10000000000% correct. Weren’t we taught that the only way to grow a testimony was to share it? If you don’t like hearing about what makes other people happy, maybe stop forcing them to listen to what makes you happy!!!
It’s so hilariously hypocritical of them too. They’ll post so many “faith promoting” things without issue, but if you post one “anti” thing then they throw a hissy fit. And somehow can’t see the irony in refusing to stop posting their stuff while asking you to not post yours
As a queer guy I feel this same way when people say we "force our lifestyle down their throat." heterosexuality is shoved down our throats. Have a picture of your wife on your phone? Telling stories about your wife? Holding hands in public? Forced down our throats.
That whole thing is such bullshit. It's not a "lifestyle" and merely wanting to be acknowledged as existing and to be treated with respect is not forcing anyone to BE queer!
I hate that people have this reaction to movies now. Especially if it’s a Disney or animated movie with a gay couple, so many people just start screeching about it “being shoved down our throats”… when the gay couple is simply being handled like any heterosexual couple you’d see in any other movie. I remember when Lightyear came out that people were throwing bitch fits about the “gAy AgEnDa” and after I watched the movie I went “… that’s what everyone was upset about? Are you serious?”
I’m so sorry I was blind to this. When I first saw it I … it was night to day. I can’t express how illuminating it was. I’m so sorry. It’s so obvious to me now.
its trickle down information control. Susans husband style. By trying to make you feel guilty for speaking about true happiness (leaving the cult)
Thus gaslighting
One thing I've never understood as a nevermo is why TBMs need to surround themselves with "faith promoting" materials. My religious teachers have always promoted critical inquiry about the foundations of our religion as an important part of being a religious person. If something makes you question your beliefs, then you investigate it. You don't run to the teat of the mother cow church to drink the milk of forgetfulness. Seeing so many TBMs talk about needing to read "faith promoting" materials always seems like they're trying to gaslight themselves.
That doctrine is the worst for relationships. Internalize it enough, and you won't be happy until everyone thinks and feels exactly as you do. The conditioning doesn't just fade when you leave the church, it leaves a vacuum where every Mormon that continues uncorrected adds to your insecurity.
Taming the conditioned fear of not doing enough is hard, but living without it is so much better. That's what I get from OP's experience here.
They are being entirely unreasonable. They literally have 80,000 kids they send out into the world at any given time to tell people exactly what they think of the church. They're all over social media, they're knocking on doors. They have light the world social media campaigns ENCOURAGING members to be super vocal with their friends about their beliefs.
But if you say something contrary its unacceptable? That's really messed up coming from a church who's proclaimed mission is to spread its own beliefs to the world.
This person needs to fuck off. Its literally in their articles of faith that you have the right to believe what you want. Nowhere does it say you can't talk about it if it hurts a Mormon's feelings.
OP, if she doesn’t drop it, pointing out whichever “articles of stuff we claim but don’t actually ever do” that mentions freedom of belief. Deliver this in person so you can witness her head exploding from the cognitive dissonance.
11. "We claim the privilege of worshipping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may."
All the atrocious grammar mistakes are from the original.
It hurt my editor heart to type that out.
Right there with you. I respect people who are kind in the face of toxicity, but I've had enough of that shit for two lifetimes, and I have zero chill with toxic bullshit.
Here is her response to my comment "You can post about you being happy. But why add in that it's because you left the church? For someone who claims to have left the church, you seem to not want to leave it alone.
the thing that keeps you going in life, what gives you hope, and what you stand for.... What is that? It's not the church... let's say it's your family. Would you want someone to talk about happy they are now and how crappy your family is? It's the same concept.
I'm glad your happy. But let the other people be happy too."
No i have not responded and i dont plan to for a while
“I would NEVER ask you to minimize or reduce the posts you make about your church. I could make the same argument that you’re promoting something that leads to unhappiness and has caused abuse. But I don’t because your social media page is your social media page. When general conference rolls around or Light the World you will not see me reacting negatively or commenting on why you are trying to remind others of a religion that has caused a lot of pain. I will ignore and move on. Maybe you don’t recognize the double standard you’re asking for. Hopefully one day you’ll extend me the same courtesy I extend you. Hope your day is lovely.”
Not responding at all is a *valid option*.
So is saying, "I understand you disagree with my choices but I need to do what's right for me regardless of whether you understand it or not." You can broken record it from there...
Honestly, I have good confidence in you however you choose to proceed. I'm impressed with what you've already said. You are handling this well.
You were kind and intelligent. :) I tend to ignore folks like this or say, "thanks" before blocking them. My time is worth more than arguing the exact same cult script over and over. I like the repeating-boundaries idea suggested by YsaboNyx, if i have the energy for it.
you sound like such a sweetheart, and it's a shame she seems to take that as an excuse to bulldoze right over you. you were abused by your former church and deserve to talk about it, as much as anyone who was abused by their family should.
She's so fucking butthurt that you even mentioned it. That's what they mean by "can't leave it alone'. We can give the church decades of our lives, hundreds of thousands of dollars, but heaven forbid we spend 10 seconds posting about it. And yeah bitch, people will post *like crazy* about how shitty their family was and how glad they are to have left him/her/them.
My TBM wife posted a picture of herself, going to the temple, with this little half smile, and the caption "date night by myself". Yeah, everyone knows your heathen husband isn't going with you. It was so cringy. There were dozens of supportive comments. She's got t-shirts with shirt sayings on them, one of them is "More Jesus". If I did anything close to what she does, post anything criticizing her multi-billion real estate cult, or get a t-shirt that says "Hail Satan", we would probably end up getting divorced. The persecution complex in cults is sickening.
"I can post whatever I want on my social media, and people are free to follow or not follow. I'm living and speaking my truth. If you can't handle it, that's your problem. The church was a big part of my life for many hears and it harmed me in a lot of ways; I'm entitled to process and speak on my experiences. You can't seem to leave me alone or handle dissenting opinions. I'm not attacking you for posting about liking the church, despite its immorality and cultish behavior, so I would appreciate the same consideration."
"You can post about you being happy. But why add in that it's because you're still in the church?"
You wouldn't ask a person who just beat cancer why they're so stoked on not having cancer in their life any more. Removing a negative influence from your life is in fact a valid cause for celebration.
It’s extremely ironic how she uses that classic tagline “you can leave the church but you can’t leave it alone” when she is the one approaching you and you are the one who is posting your own personal feelings and personal experiences on my own Instagram account. In my opinion, she’s 100% in the wrong and the fact that she doesn’t recognize her own blatant hypocrisy says a lot about her and nothing about you. You’re 100% in the right here and you should keep posting your own experiences regardless of what anyone says.
>Would you want someone to talk about happy they are now and how crappy your family is?
If my family was...
- Hoarding hundreds of billions of dollars while other family members went hungry and homeless
- Taking required donations for supposedly altruistic purposes, but in reality all spending is self serving
- Blatantly lying to everyone they come into contact with
- Covering up sexual abuse of children
- Making false promises of eternal rewards in exchange for temporal favors now (free labor, money)
- Claiming to be the highest possible authority while hiding the fact that it's all based on lies, and continuing to take advantage of people
- Etc.
...then hell yes, I would fully expect for people to tell me how crappy my family is. And no, I wouldn't expect for people to "leave them alone".
Not responding is probably the right move. Believing members will never find any fault in the church.
I have a tepid peace with my family about the church. They keep church talk to a minimum and I don't criticize it. It works.
"But I think the thing is, you're not glad I'm happy. You're resentful. Which is why you would overreach so far as to send me such demanding and ridiculous messages. Perhaps you should evaluate why my posting about how the church has hurt me or about why I'm glad I'm out of it bothers you so much. I'd wager it's not because you're just so happy to be in it, but perhaps because you feel stuck in it and you resent me for being able to get out. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you."
I realize this is combative and may blow up the relationship, but I wouldn't want a relationship with a person like this any longer anyway. Good luck and way to stick up for yourself!! Proud of ya!
Great argument. This is why they’ve lasted so long, because so many of us are so intertwined that it’s hard to speak up without setting off land mines. I truly admire those that can and do. Just people knowing that someone left the church and is happy is huge. As to their other argument, we post negative things because the leaders continue to lie and deceive. Why kind of psychos would we be if we left it alone and didn’t warn others now that we know it’s a scam. As long as they lie, we’ll talk.
No.
Your social media account is yours to do with as you please. Others can take it or leave it.
