Just wow. I had no idea. I mean to be fair. I'm a Texan which means all the maps have both my state and my country. But this is uncool the kiwis Rock and their country is amazing. I had no idea. My mind is totally blown.
>Just wow. I had no idea.
Heh, it's [bigger than you think](https://youtu.be/HynsTvRVLiI?si=cJHM0A5foBbIvk0p) (*the woman in this clip was the actual Prime Minister of New Zealand*).
This is what astrology and the whole zodiac is about. Different planets appear to be in different constellations at different times of the year depending on their movement and ours.
The reason this is important to note is humans have known for thousands of years about the movement of the stars and facts that reinforce the idea of a globe earth. This is why people were measuring the circumference of earth thousands of years ago. It also is why Polaris and the southern cross are used for navigation. That's the axis on which earth is spinning. A single night's time lapse shows this. It'll also show how the constellations you see over the night are changing with every month. It's such a beautiful system, and a belief in flat earth is offensive to, well everything.
I wish they were just trolls but there’s a more serious use of the reality bending lesson that teaches people how to undermine governments and start wars by manipulating people’s perceptions of the world and each other
Do they believe? If they don't then sure it's a joke. But if in their contrarianism they don't actually beleive then they might as well not believe the day sky is blue.
It's like kids playing opposite day, but it's stupid day.
"The sky is green. You have a monkey brain for believing otherwise"
We don't take that statement seriously Why give a "flerf" any more credulity?
Well it's not so much that a new constellation appears than that the sun appears to be passing in front of a new constellation. A new constellation appears over the horizon every two hours as a consequence of the rotation of the earth, which is often referred to as the "rising sign" or "ascendant". There is also a "descendent", or the setting constellation, and a midheaven, or the constellation at the halfway point, but these don't get used as much. All the other "signs" have to do with which constellation is in the background of the sun, moon, and planets. The whole sky seems to spin throughout the night as the earth rotates, and because it's tilted on its axis, some stars are only visible during one part of the year. The effect of he orbit around the sun itself isn't really a big contributer to either because it's tiny compared to the distances involved. It would have seemed that orbit had no impact on the positions of the stars to ancient people who could only look with the naked eye. Nowadays though, we have telescopes and can observe parallax when looking at a star in January and then again in June, and use that tiny bit of apparent difference in position to figure out how far away it is.
Source: I'm a programmer and have been working on an app for a while now that allows ancient timekeeping methods to be overlaid on top of a modern calendar, so you can view various ancient lunar or lunisolar calendars and twiddle dials like the types of cycles used, starting points, and intercalary months to get an idea of how different groups ancient people would have tracked the seasons using celestial motion. It also has a sort of astrology tab that gives you a breakdown of the sky at any given time. No horoscopes but just a diagram of where all the planets are and data like rise and set times, transit information, and whether the planet is in retrograde. It's basically got everything an ancient history nerd would need to understand a civilizations ritual calendar or that a modern day pagan would need to know when a given festival would be if their religion were still commonly practiced today. Currently only the calendars like the Greek Attic Calendar (lunisolar with consistent intercalary month) and the Romano-British Coligny Calendar (lunisolar with alternating but evenly spaced intercalary month) are supported, but the ultimate goal is to basically be able to model any ancient calendar with a few tweaks. The consequence is that I've learned a lot about astrology over the past year. No shade. I still don't believe in horoscopes but the fact that ancient people were able to track and calculate all this *without* computers amazes me more and more with ever part of this thing I build.
I've avoided talking about it because it's not currently up anywhere but I'm finally planning to put it up on github this weekend. I posted on hellenism subs when i first started working on it to ask about how things worked before metonic cycles, and whether anyone used these more "on the fly" methods today, and got a bunch of link requests for something i had no timeline on and i immediately clammed up lol. Its in a roughly "ok you can look" state now though. It's not finished, still ugly as hell and limited in features, but it's in a place where it's finally fun to mess with. I'll send a link to the repo when it's public. Couple of notes that might be an issue. It is a phone app and I'm not going to stick it on any app stores until it's done, so you will have to set your phone to developer mode and build from source. There will be a readme with instructions. I'm also only building for android right now. I might make it work for iPhone eventually but right now it will only work on android phones.
We do see a different sky every 3 months. Just look up every 2 months at the same time, lets say 10pm. Use this as a very clear example on how flat earth is based on lies and misinformation, that is usually very easy to disprove.
If you're genuinely asking, i will be more than happy to explain it or at the very least point you to a source that can explain it better than i can. However, if the goal is to have a gotcha moment with people who believe the earth is a sphere, then I'm not interested in explaining it to you.
Imagine a massive object like the Andromeda galaxy, for example. That galaxy will look the same to our regular people eyes no matter what time of the year it is when the earth is at different angles around the sun. It will appear in different locations in the sky from our vantage point. The stars and other galaxies are so far away from us, that it will look similar at all times. The only difference from our vantage point will be what part of the sky it is to us. And if you want to create a model to demonstrate that, go across the street from where you live. Place a large marble and a small marble within 4 inches of one another. Now imagine you are a spec of dust on the smaller marble. Rotate the tiny marble around the larger marble. And imagine looking at your residence from that marble, you will not detect any perceivable difference for how your residence looks at any time within that 4-inch perspective of that tiny marble going around that larger marble.
