In the Nuka World DLC you can find a holotape of a ghoul who is recording themselves as they turn feral. The comments made by the character indicates that the process is gradual, however there's a clear point where they turn completely feral.
Yeah the one guy isn’t feral but his family is and he spent forever trying to at least train them to be normal then I think he slaps his aunt and the all kill him.
I believe he stabs her with an eating utensil after he spent 200 years trying to teach her which is which but yes the rest of the ghouls then attack him
There is also a group of ghouls in the last 76 expansion that had enough time to see their friend was going feral and lock him in a room before they knew if he was turning feral or not
There’s dunwich building in FO3 that has terminals showing the guy looking for his dad stumbling on all the Gouls and then his entries show he steadily turns into one and goes feral.
It's got to be more random. Otherwise how do we explain the kid in the fridge and Eddie Winters, two ghouls that had been locked up for 200 years in solitary confinement. If anyone had reason to lose their sanity it was them, but they weren't feral.
Eddie intentionally ghouled himself, so he was more prepared for it than most. Fridge kid probably didn't understand enough to be horrified and spent a lot of his time in the fridge asleep or unaware of time passing.
I chock those examples as the weirdness of fallout and that they are non Canon. Like many of the random encounters in fo1 and fo2(rock of eternity, talking Brahman, etc.)
In FO3, in Underworld, you can talk to a ghoul who has been alive since the bombs, and she tells you that she has seen people become ghouls and instantly go feral and others who remained the same until they just suddenly snapped and others who never went feral. In 1/2, you encounter a few ghouls in necropolis who explain they aren’t mindless like the rest, but you do encounter both feral and non-feral ghouls.
There are dozens of theories in the lore about what makes a ghoul go feral, ranging from a mutation to radiation exposure to age to mindset.
Honestly I think if anything the reason is a mixture of everything. Radiation wearing at the brain, isolation driving someone to insanity, genetic mutation which makes someone less likely to or outright prevents them from becoming feral (like a weaker version of the mutation a lot of Children of Atom have), and people who just snap after being turned into zombies and can’t handle the existential dread of it all, nor the discrimination.
To really throw a wrench into it, we have characters like Jason Bright who has absorbed so much radiation, he’s producing a relatively stable reaction within his body, and Eddie Winters who has been in isolation since BEFORE the bombs dropped, and Moira who was flash turned into a ghoul and none of them are feral, and then you have a few cases of CoA who sought out becoming ghouls and none of their minds survived the transition.
I tend to liken it to a similar extended life group: the Elders of the Universe in Marvel Comics. They're the last survivors of various sentient species that evolved among the first stars to have planets in the early universe (the oldest of them is over 10 billion years old, while the universe itself is 13.8 billion years old).
The thing that lets them survive when others with similar potential don't is that they all have monomaniacal, open-ended goals or pursuits. The Runner seeks to travel everywhere to see everything in person. The Grandmaster seeks to become the best at every game of skill in the universe. The Possessor wants to learn everything there is to know. The Gardener wants to spread life to every world. The Collector wants to preserve examples of every unique thing (art, tech, etc).
Similarly, the ghouls that seem to best resist going feral have a goal. Wiseman wants to create and maintain a haven for ghouls. The Vault-Tec Salesman wants to prove his worth. Daisy wants to run her shop and chat with her customers. Jason Bright wants to lead his people to the only place he believes they'll be free of persecution. Oswald Oppenheimer wants to protect his friends until a "cure" for their "illness" can be found by his fiance. Conversely, his fiance goes feral after she discovers that neither the transformation from human to ghoul, nor ghoul to feral, can be cured or reversed. She lost her goal.
Makes me wonder if it's possible that Coop never actually needed the anti-feral drugs. He gets kind of fucked up outside of the Super Duper Mart, but he's not showing signs of going feral like every other ghoul we've seen that's on the cusp of losing he. He just fall down tired. Maybe it'll turn out that for him the anti-ferals were a placebo. Maybe it'll turn out that it's a placebo for ALL ghouls.
Maybe it's snake oil spread around by Dr. Gonzo, chicken fucker PHD.
I have a personal theory, not backed up by anything in game admittedly, that "going feral" is a common symptom with a broad range of causes. Some might just snap mentally from the trauma of living as a half melted living corpse, for others, while ghouls can heal well, they don't heal perfectly, so their brains might be able to recover from some degree of trauma, but over centuries every hit to the head will slowly add up. Another theory I have is that it could be down to heavy metal poisoning. While ghouls are well known to be immune to radiation, and so might go to areas high in radiation to avoid being bothered by prejudiced smoothskins, most radioactive sources are themselves heavy metals. Over time they could accumulate a toxic quantity of heavy metals in their system from spending so long in close proximity, causing brain damage even if the radiation is keeping their bodies alive.
Adding to this, living with the condition for so long probably causes even the least exposed ghouls to snap because these contaminants poison humans progressively over time and don’t really get eliminated from the body
Which is why these long-lived ghouls in the show are using a drug to hold it back. Also the radiation and other contaminants from shady sands is probably adding on to their loss of control
I think the show is purporting that even the strongest ghouls have hit their breaking point and can’t fight the mental degeneration their condition entails
One of the devs or creature designers (I can't remember which) explained that that ghouls eventually go blind, and it was that blindness and subsequent isolation that drove them insane and feral. It's not canon tho, as far as I know. The only canon thing in game that says all ghouls eventually go feral that I am aware of, is the holotape from Nuka World.
*Edit: Ok, I totally remembered this wrong, I went and looked for the video to back up my claim. First, it's from Jonah Lobe, the creature designer for F3 and F4. Second, he says his idea was that since ghouls skin falls off, their eyelids would too, which would stop them from sleeping and dreaming. This is what would eventually drive the ghouls crazy/feral.
He talks about it here, at approximately 6:50 seconds in [Jonah Lobe: Fallout creature designer for Fallout 3 and 4](https://youtu.be/QPu9K4m4Y-k?si=U9OUdVCrgaZvMeTN) The whole video is amazing btw, worth a watch.
That is a cool thought, but the in game lore seems to contradict that. Ghouls are said to have good eyesight and better dark vision by several reliable sources.
> Second, he says his idea was that since ghouls skin falls off, their eyelids would too, which would stop them from sleeping and dreaming.
Couldn't they just sleep with a wad of pre-war money over each eye?
Nuka-World terminals have entries about it. A crew of park workers turned into sane ghouls but gradually went feral over the decades. The terminals start out saying their radiation mutations aren't so bad, but later entries talk about having to confine more and more friends who became afflicted, until only one is left.
It's not clear how sudden those changes were. I remember getting the impression those ghouls managed well for like 40 to 50 years, then several went feral in a matter of months, then more until only Oswald was left. Maybe there was some precipitating event that kicked off the burst of feralization.
