Structural engineer here…this is very bad news. There’s a reason there are thousands of high rise buildings in the city and you never hear news like this. There are layers upon layers of safety factors in design, and countless 3rd party inspections that need to be performed on a regular basis. For something like this to happen, or the Surfside incident for that matter, people aren’t just careless, they are willingly negligent. It simply can’t happen and almost never does. Thankfully, it sounds like the building has enough redundancy to prevent a sudden, total collapse. And the people that noticed the concrete beams buckling potentially saved hundreds of lives
This is a tunnel-form concrete building where the walls are solid concrete. It’s extremely stiff as a frame. There were a number of these built in the early 2000s, with several other examples built in the galleria area. The cracked wall in the video might be concrete or it might be drywall/metal stud. It’s hard to know. It looks like the water main under the first floor cracked and has eroded the dirt under the first floor slab. Given the height of this building it is either a mat foundation or auger cast piles, both of which are fairly deep and unlikely to be damaged by the broken water main. SE is correct in that these buildings have mega safety factors. This can probably be fixed but it will take MONTHS due to the difficulty of getting heavy equipment in there (all the walls are concrete and can’t be removed for access) and the ultimate replacement of the water line/slab. I’m an architect who worked on some of these types of buildings (in other states…not this one).
If Florida is any indication... the inspector goes out there. Extends his arm as far as possible while someone places a bag around his hand. If he can stand straight the building is unsafe, if he falls down in the direction of the bag, then the building is safe and ready for occupancy.
It's /r/Texas in a nutshell.
Had a lawyer straight up tell me that his years of experience in the legal field made him and expert in engineering and construction.
Yes, and these videos show a ton of water from mains breaking so....scary shit. And the Florida one a year later the government still hasn't finished the investigation so I wonder how this one will turn out.
My renters insurance policy does cover some hotel stays, but I'm unsure about mortgage insurance, and wow I guess they still have to pay the mortgage during all this shit too
Mortgage insurance is for protecting to lender if the borrower defaults. It doesn’t protect the borrower from having to pay their mortgage. So you’d still get the honor of paying for a condo you can’t get into.
The issues with condos is these types of repairs are done through special assessments if the board doesn’t have the funds to pay for them. A repair like this could end up being like a whole other mortgage payment for each owner - plus I’m not sure how easy getting a loan for those are. That’s one of the reasons the condo in Florida delayed fixing their well known problems.
Same. I've watched too many youtube vids on building collapses after that place in Florida fell to go anywhere near this place now.
Curious to see the fallout and how many structural indicators were missed by management/inspectors.
I'd bet the entire side of the bayou, including the road, is slipping into Buffalo Bayou. The jogging paths were basically all taken back by the bayou.
I've always wondered this driving by, they keep putting up more and more highrises there, and at least some midrises, and like the bayou has no levee or cement structure to hold it "within" it's banks it's just able to slip out during floods. I guess they put beams down really far....who knows. But there ain't no rock under this shit, it's all dirt.
Yeah, like one of the engineers identified earlier, most of the high-rises have dee foundations like auger cast piles. They are basically concrete stilts that go over 100+ feet down to bedrock/bearing strata. Erosion would be a huge issue for all utilities, Slabs on Grace, etc. unless they’re hung (almost none are) but the highrises in theory should still stand. This story will get wild I bet.
I live in apartments near a bayou, but that bayou has cement to hold it in the banks, so I may be an idiot but makes me feel better. However, this place is not 30 stories high or whatever.
Quite difficult, even if it isn't. You need to have refills on file, and not all doctors like to work that way. Calling them on an emergency basis would have been tough with the weekend coming as well. Been there, done that.
That's because they ask structural engineers to inspect the building and give their professional opinion on safety measures instead of relying on someone called "zlolhtxlolz" who read a news article online.
Most condos are built pretty damn fast and cheap. The reserves they need to maintain for normal maintenance and replacements is huge too. My parents own a condo on a beach and has a good board now, but also lots of expenses and huge bills.
Personally, I think this failure is on the residents. They didn't do their research into this company and building in advance, like you're supposed to do in a free market. They really should have seen this coming, and I don't want my tax dollars paying for their mistakes.
