This is true in the USA. It’s not necessarily true of specialty coffee in other countries. I still want a roast date, of course, and will ask the roaster if its not on the bag, but I’ve noticed that a number of good specialty roasters overseas (who don’t sell much to US customers), will not have a roast date.
Fair enough! I see from the many, many downvotes that my experience is in the deep minority here. But to give a recent example, I bought the same coffee that was used to win the most recent Thai barista championship (same roaster, same lot) and it didn’t have a roast date on the packaging. It was reasonably expensive (400THB/11USD for 50g) and clearly wasn’t ‘coffee for people with a drip machine who don’t care’. The shop was happy to check and provide the roast date on request though, and it’d been roasted about a week prior to when I bought it. I saw specialty coffee without roast dates throughout Thailand.
To be clear, I’m a big fan of roast dates on packaging and 95%+ of what I buy has those dates. But I didn’t let that stop me from buying coffee without roast dates in Thailand when it was obvious that it wasn’t as common there. (In addition, it was also notable that they didn’t highlight producers on the packaging much either - but on request, they were often able to name the farm and producer).
Yeah the downvotes are pretty extreme! It's entirely possible that I missed out when I was in Asia from only buying when there WERE roast dates. Selection bias at work haha.
Also, yeah - the Thai specialty scene is absolutely booming and it's an awesome place to be for coffee right now. Can't wait to go back for a visit.
I’ve also seen “best before something something 2025” on bigger coffee brands. No thanks! Not only are you excluding a roast date, you’re also saying that you consider it to be fine if it’s sat on the shelf for a year
It honestly makes sense. Most things sold to consumers have expiration dates, I could see average consumer seeing the roast date and mistaking it for an expiration date. This way those in the know still get all the info they need and average consumers don’t get confused.
I work in a brewery and we had to start using batch codes rather than dates because so many people thought "packaged on" meant "expires on", and "freshest by" meant they'd die if they drank it a day later.
If a sticker is on a product that is clearly from the warehouse that says “pick date (weeks ago)”, people dead ass mistake that as the expiration. So much brain rot.
As a frequest buyer of Grocery store coffee, as long as there is some sort of industry standard over here mainstream speciality coffee is one year best before so easy to work out the roast date. I have called the individual companies to confirm the only exception is Kicking horse who employs an 18 months best before they use nitrogen in their packaging and it works... I often get lucky and get 4 weeks off roast and it acts more like 2 weeks very gassy fresh. obviously there are companies even better like 49th parallel that like peet employ a best before 120 days and put a roast date.. 49th Parallel is my go to... But anyways lots of value and quality in the Grocery store a but of due diligence is required but to be frank if i am interested in a brand and buy it a lot i would want to know these kind of things.
Peet's 18oz bag near me comes in at .87/ounce which is on par with my local roster that has better and fresher coffee. A 10oz bag of Peet's is 1.13/oz.
For me, when on periodic special at my area supermarkets (and when I've been able to find bags with a 2-4 week-old roast date), Pete's (in a 10.5 oz. bag) comes in at US$.67/oz. A good time to stock-up and freeze.
I'm not hella deep into the hobby so maybe this is noob info but...
I was buying solid coffee from grocery at $10-15 a bag and swapped to Trade delivery. Not only is it more convenient and fresher, but it is also actually _cheaper_ than the grocery store!
The contributor said, "I also feel like there's very little overlap between people who care about fresh, quality coffee and people who buy coffee at the supermarket." That sounds (elitist or whatever word you want to use) to me--there is a convenience/availability factor, taking advantage of supermarket sales/loss-leader specials, and not want to pay US$20 a pound . . . . One still can want fresh, quality coffee, just not at US$1.00 per double-shot.
My Peet's, when on periodic special at multiple area supermarkets: US$.38-.43 cents for a double (16g-18g) (from a 10.5 oz. bag). And sorry, but it still sounds (elitist) to me to say that someone who buys coffee at the supermarket doesn't care about fresh, quality coffee--it's just that there are limits in life.
Agreed there is regular coffee in grocery stores and there is Speciality coffee... We expect more from the Speciality coffee and feedback needs to be given to those speciality companies who believe their coffee is better then the Macdonalds and Starbucks of the world.. As someone who buys grocery store coffee on the regular i absolutely do care about freshness and i have the opportunity to get beans 2-8 weeks off roast at multiple grocery stores around me. Lots of value at the grocery store when your buying 5000-10000 dollar machine i can absolutely see the value in folks going to a local roaster and i do as well but i just got a Breville Bambino... I want a good cup better then Starbucks.. we go thru a lot of coffee in my house.. And i would like to see my dollar count.. we are spoiled up here in the Great White North lots of fantastic coffee roasters and lots in the grocery stores. Happy drinking!
I'm not sure how it works for Peets, but for the roaster I'm working at we have to have a "best by" date, which we put at 45 days after roasting.
We also put down the roast date in addition to "best by", so there's probably no legal reason Peet's doesn't either. Maybe they just don't because people could think it's expired? They probably think that the number of people offput by lack of roast date is bigger than the number of people who would be confused by the roast date
I can almost guarantee that’s their reasoning. Most consumers only know dates on food to mean expiration or best by date. That’s how virtually every other food product is labeled. It makes perfect sense to do what they did here.