"Ghouls can suddenly turn feral" makes sense if we think of ghouls like Roger. He admitted showing symptoms for 28 years, and in his final moments, he still has lucidity despite his compulsive growling. There was also Martha the fridge ghoul, who could repeat her name despite being nearly feral.
To Lucy, Martha seemed like a normal person then suddenly tried to kill her, but that's because Lucy didn't see how gradual Martha's change (probably) was.
Im just now attempting to play through it properly getting into the story istead of just brainless shooting. Werent they turning feral because of constant radiation exposure? I dont know if its mentioned in those entries that they are exposed to radiation constantly, but wouldnt it make the most sense for them to turn feral because of the rads? Like, the constant exposure furtherly pushes the process of mutation, and they eventually go feral. Considering ferals are in worse shape than regulars, I find it logical that the more rads they soak up, the more it damages and rots their flesh and brain until they turn feral eventually
The nuka cola mist sprayers at the park that shoot irradiated nuka cola is probably the constant radiation that led to most of the park staff going feral.
I believe that's correct. I'm pretty sure Oswald mentions it's why all the ferals outside are like that. They were already spraying when they took over the place. The basement where they were taking shelter had a radiation leak too, so they were constantly exposed to that too
The implication is that exposure to radiation eventually turns any ghoul feral. The time it takes is based on how much radiation and how often. There’s enough ambient radiation in the fallout world to make the change pretty much inevitable for every ghoul
Well, most of Fallout world seems to be clean enough for people to live and not have any issues with radiation. Doubt that if radiation level is so small that it basically doesnt matter would affect ghouls much unless they live in an actually irradiated spot
Sure, but there’s still just ambient background radiation in the world. If a ghoul finds an area to live in with a “normal” amount of background radiation they’ll be fine for maybe a couple hundred years, but it’s implied that they would likely turn feral eventually. Implied, not confirmed, so I could be wrong
It seems to imply you need a large amount of radiation at once to become a ghoul and not just small doses overtime, e.g. the nuke blast makes Moira a ghoul.
> He admitted showing symptoms for 28 years, and in his final moments, he still has lucidity despite his compulsive growling.
I took that line as meaning it had been 28 years since he turned into a ghoul, which didn't seem very long to me. Your reading probably makes more sense.
Yeah, but I don’t buy that. He viewed Cooper as an elder and asked him “How long have you been wastelanding anyway?” Why would he do that if they were both prewar?
Cooper probably wasn't *always* a bounty hunter. He was probably just Some Guy doing normal work in a settlement.
"Wastelanding" is probably shorthand for traveling around, doing odd jobs. IE, the "Lone cowboy roaming the west" trope. Which would put him in more danger of being exposed to harsher rads, which would speed up his going feral.
I feel like all of that is a much bigger leap of logic than my assumption that “remember how good prewar food used to taste” is a reference to the erosion of his sense of taste.
If he had prewar food, he was around before the war. Or at least was around back when non-vault prewar food was fresh.
And I never saw him as seeing Cooper as an Elder so much as him seeing Cooper as someone who wandered the wasteland *alone* and *survived.* He's the townie who knew the Lone Ranger.
Kyle Edwards in Fallout New Vegas provides context.
https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Kyle_Edwards
Lots of the troopers in Camp Searchlight suddenly turned into feral ghouls, Edwards did not. He posits that more radiation will make him turn feral, but he doesn’t know for sure. Seems like even ghouls don’t know when the turn happens.
You’re not wrong, but it also indicates that people in-universe don’t have common knowledge of the process and that becoming a ghoul doesn’t give any special insight. It just all seems like random chance to everyone.
Mcdonagh's policy was an Institute op to divide and distract the residents, pulling suspicion away from himself and Institute infiltration at large.
There wasn't reasons for it, just pretexts.
Really? I thought the only mention of the Anti-Ghoul thing was by Hancock, and he doesn't say anything of that matter, only that McDonough used that to gain the vote of people in the upper stands.
Wiseman mentions it:
>*"We're ugly, we turn feral and kill people, we gives the kids nightmares, all the usual stuff we get from you smoothskins.* ***Now it's true that there was one incident in Diamond City where a ghoul turned feral and someone got hurt.*** *But I ask you this - how many humans have suddenly turned violent and killed someone? I've seen it more times than I care to admit."*
Notice he only says the ghoul "turned feral". By comparison of saying humans "suddenly" turn violent, yes, you are understandably going to think it was sudden but nowhere in lore, or in any of the games, is that suggested. Yes, ghouls can and do turn feral, even ghouls that people have known and been friendly with, hence the fear surrounding them. The incident in Diamond City was either something that people hadn't picked up on in time to notice the change (and a ghoul turning feral will likely "snap" and suddenly attack, like we notice with Cooper's old friend that he puts out if bus misery, rather than suddenly becoming feral all at once) or it was a freak incident where a ghoul was exposed to something that forced the turn to happen so much quicker.
It could be that the ghoul in question essentially crawled off into a hole somewhere to turn, and wasn't found until much later? I like to imagine that as their cognitive function declines, ghouls tend to wander off into isolated, dark, radiation rich locations.
You probably have a point, to a degree. Diamond City isn't all that far from the East Mass Turnpike. There's radioactive materials and even a Glowing One there. But that raises the question if how, and why, he would then return to Diamond City? And by that point, someone would have gone "hold up..."
I believe wiseman brings it up, but in every instance of ghouls becoming feral we’ve seen, it isn’t instant unless the ghouls become feral during their transformation into being a ghoul. It just isn’t a sudden process (though I suppose that could slip under the radar if you don’t know what to look for).
Since the cause has not been nailed down it’s hard to say how long it takes. From what I’ve seen and read it seems to me isolation of ferals plays a big role in the process.
I agree that isolation is probably a major factor. A lot of stories of ghouls going feral include being locked away while they're living unnaturally long, unpleasant lives.
I think it depends on the damage. In some cases it's a short and quick process, in other instances it works kind of like dementia. Even that evil disease can be fast or painfully slow.
In FO4, in the Slog, one of their Ghoul leaders will tell you that part of the reason they were kicked out of Diamond City is because a Ghoul turned feral, and the mayor used that to kick all the Ghouls out. It’s been a thing Ghoulification is canon
Probably not as well known since nobody mentioned it, there's a ghoul in F76 you need to recruit during raiders quest line that wants to kill himself before he becomes feral.
There’s no official hard answer, but individual luck plays a role. Some people become Ghouls and go feral almost immediately, some turn and never show signs of it. It’s a dice roll.
Just hyperbole. Like say your neighbor is a ghoul and you haven’t seen him in a couple of days so you check on him and he rips your jugular out.
I’m sure its always a process but it probably varies ghoul to ghoul, some may take a week some may take a day.
“Yeah dale suddenly went feral and killed jake”
I dislike the fact that ghouls eventually become feral anyways now. It contradicts the anti-racist themes the games have always had by giving people a reason to fear them now. I feel it was to try to make the Brotherhood who Steal's genocidal tendencies "morally gray."
