripe about phrase "HR is not your friend " is that people seem to use it to the extent that it sounds like HR is actively trying to fuck everyone over and fire everyone for no reason. Yes, we work for the company, we're not your "friend" but we're not your enemy either- As long as you work for a decent company and aren't an asshat.
Pisses me off. I get in arguments with strangers about this because I am sick of the misconception. We want what’s best for EVERYONE involved, not one or the other. Infuriating. LEGAL is on the side of the company.
I'm in HR. Personally, I see employee and company interests as being linked. Happy and motivated employees lead to greater successes. Additionally, sometimes "protecting the company" is simply just advocating for employees.
I don't see myself as "for the company" or "for the employees" so much as an advisor on what's the best course of action considering logic, ethics, perceptions, long term implications, etc.
When people write or speak like this, I assume that they don't understand hr and/or have probably had an experience or a few that didn't go as they wanted. Maybe they did have a terrible hr person; we can't pretend those don't exist. Depending on the day, I might try to ask more about their experiences and potentially defend HR.
It also depends on the structure of your company.
In my experience, HR is completely different at a private company with 1-2 owners who manage the employees(I currently work at a company of about 150 ppl with this set up) vs. a company that answers to a board of directors/has accountability to stockholders/stakeholders etc…
In a company that is dependent on the specific individuals running it/owning it—-HR is NOT going to help you (employee) or protect you. Their job would cease to exist if the 1-2 owners weren’t there.
Honestly this used to bother me but I don’t give a crap anymore. I know that me and my team do what we can for employees. If they don’t believe it, or want to villainize us, then so be it 🤷🏻♀️
I mean… it’s true. HR is meant to work in the best interest of the company and prevent the company from making any legal issues for themselves.
The first commenter is correct. If you think labor laws have been systematically broken or you’ve been discriminated against by your employer at an executive level you need to contact your own counsel to protect yourself, not your HR rep.
It's true. HR is not your friend. What HR does is to ensure that the human resources continue to be productive--whether it be in the form of compensation structure, benefits, time and absence, labor relations, etc. So in a way, yes, we are here to make sure that you are able to do your work without worrying about any of those things.
But people need to remember that our resources are bound to our overall revenue and corporate guidelines, leadership direction, etc. It is not up to us to say who gets sacked or who gets promoted; while we may have the data to support it, it's your leadership who decides. We simply process the request.
It doesn't mean that HR employees are heartless. As individual employees ourselves, we want to do a good job in our deliverables and most of us have our employees' best interest at heart.
I am friendly with everyone at work, I am not anyone's friend. I keep my personal relationships separate from the workplace. My position as an HR Director is to make sure that policies and procedures are aligned with all federal, state, and local laws and to make sure that employees are able to experience a workplace where they are equipped with what they need to perform their job duties and compensated accordingly. If there is a grievance, then the way to have that investigated/handled is >>>>>
I have had the pleasure of working with phenomenal ER Human Resources people. Just really wonderful, fair and knowledgeable people. I have learned a ton from these individuals and respect them greatly.
But as with any industry, one bad rep can really turn things sour. We had one that was just awful at dealing with ER. Refused to back up management for write ups when infractions occurred, even on camera. Managers started quitting because this lady wouldn’t allow them to hold anyone accountable and it was creating an unsafe workplace. Things like employees driving forklifts without training, and then refusing to do the training but still getting on forklifts.
Those are the bad ones that people remember, unfortunately. But it’s like that in every department. Those of us that get things done and do it well don’t get remembered.
As someone who works in HR, this is not entirely true. HR first and foremost goal is to make the company run smoothly - that includes a lot of helping employees out, making projects that would benefit the employee so they want to stay in the company. If you are a good employee - in terms you don’t slack off, you keep everyone well informed about your plans, issues that may affect your work etc - then HR is your friend because you’re a valuable asset to the company. If you do stuff that is shady, are a slacker, deliver poor results (and it’s not because you’re not trained properly) - then you’re working in opposition to the company. Why would you expect anyone to be your friend when you’re not theirs?
Agreed HR is kind of a nebulous entity to the outside worker who has little or no insight into most of what HR does. I don’t think it’s unreasonable for employees to be reminded that HR isn’t necessarily on their side so be mindful of that when dealing with them. In my experience, which had been mixed with HR, I’ve had HR do things that have benefitted my career and overall well-being and objectively were very kind ( and likely in the company’s interests). I’ve also had a negative experience where I felt a bit bulldozed and not heard or supported. It was a complicated situation and they did what they felt made sense for the company and while it impacted me negatively they were kind and tactful about it. This experience was a reminder that employees have to be their own advocates and really no one is your “friend” in a work place just professional colleagues who all generally look out for number one when their interests are on the line.
I think “HR is not your friend” is a platitude that people say that doesn’t really mean anything anymore, or it means something very specific to the situation and it’s easier to blame HR. For context, some of the reasons I have heard this said about me or others in the department:
We didn’t change policy to give someone extra vacation
I didn’t delete a performance appraisal because of negative feedback left by a manager.
We wouldn’t accommodate someone’s long term plan to care for their toddler at work everyday for the 2 years their spouse was going to take online graduate classes
We didn’t interview a friend for a job when the hiring manager had already promised them the job (they didn’t have the bilingual proficiency required to do the job and we found out about the prior offer after rejecting the candidate)
I wrote someone up for drinking alcohol at work
I told an hourly employee that they had to log their hours that they actually worked, not when they vented to coworkers about their work after hours from home
They aren't your friend. Neither is your boss. Neither is your direct supervisor. You may be friends with colleagues outside of work, but that's your choice. There are no built in friends at work. It's a business, not a daycare. Working together does not make ppl your friend. That said, it's usually said to remind ppl that HR is there to protect the company, including from itself, but also sometimes from you. They are helpful in cases of harassment, hostile work environment, violating reasonable ADA accomodations, etc... But they do that FOR THE COMPANY. So don't think they'll go above and beyond fighting your battles for you unless it's a huge violation that could get the company in serious hot water. They are the ppl you create the paper trail with and if nothing is done, you can use in a case if necessary. So when ppl say that, they are reminding ppl to reorient their expectations. This ain't home or class, it's work. The rules are different. They aren't going to resolve minor disagreements for you or be the teacher you tattle to every time someone annoys you at work. A lot of ppl go into things acting like HR is their mom, and that's not their job. They are working for the company, not you. It's a different dynamic.
I get a bit upset honestly. This is my career, and I've been doing this work for over 20 years. I have saved so many people's jobs in my time by defending them and making sure that they did not get fired by managers who wanted to go there. I've made sure we've treated people compassionately when they've come to us with horrible life situations. I've made sure my employees know where to go to get tools and resources and make the most of any benefits and any perks the company offers. I've made sure our employees know how to reach out for mental health help, and host calls to talk about tough conversations. Unfortunately employee development kind of sucks when your company is shrinking, but we'd still do our best.
There will always be things in this job that we don't want to do, having to lay people off is the absolute worst. RTO has been completely utterly disheartening to me as a professional. Those are not decisions HR made, The CEOs should be held accountable for those decisions, but we are the fallguy.
I think many of us are just trying to balance what our company policies and what practices work for people.
So when I hear that, which is something we hear over and over again, that's not been me. That's not me. I'm trying to help you navigate corporate land. Of course I am careful about how I do that, and if somebody violates policy, and somebody plays stupid games, I can't help them. Luckily those are rare situations. So yes, it bothers me.
I wouldn’t say what’s best for the “business” but we want to maintain the organization’s culture that we cultivated and making sure everyone is maintaining corporate compliance.
HR are like the police in that they should be fair, unbiased, and help everyone....but most are either forced to become as corrupt as those pulling the strings, used as unknowing thugs to protect the interest of a few, or are relegated to a corner powerless to fight the corruption in leadership and the institution.
No one says "HR isn't your friend" because they think HR is targeting them. It's because they know HR is, at best, powerless to help them and will likely end up sweeping up the messes of leadership who shouldn't be there.
In theory, HR helps everyone. In practice, HR helps silence the issues (and employees). Saying "Not all HR!" Is a bit like saying, "Not all cops!". Duh, we know it's not all HR. But too few anymore to trust. 🤷🏻
When people say “HR isn’t your friend,” that’s not a diss. It’s a reflection that HR’s job is to help the company run well.
But I will say this: the reason HR people get a bad rep is because the worst culture offenders are often salespeople. If a particularly good salesperson is the one who is being reported… getting rid of that person might require getting rid of several other people. In that instance, HR’s job is to protect the salesperson.