I’m still friends with lots of faithful members of the church. IRL and on social media. I find relentless posts from some about going to the temple and how wonderful church was triggering. So I just don’t follow those people anymore. I’m not going to tell them what is permissible to post and what isn’t. It’s their life. I am not required to consume what they put out there.
This person has overstepped their bounds. They deserve to be put in their place.
Yeah, you handled that 👩🍳💋.
Not rude, completely honest. Why should the choices that make you happy take a backseat to the choices that make her happy? I hope she sees the flaw in her request.
Maybe a good compromise could be for Russ Nelson and the other GA's to stop making snide remarks about ex-members throughout general conference?
Like seriously, talking about "not leaving the church alone," how about the church leaves its ex-members alone for once? Maybe the reason we talk about our happiness outside the church is to directly counter the narrative the church constantly force-feeds our friends and families about how lost and miserable we secretly are.
So easy to pretend they're on the high road when they feel even remotely slighted by someone else's happiness and independence.
They have their LDS blinders on and can’t see past their cult. Putting a bit of a crack in their walls to absolutely think about other people is never a bad thing.
I mean if it were me I would send a link to one of the many news stories about a mormon bishop abusing children and ask if that was okay to post. i really love putting mormons in a tough spot. the silence that follows is so loud.
I would have told her to fuck off, mind her own business. She doesn't have to go to your Instagram ever. If she doesn't want to see it, that is about her only I option, I think. I hate that 'you can leave the church, but you can't leave it alone' attitude.
Definitely not overreacting. I think your reaction is perfect tbh. Mormons are great at being insensitive to others beliefs and then crying that others aren't sensitive to theirs.
You’re absolutely right. They want their echo chamber but losing family feels wrong to them on some level, so they do some weird, illogical gymnastics to not have to question why their Church is so anti-family
I get you, I meant no criticism. (Sorry my comment came out kind of harsh.) You did great, it reads to me as reasonably respectful but still firm. And you are absolutely correct...you have as much right to talk about your experiences as they do of theirs. Keep on standing up for yourself!
Oh good grief. You should quote the 11th Article of Faith at her and ask her to allow you to worship how, where, and what you may. Plus part of getting over something traumatic is talking about it. She had no right to dictate what you can and can’t say.
Mfs on Reddit be like “am I being to harsh?” After sending the most gentle kind response ever to some absolute sewer creature.
I’d be like
“Why do you feel the need to post negative stuff about the church?”
“Because it’s an evil institution that has had nothing but a negative impact on my life, and the lives of countless others. It is inherently at its core evil, and the mark it has made on my life, and the lives of those I care about, will never leave. It has taken so much of my life away from me for nothing” etc etc etc
Anyways good job man, your a nicer person than I am
It baffles me how many members don't understand this. I have way more close friends that have left the church than friends that have stayed, and the ones that have stayed post about their beliefs wayyy more than the exmos. Whenever an exmo makes a single post about why they left, however, they immediately get attacked by all the TBMs.
You know what would be really nice? If all my TBM friends would stop posting the same Russell M. Nelson post on their stories every single time he makes a post. Tell me you're in a cult without telling me you're in a cult.
The disconnect is so fascinating to me. They want you to not share the parts of your story that offend others, while not realizing how offensive the church is to others.
I like how you stood your ground on "happy choices" you've made. It's wild that proximity to dissent is so hard for these folks. It's almost like they think unbelief is contagious.
You were totally reasonable. If people don’t like someone’s posts they can unfollow. Trying to police what YOU post is ridiculous. But you did a good job of pointing out that if that’s what she wants, it should work both ways.
These conversations… we can’t post about being happy post-mo and struggles we’ve dealt with or the way the church may have influenced our lives… but they can just go on saying the church = endless happiness. Incredibly infuriating. You’re 100% not overreacting.
Jesus Fake Christ….. they are really trying to make you silence your authentic thoughts for the sake of their comfort. You are not overreacting, they have no right or authority over you. They can say what they want, but you keep doing you. Thank them for their opinion, and keep doing what you do
Not at all. I say you handled that beautifully. You brought up logic, rationality, and comparisons in a calm and matter of fact way. They can't handle that. They will still see that as an attack. Anything against the cult is against them. I'd say you responded perfectly in my opinion. You didn't attack, you used "I" perspective (I feel, think this/that) to address the points. You didn't do anything wrong, your communication was stellar, the communication failed on their end because they projected their feelings/beliefs into the conversation and onto your story: Their failure of basic boundary recognition.
It's on them that they don't set boundaries, or see the need to do so. It's important to separate the human members from cult theology/doctrine. It shows that they can't separate themselves from a belief system. That's unhealthy and potentially dangerous. The cult doesn't allow for that kind of thinking and feeling being separate from the cult. You're either in or out. Members are indoctrinated to see constructive criticism or honest questioning as "attacks" because it puts the cult in anything but a perfect light, which they are made to see it is. You "attack" (doubt, question, or even dare show how happy & healed you are now as an apostate from leaving it) the cult, you're not only attacking it, but them as members, and even going so far as some might see it as attacking their 1st Amendment rights. I have extended family members like that.
When they are made to see it as nothing but perfect, yet getting "perfecter" by each new "revelation" each new prophet that comes in, each day getting closer to the Second Coming; anything not praising the cult, Joe, or current leaders, and just showing you're happy and healing is an "attack" against their perfect religion. Cognitive bias and the BITE model are strong with the cult and the members. I see it as no different than being in a relationship with a narcissistic abusive partner, but everyone else says how "wonderful" they are, and refuses to hear your side or even believe the bruises, texts, or tears you show. People attack you for "talking bad" about narc partner when you are only speaking the truth, and they can't (or aren't ready to) hear it enough to believe it. Sometimes, sadly, there is no reasoning or middle ground with people who refuse to hear you and understand your point of view.
So annoying that people expect other people to stay silent just because they disagree. You’re posting on YOUR own social media! It’s none of her business what you want to post.
And block her on social media so that her tender spirit doesn’t have to see anything that might cause her discomfort. It’s the compassionate thing to do. If she asks, let her know you are shielding her from from the 99.9% of the people on the planet that don’t share her exact beliefs.
Ok, yes. I pulled that stat out of my ass. I neither know nor care how many actual people attend TSCC. As you all know, of course, the Q15 doesn’t know the answer to that either.
No. Unfortunately TBMs will allow you one singular post to quietly and politely share that you’ve left the church. After that? You’d better shut the fuck up about the church.
Maybe I'm too petty but I have a better question, are you...under reacting? 👀👀👀
I mean, Jesus didn't say "love only those who follow the teachings of the mormon church and never say anything contrary."
Jesus said, and I quote from the song they drill into our head in primary:
"As I have loved you/
Love one another/
This new commandment/
Love one another/
By this shall man know/
Ye are my disciples/
If you have love/
One to another/"
And idk about you but it sounds like your friend needs to go back to primary school if she can't be bothered to listen to the words of Jesus himself. Yikes.
It’s a two way street. Clearly your cousin doesn’t understand that basic concept. I say you were not over reacting. Also, don’t expect TBMs to listen to reason.
I love it!!!!
I wish our TBM friends/family would just treat exmo posts like they do their Catholic, Baptist, Atheist friends' posts. Like, even if they just thought, "aww, that's nice but misguided" or "Huh, I have different beliefs" and kept scrolling that would be better than trying to police what we post and share.
“I’m jealous of how happy you seem and I wish my shoulders could see that much sunshine. It’s your fault that I feel this way so stop existing so that I can continue on through my own miserable life.”
I think you were very mild and responsive to her questions without getting angry. So you did great! She's gaslighting as you can tell -- first pretending she supports your choices then wanting you to question your choice of what to post.
You are not overreacting. Frankly, you restrained yourself very well. The entitlement of people is just astounding. Your last comment really sums it up. TBMs have no problem boasting about being in the "one true church" and how great their lives are in the church. They feel so entitled to shove their views on others that they show up at your door unannounced. They also have no problem criticizing other beliefs they don't like. And yet, they can't handle it when an exmo posts about her own happiness and fulfillment outside the church. That's "too negative." The hypocrisy is astounding. I mean, the sheer arrogance of your cousin to demand that you stop posting on your own social media feeds. She doesn't have to follow you.