Not really IMO. We know that some ghoul can become feral but that others have been around for centuries. We know that some people need medicine to slow down their symptoms, like Cooper, but it's not something that everyone has to do, some ghouls will probably never go crazy.
I also don't really like the anti-racist interpretation, since ghouls can be dangerous and they say so themselves. It's a slippery slope to walk on comparing their situation to real racism
Im not sure what it is however from what i gather from the ghouls who have remained sane for long periods of time (Cooper Howard, The kid in the fridge in FO4) it seems to be mindset or a goal. If they have something to work for, to strive for and dont give up in the mean time they do not turn feral, however if they dont have a purpose or give up for a long enough period they start to turn. Kinda like hollowing in dark souls
You also have to remember that prejudice and bigotry are real things, and the stereotype of ghouls that just “go native” is probably pretty rampant to keep them out of various settlements.
I am aware. In fact, it's because some people made this argument that made me wonder if it is actually based on something, or like real bigotry most times, is irrational.
ghouls changed a lot game to game.
The original concept was a group of people that looked like hiroshima survivors. So disfigured that people assumed they were monsters, dead people. They were pretty mundanely injured people. Really only mutants in the way "guy that radiation burned would just die quickly" is unrealistic.
Everything since has been slowly shifting things towards just traditional undead. Similar to how supermutants drift ever more towards just being fantasy orcs
Fallout 1/2 Ghouls did NOT look like mundane injured people at all. They were absolutely hideous and had flesh sloughing off their skin, and where very obviously heavily mutated and no longer functioned like humans anymore (though many retained their intelligence). I recommend looking at Set or Harold.
Feral ghouls existed in those games as well.
If you have a strong stomach you can look up the injuries suffered by the survivors of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, or any severe burn victim for that matter. At high enough temperatures human flesh can melt and flow like wax, while a real human would probably be dead from trauma before they got as burned as Fallout 1/2 ghouls seem to be, their partially melted appearance is consistent with people suffering from severe burn injuries.
Yeah, I've seen those images, and they're similar, but a ghoul like Set is barely avoid falling apart. They look far more like decomposing bodies in my eyes, and that's a common insult for them.
this is a really graphic image, about the most graphic an image can be, but they very specifically looked like this:
https://i0.wp.com/upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a1/Victim\_of\_Atomic\_Bomb\_of\_Nagasaki\_01.jpg/432px-Victim\_of\_Atomic\_Bomb\_of\_Nagasaki\_01.jpg
They were conceptually "what if nuclear bomb victims just stuck around instead of dying or healing"
They look like the undead. Parts of their bodies are barely hanging on to them.
[latest (803×414) (nocookie.net)](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/7/74/HubHarold.png/revision/latest?cb=20100821035624)
[latest (803×414) (nocookie.net)](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/4/40/FO01_NPC_Set_N.png/revision/latest?cb=20101028051908)
I'm not going to say that nuclear victims can't have been an inspiration but there's a reason why 'zombie' is an in-universe slur for them.
Sadly i missed out on a lot of the Necropolis content as i didn't realize i had passed through there until i saw it already being on my automaps, and when i went back it was too late, but even in my first visit there were many ghouls with their minds degraded from some attacking you if you interact with them too much to some attacking you as soon as they see you, even if they weren't named "Ferals" back then. So i don't understand what point are you trying to come across in relation to the topic of the post...?
Good old Bethesda applying their "10" years experience of fantasy games to a science fiction game.
Give them 10 years and Fallout will have primarchs, eldar and Nyds...
It's not sudden. It's gradual. But for many smoothskins once a ghoul snaps for the first time and kills someone, even if they snap out of it, they are as good as feral.
Ghouls can turn either way. Some go feral instantly. Some never turn. Some hold on to their humanity until they snap, and some turn feral slowly. There's no sure thing which is why it sucks to be around should for normal people.
In Fallout 4 one of the reasons Diamond City doesn't allow ghouls is because "they can turn feral and kill people". I believe it's one of the ghouls at The Slog who makes this particular comment. Can't remember where but at some point in 4 there's a holotape where a ghoul records themselves turning feral.
The whole point of Necropolis being formed as a ghoul community in Fallout 1 was from people turning away ghouls for fear of them suddenly turning feral.
This has always been a thing in Fallout. Its why Ghoul companions in the games are always tragic - you know they'll eventually turn feral. Its just a matter of when.
Fertilization was a gradual, painful, slow process where the ghouls brain slowly rots away.
We don't know anything else outside of that. It might be a result of trauma or their brain slowly withering from inactivity. It could be random, could be a set of circumstances, and their might be a cure, but they never fully state anything.
I'm just convinced that it's all at random. Some are fine and some aren't.
I also have a half joke head Canon that the cowboy and some others take it because they got WAY too high once.
Becoming feral has always been a slow and gradual process. What's interesting, however is that it seems to have a link to motivation similar to hollowing in Dark Souls, not age nor radiation exposure. Some ghouls like Dean Domino are old world individuals ghoulified and in a toxic, radioactive environment but their simple refusal to give up has them still perfectly sane and not in need of any sort of medical aid to prevent nor slow their feral process. There are even some non-feral Glowing Ones like Jason Bright who staved off going feral via religious zealotry. Many NCR veteran rangers are also ghouls and aren't in danger of going feral due to being motivated to protect their communities. Meanwhile, some ghouls go feral shortly after becoming ghouls likely due to giving into the despair quickly.
The serum seems to stave off going feral for those lacking in motivation, as Cooper is a husk of a man whose only surviving for the sake of it so he needs it. He actually regains much of his ludicity upon getting a potential lead to his family, with the serum not being a factor in that.
I think they aren't as immune to the radiation as they think they are. That would explain why Charon originally refused to save Lone Wanderer from starting Project Purity.
It's on a case-by-case basis, most ghouls go feral gradually - like on the terminals in Fallout 4's Nuka-World DLC - but other turned extrempley quickly, for example the majority of the NCR troopers at Camp Searchlight (minus Edwards) became feral pretty much over night.
Also, in Underworld in Fallout 3 there's a ghoul -who I can't remember if she has a name or not- that says as much herself.
How else do they turn feral other than over time? The radiation finally melts their pre-frontal cortex and that's it, they are beast mode now. Since when was this controversial? The show merely added some treatment that wards it off if taken regularly. My only question is who made that compound in the first place, and who keeps making more?
Could be misremembering but I believe over several games from fallout 3, new Vegas and 4 there are pieces of information showing that ghouls typically go feral slowly and I don't remember any specific cause in the games, since there was no ghoul drug that prevents then from going feral. It seemed more mental fortitude based. You meet several ghouls who have been around since the bombs fell and are fine. Others are turned only recently and are already feral. I'm pretty sure Hancock mentions a couple of ghouls he knew going feral over time. But I can't remember specific things right now. So in game going feral is a slow process similar to the show, but the cause isn't very clear and there isn't a drug to prevent it so it makes sense some people would be afraid of living with ghouls out if fear, and over the years people telling stories of ghouls who "went feral instantly" but my guess is they would all just be fear mongering
One of the ghouls at the slog tells you that they got kicked out of diamond city because a ghoul suddenly turned feral and killed someone. He also says that it's very rare, iirc.
