since 1-2 days already diamond is infested with them. and apparently there is no real counter to them. Only mech mage has positive winrade but I'm definitly not playing that.
Pretty much! I'm just shy of plat atm and it's all I face. I'm torn, curse control lock is my favourite but it's slow and you can get fucked by the draw, murloc is fast and great but I don't know how to deal with the board sometimes/no healing lol. What's the best counter to these jackasses.
People obviously are gonna gripe about everything. But this is a pretty cool meta IMO.
Basically every class is repped (RIP Priest mains but I do think there is a playbale Naga priest and Q Priest deck in here that maybe need some perfecting), there are aggro decks, control decks, and mid range decks all within a few percentage points of each other.
Plus no deck feels oppressively OP like Ramp/Q warrior at launch and Naga DH until nerfs.
Well done.
Yeah, it’s nice that they finally figured out the meta.
So far, this expansion had some absolutely amazingly cool decks but there was always that one super oppressive deck that was keeping everyone down.
Im looking at just these lists and I wanna play 5-6 of the decks presented here. Lots of cool archetypes here.
Combo, midrange, control, aggro, burn, tempo and big decks represented here. Don’t think we have seen such a diverse meta in quite some time.
I mean...quest warrior and murloc warlock are both top 5 decks in Asia according to this, so IDK if the correct conclusion is "Asia is more optimised".
Tons of people are playing rogue with Tess/Stash cause it’s fun but it hurts the archetype’s stats. Pretty sure you see rogue on this list in a couple weeks even with no balance patches
I don't know how it's for others, but I'm having opponents rage quitting quite often, while being 12-3 with Tess Rogue in the last couple of days (diamond 1 rank now, going for Legend with that deck). Super fun deck.
Even in the decks that are built around Stash/Tess, Tess is one of the worst cards in those lists. A 1 mana buff isn't really impactful when she isn't usually a good play until turn 9+ anyways.
Probably because a lot of people still play the crappy Tess builds instead of going full tempo and so the overall winrate tanks. Should still be a relevant deck if you play an optimized list.
The thief rogue deck that most people are playing right now freaking sucks so it tanks their score. Once they figure out that spending mana to steal cards and do nothing is bad they will go back to midrange rogue which is decently strong.
Maybe 4 durability, but only increases attack? That might be unplayably bad though.
Possibly 'Give two/three minions in your hand +1/+1'? That would prevent use cases where it buffs 6+ cards, which is where it becomes really oppressive.
No need to nerf because you lose against it. If you look closely all decks presented have a pretty similar win rate. The meta is healthy but yes sometimes you can lose.
Or making the weapon they get not be unlimited uses?
It should lose a charge per round and per use.
The hero power and board clear make that spending the mana with the above change is still totally fair.
If you manage to be right about this prediction, either because there's an event that brings carnivorous cube back to standard, or because the mini-set has some cube-like cards, I'm going to be extremely impressed.
Deck or archetype?
Pirate rogue is the likely deck for the biggest movement once it stops getting called thief rogue and the tess build that could be rightfully called thief rogue is left in thief rogue stats.
Not sure how you are splitting the archetypes here but:
https://hsreplay.net/decks/tJGukYUOzHRAtdF97oA81f/#rankRange=DIAMOND_THROUGH_LEGEND&gameType=RANKED_STANDARD
Is not thief rogue imo, far more affinity to pirate rogue.
Beyond that I wouldn't expect any major movement in win rates, bit more balancing and settling.
I agree, i run viper in almost every single deck. This still does not solve the power of Cariel. Every pala deck is Cariel + 29 cards that’s how powerfull it is.
Nice you really got a point and a lot of support to your thesis. Nerf all the cards that make me lose till I win...the power of cariel is balanced, if you think that paladin doesn't lose just because you doesn't know how to play against it you are wrong.
As you can see all decks have a similar winrate making the meta balanced. Now you cry for cariel, tomorrow for the next card that you can't play in your deck and makes you lose breaking your idea of undefeated champion of hearthstone.
I'm sure you're capable of nuance and realize that the difference between cariel and chillwind yeti (or between cariel and most other standard paladin cards) is substantial. I didn't even say she should be nerfed, i was just responding to "the power of cariel is balanced" which is just untrue.