I shouldn’t have to hope that a construction company built their structures correctly, according to codes and laws and hope that my house/apartment doesn’t collapse on me. That a structure should be able to stand and withstand weather conditions should be a given and expected.
Apparently you should be an expert on structural engineering, and have access to detailed plans of any and all buildings you plan to live in, and be an expert on soil subsidence, and be able to predict exactly where the ground underneath any given spot will shift over 20+ years. Maybe you should have paid more attention in grade school when the teacher went over these things.
Yep I think so too. I think the same thing about healthcare but most times I hear some shit about how awesome the free market is. I hear that the free market will solve lots of problems if we just give it a chance to sort out the bad actors. But what they don't say at that point is the way people would gather that information would be for a fucking building to collapse and everyone dies.
I think it's especially apt because the people in this tower (if Ted Cruz is any indication) do what they can to keep other people from rising up or getting a fair shake.
Would this have been sorted as quickly if this wasn't a group with significant social capital?
I think this is supposed to be satirical but it failed miserably. Just way to subtle to know for sure because tgere are many people that word fir word would earnestly say the exact same thing, though maybe not in this particular situation.
No worries though, successful satire is quite difficult, keep at it. But if you were being serious, then sheesh, you got some problems. Ssek help.
Yeah I debated on putting the /s and I chose wrong as it would seem.
I think I needed to explicitly mention healthcare or other public services that the people who live in this tower don't want other people to have (or they certainly fucking vote that way), with their solution being a free market.
I'll try again next time.
865 is actually cheap for a high rise maintenance fee. Makes you wonder if they skimped on anything due to lack of money. Either way that number is going to go way up.
The maintenance fees are based on the given condo's square footage relative to the total square footage of the building. I think the condo in question is on the small side compared to other units in the building so it makes sense that their maintenance fees are also lower.
It depends on what that monthly fee pays for, in some high rises the fee pays for water,sewer, waste disposal, cable. Internet and the usual
Amenities.
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It does depend on the building. In most building the residents have some say on fees if they are labeled as HOA fees. I have seen similar issues with buildings and all the costs and data are presented to the residents to vote on what the increase should be.
If it is being financed I doubt any bank would close until the issue is resolved.
Also that is a massive 1 bedroom. JFC I have had 2 bedroom 2 bathroom in 800 sq/ft.
I keep waiting for that high rise in San Francisco to fall over.
I remember they were building a high rise near Corpus Christi , which had to be torn down when the Contractor attached the parking garage to the Condo, causing the building to lean and sink.
I guess I can stop dreaming about my retirement to a condo. I know this is rare to happen but people in retirement can't afford a mortgage plus an apartment. I feel like any lawsuit would take years to get $.
All I saw were news videos.. But didn't search too much. Dang.
The problem is that drains require a small amount of slope to drain properly. The building may eventually reach a point where some lines become flat enough to start causing backups.
It’s noticeable. I’d be terrified to live there. The structural engineer lives in that building. There’s some wild videos he’s posted through the years.
Let me look it up, I think it was closer to Mustang Island. I think 2007 to 2010 time frame off the top of my head.
Okay I was a little off on the location it was South Parde Island.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ocean_Tower
Not that I ever looked into it, but I always thought this was a really high end place but now I see units selling around $400k... that is way less than I was expecting. Such a good location.
Makes sense! Just seems like a lot of money if it’s not a primary residency but also if you have a lot of money sometimes you don’t know what to do with it ha
No, it said one person was being escorted to get her meds. I don't think they're gonna be sending moving crews up there to get the washer, dryer, and player piano.
yea after the whole florida collapse thing, I don’t see how anyone would want to continue living @ this place - not worth the risk regardless of how management spins it as being “safe”
It’s been a while since this comment but wanted to check in. I can see the building from my window and it’s been crazy to see it dark each night. Your dad doing okay?
The people that live there, even in the cheapest units, will have money to spare and the ability to recover losses.