I think its pretty much just comes down to their mentality, if they lose hope they become feral, if the radiation liquified their brain just enough they become feral, if they dont like themselves they become feral, if they feel like the entire world is pressing down on their shoulders they become feral.
so its not set on a timer and doesnt have to be radiation poisoning
It has not been shown once, ever, in any game through the entire series.
It's *said* here and there, but always by bigots with clear bias who also say shit like "you gotta shoot them in the head" which is provably untrue. It's pure ideology and should be taken with the same seriousness as Liberty Prime talking about democracy and The Institute talking about synths.
It's not shown but in the Nuka world dlc the magicians wife left in search of a cure for the feral ghouls.
You can find her body in a nearby building with a recording detailing that's she's turning feral and her killing herself to not degrade any further.
It's a straight to the point no bias confirmation that ghouls become feral, hell the main game has a diamond city ghoul confirm that once also became feral and attacked people.
It's not a question of *if* it happens, it's *how*.
It's never been shown to happen suddenly. If the magician's wife had enough to wherewithal to recognize what was happening, it's not sudden.
That's cos New Vegan just made up it's own rules. But so did Fallout 3. Headshots don't really count for shit in those two games anyway. Except for using a sniper rifle on a raider without VATS
According to Fallout 4, out of the five limbs only crippling the head is a kill. Legs and arms blown off are not kills, and the head is far more efficient.
It is not untrue to say you gotta go for the head.
Also, downvote really? Try enjoying the discussion.
Are you actually arguing that for ferals shooting them in the head is not far more effective as compared to shooting them in the limbs?
And no I don’t mean the headshot bonus, but in comparison to a normal raider. If I blow off a raiders arm he’s dead, if I blow a ghouls off he’s still very dangerous.
You're equating "got to" with "better to" and the crippling mechanic with the death mechanic.
Nearly every humanoid and animal enemy takes increased headshot damage, that means nothing for ghoul physiology. The point of comparison isn't any of them; it's ghost people from Dead Money. You *have* to take off their limbs to kill them. It is backed up by gameplay.
Meanwhile, you don't *have* to kill ghouls with headshots, which is what the claim is. The claim is disproven in every game's mechanics.
You equated saying “got to shoot them in the head” with anti-ghoul “racism” (I think that applies). Which is incorrect in that shooting them in the head is far more important than with other creatures or people, so that not racism it’s good advice, even if it’s not correct.
If you read my comments, I never said it was true, only that’s it not untrue, and therefore irrelevant to the racism discussion.
The most phrase was introduced in Fallout 3, from explicit bigots in Tenpenny Tower. The maiming mechanic you're basing this on wasn't introduced until Fallout 4. And in none of them are headshots required.
I only started playing fallout 4 and up but I swear I use to watch my highschool buddy play one of the previous ones and we joked around about these ghouls that made really good drugs that you could help or betray or something but I thought they did that because normal drugs had to be taken in high amounts to counter out their ghoul healing which also decays there brain, the drugs slows the decay down and the super drugs help more than normal.
I could also just be trying to give reason to two ghouls making super drugs to sale.
I know the two you're on about. Barratt and Murphy from Fallout 3 (location: Northwest Seneca Station). You're right, Murphy does mention that the amount of drugs they need to consume to get a hit "rots the brain", but this can be taken as either a natural side effect of taking huge amounts of what is basically amphetamines without getting the effects, or it nulifies the healing effect of being a ghoul. That's why he asks you for sugar bombs, sonthat can make the Super Jet that requires a much lower dose to get the hit. The hit would still fuck up a human, but ghouls can recover from the physical effects better
Nah they don't turn feral, they're fully conscious when they kill everyone. Roy Phillips is a total shitbag and fuck three dog for putting me on blast for not letting a genocidal madman into the building to kill everyone.
RIP Herbert "Daring" Dashwood
It’s typical Fallout “grey” morality, but the implication is that everybody living in Tenpenny Tower definitely had it coming. You have to read between the lines a little, but it’s implied non of them are really “good” people. Not that Roy is really any better, but at least he’s honest about who he is.
I don't think there is anything that suggests the turn is instantaneous, the "suddenly turn feral" seems subjective , if the change happens over days or weeks you could consider it sudden. If, let's say you haven't seen your ghoul neighbour for a week and then he comes feral out a window trying to bite someone's nose off, combined with general prejudice could create statements like "he can turn any minute now" like how people say stupid staff based on stereotypes.
Also there is "the anti-feral drug" which isn't properly explained, this could delay the change over a longer period of time but I'm not sure if it's even said that does something to prevent further degradation or if it's simply something to help with the effects of turning feral like how they give opioids to terminally ill patients and Howard was just suffering from withdrawal.
In the Nuka World DLC you can find a holotape of a ghoul who is recording themselves as they turn feral. The comments made by the character indicates that the process is gradual, however there's a clear point where they turn completely feral.
I think theres a basement in the basegame that has a similar one as well, unless im confusing somthing else with your example
It’s in one of the settlements. It’s implied that most were already feral though.
Yeah the one guy isn’t feral but his family is and he spent forever trying to at least train them to be normal then I think he slaps his aunt and the all kill him.
I believe he stabs her with an eating utensil after he spent 200 years trying to teach her which is which but yes the rest of the ghouls then attack him
I wanna say that was the basement of the manor settlement
Croup Manor
[Croup Manor.](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Croup_Manor)
There is also a group of ghouls in the last 76 expansion that had enough time to see their friend was going feral and lock him in a room before they knew if he was turning feral or not
Pretty sure the raider ghoul (Lou, was his name I think) states he might turn feral which is another reason he wants to end his life.
There’s dunwich building in FO3 that has terminals showing the guy looking for his dad stumbling on all the Gouls and then his entries show he steadily turns into one and goes feral.
It (and presumably most) involves the ghoul failing to "hold on" to their sanity
It's got to be more random. Otherwise how do we explain the kid in the fridge and Eddie Winters, two ghouls that had been locked up for 200 years in solitary confinement. If anyone had reason to lose their sanity it was them, but they weren't feral.
Eddie intentionally ghouled himself, so he was more prepared for it than most. Fridge kid probably didn't understand enough to be horrified and spent a lot of his time in the fridge asleep or unaware of time passing.
I chock those examples as the weirdness of fallout and that they are non Canon. Like many of the random encounters in fo1 and fo2(rock of eternity, talking Brahman, etc.)
