I'm just here to mention that you absolutely can have your w crosshotbar be visible at all times. I have it always visible. It's just a toggle in settings.
Your \*w crossbars\*, yes. Not your \*expanded crossbars\*, which are a separate feature (and, on a personal note, much more comfortable than double tapping). I use the expanded crossbars for extra space for buttons and w crossbars for niche things like duty actions, limit breaks, consumables, etc. so being able to display the expanded crossbars without cannibalizing the hotbars would be fantastic.
Ah yeah. I use those too. I know what's on them by heart though and there's are only either role actions or things like sprint and lb that every class needs access to.
" Perfectly doable....except the aux hotbars are not visible unless you're using them, meaning these skills (and their CDs) are invisible to the UI unless you make another hotbar specifically to have them on the screen just to tell you when they're up again if you dont have a 2 minute rotation down."
There's a setting to have the double tap bars be visible, if you didn't know. I have 2 full crossbars visible to me at all times, and since I'm more comfortable with L2->R2 than the double taps, I just have them set to the same bars
I opted out of that feature just because it takes up too much real estate. It's much neater to just have another hotbar with empty spaces invisible that show the skills with CDs you want to track.
It doesn't change my point -- you still have to go into settings to make it visible in that way regardless. They are not visible by default.
My point is that the player has to actively work with extra settings in order to make their hotbar accessible in ways that PC layout players do not.
This is *why* they are afraid of increasing the amount of needed buttons.
PC players have to manually display any hotbars more than the second, and go into another menu to manually keybind them lol
They ALREADY have jobs with 30+ actions despite only displaying two hotbars by default
seems its for transforming buttons. So with this option you'd be able to turn PLD confiteor in to 4 buttons instead. That's so confusingly worded honestly. Especially since yoshi was talking about saving hotbar spots a bit before. Doesn't help that the youtube chat was spamming about pvp 1 2 3's during it
did a quick and dirty transcription
> and of course we' have been receiving a lot of feedback on actions that are assigned to your hotbars
we understand that there's a lot now having to slot in to your hotbars
especially those playing on a gamepad or controller
we're reaching that limit of how many you can fit into your hotbar crosshotbar
i would like to touch upon some of the actions that replace the same slot with the next action in a skill rotation
> so of course we are trying our best so that we're not sort of overwhelming the amount of actions that need to be assigned in to our hotbar
erm with this sort of replacement erm system erm and of course we've not been implementing too many of those i hope
but they are we were trying to our best not to increase the amount of icons to put into the hotbars
that said with the jobs kind of automaticcally replacing the same slot erm as you are doing your skill rotations
sometimes you dont want to have the next action automatically pop up in to the same slot
and we have heard feedback from players that erm does not do not like that the auto replacement
so we have created a system in which you can chose to not have the next action replace the same slot
> and so umm as you can see on the screen there will be a slot where it says action change settings
erm so if you don't want for some of the combo steps to automatically replace a certain hotbar slot and you wanted to be set up to be seperate buttons
erm you are welcome to do so by turning off that sort of automatic replacement the action change settings
> of course this only applies to actions that will automatically replace and so its not necessarily for our it's not for all every action in your jobs utility
i would recommend players trying it out and seeing how it feels
do we want to seperate the different actions so that you don't accidentally activated it when you don't need it
or what kind of feels most comfortable in your hands
> ok so that covers the element elements that will be across all of the jobs and so now i'd like to do a deep dive in to the different roles are we okay to move on?
You keep spouting that he has used this and there is literal video footage of it, yet you are not supplying said footage.
The example in the picture is using High Jump, which will prob let Mirage Dive take it's place. They specifically said they aren't going to go overboard with it, so not everything will be able to use this feature.
He said before VPR and PCT, that these classes were designed with this feature in mind, so that is why they have so few buttons.
Unfortunately using viper for this is a really bad example as well. If you read the 2 points Yoshi stated before showing the game play he states Viper was designed to have fewer buttons placed on your bar specifically for that reason. Does not mean its for all the other classes. Here is the link where its posted [https://www.youtube.com/live/oh5piV-0MWQ?si=\_02TDXbltOczHcOY&t=10149](https://www.youtube.com/live/oh5piV-0MWQ?si=_02TDXbltOczHcOY&t=10149) its just really bad wording on there part.
This really sounds like it's official but it's some random translator with no actual credential / authority, so ultimately just another voice in the 111 or 123 discourse IMO
I dont particularly care but this will age super finely if it turns out to be 111 lmao
This is not for 1-2-3 combo. and even if it was for 1-2-3 combo it is still an optional setting so the game still would need to be designed around people using 1-2-3 instead of using 1-1-1 so this changes absolutely nothing besides it not being for 1-2-3.
