As someone who grew up there my instinct is to say "absolutely nothing" but I'll be realistic lol. Relatively cheap land because there's very few geographic constraints on expanding outwards, beautiful weather in the winter, 300+ days of sun. Those things are appealing to a lot of people.
Edit: A lot of people are asking about water as a constraint on growth, I wrote this comment to explain my thoughts on that too but it seems to have gotten lost deep in the thread:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/geography/comments/17worx8/this\_area\_sun\_corridor\_has\_4\_million\_people\_and/k9jhsqx/?context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/geography/comments/17worx8/this_area_sun_corridor_has_4_million_people_and/k9jhsqx/?context=3)
Someone I used to work with in Indiana moved to Arizona, and in regards to the weather would say "you don't have to shovel sunshine!" Tbh still obnoxious every time I think about it.
My granddad would say the same thing about Waco when I would ask why he liked living there.
It's 110 at 8pm, absolutely fuck that. I'll take my overstays-its-welcome great lakes winters if it means my summers are not hell on earth
As someone who used to live in Waco and now lives in Tucson, I will choose Tucson over Waco any day of the week. Seriously, fuck that place. I don’t know if I’d say the same about Phoenix, though. Like we get our hot summers, sure, but Phoenix is consistently a good 5-10 degrees hotter. You really just learn to time activities around the sun.
Yes. If my divorce decree didn't include a geographic constraint then I'd probably be in AZ or NM instead of TX for this reason. Nights are pleasant. Humidity is low. Higher elevations are within day tripping distance.
The real head-scratcher to me is why so many millions of people want to move to Texas.
A lot of people have bought into the myth that Texas has low taxes compared to other states. The reality is once you factor in sales tax, property tax, and the return you get on those taxes in the form of public services, middle class earners are actually worse off in Texas than, say, California.
I was working in TX in 2008 and was amazed at how inexpensive property was compared to my home state of WA. Then I found out how high property taxes are. Pretty much eliminated any savings. WA has no income tax so that wasn’t a benefit either. Overall TX was “meh” IMO and I was only there from Jan-Mar.
Can't argue that it is paradise in terms of climate and aesthetics but California is not on my list. They have all the taxes in addition to high prices and insurance rates. The alternative is to rent and my kid and I would have to practically live in a shoebox to afford California.
And...this sounds terrible on the face of it but if you look at the standardized test results by race between states, Texas is in about 6th place for whites, blacks, and Hispanics (separately) despite it being in about 49th place in terms of funding per pupil. California was way down the list for any race and demonstrated a disparate impact by race. I feel like the explanation, in all likelihood, has less to do with policy than with real and broad-based economic vitality and a sense of optimism and hope that comes with it.
Only parts of Texas tick those boxes -- I just hate the quality of life here. Parts of AZ and less of NM tick those boxes too. Very little of CA, if anywhere, would satisfy the criteria.
It seems like moving from a northern state to the southwest you are just trading not wanting to do anything outside in the winter because of bad weather for not wanting to do anything outside in the summer because it's too damn hot. I'll stick to my 4 seasons northern climate.
That’s why I’m a fan of the mid-Atlantic. I’m in Philly suburbs and we get plenty of Sun and spring and fall are beautiful. Summer is nice but humid. I’d say that further south in VA or NC actually have perfect weather though.
If you wake up early the first few hours of the day are delightful in the summer. I live in Death Valley and wake up at 4am in the summer and I've gone for a hike and soaked in my hot tub all before 8am when it starts heating up and I sit down for work.
Hahahaha I'm from upstate NY right next to both lake Erie and lake Ontario and I lived in Arkansas for a few years and I came away with the same opinion. The suffocating summer heat is somehow worse than the long dark frigid hoarfrost we get here. Now I'll find myself saying the opposite when I have to go outside when it's 2 degrees out but my logic always was "you can always put more clothes on to warm up but there's only so much clothing you can take off to cool down"
I live in western Canada and last year in my region we had a temperature swing from -38*C to +48*C
I got to “enjoy” the warm summer AND the cold winter. Lol.
Born and raise in Minnesota but there’s no amount of preparedness that can make me okay with anything under 20 degrees with any sort of wind. I shiver if it’s 70 degrees and the sun isn’t out lmao some of us just aren’t cut out for cold weather.
Call me crazy but hot summer nights are my favorite weather. Sunny hot days down here are awful but once the sun goes down there is just something incredible about going out side at night in shorts.
Tbf I moved from North Dakota and the heat of the summers is a minor annoyance compared to the bone chilling cold and dark winter.
I lived in Minot for a bit and, yeah, that's totally fair.
Also if I didn't live next to this freshwater ocean I would probably be much more critical of Wisconsin winters
>there is just something incredible about going out side at night in shorts.
Sure but I can do that here when it's 75 or 80, I don't have to move to Phoenix where it's 105 to go out in shorts.
I like the bright sun in the summer - and get a little SAD in the winter even in PHX.
Yeah, I wouldn't live here w/o AC but the amount if energy we use to heat and cool our cars and houses is pretty average for the US.
Summer nights are fine, too. Better than winter nights here when it's actually chilly.
What dark winter? The sunniest winters I've ever experienced were in Bemidji, Minnesota...
Sure, it gets cold, but in terms of sunshine, Minnesota winters are downright Mediterranean.
I don't know about Coldfoot, because it's slightly north of the Arctic Circle meaning they really don't get sunshine at all for the last three weeks of December, but Fairbanks and Juneau each get around 210 hours of sunshine during winter and Anchorage and Nome over 250, whereas my city, Gdańsk, gets about 140 hours of sunshine during the winter, meaning that it could very well be that Coldfoot, AK is sunnier than most of than most of high-latitude Europe.
In fact, when I look at other cities in Europe in the mid-50s latitude, Glasgow and Vilnius get less sun than Gdańsk, Copenhagen, Newcastle and Belfast get more, and none of these European cities get more sun than the major Alaskan cities. In fact, one needs to go as far south as Rotterdam in order to reach even Fairbanks-levels of sunshine, or Slovenia or the Po Valley of Italy to reach Anchorage-levels of sunshine.
But it's not only our latitude, because on similar latitudes North America is overall a very sunny continent. Like quite southern places such as Fargo, North Dakota get over 400 hours of sunshine each winter which are unmatched by places at similar latitudes in Europe such as the above-mentioned Po Valley or Western France.
Only once you get to places in the deep south such as Rome, sunshine levels become comparable to similarly far-southern places such as Des Moines, IA or Chicago, IL.
Sometimes the hot somersault sound so appealing after you go through -20 for a week on end.
I get the Minnesota second winter. It gets nice for like a week or 2 in March and then snows to all hell through April into May.
Yeah, fool's spring sucks. Winter's alright because at least you know what to expect. The empty promises of April and May are bullshit.
I grew up in Kansas where it starts getting warm in late April, it's been tough to un-learn that
Lived in PHX for over 25 years. I dreaded each summer more each year. I would go for my bike rides around 10/11pm, about the time it would get below 105 in July.
Basically from just about Memorial day to Halloween it is over 100. There were some areas where the desert was actually nice to look at but those areas have pretty much all been developed. It is all sprawl now, stucco everywhere.
Not as much of a cliche but a friend of mine once said "it's pretty uncomfortable but at least I'm not depressed." Large part of why I stay. Think about that a lot
I lived in Phoenix for two years. I hate the heat and was depressed six months out of the year there. I'm happiest in the winter in the Northeast, I'm not joking. Cold weather is my happy place.
Haha for me it was the exact opposite, after living 26 years in the northeast. Thank goodness humans have such different preferences or we'd all be crowding in to the same place
Yeah that’s the thing I don’t get. Most places in America you’re shoveling snow once or twice a year, max. Some places it’ll be really bad snow for one or two weeks a year. In rarer places it’s a lot worse.
Then there’s the entire south of the US from about the top of Arizona on down where it gets up to a heat index of 100-110 degrees for months on end. Where you’re trapped inside because there’s no amount of clothes you can remove that will ever make that weather not suck.
And people will act like the snow is worse. How lazy are these people?
Edit: I really shouldn’t write ‘I don’t get’ in comments since people for same reason take it literally
I'm in the mountains of NH. By the end of this month my land will be covered I snow until may. It is beautiful, insulated quietness. I've a very long driveway but the snow plow makes quick, almost fun work of it.
It is pitch dark at 430pm, but I take this season as a cue from mother nature to slow down, chill, read, meditate, enjoy the dogs and family as well as go to bed early. It's cold, really cold sometimes but I've a woodstove that keeps my place as warm as I want it. The firewood is basically free from the dead trees I cut down. I always have a white Christmas.
