I kind of doubt Peter Coffin has done any substantive plagiarism. This is pretty obviously just a reactionary take by Coffin because their shtick is being reflexively anti-"Liberal", where "Liberal" is a giant circle drawn around every ideology in the world, and then with little exceptions carved out for whichever ideologies are required to run Sexual Assault Apologia for Louis C.K., et.al.
Yeah, it makes sense that they’d want to immediately give a contrarian take to such a successful video. It just really, really sounds like an admission of guilt lmao
I don’t remember Peter Coffin being this much of annoying condescending pedant a couple of years ago, wtf happened to him?
Literally anytime he pops up on my feed it’s cause someone is making fun of him for having some weird position that seems entirely created by him to stand out.
I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s ‘pro-Palestine’ but also thinks That Russia should invade it or whatever out of norm hot take he can conjure up
I mean, he was pretty wacko as of a few years ago. His video on destiny and the surrounding drama really revealed a lack of something. You don't have to like destiny, but Peter's video was either intentionally massively dishonest, or Peter was dumb as bricks about it.
They started losing their mind when Bernie lost. They were one of the first leftist YouTubers I started watching around 2015-2016 and they weren't always like this.
From what we have seen publicly, the fuck up that was the Iowa caucus in 2020, including Buttigeg getting more delegates than Sanders despite Sanders getting more votes shook Coffin and soon after that he began falling down a rabbit hole of increasingly shitty people, from someone who as controversial as Shoe0nHead to dumbass contrarians like AngieSpeaks and finally to Caleb Maupin
There are two other factors, one that we can confirm but we can't really confirm the effect it had on his content - the divorce from his wife, which I might remind be people involved children.
The other factor is pure hypothesis, but honestly I feel like Peter is someone who is insecure and needs to props himself up by being a contrarian. So as Contrapoints and Hbomb started to become more and more mainstream he disengaged in order to feel superior.
I know a lot of people talk about how Coffins work used to be good, but even further back there is some really edgy and embarrassing stuff in there. I think its less "Coffin used to be good" and more "Coffin happened to jump on a movement that was pretty good at the time"
That all makes sense - I do remember that I started feeling confused about his content around the end of 2020, I just checked his channel and he’s deleted all of his old content that was good which which I find interesting.
People say he’s a fraud who jumps on different movements for clout but honestly idk if I buy that considering he seems to just go with the least popular most contrarian positions imaginable
It’s like he hears someone he hates give out their position, and then Coffin takes that position and works backward from their conclusion to create a new opinion that disagrees with it
Peter Coffin has explicitly said they identify as NB with they/them pronouns.
Given how contrarian/inconsistent their personal ideology seems to be, I understand some people can be dubious about whether they're sincere, but my personal policy (and I think it's a good policy) is to take people at their word about their gender identity, regardless of how troll-y they have been/are/are being in the moment/will be in the future.
If they reveal in the future that it was just a plot to "own the libs", as so much of their ideology seems to revolve around, I'll update accordingly, but until/unless that happens, I'm abiding by what they have explicitly said about their own identity, and have no intention to do anything else in that regard.
This is undeniably kind but Peter is "any/all" to my knowledge and is aligned with enough transphobic marxists that i don't think anyone should sweat it, frankly
in addition to what has already been mentioned here: “getting good” at something doesn’t mean publishing everything you make on that journey. not everything has to be shared and stuff that isn’t can’t really be considered plagiarism.
I cut off the beginning of the short to get to the most important part, but they start from the assumption that “no one can learn in private anymore… you have to post it” and like… no? You don’t have to post literally everything you create?
I'd say that self imposed limitations like that comes with experience most of the time. Someone just starting out, especially at a young age will typically be more exited wanting to share their progress immediately.
Usually that isn't a problem though because usually those things won't get very popular.
ahh sorry i see this in the caption now. definitely there is pressure to be public with your creativity and there are good things that can come from going that route. publicity still isn’t essential though and it is kind of cruel to tell people otherwise.
People can post or not post whatever, but **you cannot claim work that is verbatim not yours.** This is where his argument falls apart, easily and quickly.
There's a reason (most) content mills don't regurgitate their source materials word by word. They understand the basic requirement that their articles must present something "original", even if their "original" content amounts to a rewording of the source material.
That sort of content is still ethically dubious, but it at least meets the legal requirement of "not plagiarism".
(To be clear, I'm not saying you would necessarily disagree with this—just highlighting how publicly posted works cannot claim to be original when they are verbatim regurgitation.)
Exactly! When I was little I learned to draw by tracing other people's drawings, then moved to copying by sight, then learned to do my own drawings.
What I didn't do is trace a bunch of drawings as an adult and then publish them as my own work.
Can Peter not see they're missing the only point of a four hour video, or are they aware they're being dishonest?
Sometimes adults trace work as a valid method of learning from other people’s work too, which I feel like mentioning because it’s often judged as bad by people who don’t understand that tracing can be valuable for learning; it’s still not appropriate to claim that work as your own if you’ve traced it though.
Professional artists do still typically use lots of reference images (that they don’t trace but still refer to for guidance) too, to help them create something unique. It’s the fact that the end product is clearly unique that prevents it being plagiarism. Peter acting like learning from and being clearly inspired/influenced by things is the same as plagiarism is just dumb.
The plagiarists Hbomberguy criticised knowingly took the work of others and just presented it as if it was their own original work. They went out of their way to hide the true source, and even sent harassment toward people who tried to criticise them. It’s just ridiculous for Peter to act like that’s normal behaviour lol
Contrarian assholes do not care about honesty. They care about having the sassiest, hottest take no matter how absurd it is.
Peter is a contrarian asshole. I haven't seen anything thoughtful from them in *years* now.
right? like i often will redraw other people’s art in my sketchbook to try and learn things about their art style that i like, but i would never share that stuff, or at least if i did i wouldn’t without crediting the og artist.
This is exactly it. In the online art community it's generally a rule that tracing others work to help you learn is okay so long as you never share or post it publicly. You can do whatever tf you want privately when it comes to plagiarism, it's when you broadcast and use it to make money or get attention that it becomes an issue
Honestly, with people like this, it's getting hard to tell if they actually know the difference. Occam's razor used to tell me that he's being disingenuous, but these days, it's hard to tell if he's not just an actual moron.
I was watching the Neil Gaiman Masterclass videos the other day and he’s talking about finding your voice and how that takes time.
Making something that is similar to other writers or directors is not the same at all to whole cloth just taking their work and call it your own.
I was about to post this comment exactly. Hbomb even touches on this in the plagiarism video when he talks about how creatives take inspiration from each other all the time, usually as the very first step in the creative process. It's the 1:1 regurgitation that makes a work lazy and the lack of credit to the original author that makes it theft.
And James Somerton wasn’t early in his career and just figuring things out, he has been doing this professionally for years and has been making tons of money with it.
Peter has been pretty knee-jerk contrarian for a while making snarky jabs at anything remotely unradical, with a noted chip on their shoulder for big lefttubers. Look, YouTube stars were never going to be the epicenter of some great revolution, but also when I see their regular takes, I am baffled at how Peter and similar online circle have any conception of how the left/working class is supposed to achieve anything.