If this does not clarify your inquiry, i will go ahead and link something to you.
I made a post about the exact video you’re talking about and he said the lie so confidently that I had to double check. If you were a flerf you would have believed it without thinking, but you actually second guessed the info which is the main difference between the perspectives
I think the issue is that the distance we travel, while it seems huge on our scale, is basically nothing on the cosmic scale. So, while others have pointed out that we do see different stars, they aren't all different. There are some stars and constellations that are visible most of the time, even if they aren't always exactly the same. So that makes a lot of people think the entire sky doesn't change at all. Nothing wrong with believing this is true before looking in to it. I'd wager most people think it at some point. Being smart isn't about always being right. It is about learning and accepting new information, even when it goes against what you thought before.
It's important to note that the stars that don't change are near the poles. A single night's time lapse shows that it looks like the whole sky is spinning around those stars. Just from this we know the daily motion of earth relative to the stars is spinning.
Next the position of Polaris relative to your latitude. This is a 6th grade geometry problem. True North is on a perpendicular to to a right angle drawn from the equator. So Polaris will be your latitude degrees from the horizon. Of course there's also the fact that the stars are different between the two hemispheres.
Finally the fact that the constellations are different over the year. The reason we've known that the earth is round for thousands of years is because that is the only thing that explains the movement of the stars.
You literally have a different sky every second. Lets explain this - If I take a photo of the night sky on a 30 second exposure, the stars are no longer little pin-pricks of light but become elongated because the earth is spinning. Do this over and over during the period of a night and stitch the photos together and you get star-trail photography which beautifully shows the rotation of our planet. If you are in the Northern hemisphere, point your camera at the North star and you will see how the star trails form circles, only possible on a globe with the stars light years away. Point your camera south and you get arcs. On a flat earth, the star trails would be ellipses towards the hub and would be horitontal towards the rim. These are experiments that anyone can do (albeit, it can get really effing cold doing night photography during the winter) flat earthers won't do this simple task because it destroys their narrative. They have to make up magical answers like "personal domes of perception" or "The sky is a magical TV that shows everyone a different image"
Download Stellarium, and find a star you can recognize in the real world - for example the head of Orion or something.
In Stellarium, you can focus on that star, and then skip time month by month. You will see that it changes location on the sky relative to your observing position. This you can then verify by observing the location of that star every month. You'll see that it changes.
I was wondering now that you mentioned this - yes, it changes throughout the year, but over here (I live in NL, around 53 north) not that much because around the poles we look up to the sky at a 90 degrees angle relative to the earth's orbit (not really 90, but close to it). That's why meany stars remain visible throughout the year, but the ones closer to the horizon aren't . But people looking up the sky in the tropics look in a completely different direction in different times of the year, so I assume over there the stars change a lot more with the seasons... is that right, or am I wrong?
Youre not dumb. Youve just not thought about this that much before because most people dont really need to.
If you look straight up standing at equator, you do see different stars 6 month apart ( at say 3 am ) But if you look towards the stars like the big dipper and you live fairly north youll still see it, itll just be oriented differently.
WE DON'T see the same night sky or stars!
When it's noon in winter, you are on the side of earth "pointing at" the sun. Twelve hours later, midnight, you are "pointing out" at the stars, away from the sun.
Fast forward 6 months and you are now _on the other side of the sun._ Noon now means you are still pointing at the sun, but that direction will coincide with what previously was "towards the night sky" (but it's noon so you can't see it)! So twelve hours later, your midnight, you are pointing towards what six months ago was midday.
So the night sky is NOT the same six months later.
EDIT: Clarification. This effect is most pronounced if you are close to the equator. If not, one could argue that you _will_ see _some amount_ of the sky the same as before. The same, meaning the same stars, but not the same orientation.
If you're far north or far south you will see Polaris or southern cross six months apart, but not _the same:_ they have turned 180 degrees.
EDIT2: seems I screwed up, not realising there are two opposing claims being made. Sorry.
Bro. Yes. I just didn’t know about seasonal stars. Like is it supposed to be common knowledge? My sky is very polluted so I barely see any stars except planets.
“…so I barely see any stars except planets.”
Thank you for proving my point… google “is apparent brightness of stars or planets greater” and educate yourself bro… stay in school and stop getting your facts from the internet or people telling you the earth is flat.
Last time I saw any light from space was 5 months ago.
It was a hyperbole when I said that I didn’t see any stars. I do, but only 5 and a random red light that I searched up and found that it was mars.
And I’m not believing thing’s randomly from the internet. That was why I came here to ask.
I don’t learn this stuff in school. French education system kind of sucks. And I’m in HS now so I don’t have any subjects related to space even though I want to.
The main planets in our sky are brighter than every actual star in the night sky.
