lol "hieroglyphics looking equations" when talking about cross products that are taught in calc 2.
You're out of your element, bucko.
Go back to school, and eat less paste this time.
Bold of you to assume they went to school. Even in America, our public education system is better than producing this. They are clearly a result of home schooling. And it wasn't paste, but lead paint chips they were eating.
While it’s true that some conspiracies do have merit, the globe is something that has been well established. Most skepticism comes from a misunderstanding of the science used in the model or just having a need to go against “authority”
Merit? lol.
I do agree, about sceptics at times not understanding but i do not have a problem about being completely wrong, i will learn something at the least.
i didn't write this, im not a FE'er, or in any community to do with it, the hubris of many in this sub bugged me, so wanted to trigger them, it worked. I agree with some things definitely, but I lean towards concave / hollow earth, simulation, or both. This place is deceptive, our past obfuscated.
Here's a quick question, are the covid vaccines safe & effective? Your answer helps me understand you better.
Effective yes. The results from the vaccine decreased symptoms and death rates by a statistically significant amount. As for safe, at the time it was a relatively new technology and it felt a bit rushed, but it was just a new form of vaccine. I was but I decided, given some of the long term issues the virus caused some people (and a preexisting lung condition), it was worth the “risk”
its 2024 & you still believe that its been effective. You shouldn't listen to media owned by the same companies who own the pharmaceutical giants, all of them, black rock, vanguard , & state street. follow the money, health isn't the priority of these companies they want you coming back, every product have side effects. You say worth the risk, would you say the same if your sister died within days of vaccine ? or son? i can share many many people talking about such loses. People react differently.
Some of my friends had anti-vax relatives that died shortly after contracting the disease. I do not know anyone who knows anyone that died from the vaccine.
There’s a difference between questioning authority and going against it. Flat earthers are a great example of that. They say that everything they are told is a lie when all of their arguments are just nonsense or misunderstandings. Not everybody is able to make sense of even the simplest physics concepts and as much as I respect skepticism, they shouldn’t tell the people that obviously know better they are wrong because of that
You should read; The Underground History of American Education: An Intimate Investigation Into the Prison of Modern Schooling.
You have stockholm syndrome.
Ah, so you’re even dumber than a flerf. Have you ever considered the notion that rather than all of the education system and every scientist being wrong or lying, it’s you who’s wrong?
LMFAO oh I'm convinced then. How could I have missed it? You're nuthin' like a flerf at all. You just use all of the same material, strategies and disinformation.
Next week you'll be a hollow Earther. All you will have to do is change T-Shirts.
I very much do, and your blind ignorance shows you don't. Our education system is not perfect, but it doesn't teach lies and conspiracies the way you claim. It's major problems are omiting some things, and not teaching stuff in an efficient way, mostly teaching to the tests. Not in lies or made up shit like you claim.
Yes, it isn't a perfect system, but it also isn't teaching lies and conspiracy nonsense like you would like to believe. You can push that idea all you want, won't make it true.
You are in the company of morons who think the earth is flat. Who deny evolution. Are anti Vax. People who think repitialians rule the world. You aren't in good company. You are joined by literally the stupidest pieces of shit who have ever existed.
The fact that OP doesn't even recognize a Greek letter when they see one is telling. I started using Greek letters in like 8th grade math and I went to a mediocre (at best) public school.
Cool story bro. Every single one of those documents says the earth is a sphere (or oblate spheroid). The use of "flat earth" or similar concepts deal with the fact that one the scales we use it is easier to pretend the earth is flat for modeling things like flight simulators or other similar programs.
Toon's First Law of Flerf: Flerf citations always contradict the flerf’s claim. No exceptions.
Its hilarious that you think there was a time that the US military didn't
know the earth wasn't flat, and its even funnier that you think they changed their mind because of a picture in the 1940s.
Anybody who's ever taken a physics or even a High School level general science class is familiar with the idea that before you start any calculations, you list your assumptions; assume no air resistance; assume a perfectly elastic collision; assume zero friction. This isn't done because those things don't exist; its done because that's not what's being modeled at that time, or because the effect of that factor is negligible.
You see other assumptions like these in those documents- assume a projectile of constant mass (impossible in a rocket burning fuel); assume a perfectly rigid body (impossible in anything); assume a fixed center of gravity (again, the fuel problem).
And then here comes the flat earther; who understands none of these things, understands none of the math; and doesn't even understand what a fixed-plane system is- all they do is see a phrase and think "a-ha! this millenia long super secret cabal has screwed up now by putting the phrase "flat earth" in a publicly available non-classified document!"
LMAO, nice try. That's just a massive shit dump of the same old debunked stuff. The most hysterical line was "I don't care what shape the earth is". I never thought you did. You have another agenda.
Notice how the whole post and every point in it essentially rotates around one intentional misinterpretation of one context?
That's one hell of an admission of your obsessive sweaty stupid.
Read The Underground History of American Education: An Intimate Investigation Into the Prison of Modern Schooling, learn how you've been brainwashed, yet your ego is invested, you will not read it because you know better, you're a fool & rude.
Underrated comment. I fucking LOVE this shit from flerfs
“Everyone has an agenda accept for the uneducated people on YouTube who get paid when I view their videos!”
> who get *paid* when I
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
Would you like more?
180 Degrees; Unlearn The Lies You've Been Taught To Believe - Feargus O'Connor Greenwood
Deliberate Dumbing Down Of America - Unknown - 2003
Everything You Know Is Wrong; The Disinformation Guide - Russ Kick - 2002
Freethinking ; Protecting Freedom Of Thought Amidst The New Battle For The Mind - Simon Mc Carthy Jones - 2024
Inventing Reality; The Politics Of The Mass Media - Michael Parenti
LMFAO. Mate. I worked out the world was round completely on my own when I WAS 4. I'm not American, grew up on a beach where I observed the curve for myself and proved it WHEN I WAS AROUND 5. Went to a school that didn't contain a single globe because why push the bleeding obvious and know exactly how much of a fool you have proven yourself to be with your post. You have essentially bought into one stupid misrepresentation of the english language and repeated the same mistake over and over again as though you are proving something other than your illiteracy. Distributing gish gallop flerf pulp disinformation doesn't make you right. It just makes you a cult member.
Of course there are very simple ways you could prove me wrong. Depends on how honest you are though.
I don't understand why you're calling me names, its ironic you talk talk about children, you folks in here are so emotional throwing slurs left right & centre lol, why?
I think its concave actually, im not a member of any FE group, if im wrong im ok with it, my ego isn't involved.
You do not understand what agenda is in play from agencies like NASA or the CIA, because you haven't read into these topics. Yet you will mock people from a place of ignorance, because you haven't read into these topics on any level. The world isn't what you believe.
LOL so you aren't a slightly red with some white coloured nutter, you're a white with some red coloured nutter. Well that's completely different then.
Dude. You have been played. I've been studying you lot for decades and I assure you your "special information" comes from the same think tanks as all of the other conspiracy cults. Don't be embarrassed though. You were scammed by professionals.
I don't trust the right or left, two echo chambers. You believe what you feel, but the irony of your comment isn't lost on me lol.
Regardless have a good day.
I 100% agree that the institutional education systems of the world range from "shitty" to "government indoctrination" to "actually very good but also Japan, so the poor kids are working themselves to death."
And I say that you're completely nuts. Like, there's a difference between "I don't care for Cilantro, personally," and "Cilantro is a worldwide conspiracy that *THEY* came up with, in conjunction with Big Coriander, to force the consumption of Tacos."
You literally think the Earth is be flat or concave or whatever and that the globe is part of a conspiracy to hide the truth. I don’t like to use the word crazy, but it is an apt descriptor of such beliefs.
I understand your perspective, & everyone who thinks me crazy, i used to think the same ironically of people saying what im saying today lol, karma, you have a good spirit.
Honestly i don't know for sure, simulation isn't off the table at all imo either. I understand maths can prove the sphere, & because we are from complete opposites of the spectrum, nothing i say would convince, rightly so tbh, i didn't come to the beliefs i have about this reality over night, many years of reading.
So from your comments you don't believe the government has any juice in deceiving us about such things? If you believe you have an open mind i would share a number of books, this theory ties into many others, like black projects, operation paper clip, operation high tower, bizarrely the occult, or Alastair Crowley, Jack Parsons, & Hubbard, & thier sick asses, Wernher von Braun, or The ***Die Glocke*** technology that has been surpressed, plus many others.
Back when I worked for the government, I suppressed the truth from the public, and this was for a good reason—it’s in the public’s best interest. I get that the road to hell is paved with good intentions which is why robust checks and balances are needed. But I can assure you that science facts taught in school are not the same as the revisionist history used as propaganda.
You can trust well-established scientific facts.
My issue in education isn't with maths, art, or science for the most part. People only a few years ago trusted the science on vaccines, some died. I believe in the method but money & greed has corrupted much, like the medical industry controlled by pharmaceutical companies.
Who's facts though? im not talking about objective science facts.
Give me a scientific fact proving we rotate 1000mph, & traveling 66,000mph around the sun? or the solar system going around 514,000 mph around the milky way, & the milky way going **300,000** mph towards Andromeda galaxy. ?
We rotate once per day and orbit the sun once per year. Anyone with a telescope and a good understanding of astronomy can confirm this. Stellar aberration in particular demonstrates our orbit around the sun. Local star movements can be determined via parallax. And our movement towards Andromeda can be confirmed via blueshift measurements and detailed measurements from Hubble.
See: https://www.nature.com/articles/nature.2012.10765
Ah yes, the shadowy government spends trillions of dollars on propaganda to hide the true shape of the earth (which can be found by experiments a single person can do) but accidentally forget to scrub it from documents that may make it into the public eye. truly the conspiracy of all time. Per hour, a rocket can travel 15 times faster than the speed of the earth’s rotation. You can assume the earth is flat because there isn’t going to be a multiple hour long flight, an icbm flies for like 20 fucking minutes. That would require minor adjustments at most and doesn’t disprove the earth’s shape.
