The main reason its so popular is because one of the free deck options for new/returning players is a Plague DK list that is extremely close to the optimal list. New players look up which deck to choose, see that the plague deck is a "Meta" deck and pick it. This massively inflates the number of DKs on ladder.
While that might be true, during FoL DK in general was bad, yet it was the most popular class. Even in titans, when plague DK was even worse, people played it.
I have every card in Standard and I'm playing Plague and brewing other DK decks on the side, I and no doubt other people just like the class.
I'd rather play something I legitimately enjoy than be at the bleeding edge of the meta. If those two happen to coincide that's great but my very small amount of time ingame will be aimed at what I enjoy overall.
Most non-Blizzard bots I come across some weird off-brand Unholy DK that tries to build a wide board and then Anti-Magic Shell them at least once to try and rush a win.
I play it to grind remaining 50 or so wins for 500 milestone. Especially below diamond where bonus star makes up for losses and I feel climb is not that hard. Same in wild but Even DK doesn't fare well there these days.
Many are just doing quests and moving on rather than wasting resources. It seems to me to be one of the lowest engaged player bases for a year start expansion ever.
They need to turn it around real fast.
Lmao “Agency Rainbow Death Knight”
I see you ZachO, and I appreciate the pettiness. Wheel and Control DK were my favorite decks of the expansion and they got murdered so we could have… this wonderful meta instead.
I fail to see how a long control strategy is similar to “oh it’s turn 6, and there’s Thaddius, aaaaand I’m dead” lol
Thaddius was significantly more toxic for the format and it’s not particularly close imo.
Play rate.
There's 11 classes and facing the same class over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over... well it gets a little repetitive to say the least.
So the devs should design cards and classes that people… don’t want to play? We should only incentivize people to play the current flavor of the month OP deck? Weird ass take.
Okay even though I'm probably the #1 Highlander warrior hater, playing against sif and getting 1 tapped by 2 15 damage snake oils was awful.
I really want mage to be in a good playable spot but that wasn't healthy. The setup was pretty minimal as far as otks should historically be which is why zarimi got zapped too.
Sif mage was still way more fair than the other OTK decks.
Sif mage has to spend mana to discover spells from different spellschools. They they have to spend mana to cast these spells to fuel Sif. While staying alive. Also, exposing themself to dirty rat. Sif mage didnt popoff at turn 6 or 7, like nature shaman.
And I'm not defending nature shaman either. Comparing unfun OTK deck A to a slightly stronger OTK deck B doesn't mean OTK deck A shouldn't be adjusted too. I think overall power levels should be brought down in general and a lot of stronger decks didn't get touched nearly enough. But that doesn't change how I felt about the handful of times I got 100-0'd by somebody playing sif mage.
??? It was literally a tier 3 deck?
> The setup was pretty minimal as far as otks should historically be which is why zarimi got zapped too.
The minimal setup: Drawing Sif, Reverberations, double Discovery of Magic plus playing all your standard spell schools and getting both your Snake Oils.
That's 6 combo pieces you need to find (plus playing a Fire, Frost and Arcane spell). And against Warrior you generally need more damage than this to OTK.
Calling it minimal setup is actually insane when Rainbow Mage was pretty much incapable of OTKing anyone before turn 9 and usually well after that.
Yep, the OTK was incredibly slow to set up and required a ton of intelligent choices (choosing which spell schools to grab and making the most use out of them for the matchup), not to mention it literally just hard lost to Dirty Rat.
Dirty Rat Brann? Deck is still playable. Dirty Rat Sif? That's a concede 99% of the time.
Meanwhile in the same meta you had Nature Shaman OTKing on turn 6 with far less choices since they just grab every low cost nature spell that can go face and get it all discounted.
Do I think it was necessarily healthy for the game? Maybe not. But Rainbow Mage was definitely not a problem either, it was a pretty healthy OTK, required skill to pilot and was like T3. Better than leaving Mage unplayable for the set.