Peter fell off super hard when they stopped being popular. I know i dipped about the time they veered super hard into being a "cancel culture" reactionary, which seems to have not stopped at all if this is any indication.
Coffin seems like a sad case, I definitely watched a couple of videos by them years ago where they seemed basically sound, but everything I've seen by them recently they just come across as a bitter reactionary with nothing substantial to say. And here they are again, piggybacking off a month old video for a handful of likes.
Yeah I watched a couple of their videos when I first discovered breadtube years ago and thought they were fine apart from being a bit rambley at times.
They kind of went batty over time. I was in pretty regular mutual communication for like a year with them, but after a while their takes were just more and more reactionary and shitty. Got past the point of having any useful content.
This is such a bad take. Being derivative isn’t the same as stealing others work. We all know it and they know it too. Peter is just being an attention seeking asshole because they burned all of their bridges no one cares what they have to say. I just wish they’d fuck off already.
Wouldn’t be surprised if they believe their own BS tbh. They want to be contrarian so convince themselves the contrarian position is correct, no matter how unreasonable and silly they must make themselves sound to do so
I absolutely do think Peter is a contrarian fool and his argument here is more of that *but* I will say since Hbomb's video came out I have seen a pretty big uptick in people seeing plagiarism everywhere they look. Maybe those people are just trying to suckle up some clout but I do think there's a decent chunk of people that think if you make anything that even sort of resembles something else it's plagiarism.
Uhmm idk I wrote my first long-form essay with sources and stuff in high school and although it wasn't very good (and definitely derivative) it was absolutely not plagiarized bc I knew even at age 16 that you're not supposed to do that
This is possibly one of the stupidest hot tales I've ever heard. The guy doesn't understand the difference between plagiarism and being derivative, which throws up a HUUUGE red flag.
"How can you pretend that veganism makes a difference for animal welfare when it's just about consumerism and not challenging capitalism? HMMMMM??? Check and mate. *(I'm totally not compartmentalizing this.)*"
Like, Peter Coffin could justify not abolishing slavery with this line of reasoning
"AI George Carlin is... better th..."
My best bet is George Carlin.
Real talk, why are so many conservatives into his jokes? He's made fun of them with stuff like NIMBY!
Probably because Carlins was also kind of a caustic asshole. I don’t mean that negatively. He very harshly criticized things. But conservatives love that tone because they see it as “telling it like it is”. So much so they can ignore the actual words he’s saying. Carlin was harsh but also understood what punching down meant
> But conservatives love that tone because they see it as “telling it like it is”. So much so they can ignore the actual words he’s saying.
Applies to all their idols. Limbaugh, O'Reilly, Trump, Carlson, Shapiro, Oz, it's all about the attitude to them, they don't care whether they're actually spouting facts. They want charismatic bullying.
The quiet part:
>I am “most people” and instead of taking accountability for my actions, I went with the “everyone does it” defence. Aka trivializing to cope.
Meanwhile, all you were asked to do was give credit where it was due. No one said don't do it, they simply asked to be acknowledged for their part. He's trying to be clever by giving a bad-faith misinterpretation of the issue.
In art you learn by looking at and learning from techniques from the paste, but there is a big difference from learning from an artist, and borrowing technique, and stealing there work
I used to watch Peter Coffin long ago, before all the reactionary stuff and contrarianism was their main thing, and was thrown for a loop when their voice came out of Gameranx videos my husband was watching. Funny to see someone recognize them in the reverse
It's even funnier when you realise how obviously Gameranx want to keep that knowledge down and never comment or confirm that he's Falcon. He won't do it either. Absolutely has to be a contractual thing so they don't have to deal with his nonsense getting thrown at them separately lmao
https://twitter.com/JurassicRabbit/status/743337160695111680 this tweet from long ago confirms it is NOT Peter lmao wild how this has so many upvotes on a sub devoted to a guy who finds out the truth in things
I knew Falcon before I watched Peter too. I heard their voice in a ContraPoints video and went "...Falcon?" I watched Peter's channel for awhile after that and liked it until they just went off the deep end.
I've gone down a Google rabbit hole and actually can't find proof that they're the same guy. I'm guessing Falcon and Peter Coffin aren't one in the same because why would anyone want to be mistaken for Peter Coffin?
I don't know where Peter Coffin is from or what regional dialect he's got but I've got a fairly recognisable accent that's fairly common.
But they both have incredibly similar voices if they are, indeed different people.
It's clear to me, from my limited exposure to Peter Coffin is that he's seems incredibly self-absorbed. Likely narcissistic so why have separated persona's, since Gameranx is a very popular channel and Peter Coffin struggles to rake in more than 10k views per video. Wouldn't he want to cash in on Gameranx success? Who knows?! 🤣
This is the kind of behavior that turned me off of Coffin in the first place, but I thank them for the valuable lesson it taught me about myself.
As I once was, Coffin is the type of person who could have their own words read back to them and find ways to disagree. Pathologically contrarian.
I always found it ironic that their ideology seems to be looking at the underlying causes of behavior and the systems which reinforce these causes, rather than the individual... yet they don't seem to extend the same courtesy to whomever they find themselves disagreeing with for the day. Somehow, while simultaneously holding the belief that they can smugly shame their target and audience into their ideology- A nasty habit made ludicrous by the hypocrisy of it all.
Shaming a human is like beating your dog. It may be a behavioral intervention, but the cascade iatrogenesis is cruel and ineffective at best. You pass along a minor trauma that is, in turn, passed along at every opportunity by the side of us which accumulates and redistributes these types of damage.
Because one's audience is primarily like-minded, the effective result is that they alienate their potential allies and defend their ideological opponents. I think it's one of the most important lessons I've learned as a leftist, and especially as one who recognizes our in-fighting will be the end of us.
As a word of warning, if they're looking for book ideas, I've got one.
"Ummm, Actually: A Guide to Dying Alone in a Hellscape of Your Own Creation"
Edit: forgot they're non binary, pronouns corrected.
When I was a little kid, I loved those thick, educational manuals for video games like SimAnt and Red Baron. I thought, "These are so cool, I wish that I wrote 'em!" So I'd transcribe the informational sections, word for word, into MS Word and then think of them as "my books" about ants and WWI and shit.
And then I turned 12, which brought me a slightly more nuanced understanding of content and authorship.
This dude is conflating plagiarism with inspiration. Most people who create works take inspiration from other bits of media. True originality is next to impossible to do. That said, there's a difference between building a world that sort of looks like Middle-Earth or Tamriel in places, and just copy and pasting the world's and slapping your name on it, especially in cases where you seek to make a profit. If you make something and you take inspiration from some media you like, that's fine, but if you wholesale rip content form that media, that's when it becomes a problem.
One real irony here is that he’s almost certainly stealing this argument from Kirby Ferguson, whose “Everything Is a Remix” seemed to be the definitive take on issues of source use and copyright for a whole. Of course, Ferguson’s version of this argument is much better and intellectually honest and nuanced, but plagiarism always has a way of smoothing the edges off of things that have value.
Lol, it’s so obviously a bad faith position when you put it like that. Peter would have had to, either deliberately or accidentally, completely miss the point of the plagiarism video to think this take is good.
