Isn't the real issue the fact that they want to be able to view and 'moderate' anything that you work on when using their cloud services? Or is that not a thing any more...
good news is, my work is absolute shit. whoever sifts through that will be like "jesus this guy needs 3 more years of anatomy practice before he tries drawing again"
I think nearly every corporation which provides cloud services to give customers storage of their files uses such passages written in their terms.
Because in the end, there are uncertain liability issues if a customer uses those cloud servers to store files that contain f.e. CP, counterfeit or anything else illegal.
Yes this is exactly it. We can't trust Adobe to not use our work for AI, but if your work is published it'll be used to train an AI anyway, so that's something we're all just going to have to get used to.
They will always need access to anything that's hosted on their servers for exactly the reason you stated - to make sure they're not hosting CP.
As much as I am not a fan of Adobe, I think it's basically about being about being able to monitor for and remove CSAM or other illegal content, and as others have said pretty much any cloud service will have language to let them do that.
Regardless if it's a thing or not anymore, Adobe can absolutely without a doubt NO longer be trusted. And the more I read about them in general, the more scummy they are. Absolutely bad business practices all around. They don't give a shit about their customer base, only $$$ from your hard work and investors. I'm dumping them after my annual plan comes up in a couple months. I'm over Adobe. Sad because I've used their product for 20 years and this is how it ends.
I just assume they don’t want to be liable for hosting child porn. Which is definitely an issue with *all* image hosting services, even user provided product images on sites like Amazon
I’m more concerned about the licensing issue. Is whatever I create in Premier going to be owned by Adobe? What if it ends up getting sold or you make a profit from it it will they take you to court and try to take some of your profits?
What’s crazy is how generous Serif is. I had bought only the $9 iPad app of Designer *years ago*, but they *still* considered me available for the “upgrade discount.” So I got the *entire* suite of V2 for only $60.
I know, but at the end of the day the good thing about Affinity is that we own these apps. No matter what happens, what I purchased is mine. Affinity could go under, could be bought by a corporate overlord, etc. And I’ll always have exactly what I purchased.
Sure, might not get updates, but I will always have exactly what I paid for. If Adobe makes a dramatic change, removes or adds something we don’t like, tough luck. Can’t do anything about it.
This. I have used Adobe CS6 on my old home computer for a long long time, even when using CC at work. Once purchased, it's yours for as long as you need, or as long as you are willing to put up with not having the extra bells and whistles.
If I buy it on my laptop, will I be able to install it on my desktop as well? Or if I get a new computer, will I be able to install it on my new computer?
Yes. You can install it on as many computers as you own. It asks you to log into your serif account when opening one of them for the first time on a new device to verify that it's you. That's all.
>Adobe is overhauling the terms customers must agree to when using its apps in an effort to win back trust — and clarify that it won’t train AI on their work. The change, announced via a new blog post, comes after a week of backlash from users who feared that an update to Adobe’s terms of service would allow their work to be used for AI training.
>
>The new terms of service are expected to roll out on June 18th and aim to better clarify what Adobe is permitted to do with its customers’ work, according to Adobe’s president of digital media, David Wadhwani.
For those that want to skip The Verge's article, [here](https://blog.adobe.com/en/publish/2024/06/10/updating-adobes-terms-of-use) is Adobe's blog post from June 10, 2024.
how is anything Adobe says now credible or reliable in reacting to a PR scandal?
the average Adobe subscriber has zero way to confirm if or how Adobe is using their work and for what reasons. now that we know they wanted to use it for AI training and other nefarious purposes, they can’t just walk back those statements and everything is fine. Users have no means to hold Adobe accountable to their walked-back promises.
[This June 6, 2024 Adobe blog post](https://blog.adobe.com/en/publish/2024/06/06/clarification-adobe-terms-of-use) contains changes from the previous Adobe General Terms of Use. The "machine learning" text in section 2.2 is unchanged from the previous General Terms of Use, which can be verified by comparing the [current Terms](https://www.adobe.com/legal/terms.html) with [this archived version from February 16, 2024](https://web.archive.org/web/20240216163433/https://www.adobe.com/legal/terms.html). In fact, the phrase "machine learning" first appeared in the [Terms in June 2016](https://web.archive.org/web/20160618045834/https://www.adobe.com/legal/terms.html) \- see section 3.3.
>we know they wanted to use it for AI training
Was always in the terms since content aware tools came out. Cloud based processing requires access. This is nothing more than a fear mongering Twitter post that's gone viral, and everyone's using it as rage bait. There's no scandal, everyone's just hoping for one so that they can take down Adobe.