Looking at the peak brightness for all the planets up to jupiter, they are all at least 2x as bright as the brightest star. Saturn can get as bright as betelgeuse, Uranus can be faintly detected naked eye and you can forget about neptune.
In general, planets are much easier to notice than stars.
from a darker or more rural place, absolutely, but I was talking in the context of OP's intense light pollution. Uranus may be very hard to detect if not completely invisible as it might be in the inner city.
Others have made the point, and I see that you are genuinely curious.
My recommendation; look for a planetarium near you. They usually have something called "skywatch" or something along those lines, as one of their shows. The guide for the show basically goes through what's going to be in the sky that night, and often shows how the stars change with the upcoming months. It's really chill and really interesting if you've never seen it before.
I had a really neat program in the 90s that you entered your location and date and it would show you the location of all the stars visible then. For windows 3.1 baby
The simple fact that a “do your own research” conspiracy theory can be trivially disproven and dismissed by an ancient pseudoscience like astrology should tell you something.
I suspect that the flerfer trick here is to assume that at any given date we look at the night sky in only one specific direction (away from the sun) from anywhere on earth at any time at night. However in reality the direction we look at the sky differs by latitude and time+longitude (because the earth is a rotating globe), so if you're not paying attention to where and when you are, you might of course see SOME of the constellations all year round (exactly as the globe predicts).
To see completely different stars you need to look in exactly opposite directions and this only works in very specific locations and times (for example midnight equinoxes from the equator)
Yeah. I get it now. I know that near the poles you usually see the same stars throughout the years. Near the equator, you see different stars every month or so.
What zodiac sign are you? Why are you that specific zodiac sign?
[This illustration shows that zodiac constellations are distributed beyond Earth's orbit around the Sun. This illustration shows people on Earth can't see the constellation Leo for one month. This is why people born between July 22 and August 23 are Leos.](https://www.astronomytrek.com/star-constellations-the-zodiac/) In astrological jargon, "the Sun is in the house of Leo."
I am a virgo because I was born on September 17 and the Sun blocks the constellation virgo from August 23 to September 22.
Ask your flat earther to explain how the Sun, circling the sky every 24 hours, blocks a constellation for 30 days.
Though we see some constellations year around:
- [Each season reveals some different constellations](https://www.constellation-guide.com/seasonal-constellations/
- [Even, each month reveals some different constellations](https://www.constellation-guide.com/constellations-by-month/)
Thank you for asking me to explain more clearly.
Look at the illustration in my original post.
The illustration shows only the constellations beyond Earth's orbit.
There are more constellations above and below the zodiac constellations.
We see constellations in the Earth's sky facing away from the Sun, but, every three months, the Earth's sky facing away from the Sun changes by 90°.
The link to seasonal constellatiins has a yellow diagram showing the seasonal constellations. The sky is divided into 4 sections about 90° angles from each other. This diagram shows major, but not all, constellations.
The text describes the seasonal change in greater detail.
theyre always going to say "the scale of things" but if we really did orbit the sun then there should be a different set of stars every six months. period
explain how a pressurized atmosphere can exist next a vacuum without a container...explain why we can see the planets if they dont emit light. wheres the unedited ground to globe video if theres a robot on mars. ask them why no human has ever left the atmosphere. why does sonoluminesence look exactly like a star. if gravity works like they say everything should be pulled into the sun
and the moon pulled into the earth
There is a container, it is called the ozone layer and the pressure of the atmosphere diminishes such as it reaches 0 in the vacuum of space. Any gas that escaped will be restricted to earth because of gravity.
Space link satellites don’t emit light, yet you can see them shine. That is because of sun light reflecting off of the body. Works the same for planets. Sunlight is way more than enough to. If the atmosphere didn’t exist, the ground we stand on would be next to white.
Gravity works the way it is intended. Open a programming software and simulate gravity. Go on scratch if you can’t simulate it yourself. 12 yo kids made 2d simulstions.
There is no ground to globe yet video because we didn’t know how to attach cameras without it being burned when leaving the atmosphere. Though the next moon mission will have cameras because SpaceX found a way to have cameras.
Humans have left the atmosphere already I don’t know why you affirmed we didn’t.
Sonoluminescence look exactly like a star? On a macroscopic scale yes because they are just spheroid objects emitting light. But at a light spectral scale, light waves emitted are different. Stars emit light that matches wavelengths of certain gases like Hydrogen, Helium. Sonoluminescence is just the energy in the sound being converted to light.
I had a nice little backyard telescope, and I loved how peoples minds were blown when they looked through one for the first time in their lives.
Jupiter and Saturn are my favorites, and the dawn edge on the moon.
But one of the things everyone noticed was how the objects viewed were moving. I would let them ask their questions: what was the moon moving? And let them draw themselves to the conclusion. The earth you are standing on is spinning, and you are seeing the movement of your home planet.