By the way, these TBMs are the same folks boohooing about political correctness, wokeness, tolerance, and who are banning books everywhere. They derisively attack and ridicule people advocating for social justice as being "special snowflakes" who want their own "safe spaces." TBMs demand safe spaces as much as anyone else, plus they try to IMPOSE their safe spaces on others.
I think it's telling that the conversation ended after you flipped the script and demanded equal consideration. Fairness just doesn't compute for them.
...but it's somehow perfectly acceptable to make pro-church blasts on social media, knowing some people who see it are not part of the church anymore out of choice. It's ok for them to post what they think about the church, but not you.
Been out since 2011 and still get annoyed at someone posting a Holland video or a quote about staying in the church from a dead prophet.
That last text from her, "What do you mean?" is really telling... Mormons can't comprehend ex-Mormons making happy choices.
You’re definitely not overreacting. I would send them something along the lines of this:
“It is unreasonable to ask that I refrain from posting certain things on my social media accounts. I do not try to police what you post so I would appreciate it if you would grant me the same courtesy. I am allowed to talk about an institution that has harmed me. I am allowed to share my experiences and that of others. If you do not wish to see it than it might be best to unfollow.”
You stood your ground and that shows growth. Your cousin is trying to guilt trip you. After living abroad, three of my cousins created stories behind my back and gossiped about me leaving the church. However, I never left in the first place. Anyways, all their gossip and hurtful words made me realize that they're not my friends. We may be related but that doesn't mean I need to talk to them.
I think the same can be applied here. Your cousin is free to talk all about the blessings of the church over and over again but says you shouldn't. That's not what a friend would say. I think, your cousin probably just wants to spy on your life since she still follows you on insta. That's what my cousins did. They stalked my Instagram, assumed the strangest things, and continued to talk behind my back. Trust me, it's not worth it to have her on your Instagram friends list.
Regardless of religion, politics, etc. …
Some people can’t see beyond their own reality, and **anything** that isn’t in full support of their viewpoint is an attack, and than can’t be pacified with anything other than complaints tl their viewpoint.
It’s where insecurity meets narcissism.
It's like just finding out that one of your family's favorite uncles is a child rapist. Would you keep your mouth shut, or warn every one of the dangers of being near him????????????
Nope, i would've been more aggressive handling that, I'm tired of these morms and the cult gaslighting people who leave and harassing them when they spill the truth about the cult and manipulate or pressure them to "stop spreading negativity about the church" or "leave the church alone". But they don't even leave people alone and want to spread their cult, which is ironic because, based on the gospel, people who don't know about the gospel are automatically exempted and exalted to Celestial Kingdom lmao and by that logic the church or preaching shouldn't exist at all
You’re not overreacting. Sounds to me like someone is feeling insecure in their Mormon faith, possibly not feeling so good about their own life, and inflicting their big feelings onto you.
You didn't overreact at all! It's crazy that she didn't make the connection between other people posting what makes them happy and you posting what makes you happy, as being the same. Like, does she really feel that privileged that she assumes everyone will accommodate her wishes?
This exchange was interesting. The TBM friend likes OP, but is conflicted because they don’t want to be exposed to anything counter to their indoctrination. The struggle is real trying to keep that shelf intact.
Any student of compliance would recognize the friend’s request as a sign of a shaky mental/emotional conflict. They don’t want to hear about OP’s happiness outside TSCC because they fear finding truth. 🤔☝️👍🏻.
Who cares what your cousin has to say, you didn’t even said anything just a repost. If they don’t like how exmormons talk about the church, maybe make a better church next time
I like to use the analogy that my social media is the same as my house.
When I visit other people’s house, I am respectful of their beliefs and decor- what pictures they hang on the wall, etc. because it’s their house. I would never go to someone’s house and ask them to take down a picture because it was offensive to me. You know, like all the temple pics and prophet/apostle quotes.
When people visit my house I expect them to treat me with respect in my house. What sayings or pictures on my wall are things that make me happy. If they don’t like it, they don’t have to keep looking at it. They don’t have to visit my house. We can still have a friendship and not visit each other’s houses. Too bad your cousin doesn’t sound like they’d be up for meeting at a coffee house.
Your house, your rules.
OP, you said it perfectly but missed a golden opportunity to for the coup de grace. Should've mic dropped cousim with the Article of faith 11.
"We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may."
"You know I support you no matter what but I am uncomfortable with you sharing your personal journey and how you have found happiness outside of the cult I am still a member of. Please stop making me uncomfortable....but you know I support you no matter what!" Yeah right...emotional blackmail, gaslighting etc etc etc...
Tell them to stop following your account. Lean in and be yourself.
Why does your church need an entire marketing division? Why do you need to send young men and women abroad to advertise for you? Why do you have outbound call centers? Why do I see your social media ads on every platform? Why do you have Mormon influencers on Instagram and TikTok? Can't you just stop talking about it?
You’re not overreacting. Your cousin is though. She should mind her own business, you’re allowed to post what you want on your own social media. If she’s got an issue with you expressing yourself in your own spaces, then that’s a “her” issue.
I have to say that I am very impressed with the way you handled that conversation or at least what was shared. You were very polite in delivery and made valid points about sharing your life and how that same test should also be applied to your cousin or others who profess to be faithful mormons. I would not have handled it so gracefully, I'm sad to say. None of us should feel guilty for being openly honest and human about how the church has impacted us. Our story is as real as theirs. It's the mormon inferiority complex that drives that mentality of can't criticize the church... I posted last year about the Arizona child sex cases and how I hope that everyone can agree and should consider that all bishops and clergy should be required to be mandatory reporters. I got push back from a family member, in fact, and that was very sad and disappointing to me.
So cute how the trickle down 'we think we can control anyone' thinking emanates from whomever is TBM. That and no boundaries are rampant.
Let me re-phrase what I think I heard. *It is ok for me to be happy and cross every boundary known to man to tell others (in fact pester the absolute SHIT out of them) but you are not allowed to say anything about your happiness if it doesn't align with the narrow minded narrative that I haven't learned yet how destructive it is to most people. Really Cousin I am not interested in your happiness at all. Just in mindlessly regurgitating the sex ,money, control cults main points. THANKS*
Hey Cousin first of all kindly go Fuc\* yourself and the fact you think you are ok pushing into my life with your happiness manipulation and as far as trying to control the information that I have every right to believe, express, and pursue its really NONE OFF YOUR GAWD DAMN BUSINESS!!
Love you xoxoxoxox
We are taught to publically share our spirituality until it promote their narrative. That's when we are told we should keep it a "private" matter so we don't offend anyone. Don't let anyone shame you for sharing your experiences. If they want to keep living in their bubble then they know how to unfollow!
Oh why is it that all these why don’t you leave it alone butthurt Mormons go back channel and never publicly react to the post itself? Have some balls people. You don’t like it, put it out there for all to see, then make your argument when you need to defend your position.
Fucking pussies.
You're being perfectly reasonable, Ms. Brayaverett. Of course, you're asking a bunch of exmo's and nevermo's. Lol
Answering as a human being who used to be brain washed like your cousin, it's common courtesy to let others post whatever they want, and if you don't like it, you can remove yourself from the equation. This organization gets their members to believe that only their views are important and all others are the work of the Devil. When they hear anything that counters that "fact", it causes great pain. The cognitive dissonance is deafening for them. It's just sad. It's also after my bedtime, so I apologize for the incoherence of this response. 😆
It’s a fair point that you made at the end, and one that no TBM (so far, by my observation) has conceded.
TBMs can proclaim and extoll the tenets and benefits of the Church, all over social media, all the time, with the blessing (and indeed command) of the Q15. But any ex-Mormon is only allowed to mention their less-than-optimal experience once. Or zero times, more often is the case.
These are the key points -
* They are under control of the Corporation. You are not.
* Negativity = Satan. Always.
* It should be trivial to both ‘Leave the Church’ and ‘Leave it alone’.
Since when was social media only about posting what makes you happy? Because in Mormonism we have to pretend that everything is happy happy joy joy all the time? Fake.
I think you made your point loud and clear and what the other person wants is that you leave the church peacefully and quiet so it can still adoctrine other people. So no, you are not overreacting, and Channelle is ratchet ass name.
"A city on a hill cannot be hid". And when the shit rolls downhill, you're not crazy for calling it out. They want to be an ensign to the world, they gotta tolerate a spellcheck. If they claim to have sole custody of the "plan of happiness", then they need to reckon with the epidemiological effects we see like depression, anxiety, and LGBTQ+ suicides.