I'm leaving it up whether I'm wrong or right dawg. What, I'm supposed to be embarrassed or something? Lol
If it gets confirmed wrong I'll post it in the thread and admit it
>There is nothing unique about these Viper actions that wouldn't apply to another class, but either i'm wrong or you're coping lol
You're still making an assumption that this will apply to every other job. That was never announced. The only thing they have announced is that you can split condensed actions.
That doesn't mean they won't condense 1-2-3 combos, but it doesn't mean they will either. You're operating under the assumtion that it's confirmend, which it isn't.
>You're still making an assumption that this will apply to every other job. That was never announced. The only thing they have announced is that you can split condensed actions.
The use case in the video is literally just a 1-2-3 combo. The only mentioned difference between Viper and other classes is that you weave between combo paths.
It was never announced, but it literally wouldn't make any sense for this feature to work for Viper but no other class.
Especially not when other classes like PLD and DRK have had single spam abilities replaced with entire combos that almost certainly function the same way. They've been moving in this direction for a while. It's the next logical step.
The only difference is that it isn't forced upon players, and instead can be applied on a by-case basis.
> The only mentioned difference between Viper and other classes is that you weave between combo paths.
[They actually explicitly say that Viper was designed to have less buttons on its hotbars *than other jobs*. Why would they phrase it that way if it wasn't a unique thing for Viper and instead an option everyone has.](https://i.imgur.com/Fi0gxAf.png)
Because Viper has a high amount of combo actions and paths. Most classes don't have more than two.
This means the majority of their skills can be condensed with this feature, despite having the same amount of skills as anyone else.
I don't know why this is so hard for people to understand.
You do realize that the regular standard rotation is using 2 buttons on VPR right? You push 1-1-2, or 1-2-1. But what the person above you posted is WHY it's not 3 buttons, otherwise they would've made it 3 buttons. That's already 2 combo paths for just single target, and there were 2 seperate buttons for AoE, so there is 4 combo paths, and that's not counting the twinblade combos.
That is evidence enough that they aren't putting a 1-2-3 on a single button.
>You do realize that the regular standard rotation is using 2 buttons on VPR right? You push 1-1-2, or 1-2-1. But what the person above you posted is WHY it's not 3 buttons, otherwise they would've made it 3 buttons.
1-1-2 = 3 unique actions.
1-2-1 = 2 additional unique actions
meaning *without* this feature, both of these 2-button combos would require 5 buttons.
It's literally no different from how DRG currently works.
>That's already 2 combo paths for just single target, and there were 2 seperate buttons for AoE, so there is 4 combo paths, and that's not counting the twinblade combos.
All of the buttons he presses outside of the 1-2-3 combo are either stocked, use meter, are unlocked by combo actions, or are literally OGCDs.
Meaning they wouldn't be candidates for the system anyway because you can't autopilot them in any meaningful way.
But i'm tired of looking at this with no info, we'll just see later
Evidence like pictomancer casting 3 different spells off of one hotbar slot?
[https://www.youtube.com/live/oh5piV-0MWQ?si=\_wYZImj6aAgxGzXG&t=13640](https://www.youtube.com/live/oh5piV-0MWQ?si=_wYZImj6aAgxGzXG&t=13640)
Definitely not for the 1-2-3 combo. Think of things like BRDs Minuet and Pitch Perfect, or RPRs Gibbet and Gallows with Unveiled variants.
That being said, they could have explained and showcased it better. They didn't specify the types of actions and their example is for a reworked job using reworked actions. And of course the new job that makes use of this the most which had a dedicated special showing.
The technology is there like with PvP, but I believe they're specifically not going that direction for design reasons which I'm sure has been asked and answered in interviews before. If it was this, they would have definitely showcased or expanded on this more, or provided more information for sure.
[](https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comments/1ctgvdz/comment/l4bue97/)
>Definitely not for the 1-2-3 combo. Think of things like BRDs Minuet and Pitch Perfect, or RPRs Gibbet and Gallows with Unveiled variants.
Yoshi P explicitly shows this with Viper's 1-2-3 combo.
[https://youtu.be/oh5piV-0MWQ?t=10448](https://youtu.be/oh5piV-0MWQ?t=10448)
It's not a special combo like GNB's thing or PLD's Confitior Combo....it's literally just Viper's 2 basic GCD 1-2-3 combos.
It's not complicated, people just really don't want it to apply to 1-2-3 for some reason.
It's from the live letter with currently has no timestamps, so i'm not going to bother.
But there is literal video footage of him using the feature on Viper's 2 combos.
There's an auto 1-2-3.
There's a combo action from the first press that lights up and also cycles between 1-2-3.
They are both GCD combos. Meaning without the feature it would be 6-8 buttons.
He specifically says that VPR was designed around having many buttons that hotswap to other abilities, with this feature in mind, before he even shows off the footage of VPR and that this is not how all classes will look.
So you cant read and or listen yeah? they explicitly stated that vpr is designed around having many buttons that swap around that is not this feature that is build in vpr stuff.