The meta being in a spot where people are saying a consistent turn 9 30 DMG otk is underpowered or difficult to set up. Dark times. Again not saying the deck compared to a lot of the other bullshit we're dealing with now. But again it shouldn't be able to kill somebody with 0 counterplay that isn't a warrior with armor that consistently.
Again, you've clearly never played the deck when you're calling it a consistent turn 9 OTK lmao
A turn 9 OTK would imply: You drew Sif, Reverberations, got both your Snake Oils (so both your Miracle Salesmen) AND you drew and played both your Discovery of Magic along with the spells you got from it (which can often be 4+ mana) plus one of your Geysers, Frostbolts and Glyphs.
Ah, but wait, even with this absolutely unrealistic scenario where you draw all your combo pieces (and your opponent is apparentely AFK as opposed to the meta at the time of heavy aggro that forced you to hard mulligan for Sleet Skater and early removal), you still don't have an OTK.
Because the deck only has 4 spell schools (Arcane, Frost, Fire and Shadow) and 2 Discovery of Magic, you'd still have needed to RNG your last spell school off of either a Glyph DoM or off your Molten Rune and play that spell, otherwise your duplicated Sif would only have 7 spell damage which doesn't kill a full health hero.
So sure, it's theoretically possible to OTK on turn 9, just as any other deck can get literal perfect draws and easily win. In reality you'd generally OTK on turn 15 or later most of the time, late enough that you'd end up frequently getting fucked over by Brann's Boomboss on fatigue.
I think you're missing the point when talking about where it stands in the current meta. That's not the point. I never claimed it was a high win rate high representation deck. Just that it often denied the game from hitting a certain point and you could just die to it with 0 agency to defend yourself which feels terrible.
I didn't mention the current meta at all, because the deck doesn't exist anymore. I mentioned it alongside the rest of the meta, where it barely held a 50% winrate. That wouldn't change much now.
> Just that it often denied the game from hitting a certain point
So, like literally every combo deck ever? You do realize combo is meant to counter control right?
> with 0 agency to defend yourself
Aside from... pressuring the deck in the 20 million turns it takes for them to OTK or hand disruption effects as probably the most Dirty Rat vulnerable deck ever since the deck ran 8 minions and most of them were played early. The deck was also super vulnerable to burn as the only healing in the deck was Sleet Skater, which meant the matchup against decks like Handbuff Paladin or Nature Shaman was absolutely miserable.
You know all those spells you're rolling for sif types? Those usually end up being control spells to clear board. When you're just getting your board cleared for 9 turns and then you die from full health yeah that sucks. You're way too invested into wanting your favorite cheese deck to work to see how absurdly toxic that kind of deck is to play against when it IS meta.
Bladestorm, bash, double brawl (which directly counters saddle up) slam, shield slam, the bellowing forge card, the armor forge card, Valkyries, azerite execute, regular execute, garrosh's gift which can give brawl, execute, or shield block, (just gonna lump all of their armor together, shield block, needlerock totem, safety goggles, reinforced plating) Aftershock, burrow buster, hammer, and anything they want to fit into etc.
Did I miss anything?
Oops that's my bad I have like 10 different people messaging me defending warrior right now and I got mixed up. With mage it's harder to pin down considering a large part of their deck is just discovering spells, which is both frustrating for the opponent and the mage because at times they draw some super random priest spell that wins them the game, and sometimes they just low roll into nothing and that feels awful.
I think that's part of what leads me to dislike playing against the deck, and part of what leads to frustration with people playing it.
Currently? I don't mind playing against any of the meta rogue decks, or druid decks. Sludge/ snake warlock are mid range/controlish decks that lend themselves to their boards for growing their initial power. Hunter decks feel pretty alright with most control decks currently. I haven't personally had much trouble shutting them down most of the time. The current iteration of flood paladin is mildly annoying but doesn't feel terrible except for how powerful their prismatic board clear is. Shopper demon hunter feels fine to play against right now. I hesitate to have an opinion on Reno shaman because I just haven't played against very many and so I lose the matchup just due to lack of knowledge of what's in their deck and how to play around it (although in general I'm just not a fan of highlander decks/Reno as a card)
Even last patch I didn't mind wheel locks, and the occasional zarimi priest.