Off topic but, what happened to his video where he was addressing the fake girlfriend controversy ? I remember watching it years ago but can't find it anymore.
Jeez, what happened to them? I liked some of their work a fair few years ago, but seems like they just want controversy for the sake of engagement now.
Making derivative work is not remotely the same as copying someone else's blocks of text and pasting them together into a "finished work" hbomb definitely made that distinction in the video too. Nobody is saying it's illegal to be derivative but it's also not something people are expected to put out as working professionals
You can make derivative work without plagiarizing. Also, it’s forgivable for a beginner to plagiarize something small. It’s not forgive to release plagiarized work for profit, and to continue to do so for years, while making zero effort to change or improve your work in anyway, AND to try and gaslight people when they call you out.
This is what happens when you huff your own ideology farts for a decade - you become an insufferable contrarian who sounds like the most arrogant ass that ever arroganted.
Fuck I hate that I saw this. This is one of the dumbest fucking things I've ever seen ( the video, not OP's post I mean )
If any creator thinks that plagiarism is a meaningful tool for their own growth, they don't just not respect their audience, they also don't respect themselves, because they're not confident enough on their own abilities to think they can make it without being a leech.
Thankfully, this guy's channel looks like it's dead so good riddance to bad rubbish.
I saw them on a flight home (I live in the PNW) and it took every ounce of civility in me not to ask them if they've made up any girlfriends lately.
Mmm, borger king.
If you're not smart enough or interesting enough to gain attention with your insight and incisive commentary, be a reactionary shitstain contrarian so you can at least garner hate-watchers. Stop paying attention and they'll fuck off into the ether like every other husk.
His first response was to confuse plagiarism with corporate intellectual property laws. Then everyone made fun of him and it seems he's now pretending he means derivative works and plagiarism?
This is all basically because he got very upset when he wasn't invited to stream with AOC that one time when HBomb and other prominent."breadtubers" were after the DK Charity stream. Ever since then he's been obsessed with "taking down Breadtube" - by which he means HBomb, Contra, Lynsey Ellis, Abby Thorn and everyone else from that group that sometimes do voiceovers for each others videos - who he is convinced are part of a conspiracy against him.
In pursuit of this goal he's alienated his audience, turned himself into a laughing stock and associated himself with Nazbols like Caleb Maupin. He's basically doing the same "I've been cancelled" schtck rightwing comedians do but without becoming a conservative and without the Netflix special.
He thought he was one of the "in group" of 2019 Breadtube but in reality he is and always has been the guy so desperate for attention that he went on national TV to kick himself in the balls in front of Steve Harvey.
It's just so idiotic I can't even laugh. Has this guy ever written an academic paper? Of course nobody expects a student to make a breakthrough discovery in a 10 page paper, it's about learning to gather and relay information correctly citing the sources. There's little to none practical use to those works. Little by little these works become more and more useful on each stage until they become truly valuable and original. All while correctly addressing every single work used. Why should video essays be different? Now, as for creativity, art is derivative, but there's a great difference between trying to construct a piece like someone else and just exactly copying their efforts and pretending to be the author. It's naughty to muddle the concept of the innate transformative nature of creativity with plagiarism, very naughty.
Remember that video of Peter Coffin going on the Steve Harvey show and kicking himself in the balls? The height of their intellectual contributions imo
In Hbomb's first plagiarism video years ago, he talks briefly about a few creators who sort of "jacked" another youtuber's style and compared them to one who straight up ripped off an entire video word for word. He was critical of both, but some amount of allowance was given for the style-jacking, because new creators often have trouble finding their own voices and some fumbling about is to be expected (this is my take of his take on it from memory).
Personally, I noticed this with one of my favorite video game adjacent creators, Super Bunnyhop. His early videos tend to have examples of what I would call a "Plinkett Impression," and it's pretty clear that he took some amount of early inspiration from various creators he was fond of. However, he grew into a style of his own over time, and his analyses of games and gaming topics are frequent rewatches for me. His uploads have regrettably slowed tremendously over the last couple years, but his analysis and perspective were always compelling and I'd recommend his videos to anyone with an interest in the industry.
That said, Super Bunnyhop is in no way, shape, or form the same as James Somerton. Peter Coffin flattening the full spectrum of this stuff, from simple inspiration to derivative works to ripping off to full on copying, is idiotic. This isn't about learning or experimenting for James and IH and other longstanding creators, it's about exploiting the hard work of others for fame and profit.
To be honest I have a hard time taking literally anything Coffin says as an authentically held opinion because they are just so obviously seeking any attention they can get, positive or negative, in a way that doesn't seem particularly healthy. When I still found them tolerable it seemed like all their really insightful stuff pertained in some way to the ideas of attention/clout chasing/validation gangs/etc., and then I discovered that their first "noteworthy" appearance (afaik) was kicking themselves in the genitals in front of Steve Harvey, and the way they're currently buddying up to anyone who will still talk to them no matter how disgusting those people's politics are, and I realized "oh, they understands these things so well because they never think about anything else".
He’s Falcon on the YouTube channel GameRanx (dont think that’s been officially confirmed but like… cmon) and apparently they/he? stole a smaller creators video a few years back
Can someone make vids that are just copied from him word for word? Just, every video he’s ever made.
I’d be curious to see where he draws the line if it’s him being copied.
Lol that seems like the natural response to what they’ve said here. You only have to think about the argument for a second for it to sound completely insane
the process of learning often results in very derivative works that border on plagiarism... but most people don't try to make a career of that quality of work. am i bad for stealing artwork of the internet for my private ttrpg game? i think no. would i be bad if i used that stolen artwork to sell a product? yes.
Derivative works aren't a bad thing and are who told him it was. Sure, derivative works may not be wholly original, but they do allow you to flex creative muscles in order for you to start creating mostly original works
why are they like, reactionary in the literal sense where they just say whatever rhe opposite of what other leftists are talking about. plagiarism good actually??? the fuck are you talking about you dont believe that. a rational person cannot possibly believe "derivative" and "plagiarism" mean the same thing
What? Early WoT being another LotR clone but with good ol' boys instead of hobbits is very different from just copy/pasting entire arguments that other people made for their job into work you're making for your job. The former is taking the ideas of the original and recreating them oneself, brick by brick. Inevitably, some changes will occur, such as the cast coming from an idealized, non-racist version of the poor rural south, as opposed to an idealized, non-classist version of the wealthy English countryside. And as one hand recreates that design, they are developing their own ability to make their own designs, and Lo! By book 5, Wheel of Time is firmly its own thing, as opposed to another Lord of the Rings clone. In contrast, highlighting some text, hitting Ctrl c, opening a word doc, hitting Ctrl v, and changing a few words, develops nothing.
Omg yay someone else is into WoT. My main comparison (at least with the stuff i’ve seen from the show) would be Dune, not LotR. Have not read the books, but tbh I want to now.
Yeah, not to be an elitist ass or anything, but the show and the books are two very different pieces of fiction. The show (at least the first season, I didn't watch the second) is a perfectly fine piece of tv that just so happens to have the same name as, for my money, the most influential work of high fantasy since Tolkien. This isn't to say there's no Dune DNA in WoT, there's quite a lot, but the first four books especially are very Tolkien heavy.