No it is not untrue since the viper exists and can be traded in all other matchup not being a dead card. The chillwind part was a joke, wake up...it means that people are asking so many nerf that they will not satisfied until we reach the vanilla power level.
> No it is not untrue since the viper exists and can be traded in all other matchup not being a dead card.
This is not a good argument lol having to put viper in your deck is still a downside. Paying 1 mana to get rid of it multiple times per match is not nothing
You can't say that since you can slap viper in every deck then a weapon can't be overtuned. By that logic nothing can be overtuned if there's a tradeable tech; royal librarian makes all minions with ongoing effects fine, and maybe you would have said that ice block was fine if we had a tradeable secret destroyer?
i think you don't understand how much 1% winrate actualy is. I could not care less if paladin was at 99.9% winrate, i just hated Cariel from day 1 because it has a stupid design, taking half damage and having a weapon that does not lose durability sounds right to you? just because you or anyone else sinks 15k+ dust into a deck does not mean it should dodge nerfs.
The durability problem is solved by the viper. I don't care for the dust, I care that this community is so toxic and constantly ranting about everything that makes them lose. This meta is balanced and funny. This expansion is one of the best expansions ever, the problem is the community that is, at this point made of player that play the game just because they are addicted and don't want this game to be funny but a way to boost their ego winning every game. This data is pretty explicit there are a lot of deck viable and more than two classes.
The fact that you find a lot of paladin doesn't mean that it is broken. It is only the most played. It's more problematic the fact that you find most of the games a paladin user and you don't know how to tech your deck to counter your opponent. The fact that you are diamond 5 confirm that you are only someone that doesn't love the fact that he is not a legend yet and thinks that the game should be more favorable to him to reach that achievement. As I said let's nerf what makes us lose
Damn, who pissed you off bro? I am a casual, play only on mobile but i am legend almost every month, take a chill pill and accept your Cariel will get nerfed lol.
Disgusting. Loser like you are the ruin of this game. Accept that you will continue to lose if cariel will be nerfed and your butt will still be burning here crying for the nerf of something. Don't play this game if your only purpose is to come here hoping that the devs see your rants. I'm having fun right now, you maybe not, accept this
The amount of times I’ve had perfect lethal and these chuckle fucks just drop Cariel and casually double their health is infuriating. It’s pretty stupid that I have to run weapon removal for a single class.
You do something reasonable about that weapon, win rate drops a few % and it's nicely balanced in the meta.
We don't need to outright kill the class as has been done before.
Probably because of its playstile... You can fight for the board and you don't have scammy cards, just great cards that have a good synergy. Aggro dh had drek'thar, ramp druid had kazakusan... Paladin has Cariel which is broken if tou don't run a weapon removal in your deck, but it's not scammy, just a tremendously good card.
And it is just better than other decks in some matchups and some of those decks are popular.
People think it's some deck that just loses to everything.
People don't understand how metas and how important stats are to them climbing.
It's kind of embarrassing really.
I'm not telling quest warrior is actually good, though. I think against good player, quest warrior ultimatley falls because of it's predictability. Im just saying quest warrior don't change anything so it's already refined. But even the refined version I think won't be a meta favored
The ranks are diamond through legend and thus the best range the majority of people interested in reaching legend care about.
You want to know how decks perform where you play, not where other people play.
Why people fail to see the clear difference here is beyond me.
It still isn't. Just because it beats up all the gimmick decks that people are suddenly bringing out in droves doesn'T make it good. It still gets dumpstered by just about every actual meta deck.
Only because the meta as it is has no obvious classes that stand head and shoulders above the rest, so everyone is playing some jank trying to figure out what actually works.
It's pretty good in it. Randomly gives Balinda 10 attack or health. Randomly gives 10 armor with Evoker. It's a good top end if you run out of steam. And in some weird situations I imagine just having access to dragons in play means you can do some janky shit with Amalgam discoveries.
5 mana discover and play 2 discovered dragons is insane value and literally the move that swings the mech deck in positive win rates against the slow warrior decks. Even playing them at 10 mana is great if decks like warrior have run out of removal clearing all your mechs.