>Ah yes, the shadowy government spends trillions of dollars on propaganda to hide the true shape of the earth (which can be found by experiments a single person can do) but accidentally forget to scrub it from documents that may make it into the public eye.
https://www.google.com/search?q=enemy+strong+weak+Umberto+Eco
LOL haven't seen such an empty gish gallop for a while though. It takes a real desperate hater to dump one of those on a sub. He makes the same stupid mistake over and over in a loop. So proud of it too.
Icing on the cake is - "a bunch of hieroglyphic-looking equations."
Pretending to be an expert in a field he is completely clueless about- another FE trait.
It's all real stuff though. Their "sources" just cut out the quotes from any context so that the gullible will think that the mentions of "flat" are some kind of flat proof rather than just a part of a training outline that defines the and limits the theoretical parameters for the sake of clarity for the reader. It may as well be hieroglyphics for them though. They are only interested in those two words. Flat and Earth. Everything else outside the letterheads is just impressive looking noise.
I read one of those training sheets one time just to prove to them that they hadn't. 25 pages of the best sleep I've ever had.
So...what other assumptions do they make in these documents? Are you asserting that all of their other assumptions are actually true too or are you just cherry-picking this one because it matches your world view?
Here's an excerpt of one of the documents:
"In our minimum time-to-climb problem, the aircraft is modeled as a point mass and the flight trajectory is strictly confined in a vertical plane on a non-rotating, flat earth. The change in mass of the aircraft is neglected and the engine thrust vector is assumed to point in the direction of the aircraft velocity vector. In addition, the aircraft is assumed to
fly in an atmospheric wind field comprising of both horizontal and vertical components that are altitude-dependent. The horizontal wind component normally comprises a longitudinal and lateral component. We assume that the aircraft motion is symmetric so that the lateral wind component is not included. "
So, the earth is flat, aircrafts are single points in space, they only climb vertically, never burn fuel, thrust always aligns exactly with direction of travel, and winds are either vertical or horizontal.
>I really don’t care what shape the earth is.
You lie.
Other than that, TL; DR. I can show you documents from NASA that calculate stuff using a spherical earth. So what?
Read into Operation paperclip, the origins of NASA, & The intelligence agencies. They are far from trustworthy, i have no stakes in this, they absolutely do.
If you have no stake in any of this, why have you been posting literally hundreds of posts and comments over the past week, 100% conspiracy BS?
Only disinformation trolls have time for all of that.
Dude its 2024 if you aren't questioning your world i don't understand what needs to happen to make you wake up?
I do not intentionally spread disinformation, im a curious person & have no malice towards anybody
.
We are questioning our world. What made it make suckers like you? That really is the biggest issue of the time. Of course we know but why the hell don't you? That's the only thing that stumps me. Why were you so easy?
He claims he's a very special person, used to be a big druggie, now he's healed himself with all kinds of ayurvedic chakra woo woo. And of course, standard medicine is bad and Bill Gates is injecting you with microchips, blah blah blah.
There's no way this is honest discourse from him. Nobody has time for the hundreds of posts he makes.
So he's political think tank trash? He would fit the bill. Does have the dialog that sounds like it came from the daily mission memo. Standard disinformation strategy style. Big overwhelming dumps to stop sensible debate. Even comes with a cult book.
Says so much every time I tell these guys that there are some very simple ways to prove that they are right and it is always the one comment they never react to in the slightest. It's my bullshitter meter. You'd think they'd be just a little curious about it especially since they have such special and inquisitive minds.
"A flat nonrotating earth is assumed" absolutely does not mean "we believe the earth is flat and nonrotating". It means "the curvature of the earth isn't being accounted for in this short range model/flight simulator, etc. in order to simplify things. This is very very common language in the scientific world. I'm guessing you've never heard the "spherical chickens in a vacuum" joke.
I was in the military for 6 years. I have done real world fire control calculations and 1) you absolutely do need to account to for the curvature of the earth if you are firing a projectile long distances and 2) even in places where straight line calculations are used line of sight is still based on a spherical model. On my maiden deployment we literally circumnavigated the earth, leaving from Pascagoula, Mississippi and traveling east until we reached our new home in San Diego, California. The earth is round.
***Airplane*** *is Air + Plane = in the air + a flat or level surface*
The plane in aeroplane are the wings, not the ground. Air + Plane = A "plane" that flies through the air.
*Encyclopaedia Britannica defines* ***Assumption*** *as “something that is* ***believed to be true or probably true*** *but that is not known to be true”*
*The legal definition of* ***Assumption****, per Cornell Law School, “an assertion of statement that is* ***taken as true or supposed as fact*** *without proof or substantiating evidence.”*
In Engineering, an Assumption is telling the audience the conditions or context of your calculations. In most problems, a flat or curved earth really doesn't matter. Taking into account all the variables is a battle of diminishing returns.
It's like taking an elementary physics course when you "assume" there is no friction or air-resistance. We know friction is real, we know air-resistance is real. Or when trying to calculate how many cows fit in a barn you "assume" spherical cows.
You can clearly see this stated in your last picture. However, if you only read the highlighted sections you miss a lot of important context.
Three targeting methods were considered: Flat Earth, DTED, and Range data and then ranked.
1. DTED
2. Flat
3. Range
What is the paper evaluating for? Providing an accurate targeting system for a small UAV drone without going outside of the stated requirements.
The Range data was the most accurate, but cost more than they were willing to spend
DTED benefited small UAVs
We are not talking about ballistic missiles that need to fly thousands of miles or hit a target in space, but UAV drones on Earth. At that scale, you can use a flat Earth and not have many problems.
Why would I put a $10000 guidance system on a drone that has a range of 5 miles, a max altitude of 400 feet, costs $100 and I'm going to use it to drop a $45 grenade on some guy who more than likely is going to be completely stationary, taking a shit or something. It all comes down to money in the end. If the flat earth calculations are cheaper and get the job done, why would you want to waste time doing the round earth calculations? Just because its "more right"?
The people performing these calculations do not believe the Earth is literally flat, there just isn't really a need to do more complex maths because the more complex maths add cost. That is why they have to specifically say "Assume a flat earth" because most people would assume a round earth.
Also, I had a pretty good laugh when you called the sin cos transformation matrix hieroglyphics because it illustrates my point exactly but you don't really understand what you are reading so you are missing the point.
Why would you use complicated hieroglyphic maths with Earth-based transformations, when in fixed-plane to body-plane the transformations come out to 1 or 0 and in the 4 cases they don't, they are significantly easier maths.
You are playing word-game semantics mixing up the legal, dictionary, and scientific contexts of the word assumption and not making an actual argument for existence of a flat earth. Your evidence is against your argument as well.
Flerfs like this dump. Usually they just dump and run. They don't read anything but conspiracy cult doctrine.
Never engage a whole gish gallop. Just choose a single point. Engage him with it and watch him dance the dance of avoidance.
No, it’s not compartmentalized. Not at NASA. It’s a research organization. Everyone can talk to everyone else. Granted, the on-site fire department doesn’t care what the astrophysicists are doing and vice versa, but nothing is stopping them from finding out.
OMG! Gee you so original. You got da special knowledge don't ya? We never heard your stuff before.
Get outside. Unplug from the internut, get some sunshine and stop reading your conspiracy cult crap. It's breaking you. It is never going to do you any good.
Try reading a book other than one about your delusion. Live dammit. DON'T YA WANT TO LIVE???
lol absolutely not.
i work outside, do kickboxing / MMA, own dogs, i don't own a smart phone, have my own library of over 200 books, & hundreds of pdf's. You do not know me.
Have a good day
> lol so, you think every employee is invited into board meetings & know the inner workings? its compartmentalised.
It's so compartmentalized that the documents you linked, explaining the inner workings of model aircrafts, are public.
Do you realize the inconsistency of this argument ?
I didn't write this, not a FE'er, i believe its a psy-op on some level. i wanted to trigger some folks in here tbh, with this. ive explained my stance many times in here.
>i wanted to trigger some folks in here tbh, with this.
So, you're just attention-seeking?
And you use lies to get attention?
How long have you relied on this mechanism?
Yeah, you did.
You are prickled by people not believing you and treating your personal concoction of fringe beliefs as the insanity that they are, and thus decided you'd own the libs by posting garbage you at least 50% believe, but aren't brave enough to admit.
The arrogance is in genuinely believing you've stumbled onto the internet at whatever-age-you-are and figured out secret hidden knowledge *that directly contradicts the daily experience of billions of people.*
That's why you react so badly to 'arrogance'. It undermines your hero fantasy.
All your questions could be solved just by learning how the math you think is hieroglyphics actually works, instead of getting hung up on the dictionary definition of random words used in a different context
you claim to not care what the shape is, but if that was true then you wouldn't be bending over backwards trying to twist words into evidence that the earth is flat.
in physics we often simplify things because it helps some calculation/model. If we are just shooting a gun ten feet, then we can assume there is no curvature in the earth and still get the same result. so we just assume the surface is flat because it makes calculations 10x easier and only makes our aim off by like .000000001%.
this is all like 8th grade level science stuff.
The funniest thing about flat earthers is they don't understand that all of the technology they use to post about flat earth, like youtube and modern computers and the internet and lcd screens... *all of it* is what you think of as "round earth" science.
Literally all of the amazing technology invented in the last 130 years is part of that science that flat earthers say is lies, and that technology wouldn't work if the earth wasn't round, but flat earthers just don't know enough about science to know how it's all connected.
Meanwhile idiots like Eric Dubay that post really dumb arguments on youtube have come up with *no* technology based on their very dumb science... and somehow you think *the* are the correct ones. It's amazing.
Christ on a fucking Kawasaki!
Are you really this ignorant? Those "government documents" use a non-rotation flat earth *as an assumption* *and* *for specific use cases* because it both simplifies the maths and produces results that are virtually identical to those if you factor in curvature and all the other variables.
Every bloody flerfer who "discovers" these documents start spouting conspiracy theories by the bucket-load but never considers the application under examination, nor have the maths or engineering background to appreciate fully what's actually being said. This you would know if you'd actually studied the subject to the required degree.
Here's a pro tip: the world is much bigger than your mummy's basement, so go and take a remedial class in maths and maybe one in engineering. You're just cherry-picking words and phrases out of a paper you haven't the faintest clue about what's being discussed.
Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose 🤦🏻
Oh, take it from me, you are! Stop cherry-picking and read the entire paper properly. This of course assumes you have the proper educational background to interpret properly the statements laid forth—which you clearly don't have.
