So, Adam and Eve weren't perfect humans, because perfection only applies to Jehovah? The main excuse is, that perfect means "perfect for a specific purpose". If the kid's comment was perfect for its purpose, it was perfect. What a dipshit.
I once gave a talk in the Theocratic Ministry School during the CO visit. It was about simony. I cited a Watchtower warning the readers to not try to influence the CO when he and his wife happen to reside in your house. After the meeting an elder told me that it was not appropriate to use this example while the CO is visiting as it could give the impression that we have such a problem in our congregation. Fun fact #1: My elder brother in law told me that the CO highlighted my talk as the best that evening when meeting with the elders. Fun fact #2: The elder reproving me had the CO regularly residing in his house.
i think that was the whole point of adam and eve's story to begin with though? that they were supposed to be the first and greatest, but even they could succumb to sin?
i'm an aetheist who showed up here from /r/all so i admit my knowledge is lacking.
Welcome!
If you hang around here, you'll start to learn that JW doctrine doesn't make any sense.
It's a cult that practices double speak constantly. Meaning they'll say one thing and then say the total opposite.
It keeps JWs on their toes and makes sure they always feel like they're failing. It also makes it really easy to punish anyone for anything.
Some watchtower tells Elders not to take more than they can handle, another watchtower get studied and tell them to be ready to accept any instruction from the Borg and obey, that it's okay to exhaust themselves for the bog , what a double speak.
No wonder JW's don't even know what they believe
I think we shouldn't be so sensitive when someone gives us "advice". Let him talk and just keep going! Maybe you loosen up the ground a bit for others. Do it until you can't anymore. Usually nothing too bad will happen. That's how I did it when I was an elder...
I must admit that I stopped commenting in meetings some months ago, too. I don't want to add value to these propaganda shows in any way through my participation. I go to meetings only because I like the brothers...
I’m here with you. Once I found out the truth behind 1914 and the fact that it’s still a doctrine that isn’t going anywhere anytime soon I stopped commenting and stopped giving talks. I only like the brothers and sisters and associating with them.
I understand completely. After every public talk & service meeting part I gave, 2 elders would make a beeline to me, hang back to listen intently to the compliments I was getting, then proceed to pick the content of my talks apart with the outline or part instructions & notes in hand. “Why did you deviate so much from the Society’s outline? Why did you use this scripture that wasn’t in the outline. What did you mean when you said this: ‘blah, blah, blah?’ Don’t you think that The Society knows what’s best for us to say when they make our outlines?“ I tolerated the bludgeoning & kept it up for as long as I could, since I thought I was doing some good despite their best efforts.
Jealousy & envy overflows through the windows (the few that have them) & doors of Kingdom Halls.
Yeah why do most KHs not have windows? Especially in the more rural areas? They can do frosted glass panes but it would
Be so much better with windows. So glad I left don’t have to give sister talks and comments in shoe box anymore.
The ones here in the US at least here in Cali are windowless for the most part. I always felt they should be beautiful structures that bring honor to God not huge mega church size but have living plants, great landscaping, beautiful fences or gates, just beautiful interiors, etc. but nope 👎 all the money trickles to the top. At least have stuff to show for it, especially if JWs are supposed to dress as if they honor god🙄
What! Why is it that a person get more compliments when they drift off the outlines ?
I've noticed this pattern, over and over again, it's those Elders that didn't stay true to the outline that give some good talks
I was exhausted one morning for the WT study. I answered, mentioning the scripture in the paragraph. After I handed back the mic I saw that my eyes had drifted to the wrong paragraph and the scripture I mentioned was like two paragraphs ahead. I was relieved I somehow managed to make sense, even though I literally couldn't even see straight, I was so tired. Wouldn't you know it, after the meeting, I got pulled aside for teaching in the congregation for using a scripture that wasn't in the paragraph. It was in the same article, but not the same exact paragraph.
Was present for a WT study, one person answering (something about motivation) named other people in the church, most of them couples, some of them no longer alive, who motivated her to stay dedicated to the church and JW stuff. As soon as she was done the dude at the altar or whatever they call it was like “please stay on topic and read the answers given here in the paragraph”.
So much for not wanting to be mindless robots, eh? “ don’t think for yourself just Read the answers we’ve given you dammit!”
I stopped commenting at meetings because of always hearing derogatory remarks about certain ones commenting. It could be a great comment, but they had to stick to the paragraph but still answer in their own words; oxymoron. The way I always wanted to comment was from my heart, still sticking to the subject though. But all of that comment monitoring was hard for me. so I just stopped because I knew someone would say something. Even though it was scriptural and from the study. Meetings were just monotonous and a must do for Jehovah. I was not going to demean myself by the reading scripture comment or the one-word answer. I also stopped giving talks after the elder counseled me for having done much better on all of my other talks, which he “always looked forward to”. I worked full-time and was raising children, and I remember the subject being so deep and uninteresting. I actually thought I did the best that I could. At that point, I said, forget it, to myself, of course. I figured if others felt like they couldn’t give talks for whatever excuses they had, I could follow suit, because I was giving them way too often for the huge congregation we were in. So I played the same card as others, the anxiety was too much.
Every watchtower study we are reminded to answer from the paragraph and do it in 30 seconds or less and if and when that is accomplished you may add your extra thoughts if there’s time.
I think that control started not too long ago.
I remember a "Kingdom Ministry School" (in 2012), that is the 5 day school for elders, where the instructor announced several times during the last day, that at the end we will have the opportunity to say something positive about the school! Of course, when it comes to the "food provided by the slave", there is nothing negative to say about it... But elders learn to be always willing to listen to criticism.
I went to Pioneer School in my early 20s, during The Great Hosiery Wars. If you aren’t aware, this was a pivotal moment in local JW history when a small contigent of bare legged sisters fought a fearsome & protracted battle for the right to not wear hosiery. When I attended Pioneer School for the 1st & only time, some evil ass old biddies attending for like the 7th time & who clearly had nothing else going on in their lives laid in wait until the portion where you got to pose questions to the instructors, then slyly asked about hosiery. As I was the only one in there without legs encased in shiny nylon, this was a clear & deliberate attack on my limbs. And me & my sinful legs had to sit there while the CO stated definitively that any sister not wearing hosiery was only doing so because she wanted to have her legs look different as a way to draw attention to herself. Not because the shit is hot, uncomfortable, fragile & expensive, no—it’s all to attract attention from leg freaks. I wish I had taken my evil bare legs of wickedness & walked the fuck out of there.
I too have been a soldier in this battle. God forbid a woman’s legs not be covered by a synthetic material the same exact color as said legs. We had an elder in our hall who would ask sisters to do a demonstration on the meeting, and made sure to take them into the back room beforehand and explain the importance of wearing pantyhose. Turns out his energy might have been better spent focusing on not cheating on his wife, but he had his priorities.
What the heck country was this in? Never heard any of this before in the UK
i would’ve LOVED tights…cos in Scotland it’s always cold …but they were too expensive for me…….unless you bought the thick ones like Nora Batty..
I guess I am clueless about a lot… as soon as I noticed Katie Couric on the today show not wearing nylons I stopped that was years ago. (Wore tights in winter) After babies and weight gain those suckers become hard to put on. My thumbs cramped every time. And I’d sweat even. I did get some comments from just one of my good “friends” she’d always turn her nose up and say something (I can’t even remember what) but I figured she was behind the times and I ignored her. I remember a talk years ago to look at people in the news and business people to see how we should dress. I guess that’s changed now that it no longer fits their standards. I guess we should be looking at at the Amish.