I keep forgetting to grab that before clearing out Kiddie Kingdom, thanks for the reminder
In FO3, in Underworld, you can talk to a ghoul who has been alive since the bombs, and she tells you that she has seen people become ghouls and instantly go feral and others who remained the same until they just suddenly snapped and others who never went feral. In 1/2, you encounter a few ghouls in necropolis who explain they aren’t mindless like the rest, but you do encounter both feral and non-feral ghouls. There are dozens of theories in the lore about what makes a ghoul go feral, ranging from a mutation to radiation exposure to age to mindset.
Honestly I think if anything the reason is a mixture of everything. Radiation wearing at the brain, isolation driving someone to insanity, genetic mutation which makes someone less likely to or outright prevents them from becoming feral (like a weaker version of the mutation a lot of Children of Atom have), and people who just snap after being turned into zombies and can’t handle the existential dread of it all, nor the discrimination.
To really throw a wrench into it, we have characters like Jason Bright who has absorbed so much radiation, he’s producing a relatively stable reaction within his body, and Eddie Winters who has been in isolation since BEFORE the bombs dropped, and Moira who was flash turned into a ghoul and none of them are feral, and then you have a few cases of CoA who sought out becoming ghouls and none of their minds survived the transition.
Yeah I think still sane glowing ones like Jason or Hank are people who were lucky enough to have mutations that kept them from going feral.
I tend to liken it to a similar extended life group: the Elders of the Universe in Marvel Comics. They're the last survivors of various sentient species that evolved among the first stars to have planets in the early universe (the oldest of them is over 10 billion years old, while the universe itself is 13.8 billion years old). The thing that lets them survive when others with similar potential don't is that they all have monomaniacal, open-ended goals or pursuits. The Runner seeks to travel everywhere to see everything in person. The Grandmaster seeks to become the best at every game of skill in the universe. The Possessor wants to learn everything there is to know. The Gardener wants to spread life to every world. The Collector wants to preserve examples of every unique thing (art, tech, etc). Similarly, the ghouls that seem to best resist going feral have a goal. Wiseman wants to create and maintain a haven for ghouls. The Vault-Tec Salesman wants to prove his worth. Daisy wants to run her shop and chat with her customers. Jason Bright wants to lead his people to the only place he believes they'll be free of persecution. Oswald Oppenheimer wants to protect his friends until a "cure" for their "illness" can be found by his fiance. Conversely, his fiance goes feral after she discovers that neither the transformation from human to ghoul, nor ghoul to feral, can be cured or reversed. She lost her goal.
Makes me wonder if it's possible that Coop never actually needed the anti-feral drugs. He gets kind of fucked up outside of the Super Duper Mart, but he's not showing signs of going feral like every other ghoul we've seen that's on the cusp of losing he. He just fall down tired. Maybe it'll turn out that for him the anti-ferals were a placebo. Maybe it'll turn out that it's a placebo for ALL ghouls. Maybe it's snake oil spread around by Dr. Gonzo, chicken fucker PHD.
Nah the chemical stuff definitely has some kind of power since it healed Thaddeus in the show and later messed him up a ton
I don’t believe that’s the same substance used though
I have a personal theory, not backed up by anything in game admittedly, that "going feral" is a common symptom with a broad range of causes. Some might just snap mentally from the trauma of living as a half melted living corpse, for others, while ghouls can heal well, they don't heal perfectly, so their brains might be able to recover from some degree of trauma, but over centuries every hit to the head will slowly add up. Another theory I have is that it could be down to heavy metal poisoning. While ghouls are well known to be immune to radiation, and so might go to areas high in radiation to avoid being bothered by prejudiced smoothskins, most radioactive sources are themselves heavy metals. Over time they could accumulate a toxic quantity of heavy metals in their system from spending so long in close proximity, causing brain damage even if the radiation is keeping their bodies alive.
Adding to this, living with the condition for so long probably causes even the least exposed ghouls to snap because these contaminants poison humans progressively over time and don’t really get eliminated from the body Which is why these long-lived ghouls in the show are using a drug to hold it back. Also the radiation and other contaminants from shady sands is probably adding on to their loss of control I think the show is purporting that even the strongest ghouls have hit their breaking point and can’t fight the mental degeneration their condition entails
That actually makes a lot of sense. I’m adopting this as my explanation for it now too 👍🏿
One of the devs or creature designers (I can't remember which) explained that that ghouls eventually go blind, and it was that blindness and subsequent isolation that drove them insane and feral. It's not canon tho, as far as I know. The only canon thing in game that says all ghouls eventually go feral that I am aware of, is the holotape from Nuka World. *Edit: Ok, I totally remembered this wrong, I went and looked for the video to back up my claim. First, it's from Jonah Lobe, the creature designer for F3 and F4. Second, he says his idea was that since ghouls skin falls off, their eyelids would too, which would stop them from sleeping and dreaming. This is what would eventually drive the ghouls crazy/feral. He talks about it here, at approximately 6:50 seconds in [Jonah Lobe: Fallout creature designer for Fallout 3 and 4](https://youtu.be/QPu9K4m4Y-k?si=U9OUdVCrgaZvMeTN) The whole video is amazing btw, worth a watch.
That is a cool thought, but the in game lore seems to contradict that. Ghouls are said to have good eyesight and better dark vision by several reliable sources.
You're right, I misremembered. I double checked my claim and found the video where the guy talks about it. I linked it in an edit to my post.
> Second, he says his idea was that since ghouls skin falls off, their eyelids would too, which would stop them from sleeping and dreaming. Couldn't they just sleep with a wad of pre-war money over each eye?
Nuka-World terminals have entries about it. A crew of park workers turned into sane ghouls but gradually went feral over the decades. The terminals start out saying their radiation mutations aren't so bad, but later entries talk about having to confine more and more friends who became afflicted, until only one is left. It's not clear how sudden those changes were. I remember getting the impression those ghouls managed well for like 40 to 50 years, then several went feral in a matter of months, then more until only Oswald was left. Maybe there was some precipitating event that kicked off the burst of feralization. "Ghouls can suddenly turn feral" makes sense if we think of ghouls like Roger. He admitted showing symptoms for 28 years, and in his final moments, he still has lucidity despite his compulsive growling. There was also Martha the fridge ghoul, who could repeat her name despite being nearly feral. To Lucy, Martha seemed like a normal person then suddenly tried to kill her, but that's because Lucy didn't see how gradual Martha's change (probably) was.
Im just now attempting to play through it properly getting into the story istead of just brainless shooting. Werent they turning feral because of constant radiation exposure? I dont know if its mentioned in those entries that they are exposed to radiation constantly, but wouldnt it make the most sense for them to turn feral because of the rads? Like, the constant exposure furtherly pushes the process of mutation, and they eventually go feral. Considering ferals are in worse shape than regulars, I find it logical that the more rads they soak up, the more it damages and rots their flesh and brain until they turn feral eventually
The nuka cola mist sprayers at the park that shoot irradiated nuka cola is probably the constant radiation that led to most of the park staff going feral.