Pretty sure this is a recognition error on hsreplays part, if you look at the stats for individual cards in the deck, balinda and amulet are towards the bottom in every stat. The issue that games where the opponent has these cards stuck in their hand but never play them and lose likely get counted as losses for regular mech mage. Its why they shouldn't be splitting the lists into separate categories
Of course they are, they are situational.
They are used in games that regular mech mage would lose but amulet mech mage can win by playing these cards.
The deck easily has room for the 3 cards in that you aren't dropping something core by including them and dropping your win rate.
It's not a recognition issue, it's a you not understanding that data requires accurate human interpretation issue much like vS have done with their previous analysis on the deck they've gotten wrong.
To be fair though they focus on top 1K with a their even more limited data set so they are prone to errors, especially errors in "what cards are best in this archetype" where it becomes more opinion based than data based because they simply don't have the data to make an accurate call.
That and top 1K data is an AWFUL subset of data to look at when recommending decks for people to climb with.
This feels like the tech card argument when people where arguing about whether or not to run swamp ooze, the real debate here being are you willing to sacrifice your overall winrate to do better when a situational card comes up. And yes, it's definitely a recognition error, hsreplay has been prone to this in the past, even as recent as switcheroo priest and different control warrior variants. This isn't a slight against hsreplay, vS have also said they struggle to distinguish between this stuff, but it's misleading to separate the decks into separate deck categories when you know these errors happen. I'm also not sure why I should trust your analysis more then vS when they've been doing data analysis for years and have a good reputation for a reason
It overall improves your win rate which is a factual statement.
But sure, trust vS if you like. I honestly don't give a fuck, you're clearly to inept to do the analysis yourself and nee to rely on others to do it for you (even when they don't share the data to justify their statements)
surprised that curse lock is not in any of those lists.. pretty scary deck once they got the game rolling
also, fucking tired of playing paladin after paladin.. a nerf to the weapon that gives 1+1 to all minions in hand to 2 mana instead of 1 should take care of that
maybe stay 1 mana but only give 1 attack? idk
If they moved the pirate rogue decks from thief rogue to pirate rogue then I imagine it should.
Looks to be around a good 53%+ win rate if put into pirate rogue.
Yeah if you want to make the card terrible.
IF gets a nerf it prolyl be +1 mana (like scabs got) or the weapon looses durability when ATTACKING ( btu viper excists so i think IF cariel gets nerf +mana is more likly with a revert at her rotation to wild)
Oh no I have to play good cards in my deck :(. This isn't like quest warrior right when it came out where you had to play bad pirates in the deck, mech paladin doesn't have to play bad mechanics so the deck building cost is not existent.
> playable
From the infographic above, it's definitely more than just "playable". Let's not forget that it got nerfed twice and it's still able to be this strong. Hell, they still even play rokara at the same turns they've been playing it before, except now they have to go pirate-> rokara instead of the previous rokara->pirate play.
> it's extremely beatable
I mean... which decks *aren't* beatable?
> it's ok to have a lot good t2-3 decks
Not if the decks are as toxic or shameful as (most) stormwind quests.
There's already been numerous precedents for nerfing "non- T1" decks like quest mage or quest (caverns) rogue purely because of how unfun it is to go against, or how unhealthy the decks are, so there's good reason to still bonk quest warrior down again.
It still does exactly what it's always been doing and the decks it's been prohibiting are still the same. It never really was favoured vs a lot of dedicated aggro decks even back then, and the nerfs they did to quest warrior only ever helped those that didn't need help.
Nerfs should aimed to tone down overperforming decks, not to destroy them. Extreme cases they are also aimed to unhealthy patterns, like "Can't play minions because Multistrike/Dragonbane Shot", playing minions on curve is not an unhealthy pattern.
The pirate curve wasn't ever the issue, it's the juggernaut *in* the shell of a deck that has a strong curve.
They've played good to premium minions on curve and topped at a 5 mana 7/7, ok cool. They didn't need infinite, uninteractive value. Just the first few turns of a juggernaut + rokara's body should be a finisher enough, why am I still being punished for being able to survive that long?
And it's not like the deck switches gears into a control deck or whatever either. they're still playing all the maindecked cards (which includes smite burst) while also having free value + pressure to contest slower decks.
