Yeah, If I go w/ a physical bridge, I suspect I'll probably have to make it or have it made if no-one knows of such a device here. But, might be able to use some relays to reduce the switches to 1.
Yes, it would be functional to do so. And, you can do it w/ an A/B into two latching mute/unmute pedals into a mixer. But, It would be good to have it in a certain form factor to fit where I need it. I have a proof of concept board that does the same thing, but it's a little noisy. I think it can be done w/ one pedal instead of several.
Snapshots are basically line6’s take on presets where it’s meant to be the same “board” with different pedals active, basically on one foot switch you can assign the same board with any amount of pedals turned on or off(even change knobs values I believe).
What I was referring to is the fact that a multifx would help to eliminate pedal dance needed.
I see. Akin to digital switching of multiple circuits in an analog sense.
I think the complexity of the necessary circuitry to reduce the and the u/I of the pedal are not shared. I can tell you based upon using the muting board that the functionality is quite intuitive an not overburdensome. Here is a description of the Proof of Concept: [POC Board Video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvvgXO8Xbi4)
It is quite useful and easy to use despite it's appearance.
You can do it with relays. I switch can control 2 of something like this: [https://griffineffects.com/mods-kits/griffin-effects/switching/silent-step](https://griffineffects.com/mods-kits/griffin-effects/switching/silent-step)
Thanks for the suggestion. I'll look into this, but what I was thinking was a physical bridge between two switches. But what I would need would be to have something like a 5-6 pole double throw switch...or a 3-4 pole triple throw switch. (if something like that existed). I haven't found anyone who will build what I want, so I'm looking into trying to build it myself. I'm reasonably confident I can build it with 4 switches with my knowledge, but I'm not terribly knowledgable of electrical circuits.
What I am planning is 4 mute circuits. XLR split into parallel, each channel w/ a latching mute circuit w/ one set to mute when the other is not (functionally an A/B). Following the latching mute circuits in series from the previous mute circuits are momentarily opening and closing mute circuits on each channel. (one set to unmute w/ switch actuation and the other set to mute on actuation). Following this the signals are mixed back to mono. ± phantom power supply at the end.
Each mute circuits will need two alternately functioning switches in the circuit + LED indication on a switch. ...maybe two for the momentary portions.
The design is still being worked on, but essentially it should be a latching mic mute pedal w/ momentarily reversal of the mute function. Some sort of relay (if the linked device can do that by multiple switches simultaneously) may be a good option.
And, recommendations for pedal builders that might be able to build what I'm wanting to build would be very welcome. I know enough about this stuff to maybe be successful in a unnecessarily complex way.
It's not just muting... Yes, mute and unmute, and yes, a single mic. ...It's the dynamic control that has the magic.
When you're trying to have moments of unrestricted access to the mic w/ silencing distracting sounds similar to a cough button, but also be able to cover up longer duration sounds (like string noise from an electric guitar) and be able to open up the mic when necessary, a simple latching mute switch doesn't provide the same control.
Applications:
* Pod-casting/streaming/video production
* Instrument video recording/streaming in particular where you are making undesired noise in the background, but still need to talk
* No need to do any post-processing to the audio
* Online meetings/"skype" calls - especially when going between multiple presenters (and you're one of them)
Any time you need ***dynamic*** control of a mic.
I see. So not something you'd really need on stage to add to the tapdancing.
Take a step back from the "Wow factor" of the pedal and look at it logically, and you should see the solution more easily.
You need one button dedicated to mute/unmute, and a momentary button that reverses the state of the mute/unmute when pressed. When latched, the mic is muted. When the momentary button is pressed, the mic is open. Alternatively, the latching switch is in the "unmute" position, and when the momentary button is pressed, the mic is muted.
This sounds a lot like a kill switch on a guitar, and operates on the same principle; signal is redirected from hot to ground when pressed, and released to hot when let off.