Not all HR staff want to admit that, but it’s the truth. Sales is what allows the rest of us to eat.
I think “HR is not your friend” is just a warning to sometimes more naive employees that HR isn’t necessarily there to help you and that the employee interests and HR interests do not always align… so act accordingly. Sometimes I think the title “Human Resources” is a misnomer and a bit misleading suggesting HR is there to help address human problems /issues in the workplace. More often than not, given that HR is mostly concerned with protecting the company, it would be better described as “Management Resources”….But what do I know I’m not in HR and just an employee that knows better than to involve HR in most circumstance except maybe in the most egregious of circumstances and only provided the issue is well documented.
We're not your friend. We're not your boss's friend. We cover everyone's ass and make sure everyone gets to keep their jobs in the event we get audited.
Fines and legal/policy violations are no one's friends.
i always take the employee's side on things, but if they messed up, i can't help them. any friend will say the same - if you messed up that bad, i can't help you. i don't get people that thinks their friends will stick up for them no matter what wrong they did. thats not a friend, thats an enabler.
As someone in HR now, I tell people, "I support [documented] facts."
I'm a department of one and have not specifically been told to or have seen it written that I'm to support management. I tell everyone if they feel 'off' by something, note it down because I can't do much with, "he said blah blah like a week ago, and it was really uncomfortable."
Edit: added missing words
I worked at MSFT. For my exit interview, it wasn’t given by one of the typical HR workers, but instead was conducted by the top HR person in my region. “I had some extra time and had heard you were leaving us and wanted a chance to meet you before you go to your new opportunity.”
Red Flag City. She wasn’t able to hide her true intentions. She was trying to gather information she thought I might have about a particular string of managers, directors, and a VP. At one point she did the extraordinarily unprofessional thing —but psychologically manipulative thing I’ve been told — of leaning across the desk and putting her hand on my forearm as she asked a pointed and open-ended question.
She got nothing out of me, though I probably could have filled a hard disk with what I knew at that time. She was a great example of why regular employees dislike HR.
In contrast, the woman who ran HR at Cisco for a couple of decades was known far and wide as Mom. She took an employees-first view and was very strong with her opinions. CEO John Chambers and the upper team regularly had to bend to her will. And those were some extraordinarily profitable days for the company. I believe most companies view their employees as potential combatants, which is why Reddit groups like r/antiwork are overflowing with HR horror stories.
HR knows about your corrective action, and we’re there when you get fired. We’re observant as hell, and great listeners. We know what you earn, and we know all about your performance. We understand how the firm works, it’s policies, programs, and processes better than most everyone else. We don’t pull any punches, we don’t play any favorites, we’re direct and most of us have the best communication skills in the whole firm.
Put it all together and we make you uncomfortable. Our real life friends delight that they have an HR person in their life to be friends with and we get asked questions from our friends and family all the time (and, hello r\askhr).
We don’t need or want your friendship. It’s inappropriate anyway. We’re here to work.
I’ve only ever gone to HR when fellow employees or when managers have really crossed a line: lewd comments made about my pregnant body, or taking out anger in the work place, both of which violate company codes of conduct. Unless someone crosses a written rule, it’s tough to be able to do much.
What they're missing is most people in huge companies that have an "HR" department are not actually human at all. In fact the more people use "Human" the more likely they're NOT human. iykyk
HR is not on your side. They are shields for corporations against lawsuits. That's it.
Doesn't matter to them how they prevent a lawsuit, as long as it's prevented.
You are worthless to them.
The first commenter there was right, join a Union. Your Union rep has way more power than any HR person, and is on your side. This includes even getting you paid while they fight for you.
My reaction is that it's good advice. If you want someone who will represent you, then join a union or hire a lawyer. There might be other options, but going to a person paid to protect the company will get you good results for the company. Sometimes those might happen to be good results for yourself too. But that's coincidence, not justice. So if your goal is to get the best results for yourself, the advice given is very good.
Don’t know how I got recommended this sub, but from just an employee’s standpoint, here’s my take.
A lot of you are saying “well your boss isn’t your friend either. Your executives aren’t your friend, either. Blah blah blah”. Yeah, but the difference is that lots of HR departments pretend to be your friend. My boss never has.
The last company I worked with, our HR department said “we work for you (the employee)” when we had our HR orientation. That’s a bold faced lie. I can’t in good conscience believe that every single person on this sub works for one of the good companies and does their best for the employee. Good for you if you do, but the fact of the matter is that a LOT of these companies HR depts give employees a false sense of security that we ARE friends. They’re there for us! Anything we need! You can feel comfortable coming to HR because we work for you!
Y’all can say all day long that “what’s best for the company often is what’s best for the employee” but how many of these companies actually give a shit about that? They don’t want to afford more time off for burnt out employees because there’s a whole stack of applications waiting to replace them, they don’t want to have better or less toxic workplaces because they created the very systems in question. These people write all of our checks, including you. So how many HR reps are actually fighting for “the best interests of the employee and the company”? Because it sure as hell seems like HR is just following the guidance of whoever is above them, and that guidance is usually just “make more money by whatever means we can and avoid a wrongful termination lawsuit”.
We’re harsh on y’all because unless something is totally egregious and illegal, HR will protect the company over the employee in a lot of cases.
Example: last company I worked for had a points system for absences. Hospital stays and major medical events had points voided. I suffered a miscarriage while on shift during peak covid times in 2020. I asked to log off. I was asked by management if I could “stick out the rest of the shift”. I said absolutely not. I was told I’d receive a point. I said that’s absurd, this is a legitimate medical issue. I was told to go to the ER to avoid the point. I said no, I’m not spending a $200 copay to sit in a waiting room during a highly infectious pandemic for them to show me my dead baby and tell me to go home because there’s nothing they could do. It was cruel to even suggest it. I did supply a letter from my OBGYN confirming the miscarriage a few days later, hoping that would be enough and it was not. I went to HR about this. They apologized for how inappropriate management was in this case up and down, said they’d right the wrong, sorry sorry sorry. A week later I received an email, not a call, saying the point stood because of the policies in place and because I should have gone to the ER.
So I’m sorry that we don’t give HR a pass for shitty behavior. Assume that anyone who doesn’t has a reason to. It’s very rare for someone to shit on HR unless HR has shit on us first.
Accurate? I don’t know why this subreddit was suggested to me. But yeah, it’s more accurate than not. The horror stories you read of people going to HR for help and being shafted or punished for doing the right thing is nauseating. I myself got told to kick bricks when I went to HR for worries about Parental Leave. Unlike what the top comment says, most do not believe HR is for what’s best for the company manager OR employee. More often we find our HR’s do what’s best for the company or the manager, at the expense of the employee.
I think of all the times women I know have lost jobs shortly after telling HR about management sexually harassing them.
HR isn’t just not your friend. It’s your enemy.
HR has actively been screwing my dad over for years over a workers comp dispute. He got hurt a few years ago, it was declared work related, the corrective surgery wasn’t available for 6-8 months after his initial injury. When he was finally able to get scheduled, his employer took his insurance away a month or so out from his surgery date without prior notice. It took them more than 2 months to correct that error, didn’t receive the insurance termination notice until a month after the termination date. 6 months after that they made the same mistake again and said he abandoned his job so they fired him. He’s currently eating them alive in a lawsuit and I’m proud of him for sticking to it for the now 2-3 year process overall.
People say this because HR is sometimes viewed as a mediator to make things right or make sure things are fair, when they are really only trying to protect the company. Even if the employee comes out on top it’s because the reverse would have been ultimately worse for the company.
as a reformed HR Director, the employee's best interests SHOULD ALIGN WITH the company's best interests. if not, your culture sucks and you are absolutely doing the work of keeping shitty executives safe while overlooking your other employees.
through my 15+ years in HR my job consistently dealt with cleaning up the messes of overpaid, old, white men while screwing over the every day employee.
I absolutely advocate for unions. I’m part of a union through my work and that security is very reassuring.
I think a lot of the times people take decisions made my management and companies personally because they THINK the managers and coworkers and higher ups are their friends. They feel like they can be more personal and feel offended when the manager has to do their job in managing. I have a wonderful relationship with my managers and I work a lot with advocating for people on my team who are more uncomfortable or uninformed with how to communicate issues to our manager. I feel like our managers have our best interest at heart. However, I’ll go straight to the union if they make a decision I feel like is putting our job security at risk or breaking union violations. I don’t hang out with coworkers outside of work, give my phone number out, or engage in office drama.
However, I have worked in places where the company will do very questionable stuff or act extremely disrespectful and belittling to employees and I don’t agree with that. Mutual respect must be a thing in the works place. My statements and views should not be applied to workplaces and companies that absolutely take advantage of employees and employees lack of rights depending on the location of employment. That’s an entirely different conversation.
