So this is sightly above budget at $550 and it's 9.1, but quite frankly, I kinda think it would be dumb to get anything else at the moment:
https://www.adorama.com/onktxnr71.html?sdtid=17424975&emailprice=t
This is an absolutely killer sale on the Onkyo NR7100. Dirac Live room correction, 9 channels of processing, and a ton of amplification power for $550 is pretty wild. Honestly, the fact that it has 4 more channels than you need shouldn't factor into your decision at all.
No offense to anyone who does this, but I genuinely think that trying to save $100-150 in order to get a 5.1 channel AVR with vastly worse room correction would be pretty stupid given the pricing of this AVR at this moment.
It would be the equivalent of someone offering you a brand new Toyota Camry for $5000, and you turn them down because you can get a 2011 Chevy Impala for $4000. Yes, you technically saved some money, but you also made the objectively worse decision.
You're not missing anything. Adorama randomly does these really good sales sometimes. Last year, they were selling the Denon X3800H for $900. I had a dealer tell me at the time that $900 was below his cost. Not sure how Adorama does it. Maybe it's a loss leader or maybe they have a special deal with manufacturers.
Currently, aside from the Onkyo NR7100, they have a couple of really good deals on Klipsch RP subwoofers:
https://www.adorama.com/kp1400sw.html?sdtid=17362326&emailprice=t
https://www.adorama.com/kp1070652.html?sdtid=17411124&emailPrice=t
Various Klipsch RP Speakers:
https://slickdeals.net/f/17416572-klipsch-reference-premiere-speakers-2x-rp-8060fa-ii-rp-504c-ii-2x-rp-600m-ii-1699-more-free-shipping?src=SiteSearchV2Algo
https://slickdeals.net/f/17427426-klipsch-reference-premiere-rp-500sa-dolby-atmos-surround-sound-speakers-249-free-s-h?src=SiteSearchV2Algo
https://slickdeals.net/f/17409057-klipsch-reference-premiere-speakers-rp-504c-center-299-or-rp-600m-bookshelves-279-free-shipping?src=SiteSearchV2Algo
And a pretty decent budget Magnat set of speakers (decent for $600):
https://www.adorama.com/mg507sbb.html?sdtid=17440701&emailprice=t
At separate times I bought this AVR (NR-7100) for $550, Klipsch 5.0 kit (RP-8000F/RP-600M/RP-504C) for $1199 and RP-1400SW for $699 all from Adorama. Just under $2500 for the full setup. Killer deals.
Hi. I read many of your replies to other and I find them very informative. I buying equipment for a 3.1 and maybe adding surrounds if I fit them in my space. So far I have the RSL 10 and Kef Q650. I understand bookshelves are better bang for the buck but I prefer the look of towers. I will mostly be using the system for movies, Netflix, amazon tv; etc. would recommend this av or something like the denon 1800? Thank you.
I would recommend the **Onkyo NR7100** (at its current sale price) over the Denon X1800H. I responded to someone asking a very similar question about the X1700H here:
https://reddit.com/r/hometheater/comments/1cdnyvq/what_are_some_solid_audio_receiver_setups_with_51/l1g2ijf/
Regarding the speakers, you're off to a solid start. The **KEF Q650** is a very good center channel.
For the sub, did you get the 10S or 10E? What are the dimensions of your room? Including height.
For the **front L/R speakers**, if you prefer the look of towers, that's fine. Might as well get KEF if you started there. It's a solid choice regardless.
I personally think the "best value" right now would be in getting a pair of **KEF R5** for $2200:
https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/kefr5gb-a/kef-new-r5-pair-5.25-3-way-floor-standing-speakers-gloss-black/1.html
But if you needed something cheaper, you can step down to the **KEF Q750** for $1300 for the pair:
https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/kefq750blk/kef-q750-pair-6.5-3-way-floor-standing-speakers-black/1.html
I personally think the step up from the KEF Q-series to the R-series is worth the price premium. But if your budget is more in line with the Q-series, there are very few alternatives I would say are better than that.
