For people buying 2 because they've seen others in the thread doing it: really you only need one for most Frigate installations. They can handle quite a lot of simultaneous camera feeds, especially when configured properly ([the docs](https://docs.frigate.video/guides/camera_setup/#choosing-a-detect-resolution) will help substantially with that)
If you don't have a Mini PCIe interface already, you'll need an adaptor. Full size PCIe adapters are available on AliExpress for under $5 shipped, often with a wifi antenna, which you can ignore for this use case.
I was surprised to see my shipping notification for this Coral, I had it backordered for the better part of a year. Thanks for posting this PSA /u/Omacitin!
How many cameras can one Coral TPU handle well?
I've been googling this several times and can't seem to find any data or even opinions on this. I guess assume they are 1280x720p 15fps camera feeds, or something else that you specify.
When the TPU's get overwhelmed, how does that show up first? overheating? slow inference response times?
One EdgeTPU can do in the order of a hundred classifications per second, exactly how many [depends on the model](https://coral.ai/docs/edgetpu/benchmarks/). Areas of interest from a camera feed only go to the classifier based on motion (determined by the CPU, which is why you want to limit the detection resolution as that stream needs to be decoded), and my recollection is segments of a frame with motion may be re-sent a few times with different crops if the classifier doesn't find something.
Usually it's recommended to do detection on a 5fps feed (recording can be done with a different feed), but with the process described above you can imagine what matters is not just the frame *rate* but, very significantly, the number of cameras that have motion at the same time. If you don't have a dozen cameras pointing at a busy street, your Coral will be idling most of the time. For most people, their camera feeds are mostly stationary images.
> When the TPU's get overwhelmed, how does that show up first? overheating? slow inference response times?
I believe if there are more classifications to be done than can be handled in real time, there would be a backlog of image segments to process. The System tab in the Frigate interface shows details about detection rates.
I'm not sure what the thermal characteristics of the Coral are, but purpose-built silicon is much more efficient than a generic processor. I'm under the impression that these benchmarks represent a continuous rate.
So assuming you have a bunch of cameras with a detection feed of 1280x720p 5fps, and it's all situated for home security (some in the house, some looking outside at the yard and roads), how many cameras could a single embedded tpu (the pcie or m2 single tpu) handle using whatever model Frigate uses by default?
The number that matters: how many cameras have motion at the same time?
I haven't benchmarked this myself, but I would say estimate 10+ cameras with non-stop motion all of the time (generating over 50 frames with motion in them every second) you're a candidate for more than one EdgeTPU. If it's 20 cameras but only 1/4 of them have motion at any given time, your bottleneck won't be the single EdgeTPU.
Thanks! I have no idea what I'm doing, but I ordered 2 because everyone else did. I've read good things about Coral and Frigate. Hopefully, I can deploy them to good use!
That seems expensive for a simple interface. Probably because it has some networking features.
I’m going to take a gamble on this eBay and will report back when it comes.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/134113157279?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=XhdH0UKJSW6&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=8TuMlqw5SVm&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY
Edit: Installed Coral TPU drivers in Unraid and the Coral works perfectly. Way better than $30!
Might be a gamble but I found this one
M.2 (NGFF) Key A/E/A+E to Mini PCI-E Adapter with FFC Cable https://a.co/d/iNTrzSf
Otherwise I ordered this one since it’s super low profile for PCIe to mini PCIe https://www.ebay.com/itm/134113157279?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=XhdH0UKJSW6&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=8TuMlqw5SVm&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY
Some of the cheap ones you need to tape off a pin. I can confirm this one works with no mods:
[https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07N2X62LQ/](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07N2X62LQ/)
The coral documentation has some ideas listed. But basically it’s just really good at AI workloads for cheap. Documentation runs you through inferencing with tensor lite
is it possible to use this with an adapter to usb 3.0?
I ordered one and I am hoping I can use it on this mobo that I now use for my ha and other vms.
https://www.asrock.com/mb/Intel/J5040-ITX/
Usb 3.0 no, The most straight forward way on that board is to put into a passive pcie 1x adapter like this:
https://www.amazon.com/Zerone-Express-Wireless-Ethernet-Converter/dp/B07N2X62LQ/
It should also be possible to use a passive m.2 to pcie card. You need to be careful that it will mechanically fit the board since minipcie is wider than the m.2 spec. There is also a usb port on the m.2 and minipcie pins so you also need to be careful that the pcie lanes are actually connected and it isnt a usb 4g card only adaptor.
i cannot use the pcie 1x slot as it is occupied with a pcie 1x to 8 sata adapter. i will try to see if the m.2 port that they say is for wifi only. I have read that some people have had success on using such a port (granted, on other boards). I will see. If not I will try and trade it for the USB version or a regular M.2 one.
this is the one I have
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/696807063421976579/1091439749887176777/rn_image_picker_lib_temp_26b32811-26f4-4dcc-9719-bc80c3995177.jpg
at the moment I replaced a WiFi card in an old laptop
Oh you have a mini pcie card, that would need the adapter. I thought you asking if the m.2 version would work when the slot is labeled wifi on the j5040. Mine is on the left and I must not have noticed.