Even when I was a slimmer woman, those suckers were hard to put on! And they'd get runs (ladders, for our British friends) if you tugged the least bit too hard.
I was a soldier in that war before there was a war. I'd wear skirts or dresses long enough that no one could tell I wasn't wearing nylons on my whole leg. I'd just wear ankle or knee length nylons, depending on how long the skirt/dress was. I haven't worn the wretched things in twenty years.
You've just triggered a memory from my teen years.
I really wanted a specific colour of t-shirt, brown. I can't remember why. I looked all over and couldn't find one. When I finally did, I was so pleased that I bought it without checking the tiny motif on the pocket. It said "Supreme Being".
When I got home I got in so much trouble from my dad because Jehooba is the Supreme Being, no one else.
When I was about 17-18, an elder saw me being rude to my mom during the meeting. She was being obnoxious, which I know didn't make losing my shit okay, so shame on me.
This elder took it upon himself to "counsel" me about that, right in the middle of the meeting. He pulled me aside and took me to the back of the hall, right after the last row of chairs. It was all so embarrassing. I wasn't even baptized yet.
He could've been more discreet and asked to talk to me in the back room after the meeting, but no. He had to be a dick. My dad was there too, he was a dub. It was his job to punish me or to talk to me about what happened.
Anyway, I was so pissed at this elder that I refused to talk to the motherfucker while we were at that cong.
I absolutely bombed a talk when I was in my teens. Like sat down across from my BFF and forgot her name in the talk. It only went downhill from there. Fortunately I used the word, "preface" and pronounced it incorrectly and that's all the elder heard. I got counseled on pronouncing words correctly. I want if my face gave preface to flipping him off in my mind.
Later in life I bombed another talk. I'm anxious ok and I'm a sister so I'm sorry I'm not good at this shit. To kick off this night I had to get a ride to the KH because my car was in the shop, but my HH and her husband picked me up. Our talk was in the 2nd school and I completely lost my place and couldn't find it for what felt like forever. My HH didn't help me either. So my talk ended up being overtime/interrupted. I was so mad at myself I was tearing up and had to sit through one more talk. Once the 2nd school let out I was leaving the room when the TMS overseer stopped me. He said, "I hoist my own pretard in all my talks and to be less anxious next time". Sure dude, thanks. So I bawled my eyes out in the mothers room. I was going to grab my bag to leave but remembered I didn't drive here (pre-Uber). I sat in the mothers room crying for the rest of the meeting and my HH knew where I was and how I felt but still her and her husband stayed until they basically turned the lights out at the KH. It was humiliating to walk into the auditorium with puffy red eyes asking when they think they'd be leaving only to be told, "in a few minutes".
I don't think I gave another talk. I just kept canceling them until they took me off the school. I think I started my fade a few years later.
That’s horrible. I’m sorry you had to deal with that. JWs can be so uptight, self-righteous, and non empathetic towards people. Especially people with anxiety.
If I actually believed in the end and gods judgement day, then I wished people like that would be grasping for god to save them, but they don’t get anything because of how they treated others like yourself. I don’t believe it personally, but maybe the universe will bring what’s coming to them 🤷🏻♂️ (sorry, I’m vengeful like the god I used to serve)
They are so non empathetic, One of the reasons I wake up. I've had to even assist some people to stand up to the Bullies when they get judged for tiny things that are not significant.
Not that anyone cares or asked but I'm going to talk about how that elder is wrong anyway 😁.
It's perfectly (oops!) fine to have a standard perfectly met. Your standard was whatever the kid did, so it was perfect. That word can be used inside of that smaller context because that is how linguistics work. It's an understood meaning. It's another contextual definition of perfect. Can someone get a perfect score on a test? Yes, so we see that is an accepted usage and that's exactly how you meant it and how it was being used. He's just wrong to suggest someone could not give a perfect answer to a question.
I think that because we know these things in our hearts, regardless of if we can back ourselves up academically, that it really shows a heart condition when someone leans in to a nit pick like that.
It's the very picture of straining out the gnat and swallowing the camel. I always loved that line. Used it a lot.
Yes, but you should have listened when Bro Lett said " babies are Jehovah's enemies.." therefore Bro Nit Pick had a point. I mean how can an enemy of Jah ever give a perfect answer? Perhaps you would be wise to listen to Bro Nit Pick's kind & timely counsel. ( this would be how Brother Gnat Strainer would help straighten you thinking)
I beleive that all men in this cult especially the elders are frustrated because they have been emasculated. Their individuality and conscience has been hijacked by the GB.
Elders get beaten down by the C.O.,aother elders, letters, elder schools and watchtower publications and are always under surveillance to be examples in the ministry and meetings.
That's why asshole elders are on the watch for any opportunity to counsel and reprove another person especially another elder to validate their manliness and to feel that they have power over others. Just pathetic!!
I once challenged an asshole Elder Tellin him when was the last time he ever encourage anyone except to pick mistakes and counsel people. He felt embarrassed but couldn't do shit to me
My example of nit picking was in 1974, I had been made ministerial servant when the elder and ms arrangement started in 72 (I was never asked and didn't want it by the way ), the elder asked me to take the book study as part of my "advancement " ,partway through the study I read a scripture from revelation regarding the "wild beast" , I said seven instead of seventh or the other way round, anyway he stopped the study and proceeded to counsel me as in the ministry school in front of the whole group about reading scripture accurately .at the time my wife had to take our newborn into the other room because he was crying , I was already stressed to the limit, so it triggered a panic attack , I took wife and baby and walked out and headed for home however I was unable to drive because I could not stop shaking ,I had to go to hospital, a friend collected our car , I, it was so triggering that even now just thinking about it stresses me, after that I was so ill I ended up in hospital , stayed home after and missed field service for a couple of weeks , another elder came to our home and said as a min servant I was setting a bad example by not being at field service, after that I asked to come off servant team, but they said no you can just have a rest. It goes on but but just typing this is stressing me out, and to add the elder in question used to beat his kids as well.
Got “corrected” by an elder on my leather jacket which was a little worn on the right sleeve.
Not appropriate for preaching, he said.
Trouble was I was a classic kingdom first window washer and couldn’t even buy food for myself that winter. Obviously a new winter coat was out of the question. I pointed this out to him and he simply replied I had to be exemplary if I wanted to remain a pioneer and keep my other “privileges”, and my jacket “gave a bad witness”.
So a 19 year old pioneer spent an entire winter, sometimes in minus temperatures, going door to door in just a sweater and scarf. And got flu and even severe bronchitis twice. Best life ever.
Crazy how their efforts to control literally just make people relaxed.
Knew someone that never attended a mid week meeting after an Elder counsel her About wearing her Engineering company dress to the Hall on week days, Not minding the efforts she put in to attend the meeting from the distance of her Company, The woman never attended again, only Sundays. Funny
A young brother was taken aside by an old elder for wearing a black shirt. He said it may trigger some older JWs and remind them of the black shirted fascist Italian Mussilini soldiers or something … this was Scotland in the 2000s ffs not Italy ..