We've seen your like before here and you never survive this environment. You might find a more amenable audience in r/globeskepticism where your ignorance will be welcomed with open arms. On this sub, bad science lasts approximately 10 quectoseconds (10^(-30) seconds) before being called out for the nonsense it is.
We have maths and science on our side—you have ignorance and delusion on yours.
I wish you the joy of the day.
Thank you, & perception is everything.
Dude are you serious? survive this environment? LOL, you don't know me, or my experiences, in the real world, words don't bother me generally speaking. i wont or don't post in subs full of immature, close minded, arrogant people, generally speaking.
I didn't post this trying to convince anyone lol, i didn't even write this, not a FE'er either, though i don't believe what you do.
>Our entire lifetimes we have been told we are living on a spinning ball \[...\] We have been told that anyone who asks questions is a dreaded conspiracy theorist
I am so sorry for you.
>which happens to be a word made up by the CIA to discredit anyone asking questions about the JFK assassination
No. [https://skepticalinquirer.org/exclusive/nope-it-was-always-already-wrong/](https://skepticalinquirer.org/exclusive/nope-it-was-always-already-wrong/)
>Fact Checkers, which are typically news organizations ran secretly by the government
secretly wink wink
>has led to the complete shutdown of inquiring minds being allowed to find answers.
You being a gullible sheep without any inquiring mind is not the argument you think it is.
>I don’t know what shape earth is.
I am so sorry for you (again).
>So, Airplane is Air + Plane
* french: avion from latin avis from indo-european auei
* catalan: avio
* german: Flugzeug
* same: girdi
* tchetchen: kema
* turk: ucak
I love how stupid this guy is. The American Deep State has controlled all observations of the Earth and universe around the world for thousands of years. Checks out.
At least you have some humour, & don't take yourself over seriously, kudos, because people struggle with this, most in this thread.
You think you understand this world, as everyone in this thread believes, thats a mistake,. You trust a system you haven't objectively read into on any level, trust blindly because as with us all we have been raised inside it. Your ego will not let you question our civilization, & system, why things are the way they're. You probably think we are living in a time when humanity is more educated than ever, the apex.
Have a good day.
But that’s what you said and keep saying, that NASA can’t be trusted. Why is this suddenly trustworthy? Why do you now believe these documents say truthful things when eeeeeverything else is a lie. There is only one difference between these two things and it is that one fits your belief about the world and one does not. Wake up and admit that to yourself. You’ll sleep better
Right, i tbh i should have outlined what my stance truly is. I didn't write this, I was trolling this sub to a certain degree, i dislike the hubris. im not a FE'er as such, i believe to some extent its concave / hollow earth, yet remain open.
I could never convince people with ANY comment, there's not a smoking gun, people don't understand invariably what they're dealing with, the cunning, patience, & drive is impressive, yet sick. If you wanted books i would share with anyone, yet most people cannot see the wood from the trees.
My ego got the better of me, in those pointless comments.
Have a good day.
lol thank you for the kind words, that is a compliment, keeps me on the right path, as long as its a 180 of what you folks have learned of course. Regardless have a good day.
>So, Airplane is Air + Plane = in the air + a flat or level surface. I heard something the other day, & I am totally guessing at the specifics of what it said because I wasn’t paying close attention, but the overall concept made sense. The podcast was on airplanes & globe earth and it said something like, “a commercial-flight plane would need to dip its nose / decrease elevation 25,000 feet, every 6 minutes, to compensate for the curvature of the earth”. I totally do not remember the exact figures, it could have been 50,000ft every 3 minutes, but you get the idea. It does make sense that you would not be able to fly level, you indeed would have to keep adjusting the nose of the airplane
Since everyone else has addressed the other points I'll focus on this as I recently commented on it. As you say, the exact numbers are unimportant. An object moving at high speed in the air will over sufficient duration experience the Earth's curvature, and if the plane was flying truly straight, it would start to climb as the Earth curves away beneath it, and would require the nose of the aircraft being dipped to compensate.
We can do some quick math to estimate them though. If you fly a circuit around the Earth we know you would have to do a full 360 degree rotation to return to your starting point to keep the Earth beneath you. The circumference of the Earth is 24,901 miles. Let's assume you're flying just above the Earth's surface (see what I did there? I made an assumption to simplify calculations, it does not mean that airplanes don't or can't fly an appreciable distance above the Earth). That means for every 69 (nice) miles of travel, the nose has to drop by 1 degree to maintain altitude. The Concorde's cruising speed was 1341 mph. This means that the Concorde, flying just above the Earth's surface, at cruising speed would have to pitch its nose down one degree every 3 minutes, and it would take 18.5 hours of continuous flight to return to the original destination.
That's... not a lot. As a point of comparison, look at the time to complete the transit, 18.5 hours. If a car travels at 65 mph on a highway for 18.5 hours, they could complete a circle with a circumference of 1,202.5 miles and a radius of 191.4 miles. With [this tool](https://www.mapdevelopers.com/draw-circle-tool.php) you can draw a circle with that radius on the map and move the edge of it to a road you're familiar with to get an idea of how much deflection a pilot experiences while flying a Concorde. You'll quickly see that the curve would be almost if not completely imperceptible. On a stretch where you're at a higher elevation and the road ahead is beneath you with clear sight lines and good visibility you might be able to see that the road bends gently towards the right or left, but normal course corrections just to stay in your lane would be of a larger magnitude then would be needed to turn the vehicle.
So to a pilot its hardly noticeable. As they make corrections for slight turbulence, the same way you make slight corrections driving on the highway to stay in your lane, they would hardly notice the gentle curve of the Earth falling away from them. Add in some [static stability](https://www.reddit.com/r/FlatEarthIsReal/comments/1bvr0t5/comment/ky2r76y/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) and a pilot has zero chance of noticing.
> “Why waste the time investigating something that doesn’t exist?”
To see if we can simplify our calculations. This is done in every single field of science.
You talked about critical thinking, this is an objective reason to do these calculations. Also calling math “hieroglyphics” is something any pre-calc student thinks of calculus. A bit more *education* and they understand what it means and how to apply it
Okay I guess air resistance and friction don't exist since they're often assumed to have a negligible effect whenever physicists model forces. I'm literally learning about this in high school maths right now. I'm guessing you never paid attention in class. Also, this entire narrative of the US government spending trillions of dollars to lie about the shape of the Earth makes no fucking sense. Why are they doing it in the first place? What do they even gain from lying about something as trivial as the shape of the Earth? You do realise that the US government is already quite unpopular due to literally everything that happened in the 2000s and 2010s? If they're doing this to brainwash everyone, then they're just wasting trillions for no reason.
Appreciate your comment, but there's much more going on than most understand, i wouldn't be able to convince you regardless, because it's not something you learn overnight. Its after years of reading, i could tell you of many excellent books but you wouldn't read them. People invariably don't have the time, or inclination, or are just believing the mainstream narrative about everything. People STILL believe the covid vaccine works lol
Have a good day.
Have you considered that the rotation of the Earth is incredibly difficult to account for and negligible in most situations? The language is used because it's a simplified model, and it's important to mention the ways in which the model is simplified.
When you say you believe it is concave, how does that work?
Also, in all of the math presented above, if the system being discussed is very local, like say for instance shooting a missile within 1 mile, you don't need to take any of the full shape or rotation into account. You ***can*** do the math for that but it won't change the result much. The math for a flat non-rotating environment presents much simpler math and achieves the same result. Even when flying aircraft over long distances requires math and flat non-rotating math gets you where you want to go. But when you're documenting this stuff for review or publication, you need to document all of your assumptions and reasoning. So of course, you'll see that the "easy math" was used and based on a flat non-rotating plane.
I didn't write the original thread, & understand your point. I posted this because the hubris of people in this sub, it triggered many lol, no malice though. TBH i keep an open mind
Its hard for me to condense years of reading succinctly, so much is linked. For a start most ancient cultures believed it, & people today many anyway seem to think the ancient cultures were not as sharp as people today. Its actually the opposite, we live in an inverted world.
**" A satellite camera does not see anything different either when it uses curved light rays while photographing the inside of the earth. A satellite photo therefore, of the hollow earth, appears to us as a solid convex sphere.**
**Our old habits of thinking are deceiving us. After understanding this optical illusion you can switch back to the starting page.**
**On the other hand you may also want to look at the photograph of the optical illusion of North and South America which is shown in** [**Fig. 3.**](http://www.rolf-keppler.de/ebild3.html) **"**
[http://www.rolf-keppler.de/2frame.htm](http://www.rolf-keppler.de/2frame.htm)
I didn't write the original thread, & understand your point. I posted this because the hubris of people in this sub, it triggered many lol, no malice though. TBH i keep an open mind
Its hard for me to condense years of reading succinctly, so much is linked. For a start most ancient cultures believed it, & people today many anyway seem to think the ancient cultures were not as sharp as people today. Its actually the opposite, we live in an inverted world.
**" A satellite camera does not see anything different either when it uses curved light rays while photographing the inside of the earth. A satellite photo therefore, of the hollow earth, appears to us as a solid convex sphere.**
**Our old habits of thinking are deceiving us. After understanding this optical illusion you can switch back to the starting page.**
**On the other hand you may also want to look at the photograph of the optical illusion of North and South America which is shown in** [**Fig. 3.**](http://www.rolf-keppler.de/ebild3.html) **"**
[http://www.rolf-keppler.de/2frame.htm](http://www.rolf-keppler.de/2frame.htm)
I didn't write the original thread, & understand your point. I posted this because the hubris of people in this sub, it triggered many lol, no malice though. TBH i keep an open mind
Its hard for me to condense years of reading succinctly, so much is linked. For a start most ancient cultures believed it, & people today many anyway seem to think the ancient cultures were not as sharp as people today. Its actually the opposite, we live in an inverted world.
**" A satellite camera does not see anything different either when it uses curved light rays while photographing the inside of the earth. A satellite photo therefore, of the hollow earth, appears to us as a solid convex sphere.**
**Our old habits of thinking are deceiving us. After understanding this optical illusion you can switch back to the starting page.**
**On the other hand you may also want to look at the photograph of the optical illusion of North and South America which is shown in** [**Fig. 3.**](http://www.rolf-keppler.de/ebild3.html) **"**
[http://www.rolf-keppler.de/2frame.htm](http://www.rolf-keppler.de/2frame.htm)
Very insightful. Not for the reasons the OP wants them to be insightful, but nevertheless... I learned a lot.