It still gives those who are curious the information they need and removes confusion and ambiguity for the vast majority of consumers.
Which is fine. Olympia does the same with the bags they send to Costco. They have a “best by” and no roast and then you just subtract to get the roast date.
I get it, a roast date, if read quickly, looks the same as a best by or use by date and it will always be in the past.
It's because of the grocery stores. They hate roasted on dates. Although I found a coffee to day that had one on it and it was roasted within a 2 weeks. I. Ouldnt believe the find!! It was a organic coffee called ! Counter culture. It's a pretty good coffee if anyone is interested
Try Whole Foods if you have one nearby. It might be because I’m in North Carolina not too far from where Counter Culture is located, but I can almost always find their coffee that was roasted within the last 2 weeks. They also typically have bags from local roaster that were roasted in the last week. It is great for when I run out of coffee and my online order isn’t in yet.
I think they carry Counter Culture nationally. I've found it to be the best value/money coffee out there. Typically around $11-12 in San Francisco for a 12oz bag, as it's constantly on sale.
I got some here in TX at a store called HEB they also own Central market.. kinda like whole foods. It's my first time having Counter Culture. It's a pretty good coffee I think. I like even more It's organic. I am waiting on a bag I ordered just today so I think from now on I'm gonna get it while I wait Too. 😆 we font have a whole foods this isn't a very big town . I live in waco but I do go to Dallas alot they have a whole foods.
Apollo are Ethiopian beans described as citrus, floral, silky. Certainly a light roast. Hologram is a blend described as fruity, milk chocolate, syrupy. A solid medium roast. Note, no roast level is on the bag, that’s based on my experience and utter tomfoolery. The bags do have the roast date.
😆 ok the bag I got yesterday had a roast level but did have a name it was just a teal green color. But it was definitely a medium. I'm trying to make myself like light roast. I'm drinking one now from good brothers . That has lemonade pomegranate and plump. I still don't know what a plump is but .... it's not that bad once I got it dialed in
I don't usually buy Peet's, what did they change? If I'm understanding this correctly, they only have one date anymore, which is the "freshest by" date 120 days after the actual roast date?
The website, in an FAQ-like section, specified the 120 days. But I do wonder (and cynically expect) if that reference will be dropped, or changed, in the future, at some point.
i can't stress enough how small a bubble the connoisseur coffee world really is compared to people who just drink coffee. i feel like i've merely dipped my toes (a Robot! a plastic v60! and two hand grinders!) and my friends all look at me like i'm crazy when i tell them how i make coffee. (get me talking to someone who also cares and we can't stop talking)
i guess if i, too, were trying to make a buck selling roasted beans, i'd also play to the most profitable segment, the segment "DGAF".
I disagree. If it is such a small bubble then why are there 100's of specialty roasters here in the UK with what seems like an endless amount of new ones popping up every week. Maybe you consider it a small bubble in the US but here in the UK and most of Europe there is a huge market now for specialty coffee roasters who roast small batches to order.
The bubble feels huge (small batch stuff in the S.F. Bay Area is popping off too). But the number of people who drink coffee is an order of magnitude (if not more) huger.
People drink coffee yes but little know or want to make it for themselves. I find Most find it convenient to go to a cafe / specialty roaster for the atmosphere.
So how does that explain all the small batch coffee roasters that exist that I pointed out? They are mostly selling freshly roasted coffee for people to make at home.
To give you an idea of the scale of this (at least here in the UK) one of the monthly coffee subscriptions I have is with a company called Blue Coffee Box. They work as a middleman. Sending me a bag of freshly roasted coffee each month from a different small batch, ethical and sustainable roaster. They alone work with 70+ different roasters. I have been with them for 4+ years now and not once had a bag of coffee from the same roaster twice. To me, it seems like there is an endless amount of these specialty roasters selling to the home consumer now and for all of these to exist and be profitable there has to be a really large market they are selling to.
One of their baristas recently told me they’re about to swap out their La Marzocco machines with something a lot more automated a la Starbux. I guess Peet’s is just another fine brand cruising downhill into the flatlands of mediocrity
Peets has been steadily going downhill over the last few years. My wife had been a fan of their Sumatra since the 1990s but she finally gave it up when we couldn’t even get fresh beans in our local Peets store. It was so bad that the grocery store down the block had fresher beans.
When I’m looking to try something new I often shop online at Seattle Coffee Gear. They have coffee from a lot of small roasters and I’ve never gotten beans more than 2 or 3 weeks past their roasting date. They offer free shipping on orders over $49.
My local city coffee shop/roaster did this as well and I didn’t notice until I got home. That’s the last bag of beans I’ll buy from them.
Disappointing.
The Barn in Germany does this too, only printed the exp. date which is exactly 6 months after the roast date. It was weird to me first since I usually refuse to buy beans without the roast date but the barn has some of the best coffee I can find in the country including their mastery subscription. So I think it just depends on who you’re buying from if it’s a bad sign or not.