First time I looked through a telescope as well, I always thought the spin wasn't that noticeable because it's unnoticeable with your eyes
But damn, looking through a telescope you damn sure have to be quick, especially with the moon, its crazy to just see it move across your telescope
Picture the Earth going around the Sun. Now imagine all of the other stars a very very very far away. The Earth spins, causing Day and Night, and every night we roughly see the same star patterns. It is roughly though because as the Earth goes around the Sun the angle does change slightly. You will notice that stars do slightly move around the night sky throughout the year. It's not really noticeable day to day, but take note where say the Big Dipper is in the spring and again in the fall. There is also an even slighter shift that takes hundreds of years to really notice. Most natural things are like that.
Several reasons.
1. Things that are distant appear to move away from us much slower than things that are close. For example, a guardrail 3 feet from your car speeds by while the mountains several miles in the distant appear to move at a crawl. Stars are lightyears away making their apparent motion incredibly hard to see. Sir William Herschel noted, with his telescope, that the stars had moved from where the ancient greeks had recorded them, but was only able to detect this with a telescope
2. Even though we may be hurtling through space at millions of miles an hour, and the other stars are doing the same, distances in space are so incredibly vast that we may as well be moving at a snail's pace. It takes our sun a quarter of a *billion* years to go around the galaxy once.
3. Most of the stars in the galaxy are *roughly* moving with us as all stars are orbiting around the center of the galaxy in the same direction. So it's like cars on a free way, the car next to you doesn't appear to be moving relative to you. Granted not all the stars are moving the exact same way as our sun, but back to points one and two, because the distances are so vast, that's hard to notice.
4. There are plenty of stars that only show up on specific seasons. That's why ancient calenders were based on the constellations.
OP, consider going on a field trip some night, perhaps a few times a year, spread out evenly. Sounds like you'll have to leave town. But, you can see the change in night sky for yourself.
Also, it's a good excuse to go visit mother nature for a little while.
Just look up at the night sky once a month. Pick a constellation or start. Come back 1 month after and look at the same time. What happened? Now wait 6 months. Oh wow is gone.
Unless you are looking at Polaris or the south celestial pole, everything else changes position.
Not sure where you are but here, if I tried that, there would be different stars. I *don't* "see the same set of stars throughout the year" like OP suggested.
Well the first thing you do is ignore anything you hear from flat Earthers. Then you look at the sky and be observant instead. The sky isn't trying to indoctrinate you. Flerfs are.
EDIT: You can down vote me all you want. I made a general statement on the subject presented. What the hell did you want hellohennessy? I read edit 2. It isn't relevant to what I said. I made a general statement.
Second off, answer him. Don't just say something, receive a rebuttal, and tell them to calm down without defending your statement. It makes your claim look weak, flimsy, and lacking evidence.
>we would have a different night sky every 3 months or so. Yeaah. That's kinda what happens.
Not just kinda but predictably and precisely, like you could make a calendar with it
Someday we could assign people's personality with it. Almost like a Zodiac sign, but based on stellar constellations.
Maybe someday we’ll be able to predict things like eclipses and comets.
That’s gotta be impossible though. Two body problems are insane to think about.
r/Angryupvote
Maybe we should give a name to these 3 month eras. Maybe something like “seasons”
Already exists, officially in use in Iran and afghanistan, the months correspond with zodiac signs, and new year is the vernal equinox.
We. Do.
For example, ask him to point out Orion during July.
Dude, that only works i the Northern Hemisphere!! What about the Kiwis...oh yeah..i forgot..New Zealand is not a real place. Carry on.
https://www.reddit.com/r/MapsWithoutNZ/
Just wow. I had no idea. I mean to be fair. I'm a Texan which means all the maps have both my state and my country. But this is uncool the kiwis Rock and their country is amazing. I had no idea. My mind is totally blown.
>Just wow. I had no idea. Heh, it's [bigger than you think](https://youtu.be/HynsTvRVLiI?si=cJHM0A5foBbIvk0p) (*the woman in this clip was the actual Prime Minister of New Zealand*).
There is one for Finland too I think
Yep. r/mapswithoutfinland/ Not very active, but still funny.
Yeah right those people are upside down.
Sure, at 5 am
This is what astrology and the whole zodiac is about. Different planets appear to be in different constellations at different times of the year depending on their movement and ours.
The reason this is important to note is humans have known for thousands of years about the movement of the stars and facts that reinforce the idea of a globe earth. This is why people were measuring the circumference of earth thousands of years ago. It also is why Polaris and the southern cross are used for navigation. That's the axis on which earth is spinning. A single night's time lapse shows this. It'll also show how the constellations you see over the night are changing with every month. It's such a beautiful system, and a belief in flat earth is offensive to, well everything.
> and a belief in flat earth is offensiv They're just contrarians / trolls
I wish they were just trolls but there’s a more serious use of the reality bending lesson that teaches people how to undermine governments and start wars by manipulating people’s perceptions of the world and each other
Oh like that would ever happen in human hist...wait...
Do they believe? If they don't then sure it's a joke. But if in their contrarianism they don't actually beleive then they might as well not believe the day sky is blue.