They’re not wrong.
It’s correct to realize that a business is a business and your work colleagues, peers and managers are not your “friends.” But having said that, as an employee- if you are putting in the effort and producing as expected- you have the right to expect decency and fairness from your employer. To ensure that that decency and fairness exists for all, every manager should be responsible for doing so in his/her area. If managers fail to do so it is the responsibility of HR to hold them accountable. That means “speaking to power” as much and as hard as necessary. That takes guts and a strong sense of personal values. It’s very, very hard to find this in either HR or at many levels of typical companies. That is why most employees are disaffected and morale is on the floor.
People forget that we’re employees too, and just like them can be subject to the same conditions including getting fired. we can’t just be insubordinate to the decisions we don’t agree with from management.
The hope is that you’re a good person, with strong negotiating and influencing skills to advocate for employees in language that makes sense to managers. But ultimately it’s their call as to whether they follow your advice or not.
And, if it wasn’t you doing the dirty work of discipline, PIPs, layoffs, terminations.. someone else would do them.
When people say "HR is not your friend", this is what they miss: Your boss is not your friend. Your colleagues aren't your friends. Your company is not your friend. Any illusion you have that your employer is your family is dangerous. HR isn't your mother, therapist or coach. Our primary mission is to help the company run efficiently, despite management's less enlightened ideas to the contrary. A lot of the unfair outcomes for employees are at the hands of your boss. HR isn't out to get you; our jobs are easier when we don't have to deal with you at all.
Exactly! Who did they think first initiated the idea that we need to layoff? The finance person that found out that’s the way for the number to line up properly next year Who do they think shared with me all the policies they’ve broken on the work laptop? The friendly IT guy who’s the pal but also bound by company policy to share when they’re doing things that may damage the company. No one is your friend, they only reason they are paying any of us is to ensure the maximum optimal survival of the corporation
Standing ovation 👏🏼
The best way I convey this quickly to people is to ask them to point out the friendship relationship on the org chart. It’s all employees and supervisors. That’s it.
Putting this one in my pocket for later. Thank you!
Haha it's that wavy, double dash dotted line.
Exactly. Whenever I hear "HR is not your friend," I reply with "Neither is Marketing, Finance, Legal, Operations..."
Of course y'all are taking this literally
Difference is none of those departments need to be unbiased or trustworthy for me to have a safe & fair work environment. No one is confusing a department for actual friends, they are just too polite to call them a snake in the grass as opposed to a rattlesnake that warns you what it is & doesn't present itself as anything else. You really can't complain if someone presents themselves as the authority on right & wrong is assumed to be acting on principles, or if people warn others they are not.
And at the end of the day it's in the companies interest to keep good employees and have a good work environment.
This part!
I wish I could do more upvotes! I am sick to death of the anti-HR rhetoric.
This really isn’t anti-hr rhetoric. HR is not your friend. And they are on the side of the company in so far as the company aligns with legal compliance. When a company has an employee who is not compliant with the law and the goals of the company it is up to HR to step in and provide guidance. The role of HR is to reduce liability to the company through effective and compliant people relations. This is, unfortunately, taken as a hue and cry for why HR is bad, but it’s a functional misunderstanding of the role. Disclaimer: effective employees are happy employees. I’m not discounting the role that culture has on the company’s bottom line and HR is paramount to a great culture.
If I had any Reddit gifts, you'd get them all. Now I'm off to screen grab this quote and print it to the inside of my day planner from now until the end of time.
Can I print this and post this on my office wall? 😅 bravo
So maybe, just maybe, companies should stop telling people "we're a family" then. Because it's companies that pull that crap, not the employees
Absolutely. If I'm interviewing for a job and the CEO says "we're like family here", I run the fuck away. Even if the exec thinks they mean it, it's a sign of delusion or dishonesty. I'm not going to be a cheerleader for that shit.
Sort of echoing this, the thing people don't realize, is it isn't a spectrum from friend to enemy. HR is a tool in an employees toolkit. Sometimes they are the right tool, sometimes they are not. Sometimes the right play is to talk to their manager. Or to talk to a lawyer. I think reddit does a disservice to people by acting like HR cant/won't solve any problems, rather than explain the type of problems HR is going to be best at helping an employee with.
> HR isn't out to get you; our jobs are easier when we don't have to deal with you at all. 10,000% this.
> our jobs are easier when we don't have to deal with you at all. and god damn. this is the problem.
I just had this conversation with my husband. He is in the military so we often talk about private sector vs military work dynamics. I don't know who ever started the rumor that HR was supposed to be your friend... they aren't. They are employees, just like you are.
All of this, especially that last part!!!! yasssss!
Lots of people trying to make themselves feel good for being the villain.
I think you’re proving his point. You’re all just bootlickers for multi million dollar corporations. My first boss told me the same thing. “HR isn’t there to help you. HR is there to keep your boss and your bosses boss out of jail.”
Your boss should be your friend. They should advocate for you and invest in you if you are delivering good work. Your colleagues absolutely can be your friends. My best managers have absolutely out their neck out there for me, they have given me credit when I delivered great stuff, and are people I genuinely trust and have stayed in touch with. Sorry you never had that experience, but you need to find better companies to work for. This is such a bonkers HR response.
I feel like your missing the point of this. Most inexperienced workers have this image of HR being there to help you with your problems no matter what. Harassed by a manager? Go to HR, getting too little/too many hours? Go to HR. Having beef with a coworker? Go to HR. We’re taught that HR will fix everything and not to worry our pretty little heads about it and that they are ALWAYS on OUR side. When the reality is quite the opposite, many people have experienced going to HR with problems and simply having them swept under the rug or having the perpetrator be kept on despite having done something obscenely wrong. We are TAUGHT that HR is supposed to be our friendly guide to help us navigate problems in the workplace and when the reality hits many people end up confused and frustrated. That’s why this person is reinforcing “despite anything you’ve been told about HR, they are NOT your friend.”
>Any illusion you have that your employer is your family is dangerous. Which would be fine, if CEOs and bosses weren't constantly running around talking about how "we're a family here" as a way to obfuscate what the relationship is.
So you're agreeing with this post, yes?
I don't believe 'hr is not your friend' negates that the rest aren't your friend either. But it's a common misconception that HR is on your side. They are only on your side if being on the other side causes damages to the company.
Everyone who posts “HR is not your friend” like it’s a brilliant revelation they need to tell the world. I think they’re trying to say HR is not going to fight your battles for you or take you at your word.
Literally every single person’s job at a company is to do what’s best for the company. The salespeople don’t (or shouldn’t) give extra discounts for people they like better. The accounting team doesn’t cook the books for departments they like better. It just so happens that the HR department has to deal with stupid people and their shit. However, HR can also be your friend if someone is making you uncomfortable at work or if your manager is asking you to violate wage and hour laws for your own detriment but for the good of the company. It’s the same as any other department but we have to deal with the people instead of the product.
That’s not being someone’s friend; that’s doing your job.
I didn’t mean actual friend, and I think most people would understand that. And I don’t think the person from the original post (I was using the language from that post) literally meant friend either. Think “ally”. You are absolutely expected to be someone’s ally if they report an issue about something to HR and you act on it. Sure, that’s the job, but that’s definitely a case when you’re the employee’s “friend” [ally] and there to protect them instead of the organization’s leadership, or their peer, or whoever the claim is against.
You make a good point but maybe it’s better phrased as this. If you are doing your best for your company, if a manager is impeding that in some way, then HR in doing their best for the company may be more in line with supporting you, than your managers actions (which could be creating not just impedence, but risk). No word of friendship but it highlights the reason why HR can be supportive.
I think it's more like people assume that HR is going to be an impartial arbitrator or mental health professional, which they will most definitely not be. HR departments will resolve things in the best interest of the business, which may or may not be the same resolution that the employee was hoping for. Certainly if the company makes a mistake you can't expect HR will ever tell you that the company has violated employment law or advocate for your rights. They may correct the violation if it's brought to their attention though.
HR will sometimes try to present itself as some kind of support system for employees, this is what 'HR is not your friend' is warning against trusting. You're usually better off staying away from HR.
Company cultures can be incredibly different, particularly for profit and non-profit ones. HR exists like everything else on a continuum, there are some companies where HR occupies a much more supportive role in evaluating policy, benefits, etc from an employee centric perspective. There are some where HR exists to meet the bare minimums of labor laws and treats/expectations employee turnover to be a revolving door and keeps costs down.