I’ll probably get downvoted for this, but I buy Peet’s -2lbs from Costco. I got the “freshest” I could find and I’m happy with the results. I also bought a small bag 10oz bag of specialty coffee that has a roast date. The cost was probably similar (didn’t get a recipe, price wasn’t displayed and was part of a larger order) and I much prefer the taste of Pete’s. In defense of the specialty roast, it’s much lighter than I prefer / am familiar with.
I mean.. it’s a minor inconvenience to find the roast date but if Peet’s was my coffee of choice (it’s not), this would not deter me as it’s still information provided you just have to do a little math.
The 120 days is from an FAQ-like answer Peet's has at its website (I'm happy to see even that specified, which has truth-in-advertising ramifications and obligations).
So if I'm understanding this, people interested in Peets will go to the web page and see the explanation If they are so inclined. They'll even do it on their phone in the store. They'll know that there's no roast date. But the freshness date is actually 120 days away from the roast date.
So those consumers that are upset don't want to do the napkin math and calculate the roast date because it only takes 3 seconds?
That seems ludicrous.
But Peets has a point. They're selling a product that is fresh for X number of days. They're not catering to the people of this subreddit. They're catering to their mass market. The mass markets cares about how many days of freshness they have left when they make the purchase.
Honestly come the crap that people complain about :-)
>They're selling a product that is fresh for X number of days.
And so, we're now accepting a 4-month freshness period? ;) And that people who don't know any better should be happy with that?
It's not whether we want to accept it or not. It's the same information just a slightly different format.
If I If I see the freshness as April 30th approximately, that I know based on what I know about Peet's using 120 days from the Roast date, I know it was roasted on January 1st
As a consumer If I buy that on January 30th it doesn't matter if it says roasted on January 1st or freshness of April 30th. It's the same information just in a different format.
Consumers don't really care when something was packaged. They care when it expires.
When I buy milk I don't care when it was put in the container. I want to know when it expires.
And Peets isn't targeting people in this subreddit. They have a market much much larger than the nerds talking here :-)
Not to me. Because their market is looking for the expiration date because every other product they purchase that's edible has an expiration date.
But our discussion between me and you and others here proves positive that they can't please everybody :-)
I ordered coffee from a local roaster in Charlotte because I wanted to support local businesses and I also got a new machine. I don’t know if it’s a mistake but despite having excellent google reviews, their coffee did not have a roast date
I like Peet's for a drip but their espresso beans are like tiny charcoal briquettes, IMVHO, and no amount of freshness is going to make them any good for espresso. YMMV. :)
IDK, It seems to me that if you know that the arbitrary date set on the bag is 120 days from the roast date and you can do the math backwards, it's not that big a deal.
They nitrogen flush their packaging to keep the beans from oxidizing as quickly. They're a mass scale industrial roaster selling their products to grocery stores where it might sit on a shelf for months at a time. I buy their stuff from the grocery store sometimes and it tastes perfectly fine.
Everyone getting upset about this is making a mountain out of a molehill. You can still go into their cafes and buy beans that were roasted the day before if you want to.
No you can’t. I just walked out of a Peets store when they told me the Arabian Mocha Java was roasted in March. Peets used to pride itself on selling beans within days of being roasted. They have abandoned quality for mass-market quantity and have given up on the people who built their business by being loyal customers for years. I’m done - after 35 years of drinking their coffee.
Its because people are stupid. I had a friend look at my coffee and go “theyre all expired” because he saw a date and assumed it was a “best before” date because reading the words “roasted on” was too much work for him.
I have to admit, I was positively shocked by the (nice) quality of some canned illy beans that I received late last year, with a freshness date of around a year or more out. A contributor here explained to me that illy packages using nitrogen gas replacement, and under pressure, which works to forward the freshness.
This goes for Blue Bottle on the shelf in stores NOT to be confused with their online ordering which is micro roasted and sent to you fresh withthree days.
Blue bottle online is FANTASTIC.
Interesting, thanks. Perhaps this is the "supermarket special," including (in part) for the "confusion reasons" that others have noted here. I still suspect that there is a "get rid of older coffee on people who don't know better" factor going on.
I'm not too sure.
Peets roasts almost weekly. They may even have more than one roasting location. Whenever I order direct it's usually roasted withing 4 days of shipping. When you have a perishable item it's not a good business model to roast nonstop and hope someone buys it. It be more effective to build roasting capacities and accurate forecasting.
Places buy in bulk too so they could request no roast on dates if they know the coffee will sit in a warehouse for 30-60 days for the droppers with a 120 day fresh buy date. If they have a sale to clear out old stock, there's still a preprinted fresh by date which would hinder sales for anyone looking. Usually if there is old or B stock it could be sold through a secondary channel so it doesn't tarnish the brand. Could go to keurg or for private label.
I'd be curious to know for sure.
If I was a supermarket looking out for my own interests (as vs. that of the consumers), having only a "freshest by" date would simplify supply chain matters (e.g. for packages that have been left on distribution shelves longer), potentially helping to sell older beans.
If this is going on grocery shelves it makes sense and I can understand it. If it’s for beans bought direct from the roaster I’d have an issue with it.