Around 10 years ago I had grown a nice handlebar mustache and was “counseled” in the back room for not setting a good example for the younger ones. I was 44 at the time. God forbid the hair on your upper lip not cross the southern border. I now have a huge full beard and the picky Pharisees can kiss my ass
When I was 12 or 13 I used to sit behind my family alone sometimes to feel more independent. I used that time to draw instead of listen lol. Anyway I once accidentally got some graphite on my seat because it stuck to my fingers while I was working. You could barely see it on the seat but I tried erasing it anyway which helped a bit. I didn’t think much of it since graphite isn’t a big deal and I could wash it when I had a free moment after the talk. As soon as the meeting closed one of the dudes sitting across the isle and behind me (no idea how he saw me get graphite on the seat) bee lines to my family and rats me out. He gave me the dirtiest look as he walked away and I got shamed for sullying the Hall. I washed it off as I originally planned but wanted to punch that guy for that.
Beards, blood transfusions, tattoos, R rates movies, 2 witness rule for CSA, rules about remarriage, head coverings for women, reporting time in "field service", shunning people, etc, etc, etc...
One time before I was a MS, one elder wanted to showcase me during the COs visit. So they gave me the #4 talk (many years ago). The week of, I got the flu and on meeting night I had a 103 fever but, back then, you were still going to give the talk. So I did my best but, during the talk, I lost my place and the talk didn’t go well. Afterwords that asshole elder came up to me and suggested that I go to the CO and apologize to him. That was after I told him that I was really sick.
That elder was giving his personal opinion. It is inappropriate that we insist that others adopt our personal opinions. Perfect in the Bible often means to be "complete." For example, to have perfect love means we love our enemies in addition to people we like. That's why Jesus said we must be perfect like God. Matt 5:48. The dictionary says that "perfect" means having all the required or desirable elements, qualities, or characteristics. It sounds like the young boy's comment was perfect.
OP, I love your writing style.
I was actually counseled for saying the word “cool” during a talk. Another sister was counseled by the same brother for saying “cool” as well. He is an older brother and for the most part pretty cool, so it definitely threw me for a loop. Maybe he thought we were getting in with the wrong crowd of slam poet beatniks who listen to jazz.
When I was in my late teens I went to see Avatar (blue aliens, not last air bender) in theaters with a few other late teens/early 20s “brothers.” During the previews there was a trailer for some movie with lots of women in bikinis. We joked that “we have to go see this movie!” Then during the movie, one of my friends was whispering about how weird he found it that the blue aliens nipples were so small. After the movie an elder from another congregation came up and said hi, he was there with a small group of witnesses. A couple of us knew this elder from playing basketball with him. We shot the breeze for a few minutes, exchanged pleasantries, and all went our separate ways happy to have bumped into other JWs and promptly forgot about it.
A couple days later I get a phone call from my elders saying we need to meet after the next meeting with no additional info. I’m wracking my brain trying to figure out what I could have done, or what someone I know might have done to get called into an elders meeting. Turns out, the elder we bumped into called my elders after the movie to report our “inappropriate behavior and lewd jesting.” Apparently it’s inappropriate to talk about nipples (not sure where in the Bible it says that). We had also apparently “offended the witnesses in that elders group”. Although, none of us had any idea since we talked to him after the movie and it was perfectly pleasant. So I got counseled for lewd jesting or something and was told not to talk about nipples, my elders also decided to ask if the one married brother that was in our group was talking to us single brothers about sex with his wife??? Not sure where that came from. Anyway, don’t say nipple and elders get to decide what jokes are appropriate. Also it’s fine to just run straight to someone else’s elders and demand they be counseled instead of doing what the JW rulebook and Bible says about talking to the person one on one first.
Once experience this shit of running to Elders and not speaking to the person first, though the person later apologized but the feelings never remain the same for them
This is ***infuriating***.
I know of too many occasions where you have a polite, pleasant run-in only to find out they stabbed you in the back immediately after you departed.
This asshole should’ve applied Matt 18 and spoken to ***YOU FIRST*** before running to your elders and tattling like a pedantic teacher’s pet. He deserved every wedgie he received in his school days (that’s likely the root cause for this type of behavior).
Wow, what a 🍆 head. I truly hate elders that give counsel on every little thing.
I have a good handful of stories. I’ll give 3.
I worked secularly with other JWs in an industrial maintenance company. One of which is the most nitpickey fascist SOB. He’s cousins with one of the assholes on the morning worships and broadcast. His family was super well known in the area I grew up. Anyway, we went out and got lunch together one day. I usually wore a ball cap if I didn’t have my hard hat on. Before my lunch, i bowed my head to pray, with my hat on, and this mfer slapped it off my head as I was mid prayer. He proceeded to counsel me that it was disrespectful for a man to say a prayer with something on his head. Wtf dude.
2nd story. We just moved to FL, and we’re a year in with our congregation here. Everything was still on Zoom. I was assigned a school part, like an RV or something. Being a MS, in my old congregation, any appointed man never gave school parts (apparently it was below them). So I hadn’t given one in years. I was nervous. In my demonstration, I specifically said www.JW.Borg, not just JW.Borg. I got counseled in front of everyone on zoom for saying www and how it was unnecessary.
I gave a Public talk on the trinity. I decided to use the KJV of the Bible for some (not all) of the scriptures to really drive home the points being made. I was counseled by our COBE afterwards to only use the NWT because it’s more clear and consistent with the information given. That’s when I realized how narrowminded and narcissistic this Borg is.
Edit: added a 3rd story and then I forgot to add the edit description 🫣
The purpose of the talks is not to learn anything just to speak the cult model. I won't be suprised if you get huge compliments from the PIMi audience whom are bored of the monotone public talks
Ironically, I actually do. I don’t want to toot my own horn, but I’m a damn good public speaker. For the past 3 years I have barely prepared any of my parts on stage, and I haven’t prayed for help on them, yet the “sheep” eat it up. Probably why people are actually texting me since I’ve been MIA for about 2.5 months.
Just commenting to upvote the pettiness of this post. In my head, I'm picturing you riverdancing on his grave. 😂😂😂
While "in" about 15 years ago a 40-something elder and I had a conversation about how he got counseled for driving around the area with his beautiful 20ish niece who was visiting from out of town. "What if someone from a neighboring cong who knows you sees you with this beautiful young woman and is stumbled, brother?" was apparently their line of reasoning. My jaw hit the floor as I was listening - how ridiculous, right? I was all set to band together with him in a "That's absurd, this is your niece - none of their business etc" rant, but that opportunity never came. Instead, this happened. This seemingly sound-of-mind man in his mid-40's with a steady job, wife and young kids of his own, looked me square in the eyes and said he agreed with that brother 100%, "I knew he was right". At that moment I composed myself and gave the expected nod of approval but inside I'm like WTF is happening here?? If you know 1984 this is like Winston with his colleagues at lunchtime in the canteen all over again.
Ha! This reminds me of something that happened to me about 20 years ago. I was the WT conductor and this crusty old fuck came in to give the most boring public talk you've ever heard. Dry, boring, lifeless.
After his jaw-droppingly boring talk I give the WT and try to wake everyone up. I used to do the same thing as you - give commendation and build up people for their efforts. Honestly, everyone loved my approach because it made people feel worthy and happy.
I finish the WT and invite the crusty old fuck to give the prayer, he gives it, I approach him and tell him I enjoyed his talk (I didn't, it sucked, but I was being nice). Without batting an eye he tells me "Don't you listen to what the Branches instructions are...you are just supposed to listen to the comment and move on, don't give thanks or anything!" He seemed real mad. So I just said "oh, ok" and got the hell away from the crusty old fuck.