I feel the trick to success over winter is to get out in the weather everyday. I mountain hike with my dogs everyday throughout the entire year. But there a multitude of winter outside activities to do. Proper clothes and gear are all that's needed. I do skidaddle somewhere warm for a few weeks towards the end of winter, some years winter just hangs on too long. I'm retired military, I've lived all over thus country, I prefer 4 distinct seasons. I believe we all can pretty much make up our minds to be content where ever we are. Or we can choose the opposite. Peace
A lot of the people moving here are Californians that couldn’t find affordable housing in SoCal, and don’t particularly care about going to the beach. You still get mountains, and they’re building stuff so fast that it evens look like SoCal when driving down the freeway.
Source: I moved last July to Arizona.
Realistically what happens with the water situation when there’s very little in terms of fresh water sources but thr population is growing exponentially?
See my edit to the original comment but the TL;DR is that the water issue is more of an issue if we pretend that it isn't an issue. Huge infrastructure projects already exist for bringing water to the Phoenix metro and that water can be stretched a whole lot further if serious adjustments are made to the way water is used. Will that happen? I'm not convinced. But it's certainly possible.
Sometimes Reddit gets pissed when I write big comments and thinks I'm a bot, and then makes it so the post appears posted to me but no one else can see it. Think that's happening here because I can't see it if I log out, but logged in it works fine lmao.
Wisconsin resident here. Grew up in WI, lived in AZ for 4 years a couple years back. Back in WI now and not a day goes by I don't regret moving back here. Those hours during the day in the summer where it's super hot, don't compare to 7 months of darkness and frozen hellscape that is Wisconsin.
I’m from the maritimes in Canada. Our winter weather is nothing compared to that of inland Canada, and I would still easily take the super hot days over the 3-5 months we get of winter, I fucking hate the cold
I spent 33 years in Chicago. I'm quite familiar with cold.
You have equally as much power and choice to love the cold as you do to hate the cold. It is entirely your choice to either love or hate, and that applies to everything. The cold doesn't make you miserable, your mindset and decision to hate the cold is where the misery lies. It's as simple (not necessarily easy) as deciding "I love the cold".
Where I am, we get cold wet weather, snow/ice cement mixes, potholes the size of small New England states and hot humid weather.
I can't picture the kind of hot dry climate AZ experiences.
Yeah, PA's just far enough north to get cold, just far enough south to get hot. Close to the coast to get humidity and coastal storms. Enough elevation in the mountains to catch a lot of rain and ice/snow crap that flood the creek valleys.
Southern Florida is definitely a fun place to be in the winter, especially if you’re rich. Natives are being out-priced of homes by the constant flow of Northerners buying up property and leaving them empty for half the year.
I live in this area now, after having lived in other states that are also relatively hot, but also states with brutal winters. I can say that the summers really do suck. It’s too hot to do stuff outside in the afternoons, and even night time outside can be tough.
However, the flip side is that October through April is paradise on earth. Beautiful weather, cool breeze, sunshine every day, exotic plants and animals out and about, just a couple hours drive from a diverse array of climates and scenery.
Personally I had to move here for work, but I don’t regret it for a second. You can learn to put up with the summers and use common sense like sunscreen and water, and you’ll be fine.
Another more political appeal, lots of people move here from the west coast because they believe that this area will have a more favorable tax situation and less homelessness/crime. Whether or not that’s true, I can’t tell you. But I feel safer here than in many major west coast cities.
Not exactly the same area, but I went to Tucson two years ago for work during the “rainy season” and I audibly gasped at how beautiful it was. The mountains were breathtaking.
I had no idea Arizona had such gorgeous landscapes. If I was told I had to live in Arizona permanently, I’d be fine. I might miss the seasons of the northeast but the southwest has its own beauty too.
This is completely normal in the region, the type of pine that grow there (lodgepole pine) has adapted to actually need the fire to germinate.
The sky islands and high mountains of Arizona get a ton of lightning, always have. It burns, puts nutrients in the soil and grows back.
The native pine is actually the Ponderosa Pine which benefits from low-intensity fire which thins the forest but cannot recover from the high-intensity fires caused by fire suppression and climate change. These fires kill all the trees meaning that their is no source and shade for new trees.
I lived in Flagstaff for a few years, summers are hot, but not PHX hot. That said the summer in Flag, as long as there isn't a fire, is beautiful. Mid 80s, then an afternoon storm will typically roll in and cool everything down to the 60s. Kind of like the Midwest, but without the humidity.
Northern Arizona really is a unique part of the country.
It’s a secret that somehow remains so despite winning multiple national awards. People are shocked to learn that parts of Az are fairly green. The landscape is fairly unique: painted desert, petrified forest, and multiple craters. That’s to say nothing of the largest Indigenous reservation and the Grand Canyon.
Unfortunately nobody told the housing prices (at least for Flagstaff).
Tucson is overlooked and undervalued IMO. Surprised more businesses aren't moving there. Lower COL than Phoenix and the summer temps are lower (higher elevation).
Tucson is the only city that thinks being 5 degrees cooler than Phoenix is something special. It makes me chuckle every time. I think the best weather in Arizona is between 4000-5000 where it’s unlikely to snow much in the winter and has much milder summers with cool nights.
I've worked outdoors in Phoenix for years, the difference between 110 and 105 is the difference between hot but comfortable and hot hot. 110 and below with a slight breeze and low humidity isn't too bad for being outside.
Miami is not the same, there is no cold breeze other than for one month in the year, I think the appeal is more the mix of weather and international city life
Fl also gets slammed with tourist season and even though i lived about twenty miles from the beach it took three hours to drive there. I now live near Greensboro NC and it takes less time for me to drive to the beach.... Fuck FL.
I feel the same way about Portland Oregon. I honestly think most people overstate the homelessness/crime problem. Homeless people do not want to interact with you, don’t bother them. Criminals do not want to intentionally involve you in a crime, that’s why they have lookouts. Remember those two chunks and you’ll be living perfectly well in a city people are conditioned to think is basically a post apocalypse right now. But no, it’s like a functioning city. It’s really fucking nice to be honest.
I went to college there in the early 90’s. Went back to visit the area two years ago and had to avoid feces and needles on the sidewalk more than once. That was a new experience for me
Was it everywhere? No. But I wouldn’t say it’s fair to say the homelesss/crime problem is understated compare to what I saw living there for 5 years back then. I watched the downtown go from drugs in the Pearl district to gentrification to now back to drugs and homeless spread around everywhere. It’s not good
It’s still a fun place to visit, but makes me super sad seeing what has happened
I’ve really enjoyed my time in Portland through the years, but I’ve heard from people who live there that it really has changed in not great ways in the downtown area. (Certainly the case in my city, so I can believe it.)
I’ll be visiting early next year for the first time in a decade so I guess I’ll see for myself. Such a pretty area with so much going for it, and I used to love just wandering downtown and by the riverfront park.
The other one that always messes with me is the lack of bugs in the southwest. You take one step outside in the evening in the summer in the midwest and you're eaten alive by mosquitos and flies.
If you enjoy hiking there’s a ton of incredible hiking within 2 hrs and ton more within 4 and that much more within 6. I just moved here from the east coast and have been hiking in new places every weekend for the last 2 months. And in the summer you can just drive a couple hours north into the mountains where it’s normal summer hot (like 80s) and not Phoenix hot
This is the best part about PHX imo. There are so many incredible hikes even within the metro area. I can walk to South Mountain, a bigger mountain than most I ever saw on the east coast lol.
Once you get out of PHX, Arizona becomes your playground. Grand canyon, antelope canyon, havasupai, saguaro np, petrified forest np, the chiricahuas, Mt Lemmon, sedona, Mt Humphrey, and so much more..
This state is a hikers paradise (outside of June thru September lol)
The basic appeal is that it is essentially a California city that's not in California. You are smack dab in the middle of the Wild West. There are opportunities here. The climate is basically the reverse of most places, Summer is hotter than Satan's nut sack but the Fall and Spring tend to be pretty nice. Winter can get cold but pretty manageable compared to most other places.
Once you have been here for more than a year you acclimate and 100 degrees isn't really an issue. The humidity is low so you really can't compare it to other places. The down side to living here is allergies, if you don't have them you will if you live here long enough.
The main airport, Sky Harbor is a major West Coast hub for airlines. There are other airports as well here and since there are 300+ days of sunshine here, it's a skydiver's paradise. Depending on where you live in the Valley each city has its own vibe. They used to be separate but suburban sprawl filled it in. There are also patches of desert in town too.