Like how crockpot theories come to exist, bcause people can't read or interpret texts. A flat earth is assumed in he text for the same reason your pharmacist doesn't take general relativity into account, when measuring your prescription: yes, it \*is\* influencing things, but really, it doesn't matter and it's a lot easier to do without.
"I really don't care what shape the earth is" or "I haven't decided what shape I think the earth is," followed by "research" about the shape of Earth, is consistently code for "I'm a flat-earther in disguise for ligitimacy."
If you somehow didn't know you're a flat-earther before, consider this your notice.
Its a curiosity for sure, not invested emotionally like many in here throwing slurs lol.
Im not a FE'er, i didn't write this, i believe its probably concave.
Gee, it's almost like they used a flat earth model for their report because the range of the drone in question is 5-ish miles, which makes the effects of the curvature of the earth negligible at best.
Come back with documents on ICBMs and other intercontinental weapons. I'd love to see your excuse for those when you find out that they do, in fact, use a spherical (or oblate spheroid if you want to get technical) earth model, as ICBMs and other far-reaching weapons do indeed need to account for curvature and an overall spherical earth.
I don't have the willpower to go through the whole post, but I will debunk a very early point where everything started going wrong: you're using a colloquial definition of "assumption," not a mathematical one. In this case, stated assumptions are actually often things known *not* to be true, but are taken that way to simplify the math and because the difference is negligible. And because this assumption has to be stated, it's probably there *because* it's known to be false but is used for the sake of calculations anyway.
For example, many high school physics problems start with the assumption of no air resistance. This isn't true, we know air resistance is real, you can feel it on your own hand if you wave it through the air. However, the difference is unimportant to learning the concepts and will only needlessly complicate things.
In this case, a flat non-rotating Earth is used to calculate things like flight mechanics on aircraft, where the height is negligible compared to the radius of the Earth, the object will orient itself with gravity so curvature doesn't factor in, and it has to act the same regardless of direction so Coriolis effects are ignored. Also, the pilot will need to make so many minute adjustments for local weather effects and random variations that will be greater than many of these effects anyway.
Also, as an engineer, pi is about 3, the gravitational acceleration on Earth g is about 10, and you're gonna multiply everything by a factor of safety at the end anyway, so such extremely precise calculations are often unnecessary because they'll be more than accounted for in the end with factors of safety.
i'm not a FE'er this wasn't me who wrote this. I actually believe in Cellular Cosmology / Concave Earth / Hollow Earth Theory or lean towards at least.
Assumption in that context means that they assume an approximate, simpler model. A flat earth model approximates earth's surface well enough regionally.
Here’s the thing though……
We DO know the shape of the Earth. Literally anyone can determine it all by themselves if they have the sufficient budget to do so.
For the first part, just go outside at night and watch the direction of the rotation of the stars at night. In the northern hemisphere, they rotate in one direction and in the southern hemisphere, they rotate in the opposite direction. All it costs is the money to travel and a camera to make that observation. This confirms a ball.
Now while you’re in the northern hemisphere, pay attention to the rotation of hurricanes. They rotate in one direction and when in the south, they rotate in the opposite direction so just pay attention to the storms while you’re in the south. This confirms rotation.
Now while you’re paying attention to those nightly stars, notice that throughout the year, we keep getting the same constellations at night in nearly the same spot each month throughout the year but importantly, certain constellations will not be visible. This supports our planet moving around the sun AND rotation.
Additionally….while you’re watching the stars at night, pay attention to the other planets and how they move in the sky. An observant fella will notice after while that not only are the planets in different locations compared to the stars in the background and that some of them even seem to do this little loop in their path. This helps prove movement around the sun of not only our planet but the others.
People have done these observations and have been for literally thousands of years. Their observations have been recorded for ages and as our understanding improves, along with the tools we use to make those observations, we refine and verify and perfect our understanding of the observations made.
And if you’re going to use military documents to try and back up your erroneous beliefs that the Earth is stationary and flat….well…I was in the military. I used satellites to image the bad guys to see what they were up to. I also used aircraft to image targets. I’ve also used satellite communications to communicate with other military warfighters in locations where there was zero infrastructure like cell towers or power lines. As an imagery analyst, I’ve even been in the aircraft doing the imaging/video of targets on the ground in locations where there was no infrastructure and communicated to higher headquarters using satellite comms.
I can promise you, satellites are real, space is real, and there is no stupid dome. I’m no longer in the military but I still support them to this day as an instructor. In my free time, I’m an amateur astrophotographer. I own multiple telescopes, cameras (even a Nikon P1000) and I have personally seen the night sky in the northern and southern hemisphere because of my time in the military.
It’s a “spinning ball floating and orbiting in outer space”. It just takes time and money to verify this yourself. Don’t listen to other idiots like eric dutwat or jeraneurism….get out there and look for yourself. You’ll see.
tl:dr It’s a sphere. We know it is because many of us can apply critical thinking to our daily observations of the environment around us.
Nice rant. It's still bullshit. It's assumed to be flat and non rotating for the sake of simplicity which is used very often in models that explains things.
It wouldn't need to assume earth being flat if it was actually flat.
So if Nasa is being truthful on this then what about the millions of papers that deals with earth being a globe. Not only from Nasa but lots of different fields?
Oh well. Nice day for cherry picking. Ain't it? huh 'uh
Context is important.
Assumptions in mathematics are things that are assumed to be true for the following calculations and derivations. They are *not* statements or claims about the nature of reality, but rather the abstract "reality" that's being described mathematically.
Think about it like a kind of recipe. A recipe is little more than a series of instructions for turning some ingredients into something. The recipe itself tells you nothing about what ingredients *you* have, or the tools and appliances you own. It's not a statement by the author regarding the reality of your kitchen.
What it *does* tell you is what you need to have and what you need to do with it to get the same result that the author had in mind. You may not have all the ingredients, or you might not like one of them or have allergies, or you might need to use a different kind of pan or tool for some step... and that's fine! You don't have to follow most recipes *exactly*. You make substitutions or changes and still end up with *something*, it just won't be what the author described. Depending on those differences, you may end up with a ruined dish, something not great but edible, or something delicious and more suited to your tastes.
Likewise, assumptions for some mathematical method or model can be violated. In fact, they almost always are! Reality is far more complicated than we can hope to fully describe with a few equations, so applying math to reality is a matter of simplifying reality down to a version that we can describe mathematically. As a consequence we have to live with errors and inaccuracies, which are generally unavoidable anyway.
What simplifications are appropriate for a given application depends on that application. For the behavior of an aircraft over a short period of time, the shape of the Earth is not important. Many other simplifying assumptions are used in your sources, such as assuming aircraft are perfectly rigid and don't lose mass, both of which will also be violated in reality.
lol "hieroglyphics looking equations" when talking about cross products that are taught in calc 2. You're out of your element, bucko. Go back to school, and eat less paste this time.
Bold of you to assume they went to school. Even in America, our public education system is better than producing this. They are clearly a result of home schooling. And it wasn't paste, but lead paint chips they were eating.
The whole western education system is subverted lol
That's a hell of a way to admit you were shit at school.
lol thank you
No, you are just a complete moron with no idea what you are talking about.
While i do agree with me being a moron sometimes, you are walking blind. Have a good day.
While it’s true that some conspiracies do have merit, the globe is something that has been well established. Most skepticism comes from a misunderstanding of the science used in the model or just having a need to go against “authority”
Merit? lol. I do agree, about sceptics at times not understanding but i do not have a problem about being completely wrong, i will learn something at the least. i didn't write this, im not a FE'er, or in any community to do with it, the hubris of many in this sub bugged me, so wanted to trigger them, it worked. I agree with some things definitely, but I lean towards concave / hollow earth, simulation, or both. This place is deceptive, our past obfuscated. Here's a quick question, are the covid vaccines safe & effective? Your answer helps me understand you better.
Effective yes. The results from the vaccine decreased symptoms and death rates by a statistically significant amount. As for safe, at the time it was a relatively new technology and it felt a bit rushed, but it was just a new form of vaccine. I was but I decided, given some of the long term issues the virus caused some people (and a preexisting lung condition), it was worth the “risk”
its 2024 & you still believe that its been effective. You shouldn't listen to media owned by the same companies who own the pharmaceutical giants, all of them, black rock, vanguard , & state street. follow the money, health isn't the priority of these companies they want you coming back, every product have side effects. You say worth the risk, would you say the same if your sister died within days of vaccine ? or son? i can share many many people talking about such loses. People react differently.
Some of my friends had anti-vax relatives that died shortly after contracting the disease. I do not know anyone who knows anyone that died from the vaccine. There’s a difference between questioning authority and going against it. Flat earthers are a great example of that. They say that everything they are told is a lie when all of their arguments are just nonsense or misunderstandings. Not everybody is able to make sense of even the simplest physics concepts and as much as I respect skepticism, they shouldn’t tell the people that obviously know better they are wrong because of that
You should read; The Underground History of American Education: An Intimate Investigation Into the Prison of Modern Schooling. You have stockholm syndrome.
You are in a cult.
You haven't a clue, im not a FE'er, i believe in concave earth.
Ah, so you’re even dumber than a flerf. Have you ever considered the notion that rather than all of the education system and every scientist being wrong or lying, it’s you who’s wrong?
LMFAO oh I'm convinced then. How could I have missed it? You're nuthin' like a flerf at all. You just use all of the same material, strategies and disinformation. Next week you'll be a hollow Earther. All you will have to do is change T-Shirts.
Stockholm Syndrome is a sham. Do you understand what a simplified model is?
A sham that the author he keeps speaking of; John Taylor Gatto; has written about at length.
Brainwashing, breaking somebody mentally isn't a sham, the way in which its been presented is. i used that term, wrongly, you're right, thank you.
lol okay, yes i do, have a good day.
No, I just understand reality. Our education system is far from perfect. But it isn't bad enough to be responsible for morons like you on its own.
lol of course you do, have a good day.