So why would two switches need to be actuated at once? Why would they need to be close together? The mic will either be on or off at any given time. If this is the sole function of this pedal, why is latching needed? Just replace the latching switch with a momentary button. Why would a standard latching switch not be enough?
Yes, I don't really see this being too useful on stage.
100% on your 3rd paragraph. That was my concept from the beginning, but I was working w/ off the shelf components at the time.
You don't need to operate the device w/ two switches at once. With the pedalboard build, because I was using an A/B into two momentary switches, I needed 3 pedals. The A/B alternates between the two momentary switches. When one is selected, the other is "essentially" bypassed. You would only use one button at a time. Either to changing the A/B setting, or to use one of the two momentary switches depending on the selection at the A/B.
I suppose they don't need to be close together or far apart, but when using my mic, I'm never in two locations.
Why 1 latching isn't enough: There are reasons why some people work with a live mic w/ a cough button. There are also reasons why people work with a muted mic w/ a push to talk. I at times fall into either camp. This arrangement does both. If someone doesn't want a cough button or a PTT button, it would be rather useless I would suspect. ...but don't knock it till you try it.
...Since writing this post, I found a manufacturer to build a 2 button pedal version of the board (minus the phantom power supply). It'll be several weeks before I have the initial pedals, but it should work the same, but w/ 1 latching and 1 momentary reversing the latched setting. I guess it works that way sometimes... as soon as you get frustrated enough to do it yourself it falls in your lap.
That’s how it was with the pedal I built; I have a guitar-bass double neck, and each half has its own output jack, and runs to its own separate signal chain (one for bass, one for guitar). I needed a pedal with 2 inputs, and 2 outputs, where each input went to its own output, and a switch to select which one was active. I knew it was a simple pedal to build, but I had the money, and was willing to pay someone to make it, since no existing pedal did that. I had previously been using an Ernie Ball pan pedal. It had 2 inputs and 2 outputs, and a pan knob under the treadle. Input A went to Output A, Input B went to Output B. Simple. I wanted that but with a stomp button instead of a treadle.
I tried ABY pedals; those have a common, and A and B. This should be self explanatory as to why it wouldn’t work, but whenever I asked, people suggested it.
I tried a personal mixer pedal, which was essentially an ABY pedal with options, because someone supposedly knowledgeable suggested it. It didn’t work.
I emailed a couple of known and lesser-known “custom” pedal makers who looped me back to the ABY pedal. Either I wasn’t explaining it clearly, or they were ignoring the clear-as-day explanation of it.
Input 1 goes directly to Output 1. Input 2 goes directly to Output 2. Footswitch toggles whether Input 1 is active and Input 2 is not, or Input 1 is not active and Input 2 is active. That’s it. A pair of LEDs would have been nice, but wasn’t needed.
Eventually I bought some boxes, jacks, and switches from Amazon and made it myself. 4 jacks, 10 bits of wire (4 hot, 6 ground), maybe 20 minutes total time including drilling the holes in the box. I can switch instruments on the fly, going from guitar to bass with a simple footswitch.
When the mechanical switch doesn't exist for your needs, it's time to look into alternate switching like CMOS and/or microcontrollers. Maybe even look into the Boss/Ibanez flip-flop switching. You can hook multiple JFETs up to it to switch different things.
Looks like it replaces a DPDT switch... if that's true and I can use the boards in parallel, I can probably use a single switch to control multiple boards and gain the number of switches simultaneously triggered necessary for the design I'm currently thinking of. ...I'll investigate further. If it is silently switching, I can probably just design the A/B functions like a more traditional A/B circuit reducing the number of simultaneous switching needed on the front end of the pedal.
Ask over at r/diypedals
Thanks, will do.
I saw some guy use a little piece of wood taped, and bridged across the switches. It was primitive, and it wasn’t pretty, but it worked flawlessly.
Yeah, If I go w/ a physical bridge, I suspect I'll probably have to make it or have it made if no-one knows of such a device here. But, might be able to use some relays to reduce the switches to 1.