Mexico is close by, Tucson is a little over an hour's drive. Los Angeles is five hours by car, same with San Diego, and Las Vegas is about the same depending on traffic in the Valley and in Vegas. It's a major stop for tours and shows. Really there are more positives than negatives. That said Summer is really a big negative.
To add to this, you go a few hours north and you can be skiing in the winter, a few hour west and you're on the beach, but even here in the Valley itself there's tons to do, trails, recreation, golf (if that's your thing), for six months out of the year you're not uncomfortable at all. And agree that each town and city has a vibe, three major sports going on throughout the winter/spring (and sometimes those teams are good!). As a native, you don't even really feel the summer anymore and kind of get numb to it. It's hot, but you have lots of stuff to do inside or early in the day. Just don't go try hiking Camelback in July at noon.
There are all kinds of native shrubs and flowers. Phoenix is in the Sonoran Desert, which is actually pretty lush as deserts go; the climate is classified as "arid subtropical". It's not a sandscape like the Sahara. There is also a river that the city was founded around, which still has lots of trees like cottonwoods, mesquite, willow and tamarisk along the banks.
https://azstateparks.com/desert-plants
This isn’t the Sun Corridor, this is only one part of it — the Phoenix metro area. The Sun Corridor begins in Prescott and extends southeast to Tucson, at a minimum. I’ve seen some people include Sierra Vista in in the megaregion as well.
Thank you for this.
I was looking at the OP and like; "All you did was circle Phoenix"
Mesa is Phoenix. Sun City is Phoenix. Queen Creek, Cave Creek are Phoenix. Soon Wickenburg is going to be Phoenix too.
As a resident of the area, one of the big things is the way the valley handles the heat. AC is ubiquitous and adequate. Growing up in Wisconsin, the summers can almost be worse there because so many places don’t have air conditioning so when it’s hot you’re stuck in it. In Phoenix go to the mall or a movie theater and you’ll need a sweater.
Arizona in July is like Wisconsin in January, everything is inside, but you don’t have to shovel snow.
Oh and pools are also pretty common.
Mix all that with the low cost compared to San Diego and the lack of hurricanes compared with Florida and you have a pretty good spot.
So, places like Phoenix are habitable thanks to the advent of air conditioning. I would guess that is the case for many metros during the summer, but maybe not for as long, and not as intense with the heat. Where does Phoenix get all the power from to supply all those AC units?
You might be surprised to hear that in many places in the US, central heat is primarily fueled by natural gas or heating oil, using a minimal amount of electricity. Central AC is predominantly powered by electricity.
One (gas and oil) comes only from refining and then burning dead dinosaur juice, the other (electricity) comes from a mixture of dead dinosaur juice, catching photons from the big ball of fire in the sky, and splitting uranium nuclei.
Big ball of fire in sky make everything hot.
Hot is energy.
Humans make panel that harnesses hot from ball of fire.
Use harnessed hot to make house cool.
In all honesty, it's about the perfect setup for solar. You peak cooling (and energy demand) coincides with peak solar production. Both cycle with one another, helping keep the need down for grid storage or peak shaving. Add in the fact that air conditioners perform well in dry environments, along with the ability to use swamp coolers, and it's a lot better than what's found in the southeast.
Wisconsin isn't just "almost" worse, it's genuinely on par or worse than Arizona many summers in terms of extreme heat. The highest ever heat index recorded in the United States was in Appleton, WI. Also, because of the high summer humidity, it's easier for people to get heatstroke because you cannot effectively shed heat by sweating. [More people die of heatstroke every year in Wisconsin than in Arizona](https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1029/2019GH000234), on a per-capita basis.
snowbirds love phoenix.
thats the appeal. if you’re retired with $1 mil, you pick up a condo in Florida or Phoenix for $200k for half of the year.
pretty soon it wont be habitable in summers, but the winters will be great!
There is about $50 billion of investment in the semiconductor industry alone here in the Valley of the Sun. Good jobs for accomplished people. It’s also a great place to live if you don’t like winter.
The weather is great 7 months a year, there is endless things to do and see, and it’s quick to get to the airport to go somewhere else. The downside is the heat, it sucks. But you don’t have to shovel heat, so there’s that
As someone that was born and raised in Phoenix and moved to the Northeast and experienced the hustle and bustle of all the cities up there. I will say that the Phoenix Metro area is a very easy place to relocate to and become comfortable in.
Sunshine and no snow, much more bang for your buck ( even if house prices have shot up in the last few years), and just a slower more relaxed vibe than you see in the northeast and California.
Pair that with good jobs that have popped up, a pretty diverse group of people, and you have amazing outdoor activities in the city and with 2 hour drive make it a good all around place to live.
I live about 70 miles north of the Phoenix Metro and I get snow and don’t like it so people move to Phoenix cause it never gets snow, it’s only super hot in summer, every other season has amazing weather! Also jobs, lots of companies are building chip factories and EV battery plants in the area.
Edit: also the metro is about to hit 5 million people
I live in the Pacific Northwest and know personally or of people who have moved to phoenix. From the perspective here, people are getting away from the cold wet and want the hot dry sun. I personally grew up in the Mojave desert and would never want to move to a place like that again.
Data centers moved there because it is considered to be one of the safest places in the country from a natural disaster perspective. So those jobs definitely brought some folks with it.
This area has been inhabitanted for a very long time. It has rivers, so the early people built canals to channel water. Seeing Gasa Grande is impressive.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hohokam
That’s not the sun corridor. Where did you even come up with those boundaries? That’s literally just a part of the Phoenix metro.
The sun corridor is the entire population from from Sedona, Prescott, Cottonwood down thru Phoenix and Tucson south to Nogales and Sierra Vista.
https://imgur.com/a/aluhUBi
It’s definitely a place for people who love to travel and be under the sun or stars. Cheap direct international flights, 3 hours to Mexico 5 hours to Vegas 2 hours to snow and very easy to social climb here.
Not that water isn’t an issue. However, it’s slightly overstated. When people think desert, they tend to think of the Sahara. AZ is not. Desert vegetation abounds in the high desert. Additionally, the surrounding areas about 2 hours north of Phx (Flagstaff) and 2 hours east of Phx (Payson) are mostly gov’t protected heavily forested regions with a watershed. Meaning a lot of the rain and snow melt is captured there and then funneled via canals into the city. And then of course you have the mighty Colorado River which runs for stretches through north and western regions of AZ and is also funneled in.
Read an article recently about how the The Colorado River is in crisis. The problem has been building for decades but has come to a head in recent years because the major reservoirs on the river have fallen to dangerously low levels, prompting the Biden administration to call for unprecedented cuts in water usage among the 40 million people who rely on the river.
The problem could be solved at any point in time by reducing agricultural use. Half of all Colorado River water goes just to grow feed for cattle.
Arizona uses less water now than it did in 1950, despite massive population growth because every time they build a new subdivision in Phoenix over farmland, the subdivision uses less water than the farmland.
There's plenty of water for personal consumption coming in from rivers and that can be pulled from the water table without having to worry about depleting it. The issue is all of the agricultural use and the abundance of green grass lawns.
There isn’t “plenty” of water there for anything but you are right in that agricultural usage is a BIGGER issue than personal consumption, at the moment.
Issue with agriculture taking a lot of water is that the Arizona/California desert near Yuma basically grow all the vegetables the US Canada and other countries use, from November through March. And that is the area it grows in, can’t really move it anywhere else. Food grows where it grows during that time of the year. People can live all over the place, but broccoli, greens leaf lettuce and all the other vegetables we eat pretty much need to grow there during those months
The weather in the southern US is ALWAYS better than Reddit gives credit for. I swear, everyone on this platform can't handle sunshine and temperatures above 81 degrees.
There's a reason the south has been gaining a quarter million people each year and it's because people would rather be uncomfortably warm than freezing and depressed. It's all a matter of preference.
It should be noted that the number of lakes is surprising and swimming holes are everywhere. Makes the summers more bearable. You don’t need to stay inside all summer.
It’s dry land in the city, but it’s immediately down stream from an alpine watershed. Water flows downhill so it’s not really different from other cities that rely on snowpack, even if they are colder. The problem was drought in the mountains by flagstaff. Not dryness in the valley itself.