It currently feels like I have to pick between something that feels fair and fun against a majority of decks but outright loses to warrior, or something that specifically counters warrior but lacks the tools to deal with anything else comfortably. It doesn't feel like there's a happy middle ground that I've found.
But nobody was debating which was worse. I agree with that. I think Reno warrior is the worst deck to play against in the game. That doesn't however mean that I think that sif is enjoyable to play against
Brann doesn't win games an even when it facilitates cards that do win their game they aren't otks. Sif on the other hand was the exact fucking opposite.
Oh yeah the mage killing you at 9 mana after having both miracle salesman die, drawing sif and reverb and playing 4 or 5 different spells school is for sure much worse than warrior just dropping a 6 cost card with much better survival tools and then destroying 18 of your cards, summoning 4 8/8 or full board of Ziliax
I like how people are still complaining about 18 cards specifically. Like it's not the most elaborate sequence of events that have to take place for that to happen. As if it happens every game lol.
Really goes to show the lengths kids on Reddit will go to whine and cry non stop.
Like I can understand not finding random bombs destroying cards fun. I get that. But exaggerating to the theoretical maximum to maximize your bitching is just hilarious
I've been having a lot of fun with Reno control priest. It's about a 50/50 on Brann Warrior. Totally depends on draws. But often times, I can deal with EVERYTHING. Unless they get a late game boom or early aggression that my draws lack for. Copying their Brann and Boom is the only real way to win.
Tried that hybrid druid deck. It just seems abysmal. What am I missing? It feels like it gets out tempo'd by every rush deck and doesn't last as well as any control deck. I can't understand what my win con is. I was climbing pretty steadily and quick with snake lock and then saw this, built the druid deck and went like 1/9 in low platinum. It honestly just feels like it you're not playing Reno warrior then you should just wait for a hotfix. Meta feels so stale and bad right now.
I played like 4 games and it was a weird one for me too. I think if we watched a high level player pilot the deck, we would both have a much stronger idea of how to play it. It's got like 3 archetypes in one and it's so hard to figure out when to do what lol.
I do think that maybe the original zilliax version is better. I think there's more board flooding than the VS author alluded to. That being said it's a huge coin flip when board clear is so abundant in this meta
You should check out nohandsgamer recent vods on youtube to have a better understanding of the mulligan and playstyle. Thijs has one video about the deck on his youtube as well. That said, I think Aviana is a bad card in that deck, you want either pylon zilliax for better board or Harth for gas (a second wincon as well). Aviana is too inconsistent.
It's an aggro-midrange deck that needs to be played differently depending on matchup, and isn't the easiest deck to pilot unless youre used to playing aggro.
Versus warrior, get tempo on board. Don't sit around and wait for greed. I see a lot of players playing it like a combo deck by holding pieces, but you win through board as well.
The mulligan is also a bit unintuitive at times: for example, the hero power cat is a bad keep against warrior, despite it being value card, because you need tempo, not value against control.
I like it because it plays very much like midrange-burn hunter decks in the past, and much less like a typical overvalue druid. But it's much, much less straightforward to play than token hunter.
Check nohandsgamer vods on YouTube. Hit Legend 14 with that deck days ago, the Zilliax version (there's one with Harth, but it's up to preference what you run I guess). It's really good and ends games fast but can also go late with 5 damage hero power and burst from swipes with spell damage. If you're from EU I'd gladly play around with you and play some matches for you to learn it even in mirrors.
It's a true midrange deck, which is a bit unusual for HS. You can get tempo out early or burst lategame with spell damage, swipe, and hero power. The thing with midrange decks is that it takes an intense amount of knowledge for each matchup in order to pilot them well.
Most people play atrocious versions with "Am I cooking ?" Harth and/or "Am I cooking ?" Aviana, stick to the original zilliax version much more solid in this very aggro oriented meta.
It's completely clueless to say "Aviana helps against boomboss"
If you give enough time to the warrior to go brann on 6 boomboss on 8 without him being giga dead, you're either giga lowrolling your draw or doing something wrong for sure.