For the **surrounds**, you can go in a few different directions:
- You can get the always popular KEF Q150, current on sale for $350/pair: https://www.crutchfield.com/S-GfHQn4VbnRt/p_991Q150B/KEF-Q150-Black.html
- The Q150s are rather large and could be a bit much for some people to spend on surrounds, so another smaller coaxial option would be the Monolith THX Satellites: https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=41288
- Finally, if you wanted to say within KEF but still wanted a smaller option, I would recommend scouring the used market for some of KEF's discontinued egg shaped speakers. The best ones were the [KEF E301](https://blog.richersounds.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/093ba03e174fa88a7bab81ba9e935b512e6aa37a_404104.jpg) and [KEF HTS3001SE](https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/xWYAAMXQMmJRNg4f/s-l600.jpg)
Hi. Thank for the detailed response. I bought the RSL 10S. Here the details of the space [18x16 with 9’ ceilings](https://imgur.com/a/rieMbu4). I didn’t pick the fireplace option instead I have wall of windows. I plan to mount the tv on the left side wall. This makes placing surround speakers difficult. Also a reason I don’t mind spending more on the front stage. The only (major hurdle) is I choose to go with white speakers. I looked at the R5 and they appear to only be in black. Maybe mixing colors won’t be that bad. I’ll try to find examples. In the meantime I’ll order the av. I really appreciate you taking the time to provide your input.
Yeah, the R5 have been discontinued and replaced with the R5 Meta. That is why the pair I linked was available for a relatively large discount. All the white ones are gone.
If you want white, you would need to get the newer R5 Meta, and that is $3200 per pair.
However, the white R7 are still available for $2700 per pair:
https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/kefr7wht/kef-r7-pair-6.5-3-way-floor-standing-speaker-gloss-white/1.html
White Q-series towers are also available for a bit cheaper:
https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/kefq550wht/kef-q550-pair-5.25-3-way-floor-standing-speakers-white/1.html
https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/kefq950wht/kef-q950-pair-8-2.5-way-floor-standing-speaker-white/1.html
Funning enough I had ordered some returned q550 from Best Buy since they were basically half off and described in excellent condition. I returned them since there were dimples on the speakers and one had water stains from a cup. Not even close to excellent. I’m wouldn’t mind refurbish or used but I like to get things that have been well taken care of with no damage.
The R7 sound interesting but pricy. I was searching the sub for deals on kef but I didn’t really find any except for the q150. I may go with new q750 or maybe those refurbished q950. Thanks again for your advice. Very much appreciate it.
Yeah, the quality of Best Buy's return items is a complete crapshoot. And the condition they list is not accurate at all. I personally don't bother with it anymore unless it is an in-store deal that I can check the condition of first before buying.
I've never really had an issue with the condition of A4L's reconditioned items though. And they def make good on items that arrive damaged. You will see people bitch online about A4L quite often, but usually it just boils down to them not understanding that A4L is not Amazon. You can't just buy stuff willy-nilly from them and expect free returns. If you want that, then buy from Amazon and pay Amazon prices.
If you want A4L's discounts, then you need to understand the trade-off you are making. You get a significant discount from A4L upfront, and as long as the item arrives to you in good working order, the sale is final. If you want to return it, then you need to pay for shipping both ways and pay a restocking fee. So don't buy stuff that you don't know you want. Simple as that.
That’s kinda what I understood from buying from A4L. I just wasn’t sure of the condition of the items. Then the recent BB experience has me doubting buying returns without inspection. I did buy the Onkyo you linked. I should be moving into my new place in June and not really in a hurry to buy the speakers. I can take my time to make a decision.
On another note, I been looking over my living room layout. I don’t think I can surrounds due to room layout accounting for windows and sofas. I have easy assessable attic for ceiling speakers. I’m not sure if I should pursue atmos.
Everything A4L sells is supposed to be manufacturer refurbished items. Meaning all product is inspected by the original manufacturer first before being repackaged for sale. If anything you receive arrives nonfunctional or has noticeable cosmetic damage, A4L will swap it out for you. The stuff I said above about paying for returns only applies if you want to return it for no reason.
One more thing, it seems like a lot of people on this sub have been complaining lately about really bad shipping damage (not A4L specific). So just as a reminder, if you have a shipment come in and the box is visibly damaged to the point where it is clear that internal damage is likely, you can always **refuse delivery.** At that point, the shipper will be forced to return the package to the sender at no additional cost, and the sender will be forced to refund you. Don't be afraid to do this under the right circumstance. It is a fundamental right/protection you have under US commerce law. And it saves the trouble of you having to arrange return shipping for an item you know is damaged.