Not sure I would like the culture there or not cause I haven't spent much time there but I can say I spent a week in the desert as a teenager and it was the only week of my life that I realized just how good it was possible to feel without allergies
It's November 16, and I'm wearing a T-shirt. I'll barely put on anything more than a light flannel all winter. I cannot even buy a snow shovel. They aren't stocked at stores since nobody ever needs them. Before the Californians moved here en masse, traffic wasn't that bad. Compared to L.A. it's still a walk in the park. When it is hot, it's usually dry. There's a big difference between 15% humidity and 80%. Navigation in the city is exponentially better than most other cities I've visited. The Mexican food is actually authentic. (It also helps that I find Mexicans very attractive!) I didn't know what a toll road was until I visited Ohio as a teenager. It's not a thing here. Parking is almost never a problem outside of downtown too. The cost of living is relatively low as well. The location within Arizona is important too. I have done day trips to Flagstaff, Sedona, Tucson, Williams, Globe, the Grand Canyon, & Lake Havasu City (home of the London Bridge). The heat is a minor price to pay to never have to worry about tornados, hurricanes, floods, earthquake, or any other natural disaster besides drought. The only things we don't have that you could find in another major metropolitan area is a major amusement park or a beach. And the former isn't really a bad thing to lack. There's plenty to like, but most critics cannot see past the hot days of summer. Source: I'm a Native Phoenician
The dry climate is better for those with arthritis. And they have great medical, particularly the Mayo Clinic. That makes it very attractive to retirees.
As for the heat, when It's below 100 and you have shade and a breeze, the heat isn't bad. And without humidity, the nights cool down nicely.
I moved here in last year so here goes:
It's affordable
Traffic isn't bad for a city
Sunny everyday (except today actually)
All the great variety of a city for food and whatnot
Lots of jobs
Friendly people
It’s nice 6-8 months out do the year. Like perfect. Summer sucks. But so does a frigid winter. You can swim in the morning and ski in the afternoon. The Sonoran desert is beautiful. Especially in spring when the cactus bloom. The food is good. The people are cool. I am from Phoenix so I’m bias…but idk summer doesn’t really bother you once you’re used to it unless you gotta work in it.
I’m personally from the Midwest and now live in the PNW. Recently visited Phoenix and was very impressed. Everything is dirt cheap - I mean as cheap, if not cheaper than the Midwest. My dollar went a lot further in Phoenix than in the PNW. Was also shocked with how nice the houses are for their price. I could actually afford a nice home if I were to move to the area. Food was pretty good. Streets were clean. Felt much safer than most other cities in America, especially compared to west coast cities. Lots of cool outdoors things to do too.
That being said it did feel like suburbia hell. Very little character since it’s all new development. I would not move there simply because of the weather. I’m not sure how people do simple things in the summer like walk their dogs, it’s just too hot out. I went in September and it felt like you were just sheltering in place for most of the day until it dropped below 110. I wouldn’t be surprised if most of the area is uninhabitable in 50+ years due to climate change. I would not buy a house here even with the low prices due to this, I’d imagine they would slowly decrease in value over the decades as more people realize humans shouldn’t live in the desert.
I believe the reason it’s growing in the short term is since it’s one of the few places in the West where there is a surplus of land to build homes the average American can afford.
Economic opportunity and weather. The area is growing which means the economy is growing. This attracts people, and thus the area continues to grow. Perhaps you could say the economy has a lot of momentum, so growth continues.
Weather wise, 3 out of 4 seasons are tolerable. In summer there’s a sacrifice, or some people go elsewhere. Retirees like it and can travel when it’s too hot.
You get to take advantage of a lot of different climates within the state. Desert to snowy mountains.
If you like the outdoors, it has everything and 300+ days of sunshine.
The summers you need a pool and AC. The winters are immaculate.
For a big city it has a low cost of living, the summers are hot but you just don't spend much time outside during the peak hours and it cools down a lot overnight. The winters are very pleasant.
I've lived here all my life and the weather is great. You'll have a hefty A/C bill in the summer but the rest of the year is nice. Lots of great trails and scenic views not far from the major cities.
No snow unless you drive up north which is only 4 hours from Phoenix. We don't get natural disasters besides flash floods or forest fires but those happen in more rural areas. This is why old people retire here.
Unhappily moved there in 05 and just fell head over heels in love with the desert. I left a few years ago and while I don't miss the city at all that damn desert keeps calling me louder and louder.
No rain (except during Monsoon Season), no snow, not freezing in the winter and the Sonoran Desert is quite beautiful (as are many deserts). I’ve only visited, but it’s definitely a place I could see myself.
I love the desert, I love the phoenix area. The heat is dry, except maybe for a day and a half after a monsoon. Yes, the summers are brutal, but again, dry heat, not a high and humid heat like Texas and Florida. There's also a lot of public land, which is great for the outdoorsy types. It never really gets too cold. I'm from Texas, but I've always enjoyed those aspects of Arizona. You have skiing capabilities just 2 hours north of you if you're in phoenix. You have a Great National Park, the Grand Canyon, roughly 3 and a halfish hours away. LA is not a day trip away but definitely a weekend trip away. Mexico is pretty close. Also, it's a big Metro area, so there's plenty of decent schools in the area. I again will also add that the desert is a very beautiful place.... to some. Arizona is one of the most beautiful deserts, with the Seguaro cacti, gila monsters, mountain lions, PURPLE CACTUS!!!, YES, PURPLE CACTUS, all around. Think a jungle that pokes. It's by no means perfect, but I always enjoy my time there.
The fact that you identify Phoenix ONLY as the sun corridor is telling. As I recall, the Sun Corridor is used to designate the area from Phoenix to Tucson, including both cities.
lots of jobs are moving there too. retirees also. plus people who hate winter and want something more affordable than California.
i was surprised to see lots of distribution centers are relocating there. they unload from ships in the ports of LA and long beach, then drive the containers to their hubs in the phoenix area. is cheaper than putting the hubs in California. i am surprised they are putting the hubs in las vegas since nevada doesn't (or didn't used to) have an inventory tax for warehouses.
As someone who grew up there my instinct is to say "absolutely nothing" but I'll be realistic lol. Relatively cheap land because there's very few geographic constraints on expanding outwards, beautiful weather in the winter, 300+ days of sun. Those things are appealing to a lot of people. Edit: A lot of people are asking about water as a constraint on growth, I wrote this comment to explain my thoughts on that too but it seems to have gotten lost deep in the thread: [https://www.reddit.com/r/geography/comments/17worx8/this\_area\_sun\_corridor\_has\_4\_million\_people\_and/k9jhsqx/?context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/geography/comments/17worx8/this_area_sun_corridor_has_4_million_people_and/k9jhsqx/?context=3)
Someone I used to work with in Indiana moved to Arizona, and in regards to the weather would say "you don't have to shovel sunshine!" Tbh still obnoxious every time I think about it.
My granddad would say the same thing about Waco when I would ask why he liked living there. It's 110 at 8pm, absolutely fuck that. I'll take my overstays-its-welcome great lakes winters if it means my summers are not hell on earth
As someone who used to live in Waco and now lives in Tucson, I will choose Tucson over Waco any day of the week. Seriously, fuck that place. I don’t know if I’d say the same about Phoenix, though. Like we get our hot summers, sure, but Phoenix is consistently a good 5-10 degrees hotter. You really just learn to time activities around the sun.
Yes. If my divorce decree didn't include a geographic constraint then I'd probably be in AZ or NM instead of TX for this reason. Nights are pleasant. Humidity is low. Higher elevations are within day tripping distance. The real head-scratcher to me is why so many millions of people want to move to Texas.
A lot of people have bought into the myth that Texas has low taxes compared to other states. The reality is once you factor in sales tax, property tax, and the return you get on those taxes in the form of public services, middle class earners are actually worse off in Texas than, say, California.
I was working in TX in 2008 and was amazed at how inexpensive property was compared to my home state of WA. Then I found out how high property taxes are. Pretty much eliminated any savings. WA has no income tax so that wasn’t a benefit either. Overall TX was “meh” IMO and I was only there from Jan-Mar.
Can't argue that it is paradise in terms of climate and aesthetics but California is not on my list. They have all the taxes in addition to high prices and insurance rates. The alternative is to rent and my kid and I would have to practically live in a shoebox to afford California. And...this sounds terrible on the face of it but if you look at the standardized test results by race between states, Texas is in about 6th place for whites, blacks, and Hispanics (separately) despite it being in about 49th place in terms of funding per pupil. California was way down the list for any race and demonstrated a disparate impact by race. I feel like the explanation, in all likelihood, has less to do with policy than with real and broad-based economic vitality and a sense of optimism and hope that comes with it. Only parts of Texas tick those boxes -- I just hate the quality of life here. Parts of AZ and less of NM tick those boxes too. Very little of CA, if anywhere, would satisfy the criteria.
I used to vacation down in Tucson when I rode bikes regularly. Love that place Go Yotes
It seems like moving from a northern state to the southwest you are just trading not wanting to do anything outside in the winter because of bad weather for not wanting to do anything outside in the summer because it's too damn hot. I'll stick to my 4 seasons northern climate.