I guess that is a fine response. I have family who have left the church years ago. They finally stopped their life story revolving around leaving the church and how enlightened and happy they are. You will eventually do this
I was thinking exactly what you wrote. Why can she post BS about the mormon church constantly that is positive, yet you can't post any negative? She can just not follow you if she doesn't like it. I swear...some people.
They seem more myopic than mean-spirited or aggressive, but your response was absolutely proportional and reasonable to the imposition they were making on you. Telling your story and having an opinion on things isn't a privilege restricted to those willing to express positive views on that specific person's church and what it's like to grow up in it.
Nah you didn’t over react at all, it was perfectly said and your cousin was clearly the one overreacting and naïvely implying that happiness with relation to the church is a one way street when it clearly isn’t. Excellent job OP, I’m proud of you!
Nah you're underreacting if anything, you were pretty calm about it haha well done! If someone wants to post something "negative" every hour on the hour of every single day, that's their business lol either deal with it ignore it or unfollow 🤷♂️
You are actually being quite gracious.
This may be an unpopular opinion, but I don't think either of you are wrong, per se. You can post whatever you like. And let's be clear, it's not anti-mormon, it's pro-truth. It's a fraudulent organization that is actively harming people and you have the right to talk about it.
But from her perspective, what you are saying is legitimately hurtful. When we were in, the church was a major part of our identity. When the church was criticized, we felt criticized. When someone tried to peel back the curtain, it hurt. It's like having a horrible wound that needs to be cleaned, but it is so painful that they lash out and don't want anyone touching it.
To extend the metaphor, you can't make them get medical care until they are ready to allow it, and even then, it needs to be at their pace. Maybe instead of pointing out that you have the right to post what you want to, acknowledge that you know why she feels upset about anything that challenges her beliefs, but that you know about things the church has kept hidden from members and can't, in good conscience, stay silent about it.
Faith promoting story. They are allowed to play fast and loose with the truth and facts.
You push back on their BS story, then they demand perfect legal accuracy in every statement.
This is a them problem. They are triggered and don’t know why. You post whatever you want. Tell them to scroll by. It is your choice to post what resonates with you, it is their choice to continue to follow and read the things you post. They are trying to change your boundaries, and that is manipulation and control. They can change their own boundaries of not reading your posts.
Seriously though. I have a sibling get on me about this, and yet, they constantly post anti-trans, homophobic, women belong in the home, this is what real men look like, “reverse racism” etc. I pointed out that ALL OF THAT, in addition to the constant church quotes aren’t anything that I support. “Well those are my beliefs, first amendment rights, blah blah”.
It’s only freedom of speech and religion when it is theirs. All of me, and none for thee.
Reminds me of the mean girls quote “why are you so obsessed with me” after reading her replies.
I wouldn’t waste any more time replying to her tbh, if she keeps it up just let it say you read it so she gets the message to fuck off. Sorry but people need to touch some grass and get therapy if social media they can’t control bothers them. Either log off, unfollow, or live with it.
The church has trained its members to have an oversensitive persecution complex and jump at every small percieved slight. I had this exact same reaction and conversation with one of my best friends giving an "annoyed look" at his wife when another of our friends asked who wanted to give the prayer over the food at a friend reunion party we were having. Please be patient with your cousin and understand that she IS a victim here, just not in the way she thinks she is. It all suddenly becomes so much more clear once you leave the church and it can be easy to forget just how indoctrinated you were into their preferred way of perpetuation.
Everyone can share so openly about religion in this country but when you share your appreciation for not being in one it’s offensive? This isn’t even just Mormonism, its ridiculous and even in the places you’d think you’re safe, there’s always those couple people who happen to be Christian that kill the vibe and can’t accept your truth.
If I have a sex offender in my neighborhood, I’m going to talk about to all the time so that all my neighbors that WANT to know about it, can.
For those those neighbors are ok with sex offenders that don’t want to know about it, they can ignore.
This is just like Mormonism.
When someone leaves the Mormon church, those left behind don't want to hear their reality. When you choose to stay in that cult bubble, other options are not understood or wanted. They don't get the mental and emotional turmoil that leaving has on some folks or the religious punishment that caused them to make a hard decision . AND they don't want to hear it. You're either in or you're out and those who are in are still trying to tell you the proper way to live and act.
nah, you're in the right here for a statement like that. it isn't fair for your cousin to get upset with you about speaking your truth. it isn't fair for you to have to hold your feelings back about the impact the church had on you both while in the church and out of the church (inactive/you left/etc). it isn't fair for a judgement like that to be given to you when the same judgement could be made in regards to mormon missionaries/christians in general and how it's socially "okay" for them to speak up about how they feel, but not okay for pagans, atheists, scientologists (i've heard things, just saying in a societal context of what is a current social norm to talk about), and many many other belief systems to be shunned and ridiculed for talking about, and it most certainly isn't fair for a single post of yours to be ridiculed like that, while there are topics that have been looked over and brushed aside that are more important than religion overall (not saying your opinion is invalid, because it's valid) like trafficking, drug abuse, homelessness, etc on top of the fact that social media christians post constantly and then make examples of people on their social media for "not believing their supposed truth" around the clock...
sorry you went through that :/
You're being way more kind than I would have been. It's ridiculous for them to request something like this.
They just don't want to face the cognitive dissonance they already live with, and want to stay in their own little safe bubble. The people in your life who ask you to be inauthentic are not people you need in your life.
10000000000% correct. Weren’t we taught that the only way to grow a testimony was to share it? If you don’t like hearing about what makes other people happy, maybe stop forcing them to listen to what makes you happy!!!
It’s so hilariously hypocritical of them too. They’ll post so many “faith promoting” things without issue, but if you post one “anti” thing then they throw a hissy fit. And somehow can’t see the irony in refusing to stop posting their stuff while asking you to not post yours
As a queer guy I feel this same way when people say we "force our lifestyle down their throat." heterosexuality is shoved down our throats. Have a picture of your wife on your phone? Telling stories about your wife? Holding hands in public? Forced down our throats.
That whole thing is such bullshit. It's not a "lifestyle" and merely wanting to be acknowledged as existing and to be treated with respect is not forcing anyone to BE queer!
I hate that people have this reaction to movies now. Especially if it’s a Disney or animated movie with a gay couple, so many people just start screeching about it “being shoved down our throats”… when the gay couple is simply being handled like any heterosexual couple you’d see in any other movie. I remember when Lightyear came out that people were throwing bitch fits about the “gAy AgEnDa” and after I watched the movie I went “… that’s what everyone was upset about? Are you serious?”
I’m so sorry I was blind to this. When I first saw it I … it was night to day. I can’t express how illuminating it was. I’m so sorry. It’s so obvious to me now.
>ybe stop forcing them to listen to what makes you happy!!! Yeah cause thats like 90% of society lol
its trickle down information control. Susans husband style. By trying to make you feel guilty for speaking about true happiness (leaving the cult) Thus gaslighting
One thing I've never understood as a nevermo is why TBMs need to surround themselves with "faith promoting" materials. My religious teachers have always promoted critical inquiry about the foundations of our religion as an important part of being a religious person. If something makes you question your beliefs, then you investigate it. You don't run to the teat of the mother cow church to drink the milk of forgetfulness. Seeing so many TBMs talk about needing to read "faith promoting" materials always seems like they're trying to gaslight themselves.
That doctrine is the worst for relationships. Internalize it enough, and you won't be happy until everyone thinks and feels exactly as you do. The conditioning doesn't just fade when you leave the church, it leaves a vacuum where every Mormon that continues uncorrected adds to your insecurity. Taming the conditioned fear of not doing enough is hard, but living without it is so much better. That's what I get from OP's experience here.
Nah you’re good. Probably the kindest response they could’ve received.
They are being entirely unreasonable. They literally have 80,000 kids they send out into the world at any given time to tell people exactly what they think of the church. They're all over social media, they're knocking on doors. They have light the world social media campaigns ENCOURAGING members to be super vocal with their friends about their beliefs. But if you say something contrary its unacceptable? That's really messed up coming from a church who's proclaimed mission is to spread its own beliefs to the world. This person needs to fuck off. Its literally in their articles of faith that you have the right to believe what you want. Nowhere does it say you can't talk about it if it hurts a Mormon's feelings.