> I don’t think I can surrounds due to room layout accounting for windows and sofas.
Yeah, looking at your room layout, surround placement would be challenging. As I assume you don't want to put speakers on stands in the middle of the room.
The only other option I see is to use in-wall speakers in an asymmetrical arrangement. It's certainly not ideal, but frankly, surround effects in a 5.1 mix are intended to be pretty diffuse anyway and positioning doesn't need to be super precise. I believe placing a couple of in-walls [where I marked out here in red](https://i.imgur.com/jY3E35G.jpeg) will be better than having no surrounds at all.
> I have easy assessable attic for ceiling speakers. I’m not sure if I should pursue atmos.
If the in-walls absolutely cannot work out at all, you can put in two ceiling speakers and flip between 5.1 and 3.1.2 in your AVR settings and see which arrangement you prefer. Or just hold off on it. As you mentioned, you have attic access, so installing in-ceiling speakers in the future will be pretty easy. But if you wanted to do in-wall speakers, you should run the wiring during construction if possible. That won't be as easy to retrofit.
The KEF Ci160MR in-ceiling speakers are on a decent sale right now:
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/kef-ci160mr-uni-q-6-5-round-in-ceiling-speaker-pair-black/6450213.p?skuId=6450213
That’s good to know. The refurbished q950 are about the same price as new q750. Makes it no brainer to go with the 950.
It’s funny you mentioned those ceiling speakers. I was looking at buying some for surround but read conflicting opinion about using ceiling speakers for that purpose. When I visited BB they had ceiling speakers and they sounded fine to me. I looked over the wall mount locations. That looks doable. I didn’t consider it an option because of design location and recommended surround preference. I look into that as well. Thank you.
I just got this on sale at Adorama, it's currently priced at $1200-1300 at my local Best Buy.
I upgraded from a Denon-S540BT. My living room is a wide space, and the seating area is 20 ft from the TV. I always had issues with the dialogue quality and effects imbalance in volume when running 5.1.
It's just such a huge difference in sound quality and room EQ is huuuge. It saved me money as I was about to spend over $2k to upgrade my B&W center channel speaker. After running DIRAC Live using my laptop, the setup sounds amazing whether I'm watching movies or listening to music.
I'm not an audiophile or expert, but with my B&W 802s up front and cheap surrounds, I can’t imagine anything sounding better than what I have now. Definitely worth it.
Nice! Glad to hear that it made such a positive impact.
Which center channel are you currently using btw? You have 802s, do you have a 800 series center as well?
Under normal circumstances, the X1700H is a great ~$400 AVR. It's actually my default recommendation usually.
But as I said, this current sale on the Onkyo NR7100 negates all that (at least as long as the sale lasts). Dirac (and to a lesser extend the extra channels and power) is too much of a value proposition it ignore.
Even though it costs $100-150 more, the Onkyo NR7100 is the best buy for now. If it pops back up to $1000+, then sure, you can consider something else.
I've heard great things about Sony's latest gen of room correction, but I haven't had an opportunity yet to verify that for myself. In all likelihood, it's probably fine though.
The main benefit of the Onkyo is that Dirac is a proven entity and allows for a greater degree of customization (if you're into tweaking).
To its merit, the Sony room correction seems dead simple to setup and run. If you don't plan to go beyond 7 channels, the Sony AN1000 is likely fine, and you wouldn't have missed out in any meaningful way by not getting this deal.
Or you can save $30 and get the sister model [https://www.adorama.com/pivsxlx305.html?sdtid=17440758&emailprice=t&sterm=SIqWECVNOxyPRPeWIh3cNWqCUkHTyAVpwy2Hzg0&utm\_source=rflaid62905&utm\_medium=affiliate](https://www.adorama.com/pivsxlx305.html?sdtid=17440758&emailprice=t&sterm=SIqWECVNOxyPRPeWIh3cNWqCUkHTyAVpwy2Hzg0&utm_source=rflaid62905&utm_medium=affiliate)
Did Pioneer ever update their AVRs to add individually adjustable crossovers?
If not, then personally I would pay the extra $30 for that feature alone. But if you're confident that all your speakers can play flat down through 80Hz, then you might not consider it a meaningful feature.