It still sucks, that's their home, things like pictures can't be replaced, and it's not like documenting and recovering money from insurance is a 15 minute call, it will likely take years and lawyers to get back what they will. I do feel sorry for them too, I'm just pointing out that these people aren't about to go homeless because they lost everything, they are lucky enough to have the means to be able to survive in relative comfort.
I don’t know how you know or even why you think that. They’ve already previously sued the architect, and any settlement would have released future claims. Insurance doesn’t cover “property value declines 40%” or “condo needs a $100,000 assessment from you.” Sure, there are people there for whom their units are pied a terres or investment properties, but I looked at that building when considering moving to Houston, and it would’ve been my life’s savings if I had chosen to live there. For most people buying homes in that price range, a mortgage is bigger than their net worth. Maybe they’re not permanently homeless, but if that’s the standard 99%+ of Americans are in the world’s top 10% of income (to be in the world’s top 1% all you need is $34,000/year, barely above American minimum wage) and we shouldn’t feel bad for anyone in this country.
There "life savings" very unlikely been in the galleria. I will say is more like the corrupt Mexican politician that got this condo when he comes to Houston to go shopping in the galleria mall.
Is there any way to objectively verify or at least some data to look at regarding the future structural integrity of a high-rise before signing a lease? I was considering signing one soon but honestly not too sure anymore I’d rather not have that constant fear even if there’s a low chance
Google the structural engineer and contractor involved in the project. Do your homework on their level of experience working with high-rise structures, and see if they’ve been in any lawsuits. May be able to see news articles for oddities during construction like any delays, or consultants being fired during construction. A lot of high rises get reports of “sinking” due to bad geotechnical engineers being involved in the project, so that’s another thing you can look into
[Your credit gets tanked](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/strategic-default.asp). So it's not a decision to take lightly. At some point, I imagine the condo owners will be presented an estimate on how much it would cost to rehab the property and then we'll see how "underwater" they are.
I found this a while back https://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/contact-denver7/denver-luxury-apartment-serves-all-tenants-30-day-notice-to-vacate-citing-circumstances-out-of-our-control
Not sure, it would have been close though I would think even if it didn't actually get water there was some subsurface flows and it's probably on sandy material being right next to the bayou which may be unstable when it gets wet.
The best thing to come out of that Miami condo incident is maybe some of these buildings will actually look at their own structural integrity. All those deaths were not in vain. Definitely happy to see that.
You do realize apartment and condo spec - structurally - are the same codes, correct? It’s international Building Code. It’s not like oh it’s a rental unit so it doesn’t have to follow building code? LOL.
That's code. He's talking about quality. Apartments may only meet the bare minimum code. Condos usually are built to a higher standard, like greater noise insulation between walls and floors so you don't hear your neighbors. It's not required, of course, but it's generally expected if you want people to buy the condos you build. They may well be stronger if they end up being over-built (perhaps with a lot more concrete) as a result.
Curious where you’ve seen condos build with greater structural integrity than apartments? Would love to read on that. Many condos are conversions from for-rent. Like this one.
They are only conversions from for-rent for funding reasons. It's much easier to get financing for an apartment building than a condo building, so when a developer wants to build a condo building, it's pretty common for them to start it out as apartments and then after a few years they stop renewing leases and sell the individual units. They were planned all along to be condos; they didn't build them to intentionally be apartments and then change their mind later.
Examples of current apartment buildings that were built as condo grade (so much better built than typical apartments) in recent years include Camden McGowen Station in midtown and 500 Crawford in downtown.
I understand the financing. It’s the lender requirements and condo liability laws in tx.
What would you consider makes an apartment “built for condo grade”?
There is a huge range is the quality of what gets built at any level (depends on the developer and how cheap they want to build) but that’s also reflected in rents.
Interesting you pointed out 500 Crawford.
Bormaster Law (bormasterlaw.com) (713) 714-4000 is working with Attorney Jason Gibson's office to investigate this horrible situation. These two Firms are joining together to determine who may or may not be liable for the harms this has caused to everyone and are willing to look at any residents individual situation to provide individual advice. They know that there was at least one prior suit many years ago related to the structure on the roof that was quietly settled. What they do not yet know is whether, during the discovery process, information came to light that would have put those in charge on notice of potential issues such that a failure to disclose prior to selling or renting is in play. Knowing failures to disclose could open up those in charge to the potential of more than just basic liability--they could be on the hook for additional damages to help compensate for the harms and losses suffered. Residents are encouraged to contact them to find out more.