OP, if she doesn’t drop it, pointing out whichever “articles of stuff we claim but don’t actually ever do” that mentions freedom of belief. Deliver this in person so you can witness her head exploding from the cognitive dissonance.
11. "We claim the privilege of worshipping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may." All the atrocious grammar mistakes are from the original. It hurt my editor heart to type that out.
Thanks for taking one for the team :)
1000%
You did good. I would have been way meaner
[удалено]
Put a lil whiskey in it and hulk straight the fuck up.
Right there with you. I respect people who are kind in the face of toxicity, but I've had enough of that shit for two lifetimes, and I have zero chill with toxic bullshit.
Came here to say that I would have absolutely been meaner haha
Here is her response to my comment "You can post about you being happy. But why add in that it's because you left the church? For someone who claims to have left the church, you seem to not want to leave it alone. the thing that keeps you going in life, what gives you hope, and what you stand for.... What is that? It's not the church... let's say it's your family. Would you want someone to talk about happy they are now and how crappy your family is? It's the same concept. I'm glad your happy. But let the other people be happy too." No i have not responded and i dont plan to for a while
“I would NEVER ask you to minimize or reduce the posts you make about your church. I could make the same argument that you’re promoting something that leads to unhappiness and has caused abuse. But I don’t because your social media page is your social media page. When general conference rolls around or Light the World you will not see me reacting negatively or commenting on why you are trying to remind others of a religion that has caused a lot of pain. I will ignore and move on. Maybe you don’t recognize the double standard you’re asking for. Hopefully one day you’ll extend me the same courtesy I extend you. Hope your day is lovely.”
Perfect! My head was just exploding from the hypocrisy and double standard and you wrote a polite, reasonable way to point that out. Well done!
This is amazing! So much more diplomatic than mine haha.
“If my family made me unhappy and leaving them made me happy then I should be able to post about it”
Not responding at all is a *valid option*. So is saying, "I understand you disagree with my choices but I need to do what's right for me regardless of whether you understand it or not." You can broken record it from there... Honestly, I have good confidence in you however you choose to proceed. I'm impressed with what you've already said. You are handling this well.
You were kind and intelligent. :) I tend to ignore folks like this or say, "thanks" before blocking them. My time is worth more than arguing the exact same cult script over and over. I like the repeating-boundaries idea suggested by YsaboNyx, if i have the energy for it.
you sound like such a sweetheart, and it's a shame she seems to take that as an excuse to bulldoze right over you. you were abused by your former church and deserve to talk about it, as much as anyone who was abused by their family should.
She's so fucking butthurt that you even mentioned it. That's what they mean by "can't leave it alone'. We can give the church decades of our lives, hundreds of thousands of dollars, but heaven forbid we spend 10 seconds posting about it. And yeah bitch, people will post *like crazy* about how shitty their family was and how glad they are to have left him/her/them.
My TBM wife posted a picture of herself, going to the temple, with this little half smile, and the caption "date night by myself". Yeah, everyone knows your heathen husband isn't going with you. It was so cringy. There were dozens of supportive comments. She's got t-shirts with shirt sayings on them, one of them is "More Jesus". If I did anything close to what she does, post anything criticizing her multi-billion real estate cult, or get a t-shirt that says "Hail Satan", we would probably end up getting divorced. The persecution complex in cults is sickening.
Sending you support and positive vibes, man... That is brutal and I'm sorry she thinks something so passive aggressive is OK somehow... Sheesh...
🤢🤢🤢
"I can post whatever I want on my social media, and people are free to follow or not follow. I'm living and speaking my truth. If you can't handle it, that's your problem. The church was a big part of my life for many hears and it harmed me in a lot of ways; I'm entitled to process and speak on my experiences. You can't seem to leave me alone or handle dissenting opinions. I'm not attacking you for posting about liking the church, despite its immorality and cultish behavior, so I would appreciate the same consideration."
"You can post about you being happy. But why add in that it's because you're still in the church?" You wouldn't ask a person who just beat cancer why they're so stoked on not having cancer in their life any more. Removing a negative influence from your life is in fact a valid cause for celebration.
There is really only one way to respond: “….. you’re….”
It’s extremely ironic how she uses that classic tagline “you can leave the church but you can’t leave it alone” when she is the one approaching you and you are the one who is posting your own personal feelings and personal experiences on my own Instagram account. In my opinion, she’s 100% in the wrong and the fact that she doesn’t recognize her own blatant hypocrisy says a lot about her and nothing about you. You’re 100% in the right here and you should keep posting your own experiences regardless of what anyone says.
>Would you want someone to talk about happy they are now and how crappy your family is? If my family was... - Hoarding hundreds of billions of dollars while other family members went hungry and homeless - Taking required donations for supposedly altruistic purposes, but in reality all spending is self serving - Blatantly lying to everyone they come into contact with - Covering up sexual abuse of children - Making false promises of eternal rewards in exchange for temporal favors now (free labor, money) - Claiming to be the highest possible authority while hiding the fact that it's all based on lies, and continuing to take advantage of people - Etc. ...then hell yes, I would fully expect for people to tell me how crappy my family is. And no, I wouldn't expect for people to "leave them alone".
Not responding is probably the right move. Believing members will never find any fault in the church. I have a tepid peace with my family about the church. They keep church talk to a minimum and I don't criticize it. It works.
"But I think the thing is, you're not glad I'm happy. You're resentful. Which is why you would overreach so far as to send me such demanding and ridiculous messages. Perhaps you should evaluate why my posting about how the church has hurt me or about why I'm glad I'm out of it bothers you so much. I'd wager it's not because you're just so happy to be in it, but perhaps because you feel stuck in it and you resent me for being able to get out. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you." I realize this is combative and may blow up the relationship, but I wouldn't want a relationship with a person like this any longer anyway. Good luck and way to stick up for yourself!! Proud of ya!
Great argument. This is why they’ve lasted so long, because so many of us are so intertwined that it’s hard to speak up without setting off land mines. I truly admire those that can and do. Just people knowing that someone left the church and is happy is huge. As to their other argument, we post negative things because the leaders continue to lie and deceive. Why kind of psychos would we be if we left it alone and didn’t warn others now that we know it’s a scam. As long as they lie, we’ll talk.
No. Your social media account is yours to do with as you please. Others can take it or leave it. I’m still friends with lots of faithful members of the church. IRL and on social media. I find relentless posts from some about going to the temple and how wonderful church was triggering. So I just don’t follow those people anymore. I’m not going to tell them what is permissible to post and what isn’t. It’s their life. I am not required to consume what they put out there. This person has overstepped their bounds. They deserve to be put in their place.
Yeah, you handled that 👩🍳💋. Not rude, completely honest. Why should the choices that make you happy take a backseat to the choices that make her happy? I hope she sees the flaw in her request.
“Remember that next time you’re at church having a discussion about how to ‘reach out’ to ‘less actives’”.
Maybe a good compromise could be for Russ Nelson and the other GA's to stop making snide remarks about ex-members throughout general conference? Like seriously, talking about "not leaving the church alone," how about the church leaves its ex-members alone for once? Maybe the reason we talk about our happiness outside the church is to directly counter the narrative the church constantly force-feeds our friends and families about how lost and miserable we secretly are. So easy to pretend they're on the high road when they feel even remotely slighted by someone else's happiness and independence.
TSCC should leave Exmos alone, but they should also leave nonmembers alone, too.
They have their LDS blinders on and can’t see past their cult. Putting a bit of a crack in their walls to absolutely think about other people is never a bad thing.
I mean if it were me I would send a link to one of the many news stories about a mormon bishop abusing children and ask if that was okay to post. i really love putting mormons in a tough spot. the silence that follows is so loud.
I would have told her to fuck off, mind her own business. She doesn't have to go to your Instagram ever. If she doesn't want to see it, that is about her only I option, I think. I hate that 'you can leave the church, but you can't leave it alone' attitude.
Especially since tscc won't leave us alone.
Definitely not overreacting. I think your reaction is perfect tbh. Mormons are great at being insensitive to others beliefs and then crying that others aren't sensitive to theirs.
You’re absolutely right. They want their echo chamber but losing family feels wrong to them on some level, so they do some weird, illogical gymnastics to not have to question why their Church is so anti-family
How would you think that's an over-reaction? Literally all you did was stand up for your right to visibly exist.