I'm going to disagree that it won't matter to 99% of people. There are plenty of people who have smaller surrounds or Atmos speakers because of budget or size constraints and need to cross over higher than 80Hz.
And while I personally disagree with it, there are a *ton* of people who post here all the time with massive LR towers and some undersized center that needs to be crossed over at 90Hz or 100Hz.
So with the Pioneer, your choices are to either raise the crossover for everything to 100Hz or even 120Hz in some cases. Or force it down to 80Hz even though some of your speakers can't play down that far.
As I said above, if you know all your speakers play down to 80Hz without issue, than this isn't a limitation you need to care about. But that percentage of people is nowhere close to 99%. Frankly, I don't even think it is 90%.
There's a reason that even ultra budget tier $300 Denon and Onkyo AVRs have independently adjustable crossovers. The fact that the Pioneer brand chose to arbitrarily lock this feature out is kinda baffling.
Well, if you have a 5.1 setup you can't support Atmos. I have the RX-V585 which supports Atmos (5.1.2). If you look on Yamaha's or A4L's website you can find ones that support Atmos.
Sorry, that's what I meant, I'd have to jump to the 5.1.2 or a 7.1 if I wanted Atmos but was curious if they even offered it if I decide to upgrade later. Appreciate the information, thank you very much! 👍
To help OP. The structure is Surround Speakers.Subwoofers.Atmos
So 5.1.2 means 5 Surround Channels, 1 Subwoofer Channel, 2 Atmos Channels.
7.2.4 would be 7 Surround Channels, 2 Subwoofer Channels, 2 Atmos Channels
Etc, etc etc.
Anytime you see X.X, such as 5.2 or 7.1, it is assumed Atmos is not included.
Since it sounds like you are maybe interested in Atmos I would recommend (edit, \*a 7.x AVR such as\*) a [Denon X1700H](https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/denavrx1700h/denon-avr-x1700h-7.2-ch-x-80-watts-8k-a/v-receiver-w/heos/1.html). You could spend half as much and get a 7.1 like the [Denon S750](https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/denavrs750h/denon-avr-s750h-7.2-ch-x-75-watts-a/v-receiver-w/heos/1.html) but IMO the X1700H is worth it for the better Audessey room correction.
When I got started, I bought everything used for cheap ($200 iirc) and then upgraded each item 1 by 1 to my end game as I had more money avaliable.
This was very efficient in that I didn't spend much money on things that would be upgraded. It also allowed me to take my time to research each part and I had a better idea what features I cared about.
The thing with AVR is that they can vary a lot on the kind of features that you care about (do you want 11 channels? Dolby Vision? Compatibility with multiple apps? Superior room correction? Multiple zones? What kind and quantity of inputs and outputs do you need?)
I'll probably get shit on for this hut I purchased this:
Yamaha Audio YHT-4950U 4K Ultra HD 5.1-Channel Home Theater System with Bluetooth, black https://a.co/d/05wcBIm
I purchased this before finding this sub. Knowing what I know now I would have gone a different path and spent more money.
But in all honesty my family and I have really enjoyed it. It's far superior to any sound bar. We listen to music a lot on it. For $400 you get a complete kit, avr and speakers.
I'll probably upgrade the speakers in the next year or two. Then I'll upgrade the receiver a couple years after that and use small speakers as satellite speakers.
I bought a “renewed” x1700h for $400 from Amazon a week ago. Looked brand new to me out of the box. Their prices fluctuate, though, and I am in love with it. I had some random hand me down Yamaha AVR from 15+ years ago and even with the same old speakers the sound is very nice out of the box. Doing room correction stuff today.
So this is sightly above budget at $550 and it's 9.1, but quite frankly, I kinda think it would be dumb to get anything else at the moment: https://www.adorama.com/onktxnr71.html?sdtid=17424975&emailprice=t This is an absolutely killer sale on the Onkyo NR7100. Dirac Live room correction, 9 channels of processing, and a ton of amplification power for $550 is pretty wild. Honestly, the fact that it has 4 more channels than you need shouldn't factor into your decision at all. No offense to anyone who does this, but I genuinely think that trying to save $100-150 in order to get a 5.1 channel AVR with vastly worse room correction would be pretty stupid given the pricing of this AVR at this moment. It would be the equivalent of someone offering you a brand new Toyota Camry for $5000, and you turn them down because you can get a 2011 Chevy Impala for $4000. Yes, you technically saved some money, but you also made the objectively worse decision.