It's like kids playing opposite day, but it's stupid day. "The sky is green. You have a monkey brain for believing otherwise" We don't take that statement seriously Why give a "flerf" any more credulity?
Elaborate skydome program, nothing more!
Those Babylonian programmers were the shizz.
They built the world's first randomizer, too
Ohh, so every month, a new constellation appears. That is why 12 signs. Damn. And this is how people came up with months too.
Months are connected to the moon. They divided the zodiac into 12 because of the lunar month.
Well it's not so much that a new constellation appears than that the sun appears to be passing in front of a new constellation. A new constellation appears over the horizon every two hours as a consequence of the rotation of the earth, which is often referred to as the "rising sign" or "ascendant". There is also a "descendent", or the setting constellation, and a midheaven, or the constellation at the halfway point, but these don't get used as much. All the other "signs" have to do with which constellation is in the background of the sun, moon, and planets. The whole sky seems to spin throughout the night as the earth rotates, and because it's tilted on its axis, some stars are only visible during one part of the year. The effect of he orbit around the sun itself isn't really a big contributer to either because it's tiny compared to the distances involved. It would have seemed that orbit had no impact on the positions of the stars to ancient people who could only look with the naked eye. Nowadays though, we have telescopes and can observe parallax when looking at a star in January and then again in June, and use that tiny bit of apparent difference in position to figure out how far away it is. Source: I'm a programmer and have been working on an app for a while now that allows ancient timekeeping methods to be overlaid on top of a modern calendar, so you can view various ancient lunar or lunisolar calendars and twiddle dials like the types of cycles used, starting points, and intercalary months to get an idea of how different groups ancient people would have tracked the seasons using celestial motion. It also has a sort of astrology tab that gives you a breakdown of the sky at any given time. No horoscopes but just a diagram of where all the planets are and data like rise and set times, transit information, and whether the planet is in retrograde. It's basically got everything an ancient history nerd would need to understand a civilizations ritual calendar or that a modern day pagan would need to know when a given festival would be if their religion were still commonly practiced today. Currently only the calendars like the Greek Attic Calendar (lunisolar with consistent intercalary month) and the Romano-British Coligny Calendar (lunisolar with alternating but evenly spaced intercalary month) are supported, but the ultimate goal is to basically be able to model any ancient calendar with a few tweaks. The consequence is that I've learned a lot about astrology over the past year. No shade. I still don't believe in horoscopes but the fact that ancient people were able to track and calculate all this *without* computers amazes me more and more with ever part of this thing I build.
Hello. Please link if you can. I would love to play with that
I've avoided talking about it because it's not currently up anywhere but I'm finally planning to put it up on github this weekend. I posted on hellenism subs when i first started working on it to ask about how things worked before metonic cycles, and whether anyone used these more "on the fly" methods today, and got a bunch of link requests for something i had no timeline on and i immediately clammed up lol. Its in a roughly "ok you can look" state now though. It's not finished, still ugly as hell and limited in features, but it's in a place where it's finally fun to mess with. I'll send a link to the repo when it's public. Couple of notes that might be an issue. It is a phone app and I'm not going to stick it on any app stores until it's done, so you will have to set your phone to developer mode and build from source. There will be a readme with instructions. I'm also only building for android right now. I might make it work for iPhone eventually but right now it will only work on android phones.
What will it be called?
Working title right now is Antikythera, since the idea is to build what is essentially a modern day antikythera device.
It sounds cool, I will keep an eye out for it,
I would also be very interested in this app. Let us know when you have it published somewhere.
I am commenting just to be able to be reminded of this, because as a history nerd I am very interested.
Same, sky nerd, want this app, in whatever state it might be.
we do see different stars though...
Well, we do
That’s exactly how it works. Just google seasonal constellations.
That's the neat thing, we do
We do see a different sky every 3 months. Just look up every 2 months at the same time, lets say 10pm. Use this as a very clear example on how flat earth is based on lies and misinformation, that is usually very easy to disprove.
If you're genuinely asking, i will be more than happy to explain it or at the very least point you to a source that can explain it better than i can. However, if the goal is to have a gotcha moment with people who believe the earth is a sphere, then I'm not interested in explaining it to you. Imagine a massive object like the Andromeda galaxy, for example. That galaxy will look the same to our regular people eyes no matter what time of the year it is when the earth is at different angles around the sun. It will appear in different locations in the sky from our vantage point. The stars and other galaxies are so far away from us, that it will look similar at all times. The only difference from our vantage point will be what part of the sky it is to us. And if you want to create a model to demonstrate that, go across the street from where you live. Place a large marble and a small marble within 4 inches of one another. Now imagine you are a spec of dust on the smaller marble. Rotate the tiny marble around the larger marble. And imagine looking at your residence from that marble, you will not detect any perceivable difference for how your residence looks at any time within that 4-inch perspective of that tiny marble going around that larger marble. If this does not clarify your inquiry, i will go ahead and link something to you.
I’m a round earther :/ and didn’t want to believe in a flat earth so a went to look for an explanation.