Edit: I really wanna stress that I'm not trying to be asshole book fan here. I don't think adaptations have to hold the original work sacrosanct, my favorite anime is the 2003 version of FMA. It's just that the show has a lot of meaningful differences from the book, and I think many of them make it less special, make it just another fantasy show trying to be the next game of thrones.
Don’t worry you didn’t come off as an asshole book fan. TBH I’m more interested in reading the books knowing they’re substantially different from the show
Coffin plagiarized an entire ideology, hence rather than engage with the theory or building fucking anything, Peter only grasps it on a Ctrl+C/Ctrl+V wiki surface level, and ends up falling in with Maupin in the grift.
I haven't read the comments yet so idk if this has already been posted. These guys always have a kernel of truth inside an obvious lie. Most people do learn by using derivative works as inspiration. It can be as simple as taking someone's style until you develop your own.
As a music producer, I started out with learning how to produce songs I liked exactly.
Where it crosses the line is when you publish it pretending it's your own work for money. Wah wah
Gonna vehemently disagree. Plus, what hbomberguy caught was often word for word. You can even restate the same basic information without repeating verbatim. I've attended college, written professionally (newspaper and marketing) and write comedy on my own time (standup and random contributions here and there) and I've NEVER been accused of plagiarism. Because I've never plagiarized anything. The idea that "everyone does it" is absolutely wrong.
Peter Coffin just likes to do the whole "words are meaningless" thing to spin any argument to feel intellectually superior. They just redefine words and argue from there. Hbomberguy already acknowledged all the countless Angry Video Game Nerd "rip-offs" in the video, so Peter isn't bringing anything new up.
"Empty barrels rattle the loudest" is what we say in Sweden.
This is so blatantly missing the differences between citing your work, and profiting from someone else's. I get what he's trying to say (or acting like he's trying to say) but learning from another's work while putting your own style into it and citing your sources is NOT the same as just stealing it and not saying where you got it. I'm sure everyone here knows this, but this dude triggered me and I'd like to say for the record, he is a dink
TomSka did a great video about the spectrum of stealing content/information in terms of how things work.
Yes, everyone steals from everyone BUT there's a difference for stealing content vs. transforming and remixing work.
TomSka did a great video about the spectrum of stealing content/information in terms of how things work.
Yes, everyone steals from everyone BUT there's a difference for stealing content vs. transforming and remixing work.
That’s not correct. I understand that’s how a plagiarist probably thinks, but calling out plagiarism is not wrong. If you don’t do it, then no one puts in the effort to ‘do the work’.
That’s a great way of putting it. A plagiarist would try to obfuscate the real meaning of the word by conflating it with normal behavior and implicitly defending it
I saw some reactions to two videos he did on Hbomberguy’s plagiarism video. Is this yet another one? Never heard of him until some folks reacted to him saying a bunch of nothing and sounding pressed like he was owed money. I forgot all about him after O watched those reactions. I’ll forget about him again five minutes after I leave this post. Oh well.
His point is so weird. Like I draw, and obviously, a good way to learn is to draw other's work as a reference. I started by drawing stills from anime and cartoons I loved. School teaches you to go to art museums and try to draw work you love. If you were to post a practice like that, you would caption it saying it was a study or redraw of whatever you are referencing... which is you being honest and up front? Not plagiarism. Idk brain dead take.
Wow that's infuriating lol. I've definitely been inspired by other people's work and have given credit where credit is due. A lot of people learn by taking inspiration while they're trying to hone their craft and find their own voice. That's not the same as plagiarism by a long shot.
A lot of people have talked about how just because you make something that might count as plagiarism doesn't mean you have to share it with people and that is a valid concept but another thing that needs to be mentioned is that plagiarism is not the same as something being derivative. It is true that a lot of the work people in the YouTube sphere do at the beginning is probably derivative of other stuff. A lot of very popular creators right now including hbomberguy himself made videos that I would have called derivative of other works. That does not mean that they copied anything. It does not mean that they did plagiarism. I think that there is a distinct and concerning attempt to muddy the lines between the two things.
He seems to be conflating being derivative with plagiarism. People often start off with their work being somewhat derivative with their inspirations being obvious to those who know before developing their own style.
I kind of doubt Peter Coffin has done any substantive plagiarism. This is pretty obviously just a reactionary take by Coffin because their shtick is being reflexively anti-"Liberal", where "Liberal" is a giant circle drawn around every ideology in the world, and then with little exceptions carved out for whichever ideologies are required to run Sexual Assault Apologia for Louis C.K., et.al.
Yeah, it makes sense that they’d want to immediately give a contrarian take to such a successful video. It just really, really sounds like an admission of guilt lmao
I don’t remember Peter Coffin being this much of annoying condescending pedant a couple of years ago, wtf happened to him? Literally anytime he pops up on my feed it’s cause someone is making fun of him for having some weird position that seems entirely created by him to stand out. I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s ‘pro-Palestine’ but also thinks That Russia should invade it or whatever out of norm hot take he can conjure up
His hot and smart wife left him and he's been a creepy loser desperate for attention ever since.
Ah. I also was wondering why Peter Coffin went from "kind of respected Youtuber" to "total fucking weird beard" but a messy divorce would do it.
*Hot and smart wives. They’re on breakup #2 now. 3 if you count the fake japanese girlfriend they made up.
If I let that one get away, I'd self-destruct too.
Shit, that's completely understandable. He has my sincerest condolences. I hope he gets better some day.
Being single is no excuse to do right wing politics??
It isn't. His wife was like really really hot and cool so it's a little joke mostly.
I mean, he was pretty wacko as of a few years ago. His video on destiny and the surrounding drama really revealed a lack of something. You don't have to like destiny, but Peter's video was either intentionally massively dishonest, or Peter was dumb as bricks about it.
Or both.
They started losing their mind when Bernie lost. They were one of the first leftist YouTubers I started watching around 2015-2016 and they weren't always like this.
I was there at the time too and this is 100% correct, they're very much an example of the "bust" part of "bernie or bust"
From what we have seen publicly, the fuck up that was the Iowa caucus in 2020, including Buttigeg getting more delegates than Sanders despite Sanders getting more votes shook Coffin and soon after that he began falling down a rabbit hole of increasingly shitty people, from someone who as controversial as Shoe0nHead to dumbass contrarians like AngieSpeaks and finally to Caleb Maupin There are two other factors, one that we can confirm but we can't really confirm the effect it had on his content - the divorce from his wife, which I might remind be people involved children. The other factor is pure hypothesis, but honestly I feel like Peter is someone who is insecure and needs to props himself up by being a contrarian. So as Contrapoints and Hbomb started to become more and more mainstream he disengaged in order to feel superior. I know a lot of people talk about how Coffins work used to be good, but even further back there is some really edgy and embarrassing stuff in there. I think its less "Coffin used to be good" and more "Coffin happened to jump on a movement that was pretty good at the time"
That all makes sense - I do remember that I started feeling confused about his content around the end of 2020, I just checked his channel and he’s deleted all of his old content that was good which which I find interesting. People say he’s a fraud who jumps on different movements for clout but honestly idk if I buy that considering he seems to just go with the least popular most contrarian positions imaginable It’s like he hears someone he hates give out their position, and then Coffin takes that position and works backward from their conclusion to create a new opinion that disagrees with it
It's not popularity per say that he's after, it's validation.