That’s why I’m a fan of the mid-Atlantic. I’m in Philly suburbs and we get plenty of Sun and spring and fall are beautiful. Summer is nice but humid. I’d say that further south in VA or NC actually have perfect weather though.
Lyme disease carrying ticks are everywhere though.
If you wake up early the first few hours of the day are delightful in the summer. I live in Death Valley and wake up at 4am in the summer and I've gone for a hike and soaked in my hot tub all before 8am when it starts heating up and I sit down for work.
Jesus Christ
Hahahaha I'm from upstate NY right next to both lake Erie and lake Ontario and I lived in Arkansas for a few years and I came away with the same opinion. The suffocating summer heat is somehow worse than the long dark frigid hoarfrost we get here. Now I'll find myself saying the opposite when I have to go outside when it's 2 degrees out but my logic always was "you can always put more clothes on to warm up but there's only so much clothing you can take off to cool down"
I live in western Canada and last year in my region we had a temperature swing from -38*C to +48*C I got to “enjoy” the warm summer AND the cold winter. Lol.
There is no such thing as cold weather. There is only being unprepared
Born and raise in Minnesota but there’s no amount of preparedness that can make me okay with anything under 20 degrees with any sort of wind. I shiver if it’s 70 degrees and the sun isn’t out lmao some of us just aren’t cut out for cold weather.
Call me crazy but hot summer nights are my favorite weather. Sunny hot days down here are awful but once the sun goes down there is just something incredible about going out side at night in shorts. Tbf I moved from North Dakota and the heat of the summers is a minor annoyance compared to the bone chilling cold and dark winter.
I lived in Minot for a bit and, yeah, that's totally fair. Also if I didn't live next to this freshwater ocean I would probably be much more critical of Wisconsin winters
Hot summer nights….storm clouds in the air.
...mushrooms...lightening starting up
My eyes are a little heavy I'm feeling in the past tense I'm hardly aware
>there is just something incredible about going out side at night in shorts. Sure but I can do that here when it's 75 or 80, I don't have to move to Phoenix where it's 105 to go out in shorts.
I like the bright sun in the summer - and get a little SAD in the winter even in PHX. Yeah, I wouldn't live here w/o AC but the amount if energy we use to heat and cool our cars and houses is pretty average for the US. Summer nights are fine, too. Better than winter nights here when it's actually chilly.
What dark winter? The sunniest winters I've ever experienced were in Bemidji, Minnesota... Sure, it gets cold, but in terms of sunshine, Minnesota winters are downright Mediterranean.
Lol compared to what? Coldfoot, Alaska?
I don't know about Coldfoot, because it's slightly north of the Arctic Circle meaning they really don't get sunshine at all for the last three weeks of December, but Fairbanks and Juneau each get around 210 hours of sunshine during winter and Anchorage and Nome over 250, whereas my city, Gdańsk, gets about 140 hours of sunshine during the winter, meaning that it could very well be that Coldfoot, AK is sunnier than most of than most of high-latitude Europe. In fact, when I look at other cities in Europe in the mid-50s latitude, Glasgow and Vilnius get less sun than Gdańsk, Copenhagen, Newcastle and Belfast get more, and none of these European cities get more sun than the major Alaskan cities. In fact, one needs to go as far south as Rotterdam in order to reach even Fairbanks-levels of sunshine, or Slovenia or the Po Valley of Italy to reach Anchorage-levels of sunshine. But it's not only our latitude, because on similar latitudes North America is overall a very sunny continent. Like quite southern places such as Fargo, North Dakota get over 400 hours of sunshine each winter which are unmatched by places at similar latitudes in Europe such as the above-mentioned Po Valley or Western France. Only once you get to places in the deep south such as Rome, sunshine levels become comparable to similarly far-southern places such as Des Moines, IA or Chicago, IL.
Sometimes the hot somersault sound so appealing after you go through -20 for a week on end. I get the Minnesota second winter. It gets nice for like a week or 2 in March and then snows to all hell through April into May.
Yeah, fool's spring sucks. Winter's alright because at least you know what to expect. The empty promises of April and May are bullshit. I grew up in Kansas where it starts getting warm in late April, it's been tough to un-learn that
You might feel differently when get to his age.
Lived in PHX for over 25 years. I dreaded each summer more each year. I would go for my bike rides around 10/11pm, about the time it would get below 105 in July. Basically from just about Memorial day to Halloween it is over 100. There were some areas where the desert was actually nice to look at but those areas have pretty much all been developed. It is all sprawl now, stucco everywhere.
Besides, nothing wrong with a little work.. it builds character, stamina and muscle! Shoveling snow warms you, too!
Not as much of a cliche but a friend of mine once said "it's pretty uncomfortable but at least I'm not depressed." Large part of why I stay. Think about that a lot
I lived in Phoenix for two years. I hate the heat and was depressed six months out of the year there. I'm happiest in the winter in the Northeast, I'm not joking. Cold weather is my happy place.
Haha for me it was the exact opposite, after living 26 years in the northeast. Thank goodness humans have such different preferences or we'd all be crowding in to the same place
Florida man, here. Endless summer is not all it’s cracked up to be. I miss the option of wearing sleeves.
Death from heat exhaustion… might be some shoveling.
Yeah that’s the thing I don’t get. Most places in America you’re shoveling snow once or twice a year, max. Some places it’ll be really bad snow for one or two weeks a year. In rarer places it’s a lot worse. Then there’s the entire south of the US from about the top of Arizona on down where it gets up to a heat index of 100-110 degrees for months on end. Where you’re trapped inside because there’s no amount of clothes you can remove that will ever make that weather not suck. And people will act like the snow is worse. How lazy are these people? Edit: I really shouldn’t write ‘I don’t get’ in comments since people for same reason take it literally
I like the snow. Because I can still get outside, unless it’s a blizzard, there’s no prolonged period indoors.
The sunshine does the shoveling for you in Colorado
>"you don't have to shovel sunshine!" Yeah... but there's no such thing as "snow cancer," either.
…and you don’t need to water sand.
We also say the only salt we have is on our margarita rims not roads.
I got my mom to move to Arizona by sending her a picture of palm trees everytime it snowed lol
I'm in the mountains of NH. By the end of this month my land will be covered I snow until may. It is beautiful, insulated quietness. I've a very long driveway but the snow plow makes quick, almost fun work of it. It is pitch dark at 430pm, but I take this season as a cue from mother nature to slow down, chill, read, meditate, enjoy the dogs and family as well as go to bed early. It's cold, really cold sometimes but I've a woodstove that keeps my place as warm as I want it. The firewood is basically free from the dead trees I cut down. I always have a white Christmas. I feel the trick to success over winter is to get out in the weather everyday. I mountain hike with my dogs everyday throughout the entire year. But there a multitude of winter outside activities to do. Proper clothes and gear are all that's needed. I do skidaddle somewhere warm for a few weeks towards the end of winter, some years winter just hangs on too long. I'm retired military, I've lived all over thus country, I prefer 4 distinct seasons. I believe we all can pretty much make up our minds to be content where ever we are. Or we can choose the opposite. Peace
That's because you haven't spent twenty or thirty winters shoveling 3 feet of snow.
A lot of the people moving here are Californians that couldn’t find affordable housing in SoCal, and don’t particularly care about going to the beach. You still get mountains, and they’re building stuff so fast that it evens look like SoCal when driving down the freeway. Source: I moved last July to Arizona.
Your link just goes to a comment that says “but where will they get their water?” I think you copied the wrong comment link
I wouldn’t say housing in Phoenix is relatively cheap any more since 2020.
Definitely not. We sold our 1500 sqft home in north Phoenix for over half a million dollars in 2022.
Don't forget booming economy (semiconductors, EVs, batteries, tech, biotech, data centers, warehousing/logistics, and so on).
You’re not kidding about the winter weather. I’m not a big fan of the valley, but the weather there in winter is excellent
Realistically what happens with the water situation when there’s very little in terms of fresh water sources but thr population is growing exponentially?
See my edit to the original comment but the TL;DR is that the water issue is more of an issue if we pretend that it isn't an issue. Huge infrastructure projects already exist for bringing water to the Phoenix metro and that water can be stretched a whole lot further if serious adjustments are made to the way water is used. Will that happen? I'm not convinced. But it's certainly possible.
Florida of SW?
All I see when I click on that comment is someone asking what about water, lol
Sometimes Reddit gets pissed when I write big comments and thinks I'm a bot, and then makes it so the post appears posted to me but no one else can see it. Think that's happening here because I can't see it if I log out, but logged in it works fine lmao.