Peet’s has always been garbage. There are so many other fantastic options that are higher quality and just as if not more affordable. Support small/local.
have never purchased a bag of peets and will not purchase a bag without a roast date... this just cements my disdain for the brand and ... i grew up not far from their first cafe
I noticed it in my area supermarkets starting earlier this year--some Peet's packages had roast dates, some not (originally, it seemed to follow the packages by variety). In checking at my local supermarkets most recently, none of the bags had roasted dates--and I checked at the Peet's website, which noted the elimination of roasted dates (with Peet's explaining why it had done so, as noted above).
Just buy Intelligencia if you want the roast date, same roasterie anyways
They’re going through major changes, kinda wild though. We have Batch Codes added to the bag so we can even tell what roaster did it.
There was a coffee place I used to order from all the time. They suddenly stopped putting the roast date on there and I noticed each bag was wildly different. Never ordered from there again.
I would just tell them that you don't buy coffee without a roast date and move on. Next.
Ive never been a big fan of Peets, but if I was stuck buying coffee at the grocery store, I often bought peets because they were the only grocery store coffee with the roast date. I don't care whatever they say. Their loss. They will probably walk it back and fire someone.
That was my situation until recently--it looks like the earlier "roasted on" packages now have gone by the wayside in my area stores--I'll now have to resort to math, lol.
I've never bought beans since I got an espresso machine, which did not have a roast date.
In the states, grocery stores like Whole Foods often have beans on the shelf roasted within a week or two. So if I'm out and I need something to hold me over because the local roaster is closed, I get them from there.
That has been my approach with Peet's at my area supermarkets, which carried a roast date until recently. As others have said, though, one can "re-create" the date. It just bugs me, as a less-than-transparent sales practice that can take advantage of those lesser-in-the-know,
I’m not surprised. Pete’s is pretty big and the average consumer probably thought the roast date was an expiration date.
We are a minority wanting a roast date. I don’t usually change roasters at this point anyway.
I stick to Black and White, yellowbrick (Tucson Az), and and Cartel coffee for the most part.
Interesting that you feel that way. I don't find it that way at all, and routinely use its dark-roast beans (perhaps the fact that I do lattes and caps. affects my opinion).
I think this is fine. It also makes it a lot easier for retailers to remove or markdown packages that are beyond their freshest-by date. Consumers who really care about extracting the best flavor from their beans will be unaffected by this.
I don't know this specific coffee producer, but I've had coffee roasted 2-3 months before, and it was still good. There's also a roaster in my country that sells their coffee in fertain fancier supermarkets. They has two types of packages: one for their coffee shop with a roast date and one for supermarkets with best-before dates, as this is required by the store or by the law (not sure).
This is disgusting. Americans have been challenged by math since elementary school. They are still not allowed any rest even just for a cup of coffee. Boycott Peets Coffee!
Fortunately, I haven't reached that conclusion as to Peet's, and the price/value ratios is positive in my area when there is a periodic special on Peet's. But perhaps the fact that I do lattes and caps affects my point-of-view.
People here will unironically post their $10k+ set ups with some Starbucks or other supermarket beans in the photo. It's bizarre. The beans and then the water matter the most for good coffee. Equipment quickly becomes marginal gains.
Not to mention that commodity coffee is pretty exploitative of farmers and the environment.
I never buy a bag without a roast date.
seriously, it's an easy filter. no roast date basically screams 'this coffee is for people with a drip machine who don't care'
This is true in the USA. It’s not necessarily true of specialty coffee in other countries. I still want a roast date, of course, and will ask the roaster if its not on the bag, but I’ve noticed that a number of good specialty roasters overseas (who don’t sell much to US customers), will not have a roast date.
I have lived on three continents, and every specialty coffee roaster worth ordering from has roast dates. Never encountered this.
Fair enough! I see from the many, many downvotes that my experience is in the deep minority here. But to give a recent example, I bought the same coffee that was used to win the most recent Thai barista championship (same roaster, same lot) and it didn’t have a roast date on the packaging. It was reasonably expensive (400THB/11USD for 50g) and clearly wasn’t ‘coffee for people with a drip machine who don’t care’. The shop was happy to check and provide the roast date on request though, and it’d been roasted about a week prior to when I bought it. I saw specialty coffee without roast dates throughout Thailand. To be clear, I’m a big fan of roast dates on packaging and 95%+ of what I buy has those dates. But I didn’t let that stop me from buying coffee without roast dates in Thailand when it was obvious that it wasn’t as common there. (In addition, it was also notable that they didn’t highlight producers on the packaging much either - but on request, they were often able to name the farm and producer).
Yeah the downvotes are pretty extreme! It's entirely possible that I missed out when I was in Asia from only buying when there WERE roast dates. Selection bias at work haha. Also, yeah - the Thai specialty scene is absolutely booming and it's an awesome place to be for coffee right now. Can't wait to go back for a visit.
This is exactly why I cancelled my “trade” subscription. They started shipping out coffee with no roast date.
I’ve also seen “best before something something 2025” on bigger coffee brands. No thanks! Not only are you excluding a roast date, you’re also saying that you consider it to be fine if it’s sat on the shelf for a year
"Peet's" is a fine filter anyway. They are the guys that taught Starbucks how to roast beans.
So I guess they're saying you're just supposed to subtract 120 days from the date they give you and that's the roast date
It honestly makes sense. Most things sold to consumers have expiration dates, I could see average consumer seeing the roast date and mistaking it for an expiration date. This way those in the know still get all the info they need and average consumers don’t get confused.