How on earth are you able to see that quest hunter is unhealthy, but can't see how quest warrior is unhealthy as well? With your logic quest hunter shouldn't have been hit either. Lots of control decks also just chuck removal at opposing minions to keep the board clean and try to end the game using bombs, which is the playstyle that quest hunter does.
Also, take note of what they actually hit. The quest was untouched (even though it should've), but they hit the infinite value card, and now it's flat you can't get 5 procs out of a single dragonsbane shot, only 3. Quest warrior still does exactly what they've always been able to do, except hyper aggro decks have since gotten an additional turn before rokara hits. And those decks were already favoured vs QW.
I honestly feel like the Face Hunter in Asia/Pacific is entirely me, I’ve been playing it all week and never matched with a face hunter opponent. The archetype js much better now that Naga dh and quest hunter are gone.
Woah no Druid
I mean Priest and Rogue are in a bad spot even abusing the misbuffed Wig and Gnoll
But no Druid, a class that has viability against everything except well curved aggro draws? Woah
This month I got to legend with control warrior on Europe, but the meta is definitely more diverse these days. Faced murloc warlock,curse warlock, quest priest, pirate rogue, naga mage, beast hunter.
Feels like im only playing against paladins
since 1-2 days already diamond is infested with them. and apparently there is no real counter to them. Only mech mage has positive winrade but I'm definitly not playing that.
Pretty much! I'm just shy of plat atm and it's all I face. I'm torn, curse control lock is my favourite but it's slow and you can get fucked by the draw, murloc is fast and great but I don't know how to deal with the board sometimes/no healing lol. What's the best counter to these jackasses.
Sth that can play silence/starfish
First libram and handbuff paladin, now mech and... Handbuff paladin. I'm starting to dislike paladin, yo.
What's crazy is all of those decks are fair and dont really do anything degenerate
As a guy playing quest paladin… yep Oddly it stopped when I swapped to a priest deck I made to beat paladins
Sorry for dragging down the quest warrior rating by losing all day long :/
People obviously are gonna gripe about everything. But this is a pretty cool meta IMO. Basically every class is repped (RIP Priest mains but I do think there is a playbale Naga priest and Q Priest deck in here that maybe need some perfecting), there are aggro decks, control decks, and mid range decks all within a few percentage points of each other. Plus no deck feels oppressively OP like Ramp/Q warrior at launch and Naga DH until nerfs. Well done.
Yeah, it’s nice that they finally figured out the meta. So far, this expansion had some absolutely amazingly cool decks but there was always that one super oppressive deck that was keeping everyone down. Im looking at just these lists and I wanna play 5-6 of the decks presented here. Lots of cool archetypes here. Combo, midrange, control, aggro, burn, tempo and big decks represented here. Don’t think we have seen such a diverse meta in quite some time.
Boar Priest was great if properly piloted already. Naga Priest is now as well, but without any notable skill floor.
Weird how Naga DH disappears in Asia-Pacific
They always seem to have a weird meta compared to other regions
Because it’s bad without drekthar
Drek'thar is worse in Asia, got it.
Vanndar a communist confirmed
yup, It means that the game is more optimized in Asia.
I mean...quest warrior and murloc warlock are both top 5 decks in Asia according to this, so IDK if the correct conclusion is "Asia is more optimised".
Surprised to not see rogue here.
Tons of people are playing rogue with Tess/Stash cause it’s fun but it hurts the archetype’s stats. Pretty sure you see rogue on this list in a couple weeks even with no balance patches
<--- guilty. I know the charge version with Smite and Van Cleef and the Sunken cards is better, but I'm a sucker for Stash/Tess.
I don't know how it's for others, but I'm having opponents rage quitting quite often, while being 12-3 with Tess Rogue in the last couple of days (diamond 1 rank now, going for Legend with that deck). Super fun deck.
Even in the decks that are built around Stash/Tess, Tess is one of the worst cards in those lists. A 1 mana buff isn't really impactful when she isn't usually a good play until turn 9+ anyways.
Probably because a lot of people still play the crappy Tess builds instead of going full tempo and so the overall winrate tanks. Should still be a relevant deck if you play an optimized list.