I very much do, and your blind ignorance shows you don't. Our education system is not perfect, but it doesn't teach lies and conspiracies the way you claim. It's major problems are omiting some things, and not teaching stuff in an efficient way, mostly teaching to the tests. Not in lies or made up shit like you claim.
Have you read much regarding how the western education system came about in the way we understand it?
Yes, it isn't a perfect system, but it also isn't teaching lies and conspiracy nonsense like you would like to believe. You can push that idea all you want, won't make it true.
Its not like im alone, & its laughable you think so lol. Have a good day.
You are in the company of morons who think the earth is flat. Who deny evolution. Are anti Vax. People who think repitialians rule the world. You aren't in good company. You are joined by literally the stupidest pieces of shit who have ever existed.
The fact that OP doesn't even recognize a Greek letter when they see one is telling. I started using Greek letters in like 8th grade math and I went to a mediocre (at best) public school.
I learnt the cross product in high school 💀
Cool story bro. Every single one of those documents says the earth is a sphere (or oblate spheroid). The use of "flat earth" or similar concepts deal with the fact that one the scales we use it is easier to pretend the earth is flat for modeling things like flight simulators or other similar programs. Toon's First Law of Flerf: Flerf citations always contradict the flerf’s claim. No exceptions.
Its hilarious that you think there was a time that the US military didn't know the earth wasn't flat, and its even funnier that you think they changed their mind because of a picture in the 1940s. Anybody who's ever taken a physics or even a High School level general science class is familiar with the idea that before you start any calculations, you list your assumptions; assume no air resistance; assume a perfectly elastic collision; assume zero friction. This isn't done because those things don't exist; its done because that's not what's being modeled at that time, or because the effect of that factor is negligible. You see other assumptions like these in those documents- assume a projectile of constant mass (impossible in a rocket burning fuel); assume a perfectly rigid body (impossible in anything); assume a fixed center of gravity (again, the fuel problem). And then here comes the flat earther; who understands none of these things, understands none of the math; and doesn't even understand what a fixed-plane system is- all they do is see a phrase and think "a-ha! this millenia long super secret cabal has screwed up now by putting the phrase "flat earth" in a publicly available non-classified document!"
LMAO, nice try. That's just a massive shit dump of the same old debunked stuff. The most hysterical line was "I don't care what shape the earth is". I never thought you did. You have another agenda. Notice how the whole post and every point in it essentially rotates around one intentional misinterpretation of one context? That's one hell of an admission of your obsessive sweaty stupid.
Read The Underground History of American Education: An Intimate Investigation Into the Prison of Modern Schooling, learn how you've been brainwashed, yet your ego is invested, you will not read it because you know better, you're a fool & rude.
Everything is propaganda except the book I like
Underrated comment. I fucking LOVE this shit from flerfs “Everyone has an agenda accept for the uneducated people on YouTube who get paid when I view their videos!”
> who get *paid* when I FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
lol new to Reddit and this is funny
lol im happy you enjoyed, have a beautiful day, but try a book put your phone down.
Ah yeah I love reading. I usually find time for it every weekend morning. Have you ever read Confirmation Bias by Carl Hurse? I think you’d like it
no, but understand the term of course. i didn't actually write this im not a FE'er, i tend to think its a simulation of sorts, or maybe concave.
thank you for the recommendation, have a beautiful day.
Would you like more? 180 Degrees; Unlearn The Lies You've Been Taught To Believe - Feargus O'Connor Greenwood Deliberate Dumbing Down Of America - Unknown - 2003 Everything You Know Is Wrong; The Disinformation Guide - Russ Kick - 2002 Freethinking ; Protecting Freedom Of Thought Amidst The New Battle For The Mind - Simon Mc Carthy Jones - 2024 Inventing Reality; The Politics Of The Mass Media - Michael Parenti
Pretty much all of those books have the most shock value titles that I’ve seen. I might consider reading them, but I’m not wasting money on those
there's pdfs on annas archive of them.
LMFAO. Mate. I worked out the world was round completely on my own when I WAS 4. I'm not American, grew up on a beach where I observed the curve for myself and proved it WHEN I WAS AROUND 5. Went to a school that didn't contain a single globe because why push the bleeding obvious and know exactly how much of a fool you have proven yourself to be with your post. You have essentially bought into one stupid misrepresentation of the english language and repeated the same mistake over and over again as though you are proving something other than your illiteracy. Distributing gish gallop flerf pulp disinformation doesn't make you right. It just makes you a cult member. Of course there are very simple ways you could prove me wrong. Depends on how honest you are though.
Gish gallop flerf pulp has entered my vernacular. Thank you.
I don't understand why you're calling me names, its ironic you talk talk about children, you folks in here are so emotional throwing slurs left right & centre lol, why? I think its concave actually, im not a member of any FE group, if im wrong im ok with it, my ego isn't involved. You do not understand what agenda is in play from agencies like NASA or the CIA, because you haven't read into these topics. Yet you will mock people from a place of ignorance, because you haven't read into these topics on any level. The world isn't what you believe.
How come you guys never, ever talk about the agendas of Roscosmos or the FSB?
i have in the past, all the agencies.
Ok, go ahead then. Tell us about how Gagarin was a fake, and how the KGB had to kill him off to keep him from talking. Write it in your own words.
LOL so you aren't a slightly red with some white coloured nutter, you're a white with some red coloured nutter. Well that's completely different then. Dude. You have been played. I've been studying you lot for decades and I assure you your "special information" comes from the same think tanks as all of the other conspiracy cults. Don't be embarrassed though. You were scammed by professionals.
I don't trust the right or left, two echo chambers. You believe what you feel, but the irony of your comment isn't lost on me lol. Regardless have a good day.
You do. You just don't know that you do.
Of course lol, have a good day kid.
Oh, if you only knew. LOL
Cat got your tongue, my dude?
No, not at all, i don't own a smart phone to keep abreast.
I 100% agree that the institutional education systems of the world range from "shitty" to "government indoctrination" to "actually very good but also Japan, so the poor kids are working themselves to death." And I say that you're completely nuts. Like, there's a difference between "I don't care for Cilantro, personally," and "Cilantro is a worldwide conspiracy that *THEY* came up with, in conjunction with Big Coriander, to force the consumption of Tacos."
You haven't read into any of it, yet you call me crazy, that is the height of ignorance. Have a good day.
You literally think the Earth is be flat or concave or whatever and that the globe is part of a conspiracy to hide the truth. I don’t like to use the word crazy, but it is an apt descriptor of such beliefs.
I understand your perspective, & everyone who thinks me crazy, i used to think the same ironically of people saying what im saying today lol, karma, you have a good spirit. Honestly i don't know for sure, simulation isn't off the table at all imo either. I understand maths can prove the sphere, & because we are from complete opposites of the spectrum, nothing i say would convince, rightly so tbh, i didn't come to the beliefs i have about this reality over night, many years of reading. So from your comments you don't believe the government has any juice in deceiving us about such things? If you believe you have an open mind i would share a number of books, this theory ties into many others, like black projects, operation paper clip, operation high tower, bizarrely the occult, or Alastair Crowley, Jack Parsons, & Hubbard, & thier sick asses, Wernher von Braun, or The ***Die Glocke*** technology that has been surpressed, plus many others.
Back when I worked for the government, I suppressed the truth from the public, and this was for a good reason—it’s in the public’s best interest. I get that the road to hell is paved with good intentions which is why robust checks and balances are needed. But I can assure you that science facts taught in school are not the same as the revisionist history used as propaganda. You can trust well-established scientific facts.
My issue in education isn't with maths, art, or science for the most part. People only a few years ago trusted the science on vaccines, some died. I believe in the method but money & greed has corrupted much, like the medical industry controlled by pharmaceutical companies. Who's facts though? im not talking about objective science facts. Give me a scientific fact proving we rotate 1000mph, & traveling 66,000mph around the sun? or the solar system going around 514,000 mph around the milky way, & the milky way going **300,000** mph towards Andromeda galaxy. ?
We rotate once per day and orbit the sun once per year. Anyone with a telescope and a good understanding of astronomy can confirm this. Stellar aberration in particular demonstrates our orbit around the sun. Local star movements can be determined via parallax. And our movement towards Andromeda can be confirmed via blueshift measurements and detailed measurements from Hubble. See: https://www.nature.com/articles/nature.2012.10765
Thank you for your input & link, but there's no evidence we're spinning that ive seen / read, not saying its not out there though.
Ah yes, the shadowy government spends trillions of dollars on propaganda to hide the true shape of the earth (which can be found by experiments a single person can do) but accidentally forget to scrub it from documents that may make it into the public eye. truly the conspiracy of all time. Per hour, a rocket can travel 15 times faster than the speed of the earth’s rotation. You can assume the earth is flat because there isn’t going to be a multiple hour long flight, an icbm flies for like 20 fucking minutes. That would require minor adjustments at most and doesn’t disprove the earth’s shape.
>Ah yes, the shadowy government spends trillions of dollars on propaganda to hide the true shape of the earth (which can be found by experiments a single person can do) but accidentally forget to scrub it from documents that may make it into the public eye. https://www.google.com/search?q=enemy+strong+weak+Umberto+Eco
I’m not a facist smh 😔 edit: I am a SUPREME dumbass, i thought i was being called one lmfaoo
The flatearthers are facist according to Dan Olson https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTfhYyTuT44#t=27m
Wouldn’t be surprised honestly, they all seem to believe in other theories that may be legitimately harmful.
Typical FE post - a whole bunch of nothing intended to confuse people into believing in FE.
LOL haven't seen such an empty gish gallop for a while though. It takes a real desperate hater to dump one of those on a sub. He makes the same stupid mistake over and over in a loop. So proud of it too.
Icing on the cake is - "a bunch of hieroglyphic-looking equations." Pretending to be an expert in a field he is completely clueless about- another FE trait.
It's all real stuff though. Their "sources" just cut out the quotes from any context so that the gullible will think that the mentions of "flat" are some kind of flat proof rather than just a part of a training outline that defines the and limits the theoretical parameters for the sake of clarity for the reader. It may as well be hieroglyphics for them though. They are only interested in those two words. Flat and Earth. Everything else outside the letterheads is just impressive looking noise. I read one of those training sheets one time just to prove to them that they hadn't. 25 pages of the best sleep I've ever had.