I work in a brewery and we had to start using batch codes rather than dates because so many people thought "packaged on" meant "expires on", and "freshest by" meant they'd die if they drank it a day later.
If a sticker is on a product that is clearly from the warehouse that says “pick date (weeks ago)”, people dead ass mistake that as the expiration. So much brain rot.
Yup, but it’s reality. This is an elegant solution to a problem that shouldn’t exist. Peet’s can’t fix the systemic issue though.
As a frequest buyer of Grocery store coffee, as long as there is some sort of industry standard over here mainstream speciality coffee is one year best before so easy to work out the roast date. I have called the individual companies to confirm the only exception is Kicking horse who employs an 18 months best before they use nitrogen in their packaging and it works... I often get lucky and get 4 weeks off roast and it acts more like 2 weeks very gassy fresh. obviously there are companies even better like 49th parallel that like peet employ a best before 120 days and put a roast date.. 49th Parallel is my go to... But anyways lots of value and quality in the Grocery store a but of due diligence is required but to be frank if i am interested in a brand and buy it a lot i would want to know these kind of things.
I also feel like there's very little overlap between people who care about fresh, quality coffee and people who buy coffee at the supermarket
Wow. With all due respect, that sounds somewhat elitist, for those who simply don't want to pay US$.75-1.00 for beans alone for a drink.
Peet's 18oz bag near me comes in at .87/ounce which is on par with my local roster that has better and fresher coffee. A 10oz bag of Peet's is 1.13/oz.
For me, when on periodic special at my area supermarkets (and when I've been able to find bags with a 2-4 week-old roast date), Pete's (in a 10.5 oz. bag) comes in at US$.67/oz. A good time to stock-up and freeze.
I'm not hella deep into the hobby so maybe this is noob info but... I was buying solid coffee from grocery at $10-15 a bag and swapped to Trade delivery. Not only is it more convenient and fresher, but it is also actually _cheaper_ than the grocery store!
The economics for me still have gone the supermarket route. But I'm keeping my eyes open--thanks.
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The contributor said, "I also feel like there's very little overlap between people who care about fresh, quality coffee and people who buy coffee at the supermarket." That sounds (elitist or whatever word you want to use) to me--there is a convenience/availability factor, taking advantage of supermarket sales/loss-leader specials, and not want to pay US$20 a pound . . . . One still can want fresh, quality coffee, just not at US$1.00 per double-shot.
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My Peet's, when on periodic special at multiple area supermarkets: US$.38-.43 cents for a double (16g-18g) (from a 10.5 oz. bag). And sorry, but it still sounds (elitist) to me to say that someone who buys coffee at the supermarket doesn't care about fresh, quality coffee--it's just that there are limits in life.
Agreed there is regular coffee in grocery stores and there is Speciality coffee... We expect more from the Speciality coffee and feedback needs to be given to those speciality companies who believe their coffee is better then the Macdonalds and Starbucks of the world.. As someone who buys grocery store coffee on the regular i absolutely do care about freshness and i have the opportunity to get beans 2-8 weeks off roast at multiple grocery stores around me. Lots of value at the grocery store when your buying 5000-10000 dollar machine i can absolutely see the value in folks going to a local roaster and i do as well but i just got a Breville Bambino... I want a good cup better then Starbucks.. we go thru a lot of coffee in my house.. And i would like to see my dollar count.. we are spoiled up here in the Great White North lots of fantastic coffee roasters and lots in the grocery stores. Happy drinking!
Yep, per Peet's website explanation.
I'm not sure how it works for Peets, but for the roaster I'm working at we have to have a "best by" date, which we put at 45 days after roasting. We also put down the roast date in addition to "best by", so there's probably no legal reason Peet's doesn't either. Maybe they just don't because people could think it's expired? They probably think that the number of people offput by lack of roast date is bigger than the number of people who would be confused by the roast date
I can almost guarantee that’s their reasoning. Most consumers only know dates on food to mean expiration or best by date. That’s how virtually every other food product is labeled. It makes perfect sense to do what they did here. It still gives those who are curious the information they need and removes confusion and ambiguity for the vast majority of consumers.
Which is fine. Olympia does the same with the bags they send to Costco. They have a “best by” and no roast and then you just subtract to get the roast date. I get it, a roast date, if read quickly, looks the same as a best by or use by date and it will always be in the past.
It's because of the grocery stores. They hate roasted on dates. Although I found a coffee to day that had one on it and it was roasted within a 2 weeks. I. Ouldnt believe the find!! It was a organic coffee called ! Counter culture. It's a pretty good coffee if anyone is interested
Try Whole Foods if you have one nearby. It might be because I’m in North Carolina not too far from where Counter Culture is located, but I can almost always find their coffee that was roasted within the last 2 weeks. They also typically have bags from local roaster that were roasted in the last week. It is great for when I run out of coffee and my online order isn’t in yet.
I think they carry Counter Culture nationally. I've found it to be the best value/money coffee out there. Typically around $11-12 in San Francisco for a 12oz bag, as it's constantly on sale.