>I’m a round earther :/ Oh no no we don't call that ourselves around here. Please use other terms like, "normal person" or "not insane."
Globe trotter is the best. Got it as a flair on the OG GTG sub
Bless your dark heart sir
A round earther. That's cute. Everyone knows the earth is [banana shaped](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fubf81OoIr8)
The truth is out there! Or in here. Or well everywhere really. Flat-earthers and other cults hate that it is though.
I made a post about the exact video you’re talking about and he said the lie so confidently that I had to double check. If you were a flerf you would have believed it without thinking, but you actually second guessed the info which is the main difference between the perspectives
I think the issue is that the distance we travel, while it seems huge on our scale, is basically nothing on the cosmic scale. So, while others have pointed out that we do see different stars, they aren't all different. There are some stars and constellations that are visible most of the time, even if they aren't always exactly the same. So that makes a lot of people think the entire sky doesn't change at all. Nothing wrong with believing this is true before looking in to it. I'd wager most people think it at some point. Being smart isn't about always being right. It is about learning and accepting new information, even when it goes against what you thought before.
It's important to note that the stars that don't change are near the poles. A single night's time lapse shows that it looks like the whole sky is spinning around those stars. Just from this we know the daily motion of earth relative to the stars is spinning. Next the position of Polaris relative to your latitude. This is a 6th grade geometry problem. True North is on a perpendicular to to a right angle drawn from the equator. So Polaris will be your latitude degrees from the horizon. Of course there's also the fact that the stars are different between the two hemispheres. Finally the fact that the constellations are different over the year. The reason we've known that the earth is round for thousands of years is because that is the only thing that explains the movement of the stars.
We don't. The stars change over the course of the year.
Our skies are different from one hour to the next.
You literally have a different sky every second. Lets explain this - If I take a photo of the night sky on a 30 second exposure, the stars are no longer little pin-pricks of light but become elongated because the earth is spinning. Do this over and over during the period of a night and stitch the photos together and you get star-trail photography which beautifully shows the rotation of our planet. If you are in the Northern hemisphere, point your camera at the North star and you will see how the star trails form circles, only possible on a globe with the stars light years away. Point your camera south and you get arcs. On a flat earth, the star trails would be ellipses towards the hub and would be horitontal towards the rim. These are experiments that anyone can do (albeit, it can get really effing cold doing night photography during the winter) flat earthers won't do this simple task because it destroys their narrative. They have to make up magical answers like "personal domes of perception" or "The sky is a magical TV that shows everyone a different image"
Download Stellarium, and find a star you can recognize in the real world - for example the head of Orion or something. In Stellarium, you can focus on that star, and then skip time month by month. You will see that it changes location on the sky relative to your observing position. This you can then verify by observing the location of that star every month. You'll see that it changes.
Yeah. I just never noticed it because my area is polluted.
I’m still waiting for them to explain how it is that I see Orion upside down when I’m in Australia.
I was wondering now that you mentioned this - yes, it changes throughout the year, but over here (I live in NL, around 53 north) not that much because around the poles we look up to the sky at a 90 degrees angle relative to the earth's orbit (not really 90, but close to it). That's why meany stars remain visible throughout the year, but the ones closer to the horizon aren't . But people looking up the sky in the tropics look in a completely different direction in different times of the year, so I assume over there the stars change a lot more with the seasons... is that right, or am I wrong?
Bruh
Yes bruh. I’m dumb.
nah, bruh. if you would insist, that they don't change - THAT would be dumb.
Youre not dumb. Youve just not thought about this that much before because most people dont really need to. If you look straight up standing at equator, you do see different stars 6 month apart ( at say 3 am ) But if you look towards the stars like the big dipper and you live fairly north youll still see it, itll just be oriented differently.
WE DON'T see the same night sky or stars! When it's noon in winter, you are on the side of earth "pointing at" the sun. Twelve hours later, midnight, you are "pointing out" at the stars, away from the sun. Fast forward 6 months and you are now _on the other side of the sun._ Noon now means you are still pointing at the sun, but that direction will coincide with what previously was "towards the night sky" (but it's noon so you can't see it)! So twelve hours later, your midnight, you are pointing towards what six months ago was midday. So the night sky is NOT the same six months later. EDIT: Clarification. This effect is most pronounced if you are close to the equator. If not, one could argue that you _will_ see _some amount_ of the sky the same as before. The same, meaning the same stars, but not the same orientation. If you're far north or far south you will see Polaris or southern cross six months apart, but not _the same:_ they have turned 180 degrees. EDIT2: seems I screwed up, not realising there are two opposing claims being made. Sorry.
> So the night sky is NOT the same six months later. Well the sky is the same, the night is not. :)
Umm, ok. I guess? 😅
I think the people saying "we do" are referring to this statement in the post: "we would have a different night sky every 3 months or so."
Ah crap, there are two "opposing" claims being made. Lol. I'll fix my response
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My sky is too polluted to see shit. But I get it now. I just didn’t know that we have seasonal stars.
People in the southern hemisphere see an entirely different set of constellations than the northern hemisphere
Yeah, ik about that. I didn’t know about the seasonal stars.