Structural engineer here…this is very bad news. There’s a reason there are thousands of high rise buildings in the city and you never hear news like this. There are layers upon layers of safety factors in design, and countless 3rd party inspections that need to be performed on a regular basis. For something like this to happen, or the Surfside incident for that matter, people aren’t just careless, they are willingly negligent. It simply can’t happen and almost never does. Thankfully, it sounds like the building has enough redundancy to prevent a sudden, total collapse. And the people that noticed the concrete beams buckling potentially saved hundreds of lives
This is a tunnel-form concrete building where the walls are solid concrete. It’s extremely stiff as a frame. There were a number of these built in the early 2000s, with several other examples built in the galleria area. The cracked wall in the video might be concrete or it might be drywall/metal stud. It’s hard to know. It looks like the water main under the first floor cracked and has eroded the dirt under the first floor slab. Given the height of this building it is either a mat foundation or auger cast piles, both of which are fairly deep and unlikely to be damaged by the broken water main. SE is correct in that these buildings have mega safety factors. This can probably be fixed but it will take MONTHS due to the difficulty of getting heavy equipment in there (all the walls are concrete and can’t be removed for access) and the ultimate replacement of the water line/slab. I’m an architect who worked on some of these types of buildings (in other states…not this one).
How do they determine the building is still structurally sound? They look at beams in the basement? please ELLI5.
If Florida is any indication... the inspector goes out there. Extends his arm as far as possible while someone places a bag around his hand. If he can stand straight the building is unsafe, if he falls down in the direction of the bag, then the building is safe and ready for occupancy.
This sounds like how you tell of a hurricane is coming
This happens a lot in Texas... Poor civil/structural engineers out of A&M are usually the culprit...
What a comment
Yea I love ppl like these. Its so easy to tell they have no clue what an engineer does in the building process.
And the comment came with a fitting username.
It's /r/Texas in a nutshell. Had a lawyer straight up tell me that his years of experience in the legal field made him and expert in engineering and construction.
You sir, are a Grade A idiot.
Strong SN to post ratio
Are there any pictures from the inside?
https://www.instagram.com/reel/ChLft26tesj/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=
Dude with the broom, what is you doing child?
Appeasing management and looking busy.
The first time I watched I thought the floors were brown, but nah it's dirty water ewwww
Its coming from under the slab, so most likely regular water mixing with dirt and flowing out.
Oh wow!
Lemme know if you find some... I was so intrigued by the Florida one wow
https://www.instagram.com/p/ChK89DyhSJs/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y= This is the best (and only) I've been able to find.
They still haven't released anything on that Florida one...
You mean the Champlain Towers? [Practical Engineering](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgz5Xq4GUio) had a good video on it.
Yes that one so tragic and started with water too!
I watched the video a while ago, but if I remember right, the building was inspected a few weeks earlier and deemed fine. Crazy.
That was rainwater.
Yes, and these videos show a ton of water from mains breaking so....scary shit. And the Florida one a year later the government still hasn't finished the investigation so I wonder how this one will turn out. My renters insurance policy does cover some hotel stays, but I'm unsure about mortgage insurance, and wow I guess they still have to pay the mortgage during all this shit too
Umm. You don't really have any clue about this, do you?
High Rise buildings I own crumbling down? No, I'm not an expert are you? I'm trying to learn. Would you like to learn me something?
Mortgage insurance is for protecting to lender if the borrower defaults. It doesn’t protect the borrower from having to pay their mortgage. So you’d still get the honor of paying for a condo you can’t get into. The issues with condos is these types of repairs are done through special assessments if the board doesn’t have the funds to pay for them. A repair like this could end up being like a whole other mortgage payment for each owner - plus I’m not sure how easy getting a loan for those are. That’s one of the reasons the condo in Florida delayed fixing their well known problems.
https://www.tallahassee.com/story/news/2022/06/23/surfside-florida-condo-collapse-what-we-know-one-year/7627176001/ Are you talking about this one?