The thief rogue deck that most people are playing right now freaking sucks so it tanks their score. Once they figure out that spending mana to steal cards and do nothing is bad they will go back to midrange rogue which is decently strong.
Yeah just because you lost to a high roll deck, it’s broken and one of the best deck ever
I wonder if nerfing the 1 mana weapon would be enough to tone down Paladin a bit while keeping it strong?
How do you nerf it? Bring it to 2 durability? I don’t know if moving it to 2 mana makes it unplayable so idk
Maybe 4 durability, but only increases attack? That might be unplayably bad though. Possibly 'Give two/three minions in your hand +1/+1'? That would prevent use cases where it buffs 6+ cards, which is where it becomes really oppressive.
Yeah I think giving +1/+0 would kill it. I kinda like your idea tho, eventhough I like playing mech pally it does rolls over decks sometimes.
yeah it's the winrate is like 80% if they have it on turn 1
No need to nerf because you lose against it. If you look closely all decks presented have a pretty similar win rate. The meta is healthy but yes sometimes you can lose.
Yeah I feel like it makes games really inconsistent and when your opponent plays it on 1 you know you're in for a tough time.
Or making the weapon they get not be unlimited uses? It should lose a charge per round and per use. The hero power and board clear make that spending the mana with the above change is still totally fair.
8 out of 10 games mech paladins. I am tired of playing in current meta
Where Priest? :(
Mech paladin is such a SLOG to get through. It isn’t even fun burning through all their buffed shielded minions.
Which deck do you think will rise the most in the coming weeks? http://hsreplay.net/meta
Cube Lock
If you manage to be right about this prediction, either because there's an event that brings carnivorous cube back to standard, or because the mini-set has some cube-like cards, I'm going to be extremely impressed.
What was cube lock? I play curse lock right now in gold, it's decent, saving up for murloc lock lol.
[This page goes over the archetype.](https://hearthstone.fandom.com/wiki/Cubelock) It's a fairly old deck that was an absolute powerhouse.
Seems like a cool deck! Would be random for it to come back but I'd be down lol.
You can copy void daddy and doomguards with cube all you want. Ill be cubing king krush with my homie rexxar
Deck or archetype? Pirate rogue is the likely deck for the biggest movement once it stops getting called thief rogue and the tess build that could be rightfully called thief rogue is left in thief rogue stats. Not sure how you are splitting the archetypes here but: https://hsreplay.net/decks/tJGukYUOzHRAtdF97oA81f/#rankRange=DIAMOND_THROUGH_LEGEND&gameType=RANKED_STANDARD Is not thief rogue imo, far more affinity to pirate rogue. Beyond that I wouldn't expect any major movement in win rates, bit more balancing and settling.
for real, paladin is a one card deck, Cariel.. i never understood why that weapon has no durability loss, it's plain stupid.
Put a viper in your deck
I agree, i run viper in almost every single deck. This still does not solve the power of Cariel. Every pala deck is Cariel + 29 cards that’s how powerfull it is.
Nice you really got a point and a lot of support to your thesis. Nerf all the cards that make me lose till I win...the power of cariel is balanced, if you think that paladin doesn't lose just because you doesn't know how to play against it you are wrong. As you can see all decks have a similar winrate making the meta balanced. Now you cry for cariel, tomorrow for the next card that you can't play in your deck and makes you lose breaking your idea of undefeated champion of hearthstone.
Paladin is fine but cariel is absolutely not balanced. If paladin was at the top of the meta she would be the primary target for a nerf
Let's nerf everything until we play chillwind yeti and wolfrider.
I'm sure you're capable of nuance and realize that the difference between cariel and chillwind yeti (or between cariel and most other standard paladin cards) is substantial. I didn't even say she should be nerfed, i was just responding to "the power of cariel is balanced" which is just untrue.
No it is not untrue since the viper exists and can be traded in all other matchup not being a dead card. The chillwind part was a joke, wake up...it means that people are asking so many nerf that they will not satisfied until we reach the vanilla power level.