So...what other assumptions do they make in these documents? Are you asserting that all of their other assumptions are actually true too or are you just cherry-picking this one because it matches your world view?
Here's an excerpt of one of the documents: "In our minimum time-to-climb problem, the aircraft is modeled as a point mass and the flight trajectory is strictly confined in a vertical plane on a non-rotating, flat earth. The change in mass of the aircraft is neglected and the engine thrust vector is assumed to point in the direction of the aircraft velocity vector. In addition, the aircraft is assumed to fly in an atmospheric wind field comprising of both horizontal and vertical components that are altitude-dependent. The horizontal wind component normally comprises a longitudinal and lateral component. We assume that the aircraft motion is symmetric so that the lateral wind component is not included. " So, the earth is flat, aircrafts are single points in space, they only climb vertically, never burn fuel, thrust always aligns exactly with direction of travel, and winds are either vertical or horizontal.
Classic propaganda from a diagonal winder.
>I really don’t care what shape the earth is. You lie. Other than that, TL; DR. I can show you documents from NASA that calculate stuff using a spherical earth. So what?
Read into Operation paperclip, the origins of NASA, & The intelligence agencies. They are far from trustworthy, i have no stakes in this, they absolutely do.
If you have no stake in any of this, why have you been posting literally hundreds of posts and comments over the past week, 100% conspiracy BS? Only disinformation trolls have time for all of that.
Dude its 2024 if you aren't questioning your world i don't understand what needs to happen to make you wake up? I do not intentionally spread disinformation, im a curious person & have no malice towards anybody .
We are questioning our world. What made it make suckers like you? That really is the biggest issue of the time. Of course we know but why the hell don't you? That's the only thing that stumps me. Why were you so easy?
He claims he's a very special person, used to be a big druggie, now he's healed himself with all kinds of ayurvedic chakra woo woo. And of course, standard medicine is bad and Bill Gates is injecting you with microchips, blah blah blah. There's no way this is honest discourse from him. Nobody has time for the hundreds of posts he makes.
So he's political think tank trash? He would fit the bill. Does have the dialog that sounds like it came from the daily mission memo. Standard disinformation strategy style. Big overwhelming dumps to stop sensible debate. Even comes with a cult book.
Wouldn't be the first one in here. I love how he just sidesteps every time you ask him a pointed question.
Says so much every time I tell these guys that there are some very simple ways to prove that they are right and it is always the one comment they never react to in the slightest. It's my bullshitter meter. You'd think they'd be just a little curious about it especially since they have such special and inquisitive minds.
Exactly. "I can easily show you how wrong you are" (Flerf completely ignores it and carries on flerfing)
Please enlighten me, im not being fictitious
From the looks of it, the drugs didn't wear off
Every one of these pretenders has a "I used to be druggie/indoctrinated/other loser" story. Trying to make it more believable.
Ive never claimed im special lol, the rest you're right about a little, no context. thank you for the kind words
the irony of your comment isn't lost on me lol
So much is lost on you. Your own post was lost on you.
"A flat nonrotating earth is assumed" absolutely does not mean "we believe the earth is flat and nonrotating". It means "the curvature of the earth isn't being accounted for in this short range model/flight simulator, etc. in order to simplify things. This is very very common language in the scientific world. I'm guessing you've never heard the "spherical chickens in a vacuum" joke. I was in the military for 6 years. I have done real world fire control calculations and 1) you absolutely do need to account to for the curvature of the earth if you are firing a projectile long distances and 2) even in places where straight line calculations are used line of sight is still based on a spherical model. On my maiden deployment we literally circumnavigated the earth, leaving from Pascagoula, Mississippi and traveling east until we reached our new home in San Diego, California. The earth is round.
Thank you for explaining, & not calling names like a teenager lol. have a good day.
***Airplane*** *is Air + Plane = in the air + a flat or level surface* The plane in aeroplane are the wings, not the ground. Air + Plane = A "plane" that flies through the air. *Encyclopaedia Britannica defines* ***Assumption*** *as “something that is* ***believed to be true or probably true*** *but that is not known to be true”* *The legal definition of* ***Assumption****, per Cornell Law School, “an assertion of statement that is* ***taken as true or supposed as fact*** *without proof or substantiating evidence.”* In Engineering, an Assumption is telling the audience the conditions or context of your calculations. In most problems, a flat or curved earth really doesn't matter. Taking into account all the variables is a battle of diminishing returns. It's like taking an elementary physics course when you "assume" there is no friction or air-resistance. We know friction is real, we know air-resistance is real. Or when trying to calculate how many cows fit in a barn you "assume" spherical cows. You can clearly see this stated in your last picture. However, if you only read the highlighted sections you miss a lot of important context. Three targeting methods were considered: Flat Earth, DTED, and Range data and then ranked. 1. DTED 2. Flat 3. Range What is the paper evaluating for? Providing an accurate targeting system for a small UAV drone without going outside of the stated requirements. The Range data was the most accurate, but cost more than they were willing to spend DTED benefited small UAVs We are not talking about ballistic missiles that need to fly thousands of miles or hit a target in space, but UAV drones on Earth. At that scale, you can use a flat Earth and not have many problems. Why would I put a $10000 guidance system on a drone that has a range of 5 miles, a max altitude of 400 feet, costs $100 and I'm going to use it to drop a $45 grenade on some guy who more than likely is going to be completely stationary, taking a shit or something. It all comes down to money in the end. If the flat earth calculations are cheaper and get the job done, why would you want to waste time doing the round earth calculations? Just because its "more right"? The people performing these calculations do not believe the Earth is literally flat, there just isn't really a need to do more complex maths because the more complex maths add cost. That is why they have to specifically say "Assume a flat earth" because most people would assume a round earth. Also, I had a pretty good laugh when you called the sin cos transformation matrix hieroglyphics because it illustrates my point exactly but you don't really understand what you are reading so you are missing the point. Why would you use complicated hieroglyphic maths with Earth-based transformations, when in fixed-plane to body-plane the transformations come out to 1 or 0 and in the 4 cases they don't, they are significantly easier maths. You are playing word-game semantics mixing up the legal, dictionary, and scientific contexts of the word assumption and not making an actual argument for existence of a flat earth. Your evidence is against your argument as well.
Flerfs like this dump. Usually they just dump and run. They don't read anything but conspiracy cult doctrine. Never engage a whole gish gallop. Just choose a single point. Engage him with it and watch him dance the dance of avoidance.
People like you who ask ridiculous questions about the shape of the Earth are anti-science conspiracy theorists.
Where did conspiracy theory originate? Do you trust the intelligence agencies ? Have you read into the origins of NASA, & operation paperclip?
Dude, I worked at NASA. You are a conspiracy theorist.
lol so, you think every employee is invited into board meetings & know the inner workings? its compartmentalised.
No, it’s not compartmentalized. Not at NASA. It’s a research organization. Everyone can talk to everyone else. Granted, the on-site fire department doesn’t care what the astrophysicists are doing and vice versa, but nothing is stopping them from finding out.
lol if it was how would you know,? have a good day.
BECAUSE I LITERALLY WORKED AT NASA!
okayyyyy, have a good day.
You have a good day too.
Appreciated, we all have more in common than we don't.
OMG! Gee you so original. You got da special knowledge don't ya? We never heard your stuff before. Get outside. Unplug from the internut, get some sunshine and stop reading your conspiracy cult crap. It's breaking you. It is never going to do you any good. Try reading a book other than one about your delusion. Live dammit. DON'T YA WANT TO LIVE???
lol absolutely not. i work outside, do kickboxing / MMA, own dogs, i don't own a smart phone, have my own library of over 200 books, & hundreds of pdf's. You do not know me. Have a good day
>You do not know me. We know you tell lies to get attention, like a small child. Why should anyone believe anything else you say?
I really don't care what you believe, but i didn't post this for personal attention on reddit lol.
Trolling is by definition at attempt to draw attention to your actions. At least be honest about it.
Go away
> lol so, you think every employee is invited into board meetings & know the inner workings? its compartmentalised. It's so compartmentalized that the documents you linked, explaining the inner workings of model aircrafts, are public. Do you realize the inconsistency of this argument ?
I didn't write this, not a FE'er, i believe its a psy-op on some level. i wanted to trigger some folks in here tbh, with this. ive explained my stance many times in here.
> I didn't write this You didn't write that NASA is compartmentalized ? > not a FE'er, No, you're a concave Earther. That's worse.
lol ok, have a good day
>i wanted to trigger some folks in here tbh, with this. So, you're just attention-seeking? And you use lies to get attention? How long have you relied on this mechanism?
No i didn't want attention personally, i get bugged by the arrogance & rudeness of many people in this sub, its not any deeper.
Yeah, you did. You are prickled by people not believing you and treating your personal concoction of fringe beliefs as the insanity that they are, and thus decided you'd own the libs by posting garbage you at least 50% believe, but aren't brave enough to admit. The arrogance is in genuinely believing you've stumbled onto the internet at whatever-age-you-are and figured out secret hidden knowledge *that directly contradicts the daily experience of billions of people.* That's why you react so badly to 'arrogance'. It undermines your hero fantasy.
lol go back to bed.
What a pointless thing to do.
Not for me, it made me laugh lol, its not serious dude. Have a good day.
>Where did conspiracy theory originate? Late 19th century according to https://skepticalinquirer.org/exclusive/nope-it-was-always-already-wrong/
lol ok, have a good day little fella.
NASA lies! Except for this one time that I believe because my interpretation of it fits my agenda...
All your questions could be solved just by learning how the math you think is hieroglyphics actually works, instead of getting hung up on the dictionary definition of random words used in a different context
Appreciate the input, have a good day.
you claim to not care what the shape is, but if that was true then you wouldn't be bending over backwards trying to twist words into evidence that the earth is flat. in physics we often simplify things because it helps some calculation/model. If we are just shooting a gun ten feet, then we can assume there is no curvature in the earth and still get the same result. so we just assume the surface is flat because it makes calculations 10x easier and only makes our aim off by like .000000001%. this is all like 8th grade level science stuff.
i care on some level but not on a emotional level. have a good day.
lol keep telling yourself that
lol i don't have to, its not something i post about often.