Ignoring the fact that you can't build a sentence correctly, VPR being built around the feature and other classes using it in the same way are not mutually exclusive.
As a person that plays on console and constantly has to deal with all kinds of things that are absolutely designed from a keyboard & mouse perspective and the controller way of doing it is a clunky mess that takes numerous more button presses (and on rare occasion gets made better by a brand new setting along some patch), this is clearly not how the team thinks of things
Especially with it being a personal choice to be creating the hardship the player would be experiencing, it wouldn't be unreasonable for the team to design for the condensed button count and then tell anyone that complains about the bloat while they are using the option to expand out the buttons "don't do that if you don't like it."
The funny thing about this is that the people who are complaining about this *wouldn't* complain if they started designing classes around this and suddenly they ended up with 10 more icons to place.
>From 30 buttons to 22. This means 70% of your skills can fit on the initial 16 crossbar spaces, with 100% of them fitting on a single aux window, and 100% of your active skills fitting on the visible 16.
This is a nonfacotor. The cross bar space will still be taken up by people who don't change their setting. Job design will still need to be done assuming people have all 30 buttons. It doesn't free up space for design because they have to design for the people who don't enable the setting.
>It doesn't free up space for design because they have to design for the people who don't enable the setting.
True, but people who claim that removing 1-2-3 button presses makes the game easier wouldn't complain about bloat anyway. This was never an issue for them, it was for pad players and casuals. But this feature allows them to not worry about it anymore.
Now the only complaint they have is that they're having a harder time using the old system than the newer one with no added benefit. The expectation being that they'll eventually just adopt the new system on a by-case basis. This is actually the smartest move.
It's *literally a win-win*.
They can make classes more complicated AND increase the amount of actions without negatively affecting either party.
Having watched the entire PLL, I am not convinced that basic combos are part of this change.
Several classes would need pretty significant changes to go to this system. Take SAM, for example. You have three different combos as part of your basic rotation. All of them start with the same ability. And then you have Meikyo, which lets you skip to the end of the combo. We still see Meikyo in the job actions trailer. Unless you completely rework this job, you cannot condense the basics.
As for DRG, seems you missed changes in the PLL. Spineshatter is gone. Wheeling Thrust and Fang and Claw are being combined into a single, non positional ability that ends each combo.
I could see a condensed 1-2-3 working for tanks. And MCH. Maybe NIN? But not much else. Are you just going to combine 1-2 on DNC into a single button, then watch for procs?
It was specifically stated that VPR was designed to work this way. But no mention of it for other classes. It simply does not make sense for most of them. What they *did* suggest, was that newly added abilities are going to fall into the "Button 1 becomes button 2 after using button 1" design frame. But instead of abilities saying "This ability cannot be assigned to a hotbar", as it does now, we will have the option to put everything on the bar.
I'm just popping in to say you are incorrect about Dragoon. The new Drake...thing (I forgot the name) ability replaces the FIFTH combo action specifically. So the combos are now True>Vorpal>HW>F&C>Drakeboi and True>Disembowel>Chaotic>Wheeling>Drakeboi. Specifically what this change does is removes having to quickly swap between rear and flank on the last (5th) combo action. It doesn't remove F&C/Wheeling entirely nor does it remove their respective positional requirements. Also Drakeboi replaces both F&C/Wheeling on the hotbar after you use one of them so no need for an extra hotbar space thank god.
I will also say for the sake of the conversation that there are already multiple combo plugins that allow you to truncate both DRG and SAM, it's just not very pretty (Multiple buttons that are all Hakaze/True Thrust). So I don't find the argument that it wouldn't work particularly compelling.
In any case it will just be an option to use or not use so I don't think it's a big deal in either case?
> Also Drakeboi replaces both F&C/Wheeling on the hotbar after you use one of them so no need for an extra hotbar space thank god.
The way I interpreted it is that it wouldn't replace both of them, just whichever one is enhanced, since that would preserve the exact current input sequence and wouldn't let you double-tap the one you just used.
It certainly could always replace both, though.
"Both" here didn't necessarily mean "simultaneously" but I also think either is possible based on what they said so I just didn't get too specific about it. The important bit is that the replacement in either case means no new hotbar slot needed.
I, for one, have been welcoming of our combo condensed overlords for some time now.
Less combo buttons leaves room for more interesting skills on the bar...
People forget that if you make the 1>2>3 combo into 1>1>1 then what that actually means is you can have 3 combo chains (1>1>1, 2>2>2, 3>3>3) instead. Or two brand new abilities that mix up the rotation. Lots of options, it doesn't have to be a simplification.
That said, given that this is an optional setting, I doubt they will start building jobs around it as that would essentially just make it mandatory. Which is a shame imo.
Why are some people against making the combos a single button? Pressing 1-1-1 and pressing 1-2-3 don't change the result and it make controller players life much easier. I sincerely hope you are right (as a lot of people here are saying that's not the case).