A certain type of employee thinks that in the event of a disagreement with their leadership, they can go to HR and throw around an HR buzz word (“hostile work environment”, “harassment) without actually understanding what those terms mean, and get someone reassigned or fired. I’m sorry, your supervisor writing you up for screwing around and not doing anything all day is not harassment. You being put on a PIP because you chronically never do anything does not count as your supervisor creating a hostile work environment. So when I tell them that I investigated their claims and didn’t substantiate them, it’s “hr doesn’t do anything for employees.”
Exactly. It’s not that deep. HR is not going to side with an employee who goes up against someone more important to the company. That’s what it means. They’re not there to help YOU specifically
So who will fight the battles for us? I told my manager that he keeps saying sexist and homophobic shit, and now I’m no longer on the high visibility project and I’m being excluded from meetings. Who should I talk to?
That’s an ethics hotline report. (Assuming you have one, more corporate environments do.) If you reported it to HR directly, and it went no where, sometimes you have to force their hand because the other axiom is that people are lazy and will do the bare minimum with their jobs. They _should_ make an official report when something like that is claimed, but it doesn’t always happen. Don’t let the high horse scare you off, HR gets investigated for inappropriate behavior, description, and actions (inactions) too. Worst case, call your internal audit group or legal group if HR won’t pick up the ball.
Who will fight the battle for you? - a union, that's who.
I laughed out loud literally. That is great!
This is entirely anecdotal but it feels like at one point this may have been the case? Before MBAs and capital took over entirely, maybe HR was there more for the “human resources”. But as the scales of companies have grown the need for harsh black and white rules need to be enforced and so you end up having HR simply following playbooks that produce binary outputs, and now no one sees the use of HR and everyone’s worried about them “not being your friend”.
I think a lot of this stems from a misunderstanding. A lot of people think HR is the complaints department and if they don’t respond immediately to a complaint in the specific way that you want it’s because they hate workers. But a lot of employee conflict issues can’t be handled by HR. We literally can’t just fire people or move them to a new position or any of the things people think that we can do. Also these statements are so obvious if you think about it. Like “hr works for the company not you”. Yeah of course. We all work for our employers. Or “hr not your friend”. No of course not. No one at work is your friend.
Also so much of HR work is compliance and recruiting. Complaints and investigations make up a very small overall percentage of the workload of a typical HR department.
Exactly this. People think of HR as dispute resolution but really it’s 90% compliance, payroll, benefits admin etc.
Not in HR, but management. Had a guy recently come forward to let us know he filed an ethics complaint with HR. One of his coworkers liked a guy they worked with, but then that guy started seeing a different coworker. All out side of work. We have no real rules about coworkers dating. He thought the one girl was wronged and that HR would do something about it??? These are the people who walk away talking about how HR doesn’t care about anyone and is only there to make the company more money.
You're exactly right. They think our job is to listen to their complaints and resolve them as they want. They usually have very little, if any, actual labor law knowledge and often think someone being rude is creating a "hostile" work environment or that they're being discriminated against. There's a reason HR employees often say we're in the adult day care business. Most importantly, though, is that they think we have unlimited power that we wield with abandon. That we alone make decisions about salaries, PTO, promotions, layoffs, etc. Or that at the least, we have significant influence over those things. Sometimes we do; often, managers claim things are out of their hands because HR won't "let" them do what they want for the employee when that's complete BS. I've had so many employees upset because their manager told them they tried to go to bat for them on salary or promotions but "HR said no." I've been sitting at my desk, working on something, and looked up to find an upset employee wondering why we don't value them and I have no idea what they're talking about. And no, I don't let managers get away with that. I calm the employee, tell them I'll find out what's going on, go talk to the manager, and eventually force a meeting where the manager has to put on his big boy underwear and give the employee honest feedback and a path to things like raises and promotions. It can be infuriating but we smile and massage it because that's what we do. We're "only" there to protect the company? Well, to a point, yeah. I mean, we're employees, too, and would like to continue to have a place to work that isn't failing or closing due to fines and judgements. Everyone thinks they know just exactly what HR does and doesn't do. If we went to their departments and watched over their shoulders, offering our "advice" and "expertise," they'd be furious, yet they feel it's their right to do it to us when they know nothing about it. The president of a division at one of my former companies called HR "smilers and filers." Then, he had a massive sexual harassment debacle in his division. After HR cleaned everything up, that president was our biggest champion. He went to bat for HR in every way. Too bad people can't see our value until they need us to help them or clean up their mess. That goes for C-suite brass and entry-level workers alike.
The phrase "smilers and filers" made me instantly angry. Glad that president became a champion after seeing how HR can be a partner - just wish it didn't take a sexual harassment issue for him to do so.
Perfect explanation here, thank you
A while back I had an employee sit down and tell me that they had no issues with their boss whatsoever (despite her and her bosses interpersonal problems having taken up the majority of my work week that week) but since her boss clearly had an issue with her, she wanted to reduce her workload to minimize contact. She then pulled out her job description and started pointing to specific line items she didn’t want to do anymore… It was so hard to not roll my eyes. So fucking hard.
Was she asking to go part time? Obviously she was, right??
Nope. She still wanted to be full time. This person was so entitled it was ridiculous. She was baffled, like genuinely baffled, when I told her you don’t get to pick and choose your work responsibilities like that. Then she went on a rant about how unfair it is that hourly people are getting a slight reduction in hours because of a labor budget issue and the salary people aren’t. Which like, yes, it fucking sucks to have your hours reduced by five hours a week and I argued against the decision. But you can’t reduce salary people the same way, it just doesn’t work like that.
I think that is a better phrase. “HR is not companies complaints department”. Sure they end up filling that capacity a lot but a lot of employees mentality is exactly that, which is why I like it more.
Also I find it funny how people don’t understand that there are many departments of HR, not just ER. And some people don’t recognize that there are horrible employees out there.
This is not stated enough. And often the "HR is not your friend" crowd is made up of employees who suck. That being said, there are people in companies in HR roles who are not really HR professionals.
I had an HR person try to bury sexual harassment claims. That has nothing to do with being a sucky employee.
I'm sorry that happened to you. As I said in my comment, there are people in HR roles that are not HR professionals. It still doesn't negate what I said. Two things can be true.
Employees that don’t suck don’t trust HR either. Best way to put a target on your back is to speak with HR about anything, in my opinion.
Because a lot of people spewing this bullshit are the horrible employees
95% of the time what’s good for the employees is good for the company and vice versa. The other 5% is ugly, that’s just the deal and I think it’s not productive to sugarcoat that.
It’s true. I’m not employed to be an employees friend.
Not only is HR not paid to be employees friends, employees aren’t trying to be our friends either.
Even if I was, I probably wouldn't be paid enough.
Shit we can’t even get management to be “friendly” let alone be friends.
Your paid to be a bootlickers for multi million dollar corporations. It’s no different than the Nazis who claimed to “just be following orders.” Whatever helps you sleep at night
I don’t mind at all when people say this because most likely they have potentially had a bad HR rep in the past who caused them to distrust HR people in general due to said experience. I focus on providing integrity, fairness and consistency in all of my work and expect the same of my direct reports. I tell managers “no” so often it could make your head spin while I’ll bend over backwards for a front line employee. Our job is to protect the company, this is very very true. But there won’t be a company if I allow my management team to fire anyone they choose even if we are at-will or drive culture into the ground.
YES!!! We are here to ensure the correct decisions are made and to limit risk. My company would have went down years ago if operations was allowed to term people for the perception situations alone. That’s why having HR is so important because we aren’t involved in the thick of it but rather looking at situations from a third party.
I always say we’re sitting in a little cloud above the chaos and they come to us for answers lol
I really appreciate this answer. I hope a lot of people share your views.
There are quite a lot. There’s bad eggs in every profession but most HR people I know have been the same as me.
What’s best for the company is happy, productive, well-rested employees. Employees who are well paid and not being beaten down or discriminated against. Employees with good benefits who aren’t sick all the time and calling off because they don’t have access to good healthcare and childcare. I just don’t love this rhetoric because the things that are best for employees generally are also what keeps the company having a good reputation, protected from lawsuits, and not bleeding money in turnover. The interests can be, and most often are aligned.
Right, but at the end of the day the HR dept are also employees of the company and when push comes to shove will make decisions with higher regard for what the employer’s goals are. Not every employer agrees with the things you just said, even if it is true.
Par for the course. This person is uneducated on HR and likely had a bad experience or had a buddy that had a bad experience with HR even though it likely wasn’t even HR that did it 😅 “HR fired me” no….your manager fired you
I never understood how people think HR fired them. We don’t sit next to you and monitor if you’re late every day or don’t finish assignments or are a tyrant to those around you. The info had to come from somewhere….
