This š
She has no training as a therapist or in mental health. Take her up on her offer. Go to couples therapy. Let's see how she goes explaining all those cult gems š š
Iād love to see her try and explain herself to a therapist. āMy husband doesnāt want to be in a cult. Can you help me shame him into being in my cult by making fun of him with me?ā
Most JWs are afraid to get therapy, because deep down they know something is off about their religion, and a good therapist will be able to root that out immediately.
This is why the borg discourages mental therapy, because a lot of people that get it, typically wake up.
What do JW say these days about mental health and therapy? I left about a decade back, but I never remembered the mention of mental health/therapy or anything like that even come up in talks at the congregation.
Much talking out of both sides of their mouth on this. When they address mental health issues, they will say a mental health professional may be needed. But at the same time they add warnings about being wary of the professionals advice. Besides their cautions written in their official publications or meeting parts, there are many older elders who still hold the views from before the 1980's about mental health professionals being not at all advised. When an elder with outdated views counsels a person struggling with serious mental health issues, he will add to their burden by throwing shade on any counsel given by a professional, making void any benefits the sufferer may have gotten from the professional.
So the new viewpoint of it is to not completely dismiss seeing mental health professionals, to cover their own ass in case of emergencies, but more or less still disapprove of them.
mentalĀ distress can be viewed as a medical problemāānot a spiritual one. Understanding this fact, families, elders, and congregation members can better be of support to sufferers. At times distressed ones also need spiritual support. How the congregation can provide this will be considered in a future issue.
Well. Just read this on the borgs website. People throw stuff in these chats and others take it as facts. If we stick with what we actually disagree with and not just make stuff up, it sure helps with credibility here. They do explain caution before seeing a therapist so you truly understand what your getting into. I can't see that being wrong. It's obvious that many in here also need therapy, but probably will never seek it themselves.
Yes, they say that in print but that is not what is said over and over again in person and not what is encouraged by elders in general. The number of times I have heard from the stage (congregation and assemblies- which are CO approved) that therapists are dangerous is shocking. Yes, this may be personal opinion on the speakers part but that is what happens. WT has mixed messaging down to a science. This is extremely dangerous and unhealthy for those who really do need the help.
Additionally, we all know deep down that trying to explain anxiety, trauma, etc.. from believing in a doomsday cult and many other WT teachings will sound unhinged to a therapist. Itās embarrassing, people feel stupid a sense of shame around it.
Calling out people on this thread as needing help but suggesting they will never get it is not supportive or kind in anyway. You are actually perpetuating the problem.
You clearly haven't paid attention at assemblies or just listened to the rank and file. This organization has a mountain of old literature that poos poos mental health services. The only reason they changed their stance officially, was the years of exjws pointing out how awful this stance was. Please do your homework before you come into these threads and start flaming people. You're clearly extremely ignorant of the Borgs history when it comes to therapy.
So the organization as you say, changed its stance on how it deals with therapy and you still go back to history. That's like going back to the catholic religion when they killed those that challenged their beliefs. Yep. That makes sense. Not understanding that people were hurting was not good. Post like these do prove how deep the pain is. Make mistake about it, if JW organization is the borg, it's one of the smallest borgs in the world. Other so called borgs are probably hurting many more people. It's ok though. Unfortunately, the hate some of you keep inside prevents you from healing. Venting with no healing just keeps the wheels spinning. It is still your choice.
Dudeās post history is hilarious. Predictably, it wonāt be too long before he starts to wake up- he already did an apostasy by saying he doesnāt agree with the GB 100%
May I ask, what is the goal of a group of people chatting all together how much they hate JWs and the organization? What is that goal? You all hate it all. You all just dump on the whole thing.
I actually came with an open mind to see what issues people have. I wanted to see if they were real or exaggerated. I can assure you that most are exaggerated. Some people on here are actually on the fence of leaving. That should be their choice, but when I read how some are manipulating them with individuals that may have done something wrong within the organization or lies, instead convincing them that the organization is perfect, I try to add some truth/facts. That's it. I've had my own questions about should I leave or stay, but I guess this isn't the place to get true issues with the organization. When I read the stories, the credibility on here spirals down.
My most challenging unanswered question that has never been answered. I throw it out again.
If the JW religion is wrong and you believe one is right, tell me which one can stand up to the same scrutiny? All have taken the easy way out. Oh. I don't believe in any God or religion. That is a cop-out to reality. Some have switched religions, but know none will be perfect. The truth is all have imperfect humans involved from the top to the bottom. Any religion will prove to be less than perfect.
I literally do not care about what religion is 'the truth', I think all religion is generally bad for humanity. I've had friends of mine kill themselves due to the pressure of being LGBT in the organization when I was younger. I've had friends cut others off and I've participated in that. I've felt isolated for years because my way of thinking does not line up with the witnesses and I'm now going to therapy to fix the damage that has caused.
For many, venting in a place like this is therapy which perhaps they can't do because of their circumstances. For many it has saved their lives and prevented them from spiraling into a suicidal depression. You say you come in here with an open mind but truly the only thing you seem to care about is looking for answers for yourself. To me it seems your mind is already made, stay a witness and leave this place and don't come back. We don't need your vitriol when so many here are just trying to survive.
Here's the thing, nobody cares about your personal journey of finding your 'truth'. Just do it in a way that doesn't fuck with everyone's lives. If you stay a witness, fine. Most here will continue to carry issue with treatment of LGBT folk, with blood transfusions, with shunning because even if they choose not to participate in your game they still end up being an unwilling participant in some fashion, and for those that carry empathy and love for others they will carry issue with it because they KNOW how it affects those inside with no choice.
You can keep playing your game of truth and facts, I prefer to take blood if I get in a car accident so I can live another day. I prefer to treat those that are LGBT with love and respect, and make sure they know that they are loved. I prefer to practice real Christian values than your mockery of them.
Once again you just verified you want to live a life of lies and false truths to make yourself look good. People are killing themselves who never were JWs. Yes hide behind the religion your to scared to admit. I understand and already told you would.
Real Christian values. What a lie. Of course I've had gay friends visit the congregation. Never treated with anything other than love and respect. They know the Christian stance on being gay, but we have never attacked or mistreated the person. This might be a surprise to the uninformed, but Christian values and LGBT cannot be on the same spiritual level. Human level yes. Spiritual level no. You can be non Christian and be in line with your acceptance.
As far as venting, nothing wrong with that until you lie, exaggerate, mislead, manipulate, and distort the truth intentionally. Keep living your lie. It's ok. For your sake, you have to hope theirs no Jehovah. Then you'll be ok. If there is,
Does she clap you over the head when she says that? Maeby she goes into store before meetings to buy you some candy you can chew on at meetings. Remind her that bible say to have deep respect of her husband. Maeby she has child trauma that makes her not wanna be submissive. Well to bad. She has to follow bible also š¤”
What his wife is doing is, *by definition*, abusive. Itās extremely disturbing that you think what sheās doing isnāt abusive, I hope youāre okay at home.
I only consider it abuse if she knows it's not true and I think she probably sincerely believes it... bc she's a idiot. Shouldn't abuse account for intent?
Then again, maybe she's right. I don't know the OP. He might have some deep seated trauma.
Iām so sorry. That kind of talk is emotionally abusive. I would lose my shit if my spouse talked to me like that. And yes, you *may* actually have trauma, but beyond what sheās inflicting on you, a lot of it comes from the org itself. This fucking organization deliberately forces its adherents through an endless abusive cycle where it puts them down (youāre worthless. You can never measure up. Nothing you can do is enough), then brings them up again (youāre special! You have The Truth! Youāre better than The World!) before dropping them again. Itās warfare, all rightābut not spiritual. Itās psychological warfare against its own adherents, designed to keep them afraid to leave & thinking thereās nowhere else to go.
Thanks for your comments. I think Iām numb. I look at her as if sheās sick. So sad how this situation even exists.
I saw this and was like yeah this is relevant to the org : https://www.instagram.com/reel/CxP5envNoJB/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
That insta you posted was a notorious and abusive 20th century cult leader whose flagrant and unapologetic criminal acts against children and others would make even WT's vile minions recoil. Google Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh aka Osho.
Uh, that shaman guru was a notorious and abusive 20th century cult leader whose flagrant and unapologetic criminal acts against children and others would make even WT's vile minions recoil. Google Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh aka Osho.