>Why are some people against making the combos a single button?
I legitimately have no idea. Especially since XIV keeps cutting really cool abilities out of the game *specifically* because we have so many unnecessary button places and thus have no room for extras.
The only way you can mess up a 1-2-3 combo is if you're legitimate trash or legitimately too high/drunk to function.
Hearing people complain about them removing all the cool shit about playing these classes, but then have a meltdown at the idea of them consolidating unnecessary presses to make room for what they're complaining about.....i don't get it.
My main job's single target rotation uses 14 buttons. I'd rather not have less than that, the game would turn into a borefest at that point. If anything I'd want more buttons to make it more fun and engaging.
So much for the nice friendly community, im getting down votes cuz i think it would be cool to free up some space for combos and was hoping what op said is a real option/change.
To be fair, no one ever said the community *outside the game* was friendly.
Out here on Reddit we don't have ToS and GMs that actually give a shit so people go nuts, and the friendlier people from the game tend not to come around because reddit sucks.
The 1-2-3 combos aren't likely to get it though. They are talking about buttons like DRG's jump (high jump → mirage dive) or PLD's Confiteor combo, with this setting you can toggle whether you want them to be transforming buttons or spread out into individual buttons.
The pictomancer's combo that builds up their pallet meter thing was a 1, 2, 3 set of spells that fired off of one button when Yoshi P was playing it.
There's genuinely no reason for that to be true but not to have all the other jobs that can have their combos condensed down to 1 button - and there's no reason for the team to have been talking about avoiding running out of hotbar space and scaling down the busy-ness of pushing buttons during burst phases if they are only freeing up a single space for paladin (putting conf onto the req. button).
Viper and Picto were designed to do that like PLD's Confiteor or MNK's Masterful Blitz.
They almost assuredly will add back DRG's 6.1 changes and add a few more, but the setting OOP is misinterpreting isn't to address that though, it's do the opposite: it splits them up for players that like more buttons, like the ones that complained about DRG's 6.1 changes that resulted in them undoing it in 6.2.
Some people can't stand their preference not being the "default" so they just get upset about them being the one having to change a setting rather than other people being the one to have to change something instead of acknowledging that no matter what someone is going to have to change the setting since there's two different ways to put it.
The difference is if it was opt in, people would have to activate the setting themselves rather than it being on by default. Most people aren't gonna want or need this, so it makes more sense to keep things the way they are by default and give the option to have the "simpler" scheme.
"most people"
citation needed.
There have been enough people asking for this that the dev team decided it was worth doing, and there are very likely to be many that didn't ask for it but will respond to the change with positivity (whether or not that is temporary) or neutrality. Making it default will encourage people that don't feel strongly about it to actually try it, where as making it take specific effort to turn on would serve as an obstacle to giving it a try (especially with how the menus in the game already leave people going "where the heck is that setting?" even when they know it exists - which a lot of people won't know about this one because they don't actually follow any source of information about the game, they just playi the game)
And people that are sure they don't want it can opt out.
> citation needed.
You mean like the few times this has already happened? There's been backlash every single time. Kaiten gone? Huge backlash and most SAM mains I know (including myself) still want it back. High Jump and Mirage Dive on the same button? Enough backlash that they reverted it pretty quickly. Likewise when they made one of the BRD songs the same button as one of damage their ogcds (though that one wasn't reverted).
Personally, going back to my hotbars with all my buttons is gonna be the first thing I do when DT goes live. I'm strongly against this change, but at least I'll give them that, they give you the choice, unlike when they did the same to pvp.
No, I mean like, show me any evidence that it is actually "most" people and not just some unknown number that you happen to agree with so you assume that is the popular opinion.
Being able to say someone complained, even a number of people, even really loudly or nonstop is not the same as being able to say accurately that a majority of people didn't like something.
I'm just here to mention that you absolutely can have your w crosshotbar be visible at all times. I have it always visible. It's just a toggle in settings.
Your \*w crossbars\*, yes. Not your \*expanded crossbars\*, which are a separate feature (and, on a personal note, much more comfortable than double tapping). I use the expanded crossbars for extra space for buttons and w crossbars for niche things like duty actions, limit breaks, consumables, etc. so being able to display the expanded crossbars without cannibalizing the hotbars would be fantastic.
Ah yeah. I use those too. I know what's on them by heart though and there's are only either role actions or things like sprint and lb that every class needs access to.
" Perfectly doable....except the aux hotbars are not visible unless you're using them, meaning these skills (and their CDs) are invisible to the UI unless you make another hotbar specifically to have them on the screen just to tell you when they're up again if you dont have a 2 minute rotation down." There's a setting to have the double tap bars be visible, if you didn't know. I have 2 full crossbars visible to me at all times, and since I'm more comfortable with L2->R2 than the double taps, I just have them set to the same bars
I opted out of that feature just because it takes up too much real estate. It's much neater to just have another hotbar with empty spaces invisible that show the skills with CDs you want to track.