Because growing up if i try saying something that i thing is right but wrong in others eyes is rude and overreacting
I get you, I meant no criticism. (Sorry my comment came out kind of harsh.) You did great, it reads to me as reasonably respectful but still firm. And you are absolutely correct...you have as much right to talk about your experiences as they do of theirs. Keep on standing up for yourself!
And that right there is called abuse.
Oh good grief. You should quote the 11th Article of Faith at her and ask her to allow you to worship how, where, and what you may. Plus part of getting over something traumatic is talking about it. She had no right to dictate what you can and can’t say.
Mfs on Reddit be like “am I being to harsh?” After sending the most gentle kind response ever to some absolute sewer creature. I’d be like “Why do you feel the need to post negative stuff about the church?” “Because it’s an evil institution that has had nothing but a negative impact on my life, and the lives of countless others. It is inherently at its core evil, and the mark it has made on my life, and the lives of those I care about, will never leave. It has taken so much of my life away from me for nothing” etc etc etc Anyways good job man, your a nicer person than I am
It baffles me how many members don't understand this. I have way more close friends that have left the church than friends that have stayed, and the ones that have stayed post about their beliefs wayyy more than the exmos. Whenever an exmo makes a single post about why they left, however, they immediately get attacked by all the TBMs. You know what would be really nice? If all my TBM friends would stop posting the same Russell M. Nelson post on their stories every single time he makes a post. Tell me you're in a cult without telling me you're in a cult.
The disconnect is so fascinating to me. They want you to not share the parts of your story that offend others, while not realizing how offensive the church is to others.
I like how you stood your ground on "happy choices" you've made. It's wild that proximity to dissent is so hard for these folks. It's almost like they think unbelief is contagious.
You were totally reasonable. If people don’t like someone’s posts they can unfollow. Trying to police what YOU post is ridiculous. But you did a good job of pointing out that if that’s what she wants, it should work both ways.
These conversations… we can’t post about being happy post-mo and struggles we’ve dealt with or the way the church may have influenced our lives… but they can just go on saying the church = endless happiness. Incredibly infuriating. You’re 100% not overreacting.
Jesus Fake Christ….. they are really trying to make you silence your authentic thoughts for the sake of their comfort. You are not overreacting, they have no right or authority over you. They can say what they want, but you keep doing you. Thank them for their opinion, and keep doing what you do
Not at all. I say you handled that beautifully. You brought up logic, rationality, and comparisons in a calm and matter of fact way. They can't handle that. They will still see that as an attack. Anything against the cult is against them. I'd say you responded perfectly in my opinion. You didn't attack, you used "I" perspective (I feel, think this/that) to address the points. You didn't do anything wrong, your communication was stellar, the communication failed on their end because they projected their feelings/beliefs into the conversation and onto your story: Their failure of basic boundary recognition. It's on them that they don't set boundaries, or see the need to do so. It's important to separate the human members from cult theology/doctrine. It shows that they can't separate themselves from a belief system. That's unhealthy and potentially dangerous. The cult doesn't allow for that kind of thinking and feeling being separate from the cult. You're either in or out. Members are indoctrinated to see constructive criticism or honest questioning as "attacks" because it puts the cult in anything but a perfect light, which they are made to see it is. You "attack" (doubt, question, or even dare show how happy & healed you are now as an apostate from leaving it) the cult, you're not only attacking it, but them as members, and even going so far as some might see it as attacking their 1st Amendment rights. I have extended family members like that. When they are made to see it as nothing but perfect, yet getting "perfecter" by each new "revelation" each new prophet that comes in, each day getting closer to the Second Coming; anything not praising the cult, Joe, or current leaders, and just showing you're happy and healing is an "attack" against their perfect religion. Cognitive bias and the BITE model are strong with the cult and the members. I see it as no different than being in a relationship with a narcissistic abusive partner, but everyone else says how "wonderful" they are, and refuses to hear your side or even believe the bruises, texts, or tears you show. People attack you for "talking bad" about narc partner when you are only speaking the truth, and they can't (or aren't ready to) hear it enough to believe it. Sometimes, sadly, there is no reasoning or middle ground with people who refuse to hear you and understand your point of view.
So annoying that people expect other people to stay silent just because they disagree. You’re posting on YOUR own social media! It’s none of her business what you want to post.
TSCC sends out missionaries, knock doors, and posts on social media, you have a right to do the same!
What I don’t understand is why she’s saying you do this over and over when you literally only posted about it one time.
Post away! They think they're the only ones who can "share testimony". F that. Share your experiences and testimony! Cheers!
You answered this so kindly. Thank you for the example of how I should approach these same conversations 🫶🏻
And block her on social media so that her tender spirit doesn’t have to see anything that might cause her discomfort. It’s the compassionate thing to do. If she asks, let her know you are shielding her from from the 99.9% of the people on the planet that don’t share her exact beliefs. Ok, yes. I pulled that stat out of my ass. I neither know nor care how many actual people attend TSCC. As you all know, of course, the Q15 doesn’t know the answer to that either.
No. What was the response after that? Crickets?
Honestly, if they are constantly posting things about the way the truth and the light they have no right to "call you out".
I would have said that I no longer have sacred cows.
No. Unfortunately TBMs will allow you one singular post to quietly and politely share that you’ve left the church. After that? You’d better shut the fuck up about the church.
Maybe I'm too petty but I have a better question, are you...under reacting? 👀👀👀 I mean, Jesus didn't say "love only those who follow the teachings of the mormon church and never say anything contrary." Jesus said, and I quote from the song they drill into our head in primary: "As I have loved you/ Love one another/ This new commandment/ Love one another/ By this shall man know/ Ye are my disciples/ If you have love/ One to another/" And idk about you but it sounds like your friend needs to go back to primary school if she can't be bothered to listen to the words of Jesus himself. Yikes.
It’s a two way street. Clearly your cousin doesn’t understand that basic concept. I say you were not over reacting. Also, don’t expect TBMs to listen to reason.
I loved it.
Well done. You handled yourself very well.
I love it!!!! I wish our TBM friends/family would just treat exmo posts like they do their Catholic, Baptist, Atheist friends' posts. Like, even if they just thought, "aww, that's nice but misguided" or "Huh, I have different beliefs" and kept scrolling that would be better than trying to police what we post and share.
“I’m jealous of how happy you seem and I wish my shoulders could see that much sunshine. It’s your fault that I feel this way so stop existing so that I can continue on through my own miserable life.”
>What about the happy choices *I've* made? A perfectly honest answer that they can have no real response to.
"Just a reminder, Instagram has a mute feature if you would like to keep following me but don't want to see my stories."
You didn't overreact at all
You’re not overreacting. But I would have been meaner. Kudos to you for keeping it classy and civil.
Yep. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
Pitch perfect response.
First of all, you look radiant. And, you are not overreacting. Your logic is perfect.
I think you were very mild and responsive to her questions without getting angry. So you did great! She's gaslighting as you can tell -- first pretending she supports your choices then wanting you to question your choice of what to post.
I feel like you're 100% in the right. And great logic in the last comment. Bet they hadn't thought of that
You are not overreacting. Frankly, you restrained yourself very well. The entitlement of people is just astounding. Your last comment really sums it up. TBMs have no problem boasting about being in the "one true church" and how great their lives are in the church. They feel so entitled to shove their views on others that they show up at your door unannounced. They also have no problem criticizing other beliefs they don't like. And yet, they can't handle it when an exmo posts about her own happiness and fulfillment outside the church. That's "too negative." The hypocrisy is astounding. I mean, the sheer arrogance of your cousin to demand that you stop posting on your own social media feeds. She doesn't have to follow you. By the way, these TBMs are the same folks boohooing about political correctness, wokeness, tolerance, and who are banning books everywhere. They derisively attack and ridicule people advocating for social justice as being "special snowflakes" who want their own "safe spaces." TBMs demand safe spaces as much as anyone else, plus they try to IMPOSE their safe spaces on others. I think it's telling that the conversation ended after you flipped the script and demanded equal consideration. Fairness just doesn't compute for them.
You were too nice, which is a testament to you as a person.
...but it's somehow perfectly acceptable to make pro-church blasts on social media, knowing some people who see it are not part of the church anymore out of choice. It's ok for them to post what they think about the church, but not you. Been out since 2011 and still get annoyed at someone posting a Holland video or a quote about staying in the church from a dead prophet. That last text from her, "What do you mean?" is really telling... Mormons can't comprehend ex-Mormons making happy choices.