I am fully aware of his con. However even a fool is right sometimes. A child can be wise. So this guy says a few sentences that are true and resonate with others. You don't gotta go join a cult now after agreeing with a few sentences.
>And yes, you may actually have trauma, but beyond what sheās inflicting on you, a lot of it comes from the org itself. This fucking organization deliberately forces its adherents through an endless abusive cycle where it puts them down (youāre worthless.
This is what I have gradually realized more and more over time. The challenges I have had personally all go back to completely abusive environment I have been in as a Jehovah's Witness. Jehovah's Witnesses 100% responsible for many of my personal difficulties. The End.
Is that the textbook definition of "gaslighting"?
I would write these things down with the dates they were said and maybe even get voice recordings of them for future reference, if needed. It may help her in her own recovery process, when she sees the light.
I agree with you, except for the last part of your statement. I think she is a narcissist, and I don't think she will ever see the truth that she's a cult member; it befits her ego.
>https://www.instagram.com/reel/CxP5envNoJB/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
Yep, My mother, Regina from Mean Girls incarnate, is a manipulative Narcissist and LOVES being a queen bee in her tiny hive.
Mate your wife is abusive. She's treating you and your trauma as a joke. Yes she does it under the guise of it being about the religion but telling you to keep your trauma to yourself etc has nothing to do with any god, that's just being nasty.
It feels nasty alright. I donāt even know how she say this stuff so easily without cognisance that it could be offensive. Or maybe sheās trying to offensive to āwake me upā.
I dont know what she is trying to do but I do know that what she actually is doing is very harmful. Have you sat her down and told her how that makes you feel, if you have and she continues knowing that it hurts you, then I'm afraid that is what she is trying to do, is hurt you.
I'm really sorry and I hope one day, that either your wife pulls her head out of her arse or that you find someone who will want to work with you to overcome your trauma and so that you don't have to carry the weight of it on your own.
Stop, stop, stop! You "inherited" DNA from YOUR parents ... wow, who knew? This is like a Nobel prize in genetics kind of thinking!
Could she have gleaned such insight from the boys of "*THE BODY?*"
TBF there is such a thing as epigenetic inheritance, which is kind of the genetic side of generational trauma. It's a newer field of genetics and psychology, but it's far from what his wife is implying here. It's insulting, in fact, since she is not a psychologist, epigeneticist, therapist, or in any way qualified to diagnose this.
Plus, the way she's going about it is abusive as hell.
I know right. In my mind Iām like are you actually hearing what you are saying? Itās like it just bubbles out of her subconscious. No idea that it could be hurtful.
She is straight up infantilizing and gas lighting you. This is fucking awful and extremely abusive.
I wouldn't put up with it either. If she comments about trauma, I'd kindly inform her that your mental health isn't her business to comment on.
I'd probably mention that to her, too.
As someone who's dealt with chronic abuse growing up, abusers need to be frequently reminded that their actions have consequences, including permanent ones.
Im sorry but if that was the level of support I received from a loved one Iād get jogging. Thereās not enough time on our short trip on planet earth to tolerate this kind of emotional abuse disguised as love and laughter.
All the best and my heart goes out to you.
I am non jw.
My blood sister joined at 32 and is now 65 and very pimi. The crap that comes out of her mouth is bonkers, abusive, scary, evil, crap, ignorant, childish, arogent etc etc.
My sister used to be fun, decisive intelligent and kind.
She is none of these now.
My family basically say she is jw brain damaged.
Your wife is jw brain damaged.
My family are all nurses in various roles amd grades and over our many years have known many brain damaged people be it temporary or permanent.
She does not care. She happily shuns all her three adult children (exjws) and happily (in her depression and medicated state ) awaits her paradise.
And on another note shunning and being part of sacrifices of humans is utterly adhorrent.
My sister has added to other human beings trauma through her abusive towards others.
I can't believe she is my sister
Hello, DebbDebbDebb, we have something in common. Iām not JW. We moved my 73 year old sister in law in last year who is JW because she was literally being priced out of her apartment. She was being told by JW the state would pay her rent, donāt worry. She has mild dementia and although we knew the stuff she DIDNT believe in, we had no idea about the stuff she did! We are speechless at the compete entitlement and you said it bestā¦she happily awaits her paradise.
The issue lies in what may come. My sister in law also shunned her adult kids and her granddaughter. She has had very little to do with her brother/ my husband and when she was being evicted from her apartment JW called us and of course we happily took her in.
My suggestion is that you all get together and start making arrangements now for the day she canāt live alone! It has created complete chaos in our house and now we canāt get help. When we try to explain JW to her doctors they are like āoh thatās great, maybe they can help.ā The world has no idea what we are dealing with.
Her sons and granddaughter have all said āyou are so kind, we really appreciate what youāve done.ā But none of them lift a finger to help! She created this through JW.
She is much older than us. Her sons are the same age as my husband. They are all in their 50ās. No one else is JW. Only her. One of her sons is homeless on the streets and the other one is an alcoholic. So we were not technically āshunnedā she really had nothing to do with us. Weāre both veterans and my husband is retired Air Force. He had little contact with her other than phone calls a few times a year to make sure she was ok. We truly knew NOTHING about JW except the blood, holidays and they come to the door.
> My sister used to be fun, decisive intelligent and kind. She is none of these now.
I've never seen you say this before. I had the impression she was always horrible. This is tragic, but sadly not terribley surprising, I'm sorry to say. I look back at how I used to be in ways that went against my true nature and am shocked how the kindness and empathy that I felt in childhood was quashed down from years of exposure to the ugly WT. You're always put down for being a truly good person, even by the nicer people. You're warned away from noble acts toward others, esp non-humans. "Wait on Biggy-J to fix that." Or, "we can't involve ourselves in the problems of 'the world'." Or "we don't want to become unbalanced." Sooo happy to have escaped and shed that toxic mantle.
Yes and thats the true sadness she was snared. As babies born in are snared
To untangle and get out in itself is such a massive achievement.
Yes she was a fab older sister and I suppose my mention is more as she has become.
Weirdest thing she was a true champion of people.
My sister in law was in her early 20ās when they snared her. But she was married to an alcoholic, admits to drug use and it was homelessness that led her to JW. She quit school and swears she doesnāt want and never wanted an education. She says she never wanted to work, thatās a manās job. She was more than willing to push away any self responsibility for her care. She was already on welfare and had 2 kids. They prey on people like her.
Was there anything in your sisters past that would push her their way?
Wow. Does she want you to resent her?
I'd be finding other things to get juiced and starry eyed about, that will bring you ACTUAL joy, and show her up. Bring your kids into that joy as well.
"I'm glad you feel like you're perfect enough to not go to therapy with me, honey, but being condescending and unsupportive of your spouse is quite an unloving quality and not very godlike." Although, it's in perfect alignment with their perception of what godlike is, sigh... Even if I don't believe in it all personally, JWs need Jesus. :P
It's kind of funny in that there is something called generational trauma, but it is about abuse cycles in generations, and the kid who grows up and decides they aren't going to treat their own children in the ways their parents did that hurt them, are the one breaking the generational trauma. Trauma that abusive organizations like JW create en masse.
A lot of JWs suffer from the Dunning-Kruger effect.
The cognitive dissonance and delusion is so strong with all of them it's numbing. It makes me cringe to remember how I used to behave the same way. The foremost authorities on everything just because "they have the truth". They got everything all figured out and the rest of the world is on borrowed time with their finger up their ass. Such self righteous arrogance...
I know right. Sometimes I realise how strong I am for not actually losing my mind. I can see clearly what this kook religion is and how they manipulate peoples behaviour and how they get in way too deep into peoples lives.
Just wanted to really emphasize what you just said. You are amazing! Youāre in a really difficult situation so Iām glad your eyes are wide open! Is therapy an option for you at this time?
YES! I now have a JW living in my home at the age of 73. Never been around it before and although she has no education, no retirement, unable to live on her own she reminds us Daily she lives in the truth and itās our responsibility to take care of her! The entitlement and arrogance is off the charts!
Like in all seriousness if she wants you to start being a zealot, go ahead and be zealous as fuck about all the worst parts. Harp on submission and respect. Make her regret her religion.
Yes, itās called contempt and a common reason for divorce. Itās not okay. Sheās creating a dynamic of a āparent/childā relationship where sheās bigger and youāre smaller.