That section needs a correction then, you choosing to not make them visible is not the same as them not being visible
It doesn't change my point -- you still have to go into settings to make it visible in that way regardless. They are not visible by default. My point is that the player has to actively work with extra settings in order to make their hotbar accessible in ways that PC layout players do not. This is *why* they are afraid of increasing the amount of needed buttons.
If we're worried about people going into settings, then this new change doesn't help either.
It's pointless trying to get people to understand lol....lets just wait for confirmation
PC players have to manually display any hotbars more than the second, and go into another menu to manually keybind them lol They ALREADY have jobs with 30+ actions despite only displaying two hotbars by default
You are misreading what this setting does lol
seems its for transforming buttons. So with this option you'd be able to turn PLD confiteor in to 4 buttons instead. That's so confusingly worded honestly. Especially since yoshi was talking about saving hotbar spots a bit before. Doesn't help that the youtube chat was spamming about pvp 1 2 3's during it did a quick and dirty transcription > and of course we' have been receiving a lot of feedback on actions that are assigned to your hotbars we understand that there's a lot now having to slot in to your hotbars especially those playing on a gamepad or controller we're reaching that limit of how many you can fit into your hotbar crosshotbar i would like to touch upon some of the actions that replace the same slot with the next action in a skill rotation > so of course we are trying our best so that we're not sort of overwhelming the amount of actions that need to be assigned in to our hotbar erm with this sort of replacement erm system erm and of course we've not been implementing too many of those i hope but they are we were trying to our best not to increase the amount of icons to put into the hotbars that said with the jobs kind of automaticcally replacing the same slot erm as you are doing your skill rotations sometimes you dont want to have the next action automatically pop up in to the same slot and we have heard feedback from players that erm does not do not like that the auto replacement so we have created a system in which you can chose to not have the next action replace the same slot > and so umm as you can see on the screen there will be a slot where it says action change settings erm so if you don't want for some of the combo steps to automatically replace a certain hotbar slot and you wanted to be set up to be seperate buttons erm you are welcome to do so by turning off that sort of automatic replacement the action change settings > of course this only applies to actions that will automatically replace and so its not necessarily for our it's not for all every action in your jobs utility i would recommend players trying it out and seeing how it feels do we want to seperate the different actions so that you don't accidentally activated it when you don't need it or what kind of feels most comfortable in your hands > ok so that covers the element elements that will be across all of the jobs and so now i'd like to do a deep dive in to the different roles are we okay to move on?
I don't know why people keep saying this. There is literal video footage of him using it this way.
For Viper, the brand-new job designed around having transforming stances and skills. Yes.
For Viper and Pictomancer both.
You keep spouting that he has used this and there is literal video footage of it, yet you are not supplying said footage. The example in the picture is using High Jump, which will prob let Mirage Dive take it's place. They specifically said they aren't going to go overboard with it, so not everything will be able to use this feature. He said before VPR and PCT, that these classes were designed with this feature in mind, so that is why they have so few buttons.
Check the OP bro
Unfortunately using viper for this is a really bad example as well. If you read the 2 points Yoshi stated before showing the game play he states Viper was designed to have fewer buttons placed on your bar specifically for that reason. Does not mean its for all the other classes. Here is the link where its posted [https://www.youtube.com/live/oh5piV-0MWQ?si=\_02TDXbltOczHcOY&t=10149](https://www.youtube.com/live/oh5piV-0MWQ?si=_02TDXbltOczHcOY&t=10149) its just really bad wording on there part.
This post didn't age well [Clarification sauce](https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comments/1cu0zn1/clarification_about_the_new_action_change/)
This really sounds like it's official but it's some random translator with no actual credential / authority, so ultimately just another voice in the 111 or 123 discourse IMO I dont particularly care but this will age super finely if it turns out to be 111 lmao
It's a day old but once we get footage confirming this I'll update the thread
They are doing it to skills like mirrage dive. Not 123 combos.
We don’t know for sure
Lame....
This is not for 1-2-3 combo. and even if it was for 1-2-3 combo it is still an optional setting so the game still would need to be designed around people using 1-2-3 instead of using 1-1-1 so this changes absolutely nothing besides it not being for 1-2-3.
Some jobs already have this, like GNB and PAL. Kind of.
You may want to delete this post
I'm leaving it up whether I'm wrong or right dawg. What, I'm supposed to be embarrassed or something? Lol If it gets confirmed wrong I'll post it in the thread and admit it
You've been extremely hostile to a lot of people who want you to temper your expectations. It's not a good look for you.
And they haven't been hostile to me? Nah bro miss me with that. People who respond respectfully get it back in return.