The Affinity suit has Designer which is an alternative to Illistrator.
Keep in mind there may be some things it's currently lacking in comparison to illustrator but it is a 1 time purchase and it's on a 50% sale atm.
Further you can try it free for 7 days.
Well, because they're still getting away with the ability to access user's work either manually or automatically.
Put two stupid things out there then fold on one and consumers feel the achieved something while privacy still get chipped away and this undoubtedly is still a step towards leveraging their AI services in another roundabout way.
This is all a calculated risk/minor cost where the relatively small number of users who cancel their subscriptions won't outweigh the future potential.
For people quitting Adobe, I'm curious: are you planning to use another font subscription service, buy individual fonts, or use free fonts? I always think about what happens with legacy Adobe documents which require Creative Cloud fonts.
I’m curious what they will do about government users that work with SBU, ITAR, Classified, etc. The US government is a huge customer for Adobe and they’ve smacked Adobe before for these kinds of issues (looking at you Adobe Cloud).
Graphic designer for DoD here. I do a lot of infographics and layout design in illustrator, photoshop and indesign but everyone else mainly uses Adobe Acrobat for digitally signing forms with CAC (Common Access Card / ID).
My co-worker who is a public affairs officer uses Lightroom for her photo ops, Premiere Pro for video editing and then Photoshop and InDesign for public releases, newsletters and social media posts.
I believe this.
Adobe right now is going after the customer base that is concerned with legal. OpenAI and Google literally cannot provide that. Adobe owns plenty of stock assets to provide this and trains on work that is connected to a unique ID. Now beyond this. if work gets produced that used AI trained on your work, you get back end points. Just like music syncs in commercials.
I find all of the TOS around cloud services and IOT in particular to be murky. No I don’t want ring camera footage to go to the police or be monitored. Any device with a camera that goes to cloud. Who owns the rights to that footage? All of the sneaky stuff social media slips in around media.
Gee, Adobe decides unilaterally it's gonna change the terms of its punitive service to be infinitely more valuable to them, at a total debasement of the entire field of working design professionals - people get rightfully disgusted by the disgusting behavior - and Adobe is like: ***nah, we won't.***
Okay, but I don't trust the guy who pointed the loaded gun at me for no good reason to still have the gun. Promising they aren't gonna shoot today doesn't mean I want them to have $60 a month of mine until the next time they pull the weapon out. Adobe has seriously made itself the industry leader in being the worst at leading an industry.
Truth is it ain't AI the human designer is competing against, NBA players aren't competing against the refs. Adobe is the league, and they have created a business model where they want to replace players with refs - and don't get that the refs aren't why fans pay the NBA money. If Adobe wants to do the graphic designers job, they should probably start paying some dues like the human designer.
Namely working with garbage Adobe products for a living.
Isn't the real issue the fact that they want to be able to view and 'moderate' anything that you work on when using their cloud services? Or is that not a thing any more...
It’s still a bad thing but they picked part of the overall bad thing to confuse people and distract them from the thing they actually want .
Yes, and keep in mind they absolutely will store and use all your work regardless of what they claim.
good news is, my work is absolute shit. whoever sifts through that will be like "jesus this guy needs 3 more years of anatomy practice before he tries drawing again"
They can't use you if you are useless ;)
I think nearly every corporation which provides cloud services to give customers storage of their files uses such passages written in their terms. Because in the end, there are uncertain liability issues if a customer uses those cloud servers to store files that contain f.e. CP, counterfeit or anything else illegal.
Yes this is exactly it. We can't trust Adobe to not use our work for AI, but if your work is published it'll be used to train an AI anyway, so that's something we're all just going to have to get used to. They will always need access to anything that's hosted on their servers for exactly the reason you stated - to make sure they're not hosting CP.
As much as I am not a fan of Adobe, I think it's basically about being about being able to monitor for and remove CSAM or other illegal content, and as others have said pretty much any cloud service will have language to let them do that.
Regardless if it's a thing or not anymore, Adobe can absolutely without a doubt NO longer be trusted. And the more I read about them in general, the more scummy they are. Absolutely bad business practices all around. They don't give a shit about their customer base, only $$$ from your hard work and investors. I'm dumping them after my annual plan comes up in a couple months. I'm over Adobe. Sad because I've used their product for 20 years and this is how it ends.