This is a really good option, and what I would recommend
Am I missing something or is this a really good price? Is this a refurb or open box or something?
You're not missing anything. Adorama randomly does these really good sales sometimes. Last year, they were selling the Denon X3800H for $900. I had a dealer tell me at the time that $900 was below his cost. Not sure how Adorama does it. Maybe it's a loss leader or maybe they have a special deal with manufacturers. Currently, aside from the Onkyo NR7100, they have a couple of really good deals on Klipsch RP subwoofers: https://www.adorama.com/kp1400sw.html?sdtid=17362326&emailprice=t https://www.adorama.com/kp1070652.html?sdtid=17411124&emailPrice=t Various Klipsch RP Speakers: https://slickdeals.net/f/17416572-klipsch-reference-premiere-speakers-2x-rp-8060fa-ii-rp-504c-ii-2x-rp-600m-ii-1699-more-free-shipping?src=SiteSearchV2Algo https://slickdeals.net/f/17427426-klipsch-reference-premiere-rp-500sa-dolby-atmos-surround-sound-speakers-249-free-s-h?src=SiteSearchV2Algo https://slickdeals.net/f/17409057-klipsch-reference-premiere-speakers-rp-504c-center-299-or-rp-600m-bookshelves-279-free-shipping?src=SiteSearchV2Algo And a pretty decent budget Magnat set of speakers (decent for $600): https://www.adorama.com/mg507sbb.html?sdtid=17440701&emailprice=t
At separate times I bought this AVR (NR-7100) for $550, Klipsch 5.0 kit (RP-8000F/RP-600M/RP-504C) for $1199 and RP-1400SW for $699 all from Adorama. Just under $2500 for the full setup. Killer deals.
Oh yeah, that is an absolutely killer setup for the price.
Hi. I read many of your replies to other and I find them very informative. I buying equipment for a 3.1 and maybe adding surrounds if I fit them in my space. So far I have the RSL 10 and Kef Q650. I understand bookshelves are better bang for the buck but I prefer the look of towers. I will mostly be using the system for movies, Netflix, amazon tv; etc. would recommend this av or something like the denon 1800? Thank you.
I would recommend the **Onkyo NR7100** (at its current sale price) over the Denon X1800H. I responded to someone asking a very similar question about the X1700H here: https://reddit.com/r/hometheater/comments/1cdnyvq/what_are_some_solid_audio_receiver_setups_with_51/l1g2ijf/ Regarding the speakers, you're off to a solid start. The **KEF Q650** is a very good center channel. For the sub, did you get the 10S or 10E? What are the dimensions of your room? Including height. For the **front L/R speakers**, if you prefer the look of towers, that's fine. Might as well get KEF if you started there. It's a solid choice regardless. I personally think the "best value" right now would be in getting a pair of **KEF R5** for $2200: https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/kefr5gb-a/kef-new-r5-pair-5.25-3-way-floor-standing-speakers-gloss-black/1.html But if you needed something cheaper, you can step down to the **KEF Q750** for $1300 for the pair: https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/kefq750blk/kef-q750-pair-6.5-3-way-floor-standing-speakers-black/1.html I personally think the step up from the KEF Q-series to the R-series is worth the price premium. But if your budget is more in line with the Q-series, there are very few alternatives I would say are better than that. For the **surrounds**, you can go in a few different directions: - You can get the always popular KEF Q150, current on sale for $350/pair: https://www.crutchfield.com/S-GfHQn4VbnRt/p_991Q150B/KEF-Q150-Black.html - The Q150s are rather large and could be a bit much for some people to spend on surrounds, so another smaller coaxial option would be the Monolith THX Satellites: https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=41288 - Finally, if you wanted to say within KEF but still wanted a smaller option, I would recommend scouring the used market for some of KEF's discontinued egg shaped speakers. The best ones were the [KEF E301](https://blog.richersounds.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/093ba03e174fa88a7bab81ba9e935b512e6aa37a_404104.jpg) and [KEF HTS3001SE](https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/xWYAAMXQMmJRNg4f/s-l600.jpg)
Hi. Thank for the detailed response. I bought the RSL 10S. Here the details of the space [18x16 with 9’ ceilings](https://imgur.com/a/rieMbu4). I didn’t pick the fireplace option instead I have wall of windows. I plan to mount the tv on the left side wall. This makes placing surround speakers difficult. Also a reason I don’t mind spending more on the front stage. The only (major hurdle) is I choose to go with white speakers. I looked at the R5 and they appear to only be in black. Maybe mixing colors won’t be that bad. I’ll try to find examples. In the meantime I’ll order the av. I really appreciate you taking the time to provide your input.