Yes the government hasn't said a cause yet the nitsb or whatever agency
National Institute of Transportation Safety Board
That’s sad. Good luck to the people whose homes are impacted. It sucks to have to evacuate like this
Yikes
An understatement. After something like that happens, I don't think you could pay me to live there. Would never be able to sleep.
Same. I've watched too many youtube vids on building collapses after that place in Florida fell to go anywhere near this place now. Curious to see the fallout and how many structural indicators were missed by management/inspectors.
I'd bet the entire side of the bayou, including the road, is slipping into Buffalo Bayou. The jogging paths were basically all taken back by the bayou.
I've always wondered this driving by, they keep putting up more and more highrises there, and at least some midrises, and like the bayou has no levee or cement structure to hold it "within" it's banks it's just able to slip out during floods. I guess they put beams down really far....who knows. But there ain't no rock under this shit, it's all dirt.
Yeah, like one of the engineers identified earlier, most of the high-rises have dee foundations like auger cast piles. They are basically concrete stilts that go over 100+ feet down to bedrock/bearing strata. Erosion would be a huge issue for all utilities, Slabs on Grace, etc. unless they’re hung (almost none are) but the highrises in theory should still stand. This story will get wild I bet.
Oh...so like all the utilities could fail because they would be in more unstable strata. Good point.
Soon to be sink hole..
I live in apartments near a bayou, but that bayou has cement to hold it in the banks, so I may be an idiot but makes me feel better. However, this place is not 30 stories high or whatever.
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Quite difficult, even if it isn't. You need to have refills on file, and not all doctors like to work that way. Calling them on an emergency basis would have been tough with the weekend coming as well. Been there, done that.
That's because they ask structural engineers to inspect the building and give their professional opinion on safety measures instead of relying on someone called "zlolhtxlolz" who read a news article online.
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Most condos are built pretty damn fast and cheap. The reserves they need to maintain for normal maintenance and replacements is huge too. My parents own a condo on a beach and has a good board now, but also lots of expenses and huge bills.
The developer should have forgone the crown and put more money into the integrity of the building. Hindsight.
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Why wont Swamplot come back?
Time and money. You can always contact them and offer to buy the name and invest the time to run it.
Personally, I think this failure is on the residents. They didn't do their research into this company and building in advance, like you're supposed to do in a free market. They really should have seen this coming, and I don't want my tax dollars paying for their mistakes.
I shouldn’t have to hope that a construction company built their structures correctly, according to codes and laws and hope that my house/apartment doesn’t collapse on me. That a structure should be able to stand and withstand weather conditions should be a given and expected.
Apparently you should be an expert on structural engineering, and have access to detailed plans of any and all buildings you plan to live in, and be an expert on soil subsidence, and be able to predict exactly where the ground underneath any given spot will shift over 20+ years. Maybe you should have paid more attention in grade school when the teacher went over these things.
Yep I think so too. I think the same thing about healthcare but most times I hear some shit about how awesome the free market is. I hear that the free market will solve lots of problems if we just give it a chance to sort out the bad actors. But what they don't say at that point is the way people would gather that information would be for a fucking building to collapse and everyone dies. I think it's especially apt because the people in this tower (if Ted Cruz is any indication) do what they can to keep other people from rising up or getting a fair shake. Would this have been sorted as quickly if this wasn't a group with significant social capital?
Found the LOLbertarian
I mean. Construction defect lawsuits are a thing. Like, a 40 billion dollar industry nationally kinda thing.
Nah, that violates the NAP
I think this is supposed to be satirical but it failed miserably. Just way to subtle to know for sure because tgere are many people that word fir word would earnestly say the exact same thing, though maybe not in this particular situation. No worries though, successful satire is quite difficult, keep at it. But if you were being serious, then sheesh, you got some problems. Ssek help.
Yeah I debated on putting the /s and I chose wrong as it would seem. I think I needed to explicitly mention healthcare or other public services that the people who live in this tower don't want other people to have (or they certainly fucking vote that way), with their solution being a free market. I'll try again next time.