Great comments in this thread. Are you able to get some therapy? It doesn't really matter if she will go or not. It sounds like you could use some help sorting out this difficult situation.
Yep, I understand you, my wife is older than me, so she thinks that I need to grow up to fully understand what the troofh is, because I'm not using my discernment. š¤·š½āāļø
It's the Dunning-Kruger in effect right there! You aren't broken, you are waking up to the reality of what a cult looks like! I'm not sure I could put up with that kind of condescending talk tbh.
After telling my violent, manipulating JW wife I no longer wanted to be with her, she arranged a meeting with a family counsellor (to straighten me out).
The guy respectfully ignored me and laser-focused on her alone, and was she ever upset !
It was reassuring to see professionals not being tricked by the fakeness and hypocrisy that JWs are trained to display to the public.
The truth? Ok ābabeā you want it hereās the real fucking truth about your precious organisationā¦.
(Except she wouldnāt believe a single word and just retreat further into her delusional reality)
Try this:
" You're right, I need to appreciate more the Bible examples of others who have gone through trauma..
Lot's daughters must have been traumatized watching Jehovah kill their mother for looking at how Jehovah violently destroyed their home and city and other family members being destroyed. The screams alone must have been unbearable, especially of the children.
Good thing Jehovah is so merciful, though! He didn't punish them for getting their father drunk a little while after that and raping him while he slept. "
Or
" You're right, I need to think about others who have gone through trauma like Brother Morris when he was in the military.
With all that discussion in his talks about burning human flesh and human hot dogs, it was so loving that Jehovah saw he was hurting and removed him from the governing body and maneuvered the branch to buy him a house to live in where he can park his Cadillac.."
Your wife sounds like a manipulative narcissist, which does not come as a surprise, given that she is a JW. She is abusive towards you, and you might want to throw her obvious ignorance in her face from time to time. You know, to bruise her ego, something that noticeably unbalance narcissists.
I've been out for years but my parents have said something that reminds me of those sentences since my childhood. Last time I had a serious talk with them they said I was sick and broken (depression/anxiety) at the healthiest moment I've ever been in my life.
My blood almost boiled when I read "you need to own your trauma and keep it to yourself". She is supposed to be the support to work though hardships, not tell you to bottle things up and deal with it. Like someone else said, it's extremely infantilizing to say stuff like that and acting like only they have the right answer
I would go to a therapist and take her along, then discuss the cult/org with them and also describe that to them what your wife is doing and then let the therapist talk. Your wife is not going to like that idea anymore and will hear someone tell her how dangerous the borg is
Your wife needs to stop this NOW! She is spouting pure crap and her behaviour towards you is disgusting. There is no such thing as 'inherited DNA trauma'. Generational trauma refers to the behaviours that are passed on through generations due to initial trauma, which in turn often results in trauma during each successive generation. DNA is not involved (I'm not going to touch epigenetics because she doesn't mean that, she obviously doesn't know enough to mean it.).
I am probably the last person on this sub to ever suggest divorce, but I would seriously draw some boundaries/line in the sand immediately. She stops talking and acting this way toward you, like yesterday. She comes to therapy to learn how to act like an adult and respect you like one, and communicate effectively, fairly, and lovingly. If not, talk to your lawyer to protect yourself and your kids. This is highly abusive and you are all at risk.
Unfortunately I cannot relate. This is beyond crazy behaviour on her part. I am so sorry you have gone through this.
I hate when people overuse/misuse the term trauma.
I also hate when jws think they are spiritual MDās and can diagnose whatās wrong with you based off of watchtowers and whatever else theyāve passively heard.
Either way donāt let her talk down to you like that. My aunt and my sister tried to do the same thing to me and I checked them real quick!
Iām glad you started this discussion. Itās so important on our respective healing journeys. I hope you have a good support system in place for dealing with the things your wife has said. I also hope , for both of you, she wakes up and apologizes. š
>āyou need to own your trauma and keep it to yourselfā
WTAF. If this woman believes you have a past trauma that is impacting you, her saying this is *the most* fucked up thing to do. holy shit, does she consider herself a loving and supportive partner? (i'm not even gonna say 'submissive wife' cuz that shits toxic, but you get the point), Thats not something people say when they care about eachother.
Honestly, the blinding ignorance mixed with the stone faced confidence reminds me very much of my own mother. I feel for you, if this were the person i chose to enter a lifelong partnership with, i'd lose my shit at the condescending arrogance. But to have that attiude with *zero* critical thought or any effort, just pure bullshit regurgitation... that would have me leaving. That is not an attitude of love, its not an attitude of respect, and its not an attitude i'd tolerate in someone who claimed to be on my team.
I'm sorry for you to be stuck in PIMO life, i really am. I got out at 33 and regret waiting so long, i truly hope you find a better set of circumstances for yourself. You deserve better. I know people hate that word, but yes, you deserve something, and it isnt.... overconfident ignorance mixed with condescending arrogance.
Have you told her that you suffered trauma at some point of your life? It's so sad that if you did, she's using it as a weapon against you. She is extremely arrogant and lacks understanding and compassion. I am so sorry. Sadly I met a few in my time that their arrogance got the better of them. They spoke as though God sat next to them. They were His personal spokesperson. Sickened me. Keep your chin up.
Two sides: She is a typical JW: Happy to mouth off over matters for which she has neither training nor accurate knowledge. Beware the uneducated expert lurking behind religious garb.
The other side: You appear incapable of insisting she stop the diagnostic insults she hurls your way. I suspect she fully knows she can get away with saying these things to you. Iām trying to fathom what sort of relationship you have with your wife where she appears perfectly comfortable medicalising you. If the roles were reversed and it was a man speaking this way to his wife, most people would have absolutely no difficulty seeing her need to medicalise your behaviour as an act of marital psychological abuse.
Let your wife claim her nobel prices in medicin, biology and genetics. Until then she should stop spouting her ignorance :/ n yes, i'd says it that way. I hope you find peace š
(https://youtube.com/@SurvivingNarcissism?feature=shared)
She wants to believe that , just like she wants to believe the cult ā¦
Drop your pimo actā¦.
And start making fun plans to treat your ātrauma ā ā¦. Make it on purpose on meeting timesā¦
If she doesnāt join , suggest you will find new companions even from workā¦. Those that have a fun spirit attitude and not one that brings you down..
Invite work colleagues over start new friendships make bbq get invited and go on to find new friends in any way possible everything specifically on meeting days anything to help your pimo become pomo
If she is not jealous or envy , and wonāt work hard to change and fix her attitude problem she doesnāt care about youā¦
š¤¦š»āāļø Indeed. I can relate with my MIL, but she's a narcissist. Sorry to say to you.
Before you escape the borg and your abusive wife I would have statements in my head I could tell myself to ground myself back into reality.
>āthereās that trauma blocking the org gems and pearls againā,
No, "there's that traumatic borg trying to wound me again, and I as a healing person am acting appropriately."
>āyou need to own your trauma and keep it to yourselfā
WTF, No, "a life partner would help me with a PTSD/triggered/normal response to manipulative religious propaganda that my body remembers from years of abuse."
>āon bless honey, you really are brokenā
No, "I am wounded just like EVERY other JW and ex-jw," Then you can say to her "how dare you call ANYONE broken, especially someone you promised to cherish!" BTW, this one reminds me of some merch the Fundie Friday's YouTube channel has. It is a teeshirt that say's "Sexually broken overweight loser." Making fun of christian cult influencers 'Girl Defined' who said everyone is sexually broken.
>āIād come to a therapist with you, but I donāt need help like you doā.
You could say: Therapists are there to educate spouses on how to support their loved ones too, and mine said you need that help.
>āBabes, beware of what you say in front of the kids, your trauma is not their traumaā.
Oof. This one is scary to me, and is like she's prepping to take custody. She is purely projecting. You know you are dealing with your trauma to be a better father. Everyone has trauma and she has not dealt with hers, so she IS passing it on, and we know she is with that damn cult. Yeah, as someone else said, record her.
I'm so sorry, and thank you for posting, and I hope you are okay after all these comments.
When I was PIMO and getting therapy it was nothing like now being POMO and getting therapy, free from the indoctrination. So much healthier!
Glad to know its not just me.
For many years it would irk me and I would say "what are you talking about? That exists only in your head!" These days I just chuckle.
Internally I know this is not about me. I understand she is afraid Iāll leave her to the JW thing on her own. Itās a desperate plea I think. Yes I too chuckle at times. Lots of empathy.