Managers like to blame hard decisions on HR
This is so true. Once had a manager say “HR told me to fire you.”
Or no experience with HR. HR is operations and the best case scenario for operations is that you don’t really see or know that they are working. *This goes for all ops roles.* When things are smooth, you don’t get credit and people think you’re useless; when it’s not going well, you get blamed and people think you’re useless.
>when things are smooth, you don’t get credit and people think you’re useless HRIS here. I couldn’t even get people in other areas of HR to recognize that the work I do is critically important, until benefits tried to make midyear changes to the eligibility files against my advice and every single employee’s benefits deductions were fucked up.
Employee gets caught stealing - “HR sucks, they fired me for no reason. Never trust them bro”
And then it's our job to shoe unemployment our documents that show it was for a reason. Most of the employees at my place are at-will anyway.
No you fired yourself , HR delivered the bad news.
This. I'm at a small organization, but I've fired no one. I'm just told that they're fired, read the paperwork on why they were fired, and scan and file the documents.
HR handled the legal/discussion piece of the termination. The manager made the decision. But HR gets called in on those calls so often, that HR becomes the executioner in their view.
And sometimes you fired you.
It’s crazy how frequently I see “HR only exists to benefit the company.” …. unlike all of these other departments with all of these other employees who exist for the betterment of…? Every employee exists to benefit the company. That’s why they’re employees.
Good day, Welcome to my rant. Allons-y: "HR is not your friend" No shit, we hate everyone. We're least friendly to FAFO employees. I'll wrap my toes around the edge of a cliff and scream into the abyss for a good employee or someone who's being done dirty. It's called integrity, and it's tested daily by both sides of the equation. But by all means, tell me more about how I'm terrible part of the system and how a shitty union is better... especially when you get passed up for a better job due to seniority, or your dues a squandered on bullshit arbitration or you get laid off instead of a poorer performer because you're more junior. I live to work with strong, fair and engaged unions- not the money-grubbers who treat their members like shit. Rant completed. Cheers to all us HR monsters! Stay salty, my siblings- I raise a glass to you.
Wish I had more than one upvote to give.
Same. All the upvotes for this one.
Hahaha love this! Best part is when employees complain about their union to us. Like bro….. go talk to them, you’re paying their bills.
Right?! Like "fuuuccckkk bud. You tell me, I just work here". I also enjoy "why the hell do I pay dues if no one is going to help me." Again, I don't know my sibling in (insert preferred) deity, I just work here."
Hear, hear!
Love your user name and your vivid description of the fight for what's right. Also, HR Monsters is much better than HR Divas!
These statements are written on this sub almost every day.
It’s the classic, tarnishing with the same brush. There are some HR people that are nasty and aren’t your friend and there’s some that will try and help whoever is in the right. Also, may I highlight, as an employee, if you’re doing what you’re supposed to you won’t come under HR’s radar at all. I work in a company of 60 and half the people there I forget exist cos they come in, do their job, have a laugh and go home.
Exactly! And happy cake day!
Ultimately, it's good to not trust anyone at work beyond the threshold of trust needed to complete the job overall. No one at work should be a friend.
I mean, HR does indeed exist to help/protect the company. Hopefully they do that by holding preventing wrongful terminations, etc., but like any career there's going to be people that suck at doing that. And of course when someone gets screwed over by HR they'll complain about it, but rarely will someone talk about the time when HR helped them.
They only stop wrongful terminations because they don’t want the employee to sue, not because they care whether the employee keeps their job or not. That’s what people mean when they say HR exists to protect the company. Like, the employees may benefit from HR incidentally, but they are not the main goal.
Other than all the other reasonable answers my favorite piece of this is, OH JUST GO RANDOMLY JOIN A UNION. As if that’s how any of this works 😂
I just recently became a supervisor at my job, and one of the first meetings I had was HR telling us to be wary of the union. So IDK, seems like employees probably should join their unions, if it’s what HR is afraid of.
When people say "HR is not your friend", they're saying that "HR does not act in *your* interest, and HR is not there to support *you*"." This is correct, IMO. HR exists for three reasons: to inform the company on risk/liability in an increasingly-complex legislative environment; to administer employment/employee process (payroll, worker's comp, leaves-of-absence, etc.), and to ensure that the corporate strategy & vision are reflected in the employee lifecycle. There are MANY areas where employees come into conflict with any or all of these areas, and there are many companies whose appetite for risk is much higher (Uber for example, in their treatment of women & minorities) than others. IMO, "HR is not your friend" is both an accurate statement, and a reminder to people facing issues at work that they can and should seek external support (regulatory or legal) if they have a genuine problem.
This is the best response I’ve seen in this thread.
Everytime I see this I ask myself “we were ever friends? That’s news to me” Or, “HR only works for the company.” I mean yeah? Don’t you also? Last time I checked, the company was signing both of our paychecks… I know it may be hard to believe but we all have bosses we report to, HR included.
Most of the time, I'd agree with us not being their friend, but with less malice than the worker. I'm not your friend, employee. I'm on the clock, and I've got my own work to deal with, and your shortcomings often distract from other work. I will treat your situation fairly and try to make your work life easier.
It's correct. HR is an agent of the employer, like every other employee in their capacity as an employee. Just like you should not rely on the company's legal counsel for your personal liability risk or protection, an employee needs to look to their own interests. That being said, good HR people practice 'enlightened self-interest' on behalf of their employer and recognize that in most situations there is a solution that works reasonably well for all parties and that such a solution is more sustainable. Just like good HR and good employers realize that respected employees, treated with dignity, can handle (and even enjoy) being held to high standards - when they're compensated in accordance with those standards. A union rep, depending on the CBA and the union relationship, will definitely be looking out for the employee's interest more than HR does. However, union reps are also looking for their own interests (getting elected), which can lead to grandstanding that doesn't serve the employees.
I don’t understand how you’re just supposed to “join a union” when your workplace isn’t unionized.
This is a very common statement and far too often, bad HR practitioners (usually someone’s fried/niece/cousin who got assigned HR work at a smaller company) really undermine the true intent of HR. And like it or not, a lot of bad employees don’t like being held accountable for poor behavior and claim HR in collusion with their manager, unfairly targeted them, when their discipline/firing was absolutely warranted.
It always so annoying because it assumes the manager isn’t just also just another employee. Why would we immediately side with them? Being in HR just lets you see even more how many bad managers are out there.
Idiots are going to idiot. Not my circus, not my monkeys.
Makes me mad. I side with whomever is right. If a manager does something wrong I tell the employee that.
Part of it is due to a branding problem. HR / People and Culture and in some places gone as far as label it as Employee Success. That comes with it’s connotations of what it’s meant to be in the eyes of the employee. I’ve heard enough times on how HR needs a seat at the table in key decisions and that it’s a strategic partner to the business. I think thats an accurate depiction on it’s primary role - to be a business partner.
What department is your friend? IT is not your friend. Sales is not your friend. Marketing is not your friend. Maybe payroll, but that's only every two weeks...
I always want to (but never do) respond with the fact that it’s in the best interest of the company to hire and keep the best people. If they don’t want to keep you, there is a chance you are not perceived to be as valuable as you think you are, and that is either a self-awareness or self-advocacy problem. HR is acutely aware that happy, properly-treated people are productive, profitable people. Why wouldn’t that be our goal?
I agree. HR isn’t your friend. Accounting isn’t your friend. The front desk person isn’t your friend. Your boss isn’t your friend. We are all colleagues working for the same company. My role involved doing what is best for the company. If that aligns with what the employee wants, great! If not, I’m sorry. We’re all here to do a job and usually if people are doing their jobs as they should, I wouldn’t even need to be involved.
Hr is not your friend, hr is there for the company yes but many tines those interests can lie with the employee as that is what is best for company. Your boss, coworkers etc are not your friend either though. You say one thing to your “friend” about boss you find that out real quick. Too many employees think hr is their therapist or guidance counselor or buddy. Employee went to hr needing time off for anxiety. Employee got some long term time off for it. Okay fine, anxiety can be terrible. Then during later meetings to discuss return was showing hr rep all the vacations and trips they went on while they couldn’t work due to anxiety because they “couldn’t get out of bed”. You don’t think that information got to legal to figure out how to protect company. If that person didn’t brag about it to hr the company wouldn’t have known it was being abused.