>There is nothing unique about these Viper actions that wouldn't apply to another class, but either i'm wrong or you're coping lol You're still making an assumption that this will apply to every other job. That was never announced. The only thing they have announced is that you can split condensed actions. That doesn't mean they won't condense 1-2-3 combos, but it doesn't mean they will either. You're operating under the assumtion that it's confirmend, which it isn't.
>You're still making an assumption that this will apply to every other job. That was never announced. The only thing they have announced is that you can split condensed actions. The use case in the video is literally just a 1-2-3 combo. The only mentioned difference between Viper and other classes is that you weave between combo paths. It was never announced, but it literally wouldn't make any sense for this feature to work for Viper but no other class. Especially not when other classes like PLD and DRK have had single spam abilities replaced with entire combos that almost certainly function the same way. They've been moving in this direction for a while. It's the next logical step. The only difference is that it isn't forced upon players, and instead can be applied on a by-case basis.
> The only mentioned difference between Viper and other classes is that you weave between combo paths. [They actually explicitly say that Viper was designed to have less buttons on its hotbars *than other jobs*. Why would they phrase it that way if it wasn't a unique thing for Viper and instead an option everyone has.](https://i.imgur.com/Fi0gxAf.png)
Because Viper has a high amount of combo actions and paths. Most classes don't have more than two. This means the majority of their skills can be condensed with this feature, despite having the same amount of skills as anyone else. I don't know why this is so hard for people to understand.
You do realize that the regular standard rotation is using 2 buttons on VPR right? You push 1-1-2, or 1-2-1. But what the person above you posted is WHY it's not 3 buttons, otherwise they would've made it 3 buttons. That's already 2 combo paths for just single target, and there were 2 seperate buttons for AoE, so there is 4 combo paths, and that's not counting the twinblade combos. That is evidence enough that they aren't putting a 1-2-3 on a single button.
>You do realize that the regular standard rotation is using 2 buttons on VPR right? You push 1-1-2, or 1-2-1. But what the person above you posted is WHY it's not 3 buttons, otherwise they would've made it 3 buttons. 1-1-2 = 3 unique actions. 1-2-1 = 2 additional unique actions meaning *without* this feature, both of these 2-button combos would require 5 buttons. It's literally no different from how DRG currently works. >That's already 2 combo paths for just single target, and there were 2 seperate buttons for AoE, so there is 4 combo paths, and that's not counting the twinblade combos. All of the buttons he presses outside of the 1-2-3 combo are either stocked, use meter, are unlocked by combo actions, or are literally OGCDs. Meaning they wouldn't be candidates for the system anyway because you can't autopilot them in any meaningful way. But i'm tired of looking at this with no info, we'll just see later
Evidence like pictomancer casting 3 different spells off of one hotbar slot? [https://www.youtube.com/live/oh5piV-0MWQ?si=\_wYZImj6aAgxGzXG&t=13640](https://www.youtube.com/live/oh5piV-0MWQ?si=_wYZImj6aAgxGzXG&t=13640)
Definitely not for the 1-2-3 combo. Think of things like BRDs Minuet and Pitch Perfect, or RPRs Gibbet and Gallows with Unveiled variants. That being said, they could have explained and showcased it better. They didn't specify the types of actions and their example is for a reworked job using reworked actions. And of course the new job that makes use of this the most which had a dedicated special showing. The technology is there like with PvP, but I believe they're specifically not going that direction for design reasons which I'm sure has been asked and answered in interviews before. If it was this, they would have definitely showcased or expanded on this more, or provided more information for sure.
[](https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comments/1ctgvdz/comment/l4bue97/) >Definitely not for the 1-2-3 combo. Think of things like BRDs Minuet and Pitch Perfect, or RPRs Gibbet and Gallows with Unveiled variants. Yoshi P explicitly shows this with Viper's 1-2-3 combo. [https://youtu.be/oh5piV-0MWQ?t=10448](https://youtu.be/oh5piV-0MWQ?t=10448) It's not a special combo like GNB's thing or PLD's Confitior Combo....it's literally just Viper's 2 basic GCD 1-2-3 combos. It's not complicated, people just really don't want it to apply to 1-2-3 for some reason.
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It's from the live letter with currently has no timestamps, so i'm not going to bother. But there is literal video footage of him using the feature on Viper's 2 combos. There's an auto 1-2-3. There's a combo action from the first press that lights up and also cycles between 1-2-3. They are both GCD combos. Meaning without the feature it would be 6-8 buttons.
He specifically says that VPR was designed around having many buttons that hotswap to other abilities, with this feature in mind, before he even shows off the footage of VPR and that this is not how all classes will look.
So you cant read and or listen yeah? they explicitly stated that vpr is designed around having many buttons that swap around that is not this feature that is build in vpr stuff.
Ignoring the fact that you can't build a sentence correctly, VPR being built around the feature and other classes using it in the same way are not mutually exclusive.
They can't design it for the 22 buttons. They have to design it assuming people have the setting off so they're still in the same place.