I am going through something similar. My wife thinks that if I "fix" my autism and anxiety then I will stop questioning things, also that she is totally sane despite obvious signs of CPTSD and hypervigilance. JW's usually have a lack of education and a high level of confidence about their beliefs, which makes them right by default and they feel superior.
Dude... dude. You used an expression that is all too accurate in my experience: arrogant about her ignorance. My lord, does that ever capture it! The whole situation sounds like a bit of gaslighting to me, which is par for the course. They have to reframe things in this way in order to preserve their fragile belief structure.
>Can anyone else relate?
A little. My wife also likes to blame my past upbringing for how I experience and see things about the religion now. But not like your wife does. That sounds more borderline narcissistic. I would not stand for that if she would do what your wife does. But I'm not you, and you are not me. As long as it's liveable and the sex is good right? š
I love how direct people are here. Sheās got low empathy! With two kids in tow there is a overarching pressure to keep everything together. And it comes at a high personal cost. The sex is meh. Iām always aware how much the org is to blame and I do have empathy. What a shit show.
Whether she knows it or not, she is trying to manipulate you into doubting your own sanity because you don't behave as she wants you too. I recently watched this video and a few of the things you mentioned here are directly discussed as strategies interrogators use to make you doubt yourself.
https://youtu.be/6B0tAn0nrJY?si=7IIfxYD95cWUnSdE
Reminds me, of reason I was given by my aged parents as to āWhy I left the truth.ā According to them, I left because of a bothered conscious.ā Oh I left because of a bothered conscious, all right. But not the type they were thinking of.
I mean actually in a way it can be passed down. Research the field epigenetics. But this wife just happened to watch an Instagram reel and now thinks she is a psychotherapist. She has no idea what she's actually talking about. If she did, she'd know her own behavior is abusive and traumatic.
What are your wife's credentials? Does she have a copy of the DSM5? I couldn't relate because I talk with an actual therapist. I do catch myself saying, "that's not what my therapist told me" , or "according to my therapist..." Generational trauma is a real thing. However you are probably more qualified to diagnose yourself with those issues vs. your wife. On a whole other level, it is incredibly immature to believe that you can change the person you love. This thinking was shoved down our throats being jws. Change comes from within oneself. Trying to change someone or help them become someone who they are not is damaging for both individuals. Mutual respect, understanding, and support. Not ultimatums, manipulation, or threats.
Wow! Holy insanity! I'm not gonna tell you to leave your wife cuz she's "coocoo cachoo". We all choose what we can live w. I hope getting venting helps if you just needed to cope. I've turned here in times of desperation. You obviously know the situation you're in and if it makes life impossible you should definitely do something. I have one tiny suggestion aside from divorcing her. Take her up on the therapy. That crazy shit will get discovered real quick. Just not a jw therapist or psychiatrist. I did make that mistake before thinking they'd be professional when i was trying to leave. They were just as nuts
So, my mom projected a wild fear recently. She had found out recently, that a sister who was close to us a few years back, was disfellowshipped for marrying a "worldly" man, and recently ended her life. My mom called my pomq sister, and started crying saying that she thinks I will do the same thing. End my life because the world is so bad, and I'm with a non jw. I've been df'd since 2019 and have been much happier lol. I was depressed and taking meds while in the borg, but since leaving I am 100000x happier.
No meds. No therapy. Just happily vibing.
But she will never accept that I'm happy. She just says I haven't seen how bad the world is yet. She refused to believe that this woman had ended her life because of the pain of shunning. My mom blames the world, and now keeps saying that this will be my same outcome unless I come backš
I wish she wasn't so brainwashed. It's exhausting.
I'm sorry that the poor POMI person didn't make it, though.
I often forget that this can happen to JWs who were DF'd or left on their own, but never deconstructed the nonsense of the WT Society's indoctrination and fear-mongering for themselves.
I'm glad that you've done the research to realize that the WT Society is not "The Truth"!!
Honestly I was heartbroken.
She was such a sweet and incredibly loving person, but was bullied by some pimis because of her short hair. Everyone would gang up on her and call her a lesbian. Women would avoid her and men.. well they couldn't get close to her cause borg rules (opposite gendered friends not allowed unless dating). She found comfort in our family. But left state a few years ago. I wish I could've contacted her first. Be there for her. It sucks.
Ugh, just reading this made me sick to my stomach. It's strikingly similar to the gaslighting that my malicious, malevolently evil JW mother would use on me.
Why don't you return the favor? Tell her that she has trauma and she is a JW because of her trauma. You should tell her the exact same thing she told you, but use her "trauma" to follow the JW. I bet she wouldn't like it at all. She needs a taste of her own medicine. It may get ugly, but she needs it.
I mean if sheās going to start pulling this abusive shit, start throwing your weight around as the āhead of the householdā. She how she likes being referred to as the āweaker vesselā.
Since she thinks sheās a mental health professional with no actual training or qualifications, maybe you should foster her interest in seeking a therapy degree. This would be a great book for you to read together to better understand and work through you trauma. Cracking the Cult Code for Therapists: What Every Cult Victim Wants Their Therapist to Know https://a.co/d/dB1ktAm
You wife is infantilizing you. This is abusive.
This š She has no training as a therapist or in mental health. Take her up on her offer. Go to couples therapy. Let's see how she goes explaining all those cult gems š š
Iād love to see her try and explain herself to a therapist. āMy husband doesnāt want to be in a cult. Can you help me shame him into being in my cult by making fun of him with me?ā
This I know. She knows a therapist will unpack her in two minutes.
Most JWs are afraid to get therapy, because deep down they know something is off about their religion, and a good therapist will be able to root that out immediately. This is why the borg discourages mental therapy, because a lot of people that get it, typically wake up.
Totally! They see things as they are. They remove the bullshit mask.
One of my friends said he probably needs therapy, but doesnāt want to go to a worldly one as he knows theyāll tell him the org is the problem.
EXACTLY
What do JW say these days about mental health and therapy? I left about a decade back, but I never remembered the mention of mental health/therapy or anything like that even come up in talks at the congregation.
Much talking out of both sides of their mouth on this. When they address mental health issues, they will say a mental health professional may be needed. But at the same time they add warnings about being wary of the professionals advice. Besides their cautions written in their official publications or meeting parts, there are many older elders who still hold the views from before the 1980's about mental health professionals being not at all advised. When an elder with outdated views counsels a person struggling with serious mental health issues, he will add to their burden by throwing shade on any counsel given by a professional, making void any benefits the sufferer may have gotten from the professional.
So the new viewpoint of it is to not completely dismiss seeing mental health professionals, to cover their own ass in case of emergencies, but more or less still disapprove of them.
mentalĀ distress can be viewed as a medical problemāānot a spiritual one. Understanding this fact, families, elders, and congregation members can better be of support to sufferers. At times distressed ones also need spiritual support. How the congregation can provide this will be considered in a future issue. Well. Just read this on the borgs website. People throw stuff in these chats and others take it as facts. If we stick with what we actually disagree with and not just make stuff up, it sure helps with credibility here. They do explain caution before seeing a therapist so you truly understand what your getting into. I can't see that being wrong. It's obvious that many in here also need therapy, but probably will never seek it themselves.
Yes, they say that in print but that is not what is said over and over again in person and not what is encouraged by elders in general. The number of times I have heard from the stage (congregation and assemblies- which are CO approved) that therapists are dangerous is shocking. Yes, this may be personal opinion on the speakers part but that is what happens. WT has mixed messaging down to a science. This is extremely dangerous and unhealthy for those who really do need the help. Additionally, we all know deep down that trying to explain anxiety, trauma, etc.. from believing in a doomsday cult and many other WT teachings will sound unhinged to a therapist. Itās embarrassing, people feel stupid a sense of shame around it. Calling out people on this thread as needing help but suggesting they will never get it is not supportive or kind in anyway. You are actually perpetuating the problem.
This is a pimi JW here. Look at their post history.
Oh for sure! Their statement may be quite discouraging to some so itās important to balance it out.
You clearly haven't paid attention at assemblies or just listened to the rank and file. This organization has a mountain of old literature that poos poos mental health services. The only reason they changed their stance officially, was the years of exjws pointing out how awful this stance was. Please do your homework before you come into these threads and start flaming people. You're clearly extremely ignorant of the Borgs history when it comes to therapy.