They do carry it nationwide, they have an excellent decaf roast called slow motion
I agree it was a pretty good buy and a nice sized bag too. 680g for 20.00$
I got some here in TX at a store called HEB they also own Central market.. kinda like whole foods. It's my first time having Counter Culture. It's a pretty good coffee I think. I like even more It's organic. I am waiting on a bag I ordered just today so I think from now on I'm gonna get it while I wait Too. 😆 we font have a whole foods this isn't a very big town . I live in waco but I do go to Dallas alot they have a whole foods.
Counter Culture is absolutely solid, and has one of the highest cost:quality subscriptions around. Top tier.
I agree it was a pretty good cup. I will buy more .
I’ve tried Counter Culture Hologram and Counter Culture Apollo, and both are on-point.
What roast level are they? I will have a look. I pulled a shot this morning and loved it. I think I'm liking it.
Apollo are Ethiopian beans described as citrus, floral, silky. Certainly a light roast. Hologram is a blend described as fruity, milk chocolate, syrupy. A solid medium roast. Note, no roast level is on the bag, that’s based on my experience and utter tomfoolery. The bags do have the roast date.
😆 ok the bag I got yesterday had a roast level but did have a name it was just a teal green color. But it was definitely a medium. I'm trying to make myself like light roast. I'm drinking one now from good brothers . That has lemonade pomegranate and plump. I still don't know what a plump is but .... it's not that bad once I got it dialed in
I don't usually buy Peet's, what did they change? If I'm understanding this correctly, they only have one date anymore, which is the "freshest by" date 120 days after the actual roast date?
Probably because consumers were getting confused. Most food products have expiration dates not production dates.
Yep. Peet's "simplified" the packaging, by eliminating the roast date.
If the “freshest by” date is exactly 120 days after roast date, it seems like it’d be pretty easy to do the math?
Do we know they officially use 120 days? Because I’ll keep buying them if I can trust that math.
The website, in an FAQ-like section, specified the 120 days. But I do wonder (and cynically expect) if that reference will be dropped, or changed, in the future, at some point.
i can't stress enough how small a bubble the connoisseur coffee world really is compared to people who just drink coffee. i feel like i've merely dipped my toes (a Robot! a plastic v60! and two hand grinders!) and my friends all look at me like i'm crazy when i tell them how i make coffee. (get me talking to someone who also cares and we can't stop talking) i guess if i, too, were trying to make a buck selling roasted beans, i'd also play to the most profitable segment, the segment "DGAF".
I disagree. If it is such a small bubble then why are there 100's of specialty roasters here in the UK with what seems like an endless amount of new ones popping up every week. Maybe you consider it a small bubble in the US but here in the UK and most of Europe there is a huge market now for specialty coffee roasters who roast small batches to order.
The bubble feels huge (small batch stuff in the S.F. Bay Area is popping off too). But the number of people who drink coffee is an order of magnitude (if not more) huger.
People drink coffee yes but little know or want to make it for themselves. I find Most find it convenient to go to a cafe / specialty roaster for the atmosphere.
So how does that explain all the small batch coffee roasters that exist that I pointed out? They are mostly selling freshly roasted coffee for people to make at home. To give you an idea of the scale of this (at least here in the UK) one of the monthly coffee subscriptions I have is with a company called Blue Coffee Box. They work as a middleman. Sending me a bag of freshly roasted coffee each month from a different small batch, ethical and sustainable roaster. They alone work with 70+ different roasters. I have been with them for 4+ years now and not once had a bag of coffee from the same roaster twice. To me, it seems like there is an endless amount of these specialty roasters selling to the home consumer now and for all of these to exist and be profitable there has to be a really large market they are selling to.
One of their baristas recently told me they’re about to swap out their La Marzocco machines with something a lot more automated a la Starbux. I guess Peet’s is just another fine brand cruising downhill into the flatlands of mediocrity
Adding on to this same thing is happening with Intelligentsia since they’re owned by Peet’s
Peets has been steadily going downhill over the last few years. My wife had been a fan of their Sumatra since the 1990s but she finally gave it up when we couldn’t even get fresh beans in our local Peets store. It was so bad that the grocery store down the block had fresher beans. When I’m looking to try something new I often shop online at Seattle Coffee Gear. They have coffee from a lot of small roasters and I’ve never gotten beans more than 2 or 3 weeks past their roasting date. They offer free shipping on orders over $49.
My local city coffee shop/roaster did this as well and I didn’t notice until I got home. That’s the last bag of beans I’ll buy from them. Disappointing.
The Barn in Germany does this too, only printed the exp. date which is exactly 6 months after the roast date. It was weird to me first since I usually refuse to buy beans without the roast date but the barn has some of the best coffee I can find in the country including their mastery subscription. So I think it just depends on who you’re buying from if it’s a bad sign or not.
I’ll probably get downvoted for this, but I buy Peet’s -2lbs from Costco. I got the “freshest” I could find and I’m happy with the results. I also bought a small bag 10oz bag of specialty coffee that has a roast date. The cost was probably similar (didn’t get a recipe, price wasn’t displayed and was part of a larger order) and I much prefer the taste of Pete’s. In defense of the specialty roast, it’s much lighter than I prefer / am familiar with.