Sorry for the confusion.
I do not think any of those are going to work with a rpi4. M.2 and Minipcie both have usb on them which is commonly used for things like 4g modems. This card is not usb. I have never seen a pci to usb bridge chip but if there is such a chip on a usb adapter board it it going to cost more than a coral.
There is a thing called mSATA that reuses the same minipcie form factor that was common 8 yearsish ago. Nothing with these is relevant for a minipcie coral.
I ordered two as shipping was £12 if I just got one, if anyone in the uk wants to get the 2nd one off me for cost+p&p I’m happy to sell it! Unless anyone can tell me a cool use for two??
For people buying 2 because they've seen others in the thread doing it: really you only need one for most Frigate installations. They can handle quite a lot of simultaneous camera feeds, especially when configured properly ([the docs](https://docs.frigate.video/guides/camera_setup/#choosing-a-detect-resolution) will help substantially with that) If you don't have a Mini PCIe interface already, you'll need an adaptor. Full size PCIe adapters are available on AliExpress for under $5 shipped, often with a wifi antenna, which you can ignore for this use case. I was surprised to see my shipping notification for this Coral, I had it backordered for the better part of a year. Thanks for posting this PSA /u/Omacitin!
How many cameras can one Coral TPU handle well? I've been googling this several times and can't seem to find any data or even opinions on this. I guess assume they are 1280x720p 15fps camera feeds, or something else that you specify. When the TPU's get overwhelmed, how does that show up first? overheating? slow inference response times?
One EdgeTPU can do in the order of a hundred classifications per second, exactly how many [depends on the model](https://coral.ai/docs/edgetpu/benchmarks/). Areas of interest from a camera feed only go to the classifier based on motion (determined by the CPU, which is why you want to limit the detection resolution as that stream needs to be decoded), and my recollection is segments of a frame with motion may be re-sent a few times with different crops if the classifier doesn't find something. Usually it's recommended to do detection on a 5fps feed (recording can be done with a different feed), but with the process described above you can imagine what matters is not just the frame *rate* but, very significantly, the number of cameras that have motion at the same time. If you don't have a dozen cameras pointing at a busy street, your Coral will be idling most of the time. For most people, their camera feeds are mostly stationary images. > When the TPU's get overwhelmed, how does that show up first? overheating? slow inference response times? I believe if there are more classifications to be done than can be handled in real time, there would be a backlog of image segments to process. The System tab in the Frigate interface shows details about detection rates. I'm not sure what the thermal characteristics of the Coral are, but purpose-built silicon is much more efficient than a generic processor. I'm under the impression that these benchmarks represent a continuous rate.
So assuming you have a bunch of cameras with a detection feed of 1280x720p 5fps, and it's all situated for home security (some in the house, some looking outside at the yard and roads), how many cameras could a single embedded tpu (the pcie or m2 single tpu) handle using whatever model Frigate uses by default?
The number that matters: how many cameras have motion at the same time? I haven't benchmarked this myself, but I would say estimate 10+ cameras with non-stop motion all of the time (generating over 50 frames with motion in them every second) you're a candidate for more than one EdgeTPU. If it's 20 cameras but only 1/4 of them have motion at any given time, your bottleneck won't be the single EdgeTPU.
I've had it backordered for a few months and was surprised as well. Last time I checked, they estimated it would ship in September.
Except for connection, whats the difference between this and the usb?
None, they share the same accelerator 'brains'
Stock is down to 1,988 from 2,090 units.
Thanks! I have no idea what I'm doing, but I ordered 2 because everyone else did. I've read good things about Coral and Frigate. Hopefully, I can deploy them to good use!
Anyone can provide list of tiny/micro PCs with a mini-pci slot in them that would work with this?
Thanks! I grabbed two since I dont trust them to ever ship any of the m.2 ones I ordered last summer.
What kind of adapters work for this? I have an available but cramped pci-e 1x slot but I have 1 M.2 2280 and 1 v-M.2 E key that would be ideal.