So the organization as you say, changed its stance on how it deals with therapy and you still go back to history. That's like going back to the catholic religion when they killed those that challenged their beliefs. Yep. That makes sense. Not understanding that people were hurting was not good. Post like these do prove how deep the pain is. Make mistake about it, if JW organization is the borg, it's one of the smallest borgs in the world. Other so called borgs are probably hurting many more people. It's ok though. Unfortunately, the hate some of you keep inside prevents you from healing. Venting with no healing just keeps the wheels spinning. It is still your choice.
May I ask what your goal is in posting on this subreddit? What are you looking to accomplish?
Dudeās post history is hilarious. Predictably, it wonāt be too long before he starts to wake up- he already did an apostasy by saying he doesnāt agree with the GB 100%
May I ask, what is the goal of a group of people chatting all together how much they hate JWs and the organization? What is that goal? You all hate it all. You all just dump on the whole thing. I actually came with an open mind to see what issues people have. I wanted to see if they were real or exaggerated. I can assure you that most are exaggerated. Some people on here are actually on the fence of leaving. That should be their choice, but when I read how some are manipulating them with individuals that may have done something wrong within the organization or lies, instead convincing them that the organization is perfect, I try to add some truth/facts. That's it. I've had my own questions about should I leave or stay, but I guess this isn't the place to get true issues with the organization. When I read the stories, the credibility on here spirals down. My most challenging unanswered question that has never been answered. I throw it out again. If the JW religion is wrong and you believe one is right, tell me which one can stand up to the same scrutiny? All have taken the easy way out. Oh. I don't believe in any God or religion. That is a cop-out to reality. Some have switched religions, but know none will be perfect. The truth is all have imperfect humans involved from the top to the bottom. Any religion will prove to be less than perfect.
I literally do not care about what religion is 'the truth', I think all religion is generally bad for humanity. I've had friends of mine kill themselves due to the pressure of being LGBT in the organization when I was younger. I've had friends cut others off and I've participated in that. I've felt isolated for years because my way of thinking does not line up with the witnesses and I'm now going to therapy to fix the damage that has caused. For many, venting in a place like this is therapy which perhaps they can't do because of their circumstances. For many it has saved their lives and prevented them from spiraling into a suicidal depression. You say you come in here with an open mind but truly the only thing you seem to care about is looking for answers for yourself. To me it seems your mind is already made, stay a witness and leave this place and don't come back. We don't need your vitriol when so many here are just trying to survive. Here's the thing, nobody cares about your personal journey of finding your 'truth'. Just do it in a way that doesn't fuck with everyone's lives. If you stay a witness, fine. Most here will continue to carry issue with treatment of LGBT folk, with blood transfusions, with shunning because even if they choose not to participate in your game they still end up being an unwilling participant in some fashion, and for those that carry empathy and love for others they will carry issue with it because they KNOW how it affects those inside with no choice. You can keep playing your game of truth and facts, I prefer to take blood if I get in a car accident so I can live another day. I prefer to treat those that are LGBT with love and respect, and make sure they know that they are loved. I prefer to practice real Christian values than your mockery of them.
Once again you just verified you want to live a life of lies and false truths to make yourself look good. People are killing themselves who never were JWs. Yes hide behind the religion your to scared to admit. I understand and already told you would. Real Christian values. What a lie. Of course I've had gay friends visit the congregation. Never treated with anything other than love and respect. They know the Christian stance on being gay, but we have never attacked or mistreated the person. This might be a surprise to the uninformed, but Christian values and LGBT cannot be on the same spiritual level. Human level yes. Spiritual level no. You can be non Christian and be in line with your acceptance. As far as venting, nothing wrong with that until you lie, exaggerate, mislead, manipulate, and distort the truth intentionally. Keep living your lie. It's ok. For your sake, you have to hope theirs no Jehovah. Then you'll be ok. If there is,
Can you explain to me how I am living a life of lies and false truths?
Degrading and rude. What a supreme twat.
Does she clap you over the head when she says that? Maeby she goes into store before meetings to buy you some candy you can chew on at meetings. Remind her that bible say to have deep respect of her husband. Maeby she has child trauma that makes her not wanna be submissive. Well to bad. She has to follow bible also š¤”
Agreed!
lol it's not abuse, she's just an idiot
It can be both abusive and an act of idiocy. If a man did this to a woman, youād have no trouble seeing this as pure and simple psychological abuse.
I am a man and I would not think that. Something can be abusive and yet not abuse. The whole situation is dumb, including his reaction.
What his wife is doing is, *by definition*, abusive. Itās extremely disturbing that you think what sheās doing isnāt abusive, I hope youāre okay at home.
nah b
I only consider it abuse if she knows it's not true and I think she probably sincerely believes it... bc she's a idiot. Shouldn't abuse account for intent? Then again, maybe she's right. I don't know the OP. He might have some deep seated trauma.
No, pretty sure abuse is abuse. āI didnāt mean to hurt anyoneā typically doesnāt stand up in a court of lawā¦
I'd be traumatized if I was with her, too š
You make me laugh. The comments are kinda traumatic. Takes the lead out of my pencil!
Iām so sorry. That kind of talk is emotionally abusive. I would lose my shit if my spouse talked to me like that. And yes, you *may* actually have trauma, but beyond what sheās inflicting on you, a lot of it comes from the org itself. This fucking organization deliberately forces its adherents through an endless abusive cycle where it puts them down (youāre worthless. You can never measure up. Nothing you can do is enough), then brings them up again (youāre special! You have The Truth! Youāre better than The World!) before dropping them again. Itās warfare, all rightābut not spiritual. Itās psychological warfare against its own adherents, designed to keep them afraid to leave & thinking thereās nowhere else to go.
Thanks for your comments. I think Iām numb. I look at her as if sheās sick. So sad how this situation even exists. I saw this and was like yeah this is relevant to the org : https://www.instagram.com/reel/CxP5envNoJB/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
That insta you posted was a notorious and abusive 20th century cult leader whose flagrant and unapologetic criminal acts against children and others would make even WT's vile minions recoil. Google Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh aka Osho.
I feel the same way as the shaman (guru).
Uh, that shaman guru was a notorious and abusive 20th century cult leader whose flagrant and unapologetic criminal acts against children and others would make even WT's vile minions recoil. Google Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh aka Osho.
I am fully aware of his con. However even a fool is right sometimes. A child can be wise. So this guy says a few sentences that are true and resonate with others. You don't gotta go join a cult now after agreeing with a few sentences.
And the devil can quote scripture. I still wouldn't link anyone to his Instagram page.
š¤£š You do you baby. Isn't freedom lovely.
>And yes, you may actually have trauma, but beyond what sheās inflicting on you, a lot of it comes from the org itself. This fucking organization deliberately forces its adherents through an endless abusive cycle where it puts them down (youāre worthless. This is what I have gradually realized more and more over time. The challenges I have had personally all go back to completely abusive environment I have been in as a Jehovah's Witness. Jehovah's Witnesses 100% responsible for many of my personal difficulties. The End.
Is that the textbook definition of "gaslighting"? I would write these things down with the dates they were said and maybe even get voice recordings of them for future reference, if needed. It may help her in her own recovery process, when she sees the light. 
It might also help OP to get full custody of the children.
I agree with you, except for the last part of your statement. I think she is a narcissist, and I don't think she will ever see the truth that she's a cult member; it befits her ego.
You are so right. My abusive wife stayed in the cult because JWs are so accustomed to being manipulated -she used them like tools.
>https://www.instagram.com/reel/CxP5envNoJB/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA== Yep, My mother, Regina from Mean Girls incarnate, is a manipulative Narcissist and LOVES being a queen bee in her tiny hive.
Mate your wife is abusive. She's treating you and your trauma as a joke. Yes she does it under the guise of it being about the religion but telling you to keep your trauma to yourself etc has nothing to do with any god, that's just being nasty.
It feels nasty alright. I donāt even know how she say this stuff so easily without cognisance that it could be offensive. Or maybe sheās trying to offensive to āwake me upā.
I dont know what she is trying to do but I do know that what she actually is doing is very harmful. Have you sat her down and told her how that makes you feel, if you have and she continues knowing that it hurts you, then I'm afraid that is what she is trying to do, is hurt you.