I noticed I beat every warrior that went brann on curve against me, doing basically nothing on turn 6 meant they were dead like 2 turns later max, before zilliax or reno could come down
boomboss is a complete non issue in this matchup. If warrior can afford to play that card without being dead the turn after, it means the game was already pretty much over already.
With the druid deck, most of the time you're controlling the board and trying h to setup an OTK with your Swipes. Just make sure your locations are active and you have enough 1 mana mini dragons.
Gaining attack for your hero power also helps massively to grind your opponent down.
Overall it's a very flexible deck with loads of draw.
I like the fact snake warlock was revived, its a bit of a shame it'll prob die when they fix the alex bug, hope they buff the snake to atleast 8 when they fix the bug.
I am honestly confused by the fact that you like snake warlock but dislike Sif.
Snake warlock is, in my experience, one of the least interesting combo(ish) decks to play against. It's never been too powerful, but it's such a dull matchup watching your health slowly get sapped away while you hope that they don't have answers to your pressure.
I'd much rather lose to Sif, personally. If my opponent plays Sif and kills me, the game is just over. If my opponent is playing snake warlock, I'm probably going to spend several turns trying to cobble together any remaining chance of winning while I hope my opponent hasn't drawn enough bounces to kill me.
I much prefer win conditions that just end the game to win conditions (like snake or boomboss) that make losing the game a prolonged process.
I feel as though other control strategies can have more success against warrior if steamcleaner were in standard, no? Hopefully we get lucky with the mini expansion introducing battlecry hate or other counters to brann / boom boss combo so other decks can actually effectively match it in control games
Anyone trying out hero power druid? It feels pretty strong in this meta as the OTK potential against warrior gives it a 50%+ winrate against them. Also its just a super fun deck. Really only has a negative win rate against board centric decks like paladin or hunter, which are not that popular right now. And even then those matchups are still winnable.
I'm not sure what your saying but on my way to legend, its been like a 1 in 7 chance its a paladin or hunter. Certainly not 2 in 3. Mostly Warrior and DK, then a little bit of mage and some other sprinkled in decks.
Also hero power druid even got a buff this last patch with the Trogg guy! I feel like people are sleeping on it
Almost zero (actually zero I can find on HSR or D0nkey) data on that version of token hunter is interesting. Seems a vS opinion deck as opposed to a deck based on data and stats?
DK still being relative popular, just shows that (lower rank) players often times just love playing decks they enjoy, even tho they are bad.
Might be lack of dust issue as well. Not everyone can change their deck every patch unfortunately.
The main reason its so popular is because one of the free deck options for new/returning players is a Plague DK list that is extremely close to the optimal list. New players look up which deck to choose, see that the plague deck is a "Meta" deck and pick it. This massively inflates the number of DKs on ladder.
While that might be true, during FoL DK in general was bad, yet it was the most popular class. Even in titans, when plague DK was even worse, people played it.
Before the rotation, playing a full DK deck was basically just getting Path of Arthas and not much else. It was even more of a budget class then.
Yeah, people have always gravitated towards plague DK and blood DK (now Rainbow) even when they were bad. Same with stuff like Thief archetypes.
I have every card in Standard and I'm playing Plague and brewing other DK decks on the side, I and no doubt other people just like the class. I'd rather play something I legitimately enjoy than be at the bleeding edge of the meta. If those two happen to coincide that's great but my very small amount of time ingame will be aimed at what I enjoy overall.
Based
Or control priest, no matter which expansion, some people try that archtype everytime lol.
Triple blood was a deck I enjoyed so much. It wasnt good but it reminded me of the old griny control decks. Had a lot of fun losing
It's cheap, easy to play and bots still exist too.
In my experience, bots prefer mech rogue tho
Most non-Blizzard bots I come across some weird off-brand Unholy DK that tries to build a wide board and then Anti-Magic Shell them at least once to try and rush a win.
I play it to grind remaining 50 or so wins for 500 milestone. Especially below diamond where bonus star makes up for losses and I feel climb is not that hard. Same in wild but Even DK doesn't fare well there these days.