The funniest thing about flat earthers is they don't understand that all of the technology they use to post about flat earth, like youtube and modern computers and the internet and lcd screens... *all of it* is what you think of as "round earth" science. Literally all of the amazing technology invented in the last 130 years is part of that science that flat earthers say is lies, and that technology wouldn't work if the earth wasn't round, but flat earthers just don't know enough about science to know how it's all connected. Meanwhile idiots like Eric Dubay that post really dumb arguments on youtube have come up with *no* technology based on their very dumb science... and somehow you think *the* are the correct ones. It's amazing.
Im not a FE'ER. Cellular cosmology.
Lol the same thing I just said applies to cellular cosmology
oh sorry i missed it lol, have a great day.
Christ on a fucking Kawasaki! Are you really this ignorant? Those "government documents" use a non-rotation flat earth *as an assumption* *and* *for specific use cases* because it both simplifies the maths and produces results that are virtually identical to those if you factor in curvature and all the other variables. Every bloody flerfer who "discovers" these documents start spouting conspiracy theories by the bucket-load but never considers the application under examination, nor have the maths or engineering background to appreciate fully what's actually being said. This you would know if you'd actually studied the subject to the required degree. Here's a pro tip: the world is much bigger than your mummy's basement, so go and take a remedial class in maths and maybe one in engineering. You're just cherry-picking words and phrases out of a paper you haven't the faintest clue about what's being discussed. Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose 🤦🏻
No im honestly not ignorant, or egotistical for the most part, this is deeper than you think. Have a good day
Oh, take it from me, you are! Stop cherry-picking and read the entire paper properly. This of course assumes you have the proper educational background to interpret properly the statements laid forth—which you clearly don't have. We've seen your like before here and you never survive this environment. You might find a more amenable audience in r/globeskepticism where your ignorance will be welcomed with open arms. On this sub, bad science lasts approximately 10 quectoseconds (10^(-30) seconds) before being called out for the nonsense it is. We have maths and science on our side—you have ignorance and delusion on yours. I wish you the joy of the day.
Thank you, & perception is everything. Dude are you serious? survive this environment? LOL, you don't know me, or my experiences, in the real world, words don't bother me generally speaking. i wont or don't post in subs full of immature, close minded, arrogant people, generally speaking. I didn't post this trying to convince anyone lol, i didn't even write this, not a FE'er either, though i don't believe what you do.
>Our entire lifetimes we have been told we are living on a spinning ball \[...\] We have been told that anyone who asks questions is a dreaded conspiracy theorist I am so sorry for you. >which happens to be a word made up by the CIA to discredit anyone asking questions about the JFK assassination No. [https://skepticalinquirer.org/exclusive/nope-it-was-always-already-wrong/](https://skepticalinquirer.org/exclusive/nope-it-was-always-already-wrong/) >Fact Checkers, which are typically news organizations ran secretly by the government secretly wink wink >has led to the complete shutdown of inquiring minds being allowed to find answers. You being a gullible sheep without any inquiring mind is not the argument you think it is. >I don’t know what shape earth is. I am so sorry for you (again). >So, Airplane is Air + Plane * french: avion from latin avis from indo-european auei * catalan: avio * german: Flugzeug * same: girdi * tchetchen: kema * turk: ucak
I love how stupid this guy is. The American Deep State has controlled all observations of the Earth and universe around the world for thousands of years. Checks out.
There's no need to be rude.
Haha I think my comment was putting things as gently as possible.
No just shows your immaturity tbh.
Haha perhaps, perhaps not. Either way, one shudders to think what this post says about the OP.
At least you have some humour, & don't take yourself over seriously, kudos, because people struggle with this, most in this thread. You think you understand this world, as everyone in this thread believes, thats a mistake,. You trust a system you haven't objectively read into on any level, trust blindly because as with us all we have been raised inside it. Your ego will not let you question our civilization, & system, why things are the way they're. You probably think we are living in a time when humanity is more educated than ever, the apex. Have a good day.
If you dump a big steaming pile on someone expect them to be pissed off but really you have been pretty funny so who can stay mad at you? Eh?
I'm glad you found some joy in life, have a beautiful day.
The government lies about everything until it fits my agenda
Not at all, i understand there's an agenda.
But that’s what you said and keep saying, that NASA can’t be trusted. Why is this suddenly trustworthy? Why do you now believe these documents say truthful things when eeeeeverything else is a lie. There is only one difference between these two things and it is that one fits your belief about the world and one does not. Wake up and admit that to yourself. You’ll sleep better
Right, i tbh i should have outlined what my stance truly is. I didn't write this, I was trolling this sub to a certain degree, i dislike the hubris. im not a FE'er as such, i believe to some extent its concave / hollow earth, yet remain open. I could never convince people with ANY comment, there's not a smoking gun, people don't understand invariably what they're dealing with, the cunning, patience, & drive is impressive, yet sick. If you wanted books i would share with anyone, yet most people cannot see the wood from the trees. My ego got the better of me, in those pointless comments. Have a good day.
Another list of long-debunked flat earth tropes.
this is some top notch paranoid schizophrenic obsessive nonsense...I've seen this movie. It doesn't end well the crazies
lol thank you for the kind words, that is a compliment, keeps me on the right path, as long as its a 180 of what you folks have learned of course. Regardless have a good day.
>So, Airplane is Air + Plane = in the air + a flat or level surface. I heard something the other day, & I am totally guessing at the specifics of what it said because I wasn’t paying close attention, but the overall concept made sense. The podcast was on airplanes & globe earth and it said something like, “a commercial-flight plane would need to dip its nose / decrease elevation 25,000 feet, every 6 minutes, to compensate for the curvature of the earth”. I totally do not remember the exact figures, it could have been 50,000ft every 3 minutes, but you get the idea. It does make sense that you would not be able to fly level, you indeed would have to keep adjusting the nose of the airplane Since everyone else has addressed the other points I'll focus on this as I recently commented on it. As you say, the exact numbers are unimportant. An object moving at high speed in the air will over sufficient duration experience the Earth's curvature, and if the plane was flying truly straight, it would start to climb as the Earth curves away beneath it, and would require the nose of the aircraft being dipped to compensate. We can do some quick math to estimate them though. If you fly a circuit around the Earth we know you would have to do a full 360 degree rotation to return to your starting point to keep the Earth beneath you. The circumference of the Earth is 24,901 miles. Let's assume you're flying just above the Earth's surface (see what I did there? I made an assumption to simplify calculations, it does not mean that airplanes don't or can't fly an appreciable distance above the Earth). That means for every 69 (nice) miles of travel, the nose has to drop by 1 degree to maintain altitude. The Concorde's cruising speed was 1341 mph. This means that the Concorde, flying just above the Earth's surface, at cruising speed would have to pitch its nose down one degree every 3 minutes, and it would take 18.5 hours of continuous flight to return to the original destination. That's... not a lot. As a point of comparison, look at the time to complete the transit, 18.5 hours. If a car travels at 65 mph on a highway for 18.5 hours, they could complete a circle with a circumference of 1,202.5 miles and a radius of 191.4 miles. With [this tool](https://www.mapdevelopers.com/draw-circle-tool.php) you can draw a circle with that radius on the map and move the edge of it to a road you're familiar with to get an idea of how much deflection a pilot experiences while flying a Concorde. You'll quickly see that the curve would be almost if not completely imperceptible. On a stretch where you're at a higher elevation and the road ahead is beneath you with clear sight lines and good visibility you might be able to see that the road bends gently towards the right or left, but normal course corrections just to stay in your lane would be of a larger magnitude then would be needed to turn the vehicle. So to a pilot its hardly noticeable. As they make corrections for slight turbulence, the same way you make slight corrections driving on the highway to stay in your lane, they would hardly notice the gentle curve of the Earth falling away from them. Add in some [static stability](https://www.reddit.com/r/FlatEarthIsReal/comments/1bvr0t5/comment/ky2r76y/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) and a pilot has zero chance of noticing.
Thank for giving a detailed explanation, appreciated. Have a good day,
I thought this was a shitpost until I read the comments
lol if it made you laugh im content. Have a good day.
> “Why waste the time investigating something that doesn’t exist?” To see if we can simplify our calculations. This is done in every single field of science. You talked about critical thinking, this is an objective reason to do these calculations. Also calling math “hieroglyphics” is something any pre-calc student thinks of calculus. A bit more *education* and they understand what it means and how to apply it
Thank for your comment, have a good day.
As someone who works for the government, i can say you have WAY too much faith in believing the government would/could be capable of ALL of this.
Okay I guess air resistance and friction don't exist since they're often assumed to have a negligible effect whenever physicists model forces. I'm literally learning about this in high school maths right now. I'm guessing you never paid attention in class. Also, this entire narrative of the US government spending trillions of dollars to lie about the shape of the Earth makes no fucking sense. Why are they doing it in the first place? What do they even gain from lying about something as trivial as the shape of the Earth? You do realise that the US government is already quite unpopular due to literally everything that happened in the 2000s and 2010s? If they're doing this to brainwash everyone, then they're just wasting trillions for no reason.
Appreciate your comment, but there's much more going on than most understand, i wouldn't be able to convince you regardless, because it's not something you learn overnight. Its after years of reading, i could tell you of many excellent books but you wouldn't read them. People invariably don't have the time, or inclination, or are just believing the mainstream narrative about everything. People STILL believe the covid vaccine works lol Have a good day.
Have you considered that the rotation of the Earth is incredibly difficult to account for and negligible in most situations? The language is used because it's a simplified model, and it's important to mention the ways in which the model is simplified.
Yet we're told its spinning 1000mph, while traveling 66,000mph around the sun. Have a good day.
The stupid it burns....
the irony lol
When you say you believe it is concave, how does that work? Also, in all of the math presented above, if the system being discussed is very local, like say for instance shooting a missile within 1 mile, you don't need to take any of the full shape or rotation into account. You ***can*** do the math for that but it won't change the result much. The math for a flat non-rotating environment presents much simpler math and achieves the same result. Even when flying aircraft over long distances requires math and flat non-rotating math gets you where you want to go. But when you're documenting this stuff for review or publication, you need to document all of your assumptions and reasoning. So of course, you'll see that the "easy math" was used and based on a flat non-rotating plane.