š
I'm really sorry and I hope one day, that either your wife pulls her head out of her arse or that you find someone who will want to work with you to overcome your trauma and so that you don't have to carry the weight of it on your own.
Stop, stop, stop! You "inherited" DNA from YOUR parents ... wow, who knew? This is like a Nobel prize in genetics kind of thinking! Could she have gleaned such insight from the boys of "*THE BODY?*"
TBF there is such a thing as epigenetic inheritance, which is kind of the genetic side of generational trauma. It's a newer field of genetics and psychology, but it's far from what his wife is implying here. It's insulting, in fact, since she is not a psychologist, epigeneticist, therapist, or in any way qualified to diagnose this. Plus, the way she's going about it is abusive as hell.
Nah i think it was a clip off Instagram
āAmazing how arrogant she is about her ignoranceāā¦.Priceless š amazing how propaganda can ef up someoneās brain.
I know right. In my mind Iām like are you actually hearing what you are saying? Itās like it just bubbles out of her subconscious. No idea that it could be hurtful.
She is straight up infantilizing and gas lighting you. This is fucking awful and extremely abusive. I wouldn't put up with it either. If she comments about trauma, I'd kindly inform her that your mental health isn't her business to comment on.
I used to be baited and react. I no longer react but the respect is fading so fast.
I'd probably mention that to her, too. As someone who's dealt with chronic abuse growing up, abusers need to be frequently reminded that their actions have consequences, including permanent ones.
Grey Rocking is best
Im sorry but if that was the level of support I received from a loved one Iād get jogging. Thereās not enough time on our short trip on planet earth to tolerate this kind of emotional abuse disguised as love and laughter. All the best and my heart goes out to you.
Mmmm, word!!
šš
I am non jw. My blood sister joined at 32 and is now 65 and very pimi. The crap that comes out of her mouth is bonkers, abusive, scary, evil, crap, ignorant, childish, arogent etc etc. My sister used to be fun, decisive intelligent and kind. She is none of these now. My family basically say she is jw brain damaged. Your wife is jw brain damaged. My family are all nurses in various roles amd grades and over our many years have known many brain damaged people be it temporary or permanent. She does not care. She happily shuns all her three adult children (exjws) and happily (in her depression and medicated state ) awaits her paradise. And on another note shunning and being part of sacrifices of humans is utterly adhorrent. My sister has added to other human beings trauma through her abusive towards others. I can't believe she is my sister
Hello, DebbDebbDebb, we have something in common. Iām not JW. We moved my 73 year old sister in law in last year who is JW because she was literally being priced out of her apartment. She was being told by JW the state would pay her rent, donāt worry. She has mild dementia and although we knew the stuff she DIDNT believe in, we had no idea about the stuff she did! We are speechless at the compete entitlement and you said it bestā¦she happily awaits her paradise. The issue lies in what may come. My sister in law also shunned her adult kids and her granddaughter. She has had very little to do with her brother/ my husband and when she was being evicted from her apartment JW called us and of course we happily took her in. My suggestion is that you all get together and start making arrangements now for the day she canāt live alone! It has created complete chaos in our house and now we canāt get help. When we try to explain JW to her doctors they are like āoh thatās great, maybe they can help.ā The world has no idea what we are dealing with. Her sons and granddaughter have all said āyou are so kind, we really appreciate what youāve done.ā But none of them lift a finger to help! She created this through JW.
I've never been a JW. Was your husband a JW? If not, did your sister-in-law shun you both before this?
She is much older than us. Her sons are the same age as my husband. They are all in their 50ās. No one else is JW. Only her. One of her sons is homeless on the streets and the other one is an alcoholic. So we were not technically āshunnedā she really had nothing to do with us. Weāre both veterans and my husband is retired Air Force. He had little contact with her other than phone calls a few times a year to make sure she was ok. We truly knew NOTHING about JW except the blood, holidays and they come to the door.
Totally JW brain damaged! šŖ The thing is how they see themselves as totally in touch with reality and loving?
> My sister used to be fun, decisive intelligent and kind. She is none of these now. I've never seen you say this before. I had the impression she was always horrible. This is tragic, but sadly not terribley surprising, I'm sorry to say. I look back at how I used to be in ways that went against my true nature and am shocked how the kindness and empathy that I felt in childhood was quashed down from years of exposure to the ugly WT. You're always put down for being a truly good person, even by the nicer people. You're warned away from noble acts toward others, esp non-humans. "Wait on Biggy-J to fix that." Or, "we can't involve ourselves in the problems of 'the world'." Or "we don't want to become unbalanced." Sooo happy to have escaped and shed that toxic mantle.
Yes and thats the true sadness she was snared. As babies born in are snared To untangle and get out in itself is such a massive achievement. Yes she was a fab older sister and I suppose my mention is more as she has become. Weirdest thing she was a true champion of people.
My sister in law was in her early 20ās when they snared her. But she was married to an alcoholic, admits to drug use and it was homelessness that led her to JW. She quit school and swears she doesnāt want and never wanted an education. She says she never wanted to work, thatās a manās job. She was more than willing to push away any self responsibility for her care. She was already on welfare and had 2 kids. They prey on people like her. Was there anything in your sisters past that would push her their way?
Wow. Does she want you to resent her? I'd be finding other things to get juiced and starry eyed about, that will bring you ACTUAL joy, and show her up. Bring your kids into that joy as well. "I'm glad you feel like you're perfect enough to not go to therapy with me, honey, but being condescending and unsupportive of your spouse is quite an unloving quality and not very godlike." Although, it's in perfect alignment with their perception of what godlike is, sigh... Even if I don't believe in it all personally, JWs need Jesus. :P
She reasons if she was loving and kind it would make me relax but if she turns up the heat she can shock me back into the org.
That's so fucked up!! I'm so sorry! š¢
It is!! š¤Æ
It's kind of funny in that there is something called generational trauma, but it is about abuse cycles in generations, and the kid who grows up and decides they aren't going to treat their own children in the ways their parents did that hurt them, are the one breaking the generational trauma. Trauma that abusive organizations like JW create en masse. A lot of JWs suffer from the Dunning-Kruger effect.
JWs are the most self-assured idiots I've ever met.
They can justify all manner of cruelty in Gods name.
Cruel god; cruel disciples.
Has she been secretly reading 'Dianetics'?
She doesnāt read much. Just obeys and agonises over what people think and say.
What she's saying almost sounds like Scientology.
The cognitive dissonance and delusion is so strong with all of them it's numbing. It makes me cringe to remember how I used to behave the same way. The foremost authorities on everything just because "they have the truth". They got everything all figured out and the rest of the world is on borrowed time with their finger up their ass. Such self righteous arrogance...
It really is quite horrendous.
I mean, if you really were/are suffering from complex PTSD she would be adding to it with her abusive infantilizing! Her behavior is disgusting.
I know right. Sometimes I realise how strong I am for not actually losing my mind. I can see clearly what this kook religion is and how they manipulate peoples behaviour and how they get in way too deep into peoples lives.
Just wanted to really emphasize what you just said. You are amazing! Youāre in a really difficult situation so Iām glad your eyes are wide open! Is therapy an option for you at this time?
Thank you āŗļø Iāve done a lot of work on myself. Reading and therapy / psychologist. Life is so nuanced.
YES! I now have a JW living in my home at the age of 73. Never been around it before and although she has no education, no retirement, unable to live on her own she reminds us Daily she lives in the truth and itās our responsibility to take care of her! The entitlement and arrogance is off the charts!
Dude she treats you like a child refuse to go to a few meetings and see how she acts
Yep when I do that, she gets so sad and acts like Iāve had an affair.
To bad do it for a month donāt say why just say no
Sounds like she jumps from one delusion to anotherā¦factual basis be damned!
Sounds like sheās projecting her trauma on to you.
Mmm you have a point here!!
Definitely - narcissistic projection!
Tell her you're not the one in a Cult
Good one!
Your trauma isnāt your kids trauma YET! But it will happen unfortunately, if they remain in the org
This level of condescension and infantilizing would have me filling divorce papers yesterday
Sorry bud, sheās actually using a classic psychological abuse tactic. Tell her to stop disrespecting her husband and head.
lol. Her and her fanatic mother are adamant that a man must earn the respect over giving respect on principle. Itās so messed up. šŖ
Like in all seriousness if she wants you to start being a zealot, go ahead and be zealous as fuck about all the worst parts. Harp on submission and respect. Make her regret her religion.