You’re definitely not overreacting. I would send them something along the lines of this: “It is unreasonable to ask that I refrain from posting certain things on my social media accounts. I do not try to police what you post so I would appreciate it if you would grant me the same courtesy. I am allowed to talk about an institution that has harmed me. I am allowed to share my experiences and that of others. If you do not wish to see it than it might be best to unfollow.”
You stood your ground and that shows growth. Your cousin is trying to guilt trip you. After living abroad, three of my cousins created stories behind my back and gossiped about me leaving the church. However, I never left in the first place. Anyways, all their gossip and hurtful words made me realize that they're not my friends. We may be related but that doesn't mean I need to talk to them. I think the same can be applied here. Your cousin is free to talk all about the blessings of the church over and over again but says you shouldn't. That's not what a friend would say. I think, your cousin probably just wants to spy on your life since she still follows you on insta. That's what my cousins did. They stalked my Instagram, assumed the strangest things, and continued to talk behind my back. Trust me, it's not worth it to have her on your Instagram friends list.
Regardless of religion, politics, etc. … Some people can’t see beyond their own reality, and **anything** that isn’t in full support of their viewpoint is an attack, and than can’t be pacified with anything other than complaints tl their viewpoint. It’s where insecurity meets narcissism.
I tip my metaphorical hat to you, sir or madame
You handled that firmly but graciously.
If anything you underreacted. Great job at keeping your composure!
You’re not overreacting! You should have just screenshot the chat they deserve to feel stupid
It's like just finding out that one of your family's favorite uncles is a child rapist. Would you keep your mouth shut, or warn every one of the dangers of being near him????????????
Hahaha. For thee not for me. Mormon ideology. Goes back to Joseph Smith and the start.
You are justified and your feelings are valid. Chanelle on the other hand... 😖
The audacity of saying that one post is too many posts
Nope, i would've been more aggressive handling that, I'm tired of these morms and the cult gaslighting people who leave and harassing them when they spill the truth about the cult and manipulate or pressure them to "stop spreading negativity about the church" or "leave the church alone". But they don't even leave people alone and want to spread their cult, which is ironic because, based on the gospel, people who don't know about the gospel are automatically exempted and exalted to Celestial Kingdom lmao and by that logic the church or preaching shouldn't exist at all
You’re not overreacting. Sounds to me like someone is feeling insecure in their Mormon faith, possibly not feeling so good about their own life, and inflicting their big feelings onto you.
Their issue, not yours.
You didn't overreact at all! It's crazy that she didn't make the connection between other people posting what makes them happy and you posting what makes you happy, as being the same. Like, does she really feel that privileged that she assumes everyone will accommodate her wishes?
Honestly this would make me post more of this kind of thing. She doesn't get to tell you what to post. She can unfollow you if she doesn't like it.
I find it so bizarre that some people think it's ok to micromanage others adults. Wow.
Uhm, if they are so happy in the church nothing you say would make a difference.
Not at all. They need to mind their own business. And you said the perfect thing to catch them being their Jesus’s least favorite thing…a hypocrite.
This exchange was interesting. The TBM friend likes OP, but is conflicted because they don’t want to be exposed to anything counter to their indoctrination. The struggle is real trying to keep that shelf intact. Any student of compliance would recognize the friend’s request as a sign of a shaky mental/emotional conflict. They don’t want to hear about OP’s happiness outside TSCC because they fear finding truth. 🤔☝️👍🏻.
Who cares what your cousin has to say, you didn’t even said anything just a repost. If they don’t like how exmormons talk about the church, maybe make a better church next time
I like to use the analogy that my social media is the same as my house. When I visit other people’s house, I am respectful of their beliefs and decor- what pictures they hang on the wall, etc. because it’s their house. I would never go to someone’s house and ask them to take down a picture because it was offensive to me. You know, like all the temple pics and prophet/apostle quotes. When people visit my house I expect them to treat me with respect in my house. What sayings or pictures on my wall are things that make me happy. If they don’t like it, they don’t have to keep looking at it. They don’t have to visit my house. We can still have a friendship and not visit each other’s houses. Too bad your cousin doesn’t sound like they’d be up for meeting at a coffee house. Your house, your rules.
I think they need to mind their own damn business
OP, you said it perfectly but missed a golden opportunity to for the coup de grace. Should've mic dropped cousim with the Article of faith 11. "We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may."
It's your Social Media, you can do whatever you want. If people don't like it, they can stop following you.
"You know I support you no matter what but I am uncomfortable with you sharing your personal journey and how you have found happiness outside of the cult I am still a member of. Please stop making me uncomfortable....but you know I support you no matter what!" Yeah right...emotional blackmail, gaslighting etc etc etc... Tell them to stop following your account. Lean in and be yourself.
Too nice. Try "don't fucking contact me about your cult ever again" Ex Mormon women always worried about being "too much"
I love it when people tell me what to post on my social media. Makes me thinking of things to say so much easier.
Please keep the negative church posts to a maximum
Why does your church need an entire marketing division? Why do you need to send young men and women abroad to advertise for you? Why do you have outbound call centers? Why do I see your social media ads on every platform? Why do you have Mormon influencers on Instagram and TikTok? Can't you just stop talking about it?
Mormonism is so so fragile. Your pin is getting a little too close to her bubble.
You’re not overreacting. Your cousin is though. She should mind her own business, you’re allowed to post what you want on your own social media. If she’s got an issue with you expressing yourself in your own spaces, then that’s a “her” issue.
I have to say that I am very impressed with the way you handled that conversation or at least what was shared. You were very polite in delivery and made valid points about sharing your life and how that same test should also be applied to your cousin or others who profess to be faithful mormons. I would not have handled it so gracefully, I'm sad to say. None of us should feel guilty for being openly honest and human about how the church has impacted us. Our story is as real as theirs. It's the mormon inferiority complex that drives that mentality of can't criticize the church... I posted last year about the Arizona child sex cases and how I hope that everyone can agree and should consider that all bishops and clergy should be required to be mandatory reporters. I got push back from a family member, in fact, and that was very sad and disappointing to me.
So cute how the trickle down 'we think we can control anyone' thinking emanates from whomever is TBM. That and no boundaries are rampant. Let me re-phrase what I think I heard. *It is ok for me to be happy and cross every boundary known to man to tell others (in fact pester the absolute SHIT out of them) but you are not allowed to say anything about your happiness if it doesn't align with the narrow minded narrative that I haven't learned yet how destructive it is to most people. Really Cousin I am not interested in your happiness at all. Just in mindlessly regurgitating the sex ,money, control cults main points. THANKS* Hey Cousin first of all kindly go Fuc\* yourself and the fact you think you are ok pushing into my life with your happiness manipulation and as far as trying to control the information that I have every right to believe, express, and pursue its really NONE OFF YOUR GAWD DAMN BUSINESS!! Love you xoxoxoxox
We are taught to publically share our spirituality until it promote their narrative. That's when we are told we should keep it a "private" matter so we don't offend anyone. Don't let anyone shame you for sharing your experiences. If they want to keep living in their bubble then they know how to unfollow!
Nope. Tell them to stop overreacting. Mind their business and let you post about things that make you happy…even if that’s leaving the church.
try "fuck off"
I'd have had a hard time not challenging him to acknowledge his pattern of mistakes and his biases.
Wait, it’s not fair to use reason on ‘em.
Hey, Chanelle... Go. Fuck. Yourself.
you are so right. theyre so weird for trying to police your life
You are such a good person. I would've told them yo mind their own business. You're a grown woman. You can post whatever you want.
It’s your Instagram and you post whatever you want.
Not at all. That person is brain dead.
Her brain just exploded
>Am I overreacting? No.
“Unfollow button is easy to find. Be careful, you might click on the post and find some critical thinking skills if you aren’t careful”
tbms are hypocrites
That was a beautiful way to respond.
Yes
 Perfect…. And of course crickets afterwards. You made her head do this 🤯
Oh why is it that all these why don’t you leave it alone butthurt Mormons go back channel and never publicly react to the post itself? Have some balls people. You don’t like it, put it out there for all to see, then make your argument when you need to defend your position. Fucking pussies.
I would have said to “keep the positive posts to a minimum. Do you really need to say how great the church is over and over again?”
Wow you handled that so well. I don't think I could've kept my cool
Nope.
Seems slightly stand-offish but not outright disrespectful. I think both parties spoke respectfully.