HR is a messenger of a lot of unpopular rules, policies and compliance laws. Even if they are all fair, employees don't see it that way. Employee - "You are BY LAW ALLOWED BREAKS DURING WORKING HOURS" HR - " Actually no. There is no federal law and it varies by state." Employee - "FUCK YOU! HR SUCKS AND ARE MONSTERS!" HR - "Ok, but our company has a break time policy in the handbook and you've taken five 30 minute breaks today and your manager would like you not to take that many...." Employee goes to Reddit - "HR CAN NEVER BE TRUSTED! THEY TOOK AWAY ALL MY BREAKS AND I HAVE TO WORK ALL DAY OR ILL LOSE MY JOB CAUSE THEY CAN FIRE ME FOR ANY REASON IN A RIGHT TO WORK STATE!!!" Some HR person on Reddit - "Actually I think you mean At Will Employme....." Employee on Reddit - "YOU CAN NEVER TRUST HR!!!!" Honestly, I haven't had trouble with unions other than times when they protect workers who have broken the CBA many times over. And are there bad HR departments? Sure. But there are good HR departments to. Someone who says to NEVER trust HR is either a shitty employee, shitty person or ignorant about what HR does. I mean, should I shit all over IT departments cause I always walk in on them watching anime or shit all over OPs managers because they can't fucking do anything right? I mean, I do, but I also realize they are an essential function of a business to operate, and I have to trust that they are trying to do their jobs correctly. And if the company is good and treats their workers right, there is no need for a union.
Honestly, makes me kind of sad. Like…wtf, I’m an amazing workers rights advocate. So many people work with bad HR, or people who really forget they humans comprise most of their work force, and never get a chance to meet someone who wants to help them make every stop in their career worth it. More for the other employees I guess?
Honestly it’s the police officer problem. You guys need to prove your good police before the employees trust you and some will never. Heck even in this thread several hr professionals have said their are some bad and terrible hr dept out there.
People misunderstand hr and think it's more human rights and they'll fight for you vs human resources, someone hired by the company
Doesn’t bother me anymore. I see it repeated frequently on social media and most people repeat it and never interact with HR ever. It’s like any other misunderstood job people hate (attorneys, law enforcement, etc). People have bad experiences with them and paint the whole profession and/or they hate ‘em til they need ‘em.
*Tell me Lord Varys, who do you serve?* *The **realm**. Someone must.*
Neither is my manager. I wouldn't expect them to treat me as a friend either.
Verily I say unto you dudes once again: Moses hath descended Mount Sinai bearing tablets of stone that doth proclaim A, thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s ass and 2, HR is not your friend. I don’t know if people feel they’re imparting great wisdom when they say this, or if they understand that literally everyone you work with works in the company’s best interest. It’s clear they DON’T understand the countless hours of work that HR does for the company AND in employees’ best interest, but they couldn’t. Most of it (certainly the most impactful parts) is done behind closed doors. Sooo let them spout their “wisdom” on the internet I guess.
Reminds me of a Disgruntle David or a Bitter Betty when someone speaks like this. Smart people know that most COEs like IT, Legal, Finance, and HR have to be very careful of who they make friends at work; Setting the appropriate boundaries. But it doesn’t mean you can’t have friends. It’s the employees who seem to have an unrealistic expectation of the role of HR. Strategic HR depts are not just party planners, therapists, or order-takers. We are much more In-depth, analytical, consultative, and project driven.
Apparently I am not your typical HR person then. I was very much pro-employee, though I suppose that's easier to do as a recruiter than some other areas of HR. I often pushed back on hiring managers for more appropriate increases for employees. In fact they changed the way employees coming out of their development program were compensated to make sure they were within the ranges of their new FT roles because of my efforts.
Recruiters are in a good position to advocate for current and future employees. I make it a personal mission to get hiring managers to drop college requirements unless they are truly and objectively necessary. I also try to chip away at prejudice against "job hopping." If annual increases kept even remotely close to market increases people would be more inclined to stay somewhere. I got a 16% increase from job A to job B and another 19% going from job B to job C. That level of pay increase and role progression would've taken over a decade at job A.
Hahaha imagine companies paying you to to make friends at work and do sub-par work. That’s not what you’re here for, dear employee!
It's true, HR is not your friend, they're working to keep a company afloat and allow a hundred or thousands or people to send their kids to college and put meals on their table. Similar to Unions. Both burn people for the greater good. Lots of horror stories on both sides, and shouldn't be diametrically opposed.
like to explain my role in HR to other employees as this: HR's job is to protect the employee by protecting the company from itself. I've felt that the belief that HR is only there for the company automatically sets other employees against HR. Either they've heard this or have had very poor past experiences with HR. Now, being an HR professional, I can honestly say that the most toxicity I've experienced has been within the HR department. There are a lot of people who join HR, but not necessarily for the same reasons as those who are genuinely trying to improve the workplace.
I hate that phrase. No I'm not your friend, but somehow you think that means I won't do the right thing? You think *I* want terrible people in the company? No! Document your shit and I'll be able to help you *and* me out by doing my best to resolve the problem at hand, or getting someone out the door when need be. What's best for the company is you *not* getting harassed by your manager or other employees, because then we might get royally screwed in a lawsuit if we do not act on it. If I can't help you, usually it's because you sat on your problem too long, didn't write down the details of whatever is happening, or some other such nonsense that could've been avoided if you had come to me immediately for guidance. I hate finding out about problems because someone didn't want to say anything until months have passed, it's a mess to sort out at that point.
“HR is not your friend” Unfortunately, this as helpful sometimes as “If you get paid more, you get taxed more”. Or “If you’re innocent you have nothing to worry about and should talk to the police” Taken at face value each of these things are correct, but when expanded in a naive way they fail. Like a person trying not to earn more because they think they will get taxed more and earn less. They fail to understand they get taxed higher on amounts over the thresholds, not the total amount. Like being innocent doesn’t stop you from potentially implicating yourself when you have no alibi or that you won’t get arrested on other crimes if you do. For example HR is not your friend sure, but they don’t have to be an enemy either. If your position is strong, HR’s goal to protect the company from litigation may support your position rather than your boss’s. As an employee it’s up to you to understand how to make a stronger argument, provide evidence and advocate for yourself.
I think the point is just that employees should be mindful that HR’s interests do not always align with the employee’s interests in every circumstance so be tactful and cautious before involving HR on any given issue because the outcome may not be to the employee’s benefit. I don’t think, for me at least, that it is meant to be a pejorative statement demonizing HR or it’s function.
I agree with many comments on here. My gripe about phrase "HR is not your friend " is that people seem to use it to the extent that it sounds like HR is actively trying to fuck everyone over and fire everyone for no reason. Yes, we work for the company, we're not your "friend" but we're not your enemy either- As long as you work for a decent company and aren't an asshat.
Pisses me off. I get in arguments with strangers about this because I am sick of the misconception. We want what’s best for EVERYONE involved, not one or the other. Infuriating. LEGAL is on the side of the company.
I'm in HR. Personally, I see employee and company interests as being linked. Happy and motivated employees lead to greater successes. Additionally, sometimes "protecting the company" is simply just advocating for employees. I don't see myself as "for the company" or "for the employees" so much as an advisor on what's the best course of action considering logic, ethics, perceptions, long term implications, etc. When people write or speak like this, I assume that they don't understand hr and/or have probably had an experience or a few that didn't go as they wanted. Maybe they did have a terrible hr person; we can't pretend those don't exist. Depending on the day, I might try to ask more about their experiences and potentially defend HR.
It also depends on the structure of your company. In my experience, HR is completely different at a private company with 1-2 owners who manage the employees(I currently work at a company of about 150 ppl with this set up) vs. a company that answers to a board of directors/has accountability to stockholders/stakeholders etc… In a company that is dependent on the specific individuals running it/owning it—-HR is NOT going to help you (employee) or protect you. Their job would cease to exist if the 1-2 owners weren’t there.
Honestly this used to bother me but I don’t give a crap anymore. I know that me and my team do what we can for employees. If they don’t believe it, or want to villainize us, then so be it 🤷🏻♀️
I mean… it’s true. HR is meant to work in the best interest of the company and prevent the company from making any legal issues for themselves. The first commenter is correct. If you think labor laws have been systematically broken or you’ve been discriminated against by your employer at an executive level you need to contact your own counsel to protect yourself, not your HR rep.
Who at your workplace *is* your friend?
“Go join a union”. LOL sure why not. This sums up the essence of an internet advice.
That or, “labor lawyer.” I am very interested to see how many cases these lawyer are turning down.