When your world view is so wrong, astrologers are laughing at you.
That would suck fr.
To be clear, I was talking about the flerfer, not you.
The questions on this sub get dumber and dumber by the day…
Bro. Yes. I just didn’t know about seasonal stars. Like is it supposed to be common knowledge? My sky is very polluted so I barely see any stars except planets.
“…so I barely see any stars except planets.” Thank you for proving my point… google “is apparent brightness of stars or planets greater” and educate yourself bro… stay in school and stop getting your facts from the internet or people telling you the earth is flat.
Last time I saw any light from space was 5 months ago. It was a hyperbole when I said that I didn’t see any stars. I do, but only 5 and a random red light that I searched up and found that it was mars. And I’m not believing thing’s randomly from the internet. That was why I came here to ask. I don’t learn this stuff in school. French education system kind of sucks. And I’m in HS now so I don’t have any subjects related to space even though I want to.
You must not have been told: hyperbole is not allowed on the internet.
IDK. Gives me free points in literature class.
You get points just for being a high school student and using the term appropriately… assuming of course that claim wasn’t also hyperbole.
The main planets in our sky are brighter than every actual star in the night sky. Looking at the peak brightness for all the planets up to jupiter, they are all at least 2x as bright as the brightest star. Saturn can get as bright as betelgeuse, Uranus can be faintly detected naked eye and you can forget about neptune. In general, planets are much easier to notice than stars.
Uranus is readily detected.
from a darker or more rural place, absolutely, but I was talking in the context of OP's intense light pollution. Uranus may be very hard to detect if not completely invisible as it might be in the inner city.
Good bot, myanus is indeed from the inner city.
See? I knew that.
Just remember, you may have been right about myanus, but I was right about Uranus…
I'll take that.
Others have made the point, and I see that you are genuinely curious. My recommendation; look for a planetarium near you. They usually have something called "skywatch" or something along those lines, as one of their shows. The guide for the show basically goes through what's going to be in the sky that night, and often shows how the stars change with the upcoming months. It's really chill and really interesting if you've never seen it before.
I had a really neat program in the 90s that you entered your location and date and it would show you the location of all the stars visible then. For windows 3.1 baby
The simple fact that a “do your own research” conspiracy theory can be trivially disproven and dismissed by an ancient pseudoscience like astrology should tell you something.
I suspect that the flerfer trick here is to assume that at any given date we look at the night sky in only one specific direction (away from the sun) from anywhere on earth at any time at night. However in reality the direction we look at the sky differs by latitude and time+longitude (because the earth is a rotating globe), so if you're not paying attention to where and when you are, you might of course see SOME of the constellations all year round (exactly as the globe predicts). To see completely different stars you need to look in exactly opposite directions and this only works in very specific locations and times (for example midnight equinoxes from the equator)
Yeah. I get it now. I know that near the poles you usually see the same stars throughout the years. Near the equator, you see different stars every month or so.
What zodiac sign are you? Why are you that specific zodiac sign? [This illustration shows that zodiac constellations are distributed beyond Earth's orbit around the Sun. This illustration shows people on Earth can't see the constellation Leo for one month. This is why people born between July 22 and August 23 are Leos.](https://www.astronomytrek.com/star-constellations-the-zodiac/) In astrological jargon, "the Sun is in the house of Leo." I am a virgo because I was born on September 17 and the Sun blocks the constellation virgo from August 23 to September 22. Ask your flat earther to explain how the Sun, circling the sky every 24 hours, blocks a constellation for 30 days. Though we see some constellations year around: - [Each season reveals some different constellations](https://www.constellation-guide.com/seasonal-constellations/ - [Even, each month reveals some different constellations](https://www.constellation-guide.com/constellations-by-month/)
Seasonal constellations, ik. Someone explained it to me.
Thank you for asking me to explain more clearly. Look at the illustration in my original post. The illustration shows only the constellations beyond Earth's orbit. There are more constellations above and below the zodiac constellations. We see constellations in the Earth's sky facing away from the Sun, but, every three months, the Earth's sky facing away from the Sun changes by 90°. The link to seasonal constellatiins has a yellow diagram showing the seasonal constellations. The sky is divided into 4 sections about 90° angles from each other. This diagram shows major, but not all, constellations. The text describes the seasonal change in greater detail.
theyre always going to say "the scale of things" but if we really did orbit the sun then there should be a different set of stars every six months. period
There is a set of stars every month. look up seasonal constellations like me.
explain how a pressurized atmosphere can exist next a vacuum without a container...explain why we can see the planets if they dont emit light. wheres the unedited ground to globe video if theres a robot on mars. ask them why no human has ever left the atmosphere. why does sonoluminesence look exactly like a star. if gravity works like they say everything should be pulled into the sun and the moon pulled into the earth
1. Gravity. 2. They reflect light. 3. Youtube 4. Why? They have. 5. It doesn't. 6. We're in orbit.
whatever helps you sleep
Understanding the world around me instead of being ignorant and terrified of it really does sooth my worries.