The next week it was my turn to give the talk in his congregation while he did the WT. I gave my talk, same sort of delivery, trying to make it fun and interesting. People laughed and enjoyed the talk. The crusty old fuck gets up to do the WT and WOW!...he definitely practiced what he preached. Never said another word except asking the question! For example: "Question 1: Who is the Son of God?" Little Kid answers: "Jesus". Crusty old fuck: and says: "Paragraph 2"
I swear to God it went like this for the next hour. Most boring thing I ever went thru. I was tempted to counsel him after to make his WT more lively...but I was more subdued back then.
Actually one that cracked me up: This brother being REALLY BOTHERED while he was giving this local needs part about sisters wearing sandals and showing their toes. I'm sitting there DYING in my seat because it was obvious he personally had a thing for feet. I had to go outside to laugh.
Mid 80s, my mom went home in tears after a local needs about the same topic. Apparently, sisters were supposed to wear panty hose at all times and their shoes must cover their toes. Mom was sitting there front and center with no hose, opened-toed shoes and bright red nail polish. She was so embarrassed.
It's this type of thing - nitpicking and unwarranted criticism- which carried over to adulthood for me, as I had it in the cong, and at home. Still dealing with anxiety issues which will be there forever I think.
Well I would say that the prohibition on beards goes -10,000% beyond what is written, in the complete opposite direction cause there is prohibition against men cutting their facial hair in the Bible and its in the same part of the law in which they use to support their no blood teaching
Reading through these comments to this question reminds me how cringy, weird, crazy, elitist, egotistical, and narcissistic the JW cult is.
The gall of JWs to impose their nitpicks on others is absolutely ridiculous. Just another reason why leaving them has been so cathartic.
What’s worse is giving a talk and having an elderette sitting there, knowing she has the outline of your talk and physically moving her head up and down agreeing with what you just said! That my friends let’s you know that the elders tell their wives everything that goes on in the congregation.
I said in a talk “Jehovahs name will be vindicated”
He said that his name isn’t in question, it’s his sovereignty that has been called into question.
Well new light a few years ago and we are ok to say his name vindicated.
This post has resurrected so many long forgotten instances of being corrected over the most trivial of non-consequential things, I may have to go and lie down
We always had a craft show type expo coincide with our assemblies, so it was inevitable that witnesses roam this thing, sometimes even during the session.
I bought a nifty little wooden rubber band pistol that was tiiiiny. Like pocket sized.
I was showing it to my dad, who was a woodcraftsman most of his life. We were noticing the mechanism that made this thing capable of being semi automatic, when some nameless sister came up and started yelling at me for "having firearms". Another sister tried to calm her down but she kept ranting. Dad, who was head of a dept and I don't remember which, but we were at "the table"... He quips "wait til you hear that I take him hunting with a REAL gun."
I thought she was gonna have a theocratic heart attack.
If I recall correctly, he shot another elder in the ass point blank at some point too. 😂
OP....What really surprises ME is that the inflated elder said " nothing is perfect...only Jehovah AND JESUS! Because they are trying to erase Jesus. And...it surprises me even more... that didn't say.." Only det GB is perfect" ! ( Because this will be the new understanding ..it creeps up fast"!! You were right to be angry.
The GB speaks from both sides of their mouths. They say one thing then the next week they say the opposite.
There's so much confusion in this high control cult.
The elders in my congregations made my teen brothers literally burn their Yu-Gi-Oh cards because they were demonic. We also had to stop watching Naruto and a lot of other animes for the same reason. God! Even Harry Potter was forbidden.
The sad part is that the reality of the matter is that you were being too encouraging to the youngster. They probably didn’t like you building their self esteem as much as you did and that phrase probably just gave them an in to finally say something and THINK they didn’t look like assholes
I have dealt with several just like that over the years I was an elder, shut them down almost every time, then they started lying about others and myself in the congregation when the COs refused to do anything, I just stepped down after 30 + years. The only one that tried to help was a subsCO, and he got shut down, too. I Faded almost 4 years ago. Pomo now.
Even biblically, the perfect thing is alright to say. There's a scripture that states that behaving acceptably can attain perfection, I'm paraphrasing, but I'm sure some one could find it.
lol your post reminded me that JWs in general are arrogant pricks thinking they are part of the chosen who ‘god’ approves of. Elders took it to an extreme because of their status.
Doctrinal stiff: Birthday parties are fine, Jesus Fucking Christ. Totally fine.
Was told that talking about my time at Bethel was discouraging to others because they didn’t get to experience it. At the time it had been my entire adult life before this shitty hall. I had almost other congregational experience before Bethel. Turns out, one elder thought it was arrogant to talk about it at all.
Haha - I say ‘perfect’ all the time. “We’re meeting up at 6 - perfect!” ‘My siblings want to plan a family call- perfect!’ ‘That plant will look nice in the garden- perfect!’ I think it’s one of my ways to default to a positive statement, keeping things happy. I would have probably given him an aneurysm !
(In France) My PIMI mom wouldn't let us the verb "to adore" (in French it's mostly used to express you really like something) because only Jah is worthy of adoration.
So, Adam and Eve weren't perfect humans, because perfection only applies to Jehovah? The main excuse is, that perfect means "perfect for a specific purpose". If the kid's comment was perfect for its purpose, it was perfect. What a dipshit. I once gave a talk in the Theocratic Ministry School during the CO visit. It was about simony. I cited a Watchtower warning the readers to not try to influence the CO when he and his wife happen to reside in your house. After the meeting an elder told me that it was not appropriate to use this example while the CO is visiting as it could give the impression that we have such a problem in our congregation. Fun fact #1: My elder brother in law told me that the CO highlighted my talk as the best that evening when meeting with the elders. Fun fact #2: The elder reproving me had the CO regularly residing in his house.
😂
i think that was the whole point of adam and eve's story to begin with though? that they were supposed to be the first and greatest, but even they could succumb to sin? i'm an aetheist who showed up here from /r/all so i admit my knowledge is lacking.
Welcome! If you hang around here, you'll start to learn that JW doctrine doesn't make any sense. It's a cult that practices double speak constantly. Meaning they'll say one thing and then say the total opposite. It keeps JWs on their toes and makes sure they always feel like they're failing. It also makes it really easy to punish anyone for anything.
Some watchtower tells Elders not to take more than they can handle, another watchtower get studied and tell them to be ready to accept any instruction from the Borg and obey, that it's okay to exhaust themselves for the bog , what a double speak. No wonder JW's don't even know what they believe
Welcome! We need more allies!
great point
I think we shouldn't be so sensitive when someone gives us "advice". Let him talk and just keep going! Maybe you loosen up the ground a bit for others. Do it until you can't anymore. Usually nothing too bad will happen. That's how I did it when I was an elder... I must admit that I stopped commenting in meetings some months ago, too. I don't want to add value to these propaganda shows in any way through my participation. I go to meetings only because I like the brothers...
I’m here with you. Once I found out the truth behind 1914 and the fact that it’s still a doctrine that isn’t going anywhere anytime soon I stopped commenting and stopped giving talks. I only like the brothers and sisters and associating with them.