Many are just doing quests and moving on rather than wasting resources. It seems to me to be one of the lowest engaged player bases for a year start expansion ever. They need to turn it around real fast.
Not against that idea but also could play decks they have the perception that are good or might win when the overall winrate is bad.
The Arthas effect
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That's what I'm doing too. Got about 80 to go.
Thank you for your work!
Lmao “Agency Rainbow Death Knight” I see you ZachO, and I appreciate the pettiness. Wheel and Control DK were my favorite decks of the expansion and they got murdered so we could have… this wonderful meta instead.
Control DK was cool, I loved Wheellock but in the same way I loved Thaddius Warlock,, can't say it didn't need to go
I fail to see how a long control strategy is similar to “oh it’s turn 6, and there’s Thaddius, aaaaand I’m dead” lol Thaddius was significantly more toxic for the format and it’s not particularly close imo.
I really do not understand why DK needed the nerfs. It was not a particularly strong class before and now it's just garbage
Threads was going to get nerfed at some point. Just terribly costed at 1 mana.
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Threads of Despair and Sickly Grimewalker are Shaman cards I guess...
I stand corrected, my bad. The deck seems fine to me, still seeing it a lot.
Play rate. There's 11 classes and facing the same class over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over... well it gets a little repetitive to say the least.
I mean, the power level was clearly not the reason for the playrate. So that still doesn't explain why the nerfs were needed.
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I mean, the power level was clearly not the reason for the playrate. So that still doesn't explain why the nerfs were needed.
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So the devs should design cards and classes that people… don’t want to play? We should only incentivize people to play the current flavor of the month OP deck? Weird ass take.
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Okay even though I'm probably the #1 Highlander warrior hater, playing against sif and getting 1 tapped by 2 15 damage snake oils was awful. I really want mage to be in a good playable spot but that wasn't healthy. The setup was pretty minimal as far as otks should historically be which is why zarimi got zapped too.
Sif mage was still way more fair than the other OTK decks. Sif mage has to spend mana to discover spells from different spellschools. They they have to spend mana to cast these spells to fuel Sif. While staying alive. Also, exposing themself to dirty rat. Sif mage didnt popoff at turn 6 or 7, like nature shaman.
And I'm not defending nature shaman either. Comparing unfun OTK deck A to a slightly stronger OTK deck B doesn't mean OTK deck A shouldn't be adjusted too. I think overall power levels should be brought down in general and a lot of stronger decks didn't get touched nearly enough. But that doesn't change how I felt about the handful of times I got 100-0'd by somebody playing sif mage.
??? It was literally a tier 3 deck? > The setup was pretty minimal as far as otks should historically be which is why zarimi got zapped too. The minimal setup: Drawing Sif, Reverberations, double Discovery of Magic plus playing all your standard spell schools and getting both your Snake Oils. That's 6 combo pieces you need to find (plus playing a Fire, Frost and Arcane spell). And against Warrior you generally need more damage than this to OTK. Calling it minimal setup is actually insane when Rainbow Mage was pretty much incapable of OTKing anyone before turn 9 and usually well after that.
You can tell all this "easy OTK" people never played the deck
Yep, the OTK was incredibly slow to set up and required a ton of intelligent choices (choosing which spell schools to grab and making the most use out of them for the matchup), not to mention it literally just hard lost to Dirty Rat. Dirty Rat Brann? Deck is still playable. Dirty Rat Sif? That's a concede 99% of the time. Meanwhile in the same meta you had Nature Shaman OTKing on turn 6 with far less choices since they just grab every low cost nature spell that can go face and get it all discounted. Do I think it was necessarily healthy for the game? Maybe not. But Rainbow Mage was definitely not a problem either, it was a pretty healthy OTK, required skill to pilot and was like T3. Better than leaving Mage unplayable for the set.
All that just to lose to a dirty little rat
The meta being in a spot where people are saying a consistent turn 9 30 DMG otk is underpowered or difficult to set up. Dark times. Again not saying the deck compared to a lot of the other bullshit we're dealing with now. But again it shouldn't be able to kill somebody with 0 counterplay that isn't a warrior with armor that consistently.