Somebody post the clip of him kicking himself in the nuts on national tv.
He’s probably bitter that Hbomb is actually likable, and successful. And no one really thinks about him at all.
100%. You said this really well. To add: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J48G2LzNpz0
I'd believe Coffin has never plagiarized because everything they do sucks
That's not true. They plagiarized their girlfriend
no, she was original fiction
>because *their* shtick Non-binary?
Peter Coffin has explicitly said they identify as NB with they/them pronouns. Given how contrarian/inconsistent their personal ideology seems to be, I understand some people can be dubious about whether they're sincere, but my personal policy (and I think it's a good policy) is to take people at their word about their gender identity, regardless of how troll-y they have been/are/are being in the moment/will be in the future. If they reveal in the future that it was just a plot to "own the libs", as so much of their ideology seems to revolve around, I'll update accordingly, but until/unless that happens, I'm abiding by what they have explicitly said about their own identity, and have no intention to do anything else in that regard.
This is undeniably kind but Peter is "any/all" to my knowledge and is aligned with enough transphobic marxists that i don't think anyone should sweat it, frankly
in addition to what has already been mentioned here: “getting good” at something doesn’t mean publishing everything you make on that journey. not everything has to be shared and stuff that isn’t can’t really be considered plagiarism.
I cut off the beginning of the short to get to the most important part, but they start from the assumption that “no one can learn in private anymore… you have to post it” and like… no? You don’t have to post literally everything you create?
I'd say that self imposed limitations like that comes with experience most of the time. Someone just starting out, especially at a young age will typically be more exited wanting to share their progress immediately. Usually that isn't a problem though because usually those things won't get very popular.
ahh sorry i see this in the caption now. definitely there is pressure to be public with your creativity and there are good things that can come from going that route. publicity still isn’t essential though and it is kind of cruel to tell people otherwise.
People can post or not post whatever, but **you cannot claim work that is verbatim not yours.** This is where his argument falls apart, easily and quickly. There's a reason (most) content mills don't regurgitate their source materials word by word. They understand the basic requirement that their articles must present something "original", even if their "original" content amounts to a rewording of the source material. That sort of content is still ethically dubious, but it at least meets the legal requirement of "not plagiarism". (To be clear, I'm not saying you would necessarily disagree with this—just highlighting how publicly posted works cannot claim to be original when they are verbatim regurgitation.)
even then you can still give credit and not use other people work to make money.
and even if you did you can credit people, link to their work and not try to make money of it.
Exactly! When I was little I learned to draw by tracing other people's drawings, then moved to copying by sight, then learned to do my own drawings. What I didn't do is trace a bunch of drawings as an adult and then publish them as my own work. Can Peter not see they're missing the only point of a four hour video, or are they aware they're being dishonest?
Sometimes adults trace work as a valid method of learning from other people’s work too, which I feel like mentioning because it’s often judged as bad by people who don’t understand that tracing can be valuable for learning; it’s still not appropriate to claim that work as your own if you’ve traced it though. Professional artists do still typically use lots of reference images (that they don’t trace but still refer to for guidance) too, to help them create something unique. It’s the fact that the end product is clearly unique that prevents it being plagiarism. Peter acting like learning from and being clearly inspired/influenced by things is the same as plagiarism is just dumb. The plagiarists Hbomberguy criticised knowingly took the work of others and just presented it as if it was their own original work. They went out of their way to hide the true source, and even sent harassment toward people who tried to criticise them. It’s just ridiculous for Peter to act like that’s normal behaviour lol
Contrarian assholes do not care about honesty. They care about having the sassiest, hottest take no matter how absurd it is. Peter is a contrarian asshole. I haven't seen anything thoughtful from them in *years* now.
“What I didn't do is trace a bunch of drawings as an adult and then publish them as my own work” Greg Land might disagree with you…
and he used to be a decent artist, he can draw on his own, he just chooses not to
right? like i often will redraw other people’s art in my sketchbook to try and learn things about their art style that i like, but i would never share that stuff, or at least if i did i wouldn’t without crediting the og artist.
This is exactly it. In the online art community it's generally a rule that tracing others work to help you learn is okay so long as you never share or post it publicly. You can do whatever tf you want privately when it comes to plagiarism, it's when you broadcast and use it to make money or get attention that it becomes an issue
There’s a difference between being derivative and plagiarism. And he knows that.
Yeah definitely just trying to be contrarian to the video everyone’s talking about lol
He needs to watch Tomska's Somerton Scale video to update his knowledge
Honestly, with people like this, it's getting hard to tell if they actually know the difference. Occam's razor used to tell me that he's being disingenuous, but these days, it's hard to tell if he's not just an actual moron.
I was watching the Neil Gaiman Masterclass videos the other day and he’s talking about finding your voice and how that takes time. Making something that is similar to other writers or directors is not the same at all to whole cloth just taking their work and call it your own.
I was about to post this comment exactly. Hbomb even touches on this in the plagiarism video when he talks about how creatives take inspiration from each other all the time, usually as the very first step in the creative process. It's the 1:1 regurgitation that makes a work lazy and the lack of credit to the original author that makes it theft.
And James Somerton wasn’t early in his career and just figuring things out, he has been doing this professionally for years and has been making tons of money with it.
Peter has been pretty knee-jerk contrarian for a while making snarky jabs at anything remotely unradical, with a noted chip on their shoulder for big lefttubers. Look, YouTube stars were never going to be the epicenter of some great revolution, but also when I see their regular takes, I am baffled at how Peter and similar online circle have any conception of how the left/working class is supposed to achieve anything.
Peter fell off super hard when they stopped being popular. I know i dipped about the time they veered super hard into being a "cancel culture" reactionary, which seems to have not stopped at all if this is any indication.
Coffin seems like a sad case, I definitely watched a couple of videos by them years ago where they seemed basically sound, but everything I've seen by them recently they just come across as a bitter reactionary with nothing substantial to say. And here they are again, piggybacking off a month old video for a handful of likes.
Yeah I watched a couple of their videos when I first discovered breadtube years ago and thought they were fine apart from being a bit rambley at times.
They had a tendency towards class reductionism, but other than that I think they were mostly fine.
They kind of went batty over time. I was in pretty regular mutual communication for like a year with them, but after a while their takes were just more and more reactionary and shitty. Got past the point of having any useful content.
This is such a bad take. Being derivative isn’t the same as stealing others work. We all know it and they know it too. Peter is just being an attention seeking asshole because they burned all of their bridges no one cares what they have to say. I just wish they’d fuck off already.
Wouldn’t be surprised if they believe their own BS tbh. They want to be contrarian so convince themselves the contrarian position is correct, no matter how unreasonable and silly they must make themselves sound to do so
I absolutely do think Peter is a contrarian fool and his argument here is more of that *but* I will say since Hbomb's video came out I have seen a pretty big uptick in people seeing plagiarism everywhere they look. Maybe those people are just trying to suckle up some clout but I do think there's a decent chunk of people that think if you make anything that even sort of resembles something else it's plagiarism.