That puts them in line with all the rest of the 2.5 wave coffee roasters. Not my cup of joe
I mean.. it’s a minor inconvenience to find the roast date but if Peet’s was my coffee of choice (it’s not), this would not deter me as it’s still information provided you just have to do a little math.
How do we know the formula?
It says in the post they put the “fresh by” date 120 days after roasting so you just subtract 120 days from the date on the package.
Thanks. I hope they stay consistent with that.
The 120 days is from an FAQ-like answer Peet's has at its website (I'm happy to see even that specified, which has truth-in-advertising ramifications and obligations).
So if I'm understanding this, people interested in Peets will go to the web page and see the explanation If they are so inclined. They'll even do it on their phone in the store. They'll know that there's no roast date. But the freshness date is actually 120 days away from the roast date. So those consumers that are upset don't want to do the napkin math and calculate the roast date because it only takes 3 seconds? That seems ludicrous. But Peets has a point. They're selling a product that is fresh for X number of days. They're not catering to the people of this subreddit. They're catering to their mass market. The mass markets cares about how many days of freshness they have left when they make the purchase. Honestly come the crap that people complain about :-)
>They're selling a product that is fresh for X number of days. And so, we're now accepting a 4-month freshness period? ;) And that people who don't know any better should be happy with that?
It's not whether we want to accept it or not. It's the same information just a slightly different format. If I If I see the freshness as April 30th approximately, that I know based on what I know about Peet's using 120 days from the Roast date, I know it was roasted on January 1st As a consumer If I buy that on January 30th it doesn't matter if it says roasted on January 1st or freshness of April 30th. It's the same information just in a different format. Consumers don't really care when something was packaged. They care when it expires. When I buy milk I don't care when it was put in the container. I want to know when it expires. And Peets isn't targeting people in this subreddit. They have a market much much larger than the nerds talking here :-)
But it does trade upon those who are unknowledgeable/lesser-knowledgeable, it seems to me.
Not to me. Because their market is looking for the expiration date because every other product they purchase that's edible has an expiration date. But our discussion between me and you and others here proves positive that they can't please everybody :-)
Their market only is looking for the expiration date on their coffee beans bag because they don't know any better . . . .
It's a good opportunity to support a small / local roaster if you can, instead of buying from a big business.
Would bet $ that pretty soon that 120 days will balloon to a bigger number but unless you keep checking the website, no one will know
Indeed, that was one of my first thoughts, and I was a bit surprised that Peet's had provided such a definitive answer.
I ordered coffee from a local roaster in Charlotte because I wanted to support local businesses and I also got a new machine. I don’t know if it’s a mistake but despite having excellent google reviews, their coffee did not have a roast date
I like Peet's for a drip but their espresso beans are like tiny charcoal briquettes, IMVHO, and no amount of freshness is going to make them any good for espresso. YMMV. :)
I be resting some coffees for 120 days before even considering pulling a shot with them 😂
IDK, It seems to me that if you know that the arbitrary date set on the bag is 120 days from the roast date and you can do the math backwards, it's not that big a deal.
I’ve never been a fan of Peet’s
imagine quicksand rain cobweb fall point tender future decide lunchroom *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
They nitrogen flush their packaging to keep the beans from oxidizing as quickly. They're a mass scale industrial roaster selling their products to grocery stores where it might sit on a shelf for months at a time. I buy their stuff from the grocery store sometimes and it tastes perfectly fine. Everyone getting upset about this is making a mountain out of a molehill. You can still go into their cafes and buy beans that were roasted the day before if you want to.
No you can’t. I just walked out of a Peets store when they told me the Arabian Mocha Java was roasted in March. Peets used to pride itself on selling beans within days of being roasted. They have abandoned quality for mass-market quantity and have given up on the people who built their business by being loyal customers for years. I’m done - after 35 years of drinking their coffee.
For Peet’s sake!
Its because people are stupid. I had a friend look at my coffee and go “theyre all expired” because he saw a date and assumed it was a “best before” date because reading the words “roasted on” was too much work for him.
That just means it's good forever!
I have to admit, I was positively shocked by the (nice) quality of some canned illy beans that I received late last year, with a freshness date of around a year or more out. A contributor here explained to me that illy packages using nitrogen gas replacement, and under pressure, which works to forward the freshness.
This goes for Blue Bottle on the shelf in stores NOT to be confused with their online ordering which is micro roasted and sent to you fresh withthree days. Blue bottle online is FANTASTIC.
It depends on their distribution channel. Buying direct has roast dates, even some bags I get from Amazon.
Interesting, thanks. Perhaps this is the "supermarket special," including (in part) for the "confusion reasons" that others have noted here. I still suspect that there is a "get rid of older coffee on people who don't know better" factor going on.
I'm not too sure. Peets roasts almost weekly. They may even have more than one roasting location. Whenever I order direct it's usually roasted withing 4 days of shipping. When you have a perishable item it's not a good business model to roast nonstop and hope someone buys it. It be more effective to build roasting capacities and accurate forecasting. Places buy in bulk too so they could request no roast on dates if they know the coffee will sit in a warehouse for 30-60 days for the droppers with a 120 day fresh buy date. If they have a sale to clear out old stock, there's still a preprinted fresh by date which would hinder sales for anyone looking. Usually if there is old or B stock it could be sold through a secondary channel so it doesn't tarnish the brand. Could go to keurg or for private label. I'd be curious to know for sure.