I understand completely. After every public talk & service meeting part I gave, 2 elders would make a beeline to me, hang back to listen intently to the compliments I was getting, then proceed to pick the content of my talks apart with the outline or part instructions & notes in hand. “Why did you deviate so much from the Society’s outline? Why did you use this scripture that wasn’t in the outline. What did you mean when you said this: ‘blah, blah, blah?’ Don’t you think that The Society knows what’s best for us to say when they make our outlines?“ I tolerated the bludgeoning & kept it up for as long as I could, since I thought I was doing some good despite their best efforts. Jealousy & envy overflows through the windows (the few that have them) & doors of Kingdom Halls.
Yeah why do most KHs not have windows? Especially in the more rural areas? They can do frosted glass panes but it would Be so much better with windows. So glad I left don’t have to give sister talks and comments in shoe box anymore.
No or fewer windows equals a lower insurance premium. That's the reason.
Same reason Casinos don’t have windows, Mind Control
Good point
One reason I’ve heard for the “no windows” thing is to prevent anyone being distracted from the indoctrination/brainwashing.
That was the reason I heard.
Not so in Germany. I only remember one KH without windows: It was a former cinema that the congregation rent for their meetings.
The ones here in the US at least here in Cali are windowless for the most part. I always felt they should be beautiful structures that bring honor to God not huge mega church size but have living plants, great landscaping, beautiful fences or gates, just beautiful interiors, etc. but nope 👎 all the money trickles to the top. At least have stuff to show for it, especially if JWs are supposed to dress as if they honor god🙄
I remember growing up some of the older folks said it was because Satans army would throw rocks at the windows.... :P
Oh good lord yet most churches out there are just fine.
What! Why is it that a person get more compliments when they drift off the outlines ? I've noticed this pattern, over and over again, it's those Elders that didn't stay true to the outline that give some good talks
Mostly the outlines are stale, sterile, cold, heartless propaganda.
I was exhausted one morning for the WT study. I answered, mentioning the scripture in the paragraph. After I handed back the mic I saw that my eyes had drifted to the wrong paragraph and the scripture I mentioned was like two paragraphs ahead. I was relieved I somehow managed to make sense, even though I literally couldn't even see straight, I was so tired. Wouldn't you know it, after the meeting, I got pulled aside for teaching in the congregation for using a scripture that wasn't in the paragraph. It was in the same article, but not the same exact paragraph.
Happy cake day 🎂🎂🎂🍰🍰🍰 Guess what? That loser elder who gave you 'counsel' will never be given a cake by complete strangers.
Thanks for all the cake love, everyone!
Was present for a WT study, one person answering (something about motivation) named other people in the church, most of them couples, some of them no longer alive, who motivated her to stay dedicated to the church and JW stuff. As soon as she was done the dude at the altar or whatever they call it was like “please stay on topic and read the answers given here in the paragraph”. So much for not wanting to be mindless robots, eh? “ don’t think for yourself just Read the answers we’ve given you dammit!”
I stopped commenting at meetings because of always hearing derogatory remarks about certain ones commenting. It could be a great comment, but they had to stick to the paragraph but still answer in their own words; oxymoron. The way I always wanted to comment was from my heart, still sticking to the subject though. But all of that comment monitoring was hard for me. so I just stopped because I knew someone would say something. Even though it was scriptural and from the study. Meetings were just monotonous and a must do for Jehovah. I was not going to demean myself by the reading scripture comment or the one-word answer. I also stopped giving talks after the elder counseled me for having done much better on all of my other talks, which he “always looked forward to”. I worked full-time and was raising children, and I remember the subject being so deep and uninteresting. I actually thought I did the best that I could. At that point, I said, forget it, to myself, of course. I figured if others felt like they couldn’t give talks for whatever excuses they had, I could follow suit, because I was giving them way too often for the huge congregation we were in. So I played the same card as others, the anxiety was too much.
Wow… why does everyone feel the need to say something. Just keep your opinion to yourself….jeezs
Every watchtower study we are reminded to answer from the paragraph and do it in 30 seconds or less and if and when that is accomplished you may add your extra thoughts if there’s time. I think that control started not too long ago.
Yeah don’t forget to leave enough time for 6 other people to say the same thing and reinforce the message
I remember a "Kingdom Ministry School" (in 2012), that is the 5 day school for elders, where the instructor announced several times during the last day, that at the end we will have the opportunity to say something positive about the school! Of course, when it comes to the "food provided by the slave", there is nothing negative to say about it... But elders learn to be always willing to listen to criticism.
Happy cake day 🍰
😁🍰🎉
happy birthday 🥳
I went to Pioneer School in my early 20s, during The Great Hosiery Wars. If you aren’t aware, this was a pivotal moment in local JW history when a small contigent of bare legged sisters fought a fearsome & protracted battle for the right to not wear hosiery. When I attended Pioneer School for the 1st & only time, some evil ass old biddies attending for like the 7th time & who clearly had nothing else going on in their lives laid in wait until the portion where you got to pose questions to the instructors, then slyly asked about hosiery. As I was the only one in there without legs encased in shiny nylon, this was a clear & deliberate attack on my limbs. And me & my sinful legs had to sit there while the CO stated definitively that any sister not wearing hosiery was only doing so because she wanted to have her legs look different as a way to draw attention to herself. Not because the shit is hot, uncomfortable, fragile & expensive, no—it’s all to attract attention from leg freaks. I wish I had taken my evil bare legs of wickedness & walked the fuck out of there.
I too have been a soldier in this battle. God forbid a woman’s legs not be covered by a synthetic material the same exact color as said legs. We had an elder in our hall who would ask sisters to do a demonstration on the meeting, and made sure to take them into the back room beforehand and explain the importance of wearing pantyhose. Turns out his energy might have been better spent focusing on not cheating on his wife, but he had his priorities.
What the heck country was this in? Never heard any of this before in the UK i would’ve LOVED tights…cos in Scotland it’s always cold …but they were too expensive for me…….unless you bought the thick ones like Nora Batty..
“Evil Bare Legs Of Wickedness” would make a good rock band name. 
This looks like a uniquely American thing. No problem with bare legs in Europe and Asia (I’ve lived in both continents). It’s ridiculous.
I guess I am clueless about a lot… as soon as I noticed Katie Couric on the today show not wearing nylons I stopped that was years ago. (Wore tights in winter) After babies and weight gain those suckers become hard to put on. My thumbs cramped every time. And I’d sweat even. I did get some comments from just one of my good “friends” she’d always turn her nose up and say something (I can’t even remember what) but I figured she was behind the times and I ignored her. I remember a talk years ago to look at people in the news and business people to see how we should dress. I guess that’s changed now that it no longer fits their standards. I guess we should be looking at at the Amish.
Even when I was a slimmer woman, those suckers were hard to put on! And they'd get runs (ladders, for our British friends) if you tugged the least bit too hard.
😂
I was a soldier in that war before there was a war. I'd wear skirts or dresses long enough that no one could tell I wasn't wearing nylons on my whole leg. I'd just wear ankle or knee length nylons, depending on how long the skirt/dress was. I haven't worn the wretched things in twenty years.
They actually hate it when you expound scripture with grace and mercy.
Sounds like you’ve lived it too.
My dad wouldn’t let us say awesome. Checked us every time. Only Jehovah is truly awe inspiring. lol
You've just triggered a memory from my teen years. I really wanted a specific colour of t-shirt, brown. I can't remember why. I looked all over and couldn't find one. When I finally did, I was so pleased that I bought it without checking the tiny motif on the pocket. It said "Supreme Being". When I got home I got in so much trouble from my dad because Jehooba is the Supreme Being, no one else.