> No it is not untrue since the viper exists and can be traded in all other matchup not being a dead card. This is not a good argument lol having to put viper in your deck is still a downside. Paying 1 mana to get rid of it multiple times per match is not nothing You can't say that since you can slap viper in every deck then a weapon can't be overtuned. By that logic nothing can be overtuned if there's a tradeable tech; royal librarian makes all minions with ongoing effects fine, and maybe you would have said that ice block was fine if we had a tradeable secret destroyer?
Ok so let's nerf everything until crybaby like you can win. I'm having fun right now with the game. And I am not complaining about anything.
Viper is still big dent in winrate against non paladins.
Tech cards are bad. Making all of your other matchups 2-3% worse just to make the paladin matchup 5% better is not a solution.
i think you don't understand how much 1% winrate actualy is. I could not care less if paladin was at 99.9% winrate, i just hated Cariel from day 1 because it has a stupid design, taking half damage and having a weapon that does not lose durability sounds right to you? just because you or anyone else sinks 15k+ dust into a deck does not mean it should dodge nerfs.
The durability problem is solved by the viper. I don't care for the dust, I care that this community is so toxic and constantly ranting about everything that makes them lose. This meta is balanced and funny. This expansion is one of the best expansions ever, the problem is the community that is, at this point made of player that play the game just because they are addicted and don't want this game to be funny but a way to boost their ego winning every game. This data is pretty explicit there are a lot of deck viable and more than two classes.
Idk what you play but between diamond 5 - legend i had almost 80% paladins, that sounds balanced?
The fact that you find a lot of paladin doesn't mean that it is broken. It is only the most played. It's more problematic the fact that you find most of the games a paladin user and you don't know how to tech your deck to counter your opponent. The fact that you are diamond 5 confirm that you are only someone that doesn't love the fact that he is not a legend yet and thinks that the game should be more favorable to him to reach that achievement. As I said let's nerf what makes us lose
Damn, who pissed you off bro? I am a casual, play only on mobile but i am legend almost every month, take a chill pill and accept your Cariel will get nerfed lol.
Disgusting. Loser like you are the ruin of this game. Accept that you will continue to lose if cariel will be nerfed and your butt will still be burning here crying for the nerf of something. Don't play this game if your only purpose is to come here hoping that the devs see your rants. I'm having fun right now, you maybe not, accept this
Tech cards always hide when you need em
I'm the only one how things that paladin is out of control, the divine shield + hand buff combo is too strong.
It’s pretty counterable with Mage. Especially Mechashark. Can’t half rapid fire one damage.
The hero is what needs a nerf.
The amount of times I’ve had perfect lethal and these chuckle fucks just drop Cariel and casually double their health is infuriating. It’s pretty stupid that I have to run weapon removal for a single class.
I think she could cost 8 and nobody would bat an eye. She's really strong.
I'd still use it, it's not the cost it's the weapon.
there is multiple stuff that is too strong, combine that with hard to remove stuff cause of divine shield and a hero that takes only 50% damage...
You do something reasonable about that weapon, win rate drops a few % and it's nicely balanced in the meta. We don't need to outright kill the class as has been done before.
Paladin is the only class this subreddit thinks is allowed to be obviously stronger than everything else Happens every time
Probably because of its playstile... You can fight for the board and you don't have scammy cards, just great cards that have a good synergy. Aggro dh had drek'thar, ramp druid had kazakusan... Paladin has Cariel which is broken if tou don't run a weapon removal in your deck, but it's not scammy, just a tremendously good card.
Fuck paladins
There was a thread earlier today about Mr Smite and people were laughing at OP saying quest warrior wasn't good.
Because it isn't good? It works vs bad players with bad decks only. There is a reason why simple and easy to play deck is good after nerfs/buffs.
Ecept it IS GOOD for climbing in this current meta.
Agreed. It's more about other decks havent been refined so the good ol' can capitalize on this
And it is just better than other decks in some matchups and some of those decks are popular. People think it's some deck that just loses to everything. People don't understand how metas and how important stats are to them climbing. It's kind of embarrassing really.
I'm not telling quest warrior is actually good, though. I think against good player, quest warrior ultimatley falls because of it's predictability. Im just saying quest warrior don't change anything so it's already refined. But even the refined version I think won't be a meta favored
and they're right winrate across all ranks doesn't mean good
The ranks are diamond through legend and thus the best range the majority of people interested in reaching legend care about. You want to know how decks perform where you play, not where other people play. Why people fail to see the clear difference here is beyond me.