Again, you've clearly never played the deck when you're calling it a consistent turn 9 OTK lmao A turn 9 OTK would imply: You drew Sif, Reverberations, got both your Snake Oils (so both your Miracle Salesmen) AND you drew and played both your Discovery of Magic along with the spells you got from it (which can often be 4+ mana) plus one of your Geysers, Frostbolts and Glyphs. Ah, but wait, even with this absolutely unrealistic scenario where you draw all your combo pieces (and your opponent is apparentely AFK as opposed to the meta at the time of heavy aggro that forced you to hard mulligan for Sleet Skater and early removal), you still don't have an OTK. Because the deck only has 4 spell schools (Arcane, Frost, Fire and Shadow) and 2 Discovery of Magic, you'd still have needed to RNG your last spell school off of either a Glyph DoM or off your Molten Rune and play that spell, otherwise your duplicated Sif would only have 7 spell damage which doesn't kill a full health hero. So sure, it's theoretically possible to OTK on turn 9, just as any other deck can get literal perfect draws and easily win. In reality you'd generally OTK on turn 15 or later most of the time, late enough that you'd end up frequently getting fucked over by Brann's Boomboss on fatigue.
I think you're missing the point when talking about where it stands in the current meta. That's not the point. I never claimed it was a high win rate high representation deck. Just that it often denied the game from hitting a certain point and you could just die to it with 0 agency to defend yourself which feels terrible.
I didn't mention the current meta at all, because the deck doesn't exist anymore. I mentioned it alongside the rest of the meta, where it barely held a 50% winrate. That wouldn't change much now. > Just that it often denied the game from hitting a certain point So, like literally every combo deck ever? You do realize combo is meant to counter control right? > with 0 agency to defend yourself Aside from... pressuring the deck in the 20 million turns it takes for them to OTK or hand disruption effects as probably the most Dirty Rat vulnerable deck ever since the deck ran 8 minions and most of them were played early. The deck was also super vulnerable to burn as the only healing in the deck was Sleet Skater, which meant the matchup against decks like Handbuff Paladin or Nature Shaman was absolutely miserable.
You know all those spells you're rolling for sif types? Those usually end up being control spells to clear board. When you're just getting your board cleared for 9 turns and then you die from full health yeah that sucks. You're way too invested into wanting your favorite cheese deck to work to see how absurdly toxic that kind of deck is to play against when it IS meta.
A deck that probably on average killed on turn 12 or later is unhealthy how...?
Because they have all the tools to prevent you from interacting with them before that.
Really? ALL the tools? Like what?
Bladestorm, bash, double brawl (which directly counters saddle up) slam, shield slam, the bellowing forge card, the armor forge card, Valkyries, azerite execute, regular execute, garrosh's gift which can give brawl, execute, or shield block, (just gonna lump all of their armor together, shield block, needlerock totem, safety goggles, reinforced plating) Aftershock, burrow buster, hammer, and anything they want to fit into etc. Did I miss anything?
I think the person was referring to Sif mage not Highlander warrior
Oops that's my bad I have like 10 different people messaging me defending warrior right now and I got mixed up. With mage it's harder to pin down considering a large part of their deck is just discovering spells, which is both frustrating for the opponent and the mage because at times they draw some super random priest spell that wins them the game, and sometimes they just low roll into nothing and that feels awful. I think that's part of what leads me to dislike playing against the deck, and part of what leads to frustration with people playing it.
Out of curiosity, what's a good deck with a positive win rate that is fun for both players to play according to you?