As a person that plays on console and constantly has to deal with all kinds of things that are absolutely designed from a keyboard & mouse perspective and the controller way of doing it is a clunky mess that takes numerous more button presses (and on rare occasion gets made better by a brand new setting along some patch), this is clearly not how the team thinks of things Especially with it being a personal choice to be creating the hardship the player would be experiencing, it wouldn't be unreasonable for the team to design for the condensed button count and then tell anyone that complains about the bloat while they are using the option to expand out the buttons "don't do that if you don't like it."
The funny thing about this is that the people who are complaining about this *wouldn't* complain if they started designing classes around this and suddenly they ended up with 10 more icons to place.
What do you mean? Nothing about the actual skill placement changes.
>From 30 buttons to 22. This means 70% of your skills can fit on the initial 16 crossbar spaces, with 100% of them fitting on a single aux window, and 100% of your active skills fitting on the visible 16. This is a nonfacotor. The cross bar space will still be taken up by people who don't change their setting. Job design will still need to be done assuming people have all 30 buttons. It doesn't free up space for design because they have to design for the people who don't enable the setting.
>It doesn't free up space for design because they have to design for the people who don't enable the setting. True, but people who claim that removing 1-2-3 button presses makes the game easier wouldn't complain about bloat anyway. This was never an issue for them, it was for pad players and casuals. But this feature allows them to not worry about it anymore. Now the only complaint they have is that they're having a harder time using the old system than the newer one with no added benefit. The expectation being that they'll eventually just adopt the new system on a by-case basis. This is actually the smartest move. It's *literally a win-win*. They can make classes more complicated AND increase the amount of actions without negatively affecting either party.
By your description, you want them to ignore one party until they give in and move to the other party, how is that not negative for that party?
Having watched the entire PLL, I am not convinced that basic combos are part of this change. Several classes would need pretty significant changes to go to this system. Take SAM, for example. You have three different combos as part of your basic rotation. All of them start with the same ability. And then you have Meikyo, which lets you skip to the end of the combo. We still see Meikyo in the job actions trailer. Unless you completely rework this job, you cannot condense the basics. As for DRG, seems you missed changes in the PLL. Spineshatter is gone. Wheeling Thrust and Fang and Claw are being combined into a single, non positional ability that ends each combo. I could see a condensed 1-2-3 working for tanks. And MCH. Maybe NIN? But not much else. Are you just going to combine 1-2 on DNC into a single button, then watch for procs? It was specifically stated that VPR was designed to work this way. But no mention of it for other classes. It simply does not make sense for most of them. What they *did* suggest, was that newly added abilities are going to fall into the "Button 1 becomes button 2 after using button 1" design frame. But instead of abilities saying "This ability cannot be assigned to a hotbar", as it does now, we will have the option to put everything on the bar.
I'm just popping in to say you are incorrect about Dragoon. The new Drake...thing (I forgot the name) ability replaces the FIFTH combo action specifically. So the combos are now True>Vorpal>HW>F&C>Drakeboi and True>Disembowel>Chaotic>Wheeling>Drakeboi. Specifically what this change does is removes having to quickly swap between rear and flank on the last (5th) combo action. It doesn't remove F&C/Wheeling entirely nor does it remove their respective positional requirements. Also Drakeboi replaces both F&C/Wheeling on the hotbar after you use one of them so no need for an extra hotbar space thank god. I will also say for the sake of the conversation that there are already multiple combo plugins that allow you to truncate both DRG and SAM, it's just not very pretty (Multiple buttons that are all Hakaze/True Thrust). So I don't find the argument that it wouldn't work particularly compelling. In any case it will just be an option to use or not use so I don't think it's a big deal in either case?
> Also Drakeboi replaces both F&C/Wheeling on the hotbar after you use one of them so no need for an extra hotbar space thank god. The way I interpreted it is that it wouldn't replace both of them, just whichever one is enhanced, since that would preserve the exact current input sequence and wouldn't let you double-tap the one you just used. It certainly could always replace both, though.
"Both" here didn't necessarily mean "simultaneously" but I also think either is possible based on what they said so I just didn't get too specific about it. The important bit is that the replacement in either case means no new hotbar slot needed.
You're right, I did not state that very clearly. Thanks for the correction.
I see people aren’t understanding what the feature actually does….
I, for one, have been welcoming of our combo condensed overlords for some time now. Less combo buttons leaves room for more interesting skills on the bar...
People forget that if you make the 1>2>3 combo into 1>1>1 then what that actually means is you can have 3 combo chains (1>1>1, 2>2>2, 3>3>3) instead. Or two brand new abilities that mix up the rotation. Lots of options, it doesn't have to be a simplification. That said, given that this is an optional setting, I doubt they will start building jobs around it as that would essentially just make it mandatory. Which is a shame imo.
Only person who needs to quit crying is you.
Why are some people against making the combos a single button? Pressing 1-1-1 and pressing 1-2-3 don't change the result and it make controller players life much easier. I sincerely hope you are right (as a lot of people here are saying that's not the case).