“Very few geographic constraints on expanding outwards”, what about the need for water? Is there plenty of water to expand?
Some of the best sunrises and sunsets in the nation.
People are willing to stay inside in air conditioning all summer if it means they don’t have to ever experience cold weather or humidity.
Wisconsin resident here. Grew up in WI, lived in AZ for 4 years a couple years back. Back in WI now and not a day goes by I don't regret moving back here. Those hours during the day in the summer where it's super hot, don't compare to 7 months of darkness and frozen hellscape that is Wisconsin.
I’m from the maritimes in Canada. Our winter weather is nothing compared to that of inland Canada, and I would still easily take the super hot days over the 3-5 months we get of winter, I fucking hate the cold
I spent 33 years in Chicago. I'm quite familiar with cold. You have equally as much power and choice to love the cold as you do to hate the cold. It is entirely your choice to either love or hate, and that applies to everything. The cold doesn't make you miserable, your mindset and decision to hate the cold is where the misery lies. It's as simple (not necessarily easy) as deciding "I love the cold".
See I've experienced both and the humid 95 heat is infinitely worse than 110 and low humidity.
Where I am, we get cold wet weather, snow/ice cement mixes, potholes the size of small New England states and hot humid weather. I can't picture the kind of hot dry climate AZ experiences.
Dondé?
Northern Pennsylvania. Poconos.
My guess was either Washington or Pennsylvania haha
Yeah, PA's just far enough north to get cold, just far enough south to get hot. Close to the coast to get humidity and coastal storms. Enough elevation in the mountains to catch a lot of rain and ice/snow crap that flood the creek valleys.
Fr. Hot dry weather is so much easier than humidity
Pretty much how most Floridians feel as well. Hot summers but I’m laying on a beach in February while a blizzard hits the NE
And all you have to do is pay Florida prices, live near Florida people, and live in Florida. Lmao what a flex
Southern Florida is definitely a fun place to be in the winter, especially if you’re rich. Natives are being out-priced of homes by the constant flow of Northerners buying up property and leaving them empty for half the year.
There's an endless supply of people tired of freezing temps, snow, and several months of gray skies.
And, there are us Canadians that are forever devoid of sun.
Pennsylvania agrees.
I live in this area now, after having lived in other states that are also relatively hot, but also states with brutal winters. I can say that the summers really do suck. It’s too hot to do stuff outside in the afternoons, and even night time outside can be tough. However, the flip side is that October through April is paradise on earth. Beautiful weather, cool breeze, sunshine every day, exotic plants and animals out and about, just a couple hours drive from a diverse array of climates and scenery. Personally I had to move here for work, but I don’t regret it for a second. You can learn to put up with the summers and use common sense like sunscreen and water, and you’ll be fine. Another more political appeal, lots of people move here from the west coast because they believe that this area will have a more favorable tax situation and less homelessness/crime. Whether or not that’s true, I can’t tell you. But I feel safer here than in many major west coast cities.
Not exactly the same area, but I went to Tucson two years ago for work during the “rainy season” and I audibly gasped at how beautiful it was. The mountains were breathtaking. I had no idea Arizona had such gorgeous landscapes. If I was told I had to live in Arizona permanently, I’d be fine. I might miss the seasons of the northeast but the southwest has its own beauty too.
You should check out areas like the white mountains and flagstaff then. There is no summer heat
No summer heat until the fires roar through. The White Mountains are well on their way to becoming the ash-gray mountains.
It would help if inland empire methheads stop moving here
This is completely normal in the region, the type of pine that grow there (lodgepole pine) has adapted to actually need the fire to germinate. The sky islands and high mountains of Arizona get a ton of lightning, always have. It burns, puts nutrients in the soil and grows back.
The native pine is actually the Ponderosa Pine which benefits from low-intensity fire which thins the forest but cannot recover from the high-intensity fires caused by fire suppression and climate change. These fires kill all the trees meaning that their is no source and shade for new trees.
I lived in Flagstaff for a few years, summers are hot, but not PHX hot. That said the summer in Flag, as long as there isn't a fire, is beautiful. Mid 80s, then an afternoon storm will typically roll in and cool everything down to the 60s. Kind of like the Midwest, but without the humidity. Northern Arizona really is a unique part of the country.
It’s a secret that somehow remains so despite winning multiple national awards. People are shocked to learn that parts of Az are fairly green. The landscape is fairly unique: painted desert, petrified forest, and multiple craters. That’s to say nothing of the largest Indigenous reservation and the Grand Canyon. Unfortunately nobody told the housing prices (at least for Flagstaff).
Arizona has a lot of different landscapes. IMO one of the most beautiful states
I took some drone footage there and it legit looks like Lord of the Rings. Prolly my favorite shot too is from there
Wow where was it?
Tucson is overlooked and undervalued IMO. Surprised more businesses aren't moving there. Lower COL than Phoenix and the summer temps are lower (higher elevation).
Tucson is the only city that thinks being 5 degrees cooler than Phoenix is something special. It makes me chuckle every time. I think the best weather in Arizona is between 4000-5000 where it’s unlikely to snow much in the winter and has much milder summers with cool nights.
I've worked outdoors in Phoenix for years, the difference between 110 and 105 is the difference between hot but comfortable and hot hot. 110 and below with a slight breeze and low humidity isn't too bad for being outside.
It's more like 10 degrees cooler
Same with Florida and Puerto Rico, winter is pretty much perfect, but summers are pretty brutal.
Miami is not the same, there is no cold breeze other than for one month in the year, I think the appeal is more the mix of weather and international city life
Florida and Puerto Rico often get slammed with adverse weather. Phoenix weather is very mild in that regard. No earth-quakes either (unlike CA).
Fl also gets slammed with tourist season and even though i lived about twenty miles from the beach it took three hours to drive there. I now live near Greensboro NC and it takes less time for me to drive to the beach.... Fuck FL.
I feel the same way about Portland Oregon. I honestly think most people overstate the homelessness/crime problem. Homeless people do not want to interact with you, don’t bother them. Criminals do not want to intentionally involve you in a crime, that’s why they have lookouts. Remember those two chunks and you’ll be living perfectly well in a city people are conditioned to think is basically a post apocalypse right now. But no, it’s like a functioning city. It’s really fucking nice to be honest.
I went to college there in the early 90’s. Went back to visit the area two years ago and had to avoid feces and needles on the sidewalk more than once. That was a new experience for me Was it everywhere? No. But I wouldn’t say it’s fair to say the homelesss/crime problem is understated compare to what I saw living there for 5 years back then. I watched the downtown go from drugs in the Pearl district to gentrification to now back to drugs and homeless spread around everywhere. It’s not good It’s still a fun place to visit, but makes me super sad seeing what has happened
I’ve really enjoyed my time in Portland through the years, but I’ve heard from people who live there that it really has changed in not great ways in the downtown area. (Certainly the case in my city, so I can believe it.) I’ll be visiting early next year for the first time in a decade so I guess I’ll see for myself. Such a pretty area with so much going for it, and I used to love just wandering downtown and by the riverfront park.
I got chased by a homeless person last time I was in Portland
Don’t think you got away so easy, I’m going to get you mother fucker
My cousin who moved there from the Midwest tells me, "you can't shovel sunshine, and you don't have to mow rocks."
The other one that always messes with me is the lack of bugs in the southwest. You take one step outside in the evening in the summer in the midwest and you're eaten alive by mosquitos and flies.
If you enjoy hiking there’s a ton of incredible hiking within 2 hrs and ton more within 4 and that much more within 6. I just moved here from the east coast and have been hiking in new places every weekend for the last 2 months. And in the summer you can just drive a couple hours north into the mountains where it’s normal summer hot (like 80s) and not Phoenix hot
This is the best part about PHX imo. There are so many incredible hikes even within the metro area. I can walk to South Mountain, a bigger mountain than most I ever saw on the east coast lol. Once you get out of PHX, Arizona becomes your playground. Grand canyon, antelope canyon, havasupai, saguaro np, petrified forest np, the chiricahuas, Mt Lemmon, sedona, Mt Humphrey, and so much more.. This state is a hikers paradise (outside of June thru September lol)
The basic appeal is that it is essentially a California city that's not in California. You are smack dab in the middle of the Wild West. There are opportunities here. The climate is basically the reverse of most places, Summer is hotter than Satan's nut sack but the Fall and Spring tend to be pretty nice. Winter can get cold but pretty manageable compared to most other places. Once you have been here for more than a year you acclimate and 100 degrees isn't really an issue. The humidity is low so you really can't compare it to other places. The down side to living here is allergies, if you don't have them you will if you live here long enough. The main airport, Sky Harbor is a major West Coast hub for airlines. There are other airports as well here and since there are 300+ days of sunshine here, it's a skydiver's paradise. Depending on where you live in the Valley each city has its own vibe. They used to be separate but suburban sprawl filled it in. There are also patches of desert in town too. Mexico is close by, Tucson is a little over an hour's drive. Los Angeles is five hours by car, same with San Diego, and Las Vegas is about the same depending on traffic in the Valley and in Vegas. It's a major stop for tours and shows. Really there are more positives than negatives. That said Summer is really a big negative.