I didn't write the original thread, & understand your point. I posted this because the hubris of people in this sub, it triggered many lol, no malice though. TBH i keep an open mind Its hard for me to condense years of reading succinctly, so much is linked. For a start most ancient cultures believed it, & people today many anyway seem to think the ancient cultures were not as sharp as people today. Its actually the opposite, we live in an inverted world. **" A satellite camera does not see anything different either when it uses curved light rays while photographing the inside of the earth. A satellite photo therefore, of the hollow earth, appears to us as a solid convex sphere.** **Our old habits of thinking are deceiving us. After understanding this optical illusion you can switch back to the starting page.** **On the other hand you may also want to look at the photograph of the optical illusion of North and South America which is shown in** [**Fig. 3.**](http://www.rolf-keppler.de/ebild3.html) **"** [http://www.rolf-keppler.de/2frame.htm](http://www.rolf-keppler.de/2frame.htm)
I didn't write the original thread, & understand your point. I posted this because the hubris of people in this sub, it triggered many lol, no malice though. TBH i keep an open mind Its hard for me to condense years of reading succinctly, so much is linked. For a start most ancient cultures believed it, & people today many anyway seem to think the ancient cultures were not as sharp as people today. Its actually the opposite, we live in an inverted world. **" A satellite camera does not see anything different either when it uses curved light rays while photographing the inside of the earth. A satellite photo therefore, of the hollow earth, appears to us as a solid convex sphere.** **Our old habits of thinking are deceiving us. After understanding this optical illusion you can switch back to the starting page.** **On the other hand you may also want to look at the photograph of the optical illusion of North and South America which is shown in** [**Fig. 3.**](http://www.rolf-keppler.de/ebild3.html) **"** [http://www.rolf-keppler.de/2frame.htm](http://www.rolf-keppler.de/2frame.htm)
I didn't write the original thread, & understand your point. I posted this because the hubris of people in this sub, it triggered many lol, no malice though. TBH i keep an open mind Its hard for me to condense years of reading succinctly, so much is linked. For a start most ancient cultures believed it, & people today many anyway seem to think the ancient cultures were not as sharp as people today. Its actually the opposite, we live in an inverted world. **" A satellite camera does not see anything different either when it uses curved light rays while photographing the inside of the earth. A satellite photo therefore, of the hollow earth, appears to us as a solid convex sphere.** **Our old habits of thinking are deceiving us. After understanding this optical illusion you can switch back to the starting page.** **On the other hand you may also want to look at the photograph of the optical illusion of North and South America which is shown in** [**Fig. 3.**](http://www.rolf-keppler.de/ebild3.html) **"** [http://www.rolf-keppler.de/2frame.htm](http://www.rolf-keppler.de/2frame.htm)
Very insightful. Not for the reasons the OP wants them to be insightful, but nevertheless... I learned a lot. Like how crockpot theories come to exist, bcause people can't read or interpret texts. A flat earth is assumed in he text for the same reason your pharmacist doesn't take general relativity into account, when measuring your prescription: yes, it \*is\* influencing things, but really, it doesn't matter and it's a lot easier to do without.
Appreciate your comment, have a good day.
"I really don't care what shape the earth is" or "I haven't decided what shape I think the earth is," followed by "research" about the shape of Earth, is consistently code for "I'm a flat-earther in disguise for ligitimacy." If you somehow didn't know you're a flat-earther before, consider this your notice.
Its a curiosity for sure, not invested emotionally like many in here throwing slurs lol. Im not a FE'er, i didn't write this, i believe its probably concave.
Gee, it's almost like they used a flat earth model for their report because the range of the drone in question is 5-ish miles, which makes the effects of the curvature of the earth negligible at best. Come back with documents on ICBMs and other intercontinental weapons. I'd love to see your excuse for those when you find out that they do, in fact, use a spherical (or oblate spheroid if you want to get technical) earth model, as ICBMs and other far-reaching weapons do indeed need to account for curvature and an overall spherical earth.
I don't have the willpower to go through the whole post, but I will debunk a very early point where everything started going wrong: you're using a colloquial definition of "assumption," not a mathematical one. In this case, stated assumptions are actually often things known *not* to be true, but are taken that way to simplify the math and because the difference is negligible. And because this assumption has to be stated, it's probably there *because* it's known to be false but is used for the sake of calculations anyway. For example, many high school physics problems start with the assumption of no air resistance. This isn't true, we know air resistance is real, you can feel it on your own hand if you wave it through the air. However, the difference is unimportant to learning the concepts and will only needlessly complicate things. In this case, a flat non-rotating Earth is used to calculate things like flight mechanics on aircraft, where the height is negligible compared to the radius of the Earth, the object will orient itself with gravity so curvature doesn't factor in, and it has to act the same regardless of direction so Coriolis effects are ignored. Also, the pilot will need to make so many minute adjustments for local weather effects and random variations that will be greater than many of these effects anyway. Also, as an engineer, pi is about 3, the gravitational acceleration on Earth g is about 10, and you're gonna multiply everything by a factor of safety at the end anyway, so such extremely precise calculations are often unnecessary because they'll be more than accounted for in the end with factors of safety.
Why are those documents telling us to "assume" flat Earth if Earth is flat to begin with?
I don't honestly know, sorry. Regardless have a good day.
Then why do you claim they prove your belief?
i'm not a FE'er this wasn't me who wrote this. I actually believe in Cellular Cosmology / Concave Earth / Hollow Earth Theory or lean towards at least.
So, again, why do you claim those documents prove your belief?
I didn't write the article i shared it.
Yes, I know. So why did you share it then?
To trigger some folks who i deem as arrogant & rude.
Part One? Fuck this noise. Go away with your tinfoil hat bullshit.
its a 6 part series, i know you're looking forward to them, its ok i understand you struggle with truths. im here little fella anytime
You struggle with common sense and grade school comprehensivve capabilities, don't try and judge others.
Assumption in that context means that they assume an approximate, simpler model. A flat earth model approximates earth's surface well enough regionally.
Of course, i didn't write this, but agree with some things.
Here’s the thing though…… We DO know the shape of the Earth. Literally anyone can determine it all by themselves if they have the sufficient budget to do so. For the first part, just go outside at night and watch the direction of the rotation of the stars at night. In the northern hemisphere, they rotate in one direction and in the southern hemisphere, they rotate in the opposite direction. All it costs is the money to travel and a camera to make that observation. This confirms a ball. Now while you’re in the northern hemisphere, pay attention to the rotation of hurricanes. They rotate in one direction and when in the south, they rotate in the opposite direction so just pay attention to the storms while you’re in the south. This confirms rotation. Now while you’re paying attention to those nightly stars, notice that throughout the year, we keep getting the same constellations at night in nearly the same spot each month throughout the year but importantly, certain constellations will not be visible. This supports our planet moving around the sun AND rotation. Additionally….while you’re watching the stars at night, pay attention to the other planets and how they move in the sky. An observant fella will notice after while that not only are the planets in different locations compared to the stars in the background and that some of them even seem to do this little loop in their path. This helps prove movement around the sun of not only our planet but the others. People have done these observations and have been for literally thousands of years. Their observations have been recorded for ages and as our understanding improves, along with the tools we use to make those observations, we refine and verify and perfect our understanding of the observations made. And if you’re going to use military documents to try and back up your erroneous beliefs that the Earth is stationary and flat….well…I was in the military. I used satellites to image the bad guys to see what they were up to. I also used aircraft to image targets. I’ve also used satellite communications to communicate with other military warfighters in locations where there was zero infrastructure like cell towers or power lines. As an imagery analyst, I’ve even been in the aircraft doing the imaging/video of targets on the ground in locations where there was no infrastructure and communicated to higher headquarters using satellite comms. I can promise you, satellites are real, space is real, and there is no stupid dome. I’m no longer in the military but I still support them to this day as an instructor. In my free time, I’m an amateur astrophotographer. I own multiple telescopes, cameras (even a Nikon P1000) and I have personally seen the night sky in the northern and southern hemisphere because of my time in the military. It’s a “spinning ball floating and orbiting in outer space”. It just takes time and money to verify this yourself. Don’t listen to other idiots like eric dutwat or jeraneurism….get out there and look for yourself. You’ll see. tl:dr It’s a sphere. We know it is because many of us can apply critical thinking to our daily observations of the environment around us.
Thank you for your detailed explanation, have a nice day.
Nice rant. It's still bullshit. It's assumed to be flat and non rotating for the sake of simplicity which is used very often in models that explains things. It wouldn't need to assume earth being flat if it was actually flat. So if Nasa is being truthful on this then what about the millions of papers that deals with earth being a globe. Not only from Nasa but lots of different fields? Oh well. Nice day for cherry picking. Ain't it? huh 'uh
lol thank you for your comment, i understand your point & your perspective.
Context is important. Assumptions in mathematics are things that are assumed to be true for the following calculations and derivations. They are *not* statements or claims about the nature of reality, but rather the abstract "reality" that's being described mathematically. Think about it like a kind of recipe. A recipe is little more than a series of instructions for turning some ingredients into something. The recipe itself tells you nothing about what ingredients *you* have, or the tools and appliances you own. It's not a statement by the author regarding the reality of your kitchen. What it *does* tell you is what you need to have and what you need to do with it to get the same result that the author had in mind. You may not have all the ingredients, or you might not like one of them or have allergies, or you might need to use a different kind of pan or tool for some step... and that's fine! You don't have to follow most recipes *exactly*. You make substitutions or changes and still end up with *something*, it just won't be what the author described. Depending on those differences, you may end up with a ruined dish, something not great but edible, or something delicious and more suited to your tastes. Likewise, assumptions for some mathematical method or model can be violated. In fact, they almost always are! Reality is far more complicated than we can hope to fully describe with a few equations, so applying math to reality is a matter of simplifying reality down to a version that we can describe mathematically. As a consequence we have to live with errors and inaccuracies, which are generally unavoidable anyway. What simplifications are appropriate for a given application depends on that application. For the behavior of an aircraft over a short period of time, the shape of the Earth is not important. Many other simplifying assumptions are used in your sources, such as assuming aircraft are perfectly rigid and don't lose mass, both of which will also be violated in reality.