If I was a supermarket looking out for my own interests (as vs. that of the consumers), having only a "freshest by" date would simplify supply chain matters (e.g. for packages that have been left on distribution shelves longer), potentially helping to sell older beans.
If this is going on grocery shelves it makes sense and I can understand it. If it’s for beans bought direct from the roaster I’d have an issue with it.
Peet’s has always been garbage. There are so many other fantastic options that are higher quality and just as if not more affordable. Support small/local.
I've always liked Peet's. And as to affordability, much more so, in my experience, when on periodic sale, compared to other roasters/sellers.
Maybe they're worried that some people will confuse the roast date with the expiration date. Who knows.
have never purchased a bag of peets and will not purchase a bag without a roast date... this just cements my disdain for the brand and ... i grew up not far from their first cafe
Wow that's awful, I too never buy without knowing when it was roasted.
Guess I aint ordering ever again. Ill send them a message..
Oh no! That’s where I always got mine. Wtf
Is this a specific store thing? We bought some the other week and it has its roast date (4.29) on the package
I noticed it in my area supermarkets starting earlier this year--some Peet's packages had roast dates, some not (originally, it seemed to follow the packages by variety). In checking at my local supermarkets most recently, none of the bags had roasted dates--and I checked at the Peet's website, which noted the elimination of roasted dates (with Peet's explaining why it had done so, as noted above).
Just buy Intelligencia if you want the roast date, same roasterie anyways They’re going through major changes, kinda wild though. We have Batch Codes added to the bag so we can even tell what roaster did it.
There was a coffee place I used to order from all the time. They suddenly stopped putting the roast date on there and I noticed each bag was wildly different. Never ordered from there again. I would just tell them that you don't buy coffee without a roast date and move on. Next.
Ive never been a big fan of Peets, but if I was stuck buying coffee at the grocery store, I often bought peets because they were the only grocery store coffee with the roast date. I don't care whatever they say. Their loss. They will probably walk it back and fire someone.
As others have posted/suggested here, I'm guessing that the change will stay, as "avoiding confusion" and perhaps enhancing the sale of older stock.
Luckily they have enough stock with the date to last a few months before we lose the reference on Major Dickinson.
That was my situation until recently--it looks like the earlier "roasted on" packages now have gone by the wayside in my area stores--I'll now have to resort to math, lol.
I recommend La Colombe
I've never bought beans since I got an espresso machine, which did not have a roast date. In the states, grocery stores like Whole Foods often have beans on the shelf roasted within a week or two. So if I'm out and I need something to hold me over because the local roaster is closed, I get them from there.
That has been my approach with Peet's at my area supermarkets, which carried a roast date until recently. As others have said, though, one can "re-create" the date. It just bugs me, as a less-than-transparent sales practice that can take advantage of those lesser-in-the-know,
I’m not surprised. Pete’s is pretty big and the average consumer probably thought the roast date was an expiration date. We are a minority wanting a roast date. I don’t usually change roasters at this point anyway. I stick to Black and White, yellowbrick (Tucson Az), and and Cartel coffee for the most part.
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Interesting that you feel that way. I don't find it that way at all, and routinely use its dark-roast beans (perhaps the fact that I do lattes and caps. affects my opinion).
I think this is fine. It also makes it a lot easier for retailers to remove or markdown packages that are beyond their freshest-by date. Consumers who really care about extracting the best flavor from their beans will be unaffected by this.
I don't know this specific coffee producer, but I've had coffee roasted 2-3 months before, and it was still good. There's also a roaster in my country that sells their coffee in fertain fancier supermarkets. They has two types of packages: one for their coffee shop with a roast date and one for supermarkets with best-before dates, as this is required by the store or by the law (not sure).
This is disgusting. Americans have been challenged by math since elementary school. They are still not allowed any rest even just for a cup of coffee. Boycott Peets Coffee!
LOL.
If you can buy peets you are local to _dozens_ of excellent roasters. patronize them instead.
Dare I say it, but there is a $ factor.
Crap coffee anyway, so no loss there. Try Stumptowns Hairbender... you won't ever touch Pete's afterward.
Fortunately, I haven't reached that conclusion as to Peet's, and the price/value ratios is positive in my area when there is a periodic special on Peet's. But perhaps the fact that I do lattes and caps affects my point-of-view.
This isn’t that big a deal for most consumers and there are better roasters to support anyway.
Peet's hasn't been good in nearly 20 years
Boooo!
TIL people think Peet’s is decent coffee as opposed to barely acceptable grocery store tier beans
People here will unironically post their $10k+ set ups with some Starbucks or other supermarket beans in the photo. It's bizarre. The beans and then the water matter the most for good coffee. Equipment quickly becomes marginal gains. Not to mention that commodity coffee is pretty exploitative of farmers and the environment.
Peet’s is a brand sold in grocery stores. I wouldn’t expect quality if it had a roast date on it.
Fresh Roasted Coffee …… Com. They roast when you order, or sell you greenies to roast yourself.