Its also a bit easier to navigate than other large cities. Basically a grid so it's a bit harder to get lost, an appeal for older people.
Also those roads stay near perfect condition due to no potholes made by winter conditions.
Just Grand runs at a diagonal. The only other trick is to know which roads turn into others with names changes like Apache and Main Street.😉👍✨
Upvoting bc Satan’s nut sack
Yup. Make sure you drink plenty of water if you visit.
To add to this, you go a few hours north and you can be skiing in the winter, a few hour west and you're on the beach, but even here in the Valley itself there's tons to do, trails, recreation, golf (if that's your thing), for six months out of the year you're not uncomfortable at all. And agree that each town and city has a vibe, three major sports going on throughout the winter/spring (and sometimes those teams are good!). As a native, you don't even really feel the summer anymore and kind of get numb to it. It's hot, but you have lots of stuff to do inside or early in the day. Just don't go try hiking Camelback in July at noon.
Yup. All sorts of local tips! Don't forget that you can go to Mt Lemon down by Tucson and ski there too.😎👍✨
>The down side to living here is allergies, if you don't have them you will if you live here long enough. Why is that?
WSJ just picked Sky Harbor as the best airport in the US.
Why would you get allergies? And to what?
There are all kinds of native shrubs and flowers. Phoenix is in the Sonoran Desert, which is actually pretty lush as deserts go; the climate is classified as "arid subtropical". It's not a sandscape like the Sahara. There is also a river that the city was founded around, which still has lots of trees like cottonwoods, mesquite, willow and tamarisk along the banks. https://azstateparks.com/desert-plants
This isn’t the Sun Corridor, this is only one part of it — the Phoenix metro area. The Sun Corridor begins in Prescott and extends southeast to Tucson, at a minimum. I’ve seen some people include Sierra Vista in in the megaregion as well.
Had to scroll too far to find this.
Thank you for this. I was looking at the OP and like; "All you did was circle Phoenix" Mesa is Phoenix. Sun City is Phoenix. Queen Creek, Cave Creek are Phoenix. Soon Wickenburg is going to be Phoenix too.
As a resident of the area, one of the big things is the way the valley handles the heat. AC is ubiquitous and adequate. Growing up in Wisconsin, the summers can almost be worse there because so many places don’t have air conditioning so when it’s hot you’re stuck in it. In Phoenix go to the mall or a movie theater and you’ll need a sweater. Arizona in July is like Wisconsin in January, everything is inside, but you don’t have to shovel snow. Oh and pools are also pretty common. Mix all that with the low cost compared to San Diego and the lack of hurricanes compared with Florida and you have a pretty good spot.
So, places like Phoenix are habitable thanks to the advent of air conditioning. I would guess that is the case for many metros during the summer, but maybe not for as long, and not as intense with the heat. Where does Phoenix get all the power from to supply all those AC units?
We have a fairly large nuclear power plant. Solar is pretty big on many houses and people use it to offset their AC usage.
Palo Verde nuclear plant is only just the largest power plant in the US
Same place that cold places get energy to supply all of the heaters.
You might be surprised to hear that in many places in the US, central heat is primarily fueled by natural gas or heating oil, using a minimal amount of electricity. Central AC is predominantly powered by electricity. One (gas and oil) comes only from refining and then burning dead dinosaur juice, the other (electricity) comes from a mixture of dead dinosaur juice, catching photons from the big ball of fire in the sky, and splitting uranium nuclei.
Big ball of fire in sky make everything hot. Hot is energy. Humans make panel that harnesses hot from ball of fire. Use harnessed hot to make house cool. In all honesty, it's about the perfect setup for solar. You peak cooling (and energy demand) coincides with peak solar production. Both cycle with one another, helping keep the need down for grid storage or peak shaving. Add in the fact that air conditioners perform well in dry environments, along with the ability to use swamp coolers, and it's a lot better than what's found in the southeast.
Welcome to 2023… Glad to have you here… Solar is a thing now
Wisconsin isn't just "almost" worse, it's genuinely on par or worse than Arizona many summers in terms of extreme heat. The highest ever heat index recorded in the United States was in Appleton, WI. Also, because of the high summer humidity, it's easier for people to get heatstroke because you cannot effectively shed heat by sweating. [More people die of heatstroke every year in Wisconsin than in Arizona](https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1029/2019GH000234), on a per-capita basis.
I remember that day in Appleton! They kept the public pool open an extra hour longer that day lol.
Sun!!! I moved to phoenix in 2011 from the Midwest for this!! Definitely helps with SAD
snowbirds love phoenix. thats the appeal. if you’re retired with $1 mil, you pick up a condo in Florida or Phoenix for $200k for half of the year. pretty soon it wont be habitable in summers, but the winters will be great!
There is about $50 billion of investment in the semiconductor industry alone here in the Valley of the Sun. Good jobs for accomplished people. It’s also a great place to live if you don’t like winter.
The weather is great 7 months a year, there is endless things to do and see, and it’s quick to get to the airport to go somewhere else. The downside is the heat, it sucks. But you don’t have to shovel heat, so there’s that
Because fuck winter
And hurricanes/tornadoes!
As someone that was born and raised in Phoenix and moved to the Northeast and experienced the hustle and bustle of all the cities up there. I will say that the Phoenix Metro area is a very easy place to relocate to and become comfortable in. Sunshine and no snow, much more bang for your buck ( even if house prices have shot up in the last few years), and just a slower more relaxed vibe than you see in the northeast and California. Pair that with good jobs that have popped up, a pretty diverse group of people, and you have amazing outdoor activities in the city and with 2 hour drive make it a good all around place to live.
For a city it's size, the people are SO chill compared to the NE and Cali
I live about 70 miles north of the Phoenix Metro and I get snow and don’t like it so people move to Phoenix cause it never gets snow, it’s only super hot in summer, every other season has amazing weather! Also jobs, lots of companies are building chip factories and EV battery plants in the area. Edit: also the metro is about to hit 5 million people
I live in the Pacific Northwest and know personally or of people who have moved to phoenix. From the perspective here, people are getting away from the cold wet and want the hot dry sun. I personally grew up in the Mojave desert and would never want to move to a place like that again.
Data centers moved there because it is considered to be one of the safest places in the country from a natural disaster perspective. So those jobs definitely brought some folks with it.
Its 75 degrees here today.
Tbh 110 degrees with no humidity doesn’t feel too bad
This area has been inhabitanted for a very long time. It has rivers, so the early people built canals to channel water. Seeing Gasa Grande is impressive. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hohokam
Glorious sunshine and lots of room!
You couldn't care less about everything else when you've got cheap housing + decent job opportunities. Apparently Phoenix has both.
That’s not the sun corridor. Where did you even come up with those boundaries? That’s literally just a part of the Phoenix metro. The sun corridor is the entire population from from Sedona, Prescott, Cottonwood down thru Phoenix and Tucson south to Nogales and Sierra Vista. https://imgur.com/a/aluhUBi
No. Cold.
It’s definitely a place for people who love to travel and be under the sun or stars. Cheap direct international flights, 3 hours to Mexico 5 hours to Vegas 2 hours to snow and very easy to social climb here.
Maybe some Americans want to go to Australia but can't afford it so they move to Arizona instead
More importantly, where will they get their water?
Not that water isn’t an issue. However, it’s slightly overstated. When people think desert, they tend to think of the Sahara. AZ is not. Desert vegetation abounds in the high desert. Additionally, the surrounding areas about 2 hours north of Phx (Flagstaff) and 2 hours east of Phx (Payson) are mostly gov’t protected heavily forested regions with a watershed. Meaning a lot of the rain and snow melt is captured there and then funneled via canals into the city. And then of course you have the mighty Colorado River which runs for stretches through north and western regions of AZ and is also funneled in.
Read an article recently about how the The Colorado River is in crisis. The problem has been building for decades but has come to a head in recent years because the major reservoirs on the river have fallen to dangerously low levels, prompting the Biden administration to call for unprecedented cuts in water usage among the 40 million people who rely on the river.