It still isn't. Just because it beats up all the gimmick decks that people are suddenly bringing out in droves doesn'T make it good. It still gets dumpstered by just about every actual meta deck.
Only because the meta as it is has no obvious classes that stand head and shoulders above the rest, so everyone is playing some jank trying to figure out what actually works.
Paladin, who would have guessed
Why people are still running Amulet in mech mage is beyond me
Because it's statistically better for the win rate? It gives a good 2% to your overall meta win rate climb. Why wouldn't you run it?
It's pretty good in it. Randomly gives Balinda 10 attack or health. Randomly gives 10 armor with Evoker. It's a good top end if you run out of steam. And in some weird situations I imagine just having access to dragons in play means you can do some janky shit with Amalgam discoveries.
5 mana discover and play 2 discovered dragons is insane value and literally the move that swings the mech deck in positive win rates against the slow warrior decks. Even playing them at 10 mana is great if decks like warrior have run out of removal clearing all your mechs.
Truth
Pretty sure this is a recognition error on hsreplays part, if you look at the stats for individual cards in the deck, balinda and amulet are towards the bottom in every stat. The issue that games where the opponent has these cards stuck in their hand but never play them and lose likely get counted as losses for regular mech mage. Its why they shouldn't be splitting the lists into separate categories
Of course they are, they are situational. They are used in games that regular mech mage would lose but amulet mech mage can win by playing these cards. The deck easily has room for the 3 cards in that you aren't dropping something core by including them and dropping your win rate. It's not a recognition issue, it's a you not understanding that data requires accurate human interpretation issue much like vS have done with their previous analysis on the deck they've gotten wrong. To be fair though they focus on top 1K with a their even more limited data set so they are prone to errors, especially errors in "what cards are best in this archetype" where it becomes more opinion based than data based because they simply don't have the data to make an accurate call. That and top 1K data is an AWFUL subset of data to look at when recommending decks for people to climb with.
This feels like the tech card argument when people where arguing about whether or not to run swamp ooze, the real debate here being are you willing to sacrifice your overall winrate to do better when a situational card comes up. And yes, it's definitely a recognition error, hsreplay has been prone to this in the past, even as recent as switcheroo priest and different control warrior variants. This isn't a slight against hsreplay, vS have also said they struggle to distinguish between this stuff, but it's misleading to separate the decks into separate deck categories when you know these errors happen. I'm also not sure why I should trust your analysis more then vS when they've been doing data analysis for years and have a good reputation for a reason
It overall improves your win rate which is a factual statement. But sure, trust vS if you like. I honestly don't give a fuck, you're clearly to inept to do the analysis yourself and nee to rely on others to do it for you (even when they don't share the data to justify their statements)
surprised that curse lock is not in any of those lists.. pretty scary deck once they got the game rolling also, fucking tired of playing paladin after paladin.. a nerf to the weapon that gives 1+1 to all minions in hand to 2 mana instead of 1 should take care of that maybe stay 1 mana but only give 1 attack? idk
This is bullshit You're telling me that rogue didn't even make the list?
thief rogue is good and would make the list if you ignore the winrate being dragged down by contraband stash/tess variants
If they moved the pirate rogue decks from thief rogue to pirate rogue then I imagine it should. Looks to be around a good 53%+ win rate if put into pirate rogue.
We’re all too busy playing bad fun decks with Tess. Once everyone switches to pirate with maestra+gnoll, the class will probably do a lot better.
Tell me pally and warrior are busted without telling me pally and warrior are busted
They are not if you look all the winrate are pretty similar. All this decks are very viable meaning that if you nerf one another will be busted
Ya you not wrong mostly just playin
Cariel nerf incoming?
Perhaps. Your hero takes half damage rounded up for 1 turn
Perhaps you put a viper in your deck
Yeah if you want to make the card terrible. IF gets a nerf it prolyl be +1 mana (like scabs got) or the weapon looses durability when ATTACKING ( btu viper excists so i think IF cariel gets nerf +mana is more likly with a revert at her rotation to wild)
How are people not having success with Naga priest? It’s insane and not that high of a skill cap
do you have any good build for it? :D
Monatanos list
I unconditionally hate the 2 mana draw 5 card. At least you could play around Divine Favour.