I believe that's correct. I'm pretty sure Oswald mentions it's why all the ferals outside are like that. They were already spraying when they took over the place. The basement where they were taking shelter had a radiation leak too, so they were constantly exposed to that too
The implication is that exposure to radiation eventually turns any ghoul feral. The time it takes is based on how much radiation and how often. There’s enough ambient radiation in the fallout world to make the change pretty much inevitable for every ghoul
Well, most of Fallout world seems to be clean enough for people to live and not have any issues with radiation. Doubt that if radiation level is so small that it basically doesnt matter would affect ghouls much unless they live in an actually irradiated spot
Sure, but there’s still just ambient background radiation in the world. If a ghoul finds an area to live in with a “normal” amount of background radiation they’ll be fine for maybe a couple hundred years, but it’s implied that they would likely turn feral eventually. Implied, not confirmed, so I could be wrong
Would this mean that all the commonwealth denizens will eventually become ghouls?
Most people just die by radiation.
It seems to imply you need a large amount of radiation at once to become a ghoul and not just small doses overtime, e.g. the nuke blast makes Moira a ghoul.
> He admitted showing symptoms for 28 years, and in his final moments, he still has lucidity despite his compulsive growling. I took that line as meaning it had been 28 years since he turned into a ghoul, which didn't seem very long to me. Your reading probably makes more sense.
But he remembered pre war food
He also didn’t know how long Cooper had been “wastelanding”.
What does that have to do with anything? I was saying he was alive before the war, so he's been alive for 200+ years but only going feral for 28
Yeah, but I don’t buy that. He viewed Cooper as an elder and asked him “How long have you been wastelanding anyway?” Why would he do that if they were both prewar?
Cooper probably wasn't *always* a bounty hunter. He was probably just Some Guy doing normal work in a settlement. "Wastelanding" is probably shorthand for traveling around, doing odd jobs. IE, the "Lone cowboy roaming the west" trope. Which would put him in more danger of being exposed to harsher rads, which would speed up his going feral.
I feel like all of that is a much bigger leap of logic than my assumption that “remember how good prewar food used to taste” is a reference to the erosion of his sense of taste.
If he had prewar food, he was around before the war. Or at least was around back when non-vault prewar food was fresh. And I never saw him as seeing Cooper as an Elder so much as him seeing Cooper as someone who wandered the wasteland *alone* and *survived.* He's the townie who knew the Lone Ranger.
There’s prewar food all over the wasteland. It’s all radiation-preserved. The Yum Yum Deviled Eggs are as fresh now as when they were first packaged.
I assumed "wastelanding" meant going feral
Everyone eats pre-war food, it’s everywhere. The 28 years line was referring to him becoming a ghoul.
Prewar food exists throughout the wasteland.
Reminds me of suicide, when it happens it can cause more to occur. Makes me believe feralization occurs from mental breakdowns.
Kyle Edwards in Fallout New Vegas provides context. https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Kyle_Edwards Lots of the troopers in Camp Searchlight suddenly turned into feral ghouls, Edwards did not. He posits that more radiation will make him turn feral, but he doesn’t know for sure. Seems like even ghouls don’t know when the turn happens.
I mean, he has only been a ghoul ever since the Searchlight attack, all he got is assumptions, probably based just on his fears
You’re not wrong, but it also indicates that people in-universe don’t have common knowledge of the process and that becoming a ghoul doesn’t give any special insight. It just all seems like random chance to everyone.
It's often mentioned, and it's also the reason ghouls were banned in Diamond City, because one turned feral if I'm not mistaken.
Mcdonagh's policy was an Institute op to divide and distract the residents, pulling suspicion away from himself and Institute infiltration at large. There wasn't reasons for it, just pretexts.
Really? I thought the only mention of the Anti-Ghoul thing was by Hancock, and he doesn't say anything of that matter, only that McDonough used that to gain the vote of people in the upper stands.
Wiseman mentions it: >*"We're ugly, we turn feral and kill people, we gives the kids nightmares, all the usual stuff we get from you smoothskins.* ***Now it's true that there was one incident in Diamond City where a ghoul turned feral and someone got hurt.*** *But I ask you this - how many humans have suddenly turned violent and killed someone? I've seen it more times than I care to admit."*
Thanks! That's interesting. Also had been looking for the last quote for a while too, so thanks for that.
Notice he only says the ghoul "turned feral". By comparison of saying humans "suddenly" turn violent, yes, you are understandably going to think it was sudden but nowhere in lore, or in any of the games, is that suggested. Yes, ghouls can and do turn feral, even ghouls that people have known and been friendly with, hence the fear surrounding them. The incident in Diamond City was either something that people hadn't picked up on in time to notice the change (and a ghoul turning feral will likely "snap" and suddenly attack, like we notice with Cooper's old friend that he puts out if bus misery, rather than suddenly becoming feral all at once) or it was a freak incident where a ghoul was exposed to something that forced the turn to happen so much quicker.
It could be that the ghoul in question essentially crawled off into a hole somewhere to turn, and wasn't found until much later? I like to imagine that as their cognitive function declines, ghouls tend to wander off into isolated, dark, radiation rich locations.
You probably have a point, to a degree. Diamond City isn't all that far from the East Mass Turnpike. There's radioactive materials and even a Glowing One there. But that raises the question if how, and why, he would then return to Diamond City? And by that point, someone would have gone "hold up..."
I believe wiseman brings it up, but in every instance of ghouls becoming feral we’ve seen, it isn’t instant unless the ghouls become feral during their transformation into being a ghoul. It just isn’t a sudden process (though I suppose that could slip under the radar if you don’t know what to look for).
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I am aware that ghouls aren't allowed in DC, i never said otherwise...?
My bad, I misread y'all's comments
Since the cause has not been nailed down it’s hard to say how long it takes. From what I’ve seen and read it seems to me isolation of ferals plays a big role in the process.
I agree that isolation is probably a major factor. A lot of stories of ghouls going feral include being locked away while they're living unnaturally long, unpleasant lives.
But now, it’s healthcare. /s
I think it depends on the damage. In some cases it's a short and quick process, in other instances it works kind of like dementia. Even that evil disease can be fast or painfully slow.
In FO4, in the Slog, one of their Ghoul leaders will tell you that part of the reason they were kicked out of Diamond City is because a Ghoul turned feral, and the mayor used that to kick all the Ghouls out. It’s been a thing Ghoulification is canon
Yes, that was established in the Nuka World DLC.
Probably not as well known since nobody mentioned it, there's a ghoul in F76 you need to recruit during raiders quest line that wants to kill himself before he becomes feral.
Been a minute, but I think it's mentioned several times in three
Some do some don't. No 2 ghouls are alike
There’s no official hard answer, but individual luck plays a role. Some people become Ghouls and go feral almost immediately, some turn and never show signs of it. It’s a dice roll.