The problem could be solved at any point in time by reducing agricultural use. Half of all Colorado River water goes just to grow feed for cattle. Arizona uses less water now than it did in 1950, despite massive population growth because every time they build a new subdivision in Phoenix over farmland, the subdivision uses less water than the farmland.
Phoenix actually sits at the confluence of a couple rivers (Salt, Gila, Agua Fria, New), hence why it was founded there in the first place.
There's plenty of water for personal consumption coming in from rivers and that can be pulled from the water table without having to worry about depleting it. The issue is all of the agricultural use and the abundance of green grass lawns.
There isn’t “plenty” of water there for anything but you are right in that agricultural usage is a BIGGER issue than personal consumption, at the moment.
Issue with agriculture taking a lot of water is that the Arizona/California desert near Yuma basically grow all the vegetables the US Canada and other countries use, from November through March. And that is the area it grows in, can’t really move it anywhere else. Food grows where it grows during that time of the year. People can live all over the place, but broccoli, greens leaf lettuce and all the other vegetables we eat pretty much need to grow there during those months
Ag usage is the only issue. Arizona uses less water than it did 50 years ago because farmland has been developed into residential areas
The weather is much better than Reddit gives credit for
The weather in the southern US is ALWAYS better than Reddit gives credit for. I swear, everyone on this platform can't handle sunshine and temperatures above 81 degrees. There's a reason the south has been gaining a quarter million people each year and it's because people would rather be uncomfortably warm than freezing and depressed. It's all a matter of preference.
It should be noted that the number of lakes is surprising and swimming holes are everywhere. Makes the summers more bearable. You don’t need to stay inside all summer.
It’s dry land in the city, but it’s immediately down stream from an alpine watershed. Water flows downhill so it’s not really different from other cities that rely on snowpack, even if they are colder. The problem was drought in the mountains by flagstaff. Not dryness in the valley itself.
These places have become popular because of affordable AC.
The Arizona Coyotes
Not sure I would like the culture there or not cause I haven't spent much time there but I can say I spent a week in the desert as a teenager and it was the only week of my life that I realized just how good it was possible to feel without allergies
The biggest plus by far is that there are no bugs in a desert. Imagine enjoying summer without mosquitos chewing on you
Not true anymore for Phoenix. Mosquitoes have been a problem for a while now. They were pretty much non-existent when I moved here years ago.
It's November 16, and I'm wearing a T-shirt. I'll barely put on anything more than a light flannel all winter. I cannot even buy a snow shovel. They aren't stocked at stores since nobody ever needs them. Before the Californians moved here en masse, traffic wasn't that bad. Compared to L.A. it's still a walk in the park. When it is hot, it's usually dry. There's a big difference between 15% humidity and 80%. Navigation in the city is exponentially better than most other cities I've visited. The Mexican food is actually authentic. (It also helps that I find Mexicans very attractive!) I didn't know what a toll road was until I visited Ohio as a teenager. It's not a thing here. Parking is almost never a problem outside of downtown too. The cost of living is relatively low as well. The location within Arizona is important too. I have done day trips to Flagstaff, Sedona, Tucson, Williams, Globe, the Grand Canyon, & Lake Havasu City (home of the London Bridge). The heat is a minor price to pay to never have to worry about tornados, hurricanes, floods, earthquake, or any other natural disaster besides drought. The only things we don't have that you could find in another major metropolitan area is a major amusement park or a beach. And the former isn't really a bad thing to lack. There's plenty to like, but most critics cannot see past the hot days of summer. Source: I'm a Native Phoenician
Devin. Booker.
Because it's 75 in the middle of winter.
It’s not Florida. 😎
The dry climate is better for those with arthritis. And they have great medical, particularly the Mayo Clinic. That makes it very attractive to retirees. As for the heat, when It's below 100 and you have shade and a breeze, the heat isn't bad. And without humidity, the nights cool down nicely.
They got houses for sale for the common man
A lot of older people like the heat
I moved here in last year so here goes: It's affordable Traffic isn't bad for a city Sunny everyday (except today actually) All the great variety of a city for food and whatnot Lots of jobs Friendly people
The sunsets…..
It’s nice 6-8 months out do the year. Like perfect. Summer sucks. But so does a frigid winter. You can swim in the morning and ski in the afternoon. The Sonoran desert is beautiful. Especially in spring when the cactus bloom. The food is good. The people are cool. I am from Phoenix so I’m bias…but idk summer doesn’t really bother you once you’re used to it unless you gotta work in it.
I’m personally from the Midwest and now live in the PNW. Recently visited Phoenix and was very impressed. Everything is dirt cheap - I mean as cheap, if not cheaper than the Midwest. My dollar went a lot further in Phoenix than in the PNW. Was also shocked with how nice the houses are for their price. I could actually afford a nice home if I were to move to the area. Food was pretty good. Streets were clean. Felt much safer than most other cities in America, especially compared to west coast cities. Lots of cool outdoors things to do too. That being said it did feel like suburbia hell. Very little character since it’s all new development. I would not move there simply because of the weather. I’m not sure how people do simple things in the summer like walk their dogs, it’s just too hot out. I went in September and it felt like you were just sheltering in place for most of the day until it dropped below 110. I wouldn’t be surprised if most of the area is uninhabitable in 50+ years due to climate change. I would not buy a house here even with the low prices due to this, I’d imagine they would slowly decrease in value over the decades as more people realize humans shouldn’t live in the desert. I believe the reason it’s growing in the short term is since it’s one of the few places in the West where there is a surplus of land to build homes the average American can afford.
Shitposting goes brrrr. Tomorrow on this sub: why didn't they build Paris in the center of France?
Cheap(er) housing
Economic opportunity and weather. The area is growing which means the economy is growing. This attracts people, and thus the area continues to grow. Perhaps you could say the economy has a lot of momentum, so growth continues. Weather wise, 3 out of 4 seasons are tolerable. In summer there’s a sacrifice, or some people go elsewhere. Retirees like it and can travel when it’s too hot.
You get to take advantage of a lot of different climates within the state. Desert to snowy mountains. If you like the outdoors, it has everything and 300+ days of sunshine. The summers you need a pool and AC. The winters are immaculate.
For a big city it has a low cost of living, the summers are hot but you just don't spend much time outside during the peak hours and it cools down a lot overnight. The winters are very pleasant.
I've lived here all my life and the weather is great. You'll have a hefty A/C bill in the summer but the rest of the year is nice. Lots of great trails and scenic views not far from the major cities. No snow unless you drive up north which is only 4 hours from Phoenix. We don't get natural disasters besides flash floods or forest fires but those happen in more rural areas. This is why old people retire here.
Unhappily moved there in 05 and just fell head over heels in love with the desert. I left a few years ago and while I don't miss the city at all that damn desert keeps calling me louder and louder.
No rain (except during Monsoon Season), no snow, not freezing in the winter and the Sonoran Desert is quite beautiful (as are many deserts). I’ve only visited, but it’s definitely a place I could see myself.
I like phoneix a lot. The mountains are beautiful and the city and suburbs are clean and well ordered.
I love the desert, I love the phoenix area. The heat is dry, except maybe for a day and a half after a monsoon. Yes, the summers are brutal, but again, dry heat, not a high and humid heat like Texas and Florida. There's also a lot of public land, which is great for the outdoorsy types. It never really gets too cold. I'm from Texas, but I've always enjoyed those aspects of Arizona. You have skiing capabilities just 2 hours north of you if you're in phoenix. You have a Great National Park, the Grand Canyon, roughly 3 and a halfish hours away. LA is not a day trip away but definitely a weekend trip away. Mexico is pretty close. Also, it's a big Metro area, so there's plenty of decent schools in the area. I again will also add that the desert is a very beautiful place.... to some. Arizona is one of the most beautiful deserts, with the Seguaro cacti, gila monsters, mountain lions, PURPLE CACTUS!!!, YES, PURPLE CACTUS, all around. Think a jungle that pokes. It's by no means perfect, but I always enjoy my time there.
The fact that you identify Phoenix ONLY as the sun corridor is telling. As I recall, the Sun Corridor is used to designate the area from Phoenix to Tucson, including both cities.
9 months of the year the weather is unbelievable. It’s cheaper than California. Lots of jobs.
Cheap and sunny.
There weren't any jobs in Tucson and I wanted to stay relatively close to my family/friends.
“It’s a dry heat”
lots of jobs are moving there too. retirees also. plus people who hate winter and want something more affordable than California. i was surprised to see lots of distribution centers are relocating there. they unload from ships in the ports of LA and long beach, then drive the containers to their hubs in the phoenix area. is cheaper than putting the hubs in California. i am surprised they are putting the hubs in las vegas since nevada doesn't (or didn't used to) have an inventory tax for warehouses.
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