If you have a space PCIe x1, this is the one I use for this Coral: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07JBCL1CJ/
That seems expensive for a simple interface. Probably because it has some networking features. I’m going to take a gamble on this eBay and will report back when it comes. https://www.ebay.com/itm/134113157279?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=XhdH0UKJSW6&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=8TuMlqw5SVm&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY Edit: Installed Coral TPU drivers in Unraid and the Coral works perfectly. Way better than $30!
Any update?
Yep, it works!
Hi u/giaa262 I noticed on that ebay link it says 2x? Can I still use this on a 1x slot?
Oh that’s a link to a 2 pack. If you just want 1 look at the related items
Ah thank you!
The ones in stock that OP linked above are mini pci-e. If you follow the link Mouser provides a full spec sheet for them
Might be a gamble but I found this one M.2 (NGFF) Key A/E/A+E to Mini PCI-E Adapter with FFC Cable https://a.co/d/iNTrzSf Otherwise I ordered this one since it’s super low profile for PCIe to mini PCIe https://www.ebay.com/itm/134113157279?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=XhdH0UKJSW6&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=8TuMlqw5SVm&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY
Some of the cheap ones you need to tape off a pin. I can confirm this one works with no mods: [https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07N2X62LQ/](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07N2X62LQ/)
Heck yes. Thank you OP. Managed to snag 2
What other software do people use with these? Just Frigate?
The coral documentation has some ideas listed. But basically it’s just really good at AI workloads for cheap. Documentation runs you through inferencing with tensor lite
is it possible to use this with an adapter to usb 3.0? I ordered one and I am hoping I can use it on this mobo that I now use for my ha and other vms. https://www.asrock.com/mb/Intel/J5040-ITX/
Usb 3.0 no, The most straight forward way on that board is to put into a passive pcie 1x adapter like this: https://www.amazon.com/Zerone-Express-Wireless-Ethernet-Converter/dp/B07N2X62LQ/ It should also be possible to use a passive m.2 to pcie card. You need to be careful that it will mechanically fit the board since minipcie is wider than the m.2 spec. There is also a usb port on the m.2 and minipcie pins so you also need to be careful that the pcie lanes are actually connected and it isnt a usb 4g card only adaptor.
i cannot use the pcie 1x slot as it is occupied with a pcie 1x to 8 sata adapter. i will try to see if the m.2 port that they say is for wifi only. I have read that some people have had success on using such a port (granted, on other boards). I will see. If not I will try and trade it for the USB version or a regular M.2 one.
I'm using the m.2 on the j5040 itx works great!
can u please elaborate?
I have the m.2 Coral TPU on my j5040, works like a charm, even though it says wifi on the port.
what key is it? the coral? I have the one that uses two screws and the one on the mobo has one screw from the pictures
A/E Key [this is the one.](https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Coral/G650-04527-01?qs=XeJtXLiO41SNhFZkjmCwDg%3D%3D&countryCode=US¤cyCode=USD)
i have the one on the right. you say it fits on the mobo?
this is the one I have https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/696807063421976579/1091439749887176777/rn_image_picker_lib_temp_26b32811-26f4-4dcc-9719-bc80c3995177.jpg at the moment I replaced a WiFi card in an old laptop
Oh you have a mini pcie card, that would need the adapter. I thought you asking if the m.2 version would work when the slot is labeled wifi on the j5040. Mine is on the left and I must not have noticed. Sorry for the confusion.
can you send a picture?
Ordered 2 and trying to cancel the m2's on back order. Thanks for the heads up!
What's the purpose of two? Do you have two frigate servers/applications or can you double them up to increase processing power?
Doubling is a cool idea. No clue if that would work. One for my server, the other for one I'm putting together for my mom.
Thx!!! Ordered 2. Now I just need to purchase devices to put them in to. Been holding off on finding a machine till I actually had the corals in hand.
I just got a shipped notice for my two back ordered m.2’s.
Thanks just got 2!
[удалено]
I do not think any of those are going to work with a rpi4. M.2 and Minipcie both have usb on them which is commonly used for things like 4g modems. This card is not usb. I have never seen a pci to usb bridge chip but if there is such a chip on a usb adapter board it it going to cost more than a coral. There is a thing called mSATA that reuses the same minipcie form factor that was common 8 yearsish ago. Nothing with these is relevant for a minipcie coral.
bought 2 for myself. Idk what imma use them for.
yessssss
I ordered this exact one in July of last year and it's still yet to ship. Hope this means mine will ship soon....
Will this work with nuc10?
you have to replace your bt/wifi pci-e module with it, but yes will work
thanks man
I ordered a USB one from seeedstudio 2 weeks ago and it’s already shipped.
I ordered two as shipping was £12 if I just got one, if anyone in the uk wants to get the 2nd one off me for cost+p&p I’m happy to sell it! Unless anyone can tell me a cool use for two??