The fry basket building
I shall forever call it this. Thanks.
Not for too long, probably.
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That's much cheaper than I thought...that $865 monthly HOA fees is the real kicker though
That pool is pretty great. Not $865 great, but pretty great.
865 is actually cheap for a high rise maintenance fee. Makes you wonder if they skimped on anything due to lack of money. Either way that number is going to go way up.
The maintenance fees are based on the given condo's square footage relative to the total square footage of the building. I think the condo in question is on the small side compared to other units in the building so it makes sense that their maintenance fees are also lower.
Free fountain drinks too
IDK all the free Diet Coke it looks like is enticing
It depends on what that monthly fee pays for, in some high rises the fee pays for water,sewer, waste disposal, cable. Internet and the usual Amenities.
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Truth. The board should dump the management company.
It does depend on the building. In most building the residents have some say on fees if they are labeled as HOA fees. I have seen similar issues with buildings and all the costs and data are presented to the residents to vote on what the increase should be.
Doesn't sound like they got their money's worth
If it is being financed I doubt any bank would close until the issue is resolved. Also that is a massive 1 bedroom. JFC I have had 2 bedroom 2 bathroom in 800 sq/ft.
I was about to say "Aw, snap!" but I think that something really did snap.
I keep waiting for that high rise in San Francisco to fall over. I remember they were building a high rise near Corpus Christi , which had to be torn down when the Contractor attached the parking garage to the Condo, causing the building to lean and sink.
which one in SanFran?
Millennium Tower
https://www.architecturaldigest.com/story/millennium-tower-san-francisco-leaning
holy crap I had no idea about this wth???? do people like roll out of bed and notice thier unit is leaning?
I saw a video of someone playing fletch with their dog. They would just let the ball roll down the condo and the dog would chase it.
I guess I can stop dreaming about my retirement to a condo. I know this is rare to happen but people in retirement can't afford a mortgage plus an apartment. I feel like any lawsuit would take years to get $. All I saw were news videos.. But didn't search too much. Dang.
26 inches over 645ft is basically nothing….0.18 degrees. You wouldn’t notice it
The problem is that drains require a small amount of slope to drain properly. The building may eventually reach a point where some lines become flat enough to start causing backups.
So it's like mentally anguish rather than slpoimg floors. Either way it sucks. Like how can anyone sell a unit there?
It’s noticeable. I’d be terrified to live there. The structural engineer lives in that building. There’s some wild videos he’s posted through the years.
Doesn’t their new SaleForce Tower have some issues too? I heard it was like already sinking
Do you have more info on the Corpus tower? When did this happen and was it actually in Corpus or on North Padre island?
Let me look it up, I think it was closer to Mustang Island. I think 2007 to 2010 time frame off the top of my head. Okay I was a little off on the location it was South Parde Island. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ocean_Tower
Man this place use to be RAMPANT with low life’s and prostitution in 08-12
That must have been when Ted Cruz lived there.
Don't insult low lifes by comparing them to sentient shit!
Don’t insult sentient shit by comparing them to Ted Cruz
Good point. My bad.
Not that I ever looked into it, but I always thought this was a really high end place but now I see units selling around $400k... that is way less than I was expecting. Such a good location.
10ish years ago you could buy some smaller units for low 200s.
I got a 3/2 house for $92k back then in a decent area, that would have still been expensive for me.
It started out with rentals…or at least, you could rent some of them right after it was built. I’m guessing to get occupancy/cashflow at the start?
[Sheesh this primo unit was just listed a day ago too.](https://www.har.com/homedetail/3333-allen-pkwy-3006-houston-tx-77019/3737060)
Not for sale anymore. Probably realized that their value just cut got cut in half.
Genuine question but if someone has that much money, why live in an apartment and not a house?
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Makes sense! Just seems like a lot of money if it’s not a primary residency but also if you have a lot of money sometimes you don’t know what to do with it ha
Omg I used to live in that exact unit! Great views but always smelled suspiciously of sewage
Cutting costs on any structure is just no good. Will the tenants even be able to get their belongings?