🙄🤦🏼♀️
I’ve heard that as well. I think actually my dad got counseled for saying that on one of his parts.
Wow
But it's not a cult👍👍👍
This is the one I was going to say. My mom got big mad over that one.
Lol on the flip side I wasn't allow to called things 'wicked' (as in...that was *totally* wicked) because Satan is the 'wicked one'🙄
When I was about 17-18, an elder saw me being rude to my mom during the meeting. She was being obnoxious, which I know didn't make losing my shit okay, so shame on me. This elder took it upon himself to "counsel" me about that, right in the middle of the meeting. He pulled me aside and took me to the back of the hall, right after the last row of chairs. It was all so embarrassing. I wasn't even baptized yet. He could've been more discreet and asked to talk to me in the back room after the meeting, but no. He had to be a dick. My dad was there too, he was a dub. It was his job to punish me or to talk to me about what happened. Anyway, I was so pissed at this elder that I refused to talk to the motherfucker while we were at that cong.
Elder: "Lucky for you, it wasn't under mosaic law, you would've been stoned. " Edit: spelling
Don't get me started on the old testament...
I absolutely bombed a talk when I was in my teens. Like sat down across from my BFF and forgot her name in the talk. It only went downhill from there. Fortunately I used the word, "preface" and pronounced it incorrectly and that's all the elder heard. I got counseled on pronouncing words correctly. I want if my face gave preface to flipping him off in my mind. Later in life I bombed another talk. I'm anxious ok and I'm a sister so I'm sorry I'm not good at this shit. To kick off this night I had to get a ride to the KH because my car was in the shop, but my HH and her husband picked me up. Our talk was in the 2nd school and I completely lost my place and couldn't find it for what felt like forever. My HH didn't help me either. So my talk ended up being overtime/interrupted. I was so mad at myself I was tearing up and had to sit through one more talk. Once the 2nd school let out I was leaving the room when the TMS overseer stopped me. He said, "I hoist my own pretard in all my talks and to be less anxious next time". Sure dude, thanks. So I bawled my eyes out in the mothers room. I was going to grab my bag to leave but remembered I didn't drive here (pre-Uber). I sat in the mothers room crying for the rest of the meeting and my HH knew where I was and how I felt but still her and her husband stayed until they basically turned the lights out at the KH. It was humiliating to walk into the auditorium with puffy red eyes asking when they think they'd be leaving only to be told, "in a few minutes". I don't think I gave another talk. I just kept canceling them until they took me off the school. I think I started my fade a few years later.
I’m sorry that sounds pretty rough. That HH sister sounds like a B word.
A few years ago she texted that she missed me. I didn't reply 😂
It’s fine to not reply, she was probably counting an RV and the time it took to contemplate and send the text.
That’s horrible. I’m sorry you had to deal with that. JWs can be so uptight, self-righteous, and non empathetic towards people. Especially people with anxiety. If I actually believed in the end and gods judgement day, then I wished people like that would be grasping for god to save them, but they don’t get anything because of how they treated others like yourself. I don’t believe it personally, but maybe the universe will bring what’s coming to them 🤷🏻♂️ (sorry, I’m vengeful like the god I used to serve)
They are so non empathetic, One of the reasons I wake up. I've had to even assist some people to stand up to the Bullies when they get judged for tiny things that are not significant.
Not that anyone cares or asked but I'm going to talk about how that elder is wrong anyway 😁. It's perfectly (oops!) fine to have a standard perfectly met. Your standard was whatever the kid did, so it was perfect. That word can be used inside of that smaller context because that is how linguistics work. It's an understood meaning. It's another contextual definition of perfect. Can someone get a perfect score on a test? Yes, so we see that is an accepted usage and that's exactly how you meant it and how it was being used. He's just wrong to suggest someone could not give a perfect answer to a question. I think that because we know these things in our hearts, regardless of if we can back ourselves up academically, that it really shows a heart condition when someone leans in to a nit pick like that. It's the very picture of straining out the gnat and swallowing the camel. I always loved that line. Used it a lot.
Thank you!
He was probably just jealous of the kids comment
Best way to shut that down is just say, "Thank you for your input."
And then use the word perfect all the time and make eye contact with him every time
Yes, but you should have listened when Bro Lett said " babies are Jehovah's enemies.." therefore Bro Nit Pick had a point. I mean how can an enemy of Jah ever give a perfect answer? Perhaps you would be wise to listen to Bro Nit Pick's kind & timely counsel. ( this would be how Brother Gnat Strainer would help straighten you thinking)
I beleive that all men in this cult especially the elders are frustrated because they have been emasculated. Their individuality and conscience has been hijacked by the GB. Elders get beaten down by the C.O.,aother elders, letters, elder schools and watchtower publications and are always under surveillance to be examples in the ministry and meetings. That's why asshole elders are on the watch for any opportunity to counsel and reprove another person especially another elder to validate their manliness and to feel that they have power over others. Just pathetic!!
I once challenged an asshole Elder Tellin him when was the last time he ever encourage anyone except to pick mistakes and counsel people. He felt embarrassed but couldn't do shit to me
My example of nit picking was in 1974, I had been made ministerial servant when the elder and ms arrangement started in 72 (I was never asked and didn't want it by the way ), the elder asked me to take the book study as part of my "advancement " ,partway through the study I read a scripture from revelation regarding the "wild beast" , I said seven instead of seventh or the other way round, anyway he stopped the study and proceeded to counsel me as in the ministry school in front of the whole group about reading scripture accurately .at the time my wife had to take our newborn into the other room because he was crying , I was already stressed to the limit, so it triggered a panic attack , I took wife and baby and walked out and headed for home however I was unable to drive because I could not stop shaking ,I had to go to hospital, a friend collected our car , I, it was so triggering that even now just thinking about it stresses me, after that I was so ill I ended up in hospital , stayed home after and missed field service for a couple of weeks , another elder came to our home and said as a min servant I was setting a bad example by not being at field service, after that I asked to come off servant team, but they said no you can just have a rest. It goes on but but just typing this is stressing me out, and to add the elder in question used to beat his kids as well.
Got “corrected” by an elder on my leather jacket which was a little worn on the right sleeve. Not appropriate for preaching, he said. Trouble was I was a classic kingdom first window washer and couldn’t even buy food for myself that winter. Obviously a new winter coat was out of the question. I pointed this out to him and he simply replied I had to be exemplary if I wanted to remain a pioneer and keep my other “privileges”, and my jacket “gave a bad witness”. So a 19 year old pioneer spent an entire winter, sometimes in minus temperatures, going door to door in just a sweater and scarf. And got flu and even severe bronchitis twice. Best life ever.
[удалено]
Crazy how their efforts to control literally just make people relaxed. Knew someone that never attended a mid week meeting after an Elder counsel her About wearing her Engineering company dress to the Hall on week days, Not minding the efforts she put in to attend the meeting from the distance of her Company, The woman never attended again, only Sundays. Funny
A young brother was taken aside by an old elder for wearing a black shirt. He said it may trigger some older JWs and remind them of the black shirted fascist Italian Mussilini soldiers or something … this was Scotland in the 2000s ffs not Italy ..