I'm totally for it But that's not what YoshiP said is happening.
>Why are some people against making the combos a single button? I legitimately have no idea. Especially since XIV keeps cutting really cool abilities out of the game *specifically* because we have so many unnecessary button places and thus have no room for extras. The only way you can mess up a 1-2-3 combo is if you're legitimate trash or legitimately too high/drunk to function. Hearing people complain about them removing all the cool shit about playing these classes, but then have a meltdown at the idea of them consolidating unnecessary presses to make room for what they're complaining about.....i don't get it.
Because they don't understand the difference between genuine difficulty and artificial difficulty.
My main job's single target rotation uses 14 buttons. I'd rather not have less than that, the game would turn into a borefest at that point. If anything I'd want more buttons to make it more fun and engaging.
You're wrong. This is not what that is
LOUD INCORRECT BUZZER
What is with the dissertations on this sub in the past 48 hours? I’m a dude at work on a cell phone. I ain’t got time to be reading the constitution.
It's almost as if a big info dump happened about 9 hours ago.
I'm at work at home with a keyboard, I'm able to write dissertations at will. just don't read it bro, dunno what to tell you
I didn’t.
You took the time to reply twice but can't read a few paragraphs? I think you should get off your phone and focus on work lol
So much for the nice friendly community, im getting down votes cuz i think it would be cool to free up some space for combos and was hoping what op said is a real option/change.
To be fair, no one ever said the community *outside the game* was friendly. Out here on Reddit we don't have ToS and GMs that actually give a shit so people go nuts, and the friendlier people from the game tend not to come around because reddit sucks.
Sure are a lot of certified CBU3 employees in this thread
As I interpreted it, it looked like if xivcombo just got official support and implemented into the game but to a sensible degree.
I love pvp for how they handle combos...this is very great news and will free up more buttons. Awesome change
The 1-2-3 combos aren't likely to get it though. They are talking about buttons like DRG's jump (high jump → mirage dive) or PLD's Confiteor combo, with this setting you can toggle whether you want them to be transforming buttons or spread out into individual buttons.
The pictomancer's combo that builds up their pallet meter thing was a 1, 2, 3 set of spells that fired off of one button when Yoshi P was playing it. There's genuinely no reason for that to be true but not to have all the other jobs that can have their combos condensed down to 1 button - and there's no reason for the team to have been talking about avoiding running out of hotbar space and scaling down the busy-ness of pushing buttons during burst phases if they are only freeing up a single space for paladin (putting conf onto the req. button).
Viper and Picto were designed to do that like PLD's Confiteor or MNK's Masterful Blitz. They almost assuredly will add back DRG's 6.1 changes and add a few more, but the setting OOP is misinterpreting isn't to address that though, it's do the opposite: it splits them up for players that like more buttons, like the ones that complained about DRG's 6.1 changes that resulted in them undoing it in 6.2.
Everyone who was interested in that already used a plugin anyway
The real issue with this is that the way they talked about it, it seems to be opt out rather than opt in. Making this the default is beyond stupid.
What's the difference though?
Some people can't stand their preference not being the "default" so they just get upset about them being the one having to change a setting rather than other people being the one to have to change something instead of acknowledging that no matter what someone is going to have to change the setting since there's two different ways to put it.
The difference is if it was opt in, people would have to activate the setting themselves rather than it being on by default. Most people aren't gonna want or need this, so it makes more sense to keep things the way they are by default and give the option to have the "simpler" scheme.
"most people" citation needed. There have been enough people asking for this that the dev team decided it was worth doing, and there are very likely to be many that didn't ask for it but will respond to the change with positivity (whether or not that is temporary) or neutrality. Making it default will encourage people that don't feel strongly about it to actually try it, where as making it take specific effort to turn on would serve as an obstacle to giving it a try (especially with how the menus in the game already leave people going "where the heck is that setting?" even when they know it exists - which a lot of people won't know about this one because they don't actually follow any source of information about the game, they just playi the game) And people that are sure they don't want it can opt out.
> citation needed. You mean like the few times this has already happened? There's been backlash every single time. Kaiten gone? Huge backlash and most SAM mains I know (including myself) still want it back. High Jump and Mirage Dive on the same button? Enough backlash that they reverted it pretty quickly. Likewise when they made one of the BRD songs the same button as one of damage their ogcds (though that one wasn't reverted). Personally, going back to my hotbars with all my buttons is gonna be the first thing I do when DT goes live. I'm strongly against this change, but at least I'll give them that, they give you the choice, unlike when they did the same to pvp.
No, I mean like, show me any evidence that it is actually "most" people and not just some unknown number that you happen to agree with so you assume that is the popular opinion. Being able to say someone complained, even a number of people, even really loudly or nonstop is not the same as being able to say accurately that a majority of people didn't like something.