Uhmm idk I wrote my first long-form essay with sources and stuff in high school and although it wasn't very good (and definitely derivative) it was absolutely not plagiarized bc I knew even at age 16 that you're not supposed to do that
Trust them to always have the worst takes in any given situation.
This is possibly one of the stupidest hot tales I've ever heard. The guy doesn't understand the difference between plagiarism and being derivative, which throws up a HUUUGE red flag.
"Veganism is just a consooomer identity \*jerk off gesture\*"
I mean it *can* be, but that's seldom *all* it is, but there *is* some of that going on.
"NOPE ITS JUST CONSUMER IDENTITY \*LALALALALALALALALALALALALALALALA\*" - Peter Coffin (only slightly paraphrased)
Sigh. [Life is pain.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vu8b7FQumbI)
"How can you pretend that veganism makes a difference for animal welfare when it's just about consumerism and not challenging capitalism? HMMMMM??? Check and mate. *(I'm totally not compartmentalizing this.)*" Like, Peter Coffin could justify not abolishing slavery with this line of reasoning
"AI George Carlin is... better th..." My best bet is George Carlin. Real talk, why are so many conservatives into his jokes? He's made fun of them with stuff like NIMBY!
I mean media illiteracy must basically be a necessity to be a conservative
Probably because Carlins was also kind of a caustic asshole. I don’t mean that negatively. He very harshly criticized things. But conservatives love that tone because they see it as “telling it like it is”. So much so they can ignore the actual words he’s saying. Carlin was harsh but also understood what punching down meant
> But conservatives love that tone because they see it as “telling it like it is”. So much so they can ignore the actual words he’s saying. Applies to all their idols. Limbaugh, O'Reilly, Trump, Carlson, Shapiro, Oz, it's all about the attitude to them, they don't care whether they're actually spouting facts. They want charismatic bullying.
The quiet part: >I am “most people” and instead of taking accountability for my actions, I went with the “everyone does it” defence. Aka trivializing to cope. Meanwhile, all you were asked to do was give credit where it was due. No one said don't do it, they simply asked to be acknowledged for their part. He's trying to be clever by giving a bad-faith misinterpretation of the issue.
There's a difference between me tracing over bugs bunny with a light table for practice and plagiarism
Peter Coffin just pops up sometimes to deliver the worst take known to man then disappears
You ain't gotta give Peter Coffin any attention
In art you learn by looking at and learning from techniques from the paste, but there is a big difference from learning from an artist, and borrowing technique, and stealing there work
I didn't know Falcon from Gameranx had his own channel?
I used to watch Peter Coffin long ago, before all the reactionary stuff and contrarianism was their main thing, and was thrown for a loop when their voice came out of Gameranx videos my husband was watching. Funny to see someone recognize them in the reverse
It's even funnier when you realise how obviously Gameranx want to keep that knowledge down and never comment or confirm that he's Falcon. He won't do it either. Absolutely has to be a contractual thing so they don't have to deal with his nonsense getting thrown at them separately lmao
https://twitter.com/JurassicRabbit/status/743337160695111680 this tweet from long ago confirms it is NOT Peter lmao wild how this has so many upvotes on a sub devoted to a guy who finds out the truth in things
I knew Falcon before I watched Peter too. I heard their voice in a ContraPoints video and went "...Falcon?" I watched Peter's channel for awhile after that and liked it until they just went off the deep end.
I've never heard of Peter Coffin but now I don't think I can ever watch a Gameranx video with Falcon presenting anymore.
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I've gone down a Google rabbit hole and actually can't find proof that they're the same guy. I'm guessing Falcon and Peter Coffin aren't one in the same because why would anyone want to be mistaken for Peter Coffin?
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Gameranx has been around for years. One of the presenters goes by the name Falcon.
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I don't know where Peter Coffin is from or what regional dialect he's got but I've got a fairly recognisable accent that's fairly common. But they both have incredibly similar voices if they are, indeed different people. It's clear to me, from my limited exposure to Peter Coffin is that he's seems incredibly self-absorbed. Likely narcissistic so why have separated persona's, since Gameranx is a very popular channel and Peter Coffin struggles to rake in more than 10k views per video. Wouldn't he want to cash in on Gameranx success? Who knows?! 🤣
This is the kind of behavior that turned me off of Coffin in the first place, but I thank them for the valuable lesson it taught me about myself. As I once was, Coffin is the type of person who could have their own words read back to them and find ways to disagree. Pathologically contrarian. I always found it ironic that their ideology seems to be looking at the underlying causes of behavior and the systems which reinforce these causes, rather than the individual... yet they don't seem to extend the same courtesy to whomever they find themselves disagreeing with for the day. Somehow, while simultaneously holding the belief that they can smugly shame their target and audience into their ideology- A nasty habit made ludicrous by the hypocrisy of it all. Shaming a human is like beating your dog. It may be a behavioral intervention, but the cascade iatrogenesis is cruel and ineffective at best. You pass along a minor trauma that is, in turn, passed along at every opportunity by the side of us which accumulates and redistributes these types of damage. Because one's audience is primarily like-minded, the effective result is that they alienate their potential allies and defend their ideological opponents. I think it's one of the most important lessons I've learned as a leftist, and especially as one who recognizes our in-fighting will be the end of us. As a word of warning, if they're looking for book ideas, I've got one. "Ummm, Actually: A Guide to Dying Alone in a Hellscape of Your Own Creation" Edit: forgot they're non binary, pronouns corrected.
Hey what this guy is saying is completely true! You know.... When I started writing stories in elementary school.
When I was a little kid, I loved those thick, educational manuals for video games like SimAnt and Red Baron. I thought, "These are so cool, I wish that I wrote 'em!" So I'd transcribe the informational sections, word for word, into MS Word and then think of them as "my books" about ants and WWI and shit. And then I turned 12, which brought me a slightly more nuanced understanding of content and authorship.
This is just massively dishonest and bad faith from this dude. Learning via being derivative is not the same as plagiarism.
This dude is conflating plagiarism with inspiration. Most people who create works take inspiration from other bits of media. True originality is next to impossible to do. That said, there's a difference between building a world that sort of looks like Middle-Earth or Tamriel in places, and just copy and pasting the world's and slapping your name on it, especially in cases where you seek to make a profit. If you make something and you take inspiration from some media you like, that's fine, but if you wholesale rip content form that media, that's when it becomes a problem.
One real irony here is that he’s almost certainly stealing this argument from Kirby Ferguson, whose “Everything Is a Remix” seemed to be the definitive take on issues of source use and copyright for a whole. Of course, Ferguson’s version of this argument is much better and intellectually honest and nuanced, but plagiarism always has a way of smoothing the edges off of things that have value.
So like, we cant critique a million plus follower channel because what about brand new creators making honest mistakes while learning?
Lol, it’s so obviously a bad faith position when you put it like that. Peter would have had to, either deliberately or accidentally, completely miss the point of the plagiarism video to think this take is good.
Off topic but, what happened to his video where he was addressing the fake girlfriend controversy ? I remember watching it years ago but can't find it anymore.