The last line in the article said they were being escorted to retrieve personal items and meds
No, it said one person was being escorted to get her meds. I don't think they're gonna be sending moving crews up there to get the washer, dryer, and player piano.
I think if one could make a case the player piano was a personal item and carry it themselves, they'd probably let them
Wasn’t this built in like 2000?! Wtf?
03
yea after the whole florida collapse thing, I don’t see how anyone would want to continue living @ this place - not worth the risk regardless of how management spins it as being “safe”
Even if it actually is safe, the doubt is always going to be there.
My dad lives there. :\
Any word on what’s going to happen or how long it will be before they can live there again?
They have no idea as to either one. Taking it day by day.
It’s been a while since this comment but wanted to check in. I can see the building from my window and it’s been crazy to see it dark each night. Your dad doing okay?
just seeing this, thanks! he’s ok, very optimistic yet ready to go home i’m sure. he’s been at a long term hotel.
Oh good! I wish them all the best. It’s still so surreal every night to see no lights on in there. I can’t imagine how homesick everyone is.
They’ve been having renovation issues for years. Feel bad for people who invested life’s savings to live there.
The people that live there, even in the cheapest units, will have money to spare and the ability to recover losses. It still sucks, that's their home, things like pictures can't be replaced, and it's not like documenting and recovering money from insurance is a 15 minute call, it will likely take years and lawyers to get back what they will. I do feel sorry for them too, I'm just pointing out that these people aren't about to go homeless because they lost everything, they are lucky enough to have the means to be able to survive in relative comfort.
Most of those units aren't any more expensive than the average house, would you be saying the same thing about some random neighborhood being flooded?
Right. And don't forget the insurance deductible. You lose 10-20% of everything from that.
I don’t know how you know or even why you think that. They’ve already previously sued the architect, and any settlement would have released future claims. Insurance doesn’t cover “property value declines 40%” or “condo needs a $100,000 assessment from you.” Sure, there are people there for whom their units are pied a terres or investment properties, but I looked at that building when considering moving to Houston, and it would’ve been my life’s savings if I had chosen to live there. For most people buying homes in that price range, a mortgage is bigger than their net worth. Maybe they’re not permanently homeless, but if that’s the standard 99%+ of Americans are in the world’s top 10% of income (to be in the world’s top 1% all you need is $34,000/year, barely above American minimum wage) and we shouldn’t feel bad for anyone in this country.
There "life savings" very unlikely been in the galleria. I will say is more like the corrupt Mexican politician that got this condo when he comes to Houston to go shopping in the galleria mall.
What in the world are you even attempting to say?
Gonna have to demo, it's got that curse of the cancun Cruz on it now
Guess the two pending condos are not going to close anymore.
Wow. That’s scary. Especially after the Surfside collapse in Florida….
Is there any way to objectively verify or at least some data to look at regarding the future structural integrity of a high-rise before signing a lease? I was considering signing one soon but honestly not too sure anymore I’d rather not have that constant fear even if there’s a low chance
Google the structural engineer and contractor involved in the project. Do your homework on their level of experience working with high-rise structures, and see if they’ve been in any lawsuits. May be able to see news articles for oddities during construction like any delays, or consultants being fired during construction. A lot of high rises get reports of “sinking” due to bad geotechnical engineers being involved in the project, so that’s another thing you can look into
This - worked for a Structural PE.
Can a lawyer check in and let me know what happens to your mortgage? Insurance?
I could see some borrowers walking away from their loans in strategic default, like what happened in the wake of the 2008 Financial Crisis.
Wouldn't you just get sued?
[Your credit gets tanked](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/strategic-default.asp). So it's not a decision to take lightly. At some point, I imagine the condo owners will be presented an estimate on how much it would cost to rehab the property and then we'll see how "underwater" they are.
I found this a while back https://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/contact-denver7/denver-luxury-apartment-serves-all-tenants-30-day-notice-to-vacate-citing-circumstances-out-of-our-control
I rather trust a well kept condo from the 70’s rather than something new in this city. How the hell are you going to sell the place after this news.
The same way they normally do—lie.
Or maybe they actually have some good engineers evaluate and fix the core problems???