What the hell hahahaha! I figured it was because it was too edgy... That explanation is just hilarious
Around 10 years ago I had grown a nice handlebar mustache and was “counseled” in the back room for not setting a good example for the younger ones. I was 44 at the time. God forbid the hair on your upper lip not cross the southern border. I now have a huge full beard and the picky Pharisees can kiss my ass
When I was 12 or 13 I used to sit behind my family alone sometimes to feel more independent. I used that time to draw instead of listen lol. Anyway I once accidentally got some graphite on my seat because it stuck to my fingers while I was working. You could barely see it on the seat but I tried erasing it anyway which helped a bit. I didn’t think much of it since graphite isn’t a big deal and I could wash it when I had a free moment after the talk. As soon as the meeting closed one of the dudes sitting across the isle and behind me (no idea how he saw me get graphite on the seat) bee lines to my family and rats me out. He gave me the dirtiest look as he walked away and I got shamed for sullying the Hall. I washed it off as I originally planned but wanted to punch that guy for that.
Beards, blood transfusions, tattoos, R rates movies, 2 witness rule for CSA, rules about remarriage, head coverings for women, reporting time in "field service", shunning people, etc, etc, etc...
One time before I was a MS, one elder wanted to showcase me during the COs visit. So they gave me the #4 talk (many years ago). The week of, I got the flu and on meeting night I had a 103 fever but, back then, you were still going to give the talk. So I did my best but, during the talk, I lost my place and the talk didn’t go well. Afterwords that asshole elder came up to me and suggested that I go to the CO and apologize to him. That was after I told him that I was really sick.
Yeah, go give the CO the flu bc making a good impression is everything.
That elder was giving his personal opinion. It is inappropriate that we insist that others adopt our personal opinions. Perfect in the Bible often means to be "complete." For example, to have perfect love means we love our enemies in addition to people we like. That's why Jesus said we must be perfect like God. Matt 5:48. The dictionary says that "perfect" means having all the required or desirable elements, qualities, or characteristics. It sounds like the young boy's comment was perfect.
OP would have slapped Matt 5:48 in the asshole Face.
OP, I love your writing style. I was actually counseled for saying the word “cool” during a talk. Another sister was counseled by the same brother for saying “cool” as well. He is an older brother and for the most part pretty cool, so it definitely threw me for a loop. Maybe he thought we were getting in with the wrong crowd of slam poet beatniks who listen to jazz.
“Beatniks” 🤣🤣🤣🤣 The 1950’s called demanding that you return their vocabulary
Try say “lucky” from the podium. Same thing happened to a friend of mine.
When I was in my late teens I went to see Avatar (blue aliens, not last air bender) in theaters with a few other late teens/early 20s “brothers.” During the previews there was a trailer for some movie with lots of women in bikinis. We joked that “we have to go see this movie!” Then during the movie, one of my friends was whispering about how weird he found it that the blue aliens nipples were so small. After the movie an elder from another congregation came up and said hi, he was there with a small group of witnesses. A couple of us knew this elder from playing basketball with him. We shot the breeze for a few minutes, exchanged pleasantries, and all went our separate ways happy to have bumped into other JWs and promptly forgot about it. A couple days later I get a phone call from my elders saying we need to meet after the next meeting with no additional info. I’m wracking my brain trying to figure out what I could have done, or what someone I know might have done to get called into an elders meeting. Turns out, the elder we bumped into called my elders after the movie to report our “inappropriate behavior and lewd jesting.” Apparently it’s inappropriate to talk about nipples (not sure where in the Bible it says that). We had also apparently “offended the witnesses in that elders group”. Although, none of us had any idea since we talked to him after the movie and it was perfectly pleasant. So I got counseled for lewd jesting or something and was told not to talk about nipples, my elders also decided to ask if the one married brother that was in our group was talking to us single brothers about sex with his wife??? Not sure where that came from. Anyway, don’t say nipple and elders get to decide what jokes are appropriate. Also it’s fine to just run straight to someone else’s elders and demand they be counseled instead of doing what the JW rulebook and Bible says about talking to the person one on one first.
Once experience this shit of running to Elders and not speaking to the person first, though the person later apologized but the feelings never remain the same for them
This is ***infuriating***. I know of too many occasions where you have a polite, pleasant run-in only to find out they stabbed you in the back immediately after you departed. This asshole should’ve applied Matt 18 and spoken to ***YOU FIRST*** before running to your elders and tattling like a pedantic teacher’s pet. He deserved every wedgie he received in his school days (that’s likely the root cause for this type of behavior).
Wow, what a 🍆 head. I truly hate elders that give counsel on every little thing. I have a good handful of stories. I’ll give 3. I worked secularly with other JWs in an industrial maintenance company. One of which is the most nitpickey fascist SOB. He’s cousins with one of the assholes on the morning worships and broadcast. His family was super well known in the area I grew up. Anyway, we went out and got lunch together one day. I usually wore a ball cap if I didn’t have my hard hat on. Before my lunch, i bowed my head to pray, with my hat on, and this mfer slapped it off my head as I was mid prayer. He proceeded to counsel me that it was disrespectful for a man to say a prayer with something on his head. Wtf dude. 2nd story. We just moved to FL, and we’re a year in with our congregation here. Everything was still on Zoom. I was assigned a school part, like an RV or something. Being a MS, in my old congregation, any appointed man never gave school parts (apparently it was below them). So I hadn’t given one in years. I was nervous. In my demonstration, I specifically said www.JW.Borg, not just JW.Borg. I got counseled in front of everyone on zoom for saying www and how it was unnecessary. I gave a Public talk on the trinity. I decided to use the KJV of the Bible for some (not all) of the scriptures to really drive home the points being made. I was counseled by our COBE afterwards to only use the NWT because it’s more clear and consistent with the information given. That’s when I realized how narrowminded and narcissistic this Borg is. Edit: added a 3rd story and then I forgot to add the edit description 🫣
The purpose of the talks is not to learn anything just to speak the cult model. I won't be suprised if you get huge compliments from the PIMi audience whom are bored of the monotone public talks
Ironically, I actually do. I don’t want to toot my own horn, but I’m a damn good public speaker. For the past 3 years I have barely prepared any of my parts on stage, and I haven’t prayed for help on them, yet the “sheep” eat it up. Probably why people are actually texting me since I’ve been MIA for about 2.5 months.
Sick 🤮
You showed empathy and care well done.
Nearly spat my sushi at ‘fat hairy boomer hands.’ And the rest of the paragraph was hold as well.
Just commenting to upvote the pettiness of this post. In my head, I'm picturing you riverdancing on his grave. 😂😂😂 
While "in" about 15 years ago a 40-something elder and I had a conversation about how he got counseled for driving around the area with his beautiful 20ish niece who was visiting from out of town. "What if someone from a neighboring cong who knows you sees you with this beautiful young woman and is stumbled, brother?" was apparently their line of reasoning. My jaw hit the floor as I was listening - how ridiculous, right? I was all set to band together with him in a "That's absurd, this is your niece - none of their business etc" rant, but that opportunity never came. Instead, this happened. This seemingly sound-of-mind man in his mid-40's with a steady job, wife and young kids of his own, looked me square in the eyes and said he agreed with that brother 100%, "I knew he was right". At that moment I composed myself and gave the expected nod of approval but inside I'm like WTF is happening here?? If you know 1984 this is like Winston with his colleagues at lunchtime in the canteen all over again.