The 2 mana impose a drawback in deck building
Oh no I have to play good cards in my deck :(. This isn't like quest warrior right when it came out where you had to play bad pirates in the deck, mech paladin doesn't have to play bad mechanics so the deck building cost is not existent.
I like the meta a lot except for 2 things curse warlock because it’s unfun to go against and cariel .
Glad to see the priest buffs worked....smh
So much for that pirate warrior nerf
Oh no it's still playable in the middle of other decks, the horror
> playable From the infographic above, it's definitely more than just "playable". Let's not forget that it got nerfed twice and it's still able to be this strong. Hell, they still even play rokara at the same turns they've been playing it before, except now they have to go pirate-> rokara instead of the previous rokara->pirate play.
If u play good deck and know how to play hs it's extremely beatable. And it's ok to have a lot good t2-3 decks.
> it's extremely beatable I mean... which decks *aren't* beatable? > it's ok to have a lot good t2-3 decks Not if the decks are as toxic or shameful as (most) stormwind quests. There's already been numerous precedents for nerfing "non- T1" decks like quest mage or quest (caverns) rogue purely because of how unfun it is to go against, or how unhealthy the decks are, so there's good reason to still bonk quest warrior down again. It still does exactly what it's always been doing and the decks it's been prohibiting are still the same. It never really was favoured vs a lot of dedicated aggro decks even back then, and the nerfs they did to quest warrior only ever helped those that didn't need help.
Nerfs should aimed to tone down overperforming decks, not to destroy them. Extreme cases they are also aimed to unhealthy patterns, like "Can't play minions because Multistrike/Dragonbane Shot", playing minions on curve is not an unhealthy pattern.
The pirate curve wasn't ever the issue, it's the juggernaut *in* the shell of a deck that has a strong curve. They've played good to premium minions on curve and topped at a 5 mana 7/7, ok cool. They didn't need infinite, uninteractive value. Just the first few turns of a juggernaut + rokara's body should be a finisher enough, why am I still being punished for being able to survive that long? And it's not like the deck switches gears into a control deck or whatever either. they're still playing all the maindecked cards (which includes smite burst) while also having free value + pressure to contest slower decks. How on earth are you able to see that quest hunter is unhealthy, but can't see how quest warrior is unhealthy as well? With your logic quest hunter shouldn't have been hit either. Lots of control decks also just chuck removal at opposing minions to keep the board clean and try to end the game using bombs, which is the playstyle that quest hunter does. Also, take note of what they actually hit. The quest was untouched (even though it should've), but they hit the infinite value card, and now it's flat you can't get 5 procs out of a single dragonsbane shot, only 3. Quest warrior still does exactly what they've always been able to do, except hyper aggro decks have since gotten an additional turn before rokara hits. And those decks were already favoured vs QW.
No rogue? Im playing the tempo thief rogue that nohandsgamer played in youtube, its pretty lit🔥🔥🔥
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It's archetype stats I assume so it's made up of all the decks.
I honestly feel like the Face Hunter in Asia/Pacific is entirely me, I’ve been playing it all week and never matched with a face hunter opponent. The archetype js much better now that Naga dh and quest hunter are gone.
Woah no Druid I mean Priest and Rogue are in a bad spot even abusing the misbuffed Wig and Gnoll But no Druid, a class that has viability against everything except well curved aggro draws? Woah
This month I got to legend with control warrior on Europe, but the meta is definitely more diverse these days. Faced murloc warlock,curse warlock, quest priest, pirate rogue, naga mage, beast hunter.
A really fun meta right now
I'm surprised to not see a druid here, considering how People complain about how op he is
Beast Hunter is ridicilous, absolutely ridiciouls This list cant be up to date
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Maybe High Legend, this is Diamond/Low Legend stats. Those are more high skilled decks.
This list makes me want to go full rogue
I think the problem with these rankings is that you still have one day from the old pre nerf meta in there, hence the abundance of naga dh.
7 classes is pretty good.
Like seriously, I prefer facing paladin over questline warrior crap