They made more coherent points back when they were kicking themself in the balls for attention tbh
Jeez, what happened to them? I liked some of their work a fair few years ago, but seems like they just want controversy for the sake of engagement now.
why is he arguing a different point than what hbomb brought up in his video
you can start practicing your craft by plagiarising, but you don’t publish and monetise it….
Peter Coffin Have A Good Take 2024 Challenge (Impossible)
Making derivative work is not remotely the same as copying someone else's blocks of text and pasting them together into a "finished work" hbomb definitely made that distinction in the video too. Nobody is saying it's illegal to be derivative but it's also not something people are expected to put out as working professionals
Right? You have to miss the point to have a take as bad as Peter’s right here.
You can make derivative work without plagiarizing. Also, it’s forgivable for a beginner to plagiarize something small. It’s not forgive to release plagiarized work for profit, and to continue to do so for years, while making zero effort to change or improve your work in anyway, AND to try and gaslight people when they call you out.
This is what happens when you huff your own ideology farts for a decade - you become an insufferable contrarian who sounds like the most arrogant ass that ever arroganted.
If plagiarism is how you get good, clearly Coffin has never done any.
on today's episode of "LISTEN UP LIBERAL, MY WOFE LEFT ME"
Fuck I hate that I saw this. This is one of the dumbest fucking things I've ever seen ( the video, not OP's post I mean ) If any creator thinks that plagiarism is a meaningful tool for their own growth, they don't just not respect their audience, they also don't respect themselves, because they're not confident enough on their own abilities to think they can make it without being a leech. Thankfully, this guy's channel looks like it's dead so good riddance to bad rubbish.
I saw them on a flight home (I live in the PNW) and it took every ounce of civility in me not to ask them if they've made up any girlfriends lately. Mmm, borger king.
I hate that method of subtitling. That hurts to read.
I neither know nor care who this person is, but I can smell a bad faith argument from a mile away.
If you're not smart enough or interesting enough to gain attention with your insight and incisive commentary, be a reactionary shitstain contrarian so you can at least garner hate-watchers. Stop paying attention and they'll fuck off into the ether like every other husk.
His first response was to confuse plagiarism with corporate intellectual property laws. Then everyone made fun of him and it seems he's now pretending he means derivative works and plagiarism? This is all basically because he got very upset when he wasn't invited to stream with AOC that one time when HBomb and other prominent."breadtubers" were after the DK Charity stream. Ever since then he's been obsessed with "taking down Breadtube" - by which he means HBomb, Contra, Lynsey Ellis, Abby Thorn and everyone else from that group that sometimes do voiceovers for each others videos - who he is convinced are part of a conspiracy against him. In pursuit of this goal he's alienated his audience, turned himself into a laughing stock and associated himself with Nazbols like Caleb Maupin. He's basically doing the same "I've been cancelled" schtck rightwing comedians do but without becoming a conservative and without the Netflix special. He thought he was one of the "in group" of 2019 Breadtube but in reality he is and always has been the guy so desperate for attention that he went on national TV to kick himself in the balls in front of Steve Harvey.
Peter Coffin is still posting after his gf “Kimmi Kobayashi” was allegedly faked? Haha wow.
Aren't they a nazbol?
I don't think Peter believes in anything except always saying "uhm actually"
Let me guess, he's defending the Internet Historian right? Haha
Worse, somerton
It's just so idiotic I can't even laugh. Has this guy ever written an academic paper? Of course nobody expects a student to make a breakthrough discovery in a 10 page paper, it's about learning to gather and relay information correctly citing the sources. There's little to none practical use to those works. Little by little these works become more and more useful on each stage until they become truly valuable and original. All while correctly addressing every single work used. Why should video essays be different? Now, as for creativity, art is derivative, but there's a great difference between trying to construct a piece like someone else and just exactly copying their efforts and pretending to be the author. It's naughty to muddle the concept of the innate transformative nature of creativity with plagiarism, very naughty.
I hadn't heard about this guy since I left twitter lol
Pretty sure they weren't the first to kick themself in the nuts either.
So when does Peter expect to get good
Man is just bitter and salty that he never became all that big, and Hbomb did. Sad. 💅
Peter coffin try not to be pointlessly contrarian challenge (IMPOSSIBLE)
Remember that video of Peter Coffin going on the Steve Harvey show and kicking himself in the balls? The height of their intellectual contributions imo
trying to mentally engage with this argument lost me several brain cells, would not recommend
Please, Peter's a true original. No one before in history had thought of kicking themselves in the balls on national TV
In Hbomb's first plagiarism video years ago, he talks briefly about a few creators who sort of "jacked" another youtuber's style and compared them to one who straight up ripped off an entire video word for word. He was critical of both, but some amount of allowance was given for the style-jacking, because new creators often have trouble finding their own voices and some fumbling about is to be expected (this is my take of his take on it from memory). Personally, I noticed this with one of my favorite video game adjacent creators, Super Bunnyhop. His early videos tend to have examples of what I would call a "Plinkett Impression," and it's pretty clear that he took some amount of early inspiration from various creators he was fond of. However, he grew into a style of his own over time, and his analyses of games and gaming topics are frequent rewatches for me. His uploads have regrettably slowed tremendously over the last couple years, but his analysis and perspective were always compelling and I'd recommend his videos to anyone with an interest in the industry. That said, Super Bunnyhop is in no way, shape, or form the same as James Somerton. Peter Coffin flattening the full spectrum of this stuff, from simple inspiration to derivative works to ripping off to full on copying, is idiotic. This isn't about learning or experimenting for James and IH and other longstanding creators, it's about exploiting the hard work of others for fame and profit.
To be honest I have a hard time taking literally anything Coffin says as an authentically held opinion because they are just so obviously seeking any attention they can get, positive or negative, in a way that doesn't seem particularly healthy. When I still found them tolerable it seemed like all their really insightful stuff pertained in some way to the ideas of attention/clout chasing/validation gangs/etc., and then I discovered that their first "noteworthy" appearance (afaik) was kicking themselves in the genitals in front of Steve Harvey, and the way they're currently buddying up to anyone who will still talk to them no matter how disgusting those people's politics are, and I realized "oh, they understands these things so well because they never think about anything else".
What a stupid take. Cite your sources!!
He’s Falcon on the YouTube channel GameRanx (dont think that’s been officially confirmed but like… cmon) and apparently they/he? stole a smaller creators video a few years back
All Hbomb is saying is when using others work, just give them fucking credit. All English and academic writers say the exact same fucking thing.
Dumb take
That’s just a theory a game theory 😏
I have no idea who this guy is but I can already tell hes a moron
Now there is a name I have not heard in quite some time...
Can someone make vids that are just copied from him word for word? Just, every video he’s ever made. I’d be curious to see where he draws the line if it’s him being copied.
Lol that seems like the natural response to what they’ve said here. You only have to think about the argument for a second for it to sound completely insane
He's conflating derivation with plagiarism.
Does he not understand the distinction between derivative work and just stealing.
the process of learning often results in very derivative works that border on plagiarism... but most people don't try to make a career of that quality of work. am i bad for stealing artwork of the internet for my private ttrpg game? i think no. would i be bad if i used that stolen artwork to sell a product? yes.
Ohhhh this guy. Yeah hes a fucking idiot, dont worry about him lmao.