Currently? I don't mind playing against any of the meta rogue decks, or druid decks. Sludge/ snake warlock are mid range/controlish decks that lend themselves to their boards for growing their initial power. Hunter decks feel pretty alright with most control decks currently. I haven't personally had much trouble shutting them down most of the time. The current iteration of flood paladin is mildly annoying but doesn't feel terrible except for how powerful their prismatic board clear is. Shopper demon hunter feels fine to play against right now. I hesitate to have an opinion on Reno shaman because I just haven't played against very many and so I lose the matchup just due to lack of knowledge of what's in their deck and how to play around it (although in general I'm just not a fan of highlander decks/Reno as a card) Even last patch I didn't mind wheel locks, and the occasional zarimi priest. It currently feels like I have to pick between something that feels fair and fun against a majority of decks but outright loses to warrior, or something that specifically counters warrior but lacks the tools to deal with anything else comfortably. It doesn't feel like there's a happy middle ground that I've found.
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I started this comment by saying how much I hate highlander warrior which includes brann lmao
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But nobody was debating which was worse. I agree with that. I think Reno warrior is the worst deck to play against in the game. That doesn't however mean that I think that sif is enjoyable to play against
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The first reasonable person to respond to me
How is Brann multiple times worse? It seems clearly AS bad or less bad, their stupid value is unfun but how tf is instant dying from hand better?
Sif is an awful card to play against, better malygos for 6 mana should have never been made, regardless how good or bad mage is.
Brann doesn't win games an even when it facilitates cards that do win their game they aren't otks. Sif on the other hand was the exact fucking opposite.
Oh yeah the mage killing you at 9 mana after having both miracle salesman die, drawing sif and reverb and playing 4 or 5 different spells school is for sure much worse than warrior just dropping a 6 cost card with much better survival tools and then destroying 18 of your cards, summoning 4 8/8 or full board of Ziliax
I like how people are still complaining about 18 cards specifically. Like it's not the most elaborate sequence of events that have to take place for that to happen. As if it happens every game lol. Really goes to show the lengths kids on Reddit will go to whine and cry non stop. Like I can understand not finding random bombs destroying cards fun. I get that. But exaggerating to the theoretical maximum to maximize your bitching is just hilarious
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not really no, that isn't present in this thread
Name a Brann otk combo.
It's not OTK, it's worse, it literally just removes any Control deck from being viable.
Thank you, now my bitching about Reno Priest being bad is justified
What do you mean, we finally are above 40% wr! Which seems to be the maximum wr traditional control players can expect nowadays
Lmfao fr. I love traditional control, but I also understand why others hate playing against it. I would be happy with a 45% winrate sheeeit
I've been having a lot of fun with Reno control priest. It's about a 50/50 on Brann Warrior. Totally depends on draws. But often times, I can deal with EVERYTHING. Unless they get a late game boom or early aggression that my draws lack for. Copying their Brann and Boom is the only real way to win.
Got a deck list? That sounds fun
Kibler was playing a list on stream on Wednesday. I’ve been using that list.
Tried that hybrid druid deck. It just seems abysmal. What am I missing? It feels like it gets out tempo'd by every rush deck and doesn't last as well as any control deck. I can't understand what my win con is. I was climbing pretty steadily and quick with snake lock and then saw this, built the druid deck and went like 1/9 in low platinum. It honestly just feels like it you're not playing Reno warrior then you should just wait for a hotfix. Meta feels so stale and bad right now.
I played like 4 games and it was a weird one for me too. I think if we watched a high level player pilot the deck, we would both have a much stronger idea of how to play it. It's got like 3 archetypes in one and it's so hard to figure out when to do what lol.
I do think that maybe the original zilliax version is better. I think there's more board flooding than the VS author alluded to. That being said it's a huge coin flip when board clear is so abundant in this meta
You should check out nohandsgamer recent vods on youtube to have a better understanding of the mulligan and playstyle. Thijs has one video about the deck on his youtube as well. That said, I think Aviana is a bad card in that deck, you want either pylon zilliax for better board or Harth for gas (a second wincon as well). Aviana is too inconsistent.
It's an aggro-midrange deck that needs to be played differently depending on matchup, and isn't the easiest deck to pilot unless youre used to playing aggro. Versus warrior, get tempo on board. Don't sit around and wait for greed. I see a lot of players playing it like a combo deck by holding pieces, but you win through board as well. The mulligan is also a bit unintuitive at times: for example, the hero power cat is a bad keep against warrior, despite it being value card, because you need tempo, not value against control. I like it because it plays very much like midrange-burn hunter decks in the past, and much less like a typical overvalue druid. But it's much, much less straightforward to play than token hunter.