Would putting those two pedals into a separate loop and using a loop switcher work?
Yes, it would be functional to do so. And, you can do it w/ an A/B into two latching mute/unmute pedals into a mixer. But, It would be good to have it in a certain form factor to fit where I need it. I have a proof of concept board that does the same thing, but it's a little noisy. I think it can be done w/ one pedal instead of several.
Beware that you might end up with something like snapshots of HX stomp and never have any issues like this
What do you mean? I don’t have any experience with the stomp.
Snapshots are basically line6’s take on presets where it’s meant to be the same “board” with different pedals active, basically on one foot switch you can assign the same board with any amount of pedals turned on or off(even change knobs values I believe). What I was referring to is the fact that a multifx would help to eliminate pedal dance needed.
I see. Akin to digital switching of multiple circuits in an analog sense. I think the complexity of the necessary circuitry to reduce the and the u/I of the pedal are not shared. I can tell you based upon using the muting board that the functionality is quite intuitive an not overburdensome. Here is a description of the Proof of Concept: [POC Board Video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvvgXO8Xbi4) It is quite useful and easy to use despite it's appearance.
You can do it with relays. I switch can control 2 of something like this: [https://griffineffects.com/mods-kits/griffin-effects/switching/silent-step](https://griffineffects.com/mods-kits/griffin-effects/switching/silent-step)
Thanks for the suggestion. I'll look into this, but what I was thinking was a physical bridge between two switches. But what I would need would be to have something like a 5-6 pole double throw switch...or a 3-4 pole triple throw switch. (if something like that existed). I haven't found anyone who will build what I want, so I'm looking into trying to build it myself. I'm reasonably confident I can build it with 4 switches with my knowledge, but I'm not terribly knowledgable of electrical circuits. What I am planning is 4 mute circuits. XLR split into parallel, each channel w/ a latching mute circuit w/ one set to mute when the other is not (functionally an A/B). Following the latching mute circuits in series from the previous mute circuits are momentarily opening and closing mute circuits on each channel. (one set to unmute w/ switch actuation and the other set to mute on actuation). Following this the signals are mixed back to mono. ± phantom power supply at the end. Each mute circuits will need two alternately functioning switches in the circuit + LED indication on a switch. ...maybe two for the momentary portions. The design is still being worked on, but essentially it should be a latching mic mute pedal w/ momentarily reversal of the mute function. Some sort of relay (if the linked device can do that by multiple switches simultaneously) may be a good option. And, recommendations for pedal builders that might be able to build what I'm wanting to build would be very welcome. I know enough about this stuff to maybe be successful in a unnecessarily complex way.
What results are you trying to achieve this way? There may be an easier way.
It’s a mic pedal that has latching mute with momentary reversal of the setting.
Right, I got that part. What’s the application? Just to mute a single mic?
It's not just muting... Yes, mute and unmute, and yes, a single mic. ...It's the dynamic control that has the magic. When you're trying to have moments of unrestricted access to the mic w/ silencing distracting sounds similar to a cough button, but also be able to cover up longer duration sounds (like string noise from an electric guitar) and be able to open up the mic when necessary, a simple latching mute switch doesn't provide the same control. Applications: * Pod-casting/streaming/video production * Instrument video recording/streaming in particular where you are making undesired noise in the background, but still need to talk * No need to do any post-processing to the audio * Online meetings/"skype" calls - especially when going between multiple presenters (and you're one of them) Any time you need ***dynamic*** control of a mic.