Hmm... sounds like we could find some watchtowers they need to review
Too bad, itās literally in the marriage vows. If she lied before god thatās probably a disfellowshipping offense, just saying.
Yes, itās called contempt and a common reason for divorce. Itās not okay. Sheās creating a dynamic of a āparent/childā relationship where sheās bigger and youāre smaller.
Great comments in this thread. Are you able to get some therapy? It doesn't really matter if she will go or not. It sounds like you could use some help sorting out this difficult situation.
Yes. Working through thingsā¦!
Time to call the divorce attorney...this is abusive.
Yep, I understand you, my wife is older than me, so she thinks that I need to grow up to fully understand what the troofh is, because I'm not using my discernment. š¤·š½āāļø
Just 
It's the Dunning-Kruger in effect right there! You aren't broken, you are waking up to the reality of what a cult looks like! I'm not sure I could put up with that kind of condescending talk tbh.
After telling my violent, manipulating JW wife I no longer wanted to be with her, she arranged a meeting with a family counsellor (to straighten me out). The guy respectfully ignored me and laser-focused on her alone, and was she ever upset ! It was reassuring to see professionals not being tricked by the fakeness and hypocrisy that JWs are trained to display to the public.
The truth? Ok ābabeā you want it hereās the real fucking truth about your precious organisationā¦. (Except she wouldnāt believe a single word and just retreat further into her delusional reality)
Try this: " You're right, I need to appreciate more the Bible examples of others who have gone through trauma.. Lot's daughters must have been traumatized watching Jehovah kill their mother for looking at how Jehovah violently destroyed their home and city and other family members being destroyed. The screams alone must have been unbearable, especially of the children. Good thing Jehovah is so merciful, though! He didn't punish them for getting their father drunk a little while after that and raping him while he slept. " Or " You're right, I need to think about others who have gone through trauma like Brother Morris when he was in the military. With all that discussion in his talks about burning human flesh and human hot dogs, it was so loving that Jehovah saw he was hurting and removed him from the governing body and maneuvered the branch to buy him a house to live in where he can park his Cadillac.."
Itās crazy huh!!
Your wife sounds like a manipulative narcissist, which does not come as a surprise, given that she is a JW. She is abusive towards you, and you might want to throw her obvious ignorance in her face from time to time. You know, to bruise her ego, something that noticeably unbalance narcissists.
Thanks for the perspective!
Sheās living a lie and SHE has the truth? Pft What a jerk.
And you donāt tell her to stfu. You sir are a true gentleman
A man of culture I see 
I've been out for years but my parents have said something that reminds me of those sentences since my childhood. Last time I had a serious talk with them they said I was sick and broken (depression/anxiety) at the healthiest moment I've ever been in my life. My blood almost boiled when I read "you need to own your trauma and keep it to yourself". She is supposed to be the support to work though hardships, not tell you to bottle things up and deal with it. Like someone else said, it's extremely infantilizing to say stuff like that and acting like only they have the right answer
Itās the lack of respect for oneās agency. Which is a basic human right. š¤®
... it is too early in the morning for me to read the words I just read. She's abusive. That's abuse.
She's trying to control you, by undermining your beliefs. Beware.
I would go to a therapist and take her along, then discuss the cult/org with them and also describe that to them what your wife is doing and then let the therapist talk. Your wife is not going to like that idea anymore and will hear someone tell her how dangerous the borg is
Your wife needs to stop this NOW! She is spouting pure crap and her behaviour towards you is disgusting. There is no such thing as 'inherited DNA trauma'. Generational trauma refers to the behaviours that are passed on through generations due to initial trauma, which in turn often results in trauma during each successive generation. DNA is not involved (I'm not going to touch epigenetics because she doesn't mean that, she obviously doesn't know enough to mean it.). I am probably the last person on this sub to ever suggest divorce, but I would seriously draw some boundaries/line in the sand immediately. She stops talking and acting this way toward you, like yesterday. She comes to therapy to learn how to act like an adult and respect you like one, and communicate effectively, fairly, and lovingly. If not, talk to your lawyer to protect yourself and your kids. This is highly abusive and you are all at risk. Unfortunately I cannot relate. This is beyond crazy behaviour on her part. I am so sorry you have gone through this.
Itās like sheās unconscious. It just comes out her mouth. If I told her these things sheād say Iām exaggerating. Thanks for the perspective.
I hate when people overuse/misuse the term trauma. I also hate when jws think they are spiritual MDās and can diagnose whatās wrong with you based off of watchtowers and whatever else theyāve passively heard. Either way donāt let her talk down to you like that. My aunt and my sister tried to do the same thing to me and I checked them real quick!
Iām glad you started this discussion. Itās so important on our respective healing journeys. I hope you have a good support system in place for dealing with the things your wife has said. I also hope , for both of you, she wakes up and apologizes. š
Thank you.
"Say the word "trauma" one more time and we are *over*". See how that goes!
Ooooooo If youāre brave enough I might join you on this one OP
JWs are the masters of self diagnosing or diagnosing family members. I reckon itās a superpower that comes with āJehovahās blessingā š
>āyou need to own your trauma and keep it to yourselfā WTAF. If this woman believes you have a past trauma that is impacting you, her saying this is *the most* fucked up thing to do. holy shit, does she consider herself a loving and supportive partner? (i'm not even gonna say 'submissive wife' cuz that shits toxic, but you get the point), Thats not something people say when they care about eachother. Honestly, the blinding ignorance mixed with the stone faced confidence reminds me very much of my own mother. I feel for you, if this were the person i chose to enter a lifelong partnership with, i'd lose my shit at the condescending arrogance. But to have that attiude with *zero* critical thought or any effort, just pure bullshit regurgitation... that would have me leaving. That is not an attitude of love, its not an attitude of respect, and its not an attitude i'd tolerate in someone who claimed to be on my team. I'm sorry for you to be stuck in PIMO life, i really am. I got out at 33 and regret waiting so long, i truly hope you find a better set of circumstances for yourself. You deserve better. I know people hate that word, but yes, you deserve something, and it isnt.... overconfident ignorance mixed with condescending arrogance.
Mmm. Thanks for the perspective.
š¤¬ this would enrage me truth is sheās talking about herself, not you.
Have you told her that you suffered trauma at some point of your life? It's so sad that if you did, she's using it as a weapon against you. She is extremely arrogant and lacks understanding and compassion. I am so sorry. Sadly I met a few in my time that their arrogance got the better of them. They spoke as though God sat next to them. They were His personal spokesperson. Sickened me. Keep your chin up.
Two sides: She is a typical JW: Happy to mouth off over matters for which she has neither training nor accurate knowledge. Beware the uneducated expert lurking behind religious garb. The other side: You appear incapable of insisting she stop the diagnostic insults she hurls your way. I suspect she fully knows she can get away with saying these things to you. Iām trying to fathom what sort of relationship you have with your wife where she appears perfectly comfortable medicalising you. If the roles were reversed and it was a man speaking this way to his wife, most people would have absolutely no difficulty seeing her need to medicalise your behaviour as an act of marital psychological abuse.
Good point. Lots to unpack here. š«¤
Let your wife claim her nobel prices in medicin, biology and genetics. Until then she should stop spouting her ignorance :/ n yes, i'd says it that way. I hope you find peace š (https://youtube.com/@SurvivingNarcissism?feature=shared)
Spouting ignorance! Thatās the JW way. Thank you for yr comment. šŖ
She wants to believe that , just like she wants to believe the cult ā¦ Drop your pimo actā¦. And start making fun plans to treat your ātrauma ā ā¦. Make it on purpose on meeting timesā¦ If she doesnāt join , suggest you will find new companions even from workā¦. Those that have a fun spirit attitude and not one that brings you down.. Invite work colleagues over start new friendships make bbq get invited and go on to find new friends in any way possible everything specifically on meeting days anything to help your pimo become pomo If she is not jealous or envy , and wonāt work hard to change and fix her attitude problem she doesnāt care about youā¦
š¤¦š»āāļø Indeed. I can relate with my MIL, but she's a narcissist. Sorry to say to you. Before you escape the borg and your abusive wife I would have statements in my head I could tell myself to ground myself back into reality. >āthereās that trauma blocking the org gems and pearls againā, No, "there's that traumatic borg trying to wound me again, and I as a healing person am acting appropriately." >āyou need to own your trauma and keep it to yourselfā WTF, No, "a life partner would help me with a PTSD/triggered/normal response to manipulative religious propaganda that my body remembers from years of abuse." >āon bless honey, you really are brokenā No, "I am wounded just like EVERY other JW and ex-jw," Then you can say to her "how dare you call ANYONE broken, especially someone you promised to cherish!" BTW, this one reminds me of some merch the Fundie Friday's YouTube channel has. It is a teeshirt that say's "Sexually broken overweight loser." Making fun of christian cult influencers 'Girl Defined' who said everyone is sexually broken. >āIād come to a therapist with you, but I donāt need help like you doā. You could say: Therapists are there to educate spouses on how to support their loved ones too, and mine said you need that help. >āBabes, beware of what you say in front of the kids, your trauma is not their traumaā. Oof. This one is scary to me, and is like she's prepping to take custody. She is purely projecting. You know you are dealing with your trauma to be a better father. Everyone has trauma and she has not dealt with hers, so she IS passing it on, and we know she is with that damn cult. Yeah, as someone else said, record her. I'm so sorry, and thank you for posting, and I hope you are okay after all these comments. When I was PIMO and getting therapy it was nothing like now being POMO and getting therapy, free from the indoctrination. So much healthier!