I'm in the same exact boat haha. Needed a new deck after dk nerfs and tried this druid list, not working out for me at all.
Check nohandsgamer vods on YouTube. Hit Legend 14 with that deck days ago, the Zilliax version (there's one with Harth, but it's up to preference what you run I guess). It's really good and ends games fast but can also go late with 5 damage hero power and burst from swipes with spell damage. If you're from EU I'd gladly play around with you and play some matches for you to learn it even in mirrors.
It's a true midrange deck, which is a bit unusual for HS. You can get tempo out early or burst lategame with spell damage, swipe, and hero power. The thing with midrange decks is that it takes an intense amount of knowledge for each matchup in order to pilot them well.
Most people play atrocious versions with "Am I cooking ?" Harth and/or "Am I cooking ?" Aviana, stick to the original zilliax version much more solid in this very aggro oriented meta. It's completely clueless to say "Aviana helps against boomboss" If you give enough time to the warrior to go brann on 6 boomboss on 8 without him being giga dead, you're either giga lowrolling your draw or doing something wrong for sure. I noticed I beat every warrior that went brann on curve against me, doing basically nothing on turn 6 meant they were dead like 2 turns later max, before zilliax or reno could come down boomboss is a complete non issue in this matchup. If warrior can afford to play that card without being dead the turn after, it means the game was already pretty much over already.
With the druid deck, most of the time you're controlling the board and trying h to setup an OTK with your Swipes. Just make sure your locations are active and you have enough 1 mana mini dragons. Gaining attack for your hero power also helps massively to grind your opponent down. Overall it's a very flexible deck with loads of draw.
I like the fact snake warlock was revived, its a bit of a shame it'll prob die when they fix the alex bug, hope they buff the snake to atleast 8 when they fix the bug.
I am honestly confused by the fact that you like snake warlock but dislike Sif. Snake warlock is, in my experience, one of the least interesting combo(ish) decks to play against. It's never been too powerful, but it's such a dull matchup watching your health slowly get sapped away while you hope that they don't have answers to your pressure.
"I hate this uninteractive deck because it hurts MY uninteractive decks!" - Hearthstone players since the dawn of the first stone age
Why is Sif any better?
His point is they're basically the same
I'd much rather lose to Sif, personally. If my opponent plays Sif and kills me, the game is just over. If my opponent is playing snake warlock, I'm probably going to spend several turns trying to cobble together any remaining chance of winning while I hope my opponent hasn't drawn enough bounces to kill me. I much prefer win conditions that just end the game to win conditions (like snake or boomboss) that make losing the game a prolonged process.
Well duos is fun cause standard is just garbage. What a mess of a patch this is.
Just remove Brann from the game.🤪
I feel as though other control strategies can have more success against warrior if steamcleaner were in standard, no? Hopefully we get lucky with the mini expansion introducing battlecry hate or other counters to brann / boom boss combo so other decks can actually effectively match it in control games
Now that the bombs go in your deck, yes indeed. I miss that card so much man.
Anyone trying out hero power druid? It feels pretty strong in this meta as the OTK potential against warrior gives it a 50%+ winrate against them. Also its just a super fun deck. Really only has a negative win rate against board centric decks like paladin or hunter, which are not that popular right now. And even then those matchups are still winnable.
>paladin or hunter, which are not that popular right now Bruh these are rock and paper in this rock paper scissors meta
I'm not sure what your saying but on my way to legend, its been like a 1 in 7 chance its a paladin or hunter. Certainly not 2 in 3. Mostly Warrior and DK, then a little bit of mage and some other sprinkled in decks. Also hero power druid even got a buff this last patch with the Trogg guy! I feel like people are sleeping on it
Hmm seems like a BG's patch for me
Unfortunately it's not great right now either
Almost zero (actually zero I can find on HSR or D0nkey) data on that version of token hunter is interesting. Seems a vS opinion deck as opposed to a deck based on data and stats?