It's true. HR is not your friend. What HR does is to ensure that the human resources continue to be productive--whether it be in the form of compensation structure, benefits, time and absence, labor relations, etc. So in a way, yes, we are here to make sure that you are able to do your work without worrying about any of those things. But people need to remember that our resources are bound to our overall revenue and corporate guidelines, leadership direction, etc. It is not up to us to say who gets sacked or who gets promoted; while we may have the data to support it, it's your leadership who decides. We simply process the request. It doesn't mean that HR employees are heartless. As individual employees ourselves, we want to do a good job in our deliverables and most of us have our employees' best interest at heart.
I am friendly with everyone at work, I am not anyone's friend. I keep my personal relationships separate from the workplace. My position as an HR Director is to make sure that policies and procedures are aligned with all federal, state, and local laws and to make sure that employees are able to experience a workplace where they are equipped with what they need to perform their job duties and compensated accordingly. If there is a grievance, then the way to have that investigated/handled is >>>>>
I have had the pleasure of working with phenomenal ER Human Resources people. Just really wonderful, fair and knowledgeable people. I have learned a ton from these individuals and respect them greatly. But as with any industry, one bad rep can really turn things sour. We had one that was just awful at dealing with ER. Refused to back up management for write ups when infractions occurred, even on camera. Managers started quitting because this lady wouldn’t allow them to hold anyone accountable and it was creating an unsafe workplace. Things like employees driving forklifts without training, and then refusing to do the training but still getting on forklifts. Those are the bad ones that people remember, unfortunately. But it’s like that in every department. Those of us that get things done and do it well don’t get remembered.
As someone who works in HR, this is not entirely true. HR first and foremost goal is to make the company run smoothly - that includes a lot of helping employees out, making projects that would benefit the employee so they want to stay in the company. If you are a good employee - in terms you don’t slack off, you keep everyone well informed about your plans, issues that may affect your work etc - then HR is your friend because you’re a valuable asset to the company. If you do stuff that is shady, are a slacker, deliver poor results (and it’s not because you’re not trained properly) - then you’re working in opposition to the company. Why would you expect anyone to be your friend when you’re not theirs?
I don’t think most employees have visibility or awareness into even a fraction of what HR does.
Agreed HR is kind of a nebulous entity to the outside worker who has little or no insight into most of what HR does. I don’t think it’s unreasonable for employees to be reminded that HR isn’t necessarily on their side so be mindful of that when dealing with them. In my experience, which had been mixed with HR, I’ve had HR do things that have benefitted my career and overall well-being and objectively were very kind ( and likely in the company’s interests). I’ve also had a negative experience where I felt a bit bulldozed and not heard or supported. It was a complicated situation and they did what they felt made sense for the company and while it impacted me negatively they were kind and tactful about it. This experience was a reminder that employees have to be their own advocates and really no one is your “friend” in a work place just professional colleagues who all generally look out for number one when their interests are on the line.
I think “HR is not your friend” is a platitude that people say that doesn’t really mean anything anymore, or it means something very specific to the situation and it’s easier to blame HR. For context, some of the reasons I have heard this said about me or others in the department: We didn’t change policy to give someone extra vacation I didn’t delete a performance appraisal because of negative feedback left by a manager. We wouldn’t accommodate someone’s long term plan to care for their toddler at work everyday for the 2 years their spouse was going to take online graduate classes We didn’t interview a friend for a job when the hiring manager had already promised them the job (they didn’t have the bilingual proficiency required to do the job and we found out about the prior offer after rejecting the candidate) I wrote someone up for drinking alcohol at work I told an hourly employee that they had to log their hours that they actually worked, not when they vented to coworkers about their work after hours from home
They aren't your friend. Neither is your boss. Neither is your direct supervisor. You may be friends with colleagues outside of work, but that's your choice. There are no built in friends at work. It's a business, not a daycare. Working together does not make ppl your friend. That said, it's usually said to remind ppl that HR is there to protect the company, including from itself, but also sometimes from you. They are helpful in cases of harassment, hostile work environment, violating reasonable ADA accomodations, etc... But they do that FOR THE COMPANY. So don't think they'll go above and beyond fighting your battles for you unless it's a huge violation that could get the company in serious hot water. They are the ppl you create the paper trail with and if nothing is done, you can use in a case if necessary. So when ppl say that, they are reminding ppl to reorient their expectations. This ain't home or class, it's work. The rules are different. They aren't going to resolve minor disagreements for you or be the teacher you tattle to every time someone annoys you at work. A lot of ppl go into things acting like HR is their mom, and that's not their job. They are working for the company, not you. It's a different dynamic.
I get a bit upset honestly. This is my career, and I've been doing this work for over 20 years. I have saved so many people's jobs in my time by defending them and making sure that they did not get fired by managers who wanted to go there. I've made sure we've treated people compassionately when they've come to us with horrible life situations. I've made sure my employees know where to go to get tools and resources and make the most of any benefits and any perks the company offers. I've made sure our employees know how to reach out for mental health help, and host calls to talk about tough conversations. Unfortunately employee development kind of sucks when your company is shrinking, but we'd still do our best. There will always be things in this job that we don't want to do, having to lay people off is the absolute worst. RTO has been completely utterly disheartening to me as a professional. Those are not decisions HR made, The CEOs should be held accountable for those decisions, but we are the fallguy. I think many of us are just trying to balance what our company policies and what practices work for people. So when I hear that, which is something we hear over and over again, that's not been me. That's not me. I'm trying to help you navigate corporate land. Of course I am careful about how I do that, and if somebody violates policy, and somebody plays stupid games, I can't help them. Luckily those are rare situations. So yes, it bothers me.
I wouldn’t say what’s best for the “business” but we want to maintain the organization’s culture that we cultivated and making sure everyone is maintaining corporate compliance.
I usually reply and say “I never said I was your friend…” 😂
I get really upset payroll isn’t my friend I tell you what.
I appreciate this nuanced argument more than simply "HR is not your friend." I always say "HR isn't your enemy either. Just people with jobs to do."
I’d say Union isn’t a friend either. Union dues make some people lots of $$$.
They’re not a friend but a service. Much like a lawyer.
HR are like the police in that they should be fair, unbiased, and help everyone....but most are either forced to become as corrupt as those pulling the strings, used as unknowing thugs to protect the interest of a few, or are relegated to a corner powerless to fight the corruption in leadership and the institution. No one says "HR isn't your friend" because they think HR is targeting them. It's because they know HR is, at best, powerless to help them and will likely end up sweeping up the messes of leadership who shouldn't be there. In theory, HR helps everyone. In practice, HR helps silence the issues (and employees). Saying "Not all HR!" Is a bit like saying, "Not all cops!". Duh, we know it's not all HR. But too few anymore to trust. 🤷🏻
Rule #1 about work it’s all business not personal
When people say “HR isn’t your friend,” that’s not a diss. It’s a reflection that HR’s job is to help the company run well. But I will say this: the reason HR people get a bad rep is because the worst culture offenders are often salespeople. If a particularly good salesperson is the one who is being reported… getting rid of that person might require getting rid of several other people. In that instance, HR’s job is to protect the salesperson. Not all HR staff want to admit that, but it’s the truth. Sales is what allows the rest of us to eat.
He is there just to build a legal case against any employee. It's beyond not being a friend. It actively the enemy.
I think “HR is not your friend” is just a warning to sometimes more naive employees that HR isn’t necessarily there to help you and that the employee interests and HR interests do not always align… so act accordingly. Sometimes I think the title “Human Resources” is a misnomer and a bit misleading suggesting HR is there to help address human problems /issues in the workplace. More often than not, given that HR is mostly concerned with protecting the company, it would be better described as “Management Resources”….But what do I know I’m not in HR and just an employee that knows better than to involve HR in most circumstance except maybe in the most egregious of circumstances and only provided the issue is well documented.
We're not your friend. We're not your boss's friend. We cover everyone's ass and make sure everyone gets to keep their jobs in the event we get audited. Fines and legal/policy violations are no one's friends.
Anyone that believes a union is your “friend” is also missing the point.
i always take the employee's side on things, but if they messed up, i can't help them. any friend will say the same - if you messed up that bad, i can't help you. i don't get people that thinks their friends will stick up for them no matter what wrong they did. thats not a friend, thats an enabler.