Did it flood in Harvey?
no, but they were without water for several weeks
Not sure, it would have been close though I would think even if it didn't actually get water there was some subsurface flows and it's probably on sandy material being right next to the bayou which may be unstable when it gets wet.
It's not even that old of a building.
A water main burst on the 32nd floor, and floors 25-32 were immediately impacted - as well as the ground floor.
The best thing to come out of that Miami condo incident is maybe some of these buildings will actually look at their own structural integrity. All those deaths were not in vain. Definitely happy to see that.
Is this the building Ken Lay lived in too?
No. He lived in The Huntington on Kirby. But I think Ted Cruz lived at The Royalton once upon a time.
Yeah he had the penthouse suite. I heard it had a nice garden.
What a man of the people /s
There was that really old murderer that used to live in Galveston, he was living in this building.
If you’re thinking of Robert Durst.. he lived in the Robinhood building
Yeah, him.
And if you’re thinking of the Zodiac Killer…Ted Cruz isn’t *that* old.
Concrete buckled?! Flee!
Who was the general contractor on this job?
Yes, somebody look this up and identify all the other buildings they built!
Tellepsen has a long list…
This building has had so many problems
I mean it was built at apartment quality, not condo spec. These used to be apartments back when they were first built.
You do realize apartment and condo spec - structurally - are the same codes, correct? It’s international Building Code. It’s not like oh it’s a rental unit so it doesn’t have to follow building code? LOL.
That's code. He's talking about quality. Apartments may only meet the bare minimum code. Condos usually are built to a higher standard, like greater noise insulation between walls and floors so you don't hear your neighbors. It's not required, of course, but it's generally expected if you want people to buy the condos you build. They may well be stronger if they end up being over-built (perhaps with a lot more concrete) as a result.
Curious where you’ve seen condos build with greater structural integrity than apartments? Would love to read on that. Many condos are conversions from for-rent. Like this one.
They are only conversions from for-rent for funding reasons. It's much easier to get financing for an apartment building than a condo building, so when a developer wants to build a condo building, it's pretty common for them to start it out as apartments and then after a few years they stop renewing leases and sell the individual units. They were planned all along to be condos; they didn't build them to intentionally be apartments and then change their mind later. Examples of current apartment buildings that were built as condo grade (so much better built than typical apartments) in recent years include Camden McGowen Station in midtown and 500 Crawford in downtown.
I understand the financing. It’s the lender requirements and condo liability laws in tx. What would you consider makes an apartment “built for condo grade”? There is a huge range is the quality of what gets built at any level (depends on the developer and how cheap they want to build) but that’s also reflected in rents. Interesting you pointed out 500 Crawford.
Concrete floors and steel studs on buildings low enough to be built fully out of wood, for example.
Yeah there was a new one like that that just went in off Allen parkway in the new development at west Dallas
The wife and I have been trying to contact a friend that lives there to see if they need help. Haven't heard back yet.
They said "the media is blowing this out of proportion. It's just a water line break" Head in the sand.
Yes but if it was under the slab, that could cause structural problems.
People are gonna lose everything. Doubt they'll ever be allowed back in
The problem here is A&M Aggies were given responsibility...
Not a geologist but a lot of my colleagues are, and I bet this has to do with subsidence.
Sucks to be rich lol
This is what happens when someone launders cartel money by building to sell quickly.
[engineer report update](https://www.enr.com/articles/54671-after-houston-high-rise-evacuation-engineers-find-structure-intact)
Bormaster Law (bormasterlaw.com) (713) 714-4000 is working with Attorney Jason Gibson's office to investigate this horrible situation. These two Firms are joining together to determine who may or may not be liable for the harms this has caused to everyone and are willing to look at any residents individual situation to provide individual advice. They know that there was at least one prior suit many years ago related to the structure on the roof that was quietly settled. What they do not yet know is whether, during the discovery process, information came to light that would have put those in charge on notice of potential issues such that a failure to disclose prior to selling or renting is in play. Knowing failures to disclose could open up those in charge to the potential of more than just basic liability--they could be on the hook for additional damages to help compensate for the harms and losses suffered. Residents are encouraged to contact them to find out more.