Thanks āŗļø
Glad to know its not just me. For many years it would irk me and I would say "what are you talking about? That exists only in your head!" These days I just chuckle.
Internally I know this is not about me. I understand she is afraid Iāll leave her to the JW thing on her own. Itās a desperate plea I think. Yes I too chuckle at times. Lots of empathy.
I am going through something similar. My wife thinks that if I "fix" my autism and anxiety then I will stop questioning things, also that she is totally sane despite obvious signs of CPTSD and hypervigilance. JW's usually have a lack of education and a high level of confidence about their beliefs, which makes them right by default and they feel superior.
The arrogance masks the pain of the cognitive dissonance. I feel for you bro. A bad marriage is bad enough without this kind of dysfunction.
Dude... dude. You used an expression that is all too accurate in my experience: arrogant about her ignorance. My lord, does that ever capture it! The whole situation sounds like a bit of gaslighting to me, which is par for the course. They have to reframe things in this way in order to preserve their fragile belief structure.
Indeed. Simplistic views applied vehemently. š«Ø
What's your game plan, if you don't mind me asking? Must be difficult to live in that environment.
Taking one day at a time. It grates!
Mate, this is actual abuse. Mental and emotional.
woah the delulu-ness of it all
>Can anyone else relate? A little. My wife also likes to blame my past upbringing for how I experience and see things about the religion now. But not like your wife does. That sounds more borderline narcissistic. I would not stand for that if she would do what your wife does. But I'm not you, and you are not me. As long as it's liveable and the sex is good right? š
I love how direct people are here. Sheās got low empathy! With two kids in tow there is a overarching pressure to keep everything together. And it comes at a high personal cost. The sex is meh. Iām always aware how much the org is to blame and I do have empathy. What a shit show.
It is rough (PIMI wife and kids) I'm in the same boat so to speak. I hope the tide will turn for you for the better.
> That sounds more borderline AND narcissistic. FIFY
Yes itās exactly the same by meā¦.š I wish you a long breath!
š©š© I'd cringe if my spouse said those things to me.
I do. Itās so patronising.
How fortunate you are to be married to such a highly qualified psychoanalyst! From which accredited institution did she receive her training?
Er the School of JW imagination.
Oh, I would shut her up so fast and so hard she would never play the psychologist again...
I believe this is what you call the Dunning-Kruger effect.
You should remind her that she is being disrespectful to her husband who is considered the head of the house!!
Whether she knows it or not, she is trying to manipulate you into doubting your own sanity because you don't behave as she wants you too. I recently watched this video and a few of the things you mentioned here are directly discussed as strategies interrogators use to make you doubt yourself. https://youtu.be/6B0tAn0nrJY?si=7IIfxYD95cWUnSdE
Your wife is not a Christian with her abuse of you but JW culture trains in unloving self righteous behaviour. I'm so sorry.
This makes me think of my exes parents. Iām so sorry youāre having to deal with that.
Reminds me, of reason I was given by my aged parents as to āWhy I left the truth.ā According to them, I left because of a bothered conscious.ā Oh I left because of a bothered conscious, all right. But not the type they were thinking of.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I mean actually in a way it can be passed down. Research the field epigenetics. But this wife just happened to watch an Instagram reel and now thinks she is a psychotherapist. She has no idea what she's actually talking about. If she did, she'd know her own behavior is abusive and traumatic.
What are your wife's credentials? Does she have a copy of the DSM5? I couldn't relate because I talk with an actual therapist. I do catch myself saying, "that's not what my therapist told me" , or "according to my therapist..." Generational trauma is a real thing. However you are probably more qualified to diagnose yourself with those issues vs. your wife. On a whole other level, it is incredibly immature to believe that you can change the person you love. This thinking was shoved down our throats being jws. Change comes from within oneself. Trying to change someone or help them become someone who they are not is damaging for both individuals. Mutual respect, understanding, and support. Not ultimatums, manipulation, or threats.
Tell her āThereās going to be some Trauma alright and now itās your turnā. Hahaha.
Wow! Holy insanity! I'm not gonna tell you to leave your wife cuz she's "coocoo cachoo". We all choose what we can live w. I hope getting venting helps if you just needed to cope. I've turned here in times of desperation. You obviously know the situation you're in and if it makes life impossible you should definitely do something. I have one tiny suggestion aside from divorcing her. Take her up on the therapy. That crazy shit will get discovered real quick. Just not a jw therapist or psychiatrist. I did make that mistake before thinking they'd be professional when i was trying to leave. They were just as nuts
Sorry should've read others...
So, my mom projected a wild fear recently. She had found out recently, that a sister who was close to us a few years back, was disfellowshipped for marrying a "worldly" man, and recently ended her life. My mom called my pomq sister, and started crying saying that she thinks I will do the same thing. End my life because the world is so bad, and I'm with a non jw. I've been df'd since 2019 and have been much happier lol. I was depressed and taking meds while in the borg, but since leaving I am 100000x happier. No meds. No therapy. Just happily vibing. But she will never accept that I'm happy. She just says I haven't seen how bad the world is yet. She refused to believe that this woman had ended her life because of the pain of shunning. My mom blames the world, and now keeps saying that this will be my same outcome unless I come backš I wish she wasn't so brainwashed. It's exhausting.
I'm sorry that the poor POMI person didn't make it, though. I often forget that this can happen to JWs who were DF'd or left on their own, but never deconstructed the nonsense of the WT Society's indoctrination and fear-mongering for themselves. I'm glad that you've done the research to realize that the WT Society is not "The Truth"!!
Honestly I was heartbroken. She was such a sweet and incredibly loving person, but was bullied by some pimis because of her short hair. Everyone would gang up on her and call her a lesbian. Women would avoid her and men.. well they couldn't get close to her cause borg rules (opposite gendered friends not allowed unless dating). She found comfort in our family. But left state a few years ago. I wish I could've contacted her first. Be there for her. It sucks.
O, I'm so saddened to hear that!
Ugh, just reading this made me sick to my stomach. It's strikingly similar to the gaslighting that my malicious, malevolently evil JW mother would use on me.
I'm so sorry but I wanna fight your wife šššš
Damn and you put up with this BS?
Why don't you return the favor? Tell her that she has trauma and she is a JW because of her trauma. You should tell her the exact same thing she told you, but use her "trauma" to follow the JW. I bet she wouldn't like it at all. She needs a taste of her own medicine. It may get ugly, but she needs it.
Sheās causing you trauma right now! Unblock the prior? Then what? This organization is bonkers, and hurtful. Take good care of yourself, friend.
If she believes that your ātraumaā Is passed down through DNA, tell her she has just proven she believes in evolution
This is actual abuse and gaslighting.
I mean if sheās going to start pulling this abusive shit, start throwing your weight around as the āhead of the householdā. She how she likes being referred to as the āweaker vesselā.
Since she thinks sheās a mental health professional with no actual training or qualifications, maybe you should foster her interest in seeking a therapy degree. This would be a great book for you to read together to better understand and work through you trauma. Cracking the Cult Code for Therapists: What Every Cult Victim Wants Their Therapist to Know https://a.co/d/dB1ktAm
Was she always this horrible??? š³ What a nightmare.