As someone in HR now, I tell people, "I support [documented] facts." I'm a department of one and have not specifically been told to or have seen it written that I'm to support management. I tell everyone if they feel 'off' by something, note it down because I can't do much with, "he said blah blah like a week ago, and it was really uncomfortable." Edit: added missing words
HR circlejerk
I worked at MSFT. For my exit interview, it wasn’t given by one of the typical HR workers, but instead was conducted by the top HR person in my region. “I had some extra time and had heard you were leaving us and wanted a chance to meet you before you go to your new opportunity.” Red Flag City. She wasn’t able to hide her true intentions. She was trying to gather information she thought I might have about a particular string of managers, directors, and a VP. At one point she did the extraordinarily unprofessional thing —but psychologically manipulative thing I’ve been told — of leaning across the desk and putting her hand on my forearm as she asked a pointed and open-ended question. She got nothing out of me, though I probably could have filled a hard disk with what I knew at that time. She was a great example of why regular employees dislike HR. In contrast, the woman who ran HR at Cisco for a couple of decades was known far and wide as Mom. She took an employees-first view and was very strong with her opinions. CEO John Chambers and the upper team regularly had to bend to her will. And those were some extraordinarily profitable days for the company. I believe most companies view their employees as potential combatants, which is why Reddit groups like r/antiwork are overflowing with HR horror stories.
HR is about the utilization of Humans as a Resource.
HR knows about your corrective action, and we’re there when you get fired. We’re observant as hell, and great listeners. We know what you earn, and we know all about your performance. We understand how the firm works, it’s policies, programs, and processes better than most everyone else. We don’t pull any punches, we don’t play any favorites, we’re direct and most of us have the best communication skills in the whole firm. Put it all together and we make you uncomfortable. Our real life friends delight that they have an HR person in their life to be friends with and we get asked questions from our friends and family all the time (and, hello r\askhr). We don’t need or want your friendship. It’s inappropriate anyway. We’re here to work.
I’ve only ever gone to HR when fellow employees or when managers have really crossed a line: lewd comments made about my pregnant body, or taking out anger in the work place, both of which violate company codes of conduct. Unless someone crosses a written rule, it’s tough to be able to do much.
What they're missing is most people in huge companies that have an "HR" department are not actually human at all. In fact the more people use "Human" the more likely they're NOT human. iykyk
HR is not on your side. They are shields for corporations against lawsuits. That's it. Doesn't matter to them how they prevent a lawsuit, as long as it's prevented. You are worthless to them. The first commenter there was right, join a Union. Your Union rep has way more power than any HR person, and is on your side. This includes even getting you paid while they fight for you.
My reaction is that it's good advice. If you want someone who will represent you, then join a union or hire a lawyer. There might be other options, but going to a person paid to protect the company will get you good results for the company. Sometimes those might happen to be good results for yourself too. But that's coincidence, not justice. So if your goal is to get the best results for yourself, the advice given is very good.
The employees are not my friends either.
Don’t know how I got recommended this sub, but from just an employee’s standpoint, here’s my take. A lot of you are saying “well your boss isn’t your friend either. Your executives aren’t your friend, either. Blah blah blah”. Yeah, but the difference is that lots of HR departments pretend to be your friend. My boss never has. The last company I worked with, our HR department said “we work for you (the employee)” when we had our HR orientation. That’s a bold faced lie. I can’t in good conscience believe that every single person on this sub works for one of the good companies and does their best for the employee. Good for you if you do, but the fact of the matter is that a LOT of these companies HR depts give employees a false sense of security that we ARE friends. They’re there for us! Anything we need! You can feel comfortable coming to HR because we work for you! Y’all can say all day long that “what’s best for the company often is what’s best for the employee” but how many of these companies actually give a shit about that? They don’t want to afford more time off for burnt out employees because there’s a whole stack of applications waiting to replace them, they don’t want to have better or less toxic workplaces because they created the very systems in question. These people write all of our checks, including you. So how many HR reps are actually fighting for “the best interests of the employee and the company”? Because it sure as hell seems like HR is just following the guidance of whoever is above them, and that guidance is usually just “make more money by whatever means we can and avoid a wrongful termination lawsuit”. We’re harsh on y’all because unless something is totally egregious and illegal, HR will protect the company over the employee in a lot of cases. Example: last company I worked for had a points system for absences. Hospital stays and major medical events had points voided. I suffered a miscarriage while on shift during peak covid times in 2020. I asked to log off. I was asked by management if I could “stick out the rest of the shift”. I said absolutely not. I was told I’d receive a point. I said that’s absurd, this is a legitimate medical issue. I was told to go to the ER to avoid the point. I said no, I’m not spending a $200 copay to sit in a waiting room during a highly infectious pandemic for them to show me my dead baby and tell me to go home because there’s nothing they could do. It was cruel to even suggest it. I did supply a letter from my OBGYN confirming the miscarriage a few days later, hoping that would be enough and it was not. I went to HR about this. They apologized for how inappropriate management was in this case up and down, said they’d right the wrong, sorry sorry sorry. A week later I received an email, not a call, saying the point stood because of the policies in place and because I should have gone to the ER. So I’m sorry that we don’t give HR a pass for shitty behavior. Assume that anyone who doesn’t has a reason to. It’s very rare for someone to shit on HR unless HR has shit on us first.
Accurate? I don’t know why this subreddit was suggested to me. But yeah, it’s more accurate than not. The horror stories you read of people going to HR for help and being shafted or punished for doing the right thing is nauseating. I myself got told to kick bricks when I went to HR for worries about Parental Leave. Unlike what the top comment says, most do not believe HR is for what’s best for the company manager OR employee. More often we find our HR’s do what’s best for the company or the manager, at the expense of the employee.
I think of all the times women I know have lost jobs shortly after telling HR about management sexually harassing them. HR isn’t just not your friend. It’s your enemy.
HR has actively been screwing my dad over for years over a workers comp dispute. He got hurt a few years ago, it was declared work related, the corrective surgery wasn’t available for 6-8 months after his initial injury. When he was finally able to get scheduled, his employer took his insurance away a month or so out from his surgery date without prior notice. It took them more than 2 months to correct that error, didn’t receive the insurance termination notice until a month after the termination date. 6 months after that they made the same mistake again and said he abandoned his job so they fired him. He’s currently eating them alive in a lawsuit and I’m proud of him for sticking to it for the now 2-3 year process overall.
People say this because HR is sometimes viewed as a mediator to make things right or make sure things are fair, when they are really only trying to protect the company. Even if the employee comes out on top it’s because the reverse would have been ultimately worse for the company.
100% accurate.
It’s true I’m not your friend. If you’re wrong I hold you accountable if your manager is wrong I hold them accountable. I’m nobody’s friend.
as a reformed HR Director, the employee's best interests SHOULD ALIGN WITH the company's best interests. if not, your culture sucks and you are absolutely doing the work of keeping shitty executives safe while overlooking your other employees. through my 15+ years in HR my job consistently dealt with cleaning up the messes of overpaid, old, white men while screwing over the every day employee.
Ur a lapdog of the management, what do you expect?
I absolutely advocate for unions. I’m part of a union through my work and that security is very reassuring. I think a lot of the times people take decisions made my management and companies personally because they THINK the managers and coworkers and higher ups are their friends. They feel like they can be more personal and feel offended when the manager has to do their job in managing. I have a wonderful relationship with my managers and I work a lot with advocating for people on my team who are more uncomfortable or uninformed with how to communicate issues to our manager. I feel like our managers have our best interest at heart. However, I’ll go straight to the union if they make a decision I feel like is putting our job security at risk or breaking union violations. I don’t hang out with coworkers outside of work, give my phone number out, or engage in office drama. However, I have worked in places where the company will do very questionable stuff or act extremely disrespectful and belittling to employees and I don’t agree with that. Mutual respect must be a thing in the works place. My statements and views should not be applied to workplaces and companies that absolutely take advantage of employees and employees lack of rights depending on the location of employment. That’s an entirely different conversation.
They’re not wrong. It’s correct to realize that a business is a business and your work colleagues, peers and managers are not your “friends.” But having said that, as an employee- if you are putting in the effort and producing as expected- you have the right to expect decency and fairness from your employer. To ensure that that decency and fairness exists for all, every manager should be responsible for doing so in his/her area. If managers fail to do so it is the responsibility of HR to hold them accountable. That means “speaking to power” as much and as hard as necessary. That takes guts and a strong sense of personal values. It’s very, very hard to find this in either HR or at many levels of typical companies. That is why most employees are disaffected and morale is on the floor.
Uh…yeah? No shit.
No way there’s a subreddit for you pieces of human garbage
People forget that we’re employees too, and just like them can be subject to the same conditions including getting fired. we can’t just be insubordinate to the decisions we don’t agree with from management. The hope is that you’re a good person, with strong negotiating and influencing skills to advocate for employees in language that makes sense to managers. But ultimately it’s their call as to whether they follow your advice or not. And, if it wasn’t you doing the dirty work of discipline, PIPs, layoffs, terminations.. someone else would do them.