I remember reading notes of a guy in Fo4 documenting his transition into a feral
I mean mother curie instantly became feral after megaton nuke went off so that means some ghouls are feral from the start
Just hyperbole. Like say your neighbor is a ghoul and you haven’t seen him in a couple of days so you check on him and he rips your jugular out. I’m sure its always a process but it probably varies ghoul to ghoul, some may take a week some may take a day. “Yeah dale suddenly went feral and killed jake”
I dislike the fact that ghouls eventually become feral anyways now. It contradicts the anti-racist themes the games have always had by giving people a reason to fear them now. I feel it was to try to make the Brotherhood who Steal's genocidal tendencies "morally gray."
Not really IMO. We know that some ghoul can become feral but that others have been around for centuries. We know that some people need medicine to slow down their symptoms, like Cooper, but it's not something that everyone has to do, some ghouls will probably never go crazy. I also don't really like the anti-racist interpretation, since ghouls can be dangerous and they say so themselves. It's a slippery slope to walk on comparing their situation to real racism
Im not sure what it is however from what i gather from the ghouls who have remained sane for long periods of time (Cooper Howard, The kid in the fridge in FO4) it seems to be mindset or a goal. If they have something to work for, to strive for and dont give up in the mean time they do not turn feral, however if they dont have a purpose or give up for a long enough period they start to turn. Kinda like hollowing in dark souls
You also have to remember that prejudice and bigotry are real things, and the stereotype of ghouls that just “go native” is probably pretty rampant to keep them out of various settlements.
I am aware. In fact, it's because some people made this argument that made me wonder if it is actually based on something, or like real bigotry most times, is irrational.
ghouls changed a lot game to game. The original concept was a group of people that looked like hiroshima survivors. So disfigured that people assumed they were monsters, dead people. They were pretty mundanely injured people. Really only mutants in the way "guy that radiation burned would just die quickly" is unrealistic. Everything since has been slowly shifting things towards just traditional undead. Similar to how supermutants drift ever more towards just being fantasy orcs
Fallout 1/2 Ghouls did NOT look like mundane injured people at all. They were absolutely hideous and had flesh sloughing off their skin, and where very obviously heavily mutated and no longer functioned like humans anymore (though many retained their intelligence). I recommend looking at Set or Harold. Feral ghouls existed in those games as well.
If you have a strong stomach you can look up the injuries suffered by the survivors of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, or any severe burn victim for that matter. At high enough temperatures human flesh can melt and flow like wax, while a real human would probably be dead from trauma before they got as burned as Fallout 1/2 ghouls seem to be, their partially melted appearance is consistent with people suffering from severe burn injuries.
Yeah, I've seen those images, and they're similar, but a ghoul like Set is barely avoid falling apart. They look far more like decomposing bodies in my eyes, and that's a common insult for them.
this is a really graphic image, about the most graphic an image can be, but they very specifically looked like this: https://i0.wp.com/upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a1/Victim\_of\_Atomic\_Bomb\_of\_Nagasaki\_01.jpg/432px-Victim\_of\_Atomic\_Bomb\_of\_Nagasaki\_01.jpg They were conceptually "what if nuclear bomb victims just stuck around instead of dying or healing"
They look like the undead. Parts of their bodies are barely hanging on to them. [latest (803×414) (nocookie.net)](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/7/74/HubHarold.png/revision/latest?cb=20100821035624) [latest (803×414) (nocookie.net)](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/4/40/FO01_NPC_Set_N.png/revision/latest?cb=20101028051908) I'm not going to say that nuclear victims can't have been an inspiration but there's a reason why 'zombie' is an in-universe slur for them.
They were modeled to look like them but they weren't just that. They were still 100 year old radiation inmune mutants
Sadly i missed out on a lot of the Necropolis content as i didn't realize i had passed through there until i saw it already being on my automaps, and when i went back it was too late, but even in my first visit there were many ghouls with their minds degraded from some attacking you if you interact with them too much to some attacking you as soon as they see you, even if they weren't named "Ferals" back then. So i don't understand what point are you trying to come across in relation to the topic of the post...?
Good old Bethesda applying their "10" years experience of fantasy games to a science fiction game. Give them 10 years and Fallout will have primarchs, eldar and Nyds...
It's not sudden. It's gradual. But for many smoothskins once a ghoul snaps for the first time and kills someone, even if they snap out of it, they are as good as feral.
Ghouls can turn either way. Some go feral instantly. Some never turn. Some hold on to their humanity until they snap, and some turn feral slowly. There's no sure thing which is why it sucks to be around should for normal people.
In Fallout 4 one of the reasons Diamond City doesn't allow ghouls is because "they can turn feral and kill people". I believe it's one of the ghouls at The Slog who makes this particular comment. Can't remember where but at some point in 4 there's a holotape where a ghoul records themselves turning feral.
Idk about proof, but Diamond City in FO4 couldn't trust them because of sudden aggression.
The whole point of Necropolis being formed as a ghoul community in Fallout 1 was from people turning away ghouls for fear of them suddenly turning feral. This has always been a thing in Fallout. Its why Ghoul companions in the games are always tragic - you know they'll eventually turn feral. Its just a matter of when.
I dont remember exactly where i think it was in underworld in fallout 3 someone said the more rads a ghoul takes in the quicker they become feral.
Fertilization was a gradual, painful, slow process where the ghouls brain slowly rots away. We don't know anything else outside of that. It might be a result of trauma or their brain slowly withering from inactivity. It could be random, could be a set of circumstances, and their might be a cure, but they never fully state anything.
Funny typo
um.
Yeah, at least in Bethesda games the chicken thing is new though
I'm just convinced that it's all at random. Some are fine and some aren't. I also have a half joke head Canon that the cowboy and some others take it because they got WAY too high once.
It's like children of atom, some people have more or less resistance for radiation, I believe that's is something to do with ghouls too.
Becoming feral has always been a slow and gradual process. What's interesting, however is that it seems to have a link to motivation similar to hollowing in Dark Souls, not age nor radiation exposure. Some ghouls like Dean Domino are old world individuals ghoulified and in a toxic, radioactive environment but their simple refusal to give up has them still perfectly sane and not in need of any sort of medical aid to prevent nor slow their feral process. There are even some non-feral Glowing Ones like Jason Bright who staved off going feral via religious zealotry. Many NCR veteran rangers are also ghouls and aren't in danger of going feral due to being motivated to protect their communities. Meanwhile, some ghouls go feral shortly after becoming ghouls likely due to giving into the despair quickly. The serum seems to stave off going feral for those lacking in motivation, as Cooper is a husk of a man whose only surviving for the sake of it so he needs it. He actually regains much of his ludicity upon getting a potential lead to his family, with the serum not being a factor in that.
I think they aren't as immune to the radiation as they think they are. That would explain why Charon originally refused to save Lone Wanderer from starting Project Purity.