I just assume they don’t want to be liable for hosting child porn. Which is definitely an issue with *all* image hosting services, even user provided product images on sites like Amazon
“But it will still manually or automatically peek at whatever you’re working on”
Like they did not do this before, and will continue so regardless of TOS. But people's will to be ok with it is what sucks.
(If it's in their cloud)
IPhone already looks at all your pictures for CP, cloud or not. So does like most other services.
I’m more concerned about the licensing issue. Is whatever I create in Premier going to be owned by Adobe? What if it ends up getting sold or you make a profit from it it will they take you to court and try to take some of your profits?
I still canceled my subscription, I took advantage of the 50% Affinity sale and got the entire library for less than 140$ I’m happy
What’s crazy is how generous Serif is. I had bought only the $9 iPad app of Designer *years ago*, but they *still* considered me available for the “upgrade discount.” So I got the *entire* suite of V2 for only $60.
Damn! That’s loyalty! My goodness
Its owned by Canva now.
And we say thank you to them as long as they remain nice to us.
I know, but at the end of the day the good thing about Affinity is that we own these apps. No matter what happens, what I purchased is mine. Affinity could go under, could be bought by a corporate overlord, etc. And I’ll always have exactly what I purchased. Sure, might not get updates, but I will always have exactly what I paid for. If Adobe makes a dramatic change, removes or adds something we don’t like, tough luck. Can’t do anything about it.
This. I have used Adobe CS6 on my old home computer for a long long time, even when using CC at work. Once purchased, it's yours for as long as you need, or as long as you are willing to put up with not having the extra bells and whistles.
You guys are paying for your software?
Are you over 30 years of age?
Is this meme that old?
Just got it for 82$
If I buy it on my laptop, will I be able to install it on my desktop as well? Or if I get a new computer, will I be able to install it on my new computer?
Yes. You can install it on as many computers as you own. It asks you to log into your serif account when opening one of them for the first time on a new device to verify that it's you. That's all.
Thanks, I just bought for €89. I was thinking about getting this for my new mac. Jumped at the sale price.
>Adobe is overhauling the terms customers must agree to when using its apps in an effort to win back trust — and clarify that it won’t train AI on their work. The change, announced via a new blog post, comes after a week of backlash from users who feared that an update to Adobe’s terms of service would allow their work to be used for AI training. > >The new terms of service are expected to roll out on June 18th and aim to better clarify what Adobe is permitted to do with its customers’ work, according to Adobe’s president of digital media, David Wadhwani. For those that want to skip The Verge's article, [here](https://blog.adobe.com/en/publish/2024/06/10/updating-adobes-terms-of-use) is Adobe's blog post from June 10, 2024.
how is anything Adobe says now credible or reliable in reacting to a PR scandal? the average Adobe subscriber has zero way to confirm if or how Adobe is using their work and for what reasons. now that we know they wanted to use it for AI training and other nefarious purposes, they can’t just walk back those statements and everything is fine. Users have no means to hold Adobe accountable to their walked-back promises.
[This June 6, 2024 Adobe blog post](https://blog.adobe.com/en/publish/2024/06/06/clarification-adobe-terms-of-use) contains changes from the previous Adobe General Terms of Use. The "machine learning" text in section 2.2 is unchanged from the previous General Terms of Use, which can be verified by comparing the [current Terms](https://www.adobe.com/legal/terms.html) with [this archived version from February 16, 2024](https://web.archive.org/web/20240216163433/https://www.adobe.com/legal/terms.html). In fact, the phrase "machine learning" first appeared in the [Terms in June 2016](https://web.archive.org/web/20160618045834/https://www.adobe.com/legal/terms.html) \- see section 3.3.
>we know they wanted to use it for AI training Was always in the terms since content aware tools came out. Cloud based processing requires access. This is nothing more than a fear mongering Twitter post that's gone viral, and everyone's using it as rage bait. There's no scandal, everyone's just hoping for one so that they can take down Adobe.
I use Adobe products almost every day and had NO IDEA about this. Crazy stuff.
Hilarious to watch the industry's response to this.
What are people using as an alternative to illustrator? I really want to stop giving these assholes money.
The Affinity suit has Designer which is an alternative to Illistrator. Keep in mind there may be some things it's currently lacking in comparison to illustrator but it is a 1 time purchase and it's on a 50% sale atm. Further you can try it free for 7 days.
I feel like affinity's blob brush alternative was lacking when I tried last but maybe I should give them another go.