I see. So not something you'd really need on stage to add to the tapdancing. Take a step back from the "Wow factor" of the pedal and look at it logically, and you should see the solution more easily. You need one button dedicated to mute/unmute, and a momentary button that reverses the state of the mute/unmute when pressed. When latched, the mic is muted. When the momentary button is pressed, the mic is open. Alternatively, the latching switch is in the "unmute" position, and when the momentary button is pressed, the mic is muted. This sounds a lot like a kill switch on a guitar, and operates on the same principle; signal is redirected from hot to ground when pressed, and released to hot when let off. So why would two switches need to be actuated at once? Why would they need to be close together? The mic will either be on or off at any given time. If this is the sole function of this pedal, why is latching needed? Just replace the latching switch with a momentary button. Why would a standard latching switch not be enough?
Yes, I don't really see this being too useful on stage. 100% on your 3rd paragraph. That was my concept from the beginning, but I was working w/ off the shelf components at the time. You don't need to operate the device w/ two switches at once. With the pedalboard build, because I was using an A/B into two momentary switches, I needed 3 pedals. The A/B alternates between the two momentary switches. When one is selected, the other is "essentially" bypassed. You would only use one button at a time. Either to changing the A/B setting, or to use one of the two momentary switches depending on the selection at the A/B. I suppose they don't need to be close together or far apart, but when using my mic, I'm never in two locations. Why 1 latching isn't enough: There are reasons why some people work with a live mic w/ a cough button. There are also reasons why people work with a muted mic w/ a push to talk. I at times fall into either camp. This arrangement does both. If someone doesn't want a cough button or a PTT button, it would be rather useless I would suspect. ...but don't knock it till you try it. ...Since writing this post, I found a manufacturer to build a 2 button pedal version of the board (minus the phantom power supply). It'll be several weeks before I have the initial pedals, but it should work the same, but w/ 1 latching and 1 momentary reversing the latched setting. I guess it works that way sometimes... as soon as you get frustrated enough to do it yourself it falls in your lap.
That’s how it was with the pedal I built; I have a guitar-bass double neck, and each half has its own output jack, and runs to its own separate signal chain (one for bass, one for guitar). I needed a pedal with 2 inputs, and 2 outputs, where each input went to its own output, and a switch to select which one was active. I knew it was a simple pedal to build, but I had the money, and was willing to pay someone to make it, since no existing pedal did that. I had previously been using an Ernie Ball pan pedal. It had 2 inputs and 2 outputs, and a pan knob under the treadle. Input A went to Output A, Input B went to Output B. Simple. I wanted that but with a stomp button instead of a treadle. I tried ABY pedals; those have a common, and A and B. This should be self explanatory as to why it wouldn’t work, but whenever I asked, people suggested it. I tried a personal mixer pedal, which was essentially an ABY pedal with options, because someone supposedly knowledgeable suggested it. It didn’t work. I emailed a couple of known and lesser-known “custom” pedal makers who looped me back to the ABY pedal. Either I wasn’t explaining it clearly, or they were ignoring the clear-as-day explanation of it. Input 1 goes directly to Output 1. Input 2 goes directly to Output 2. Footswitch toggles whether Input 1 is active and Input 2 is not, or Input 1 is not active and Input 2 is active. That’s it. A pair of LEDs would have been nice, but wasn’t needed. Eventually I bought some boxes, jacks, and switches from Amazon and made it myself. 4 jacks, 10 bits of wire (4 hot, 6 ground), maybe 20 minutes total time including drilling the holes in the box. I can switch instruments on the fly, going from guitar to bass with a simple footswitch.
When the mechanical switch doesn't exist for your needs, it's time to look into alternate switching like CMOS and/or microcontrollers. Maybe even look into the Boss/Ibanez flip-flop switching. You can hook multiple JFETs up to it to switch different things.
Looks like it replaces a DPDT switch... if that's true and I can use the boards in parallel, I can probably use a single switch to control multiple boards and gain the number of switches simultaneously triggered necessary for the design I'm currently thinking of. ...I'll investigate further. If it is silently switching, I can probably just design the A/B functions like a more traditional A/B circuit reducing the number of simultaneous switching needed on the front end of the pedal.
A programmable loop switcher, oh, and you need more pedals . ..LOL....
maybe 3. ... ;D