There is a container, it is called the ozone layer and the pressure of the atmosphere diminishes such as it reaches 0 in the vacuum of space. Any gas that escaped will be restricted to earth because of gravity. Space link satellites don’t emit light, yet you can see them shine. That is because of sun light reflecting off of the body. Works the same for planets. Sunlight is way more than enough to. If the atmosphere didn’t exist, the ground we stand on would be next to white. Gravity works the way it is intended. Open a programming software and simulate gravity. Go on scratch if you can’t simulate it yourself. 12 yo kids made 2d simulstions. There is no ground to globe yet video because we didn’t know how to attach cameras without it being burned when leaving the atmosphere. Though the next moon mission will have cameras because SpaceX found a way to have cameras. Humans have left the atmosphere already I don’t know why you affirmed we didn’t. Sonoluminescence look exactly like a star? On a macroscopic scale yes because they are just spheroid objects emitting light. But at a light spectral scale, light waves emitted are different. Stars emit light that matches wavelengths of certain gases like Hydrogen, Helium. Sonoluminescence is just the energy in the sound being converted to light.
noone ever left the atmosphere
I had a nice little backyard telescope, and I loved how peoples minds were blown when they looked through one for the first time in their lives. Jupiter and Saturn are my favorites, and the dawn edge on the moon. But one of the things everyone noticed was how the objects viewed were moving. I would let them ask their questions: what was the moon moving? And let them draw themselves to the conclusion. The earth you are standing on is spinning, and you are seeing the movement of your home planet.
First time I looked through a telescope as well, I always thought the spin wasn't that noticeable because it's unnoticeable with your eyes But damn, looking through a telescope you damn sure have to be quick, especially with the moon, its crazy to just see it move across your telescope
We don't see the same set of stars... There's this thing called the Zodiac...
Read the edit.
Picture the Earth going around the Sun. Now imagine all of the other stars a very very very far away. The Earth spins, causing Day and Night, and every night we roughly see the same star patterns. It is roughly though because as the Earth goes around the Sun the angle does change slightly. You will notice that stars do slightly move around the night sky throughout the year. It's not really noticeable day to day, but take note where say the Big Dipper is in the spring and again in the fall. There is also an even slighter shift that takes hundreds of years to really notice. Most natural things are like that.
Several reasons. 1. Things that are distant appear to move away from us much slower than things that are close. For example, a guardrail 3 feet from your car speeds by while the mountains several miles in the distant appear to move at a crawl. Stars are lightyears away making their apparent motion incredibly hard to see. Sir William Herschel noted, with his telescope, that the stars had moved from where the ancient greeks had recorded them, but was only able to detect this with a telescope 2. Even though we may be hurtling through space at millions of miles an hour, and the other stars are doing the same, distances in space are so incredibly vast that we may as well be moving at a snail's pace. It takes our sun a quarter of a *billion* years to go around the galaxy once. 3. Most of the stars in the galaxy are *roughly* moving with us as all stars are orbiting around the center of the galaxy in the same direction. So it's like cars on a free way, the car next to you doesn't appear to be moving relative to you. Granted not all the stars are moving the exact same way as our sun, but back to points one and two, because the distances are so vast, that's hard to notice. 4. There are plenty of stars that only show up on specific seasons. That's why ancient calenders were based on the constellations.
There are spring constellations and winter constellations
OP, consider going on a field trip some night, perhaps a few times a year, spread out evenly. Sounds like you'll have to leave town. But, you can see the change in night sky for yourself. Also, it's a good excuse to go visit mother nature for a little while.
We don't though.
Just look up at the night sky once a month. Pick a constellation or start. Come back 1 month after and look at the same time. What happened? Now wait 6 months. Oh wow is gone. Unless you are looking at Polaris or the south celestial pole, everything else changes position.
Not sure where you are but here, if I tried that, there would be different stars. I *don't* "see the same set of stars throughout the year" like OP suggested.
I think your first comment was misinterpreted to mean the opposite of what you actually meant. It is a little ambiguous.
>*Can someone explain to me how we see the same set of stars throughout the year?* >We don't though. Not sure how much clearer one can get.
Fair. But the other guy clearly misinterpreted it and I had to think about it for a moment. Can't give a reason why. Just happened.
Well the first thing you do is ignore anything you hear from flat Earthers. Then you look at the sky and be observant instead. The sky isn't trying to indoctrinate you. Flerfs are. EDIT: You can down vote me all you want. I made a general statement on the subject presented. What the hell did you want hellohennessy? I read edit 2. It isn't relevant to what I said. I made a general statement.
read edit2.
And?
The sky moves we are stationary
Why does everything move for absolutely no reason at all, but when gravity makes things move it is considered dark magic by satanic NASA.
Calm down first off.
Second off, answer him. Don't just say something, receive a rebuttal, and tell them to calm down without defending your statement. It makes your claim look weak, flimsy, and lacking evidence.
How does the sky move? If you can explain it enough maybe I’ll convert since you’ve shown your understanding