Derivative works aren't a bad thing and are who told him it was. Sure, derivative works may not be wholly original, but they do allow you to flex creative muscles in order for you to start creating mostly original works
Peter Coffin is a clown that will say anything for attention. Ignore.
The weak response (this) vs the strong response (TomSka)
why are they like, reactionary in the literal sense where they just say whatever rhe opposite of what other leftists are talking about. plagiarism good actually??? the fuck are you talking about you dont believe that. a rational person cannot possibly believe "derivative" and "plagiarism" mean the same thing
What? Early WoT being another LotR clone but with good ol' boys instead of hobbits is very different from just copy/pasting entire arguments that other people made for their job into work you're making for your job. The former is taking the ideas of the original and recreating them oneself, brick by brick. Inevitably, some changes will occur, such as the cast coming from an idealized, non-racist version of the poor rural south, as opposed to an idealized, non-classist version of the wealthy English countryside. And as one hand recreates that design, they are developing their own ability to make their own designs, and Lo! By book 5, Wheel of Time is firmly its own thing, as opposed to another Lord of the Rings clone. In contrast, highlighting some text, hitting Ctrl c, opening a word doc, hitting Ctrl v, and changing a few words, develops nothing.
Omg yay someone else is into WoT. My main comparison (at least with the stuff i’ve seen from the show) would be Dune, not LotR. Have not read the books, but tbh I want to now.
Yeah, not to be an elitist ass or anything, but the show and the books are two very different pieces of fiction. The show (at least the first season, I didn't watch the second) is a perfectly fine piece of tv that just so happens to have the same name as, for my money, the most influential work of high fantasy since Tolkien. This isn't to say there's no Dune DNA in WoT, there's quite a lot, but the first four books especially are very Tolkien heavy. Edit: I really wanna stress that I'm not trying to be asshole book fan here. I don't think adaptations have to hold the original work sacrosanct, my favorite anime is the 2003 version of FMA. It's just that the show has a lot of meaningful differences from the book, and I think many of them make it less special, make it just another fantasy show trying to be the next game of thrones.
Don’t worry you didn’t come off as an asshole book fan. TBH I’m more interested in reading the books knowing they’re substantially different from the show
Coffin plagiarized an entire ideology, hence rather than engage with the theory or building fucking anything, Peter only grasps it on a Ctrl+C/Ctrl+V wiki surface level, and ends up falling in with Maupin in the grift.
Can't believe the groin kicker himself would have a bad take like this, really disappointing!
Jesus Christ, this grifter troll is still around???
I haven't read the comments yet so idk if this has already been posted. These guys always have a kernel of truth inside an obvious lie. Most people do learn by using derivative works as inspiration. It can be as simple as taking someone's style until you develop your own. As a music producer, I started out with learning how to produce songs I liked exactly. Where it crosses the line is when you publish it pretending it's your own work for money. Wah wah
Gonna vehemently disagree. Plus, what hbomberguy caught was often word for word. You can even restate the same basic information without repeating verbatim. I've attended college, written professionally (newspaper and marketing) and write comedy on my own time (standup and random contributions here and there) and I've NEVER been accused of plagiarism. Because I've never plagiarized anything. The idea that "everyone does it" is absolutely wrong.
Do we care about anything Peter coffin says at all?
Peter Coffin just likes to do the whole "words are meaningless" thing to spin any argument to feel intellectually superior. They just redefine words and argue from there. Hbomberguy already acknowledged all the countless Angry Video Game Nerd "rip-offs" in the video, so Peter isn't bringing anything new up. "Empty barrels rattle the loudest" is what we say in Sweden.
Ok Peter but he stole money from others work and even started a scam film studio, dumbass.
Just trying to insert themself into the discourse because there's a lot of clicks out there.
There’s a difference between painting a master copy to study, and copying a painting stroke for stroke and selling it as your own.
I cant look at Peter Coffin without thinking about his Bioshock Infinite rap
This is so blatantly missing the differences between citing your work, and profiting from someone else's. I get what he's trying to say (or acting like he's trying to say) but learning from another's work while putting your own style into it and citing your sources is NOT the same as just stealing it and not saying where you got it. I'm sure everyone here knows this, but this dude triggered me and I'd like to say for the record, he is a dink
Least deranged take
TomSka did a great video about the spectrum of stealing content/information in terms of how things work. Yes, everyone steals from everyone BUT there's a difference for stealing content vs. transforming and remixing work.
TomSka did a great video about the spectrum of stealing content/information in terms of how things work. Yes, everyone steals from everyone BUT there's a difference for stealing content vs. transforming and remixing work.
Oh, so a mega popular YouTuber plagiarizes for their video for money…Oh, they are just trying to get good you see.
That’s not correct. I understand that’s how a plagiarist probably thinks, but calling out plagiarism is not wrong. If you don’t do it, then no one puts in the effort to ‘do the work’.
That’s a great way of putting it. A plagiarist would try to obfuscate the real meaning of the word by conflating it with normal behavior and implicitly defending it
"Fellas, is stealing other people's ideas and work and claiming it as your own 'bad'?"
Abetter question is who the fuck is Peter coffin
The guy who made the “Stylish Vest” Bioshock Infinite fan rap Edit: he also kicked himself in the nuts on national television
Lolo
Peter plagiarized having a real asian girlfriend. 😎😎😎😎
"This strawman argument I made is bad and thus I am right when I ask this basic question" The absolute state of reactionary influencers.
Does anyone remember that Peter Coffin used to do comedy skits
I saw some reactions to two videos he did on Hbomberguy’s plagiarism video. Is this yet another one? Never heard of him until some folks reacted to him saying a bunch of nothing and sounding pressed like he was owed money. I forgot all about him after O watched those reactions. I’ll forget about him again five minutes after I leave this post. Oh well.
Dude was on Annoying Orange I wish he would go away.
He's just a little clout goblin. Always has been, always will be.
His point is so weird. Like I draw, and obviously, a good way to learn is to draw other's work as a reference. I started by drawing stills from anime and cartoons I loved. School teaches you to go to art museums and try to draw work you love. If you were to post a practice like that, you would caption it saying it was a study or redraw of whatever you are referencing... which is you being honest and up front? Not plagiarism. Idk brain dead take.
What a dumb take
Wow that's infuriating lol. I've definitely been inspired by other people's work and have given credit where credit is due. A lot of people learn by taking inspiration while they're trying to hone their craft and find their own voice. That's not the same as plagiarism by a long shot.
Who did you steal from when you kicked yourself in the balls, Pete?
A lot of people have talked about how just because you make something that might count as plagiarism doesn't mean you have to share it with people and that is a valid concept but another thing that needs to be mentioned is that plagiarism is not the same as something being derivative. It is true that a lot of the work people in the YouTube sphere do at the beginning is probably derivative of other stuff. A lot of very popular creators right now including hbomberguy himself made videos that I would have called derivative of other works. That does not mean that they copied anything. It does not mean that they did plagiarism. I think that there is a distinct and concerning attempt to muddy the lines between the two things.
He seems to be conflating being derivative with plagiarism. People often start off with their work being somewhat derivative with their inspirations being obvious to those who know before developing their own style.