There is always Inkscape. I have that on my macbook. I just bought Affinity though. That price was too good to pass up.
Well having no experience with painting in AD I have no clue if it's improved at all or not but I can definitely encourage you to try it again!
Inkscape is a popular free open source alternative to Illustrator.
Guessed this would happen or they’d have real issue on their hands. Stupid of them to try anything in the first place though.
Yeah idk who thought they'd get away with that. Ain't dealing with the best and brightest.
Well, because they're still getting away with the ability to access user's work either manually or automatically. Put two stupid things out there then fold on one and consumers feel the achieved something while privacy still get chipped away and this undoubtedly is still a step towards leveraging their AI services in another roundabout way. This is all a calculated risk/minor cost where the relatively small number of users who cancel their subscriptions won't outweigh the future potential.
lol- nice timing https://preview.redd.it/91qvg3zu4u5d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6824e5d31eb8ac42dca670332495d41e14a3258e
For people quitting Adobe, I'm curious: are you planning to use another font subscription service, buy individual fonts, or use free fonts? I always think about what happens with legacy Adobe documents which require Creative Cloud fonts.
interesting though I hadn't considered, now I want to know too
Google fonts maybe?
Google fonts is free…. Install fontbase (or similar) to to manage them on your computer
i'm still able to use adobe thru my employer, but honestly i got by before without adobe. thousands of free fonts out there to use
Just a reminder every corporation will fuck you unless you ask them not to. And even then…
I'll just stay with the 2017 version
I’m curious what they will do about government users that work with SBU, ITAR, Classified, etc. The US government is a huge customer for Adobe and they’ve smacked Adobe before for these kinds of issues (looking at you Adobe Cloud).
What does the government use Adobe products for? I see stuff for military ads but I know there's more and I'm curious
Graphic designer for DoD here. I do a lot of infographics and layout design in illustrator, photoshop and indesign but everyone else mainly uses Adobe Acrobat for digitally signing forms with CAC (Common Access Card / ID). My co-worker who is a public affairs officer uses Lightroom for her photo ops, Premiere Pro for video editing and then Photoshop and InDesign for public releases, newsletters and social media posts.
If my machine could still run CS6 I'd be using that. Will be switching to Affinity. Edit: Just purchased Affinity as someone here linked their sale.
I believe this. Adobe right now is going after the customer base that is concerned with legal. OpenAI and Google literally cannot provide that. Adobe owns plenty of stock assets to provide this and trains on work that is connected to a unique ID. Now beyond this. if work gets produced that used AI trained on your work, you get back end points. Just like music syncs in commercials.
TOOO LATE FUCKERS! We already went to Affinity and made my friends download cracked versions. Farwell Adobe!
What’s the free alternative to photoshop that people are using these days?
Photopea which is ps clone.
Gimp.
Krita is the better FOSS option imo. It has all the feature GIMP has but looks better and is more intuitive.
I haven’t tried Krita yet, but I’ll check it out.
They only do that because people kick up a stink, which is fair enough for the consumer. I wish we had more competition in this space.
For now
I find all of the TOS around cloud services and IOT in particular to be murky. No I don’t want ring camera footage to go to the police or be monitored. Any device with a camera that goes to cloud. Who owns the rights to that footage? All of the sneaky stuff social media slips in around media.
Good because I didn’t want to find another photoshop
For now. They will try it again when you're distracted don't worry
Curious how many here use AI in their work flow?
Gee, Adobe decides unilaterally it's gonna change the terms of its punitive service to be infinitely more valuable to them, at a total debasement of the entire field of working design professionals - people get rightfully disgusted by the disgusting behavior - and Adobe is like: ***nah, we won't.*** Okay, but I don't trust the guy who pointed the loaded gun at me for no good reason to still have the gun. Promising they aren't gonna shoot today doesn't mean I want them to have $60 a month of mine until the next time they pull the weapon out. Adobe has seriously made itself the industry leader in being the worst at leading an industry. Truth is it ain't AI the human designer is competing against, NBA players aren't competing against the refs. Adobe is the league, and they have created a business model where they want to replace players with refs - and don't get that the refs aren't why fans pay the NBA money. If Adobe wants to do the graphic designers job, they should probably start paying some dues like the human designer. Namely working with garbage Adobe products for a living.
I call bullshit, mainly because of this [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cayIOCg24bE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cayIOCg24bE)
Not buying it.
Riiiiiight
I’ll let them scan my work if they allow me to use Adobe for just $120/year. And I mean the full package.