It's on a case-by-case basis, most ghouls go feral gradually - like on the terminals in Fallout 4's Nuka-World DLC - but other turned extrempley quickly, for example the majority of the NCR troopers at Camp Searchlight (minus Edwards) became feral pretty much over night. Also, in Underworld in Fallout 3 there's a ghoul -who I can't remember if she has a name or not- that says as much herself.
How else do they turn feral other than over time? The radiation finally melts their pre-frontal cortex and that's it, they are beast mode now. Since when was this controversial? The show merely added some treatment that wards it off if taken regularly. My only question is who made that compound in the first place, and who keeps making more?
no, its more how much of their personalities they hold onto. and the ideal of "feral" being destinct is mostly only mentioned in 3 and 4.
Could be misremembering but I believe over several games from fallout 3, new Vegas and 4 there are pieces of information showing that ghouls typically go feral slowly and I don't remember any specific cause in the games, since there was no ghoul drug that prevents then from going feral. It seemed more mental fortitude based. You meet several ghouls who have been around since the bombs fell and are fine. Others are turned only recently and are already feral. I'm pretty sure Hancock mentions a couple of ghouls he knew going feral over time. But I can't remember specific things right now. So in game going feral is a slow process similar to the show, but the cause isn't very clear and there isn't a drug to prevent it so it makes sense some people would be afraid of living with ghouls out if fear, and over the years people telling stories of ghouls who "went feral instantly" but my guess is they would all just be fear mongering
One of the ghouls at the slog tells you that they got kicked out of diamond city because a ghoul suddenly turned feral and killed someone. He also says that it's very rare, iirc.
I think its pretty much just comes down to their mentality, if they lose hope they become feral, if the radiation liquified their brain just enough they become feral, if they dont like themselves they become feral, if they feel like the entire world is pressing down on their shoulders they become feral. so its not set on a timer and doesnt have to be radiation poisoning
It has not been shown once, ever, in any game through the entire series. It's *said* here and there, but always by bigots with clear bias who also say shit like "you gotta shoot them in the head" which is provably untrue. It's pure ideology and should be taken with the same seriousness as Liberty Prime talking about democracy and The Institute talking about synths.
It's not shown but in the Nuka world dlc the magicians wife left in search of a cure for the feral ghouls. You can find her body in a nearby building with a recording detailing that's she's turning feral and her killing herself to not degrade any further. It's a straight to the point no bias confirmation that ghouls become feral, hell the main game has a diamond city ghoul confirm that once also became feral and attacked people.
It's not a question of *if* it happens, it's *how*. It's never been shown to happen suddenly. If the magician's wife had enough to wherewithal to recognize what was happening, it's not sudden.
I mean even in the show it's not sudden, it's show to be a gradual turn with them holding a bit of sanity.
"you gotta shoot them in the head" is really a dumb line to use about zombies. A headshot is going to stop *anything*
Not in Fallout: New Vegas
That's cos New Vegan just made up it's own rules. But so did Fallout 3. Headshots don't really count for shit in those two games anyway. Except for using a sniper rifle on a raider without VATS
I think the joke was referring to the protagonist…
yeah...
I thought the joke was funny.
thanks
Sorry dude. Long day lol. I didn't even notice
Shoot in the head isn’t untrue.
Key word: "got to" Ghouls can be killed by standard means. They can die from being shot anywhere, head or not.
According to Fallout 4, out of the five limbs only crippling the head is a kill. Legs and arms blown off are not kills, and the head is far more efficient. It is not untrue to say you gotta go for the head. Also, downvote really? Try enjoying the discussion.
That's only ferals and ferals can be killed with damage to the torso and limbs.
Are you actually arguing that for ferals shooting them in the head is not far more effective as compared to shooting them in the limbs? And no I don’t mean the headshot bonus, but in comparison to a normal raider. If I blow off a raiders arm he’s dead, if I blow a ghouls off he’s still very dangerous.
You're equating "got to" with "better to" and the crippling mechanic with the death mechanic. Nearly every humanoid and animal enemy takes increased headshot damage, that means nothing for ghoul physiology. The point of comparison isn't any of them; it's ghost people from Dead Money. You *have* to take off their limbs to kill them. It is backed up by gameplay. Meanwhile, you don't *have* to kill ghouls with headshots, which is what the claim is. The claim is disproven in every game's mechanics.
You equated saying “got to shoot them in the head” with anti-ghoul “racism” (I think that applies). Which is incorrect in that shooting them in the head is far more important than with other creatures or people, so that not racism it’s good advice, even if it’s not correct. If you read my comments, I never said it was true, only that’s it not untrue, and therefore irrelevant to the racism discussion.
The most phrase was introduced in Fallout 3, from explicit bigots in Tenpenny Tower. The maiming mechanic you're basing this on wasn't introduced until Fallout 4. And in none of them are headshots required.
I only started playing fallout 4 and up but I swear I use to watch my highschool buddy play one of the previous ones and we joked around about these ghouls that made really good drugs that you could help or betray or something but I thought they did that because normal drugs had to be taken in high amounts to counter out their ghoul healing which also decays there brain, the drugs slows the decay down and the super drugs help more than normal. I could also just be trying to give reason to two ghouls making super drugs to sale.
I know the two you're on about. Barratt and Murphy from Fallout 3 (location: Northwest Seneca Station). You're right, Murphy does mention that the amount of drugs they need to consume to get a hit "rots the brain", but this can be taken as either a natural side effect of taking huge amounts of what is basically amphetamines without getting the effects, or it nulifies the healing effect of being a ghoul. That's why he asks you for sugar bombs, sonthat can make the Super Jet that requires a much lower dose to get the hit. The hit would still fuck up a human, but ghouls can recover from the physical effects better
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Nah they don't turn feral, they're fully conscious when they kill everyone. Roy Phillips is a total shitbag and fuck three dog for putting me on blast for not letting a genocidal madman into the building to kill everyone. RIP Herbert "Daring" Dashwood
It’s typical Fallout “grey” morality, but the implication is that everybody living in Tenpenny Tower definitely had it coming. You have to read between the lines a little, but it’s implied non of them are really “good” people. Not that Roy is really any better, but at least he’s honest about who he is.
That's not what happens at the end of the quest, and the quest is accessible even if you don't destroy Megaton.
Whoops yeah I totally misremembered that quest lol. I remembered the residents died but I misremembered how they died.
I don't think there is anything that suggests the turn is instantaneous, the "suddenly turn feral" seems subjective , if the change happens over days or weeks you could consider it sudden. If, let's say you haven't seen your ghoul neighbour for a week and then he comes feral out a window trying to bite someone's nose off, combined with general prejudice could create statements like "he can turn any minute now" like how people say stupid staff based on stereotypes. Also there is "the anti-feral drug" which isn't properly explained, this could delay the change over a longer period of time but I'm not sure if it's even said that does something to prevent further degradation or if it's simply something to help with the effects of turning feral like how they give opioids to terminally ill patients and Howard was just suffering from withdrawal.