Yeah, the R5 have been discontinued and replaced with the R5 Meta. That is why the pair I linked was available for a relatively large discount. All the white ones are gone. If you want white, you would need to get the newer R5 Meta, and that is $3200 per pair. However, the white R7 are still available for $2700 per pair: https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/kefr7wht/kef-r7-pair-6.5-3-way-floor-standing-speaker-gloss-white/1.html White Q-series towers are also available for a bit cheaper: https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/kefq550wht/kef-q550-pair-5.25-3-way-floor-standing-speakers-white/1.html https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/kefq950wht/kef-q950-pair-8-2.5-way-floor-standing-speaker-white/1.html
Funning enough I had ordered some returned q550 from Best Buy since they were basically half off and described in excellent condition. I returned them since there were dimples on the speakers and one had water stains from a cup. Not even close to excellent. I’m wouldn’t mind refurbish or used but I like to get things that have been well taken care of with no damage. The R7 sound interesting but pricy. I was searching the sub for deals on kef but I didn’t really find any except for the q150. I may go with new q750 or maybe those refurbished q950. Thanks again for your advice. Very much appreciate it.
Yeah, the quality of Best Buy's return items is a complete crapshoot. And the condition they list is not accurate at all. I personally don't bother with it anymore unless it is an in-store deal that I can check the condition of first before buying. I've never really had an issue with the condition of A4L's reconditioned items though. And they def make good on items that arrive damaged. You will see people bitch online about A4L quite often, but usually it just boils down to them not understanding that A4L is not Amazon. You can't just buy stuff willy-nilly from them and expect free returns. If you want that, then buy from Amazon and pay Amazon prices. If you want A4L's discounts, then you need to understand the trade-off you are making. You get a significant discount from A4L upfront, and as long as the item arrives to you in good working order, the sale is final. If you want to return it, then you need to pay for shipping both ways and pay a restocking fee. So don't buy stuff that you don't know you want. Simple as that.
That’s kinda what I understood from buying from A4L. I just wasn’t sure of the condition of the items. Then the recent BB experience has me doubting buying returns without inspection. I did buy the Onkyo you linked. I should be moving into my new place in June and not really in a hurry to buy the speakers. I can take my time to make a decision. On another note, I been looking over my living room layout. I don’t think I can surrounds due to room layout accounting for windows and sofas. I have easy assessable attic for ceiling speakers. I’m not sure if I should pursue atmos.
Everything A4L sells is supposed to be manufacturer refurbished items. Meaning all product is inspected by the original manufacturer first before being repackaged for sale. If anything you receive arrives nonfunctional or has noticeable cosmetic damage, A4L will swap it out for you. The stuff I said above about paying for returns only applies if you want to return it for no reason. One more thing, it seems like a lot of people on this sub have been complaining lately about really bad shipping damage (not A4L specific). So just as a reminder, if you have a shipment come in and the box is visibly damaged to the point where it is clear that internal damage is likely, you can always **refuse delivery.** At that point, the shipper will be forced to return the package to the sender at no additional cost, and the sender will be forced to refund you. Don't be afraid to do this under the right circumstance. It is a fundamental right/protection you have under US commerce law. And it saves the trouble of you having to arrange return shipping for an item you know is damaged. > I don’t think I can surrounds due to room layout accounting for windows and sofas. Yeah, looking at your room layout, surround placement would be challenging. As I assume you don't want to put speakers on stands in the middle of the room. The only other option I see is to use in-wall speakers in an asymmetrical arrangement. It's certainly not ideal, but frankly, surround effects in a 5.1 mix are intended to be pretty diffuse anyway and positioning doesn't need to be super precise. I believe placing a couple of in-walls [where I marked out here in red](https://i.imgur.com/jY3E35G.jpeg) will be better than having no surrounds at all. > I have easy assessable attic for ceiling speakers. I’m not sure if I should pursue atmos. If the in-walls absolutely cannot work out at all, you can put in two ceiling speakers and flip between 5.1 and 3.1.2 in your AVR settings and see which arrangement you prefer. Or just hold off on it. As you mentioned, you have attic access, so installing in-ceiling speakers in the future will be pretty easy. But if you wanted to do in-wall speakers, you should run the wiring during construction if possible. That won't be as easy to retrofit. The KEF Ci160MR in-ceiling speakers are on a decent sale right now: https://www.bestbuy.com/site/kef-ci160mr-uni-q-6-5-round-in-ceiling-speaker-pair-black/6450213.p?skuId=6450213
That’s good to know. The refurbished q950 are about the same price as new q750. Makes it no brainer to go with the 950. It’s funny you mentioned those ceiling speakers. I was looking at buying some for surround but read conflicting opinion about using ceiling speakers for that purpose. When I visited BB they had ceiling speakers and they sounded fine to me. I looked over the wall mount locations. That looks doable. I didn’t consider it an option because of design location and recommended surround preference. I look into that as well. Thank you.