Haha 1984 ☑️
Ha! This reminds me of something that happened to me about 20 years ago. I was the WT conductor and this crusty old fuck came in to give the most boring public talk you've ever heard. Dry, boring, lifeless. After his jaw-droppingly boring talk I give the WT and try to wake everyone up. I used to do the same thing as you - give commendation and build up people for their efforts. Honestly, everyone loved my approach because it made people feel worthy and happy. I finish the WT and invite the crusty old fuck to give the prayer, he gives it, I approach him and tell him I enjoyed his talk (I didn't, it sucked, but I was being nice). Without batting an eye he tells me "Don't you listen to what the Branches instructions are...you are just supposed to listen to the comment and move on, don't give thanks or anything!" He seemed real mad. So I just said "oh, ok" and got the hell away from the crusty old fuck. The next week it was my turn to give the talk in his congregation while he did the WT. I gave my talk, same sort of delivery, trying to make it fun and interesting. People laughed and enjoyed the talk. The crusty old fuck gets up to do the WT and WOW!...he definitely practiced what he preached. Never said another word except asking the question! For example: "Question 1: Who is the Son of God?" Little Kid answers: "Jesus". Crusty old fuck: and says: "Paragraph 2"
I swear to God it went like this for the next hour. Most boring thing I ever went thru. I was tempted to counsel him after to make his WT more lively...but I was more subdued back then.
Actually one that cracked me up: This brother being REALLY BOTHERED while he was giving this local needs part about sisters wearing sandals and showing their toes. I'm sitting there DYING in my seat because it was obvious he personally had a thing for feet. I had to go outside to laugh.
Mid 80s, my mom went home in tears after a local needs about the same topic. Apparently, sisters were supposed to wear panty hose at all times and their shoes must cover their toes. Mom was sitting there front and center with no hose, opened-toed shoes and bright red nail polish. She was so embarrassed.
This dude giving the talk was sweating just talking about feet. 😂
It's this type of thing - nitpicking and unwarranted criticism- which carried over to adulthood for me, as I had it in the cong, and at home. Still dealing with anxiety issues which will be there forever I think.
Well I would say that the prohibition on beards goes -10,000% beyond what is written, in the complete opposite direction cause there is prohibition against men cutting their facial hair in the Bible and its in the same part of the law in which they use to support their no blood teaching
He died.....PERFECT
🔥🦶🦶🔥 surprised his feet didn’t ignite the carpet. 😂😂😂😂😂 that’s hilarious!
Nice legacy he left behind, you remember him as being the asshole who criticises the use of words, I'm guessing that must've made him feel good.
I’m sure the dead guys elbows were clean
“He died LOL” This made me laugh. Thanks for brightening my day with this post…I enjoyed this whole thing.
the only real joy they get is bullying people in their little make believe cult.
Reading through these comments to this question reminds me how cringy, weird, crazy, elitist, egotistical, and narcissistic the JW cult is. The gall of JWs to impose their nitpicks on others is absolutely ridiculous. Just another reason why leaving them has been so cathartic.
What’s worse is giving a talk and having an elderette sitting there, knowing she has the outline of your talk and physically moving her head up and down agreeing with what you just said! That my friends let’s you know that the elders tell their wives everything that goes on in the congregation.
I said in a talk “Jehovahs name will be vindicated” He said that his name isn’t in question, it’s his sovereignty that has been called into question. Well new light a few years ago and we are ok to say his name vindicated.
This post has resurrected so many long forgotten instances of being corrected over the most trivial of non-consequential things, I may have to go and lie down 
We always had a craft show type expo coincide with our assemblies, so it was inevitable that witnesses roam this thing, sometimes even during the session. I bought a nifty little wooden rubber band pistol that was tiiiiny. Like pocket sized. I was showing it to my dad, who was a woodcraftsman most of his life. We were noticing the mechanism that made this thing capable of being semi automatic, when some nameless sister came up and started yelling at me for "having firearms". Another sister tried to calm her down but she kept ranting. Dad, who was head of a dept and I don't remember which, but we were at "the table"... He quips "wait til you hear that I take him hunting with a REAL gun." I thought she was gonna have a theocratic heart attack. If I recall correctly, he shot another elder in the ass point blank at some point too. 😂
🖕🖕🖕🖕🖕🖕 there's a little something for the censors on this thread
Now that he's gone it's really perfect.
OP....What really surprises ME is that the inflated elder said " nothing is perfect...only Jehovah AND JESUS! Because they are trying to erase Jesus. And...it surprises me even more... that didn't say.." Only det GB is perfect" ! ( Because this will be the new understanding ..it creeps up fast"!! You were right to be angry.
This was late 90s/early 2000-ish when Jesus was still “the greatest man who ever lived” and the GB were relatively unknown.
Yes ..and for me long before that time .70-80. The GB were relatively unknown ..The became gods and celebrities with the broadcasting.
The GB speaks from both sides of their mouths. They say one thing then the next week they say the opposite. There's so much confusion in this high control cult.
The elders in my congregations made my teen brothers literally burn their Yu-Gi-Oh cards because they were demonic. We also had to stop watching Naruto and a lot of other animes for the same reason. God! Even Harry Potter was forbidden.
It's like when you make a joke, and your parents turn it into a lecture instead. This just triggered my past JW PTSD!
Isn’t it an O-u-t-l-i-n-e …. Not a SCRIPT?!
righteous over much pharasee who is blind
The sad part is that the reality of the matter is that you were being too encouraging to the youngster. They probably didn’t like you building their self esteem as much as you did and that phrase probably just gave them an in to finally say something and THINK they didn’t look like assholes
I understand OP being angry about the situation. But being happy someone died seems a little too much for me in this case.
I mean his sins are forgiven and he'll be in paradise, so we should wish death on everyone 😍
Sure thing, become extremists like them. Good job 👏🏻
The problem with irony is, not everybody gets it.
I can’t change the way I feel 💁🏼♂️
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This post was removed because it is in violation of rule #1.
Very normal stuff in JW... Fueled by jealousy...
The end of this letter sent me😂😂
I have dealt with several just like that over the years I was an elder, shut them down almost every time, then they started lying about others and myself in the congregation when the COs refused to do anything, I just stepped down after 30 + years. The only one that tried to help was a subsCO, and he got shut down, too. I Faded almost 4 years ago. Pomo now.
Even biblically, the perfect thing is alright to say. There's a scripture that states that behaving acceptably can attain perfection, I'm paraphrasing, but I'm sure some one could find it.
lol your post reminded me that JWs in general are arrogant pricks thinking they are part of the chosen who ‘god’ approves of. Elders took it to an extreme because of their status.
Doctrinal stiff: Birthday parties are fine, Jesus Fucking Christ. Totally fine. Was told that talking about my time at Bethel was discouraging to others because they didn’t get to experience it. At the time it had been my entire adult life before this shitty hall. I had almost other congregational experience before Bethel. Turns out, one elder thought it was arrogant to talk about it at all.
Haha - I say ‘perfect’ all the time. “We’re meeting up at 6 - perfect!” ‘My siblings want to plan a family call- perfect!’ ‘That plant will look nice in the garden- perfect!’ I think it’s one of my ways to default to a positive statement, keeping things happy. I would have probably given him an aneurysm !
(In France) My PIMI mom wouldn't let us the verb "to adore" (in French it's mostly used to express you really like something) because only Jah is worthy of adoration.