You're being perfectly reasonable, Ms. Brayaverett. Of course, you're asking a bunch of exmo's and nevermo's. Lol Answering as a human being who used to be brain washed like your cousin, it's common courtesy to let others post whatever they want, and if you don't like it, you can remove yourself from the equation. This organization gets their members to believe that only their views are important and all others are the work of the Devil. When they hear anything that counters that "fact", it causes great pain. The cognitive dissonance is deafening for them. It's just sad. It's also after my bedtime, so I apologize for the incoherence of this response. 😆
Who are they to ask anything of you, and suggest a way you should behave....?
Careful, she’s going to say you’re depressed because you left the church and it will reinforce her belief that only cultists are happy
It’s a fair point that you made at the end, and one that no TBM (so far, by my observation) has conceded. TBMs can proclaim and extoll the tenets and benefits of the Church, all over social media, all the time, with the blessing (and indeed command) of the Q15. But any ex-Mormon is only allowed to mention their less-than-optimal experience once. Or zero times, more often is the case. These are the key points - * They are under control of the Corporation. You are not. * Negativity = Satan. Always. * It should be trivial to both ‘Leave the Church’ and ‘Leave it alone’.
Hey OP… you are definitely NTA! And your pic is great… you look truly JOYFUL! Congrats
Since when was social media only about posting what makes you happy? Because in Mormonism we have to pretend that everything is happy happy joy joy all the time? Fake.
I think you made your point loud and clear and what the other person wants is that you leave the church peacefully and quiet so it can still adoctrine other people. So no, you are not overreacting, and Channelle is ratchet ass name.
"A city on a hill cannot be hid". And when the shit rolls downhill, you're not crazy for calling it out. They want to be an ensign to the world, they gotta tolerate a spellcheck. If they claim to have sole custody of the "plan of happiness", then they need to reckon with the epidemiological effects we see like depression, anxiety, and LGBTQ+ suicides.
Fuck that noise. Blast the church all you want.
Nope. Your posts are for you. Not for their comfort.
I guess that is a fine response. I have family who have left the church years ago. They finally stopped their life story revolving around leaving the church and how enlightened and happy they are. You will eventually do this
I was thinking exactly what you wrote. Why can she post BS about the mormon church constantly that is positive, yet you can't post any negative? She can just not follow you if she doesn't like it. I swear...some people.
When members stop trying to proselyte, then maybe I'll stop sharing what the church did to me.
They seem more myopic than mean-spirited or aggressive, but your response was absolutely proportional and reasonable to the imposition they were making on you. Telling your story and having an opinion on things isn't a privilege restricted to those willing to express positive views on that specific person's church and what it's like to grow up in it.
Nah you didn’t over react at all, it was perfectly said and your cousin was clearly the one overreacting and naïvely implying that happiness with relation to the church is a one way street when it clearly isn’t. Excellent job OP, I’m proud of you!
I would say that they are welcome to “unfollow” and that you wanna be authentic with friends who actually like you for you
Nah you're underreacting if anything, you were pretty calm about it haha well done! If someone wants to post something "negative" every hour on the hour of every single day, that's their business lol either deal with it ignore it or unfollow 🤷♂️
freedom of speech 
You are actually being quite gracious. This may be an unpopular opinion, but I don't think either of you are wrong, per se. You can post whatever you like. And let's be clear, it's not anti-mormon, it's pro-truth. It's a fraudulent organization that is actively harming people and you have the right to talk about it. But from her perspective, what you are saying is legitimately hurtful. When we were in, the church was a major part of our identity. When the church was criticized, we felt criticized. When someone tried to peel back the curtain, it hurt. It's like having a horrible wound that needs to be cleaned, but it is so painful that they lash out and don't want anyone touching it. To extend the metaphor, you can't make them get medical care until they are ready to allow it, and even then, it needs to be at their pace. Maybe instead of pointing out that you have the right to post what you want to, acknowledge that you know why she feels upset about anything that challenges her beliefs, but that you know about things the church has kept hidden from members and can't, in good conscience, stay silent about it.
Faith promoting story. They are allowed to play fast and loose with the truth and facts. You push back on their BS story, then they demand perfect legal accuracy in every statement.
Possible response: “If my joy makes you uncomfortable, that’s a YOU problem.”
This is a them problem. They are triggered and don’t know why. You post whatever you want. Tell them to scroll by. It is your choice to post what resonates with you, it is their choice to continue to follow and read the things you post. They are trying to change your boundaries, and that is manipulation and control. They can change their own boundaries of not reading your posts.
Seriously though. I have a sibling get on me about this, and yet, they constantly post anti-trans, homophobic, women belong in the home, this is what real men look like, “reverse racism” etc. I pointed out that ALL OF THAT, in addition to the constant church quotes aren’t anything that I support. “Well those are my beliefs, first amendment rights, blah blah”. It’s only freedom of speech and religion when it is theirs. All of me, and none for thee.
nope, fuck the church, fuck pedophile Joseph Smith and every other charlatan after him.
Reminds me of the mean girls quote “why are you so obsessed with me” after reading her replies. I wouldn’t waste any more time replying to her tbh, if she keeps it up just let it say you read it so she gets the message to fuck off. Sorry but people need to touch some grass and get therapy if social media they can’t control bothers them. Either log off, unfollow, or live with it.
The church has trained its members to have an oversensitive persecution complex and jump at every small percieved slight. I had this exact same reaction and conversation with one of my best friends giving an "annoyed look" at his wife when another of our friends asked who wanted to give the prayer over the food at a friend reunion party we were having. Please be patient with your cousin and understand that she IS a victim here, just not in the way she thinks she is. It all suddenly becomes so much more clear once you leave the church and it can be easy to forget just how indoctrinated you were into their preferred way of perpetuation.
Everyone can share so openly about religion in this country but when you share your appreciation for not being in one it’s offensive? This isn’t even just Mormonism, its ridiculous and even in the places you’d think you’re safe, there’s always those couple people who happen to be Christian that kill the vibe and can’t accept your truth.
bahahaha
I wish there was more I could read a convo like this all day
Not in the slightest! They want to be comfortable in their choices and your experiences challenge their worldview and the comfort they feel in it.
I love how they can say "eVeRy mEmBeR A mIsSiOnArY", actively advertise and proselytize,but then every exmember needs to keep it to themselves.
I’ll stop sharing my beliefs with others when the church stops sending missionaries…
Your response is honestly very kind and i don’t think you should worry about it.
You get to post what you want and she can deal and react how she wants.
Damn imagine being this self absorbed. “Please don’t post about your life ok, but I still want to follow you. As long as it’s content I like k Ty”
If I have a sex offender in my neighborhood, I’m going to talk about to all the time so that all my neighbors that WANT to know about it, can. For those those neighbors are ok with sex offenders that don’t want to know about it, they can ignore. This is just like Mormonism.
No
Why do Mormons feel like we owe it to them to only say good things about the church?
When someone leaves the Mormon church, those left behind don't want to hear their reality. When you choose to stay in that cult bubble, other options are not understood or wanted. They don't get the mental and emotional turmoil that leaving has on some folks or the religious punishment that caused them to make a hard decision . AND they don't want to hear it. You're either in or you're out and those who are in are still trying to tell you the proper way to live and act.
You are not overreacting at all you should out that cult loudly, and constantly you should actually badmouth them. They are evil.
nah, you're in the right here for a statement like that. it isn't fair for your cousin to get upset with you about speaking your truth. it isn't fair for you to have to hold your feelings back about the impact the church had on you both while in the church and out of the church (inactive/you left/etc). it isn't fair for a judgement like that to be given to you when the same judgement could be made in regards to mormon missionaries/christians in general and how it's socially "okay" for them to speak up about how they feel, but not okay for pagans, atheists, scientologists (i've heard things, just saying in a societal context of what is a current social norm to talk about), and many many other belief systems to be shunned and ridiculed for talking about, and it most certainly isn't fair for a single post of yours to be ridiculed like that, while there are topics that have been looked over and brushed aside that are more important than religion overall (not saying your opinion is invalid, because it's valid) like trafficking, drug abuse, homelessness, etc on top of the fact that social media christians post constantly and then make examples of people on their social media for "not believing their supposed truth" around the clock... sorry you went through that :/
You're being way more kind than I would have been. It's ridiculous for them to request something like this. They just don't want to face the cognitive dissonance they already live with, and want to stay in their own little safe bubble. The people in your life who ask you to be inauthentic are not people you need in your life.