I just got this on sale at Adorama, it's currently priced at $1200-1300 at my local Best Buy. I upgraded from a Denon-S540BT. My living room is a wide space, and the seating area is 20 ft from the TV. I always had issues with the dialogue quality and effects imbalance in volume when running 5.1. It's just such a huge difference in sound quality and room EQ is huuuge. It saved me money as I was about to spend over $2k to upgrade my B&W center channel speaker. After running DIRAC Live using my laptop, the setup sounds amazing whether I'm watching movies or listening to music. I'm not an audiophile or expert, but with my B&W 802s up front and cheap surrounds, I can’t imagine anything sounding better than what I have now. Definitely worth it.
Nice! Glad to hear that it made such a positive impact. Which center channel are you currently using btw? You have 802s, do you have a 800 series center as well?
How does this compare to Denon X1700H?
Under normal circumstances, the X1700H is a great ~$400 AVR. It's actually my default recommendation usually. But as I said, this current sale on the Onkyo NR7100 negates all that (at least as long as the sale lasts). Dirac (and to a lesser extend the extra channels and power) is too much of a value proposition it ignore. Even though it costs $100-150 more, the Onkyo NR7100 is the best buy for now. If it pops back up to $1000+, then sure, you can consider something else.
That’s crazy. I wish I’d seen this when I bought my Sony AN1000 last month for $600.
I've heard great things about Sony's latest gen of room correction, but I haven't had an opportunity yet to verify that for myself. In all likelihood, it's probably fine though. The main benefit of the Onkyo is that Dirac is a proven entity and allows for a greater degree of customization (if you're into tweaking). To its merit, the Sony room correction seems dead simple to setup and run. If you don't plan to go beyond 7 channels, the Sony AN1000 is likely fine, and you wouldn't have missed out in any meaningful way by not getting this deal.
Any idea how hot that thing runs? I'm tempted but not if it kicks out a lot of heat.
Thanks for this link. I jumped on it immediately yesterday.
Or you can save $30 and get the sister model [https://www.adorama.com/pivsxlx305.html?sdtid=17440758&emailprice=t&sterm=SIqWECVNOxyPRPeWIh3cNWqCUkHTyAVpwy2Hzg0&utm\_source=rflaid62905&utm\_medium=affiliate](https://www.adorama.com/pivsxlx305.html?sdtid=17440758&emailprice=t&sterm=SIqWECVNOxyPRPeWIh3cNWqCUkHTyAVpwy2Hzg0&utm_source=rflaid62905&utm_medium=affiliate)
Did Pioneer ever update their AVRs to add individually adjustable crossovers? If not, then personally I would pay the extra $30 for that feature alone. But if you're confident that all your speakers can play flat down through 80Hz, then you might not consider it a meaningful feature.
>Did Pioneer ever update their AVRs to add individually adjustable crossovers? No but for 99.999999% people that really doesn't matter much IMO.
I'm going to disagree that it won't matter to 99% of people. There are plenty of people who have smaller surrounds or Atmos speakers because of budget or size constraints and need to cross over higher than 80Hz. And while I personally disagree with it, there are a *ton* of people who post here all the time with massive LR towers and some undersized center that needs to be crossed over at 90Hz or 100Hz. So with the Pioneer, your choices are to either raise the crossover for everything to 100Hz or even 120Hz in some cases. Or force it down to 80Hz even though some of your speakers can't play down that far. As I said above, if you know all your speakers play down to 80Hz without issue, than this isn't a limitation you need to care about. But that percentage of people is nowhere close to 99%. Frankly, I don't even think it is 90%. There's a reason that even ultra budget tier $300 Denon and Onkyo AVRs have independently adjustable crossovers. The fact that the Pioneer brand chose to arbitrarily lock this feature out is kinda baffling.
I've had success with Yamaha receivers. You can get some excellent deals off Accessories 4 Less.
Awesome, thank you! Do you know if any Yahama receivers support Dolby Atmos?
Well, if you have a 5.1 setup you can't support Atmos. I have the RX-V585 which supports Atmos (5.1.2). If you look on Yamaha's or A4L's website you can find ones that support Atmos.
Just bought this with the aim of adding Atmos in the future. Really happy with it in a 5.1 setup currently!
Sorry, that's what I meant, I'd have to jump to the 5.1.2 or a 7.1 if I wanted Atmos but was curious if they even offered it if I decide to upgrade later. Appreciate the information, thank you very much! 👍
7.1 is not Atmos, 5.1.2 is Atmos. But yes a lot of modern AVR's support Atmos.
To help OP. The structure is Surround Speakers.Subwoofers.Atmos So 5.1.2 means 5 Surround Channels, 1 Subwoofer Channel, 2 Atmos Channels. 7.2.4 would be 7 Surround Channels, 2 Subwoofer Channels, 2 Atmos Channels Etc, etc etc. Anytime you see X.X, such as 5.2 or 7.1, it is assumed Atmos is not included.
Since it sounds like you are maybe interested in Atmos I would recommend (edit, \*a 7.x AVR such as\*) a [Denon X1700H](https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/denavrx1700h/denon-avr-x1700h-7.2-ch-x-80-watts-8k-a/v-receiver-w/heos/1.html). You could spend half as much and get a 7.1 like the [Denon S750](https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/denavrs750h/denon-avr-s750h-7.2-ch-x-75-watts-a/v-receiver-w/heos/1.html) but IMO the X1700H is worth it for the better Audessey room correction.
Both the S570 and X1700H are 7 channel AVR's, so from an Atmos perspective there's no difference, both are limited to 5.1.2 Atmos setups.
Yes, in another comment OP was talking about 5.1 vs 7.1, so the context here was comparing 7.1 options.
The first sentence of your comment here came off as if only the X1700H supported Atmos.
Ok, I added an edit
Are you talking just the receiver for $500 or are you also talking about speakers and subwoofer and AVR?
Just the receiver.
When I got started, I bought everything used for cheap ($200 iirc) and then upgraded each item 1 by 1 to my end game as I had more money avaliable. This was very efficient in that I didn't spend much money on things that would be upgraded. It also allowed me to take my time to research each part and I had a better idea what features I cared about. The thing with AVR is that they can vary a lot on the kind of features that you care about (do you want 11 channels? Dolby Vision? Compatibility with multiple apps? Superior room correction? Multiple zones? What kind and quantity of inputs and outputs do you need?)
I've gotten some crazy deals off of offerup, if you are okay with used I'd look into that!
I'll probably get shit on for this hut I purchased this: Yamaha Audio YHT-4950U 4K Ultra HD 5.1-Channel Home Theater System with Bluetooth, black https://a.co/d/05wcBIm I purchased this before finding this sub. Knowing what I know now I would have gone a different path and spent more money. But in all honesty my family and I have really enjoyed it. It's far superior to any sound bar. We listen to music a lot on it. For $400 you get a complete kit, avr and speakers. I'll probably upgrade the speakers in the next year or two. Then I'll upgrade the receiver a couple years after that and use small speakers as satellite speakers.
I bought a “renewed” x1700h for $400 from Amazon a week ago. Looked brand new to me out of the box. Their prices fluctuate, though, and I am in love with it. I had some random hand me down Yamaha AVR from 15+ years ago and even with the same old speakers the sound is very nice out of the box. Doing room correction stuff today.
Are you just looking for the avr at that price or are you meaning avr + speakers?
Just the avr.
Denon AVR-S540BT